AA-52 GPMG Question

[Jabroni]

How are you supposed to cary the AA-52 GPMG Around?, It has no front handguard, Wouldnt it burn your hand?.

http://i14.tinypic.com/30hy0aq.jpg

[KillerBD]

http://www.world.guns.ru/machine/mg09-e.htm

Or the soldier could possibly wear a glove, or just not hold onto the barrel and set it up on its bi-pod while on the ground.

[Warden]

With the carry handle pictured? No?

[exarmyguard]

Odd looking weapon? Is there anything "special" about it, something that makes it any good? You would think after WW2, the french would just adopt the MG42 as there must have been alot of them around.

[Kaapeli]

There's no need to touch the barrel at all when operating and carrying a MG. Unless you try to shoot it from the hip or standing up.

[Yimmy]

Neither does the L7A2 have a handguard. Use the bi-pod leg.

[Göönk]

You dont carry it around while shooting. It's fired with a tripod or the bipod. That's all. Now it's used on vehicules. It can be compared to the M240. In the crouching position you don't need the heat protection handguard. If you want to carry it around, there is a carry handle. It's very heavy. You don't want to carry it around too much. ("23 kg on tripod with heavy barrel ")

[gafkiwi]

How are you supposed to cary the AA-52 GPMG Around?, It has no front handguard, Wouldnt it burn your hand?.

I think what Jabroni is trying to get at is how do you patrol with it?
Carrying it by the carry handle on patrol sounds a bit shady, and most tgts arn't gonna stand still while you fold the bipod down and take up a ****e position. How does one utilise it for snap tgts, there doesn't look like a hell of alot of bipod to use as a hand guard.

[JVeld]

Not unless you're trying to hit someone with it grabbing it from the barrel......and with no gloves !!!

[Erik Sleivöks]

Euhh?? Carry it around?

Well it has a quite practical sling, and it is very well carried on the shoulder. In the configuration showed on your photo the weapon is very close to 10kg, so without being a “lightweight” it is still reasonably possible to carry it around.

During and after firing the barrel obviously becomes very hot and should not be touched. However in this situation the wooden handle is the best solution. This handle is placed on the center of gravity, and for a short period (10 min) the weapon can easily be carried using this handle.

[digrar]

Would the handle or sling be the best option if you are trying to fire and move forward into the battle? In my opinion it's not.

[Erik Sleivöks]

To move and fire with this weapon quickly becomes a mess. As you can see it feed with a 7.62mm or 7.5mm ammunition band, and if you are moving while firing the whole band will “dangle” sideways and the weapon will jam.
The AA52 is supposed (in this configuration) to be fired on its bi-pods with a human ammunition provider that actually guides the ammunition band in to the feeder.

[Hydro]

Odd looking weapon? Is there anything "special" about it, something that makes it any good? You would think after WW2, the french would just adopt the MG42 as there must have been alot of them around.



I believe the French did use the MG42 for a few years after the war, like they also put some left over Panthers into (brief) use.



The AA52 does seem to be not quite as flexible as say the MAG - the bipod acts as a handguard when folded on the MAG.

[Jabroni]

I was thinking about using a customised handguard from a '1919'(Or Similar] air cooled barrel jacket, Chop about 10 inches of an Air Cooled Barrel Jacket and the AA-52 Barrel will wedge itself into it.

What i like about the AA-52 is its simple in design, Easy to stash away with the removable barrel and retracting buttstock. It is also Blowback Operated which i like.

I would maybe replace the existing bipod with an M60 Bipod?

It makes a nice weapon for Paratroops/Tank Crew/Or for Bunkers.

[oldsoak]

Is this still current with the French army ?

[gilgoul]

How are you supposed to cary the AA-52 GPMG Around?, It has no front handguard, Wouldnt it burn your hand?.

http://i14.tinypic.com/30hy0aq.jpg

You don't,

AA52 and ANF1 are rather violent to control compared to the MAG or even the M60.

More accurately, whoever has arms long enough could try to grab one leg of the bipod and use it as a handle, but I've never seen it used this way, always properly laid on the ground.

BTW, the ROF is a bit high, and the barrel tends to overheat fast, while the ejection of the empty shells is simply aggressive.
On the good side, it is quite easy to maintain (be careful with the action spring when opening the weapon, it is an eye poker), relatively reliable (less than the MAG, but then, everything is less reliable than the MAG), and in the ANF1 version offers the possibility to mount a starlite or an OB40 night vision (Am I right, can't remember)

[gilgoul]

Is this still current with the French army ?

Replaced by the ANF1 in the 90's.
The ANF1 is simply the same stuff in 7.62mm NATO, and slightly modified receiver to ease the mounting of a carrier for a NV device.
I heard the feeding was also changed, never saw any difference.

[Erik Sleivöks]

We used it in the AMX 10 RC, one coaxial to the 105mm, and one on the top of the turret (manned by the loader). We would also have several in the other reconnaissance vehicles within the platoon.
I consider it very good in the coaxial position (automatically feed by a 200 round ammo box) it was somehow a bit more tricky on top of the turret, but it was mainly due to the mounting that was a bit strange. Used from a jeep (or similar) it is perfect.

Its main strong point is its simplicity. I cannot remember any mechanical failures, and it is dead easy to clean (just strip it and throw the whole thing in the shower).
The weak point is certainly when you are using it with a “free floating band” (without ammo box) then it needs a caring hand to guide the band. If not it will jam.
However my personal experience tells me that it is highly unlikely to run around firing this thing from the hip.

[mas-36]

http://i14.tinypic.com/30hy0aq.jpg

That bi-pod looks like it came right off the Chatelleraut m24/29 machinegun.

[gilgoul]

We used it in the AMX 10 RC, one coaxial to the 105mm, and one on the top of the turret (manned by the loader). We would also have several in the other reconnaissance vehicles within the platoon.
I consider it very good in the coaxial position (automatically feed by a 200 round ammo box) it was somehow a bit more tricky on top of the turret, but it was mainly due to the mounting that was a bit strange. Used from a jeep (or similar) it is perfect.

Its main strong point is its simplicity. I cannot remember any mechanical failures, and it is dead easy to clean (just strip it and throw the whole thing in the shower).
The weak point is certainly when you are using it with a “free floating band” (without ammo box) then it needs a caring hand to guide the band. If not it will jam.
However my personal experience tells me that it is highly unlikely to run around firing this thing from the hip.

Hey, what cav were you in?
I was EED2, P4 and VBL.

[Erik Sleivöks]

Hey, what cav were you in?
I was EED2, P4 and VBL.

1 Regiment Etranger de Cavalerie / 1 Escadron.
AMX 10 RC, VBL, P4

[Deicide]

Some hi-res pics about the ANF1 here: http://www.imagestation.com/album/index.html?id=2098197860

[gilgoul]

1 Regiment Etranger de Cavalerie / 1 Escadron.
AMX 10 RC, VBL, P4

Respect, I did a tournante with the 3 REI in Kourou back in the days, had some fun :)

[Jabroni]

And why did the French replace this beast with the Minimi?

Ok the Minimi is a great weapon but instead of replacing the '52', I would either just add a handguard or add a mag insertunderneath the belt feed.

Or extend the family of it by producing short barrel variants or one in 5.56mm.

Has there ever been plans for adding a handguard?

[gilgoul]

And why did the French replace this beast with the Minimi?

Ok the Minimi is a great weapon but instead of replacing the '52', I would either just add a handguard or add a mag insertunderneath the belt feed.

Or extend the family of it by producing short barrel variants or one in 5.56mm.

Has there ever been plans for adding a handguard?

Because the minimi is a LMG, and didn't replace all of the ANF1 used. I don't know if the infantry still carries them at squad level, but I'm almost sure there is at least a GPMG per platoon.
In cavalry regiments, the ANF1 is used on everything with wheels or tracks, from the Peugeot P4 to the Leclerc.
I even saw it on the Haglung light tracked vehicles used by the 3 REI.

[Erik Sleivöks]

Because the minimi is a LMG, and didn't replace all of the ANF1 used. I don't know if the infantry still carries them at squad level, but I'm almost sure there is at least a GPMG per platoon.
In cavalry regiments, the ANF1 is used on everything with wheels or tracks, from the Peugeot P4 to the Leclerc.
I even saw it on the Haglung light tracked vehicles used by the 3 REI.

That is 100% correct.

The Minimi is just used at squad level when they are on foot. The ANF1/AA52 is still largely used on all the vehicles. This mainly because it is not the most practical weapon in the world to carry around, but also since the squad (where the Minimi is) is seldom operating at ranges more than a couple of hundred meters, and at this ranges the Minimi is sufficient. For more heavy “direct fire support” they will use the ANF1 from a vehicle.

[Erik Sleivöks]

And why did the French replace this beast with the Minimi?

Ok the Minimi is a great weapon but instead of replacing the '52', I would either just add a handguard or add a mag insertunderneath the belt feed.

Or extend the family of it by producing short barrel variants or one in 5.56mm.

Has there ever been plans for adding a handguard?

This is a light machine gun, what do you exactly intend to do with the hand-guard, and why shorten the barrel?

[Jabroni]

Becouse the barrel heat would scrch your hand while carrying the thing, Why do you think they are on Rifles/GPMG's?

http://i12.tinypic.com/2zdrg5g.jpg

And about stumpy barrel variants, Just like the first Minimi had a longer barrel, Now there is a paratroop variant with retracting stock and stumpy barrel. Just wanted to bring the idea to the AA-52. Got a problem with that?

Why do you think they made short barrel FAL's, M4 Carbines, AKSU's, HK53's?.

[Erik Sleivöks]

Well just carry it by the flipping handle; that is what it is there for. If you take a closer look you will discover that the handle is at a certain angle related to the barrel. This has been made on purpose in order to create a natural effect by the center of gravity, hence allowing the user to carry the weapon easily with the handle horizontal.
If you think that it would be better with a hand-guard around the barrel, you are welcome. However, I consider it risky, especially when the advice is coming from somebody that has probably only seen the weapon on a photo.

To do the job that it has been designed for it needs the length of the barrel that it got from the start. It already has a folding (sliding) stock, so there is no need for further shortening.
This weapon has been in the French army for around 50 years and it has gone thru several modifications during this time period. Now if you are intending to give some “expert” advice about these weapons should have been build, you are welcome. However please keep in mind that you are taking the great risk of being ridiculous.

If the information on your profile is correct, it basically means that I was carrying the AA52 on my shoulders in a war situation before (or actually when) you where born, and I kept on handling this weapon for the first 15 years of your life.
Obviously it is possible that I am a complete idiot and you a genius. However keep this information in your mind when you are proposing new modifications.

[Pidyon Shevuyim]

Sorry, this has nothing to do with this thread....but i just thoght i would stop in and say hey to Erik (its Blixa from Cervens) welcome abord!

[Erik Sleivöks]

Sorry, this has nothing to do with this thread....but i just thoght i would stop in and say hey to Erik (its Blixa from Cervens) welcome abord!

Howzitt ??woot

[digrar]

Make use of the PM button.

[Pidyon Shevuyim]

Make use of the PM button.

yeah sorry..

[Kocur]

To do the job that it has been designed for it needs the length of the barrel that it got from the start.

Not to mention, that since the weapon is retarded blowback operated, shortening barrel would take altering amount of "fake" inertia created by that Kiraly bolt, by, say, making rear part of it lighter, if reliability was not to be challenged.

[Jabroni]

Howabout this?

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/8113/aa52mm1.jpg

[TacoDelRio]

You'd need to give Soldiers one hell of a medical plan to carry that thing after it goes off...

"WHAT?!"