Question about Saiga shotguns

[silveykyle]

My buddy is looking to get a 20 gauge Saiga shotgun, anyone have any experience with them, pros and cons?
Thanks

this is the model: http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/3086/raaiz1061lw6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[punchinout]

Interesting shotguns aren't they???

At work we have all the Saiga sporter models; 410's, 20's and 12 gauges along with .223's, 7.62x39's and saiga's in .308 rem. They are pretty popular with some AK enthusiasts, a very economical alternative to a traditional auto-loading shotgun. Personally i haven't ever fired one, i've only handled 'em but all my customers seem to swear by 'em.

I know there are a few differen't accessories out for 'em, folding stocks, higher capacity magazines, etc...

I'd tell your friend to go for it, i know they made that new assault weapons ban, so...get the stuff you won't be able to buy just in case.

[silveykyle]

Interesting shotguns aren't they???

At work we have all the Saiga sporter models; 410's, 20's and 12 gauges along with .223's, 7.62x39's and saiga's in .308 rem. They are pretty popular with some AK enthusiasts, a very economical alternative to a traditional auto-loading shotgun. Personally i haven't ever fired one, i've only handled 'em but all my customers seem to swear by 'em.

I know there are a few differen't accessories out for 'em, folding stocks, higher capacity magazines, etc...

I'd tell your friend to go for it, i know they made that new assault weapons ban, so...get the stuff you won't be able to buy just in case.
Thanks man, yeah I think hes going to go for it, he can get one for like $275 I think.

[punchinout]

Thanks man, yeah I think hes going to go for it, he can get one for like $275 I think.

daaaamn, 275? it used? thats way below MSRP.

[silveykyle]

yeah it's used, I don't know the condition though.

[punchinout]

cool, well i hope it works out.

[silveykyle]

Yeah thanks for the help man.

[manilaboy]

they;'re quite populat here in the philippines because they cost much cheaper than the european ones and the perception is that they are of good quality,
i got a benelli m1 last year and i think ill get a saiga whan i save enough.
its very practical for property defense because you can keep the magazine always loaded but separated so it is safer than keeping an actual gun loaded. and it will be ready for action faster because just click the magazine on then boom :D

[LaoSexMachine]

That's why you keep your gun on safe at all times and never point at anything you are nt going to shoot.

[manilaboy]

a loaded gun is still a loaded gun even when its on safe. you can still get accidents.

[Masai]

the Saiga's use a modified AK action, right ? just chambered for the 12 gauge calibre ?

[punchinout]

the Saiga's use a modified AK action, right ? just chambered for the 12 gauge calibre ?

more than that


all the Saiga sporter models; 410's, 20's and 12 gauges along with .223's, 7.62x39's and saiga's in .308 rem.

[Jippo]

the Saiga's use a modified AK action, right ? just chambered for the 12 gauge calibre ?

Action is very similar to AK, biggest differences are in the bolt, barrel and magazines but the rest of it is more or less just the same old AK.


-jippo

[Jippo]

...because you can keep the magazine always loaded but separated so it is safer than keeping an actual gun loaded. and it will be ready for action faster because just click the magazine on then boom :D

I have heard that the rounds stored in the magazine can deform and cause feeding problems. That is because of the magazine spring pressure on the side of the cartridge.


-jippo

[TacoDelRio]

a loaded gun is still a loaded gun even when its on safe. you can still get accidents.

I'm not ruling out meteorites hitting the trigger that's not blocked because your finger isn't anywhere near it, but there should be zero accidents if you're disciplined. Period.

[Durandal]

My buddy is looking to get a 20 gauge Saiga shotgun, anyone have any experience with them, pros and cons?
Thanks

this is the model: http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/3086/raaiz1061lw6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Shot the 12ga and .410 quite a lot in various configs using a both commercial and combat mags.

Love the gun. I'll see if I can't post some video of it.

For 275.00 I'd pick up two....seriously.

Edit: I need to edit the video to get the clip, but here's a photo of me:

Tromix shorty 2ga conversion
http://homepage.mac.com/thesw0rdofroland/.Pictures/Photo%20Album%20Pictures/2006-01-21%2015.01.17%20-0800/Image-5FAD18FC8AD111DA.jpg

I'll dig around for the .410...which will be close enough to the 20ga

[silveykyle]

thanks for the help fellas.

[trey40]

check out Tromix before you get a factory saiga 12/20

[manilaboy]

I have heard that the rounds stored in the magazine can deform and cause feeding problems. That is because of the magazine spring pressure on the side of the cartridge.


-jippo


is this true? i probably wont get the gun because the idea of keeping ammo in the mag is my main reason for liking it.

[LaoSexMachine]

is this true? i probably wont get the gun because the idea of keeping ammo in the mag is my main reason for liking it.

Can happen.

[Nick_Karatzides]

At work we have all the Saiga sporter models; 410's, 20's and 12 gauges along with .223's, 7.62x39's and saiga's in .308 rem.
I'll dig around for the .410...which will be close enough to the 20gaDon't get confused! The word ".410 bore" has NOTHING to do with the word "gauge".

Notice that the nominal bore of a .410 shotgun, simply means .410 of inch which is actualy equal to 10.414 mm! Please feel free to check HERE (http://www.municion.org/semi/36.htm) for more infos. Which is why it is properly called the .410 bore instead of the .410 gauge.

In Europe it is sometimes called the 12mm, which is an inaccurate designation as a .410 bore has an actual diameter of approximately 10.4mm by metric measure. If the .410 had been named in the traditional fashion, by the number of lead balls .41 inch in diameter needed to make one pound, it would be about a 67-68 gauge. It's also called the 36 gauge and I have seen a picture of an old box of Remington shells marked "(36 Ga.) .410 - 2 1/2 In (12 mm)". However, the "36 gauge" designation was very inaccurate, as a true 36 gauge gun would actually have a .506 inch bore diameter.

Some additional infos for .410" ammo HERE (http://www.4-10.freeuk.com/mwslug.html), HERE (http://www.chuckhawks.com/410bore.htm) and HERE (http://www.4-10.freeuk.com/barnaul.html).

[Durandal]

Don't get confused! The word ".410 bore" has NOTHING to do with the word "gauge".

Oh, I am not confused.

.410 and 20 ga are pretty damn comparable both in when you watch someone shoot them. Hell to me if its not 12 or 10ga its just a small bird gun.

My point was not a technical comparison just a visual one.

[Durandal]

is this true? i probably wont get the gun because the idea of keeping ammo in the mag is my main reason for liking it.

Here is a 12 ga 8 round mag.

http://web.mac.com/thesw0rdofroland/iWeb/Site/2006_files/IMG_0118.jpg

The only deformation I can imagine happening is the plastic casing (the brass ends of the rounds would be no different than any other ammo type). Then this would be true with ANY magazine fed shot gun.

Here is an exploded .410:

http://club.guns.ru/images/saiga410mag.jpg

Edit: If you will note the design of the follower, it looks like it would decrease damage since it would need to ride forward, over the brass and indent the plastic.

So I am skeptical, though I have NEVER seen rounds kept in a magazine for a year to prove that it in fact does not.

[silveykyle]

thanks for the help everyone

[gtronin]

*cough* also check the vepr-12 though *cough*

damn allergies...

[Jippo]

So I am skeptical, though I have NEVER seen rounds kept in a magazine for a year to prove that it in fact does not.

I think I originally heard it as an explanation for failures of the Russian IPSC team when Saiga's were a new thing. So it may rather be dependable on the ammunition more than actual storage. I shoudl think magnum cartridge filled to brim with 000 may not deform whilst half empty sporting round might do it relatively fast.

I haven't tried so I don't know either. Just what I have heard.


-jippo

[manilaboy]

seems correct. a good quality cartidge might not deform but i was looking at some cheapo cartidges i have and they seem like the first cartridge out of the magazine might even tear and break up


I think I originally heard it as an explanation for failures of the Russian IPSC team when Saiga's were a new thing. So it may rather be dependable on the ammunition more than actual storage. I shoudl think magnum cartridge filled to brim with 000 may not deform whilst half empty sporting round might do it relatively fast.

I haven't tried so I don't know either. Just what I have heard.


-jippo