New wage boost puts squeeze on teenage workers across Arizona

[Geezah]

Employers are cutting back hours, laying off young staffers

Oh, for the days when Arizona's high school students could roll pizza dough, sweep up sticky floors in theaters or scoop ice cream without worrying about ballot initiatives affecting their earning power.

That's certainly not the case under the state's new minimum-wage law that went into effect last month.

Some Valley employers, especially those in the food industry, say payroll budgets have risen so much that they're cutting hours, instituting hiring freezes and laying off employees.

And teens are among the first workers to go.

Companies maintain the new wage was raised to $6.75 per hour from $5.15 per hour to help the breadwinners in working-poor families. Teens typically have other means of support.

Mark Messner, owner of Pepi's Pizza in south Phoenix, estimates he has employed more than 2,000 high school students since 1990. But he plans to lay off three teenage workers and decrease hours worked by others. Of his 25-person workforce, roughly 75 percent are in high school.

"I've had to go to some of my kids and say, 'Look, my payroll just increased 13 percent,' " he said. " 'Sorry, I don't have any hours for you.' "

Messner's monthly cost to train an employee has jumped from $440 to $580 as the turnover rate remains high.

"We go to great lengths to hang on to our high school workers, but there are a lot of kids who come in and get one check in their pocket and feel like they're living large and out the door they go," he said. "We never get our return on investment when that happens."

For years, economists have debated how minimum-wage increases impact the teenage workforce.

The Employment Policies Institute in Washington, which opposed the recent increases, cited 2003 data by Federal Reserve economists showing a 10 percent increase caused a 2 percent to 3 percent decrease in employment.

It also cited comments by notedeconomist Milton Friedman, who maintained that high teen unemployment rates were largely the result of minimum-wage laws.

"After a wage hike, employers seek to take fewer chances on individuals with little education or experience," one institute researcher told lawmakers in 2004.

Tom Kelly, owner of Mary Coyle Ol' Fashion Ice Cream Parlor in Phoenix, voted for the minimum-wage increase. But he said, "The new law has impacted us quite a bit."

It added about $2,000 per month in expenses. The store, which employs mostly teen workers, has cut back on hours and has not replaced a couple of workers who quit.

Kelly raised the wages of workers who already made above minimum wage to ensure pay scales stayed even. As a result, "we have to be a lot more efficient" and must increase menu prices, he said.

While most of the state's 124,067 workers between the ages of 16 and 19 made well above $5.15 per hour before the change, the new law has created real-life economic opportunities.

Liliana Hernandez brings home noticeably more under the new law. The 18-year-old, who attends Metro Tech High School in Phoenix and works part time at Central High School, is saving the extra money, maybe to put towards buying a used car.

Hernandez said she deserves the raise just like any other Arizona worker even if she still lives with her parents.

"I'm doing the best I can and working hard like everyone else," she said.

In the months leading up to last November's vote, advocates of the new law maintained that it would help Arizona create a "living wage" for some of the poorest workers.

The Economic Policy Institute estimated that 145,000 Arizonans would receive a pay raise. That was how many made $5.15 to $6.74 per hour.

At one press conference, a mother described how she was unable to afford basic school supplies for her son.

Opponents, however, said there was little talk about teenage workers. "Everyone wanted to focus on the other aspects of the minimum-wage campaign," said Michelle Bolton, Arizona state director of the National Federation of Independent Business.

An Employment Policies Institute study determined that 30.1 percent of affected workers in Arizona fell between the ages of 16 and 19.

"Workers affected by the minimum-wage increase are less likely to be supporting a family than the typical Arizona worker," it stated. "For example, 30.4 percent of the workers are living with their parent or parents, while only 7.6 percent of all Arizona workers are in this category."

John Weischedel, a senior at the East Valley Institute of Technology in Mesa, knows he is lucky to be making $8 per hour at an auto dealership and learning technical skills. So are most of his friends who make $9 or more per hour while still attending high school.

After the minimum-wage law went into effect, "a couple of my friends got laid off - they worked in fast food," he said. "They're going to wait until they're out of high school to find other jobs."

Link (http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0210biz-teenwork0210.html)

.....................

[vinny_121_ND]

If you want a real job, stay in school, get a good solid education, and then more options are available instead of working fast food.

[Hunterhr]

If you want a real job, stay in school, get a good solid education, and then more options are available instead of working fast food.

...these are High School students working part time jobs.

:roll:

[Kaapeli]

Why not drop the minimum wage to one dollar and get jobs for 8-year olds too. Think of the employment boom.

[Hollis]

Why not drop the minimum wage to one dollar and get jobs for 8-year olds too. Think of the employment boom.

I don't how to take that, maybe you were born with a golden spoon in your mouth.

Summer employment here use to offer kids to raise money for school cloths and stuff. BUT... laws like this killed summer jobs for kids. So what do the kids do? Are you going to take them shopping and pick up the bill. Or Make another person pick up the bill. Some kids parents don't have the resources to buy them Guchie shoes........... Hell Wal-Mart is high end for some of them.

[Kaapeli]

I don't how to take that, maybe you were born with a golden spoon in your mouth.

Nope. I still have summerjobs since I'm an university student.


Summer employment here use to offer kids to raise money for school cloths and stuff. BUT... laws like this killed summer jobs for kids. So what do the kids do? Are you going to take them shopping and pick up the bill. Or Make another person pick up the bill. Some kids parents don't have the resources to buy them Guchie shoes........... Hell Wal-Mart is high end for some of them.

I think 2 percent decrease in teenagers summerjobs is a good tradeoff for a 10% pay increase to low wage workers (the 70% that don't have their mummies and daddies to pay for everything except nice new shoes) who are actually trying to live with their pay and not just buy fashionable clothing.

[Straker]

Could you not have an incremental minimum wage system like we do in the UK.

It isn't perfect, certainly employers favour young people because they can pay them less and people are paid differing amounts for
doing the same job. However, it hasn't seemed to hurt employment figures that much.

[ßå$tĮТHÏ¿ð]

Wow $5.15/$6.75 an hour, how can you make anything working that even full time!

Its hard for school kids to make a decent amount of money while studying...and I hope that raise helps alot of those kids out. Cause not everyone is rich.

[PanzerMaster]

When I hear the employer of minimum wage workers talking against pay raise I really want to see him and his family butchered and sold for organs in the far east market.

Shame on people who employ minimun wage workers... the are not enterprenours, only leech! :bash::bash::bash::bash:

[Will938]

Um, those who say that mommy and daddy buy kids everything except those fancy new shoes they're working for...I had a part time job (full time in the summers) my jr/sr years so I could pay for my vehicle and save money for college. (I had a job fish/soph years too, but it wasn't a real W-2 job, more of my dad telling me to "bust up that concrete" and clean worksites) Not every kid is a spoiled brat who gets everything on a silver platter. Mommy and daddy arn't always there to take care of every little problem, I count myself lucky for the support I was given and that my employer was gracious enough to give me fair wages.

If I had been laid off or had reduced wages, I'd be in a lot more debt right now then I'm already in because of the rediculous increases in education costs. I'll stop there before I enter another rant about affirmative action.

[Hollis]

Nope. I still have summerjobs since I'm an university student.



I think 2 percent decrease in teenagers summerjobs is a good tradeoff for a 10% pay increase to low wage workers (the 70% that don't have their mummies and daddies to pay for everything except nice new shoes) who are actually trying to live with their pay and not just buy fashionable clothing.

OK, it is a trade off. There are marginal jobs that if they became too expensive, they would be cut. It would be nice if there was some way to have "youth Jobs", A kid living at home does not need the wage a single parent does. In picking, it is a flat rate job, a picker got so much for a flat. But when the law was passed to guarantee a minimum wage, kids where not allowed to pick. People who were good at picking did pretty good, above min. wage. Many kids were less. This allowed kids to still earn money commensurate with their ability. The farmer got paid by the flat also. So you can it did not help kids out.

There were strong arguments either direction. But your 2% is really over time much more than 2%. With the continuous loss of employment for summer time job for kids. BTW Kids, I am referring to those still in the K - 12 Grades.

Sometimes laws are passed to insure fairness, but they are never 100% and maybe very questionable as to who they help.

[Geezah]

Wow $5.15/$6.75 an hour, how can you make anything working that even full time!

Its hard for school kids to make a decent amount of money while studying...and I hope that raise helps alot of those kids out. Cause not everyone is rich.

I worked a paper round when I was 13/14, I worked in Waitrose when I was at 6th Form, earning min wage. I still lived at home with my parents but earnt enough disposable income to blow on sweets and computer games, so I'm not sure why all the fuss.

[ren0312]

Well last time i checked, Hong Kong has no minimum wage, which according to neoclassical economic theory, helps keep its unemployment rate low. Since the wage rate is determined by market forces, so if the unemployment rate is low, the wage rate will go up, if it is high, the wage rate will naturally go down, law of supply and demand.

[Hunterhr]

When I hear the employer of minimum wage workers talking against pay raise I really want to see him and his family butchered and sold for organs in the far east market.

Shame on people who employ minimun wage workers... the are not enterprenours, only leech! :bash::bash::bash::bash:

So how much do you feel people should make for working the fryer at McDonald's?

[Kaapeli]

Over here McDonald's workers basic salary is 8,25 euros per hour (they are under a collective bargaining agreement). It can increase up to 10 euros with a few years of experience.
And it's so hard work with such a high turnover rate that they are constantly seeking new employees. Even today I saw a recruitment posters everywhere when I ate my lunch there. Wouldn't like to work there even for the 8,25e and sure as hell not for 4e (that's 5,15$ in euros).

[Durandal]

If you want a real job, stay in school, get a good solid education, and then more options are available instead of working fast food.

True, like 45 to 100K in student loan debt.

[Violet Fashion by Mindy]

A person should be able to afford to support a family of 2 children on min wage.

[Calanen]

That's why I say these days we live in Neofeudalism, not capitalism. Capitalism died in the 60s and maybe the 70s.

[Violet Fashion by Mindy]

I've been saying that for years that today's society is no different then the medieval period.

Despite democracy the wealthy are still the ones with the power.

[Durandal]

I've been saying that for years that today's society is no different then the medieval period.

Despite democracy the wealthy are still the ones with the power.

No offense man, but the last time I checked, a majority of Americans are land owners, not serfs.

I am fairly well read in the area of French Feudalism and I have to say, the comparisons of todays disparity of wealth to that of French Nobles and their serfs is neither accurate or well thought out.

Oh, and dude, what ever happened to your trip over here?

[Durandal]

A person should be able to afford to support a family of 2 children on min wage.

I think a person should make a choice to not have children until they can afford them.

Just out of curiosity, how do you define "support"?

[Violet Fashion by Mindy]

Having a roof over their heads, either through renting, governmant assisted housing or low value ownership. Being able to provide the family with the staple 3 meals a day. And ensure the family has adequate clothing.

Nothing more nothing less.

The comparison to today and the fuedal period is still quite valid. I admit there is a higher % of business owners and landownership. However just think about power the wealthy have to control decision making as opposed to yourself?

Supermarkets have forced the farmers to lower prices through shear buying power, companies are trying to reverse 100 years of working conditions and real wage growth. It goes on.

[sir-chimp]

A person should be able to afford to support a family of 2 children on min wage.

What the hell do you smoke before you decide to take a shot at posting?

F_uck I worked three jobs while IN highschool attending college level classes.

I ran my own business and worked two other jobs out of highschool because I wanted to advance myself and I did.

You want to make more f_ucking money? Work for it. You aint owed jack s_hit by the world.

[Geezah]

What the hell do you smoke before you decide to take a shot at posting?

F_uck I worked three jobs while IN highschool attending college level classes.

I ran my own business and worked two other jobs out of highschool because I wanted to advance myself and I did.

You want to make more f_ucking money? Work for it. You aint owed jack s_hit by the world.

As much as I like Min, he sure does have some crazy ideas.

When I moved here, I worked for close to 9mths(for a company my cousin worked for doing maintenance on heavy machinery) earning min wage cutting truck bed mats, then during the summer I would clock out at my day job and clock back in during the 2nd shift under the owners other company, which I found out after was illegal when we should have been paid overtime.


Anywho, I did what I had to to get a start, I went back to the UK after roughly 9mths to see if I wanted to stay in the US, and on my return got back into the building trade.
I have since worked my way up and I have allot more to show for my troubles.
The problem is, some people are content doing the bare minimum(sp), me, I want to live a comfortable life over here, and between me and the Wife, we own our home(or the bank does)it came with a swimming pool and we live in a decent neighbourhood, we have two cars that were purchased new.
It burns my hide when you have people that want to leach off of those that have done their best to live the American dream and to be honest I think Mins comments are stupid(in a polite wayp-)).

I would have more respect for people that give it a go and fail, than those that just assume we owe them sh!t.

[shocker1]

The comparison to today and the fuedal period is still quite valid. I admit there is a higher % of business owners and landownership. However just think about power the wealthy have to control decision making as opposed to yourself?


By the looney lefts criteria I am one of those wealthy exploiters of the poor. My income is ripe for their socialist paradise to rape. Fuedal period? What a bunch a bologna that is. If you have nothing in America chances are you never made an effort beyond what is given to you by the tax payers and your favorite charity. I have never worked for min wage but for a brief bag boy job at the grocery store. I think it was $3.75 then plus tips. If you are still making min wage after school you have no intention of making more IMO.

[PanzerMaster]

...

If you are still making min wage after school you have no intention of making more IMO.

I hate the ***** [I put myself the '*'] that keep saying this! Do you ***EVER*** minded that SOME (majority) people CAN'T make more instead of NOT WANT ?????

From what I personally Knowor see, 80-90% of those that make more money or have a good positions are in this condition because of connections or previous wealthy situation! Good Family, good political connections or whatever.

BTW, from what I know again, maybe 10%-20% of people that are on the minimin wage equivalent there (Italy) CHOOSE to not do more because are lazy... the other 80-90%??? No connections.... no wealthy family behind.... heath problems of them or of one relative.

The only good things in this world is that occasionally some wealthy mother****er get killed along with his family in his villa during some robbery!

[Hollis]

As much as I like Min, he sure does have some crazy ideas.




I think Min thinking of only one kind of employee. When a person 1) single, 2) no kids 3) lives at home, 4)parents provide health care 5) THEN depending how much they have to contribute to household expenses their income needs is not the same as a single parent on their own providing for 2 kids with all the health, etc stuff.

plus a college student and a high school student would have different needs too. Next year my son is in high school, his needs is for "folding money" for fun stuff. He won't be able to earn it because the jobs were cut by government interference/protection in employees wages.

[Kaapeli]

Not everyone can be smart and educated no matter how much they wanted to and worked for it. And even if everyone was a professor someone would still have to do the more menial jobs that some of you people considerer "for losers by their own choice".
Many of these people cleaning after you and making burgers for you work many times harder than you and why don't you go ask them are they "content" with making 5 dollars on hour year after year without never getting a raise (minimum wage has stayed the same in USA for decades while the average worker gets an average annual raise of 3%).

[Kaapeli]

plus a college student and a high school student would have different needs too. Next year my son is in high school, his needs is for "folding money" for fun stuff. He won't be able to earn it because the jobs were cut by government interference/protection in employees wages.

How do you know? Has he applied for jobs and been turned down?

[Hunterhr]

Many of these people cleaning after you and making burgers for you work many times harder than you and why don't you go ask them are they "content" with making 5 dollars on hour year after year without never getting a raise (minimum wage has stayed the same in USA for decades while the average worker gets an average annual raise of 3%).

That's fine, but they're still doing a job that literally anyone can do. Anyone can flip burgers or clean floors, of course they're not going to make a lot of money. Why should they?

I did both and I had no problem making minimum wage. I also wasn't stupid enough to try and raise two kids on that salary.

Why do people think you should be able to start squeezing out kids when you're making the minimum amount of money required by law? If you do that, you're going to be in a world of hurt and I could really care less.

[Kaapeli]

That's fine, but they're still doing a job that literally anyone can do. Anyone can flip burgers or clean floors, of course they're not going to make a lot of money. Why should they?

Not anyone. It's damn hard physical work even if it is simple.
But do you consider 6.75$ a lot of money?


I did both and I had no problem making minimum wage. I also wasn't stupid enough to try and raise two kids on that salary.

Unfortunately some people are stupid enough.

[Hollis]

How do you know? Has he applied for jobs and been turned down?

I gather you don't know about the labor laws in the states, age restrictions, etc. Also as I posted earlier there were many more jobs available but, the state decided to close those doors to kids. One really big source of summer income here was picking crops. IT IS GONE, for kids.

Also employers also cut back on "summer" jobs because of cost.

As for me, I use to be on the board of directors for a chamber of commerce near me, owned a small corporation, was on the board of directors for a medical clinic, elected official, and some other. As a elected official I had some oversight of economic development funds. Heck I even have a degree and some graduate classes in business. I think I have a fairly reasonable view of the business world around me.

[Kaapeli]

I gather you don't know about the labor laws in the states, age restrictions, etc. Also as I posted earlier there were many more jobs available but, the state decided to close those doors to kids. One really big source of summer income here was picking crops. IT IS GONE, for kids.

"Kids" aren't supposed to work. Underaged teens can do light parttime work like delivering newspapers, cutting grass etc.
18-year olds are ready for proper adult work for proper adult pay of course.


Also employers also cut back on "summer" jobs because of cost.

Good. Using kids for hard work on crappy pay is supposed to get cut.


As for me, I use to be on the board of directors for a chamber of commerce near me, owned a small corporation, was on the board of directors for a medical clinic, elected official, and some other. As a elected official I had some oversight of economic development funds. Heck I even have a degree and some graduate classes in business. I think I have a fairly reasonable view of the business world around me.

So you're privileged and apparently doing very well. And you go around demanding that already poor people should work for less money. Nice.

[Hunterhr]

Not anyone. It's damn hard physical work even if it is simple.
But do you consider 6.75$ a lot of money?

I consider $6.75 a perfectly reasonable amount of money for the labor that's being performed.

It isn't that difficult to find a higher wage. I paint houses during the summer for $10 an hour.


Unfortunately some people are stupid enough.

Then they can deal with their stupidity themselves. Why should other people have to?


Good. Using kids for hard work on crappy pay is supposed to get cut.

What? What exactly entitles kids to work anything other than jobs that involve hard work and crappy pay? My first few jobs growing up all sucked. They motivated me to improve myself.

[Kaapeli]

I consider $6.75 a perfectly reasonable amount of money for the labor that's being performed.

But weren't we talking about the 5.15 -> 6.75 raise here and how bad it was?


Then they can deal with their stupidity themselves. Why should other people have to?

Exactly! Other people = the children of such a parent.


What? What exactly entitles kids to work anything other than jobs that involve hard work and crappy pay? My first few jobs growing up all sucked. They motivated me to improve myself.

Well duh!? Because they're children perhaps?
Please don't tell me you're pro-child labour.

[Hollis]

"Kids" aren't supposed to work. Underaged teens can do light parttime work like delivering newspapers, cutting grass etc.
18-year olds are ready for proper adult work for proper adult pay of course.



Good. Using kids for hard work on crappy pay is supposed to get cut.



So you're privileged and apparently doing very well. And you go around demanding that already poor people should work for less money. Nice.


You sure read a lot into something. Jeepers, I am done with you, Slave labor is gone, Unsafe working conditions, Liability etc,. ended all are that crap. You are just to damn clueless about the states,,,,,,,,,and always inserting some BS slave labor crap for kids. This is not the 1860's................. wake up and stop reading Das Kaptial (written in the 1800's) this is 21st century.

[Hunterhr]

Well duh!? Because they're children perhaps?
Please don't tell me you're pro-child labour.

Jesus dude, we're talking about teenagers working at pet shops and painting houses, not some six year olds working at a textile mill.

You obviously don't have any clue what the rest of us are talking about.

[Kaapeli]

You obviously don't have any clue what the rest of us are talking about.

Sure I do. You're against poor people getting a raise that they haven't had in decades with the pretext of 3% loss of summerjobs for teenagers. Why not just be honest and say "**** the poor" when we all know that's what this is actually about?

[shocker1]

I hate the ***** [I put myself the '*'] that keep saying this! Do you ***EVER*** minded that SOME (majority) people CAN'T make more instead of NOT WANT ?????

From what I personally Knowor see, 80-90% of those that make more money or have a good positions are in this condition because of connections or previous wealthy situation! Good Family, good political connections or whatever.

BTW, from what I know again, maybe 10%-20% of people that are on the minimin wage equivalent there (Italy) CHOOSE to not do more because are lazy... the other 80-90%??? No connections.... no wealthy family behind.... heath problems of them or of one relative.

The only good things in this world is that occasionally some wealthy mother****er get killed along with his family in his villa during some robbery!
Your a freakin genius.:roll:

[Hunterhr]

Sure I do. You're against poor people getting a raise that they haven't had in decades with the pretext of 3% loss of summerjobs for teenagers. Why not just be honest and say "**** the poor" when we all know that's what this is actually about?

Poor people=Making minimum wage.

Raising minimum wage=Less minimum wage jobs for teenagers... and poor people! Or are they somehow working different minimum wage jobs?

Logically if you're increasing the minimum wage to help the poor, your also cutting jobs from other poor people. Understand?

No idea where you got **** the poor from. I merely stated that you shouldn't be trying to raise two kids on a minimum wage job.

[Hunterhr]

Double post.

[Kaapeli]

Poor people=Making minimum wage.

Correct.


Raising minimum wage=Less minimum wage jobs for teenagers... and poor people!

Wrong. Teenager summerjobs have almost nothing to do with poverty and alleviating it. It's additional income for minors who are provided for by their parents by law.

[Durandal]

Jesus dude, we're talking about teenagers working at pet shops and painting houses, not some six year olds working at a textile mill.

You obviously don't have any clue what the rest of us are talking about.

THe husband of a family of four can be making more than twice an hour than the minimum wage and still be considered poor.

Not too sure what you are talking about.

Minimum wage is such a non-issue on both sides its silly seeing everyone get riled up about it.

A) Most Americans make several dollars above the proposed increase in minimum wage.

B) Few Americans actually make minimum wage.

To all the pro-min wage increase folks...its impact on people trying to making a living wage is going to be irrelevant.

To all those against it, the only people that are going to have to lay people off are the dirtbags who have $hitty workers.

To both, this is America and a majority of the people in this nation are Christians...that means we live in the land of opportunity (for some) and we like to help our fellow man (in times of need).

Somwhere there is a middle ground and simply saying all these people are abused by the system OR all these people are lazy scum suckers is simply...


...dumb.

We live in a time when CEOs that run companies into the ground are rewarded with pay outs and options worth millions and yet we bicker about 2.00 USD...

[Hunterhr]

THe husband of a family of four can be making more than twice an hour than the minimum wage and still be considered poor.

Minimum wage is such a non-issue on both sides its silly seeing everyone get riled up about it.

A) Most Americans make several dollars above the proposed increase in minimum wage.

B) Few Americans actually make minimum wage.


That's my point. Raising the minimum wage isn't going be some magical cure for poverty. If you're actually trying to make some sort of living off of minimum wage you're in serious trouble.

[Hollis]

That's my point. Raising the minimum wage isn't going be some magical cure for poverty. If you're actually trying to make some sort of living off of minimum wage you're in serious trouble.

I agree with both you and Durandal, It is feel good legislature nothing more. BUT!! it ends a lot of little jobs,,,,,,, or as a few people do, they get paid under the table.

The problem was defined a long time ago, you can not legislate morality. When the government messes with the market, it does so in a contrived way that benefits one group at the cost to another group.

[PanzerMaster]

Your a freakin genius.:roll:

An idiotic genius , I know. I still haven't learn to not post when in anger.

[PanzerMaster]

Poor people=Making minimum wage.

Raising minimum wage=Less minimum wage jobs for teenagers... and poor people! Or are they somehow working different minimum wage jobs?

Logically if you're increasing the minimum wage to help the poor, your also cutting jobs from other poor people. Understand?

No idea where you got **** the poor from. I merely stated that you shouldn't be trying to raise two kids on a minimum wage job.

So if we bring minimun wage to 0.5$/hours we will create a lot of job for the poors? Sir, you resolved the problem of many nations! :hug:

[Nano]

The minimum wage increase does more harm than good. Price increases as a result of the increase in the minimum wage will make everyone's money worth less. This is all just feel good do no good legislation. I remember someone saying that good intentions cause more problems than they have solve.

[Nano]

So if we bring minimun wage to 0.5$/hours we will create a lot of job for the poors? Sir, you resolved the problem of many nations! :hug:
It's already being done its called outsourcing labor.

[Kaapeli]

Price increases as a result of the increase in the minimum wage will make everyone's money worth less.

It's called inflation and it's happening constantly while there is economic growth. This is why the average personal income also increases 3-5% each year. Except for those earning minimum wage who are only getting poorer because their pay remains the same while prices increase.