AK47 Bayonet for M1 Carbine?

[YANKEEBOBB]

We do alot of show and tell here and a friend was showing me a bayonet he said was Chinese but these were made to fit the M1 carbine rifle but he didn't know if it was true. So I pulled out my rifle and we tried it and it fit!! Needless to say it blew my mind! An AK bayonet on an M1 carbine?

Anyone have any info about this? I thought maybe during the Korean war and even Vietnam some M1 carbines fell into enemy hands and these were modified to fit the carbines? But were these actually made just for the AK's? Never seen this style of bayonet before.

Here's the pics.

http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/5311/1006ar3.jpg
http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/4687/1007dq4.jpg
http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/6667/1010kx4.jpg
http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/7602/1003da1.jpg
http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/3641/1005ug8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Hollis]

During the Korean war, many Chinese troops where not issued firearms, they were told to use the captured ones or the one from fallen comrades.

The US general encharge gave a order that No firearm was to be left behind, all weapons used to the fullest capacity. The Chinese wave attacks was based on sending in enough people, the defenders could not kill them all in time. One of the worse feelings in combat is when you can not kill them fast enough. I had a Gunny who had 9 confirms with a e-tool during that war.

I don't think anyone really knows how many Chinese soldiers where killed in Korean.

[snake]

Well you hear stories of these young marines holding off wave after wave and them mowing down the Chinese the 50's and BAR's

Maybe only two or three guys left standing afterwards everyone wounded

The number has to be enormous

[haze99]

If I am correct, this is a bayonet for the PRC Type-81 rifle, not M-1 carbine.

[YANKEEBOBB]

If I am correct, this is a bayonet for the PRC Type-81 rifle, not M-1 carbine.

That's what I'm trying to find out, I'll reaseach that.

Thanks for the help, if you are correct!

It looks like it was modified, but that's the mystery to me!

Why?

[scrybe]

I thought a lot of our M1s were sold to Korea about that time. I was told at a gun shop not too long ago that a lot of the .30cal ammo on the market now is actually US made ammo that was sold to Korea, stored for a couple decades, now being sold back to the US. Wouldn't surpise me that if they had a surplus of AK bayonets and a whole lot of imported M1s, they'd find a way to put them both to use.

I'm in no way an expert though.

[YANKEEBOBB]

I thought a lot of our M1s were sold to Korea about that time. I was told at a gun shop not too long ago that a lot of the .30cal ammo on the market now is actually US made ammo that was sold to Korea, stored for a couple decades, now being sold back to the US. Wouldn't surpise me that if they had a surplus of AK bayonets and a whole lot of imported M1s, they'd find a way to put them both to use.

I'm in no way an expert though.

You are correct there was alot of Korean ammo out, 30.06 and carbine etc... but that was S. korean and this seems to be a commie bayonet, but there could be a connection there?

[deagle]

i'd rather have a sword or spear as my baynet, lol

[Malchi]

well here is my bayonet, its a bit diffrent then yours.
the story behind it is that a friend of my father fought
in the Yom Kippur War (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yom_Kippur_War)
he took this as a souvenir from "someone".
now he gave it to me:

http://www.pictor.co.il/lils22/254503/6470986_med.jpg (http://www.pictor.co.il/lils22/254503/6470986.jpg)


can also be used a a wire cutter:

http://www.pictor.co.il/lils22/254503/6471017_med.jpg (http://www.pictor.co.il/lils22/254503/6471017.jpg)

if you want more info send a PM.

anyway the shape of my bayonet's is diffrent then your, probably
diffrent manufacturer.

[gaijinsamurai]

Interesting bayonet, Yankeebob.
Interesting story, Hollis: related to that, I just read an excellent biography of Mao Tse Tung, which states that most of the Chinese "volunteers" in the Korean war were from Nationalist units which had surrendered to the Communists in 1949. Mao was suspicious of their loyalties, and wanted to kill as many of them as possible in a war of attrition. The book further states that Kim Il Sung wanted to end the war much earlier, and it was Mao and Stalin who pushed for its continuation. Ironically, Mao's own son was killed in the war, in an American artillery barrage.

[ShanghaiExpress]

That is a Type-81 rifle bayonet. It was designed to double as a dagger.

The official Chinese Korean war KIA count was ~240,000. Including wounded and non-combat casualties it would probably be close to a million. Names of all Chinese KIAs had been published decades ago. My understanding is in recent years the official KIA count has been revised downward as a number of missing and presumed dead soldiers have turned up alive to claim retirement benefits.

China had no SKS or AK rifles during the Korean War. The Chinese forces deployed to Korea in two waves during the first year. Both waves were around 250,000 men. The first wave was heavily ex-Nationalist troops. Standard weapons were captured Japanese in origin. And only 1/3 were equipped with firearms. The rest carried ammunition and grenades.

The second wave carried out the Spring offensive south of Seoul in 1951. They were much better equipped with Soviet WWII surplus which had been purchased following the outbreak of war. The standard rifle from this point on was the Mosin-Nagant.

I would caution against using Jung Chang's bio on Mao as serious reference. She used a huge amount of heresay and conjecture without real evidence. Mao did enough terrible things to write about without the need tp resort to tabloid sensationalism which discredits serious Mao critics. Unfortunatly more balanced works on Mao do not draw much interest in the West and as a result only sensationalists get published.

For example by 1950 half of the Chinese army were ex-Nationalists. And since the old guard Communist troops were stationed in South China, it's only natural the first wave deployment from North China would have a large number of ex-Nationalists. Although Mao probably was less concerned for the welfare of ex-Nationalist troops than his old guard, he had no need to go out of his way to round up ex-Nationalists for the war. In fact ex-Nationlists troops were the most eager to deploy to Korea because it would earn them credibility in the new regime. After the war they were no longer classified as enemy veterans but rather Korean War volunteers.

[ShanghaiExpress]

http://cache44.51.com/photo5/ba/04/czq0609/49026513cda90d54e5aa7b0f07f68b17.jpg
http://www.junmi.net/uploadpic/20067261633481007.jpg
http://www.junshi99.com/wuqi/UploadFiles_9757/200609/20060922212550976.jpg

[YANKEEBOBB]

Awesome pics man, thanks!! I apreciate all the info on the Korean war but really wanted to know more about the bayonet.

I guess it was just modified for the heck of it. Seems to be a more modern version and not old enough to have been in the korean war then?

It has an insert welded on the inside of the ring and has been modified to clamp on the bayonet lug of the carbine.

[ShanghaiExpress]

I guess it was just modified for the heck of it. Seems to be a more modern version and not old enough to have been in the korean war then?

It has an insert welded on the inside of the ring and has been modified to clamp on the bayonet lug of the carbine.

Mostly likely it was modified. The bayonet was designed for the Type-81 rifle which as the name implies, was adopted in 1981. China received M1 carbines from the US during WWII and the civil war that followed, but these would've worn out by the 1980s. Very few Type-81 rifles were exported to the US, I'm surprised you have a bayonet.

[gaijinsamurai]

Thanks for the insight, Shanghaiexpress. It was indeed Jung Chang's book I was referring to. This book has been banned in China, hasn't it?
I know that it has been heavily criticized.
If the author was indeed sloppy with her research, that is really a shame. That type of scholarship throws the credibility of all of one's work into question.

[ShanghaiExpress]

Thanks for the insight, Shanghaiexpress. It was indeed Jung Chang's book I was referring to. This book has been banned in China, hasn't it?
I know that it has been heavily criticized.
If the author was indeed sloppy with her research, that is really a shame. That type of scholarship throws the credibility of all of one's work into question.

Yes it's banned. Pretty stupid move in my opinon because you can get anything you want in China if you want it bad enough. And a ban just makes it more interesting.

[gaijinsamurai]

I liked her book "Wild Swans". It put a good human face on the victims of the Cultural Revolution, as well as those who fought to try to make a better society.

[ShanghaiExpress]

Wild Swans was pretty good. There are lots of stories like that in Chinese, and each is interesting. Chang is a good autobiographer but not a good biographer. The latter require detached objectivity while the former is about presenting a personal point of view. She was a victim of Mao, and victims are not reliable biographers of their oppressors.

[huurling]

Sorry for upping this "forgotten" post.
Because there is no answer given i will reply.

Half way the 1980's a big U.S. surplus dealer brought in quantities of the T81 bayonet.
Because the market for T81 is / was very small they decided to alter the bayonet so it could fit the M1 carbine.

Have an article about this. But i have to find it before i can tell who the importer was. ( I thought Interarms)