Propaganda for Uninen

[SeanAshi]

Palestinian and Arab spokesmen commonly claim that the recent Palestinian terrorism is the result of the Israeli 'occupation' of the West Bank and Gaza, adding that the violence will cease only when the 'occupation' is ended.

Despite this claim, it should be recalled that the many Palestinian and Arab rejectionist factions (such as the Hamas and the Hizbullah) repeatedly declare that even if Israel would fully withdraw from the territories they will continue their attacks, since they refute Israel's basic right to exist.

More importantly, however, the basic premise of the Palestinian claim - that the 'occupation' causes terrorism - is historically flawed. Arab and Palestinian terrorism against Israel existed prior to the beginning of Israeli control over the West Bank and Gaza as a result of the Six Day War of June 1967, and even prior to the establishment of the State of Israel in May 1948.

For example, Arab terrorism was rampant during wave of anti-Jewish riots in 1920-21 (which was characterized by the brutal murder in Jaffa of the prominent Jewish author Y. Brenner), during the 'Disturbances' of 1929 (which included the massacre of the Jewish community in Hebron), during the Arab Revolt of 1936-39, and in many other recorded incidents of wholesale anti-Jewish Arab violence throughout the pre-state period.

Pizdeet kak Trotsky

[Javehn]

Pizdeet kak Trotsky

:lol:
Where did you heard that , Ashi ?

[Uninen]

More importantly, however, the basic premise of the Palestinian claim - that the 'occupation' causes terrorism - is historically flawed. Arab and Palestinian terrorism against Israel existed prior to the beginning of Israeli control over the West Bank and Gaza as a result of the Six Day War of June 1967, and even prior to the establishment of the State of Israel in May 1948.

Pizdeet kak Trotsky

Ever stopped to think that the land actually belongs to the Palestinian Arabs and not to the Jews? That is if we ignore that what is writen in the "bible"..... and its not just West Bank and Gaza that is their land, ITS ALL OF IT.

Also can you remember the ethnic clensings made by Israeli troops and terrorists organisations during the "war of independence".?

I can, and im sure that every Palestinian also does......

Nothing is black and white just remember that.

Futhermore, read this, part of my nations history:

http://www.snipercountry.com/ValkoinenKuolema.html

Oh yeah, I MUST BE THE WORLDS BIGGEST COMMUNIST...... fook you! :slap:

[ronin2172]

what is your problem Uninen? I think u have selective memory when it comes to history.

Also can you remember the ethnic clensings made by Israeli troops and terrorists organisations during the "war of independence".?

To which ethnic cleansing do u refer? There was only one incident that happened then and that was blown way out of proportion by Arab propoganda. How do i know? Well one of the Palestinians who was there said so. Yes the Israeli's did attack the village, yes it was wrong, but who stopped them from killing everyone there? Other israelis. And they were not israeli troops they were more of a paramilitary organization.

Your bias is so obvious it's pathetic.


Ever stopped to think that the land actually belongs to the Palestinian Arabs and not to the Jews?

So i guess that the fact that jews had been living there BEFORE there was a palestine escapes your logic.

[Uninen]

ronin2172,

Cofusing things again? Jews did infact "ethnicly clense" numerous villages and burned them to ground, i didnt claim that they actually murdered all that much people in those let alone raped.....

But some civilians (unarmed) did also die...... but cases ive heard those have been by mistake....... and by grenades that have been thrown into the buildings trough windows... so the trooper that did it had no way knowing that who if anyone was inside.......

This is how it happened with Israels army troopers.....

But the members of few Israeli terrorist organisations actually on many occasions massacred people in cold blood.... but if Army unit arraived in the scene, they usually did their best to stop those bastards.

[hey]

It's nice to say things when you don't have any facts and proves to back them up. you keep throwing so called "facts" to the air ,in this thread and in others.
learn history (from objective books and other sources) then if your opinions still wont change we could all sit down and talk about it. until then please, shut up.

thanks :|

[ronin2172]

that is not ethnicly cleanse....stop using inflammatory terms out of context. U r the one getting things confused because u r biased. What the serbs were accused of in Bosnia is ethnicly cleansing. Forcing all the muslims to get out and taking away all the men whom were of fighting age to never be seen again (in other words murdered and/or placed in concentration camps). Did the israelis do that? No.

[Uninen]

ronin2172,


Ethnic cleansing

The term ethnic cleansing refers to various policies of forcibly removing people of another ethnic group. At one end of the spectrum, it is virtually indistinguishable from forced emigration and population transfer, while at the other it merges with deportation and genocide.

At the most general level, however, ethnic cleansing can be understood as the expulsion of an "undesirable" population from a given territory due to religious or ethnic discrimination, political, strategic or ideological considerations, or a combination of these.

It was just that, or did i fail to mention that THEY FORCED THE PALESTINIAN VILLAGERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES, AND DID NOT ALLOW THEM TO RETURN, OR DIDNT YOU JUST KNOW?

:petting:

[Vance]

ronin2172,


Ethnic cleansing

The term ethnic cleansing refers to various policies of forcibly removing people of another ethnic group. At one end of the spectrum, it is virtually indistinguishable from forced emigration and population transfer, while at the other it merges with deportation and genocide.

At the most general level, however, ethnic cleansing can be understood as the expulsion of an "undesirable" population from a given territory due to religious or ethnic discrimination, political, strategic or ideological considerations, or a combination of these.

It was just that, or did i fail to mention that THEY FORCED THE PALESTINIAN VILLAGERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES, AND DID NOT ALLOW THEM TO RETURN, OR DIDNT YOU JUST KNOW?

:petting:
I still don't think that's ethnic cleansing - I'm sure Allied soldiers during WWII displaced German civilians from their homes, but I don't call that ethnic cleansing.

[Uninen]

It's nice to say things when you don't have any facts and proves to back them up. you keep throwing so called "facts" to the air ,in this thread and in others.
learn history (from objective books and other sources) then if your opinions still wont change we could all sit down and talk about it. until then please, shut up.

thanks :|

The 50 years war - israel and the arabs, from PBS...... should be easy enough for even you to understand..... theres all the big names of all sides that are still alive telling about these things, and even the Israelis, even Sharon is very open and truthful about the issues.

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B00004TX2W.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

"50 Years War, The: Israel and the Arabs

Leading statesmen, generals, terrorists and others who made the headlines in one of history's most bitter and enduring struggles tell the story of the Arab-Israeli conflict in The 50 Years War: Israel and the Arabs. Opening with the U.N decision to partition Palestine in 1947, the program charts the ensuing half-century of enmity, warfare, mediation and negotiation."

Link! (http://www.google.fi/search?hl=fi&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=PBS+The+50+years+war+-+israel+and+the+arabs&btnG=Hae)

[S'13]

ronin2172,


Ethnic cleansing

The term ethnic cleansing refers to various policies of forcibly removing people of another ethnic group. At one end of the spectrum, it is virtually indistinguishable from forced emigration and population transfer, while at the other it merges with deportation and genocide.

At the most general level, however, ethnic cleansing can be understood as the expulsion of an "undesirable" population from a given territory due to religious or ethnic discrimination, political, strategic or ideological considerations, or a combination of these.

It was just that, or did i fail to mention that THEY FORCED THE PALESTINIAN VILLAGERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES, AND DID NOT ALLOW THEM TO RETURN, OR DIDNT YOU JUST KNOW?

:petting:

Actually a transfer is a more suitable term to use...

The Arabs did the smae with over 800,000 Jews living in Arab countries.

http://www.jajz-ed.org.il/100/maps/refs.html

In 1945 there were more than 870,000 Jews living in the various Arab states. Many of their communities dated back 2,500 years. Throughout 1947 and 1948 these Jews were persecuted. Their property and belongings were confiscated. There were anti-Jewish riots in Aden, Egypt, Lybia, Syria, and Iraq. In Iraq, Zionism was made a capital crime. Approximately 600,000 Jews sought refuge in the State of Israel.(1) They arrived destitute, but they were absorbed into the society and became an integral part of the state. In effect, then, a veritable exchange of populations took place between Arab and Jewish refugees. Thus the Jewish refugees became full Israeli citizens while the Arab refugees remained "refugees" according to the wishes of the Arab leaders.

[hey]

Uninen wrote:


It was just that, or did i fail to mention that THEY FORCED THE PALESTINIAN VILLAGERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES, AND DID NOT ALLOW THEM TO RETURN, OR DIDNT YOU JUST KNOW?

If this is the case . how the f*ck there is 1,200,000 arabs living in Israel right now? Didn't we "FORCED THE PALESTINIAN VILLAGERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES, AND DID NOT ALLOW THEM TO RETURN"?

[Uninen]

I still don't think that's ethnic cleansing - I'm sure Allied soldiers during WWII displaced German civilians from their homes, but I don't call that ethnic cleansing.

The part of them not been "allowed back at their homes" / "their homes being destroyed or taken over" is the part what makes it ethnic cleansing..

They were not "displaced"..... if not 50 years in exile is what is your idea of being "displaced".........

Whole villages burned to ground, on many occasions..... and many also just fled in panic..... as they thought that "Israelis were comming to rape them" which they didnt on any occasion... that was due one certain false claim to gain symphaty that "kinda" back fired when people fled their homes like i said in panic.......

[Uninen]

Uninen wrote:


It was just that, or did i fail to mention that THEY FORCED THE PALESTINIAN VILLAGERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES, AND DID NOT ALLOW THEM TO RETURN, OR DIDNT YOU JUST KNOW?

If this is the case . how the f*ck there is 1,200,000 arabs living in Israel right now? Didn't we "FORCED THE PALESTINIAN VILLAGERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES, AND DID NOT ALLOW THEM TO RETURN"?

From certain villages they were forced out, and not allowed to return, those people remain "ethnicly cleansed", and like i just said... many people fled their homes in panic... they also werent allowed back.

[radon]

For example, Arab terrorism was rampant during wave of anti-Jewish riots in 1920-21 (which was characterized by the brutal murder in Jaffa of the prominent Jewish author Y. Brenner), during the 'Disturbances' of 1929 (which included the massacre of the Jewish community in Hebron), during the Arab Revolt of 1936-39, and in many other recorded incidents of wholesale anti-Jewish Arab violence throughout the pre-state period.

Pizdeet kak Trotsky

Ok. But if Palestinians ,even if there never was such a nation back then , did not like the big and growing jewish immigration to the area in the last decades. I got this stuff from Mideastweb.

http://www.mideastweb.org/briefhistory.htm
" By 1914, the total population of Palestine stood at about 700,000. About 615,000 were Arabs, and 85,000 to 100,000 were Jews. (See population figures). "

And then for example look here.
http://www.mideastweb.org/palpop.htm

-
And my opinion to this was "average Israeli citizen" in that test . But when I see this history I can only see Israel was created by force. But that is history and this is topic is about that[/quote]

[IDFM203]

From certain villages they were forced out, and not allowed to return, those people remain "ethnicly cleansed", and like i just said... many people fled their homes in panic... they also werent allowed back.yes we aren’t perfect and some of us in the past did as you say but MOST did not and MOST of the pali's fled on their own from the commands and wishes of their invading Arab brethren (that told thme to get out of the way and that they can return after thier "short victory") that had attacked in their effort to annihilate every single Jew.

secondly at the time Israel made it very clear that anyone that chose to stay can and become full citizens and guess what, thousands and thousands did so to the point that now there is over a million Israeli Arabs, letting in Arabs is hardly a sign of mass expelling them.

Now of course after they invaded to wipe us out, to have a full return would be almost committing suicide as is the case now of allowing that to happen.


Shalom :D

[radon]

Palestinian and Arab spokesmen commonly claim that the recent Palestinian terrorism is the result of the Israeli 'occupation' of the West Bank and Gaza, adding that the violence will cease only when the 'occupation' is ended.

Then following decades old listing of violence.

----
This is very cheap imo. Comparing the situation then and what it is like now that. This is cheap , it is Propaganda. And I dont say anything about the Arab spokesmen.

[ronin2172]

ronin2172,


Ethnic cleansing

The term ethnic cleansing refers to various policies of forcibly removing people of another ethnic group. At one end of the spectrum, it is virtually indistinguishable from forced emigration and population transfer, while at the other it merges with deportation and genocide.

At the most general level, however, ethnic cleansing can be understood as the expulsion of an "undesirable" population from a given territory due to religious or ethnic discrimination, political, strategic or ideological considerations, or a combination of these.

It was just that, or did i fail to mention that THEY FORCED THE PALESTINIAN VILLAGERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES, AND DID NOT ALLOW THEM TO RETURN, OR DIDNT YOU JUST KNOW?

:petting:

when did israel Expulse the arabs from their lands?

Main Entry: ex·pel
****unciation: ik-'spel
Function: transitive verb
Inflected Form(s): ex·pelled; ex·pel·ling
Etymology: Middle English expellen, from Latin expellere, from ex- + pellere to drive -- more at FELT
1 : to force out : EJECT <expelled the smoke from her lungs>
2 : to force to leave (as a place or organization) by official action : take away rights or privileges of membership <expelled from college>

yet you say:

as they thought that "Israelis were comming to rape them" which they didnt on any occasion... that was due one certain false claim to gain symphaty that "kinda" back fired when people fled their homes like i said in panic.......

So acording to your own words the israeli's did not have any offical policy to expulsing or evicting Arabs. Therefore we see that there is no ethnic cleansing. The arabs left on their own accord, NOT by official israeli action.

We all know that some israeli's committed atrocities but they did not exceed what the Arabs did. And the PBS documentary did not support your ethnic cleansing claim whatsoever, so stop using it as your 'source'

[Mr. Nielsen]

I still don't think that's ethnic cleansing - I'm sure Allied soldiers during WWII displaced German civilians from their homes, but I don't call that ethnic cleansing.

I'm sure that, british and US forces would allow german civilians to return to their homes as soon as possible, considering the military situation.

On the eastern front however, Stalin was responsible for massive etnic cleansing of germans civilians, killing hundred og thousands in the process.

[Mr. Nielsen]

Actually a transfer is a more suitable term to use...

Yeah. Sounds almost nice.
But it's still just a synonym for etnic cleansing.



The Arabs did the smae with over 800,000 Jews living in Arab countries.

It would still be no excuse as it happened after the israeli expulsion of the palestinians. And it is certainly not the palestnians problem.



If this is the case . how the f*ck there is 1,200,000 arabs living in Israel right now? Didn't we "FORCED THE PALESTINIAN VILLAGERS OUT OF THEIR HOMES, AND DID NOT ALLOW THEM TO RETURN"?

Because only about 700.000 were expelled. That left about 150.000 still in their homes or who were only internally displaced.

High birth rates, countered by massive jewish only immigration, has turned them into the present 20% of the population of Israel proper.

[IDFM203]

Because only about 700.000 were expelled. That left about 150.000 still in their homes or who were only internally displaced.

yeah so in your view, we wanted to expell them so that is why we expelled 700,000 but kept 150,000 :roll: :cantbeli: why if we acted to expel the, we didn’t expel all of them, obviously that cant be explained but gees when did something that did not make any sense come into play with you :roll:

No most of the Arabs then fled at the behest of their Arab brethren that had invaded to wipe out and kill very single Jew, and those Arabs that decided to stay, did so as Israel promised all that chose to stay will get Israeli citizenship and in fact thousands and thousand chose that.

That is hardly an act of a nation wanting to do mass expulsions.

Shalom :D

[big80a2]

lol it looks the more northen you go from Israel the more anti Israel the people get :roll: :roll:

[ronin2172]

IDFM203....u r banging your head against a brick wall....lol

Some people in this forum will always believe that certain countries (the US, Israel, Russia in particular) are wrong, the source of all that is bad in the world, or just plain evil.

[IDFM203]

IDFM203....u r banging your head against a brick wall....lol

yeah I know I am..lol :D

What can I say other then I have already been officially diagnosed with a strong degree of masochism...I just can’t help myself ;)

Shalom :D

[UkrainianAmerican]

IDFM203....u r banging your head against a brick wall....lol

Some people in this forum will always believe that certain countries (the US, Israel, Russia in particular) are wrong, the source of all that is bad in the world, or just plain evil.
I think that sums it up perfectly.

[Sayeret]

S'13 wrote:


Actually a transfer is a more suitable term to use...

Mr. Nielsen wrote:


Yeah. Sounds almost nice.
But it's still just a synonym for etnic cleansing.

Learn what ethnic cleansing is befere you say it. Transfer would prevent the death of a lot of people since it would make it harder for the Palestinians to come over to Israel and carry out an attack.