Israeli Combat Point Shooting

[Player]

Kapap Academy

http://www.youtube.com/v/AlRe-wzC1W8

http://www.youtube.com/v/7O4h_GYUnms

[XIE]

nice vids.

[j.moghisi]

out of interest, what handguns are they using?

[RallyPointCebu]

I love this vid. i want to learn. ^_^

[Moledet]

It looks ridiculous, nothing like the courses that the Shabak does. Looks more like boy scouts with guns.

[Alin]

That’s a rather unusual shooting stance (half-squat with leg wide-open and center of gravity to the rear?).

Somewhat contradicts my understanding of shooting basics, although admittedly my knowledge only came from books and handgun magazines.

[j.moghisi]

some websites are saying that the 'Israeli method' has become out dated... i like the idea of point shooting in general though

[Samboka]

To shot fast, there´s nothing better than israeli combat shooting system.
The pointing admits you to fire while havíng only little place. My instructor told me to shot like this and now i will never shot different.

[tango44]

It looks ridiculous, Looks more like boy scouts with guns.


+1 on that it makes me go... rofl

[Kaplanr]

It looks like "Dream Camp" for SWAT wannabes. Kind of like what they used to show on "Fantasy Island" but for real. "Boss, the Kepap, the Kepap".

[IDF_TANKER]

It looks ridiculous, nothing like the courses that the Shabak does. Looks more like boy scouts with guns.

Looks like the light version of the staff we did in the security guards course.
But yes, they look bad - slow, clumsy, unmotivated (no "ra'al"). Maybe because they just started the course ...

[vulpine]

It looks ridiculous, nothing like the courses that the Shabak does. Looks more like boy scouts with guns.

At a SWAT conference a guy that was in YAMAS traineed us roughly the same way.

[IDF_TANKER]

That’s a rather unusual shooting stance (half-squat with leg wide-open and center of gravity to the rear?).

Somewhat contradicts my understanding of shooting basics, although admittedly my knowledge only came from books and handgun magazines.

Several reasons for that:
1) The main reason, as strange as it may sound, it because the first thing a person does when been shut upon or scared by the sound of explosion, is bend his legs and to lower his upper body (kind of instinctive movement we all do when suddenly being scared). To save the time needed to get to the "right" position, you just stay in your current one and open fire.

2) All the shooting happens after you ran or before you run, thus this position is optimal to start running or rapidly stop after running (we don't shut while moving) - your legs already bended, muscles "activated".

3) Low profile - not to be overexposed.

4) Low center of gravity makes the stance more stable - you will not fall if pushed etc.

This stance is actually not easy to get used to, it takes time and training.
After a day of training your legs just killing you. There are infamous "wooden leg" exercises in IDF special units, which includes instructors giving endless low-kicks to the trainees in order to make their legs "wooden" for this stance.

My two shekels...:)

[el_kab0ng]

#4 is not necessarily correct.

We train using the modified weaver stance to be able to stand against rush attacks which might knock you over. If you're squatting with both legs even, then you run the risk of being rolled by an aggressor. The Israeli stance is also known as the Isosceles in certain circles (for those of you who might have learned it by a different name).

As for SWAT wannabes, I've seen SWAT guys who are worse with stance/shooting than what I've seen in those two videos.

Compared to other training videos, I was glad to see the instructors "raising the body temperature" of the trainees to simulate stress conditions. It really changes the dynamics of point shooting when your heart is in your throat and your arms feel like jello.

[playtym]

2) All the shooting happens after you ran or before you run, thus this position is optimal to start running or rapidly stop after running (we don't shut while moving) - your legs already bended, muscles "activated".

You guys end up in that wide-legged stance because when you run up to a target and stop to engage it you come to a stop by planting your feet in progressively wider positions with each step in order to stop yourselves, correct?

[IDF_TANKER]

You guys end up in that wide-legged stance because when you run up to a target and stop to engage it you come to a stop by planting your feet in progressively wider positions with each step in order to stop yourselves, correct?

In order to stop after a fast running we perform a series of small very "aggressive" steps (in course we called it ABS brakes:); in the video they just don't do it well), so I guess it just natural to end the steps in the wide position...

[KaceCoyote]

Point shooting is retarded. if your under lets say, 20 feet then the sights arent going to be used anyway. Your going to "point not aim" the gun anyway, and I think making this very natural reality of combat shooting something you conciously think about rather than just -do- is a bad idea. Shoot fast, and shoot natural.

Too many schools teaching too much bull**** that guys who never saw combat came up with.

[el_kab0ng]

Point shooting is retarded. if your under lets say, 20 feet then the sights arent going to be used anyway. Your going to "point not aim" the gun anyway, and I think making this very natural reality of combat shooting something you conciously think about rather than just -do- is a bad idea. Shoot fast, and shoot natural.

I think that was the whole point of the course...

I'm not about to punk on you and ask your level of extensive experience with shooting tactics... but a guy who is much wiser than both you or I once said when the SHTF, you won't default to your level of training... you default to the level of training you've mastered. This implies that the training you accomplish should become automatic. Use what works for YOU.. since that is who you are ultimately trying to defend.

[IDF_TANKER]

Point shooting is retarded. if your under lets say, 20 feet then the sights arent going to be used anyway. Your going to "point not aim" the gun anyway, and I think making this very natural reality of combat shooting something you conciously think about rather than just -do- is a bad idea. Shoot fast, and shoot natural.

Too many schools teaching too much bull**** that guys who never saw combat came up with.

Who said anything about shooting without aiming? We aim always from any distance. Or I didn't understand you ..?

[KaceCoyote]

Who said anything about shooting without aiming? We aim always from any distance. Or I didn't understand you ..?

You didnt understand me. I say, You aim with sights. You point with a "feeling" IE you aim a rifle, you point a shotgun. Does that make sense?

If we already point, when we have a OMFG moment then why do we need to be taught how to do it?