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Lazy Lob
03-27-2007, 03:26 PM
I could’ve just seen this getting out of hand. A stupid law would mean (thanks to ECHR and discrimination laws) that no one is responsible for their actions once pissed.


Judges clarify drunken rape law
The law on rape in cases where an allegation is made after heavy drinking has been clarified by appeal judges.

Three Court of Appeal judges said someone who consumed "substantial" quantities of alcohol could still be capable of consenting to ***.

However, the judges said if a complainant lost the capacity to consent then that would amount to rape.

They addressed the issue in the case of Benjamin Bree, 25, from Southampton, who had his rape conviction quashed.

The computer software engineer had been found guilty of raping a 19-year-old student after an evening of heavy drinking.

'Substantial quantities'

Sir Igor Judge, Lady Justice Hallett and Mrs Justice Gloster said the appeal had required them to "address the effect of voluntary heavy alcohol consumption as it applies to the law of rape".

In making the ruling, Sir Igor said: "If, through drink - or for any other reason - the complainant has temporarily lost her capacity to choose whether to have intercourse on the relevant occasion, she is not consenting, and subject to questions about the defendant's state of mind, if the intercourse takes place, this would be rape.

"However, where the complainant has voluntarily consumed even substantial quantities of alcohol, but nevertheless remains capable of choosing whether or not to have intercourse, and in drink agrees to do so this would not be rape."

He added that the "capacity to consent may evaporate well before a complainant becomes unconscious".

Summing up

It is the first time the Court of Appeal has looked at the issue since a legal definition of consent in rape cases was established by the ****** Offences Act 2003.

The law says a person consents to *** if they agree by choice and have the freedom and capacity to make that choice.

Mr Bree had denied raping the woman, who cannot be named for legal reasons, but was convicted by a jury at Bournemouth Crown Court and jailed for five years last year.

The student said she had not consented to *** after they had been out in Bournemouth drinking vodka and Red Bull and cider.

The quashing of his conviction related to "deficiencies" in the trial judge's summing up, and Mr Bree was freed from prison on 13 March.

BBC News home affairs correspondent Danny Shaw says the guidelines are intended to clear up confusion around the law and may help prevent people being wrongfully convicted or wrongfully acquitted.
Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/uk/6497889.stm

Published: 2007/03/27 01:30:24 GMT

© BBC MMVII

MetroN
03-27-2007, 03:30 PM
By pissed you mean angry, right?

Wow, that would be a very idiotic law.
Soo nobody is responsible for their actions anymore? Thats not what my parents teached me...

Hydro
03-27-2007, 03:31 PM
No, by pissed he means drunk. Pissed means drunk here.

MetroN
03-27-2007, 03:32 PM
Ok, I'll write that down.

h22chen
03-27-2007, 10:09 PM
That law is stupid and so is getting drunk.

So in this case, if a guy have *** with a drunk girl, it means he raped her, since she has no capacity to consent. What happens if she was the one who forced the guy? (if that ever happens)

But if a guy gets drunk and has *** with a woman, it's still the guy's fault no matter which reason:
1. either he forced while drunk or was forced himself...
2. either he had *** with a woman
The results are still the same, it's the guy's fault...
I like the wording in the article, the sentences "capacity to consent" instead of "capacity to judge".
Both reasonings could be abused.


A 3rd scenario, both are drunk and had ***. Then who's at fault? aside from the bad ***... From what I've heard, it's the guy's fault with reasoning like "he shouldn't have gotten her drunk", etc...

I'm not unsympathetic to the victim or the agressor, but the whole thing is just :cantbeli:.


Bottom line, don't get drunk with someone you can't trust! or don't get drunk at all!

The whole concept is just :cantbeli::cantbeli::cantbeli:

LaoSexMachine
03-27-2007, 10:19 PM
So is a confession let say murder under the influence is admissable?

h22chen
03-27-2007, 10:25 PM
do you think so?

LaoSexMachine
03-27-2007, 10:27 PM
do you think so?

I'm not a Supreme Court judge. So that's why I asked.

h22chen
03-27-2007, 10:30 PM
From what I read of this ruling, it does not seem that it will be admissible.

It's funny, ppl keep narrowing everything down in order to satisfy one condition/group or another and in the end, all we lose is our common sense.

Calanen
03-28-2007, 03:56 AM
So is a confession let say murder under the influence is admissable?

I am not sure what you are asking. Are you asking 'Is a confession to murder given while under the influence of alcohol' admissible? - prima facie, yes. It would just go to what weight you placed on it.