British Troops also accused of mistreatment of prisoners

[ShadowNeo]

Just watching the BBC news right now,

there was a picture of a British soldier apparently urinating on and beating an Iraqi Prisoner - will post more info as it comes.

EDIT:

General Sir Michael Jackson has in the last hour announced that this incident is under investigation, and that the perpetrators were not fit to wear their uniforms. There was also mention of this being down to a small, rogue element within the British Forces.

[Argyll]

Every nation who has taken POW's has abused them in some way,at least they were not shot to death and bulldozed into an unmarked grave just like Saddam used to do!!

[ShadowNeo]

Still disgraceful nonetheless. Also, the prisoner was not really a prisoner of war - he was a thief (according to those who got hold of the pictures), which makes his treatment somewhat more mind boggling. Although it must be said that there isn't really any background ont he situation these pictures were taken.

[M1A2U2]

Great now we can hear morons generalize the British Army as well. Its all yours uninnen and mustamato

[ShadowNeo]

From BBC News



http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40103000/jpg/_40103599_mirror203.jpg

UK troops in Iraqi torture probe
The paper claims British soldiers handed over the photos

Ministry of Defence has launched an investigation into allegations that British soldiers have been pictured torturing an Iraqi prisoner.
The photographs, obtained by the Daily Mirror newspaper, show a suspected thief being beaten and urinated on.

The UK's most senior soldier, General Sir Mike Jackson, said if guilty, the men were not fit to wear the uniform.

Earlier, the UK Government said it was "appalled" by pictures of Iraqi prisoners being abused by US troops.

Tony Blair's official spokesman said the way naked prisoners were tormented by troops directly contravened all the US-led coalition's policy.

He stressed the abuse by a few soldiers at the Abu Ghraib jail was not representative of coalition troops.

But Labour MP John McDonnell instead argued the coalition's occupation of Iraq was being discredited.

If proven, not only is such appalling conduct clearly unlawful but also contravenes the British Army's high standards of conduct

Sir Michael Jackson
The latest pictures were handed over by British soldiers who claimed a rogue element in the British army was responsible for abusing prisoners and civilians.

It is alleged during his 8-hour ordeal he was threatened with execution, his jaw broken and his teeth smashed.

Sir Michael Jackson, chief of the general staff, said: "If proven, not only is such appalling conduct clearly unlawful but also contravenes the British Army's high standards of conduct.

"The allegations are already under investigation.

"Again, if proven, the perpetrators are not fit to wear the Queen's uniform and they have besmirched the Army's good name and conduct."

'regrettable'

A US military investigation has recommended disciplinary action against several of its officers for the alleged abuse of Iraqi prisoners.

Brigadier General Janice Karpinski is among seven officers being investigated following claims that soldiers under their command mistreated detainees.

The officers have already been suspended from duty.

Mr Blair's official spokesman said: "The US army spokesman has said this morning that he is appalled, that those responsible have let their fellow soldiers down, and those are views that we would associate the UK Government with."

He added: "This is not representative of the 150,000 soldiers that are in Iraq, and they should not judge the actions of the coalition as a whole on the actions of a few.

"But it is regrettable, to say the least."

[Threelions]

The last time prisoners were mistreaeted at the hands of Canadian soldiers a man died, and a whole regiment was disbanded. Hopefully there wont be regimental reprocutions to the current crap going on by both american indivduals and british individuals.

Cheers

[Ichhabe]

Every nation who has taken POW's has abused them in some way,at least they were not shot to death and bulldozed into an unmarked grave just like Saddam used to do!!

I was on my way from Mitrovica and back to my camp. I was sitting in the same vehicle with my Company Commander as his "side face" when we came upon two Norwegian soldiers that had detained two young men after a bridal kidnapping. It was raining cats and dogs outside, and the two young men had been forced to lay face down in the mud.
Both prisoners had their arms on the back secured with strips. We stopped the car, and my Company Commander ran towards them and really gave them what they deserved.

Since bot of them were properly secured by being hog tied, there was absolute no reason to force them to be face down in the cold mud.

Don't know what happened afterwards with the two soldiers, but their names were taken down and a report written.
Not that this case can be compared to the episodes in Iraq, but is given as a proof that even in "my" army there are soldiers that doesn't give their actions a thorougly consideration.

[Gringo]

Argyll as a serving British soldier and as an ambassador for your nations military can you not come up with something better than the responce you just gave towards this post!
It doesn't matter what Iraqi forces done in the past, pissing on a POW is a very low thing to do. I would have expected more from British troops, this is a source of shame towards Britain.

Hey! Don't generalize that the whole of Britain or it's armed forces is responsible.

These are individuals at work here, and they do NOT represent the British Army.

[American Patriot]

Pissing on a POW is much more severe than making a haji pyramid.

[ShadowNeo]

Please don't try and turn this into another UK vs US thread Patriot, as its obvious that is what your trying to do. I'm not even going to go into detail about the somewhat biassed inaccuracy of your statement anyway.

[UkrainianAmerican]

While this is not model beaviour, I would give those soldier pretty light punishments, like cleaning the bathrooms,and peeling potatoes or something.
I mean the "POW" probably had it coming.

[steel bonnet]

Simple Question,What proof that`s Actually from Iraq & NOT STAGED by the Media??

As all in the UK know the Media have been far from Loyal in the handling of the build up/war & aftermath of Britain & British Forces.
Personally l wouldn`t put it past the media of Britain to STAGE this just to promote those Sick & Twisted Anti War ideals & also give a Black eye the Goverment & British Forces.

If it is true,Good God man Get out & smell the coffee. All conflicts of all ages have seen a POW being mistreat,tempers fly & having an Awkward POW will annoy the crap out of you too.
If he is a thief,well being pissed on is better than a hand off or DEATH.

Just because it`s IN THE PAPER or On the TV does NOT MAKE IT GOSPEL.

It`s always the Anti War one`s looking for some way to Discredit the fighting forces who ARE in Harms way & have a Very Stressfull time at present.
Support the Armed forces & vent your anger at the Goverment,THEY put our People there,not like the MoD put out a Vote to the Armed forces & asked where they`d like to spend there time serving.

ja
Steel Bonnet

[Jack Mehoff]

martinexsquaddie, ohhh where are youuuuuuu???

[ShadowNeo]

If it is true,Good God man Get out & smell the coffee. All conflicts of all ages have seen a POW being mistreat,tempers fly & having an Awkward POW will annoy the crap out of you too.

If it is true, you can't simply turn a blind eye and legitimise it with this "it always happens" argument. If true, these soldiers should be made an example of and should face the punishment befitting them.

It is made all the more damaging by the fact that this will probably be plastere dall over Middle-Eastern TV stations, and it isn't exactly going to help our cause in Iraq is it?

[Uncle Sam]

If it is true,Good God man Get out & smell the coffee. All conflicts of all ages have seen a POW being mistreat,tempers fly & having an Awkward POW will annoy the crap out of you too.

If it is true, you can't simply turn a blind eye and legitimise it with this "it always happens" argument. If true, these soldiers should be made an example of and should face the punishment befitting them.

It is made all the more damaging by the fact that this will probably be plastere dall over Middle-Eastern TV stations, and it isn't exactly going to help our cause in Iraq is it?

Al Jazeera here we come, do da, do da...

It's already plastered all over the news in Iraq...Both the US and UK incidents.

[Ichhabe]

If it is true,Good God man Get out & smell the coffee. All conflicts of all ages have seen a POW being mistreat,tempers fly & having an Awkward POW will annoy the crap out of you too.

If it is true, you can't simply turn a blind eye and legitimise it with this "it always happens" argument. If true, these soldiers should be made an example of and should face the punishment befitting them.

It is made all the more damaging by the fact that this will probably be plastere dall over Middle-Eastern TV stations, and it isn't exactly going to help our cause in Iraq is it?

Al Jazeera here we come, do da, do da...

It's already plastered all over the news in Iraq...Both the US and UK incidents.

Well, if these "incidents" hadn't been taken picture of then it wouldn't been so hard to learn about it. But when these idiots are so stupid to take pictures and literally help them. Then they (we) maybe deserve the anti-propaganda that will project out of this.

[chauncy republicans]

While this is not model beaviour, I would give those soldier pretty light punishments, like cleaning the bathrooms,and peeling potatoes or something.
I mean the "POW" probably had it coming.
You ****ing wannabe!

[Jack Mehoff]

I've done similar thing like that to my friends while we were drunk. We refer that to as "golden shower".

[chauncy republicans]

I've done similar thing like that to my friends while we were drunk. We refer that to as "golden shower".
eeeeeeeew :oops:

[Uncle Sam]

If it is true,Good God man Get out & smell the coffee. All conflicts of all ages have seen a POW being mistreat,tempers fly & having an Awkward POW will annoy the crap out of you too.

If it is true, you can't simply turn a blind eye and legitimise it with this "it always happens" argument. If true, these soldiers should be made an example of and should face the punishment befitting them.

It is made all the more damaging by the fact that this will probably be plastere dall over Middle-Eastern TV stations, and it isn't exactly going to help our cause in Iraq is it?

Al Jazeera here we come, do da, do da...

It's already plastered all over the news in Iraq...Both the US and UK incidents.

Well, if these "incidents" hadn't been taken picture of then it wouldn't been so hard to learn about it. But when these idiots are so stupid to take pictures and literally help them. Then they (we) maybe deserve the anti-propaganda that will project out of this.

You're preaching to the choir. This looks bad, yes indeed.

[mocking_loudly_died]

It's always amusing when people try and justify this as abit of "fun", if the shoe was on the other foot and we had pictures of insurgents pissing on or forming naked pyramids with British or American troops, we would hear cries of "those bastards must die!".


If you disgrace your military you should be punished, if we are constantly telling the world that our moral code is superior than we must be beyond reproach at all times.

Hypocrisy is annoying.

[ibstolidude]

so I wonder when staged incidents will start?

[big_les]

Both incidents are sickening, and much as I respect serving members of our respective armed forces, I'm saddened to see anything other than condemnation of them from distinguished members like Argyll. I appreciate war is no walk in the playboy mansion, but for god's sake how can you compare levels of torture and humiliation and say 'at least we didn't <insert worse incident here>'.

Even the most hardened cynical and experienced warrior should be if not disgusted, worried that the idiots have actually taken photographic evidence of the crimes!

It begs the question what else has gone on/is going on in Iraq and other areas out of the public gaze.

[big_les]

so I wonder when staged incidents will start?

I'm not sure I understand. Could you clarify your train of thought?

(Sorry for the two posts, should have combined them)

[Jack Mehoff]

Ice tea anybody?

http://img7.imageshack.us/my.php?loc=img7&image=DSC00183.JPG

[MaDuce]

Hey it's hard to get off BDU's with with all those straps and crap. Uou dont wanna piss you pants I mean thats a long march.

[mustamato]

Every nation who has taken POW's has abused them in some way,at least they were not shot to death and bulldozed into an unmarked grave just like Saddam used to do!!

Is that some kind of excuse for this?

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40103000/jpg/_40103599_mirror203.jpg

[MaDuce]

That picked could be ripped from a S&M site.

[One?]

Every nation who has taken POW's has abused them in some way,at least they were not shot to death and bulldozed into an unmarked grave just like Saddam used to do!!

just because saddam did worst, it does not justify the acts of the coalition. If you are going to tell iraqis that I doubt they will love you the way you want them to.

[Jack Mehoff]

Every nation who has taken POW's has abused them in some way,at least they were not shot to death and bulldozed into an unmarked grave just like Saddam used to do!!

just because saddam did worst, it does not justify the acts of the coalition. If you are going to tell iraqis that I doubt they will love you the way you want them to.

Are you blaming the coalition for the action of a few bad apples?

Using your own logic, you and the rest of your muslim arab buddies are terrorists.

See...generalization is fun, isn't it?

[obd]

hmmm dont know anything about the "Daily Mirror" but it looks alot like a trash tabloid to me.... is this a respectable paper?? Can its contents even be trusted??

Also, I too am surpirsed at Argyls flippant dismisal of this photo as if its no big deal......Might not be a big deal to him but it sure as hell is gonna create a **** storm with the Iraqi's.......We shouldnt even have prisioners at the Abu Gharrib....theres just too much history there...we should have destroyed that place and biult something else because it makes us look too much like the old regime to have articles of mistreatment by US soldiers comgin out of Abu Gharrib.......sad sad sad..

[cut]

hmmm dont know anything about the "Daily Mirror" but it looks alot like a trash tabloid to me.... is this a respectable paper?? Can its contents even be trusted??


it is a tabloid and anything but a respectable paper, but these photos speak for themselves and the mirror would be ****ed if they made something up like this. Also in an earlier post there is a BBC article on it, and if it gets to the BBC then it is not BS. Aswell as Gen. Sir Jackson coming out and making a statement straight away (a whole day before the article is published) means it is serious.

[martinexsquaddie]

bunch of cretins who have raised the wrath of the dark lord himself.
:lol:. they will be getting there just deserts shortly. off to colly you go continue running until 2006 :backhand:
Mind you from what my brother told me about the new iraqi police in basra. the only real diffrence is that there not suppoused to have torture :( chambers :(.
The average Iraqi would be outraged that the "ali baba" was still breathing :( .
As two car bombers were stoned to death at the scence of an attack

[oldsoak]

What a bunch of f**kwits. Shot in the foot by our own side - absolutely bloody marvellous.

[Argyll]

hmmm dont know anything about the "Daily Mirror" but it looks alot like a trash tabloid to me.... is this a respectable paper?? Can its contents even be trusted??

Also, I too am surpirsed at Argyls flippant dismisal of this photo as if its no big deal......Might not be a big deal to him but it sure as hell is gonna create a **** storm with the Iraqi's.......We shouldnt even have prisioners at the Abu Gharrib....theres just too much history there...we should have destroyed that place and biult something else because it makes us look too much like the old regime to have articles of mistreatment by US soldiers comgin out of Abu Gharrib.......sad sad sad..

It is flipant for a simple reason guys it's the truth,there are literally hundreds of incidents like this across the globe,you think that POW's were treated any different in other wars?You think the Japanese and the Italians and the Americans who were captured rescently In Iraq were not degraded in a similar fashion?
Lets get one thing straight I never agreed with it,people here are jumping to their own conclusions again.
Most of these incidents are done not by 1st line combat troops either but the PONTI's and REMF's who think they're the dogs bollocks,and many cases they are also not regular troops but Part time soldiers as well.
Those who carried out these acts have complexes ,they are acting the bigman,many do this for photo ops to show their buddies back home etc.
I do not agree with the inhumane treatment of anybody whether they be a POW or not,or whatever country country they come from.

Some of you lot are under the impression I'm a serving soldier.....I am not,I work for a Security company in Baghdad.......none the less There is nothing anyone can do about it,many of you bought the papers selling the story..........which means you are feeding the media's frenzy,I have learned from being in Iraq that the media is NOT your friend in Iraq.

Just another thought,has anyone considered these photo's are staged?I
I was not there at the times they were taken ................neither were any of you,the truth behind these may never come out that includes the pics from the US side..........but have any of you lot seen Udays/Qusays personal photo collections of the torture and degradation they participated in?.........I have seen some........and the pictures feom our media are tame in comparison.

Bottom line Gents,the actions are those of Individuals(asshole at that!),
Compared to photos of POW's executed with their Genitalia stuck in their mouths these pictures are no big deal.......that is the way I interpreted it.
Compared to video's taken by Al Jazeera of the execution of the captured foreign Nationals....these stills are no big deal.

[Romulus]

They do worse things to prisoners in the "hole" here in the states. The guy got pissed on.... big deal, this in no way can be compared to Saddams torture
methods. Anyone who compares pissing to having hot iron rods stuck up your backside, has a skewed sense of pain.

In no way do I condone these actionsm, but I find in disturbing when an Italian prisoner gets shot in his neck certain individuals here accept it, but oh no when a POW the Brits have gets pissed on.... Call Amnesty international!!!!

Punish the troops involved and move along.

[weedman]

I think it is wrong to compare the mistreatments of POWs with the things insurgents did to mercs.

Because MPs or marines or all other military units are troops that represent the interests of an sovereign country.

However most of these insurgents are citiziens who are unsatisfied by their current conditions and show this in a destructive way. So they have totally differnet structures, motives, aims and conceivabilities.

[Romulus]

I think it is wrong to compare the mistreatments of POWs with the things insurgents did to mercs.

Because MPs or marines or all other military units are troops that represent the interests of an sovereign country.

However most of these insurgents are citiziens who are unsatisfied by their current conditions and show this in a destructive way. So they have totally differnet structures, motives, aims and conceivabilities.

So it's ok to kill and torture coalition hostages? Ok thats cool. :roll:

[Argyll]

I think it is wrong to compare the mistreatments of POWs with the things insurgents did to mercs.

Because MPs or marines or all other military units are troops that represent the interests of an sovereign country.

However most of these insurgents are citiziens who are unsatisfied by their current conditions and show this in a destructive way. So they have totally differnet structures, motives, aims and conceivabilities.

A lot of these insurgents gents are Foreign Nationals from Syria and Iran.
Many of the attacks on Iraqi's are carried out by them

just as an after post here obd,the Iraqis do not get the Daily Mail,or any other UK paper for matter,many are illiterate and cannot read,these people are so used to seeing violence mooted out to them by the old regime that these pics will have very little effect on the ordinary Iraqi citizen,as they will simply never see them.
There are way too many other issues to deal with inside Iraq right now to call a halt and go ballistic about some photo's that have appeared in the Western Press.

I wonder how much the submitor got paid in blood money for giving these stills to the Tabloids?The fact that an individual gained finacially out of this seems to have been overlooked!,and that makes him just as guilty in my book!

[Jack Mehoff]

I think it is wrong to compare the mistreatments of POWs with the things insurgents did to mercs.

Because MPs or marines or all other military units are troops that represent the interests of an sovereign country.

However most of these insurgents are citiziens who are unsatisfied by their current conditions and show this in a destructive way. So they have totally differnet structures, motives, aims and conceivabilities.

So it's OK to shoot terrorists in Afghanistan in the back of the head since they don't give a rat ass about Geneva Convention in the first place. At least merc don't go around hijacking jets and fly into buildings full of office workers. Besides, a lot of the insurgents are not Iraqis to begin with.

[weedman]

So it's ok to kill and torture coalition hostages? Ok thats cool. :roll:Read again, and start to think.
I never wrote that this justifies anything, but it is part of the pyschological background.
I condemn both, the insurgents' and the MPs'/Marines'/whatever reaction.

[mustamato]

The same photo, but without TABLOID written
all over it,

http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/0405/01/kiss200.jpg

[Tengu]

Happens in every militairy. But that doesn't mean it's acceptable.

Reminds me of how paratroopers from my country hung children form the congo over a fire.

[perdurabo]

Happens in every militairy. But that doesn't mean it's acceptable.

Reminds me of how paratroopers from my country hung children form the congo over a fire.
yes every where are black ships
but good army/country trials them and sends to prison/shots them out etc bad army/country acts like nothing happened ...

[HELEX]

Here with better quality:

(Text from Mirror.co.uk)

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/2/2/00070B15-4CBB-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
URINATED ON: A British soldier urinates on an Iraqi prisoner in a vile display of abuse.
The captive was beaten and hurled from a moving truck.
Army chiefs are investigating.
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/3/2/00049B0E-4D57-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
GUN TO HEAD: The terrified suspect cowers as a gun is placed at his head - then the rifle barrel was forced into his mouth
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/4/2/000D1B05-4DC0-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
BLEEDING: Blood seeps through the mask of battered suspect
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/1/2/0009DF21-4C67-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
BUTT IN GROIN: A rifle is cruelly jabbed in the young man's groin as his eight-hour nightmare goes on

[THE_Dorff]

well..... arse

I very much doubt that these incidents were staged, as the hgigh command and esp. mike jackson would deny the events outright.

regardin the Mirror- the mirror has been RABIDLY anti-war and are well reknowned for inflaming their stories to make them seem worse thatn they actually were.

I agree with argyll over the REMF issue and tryin to impress their mates- there was a similar story about a POW being hung upside down from a tractor last year.

the issue is deplorabe and i doubt if the squaddie will have much of a future in the british army- if it was a private incident then he would have been less severely punished- but nw its out in the open he will probably face a dishonourable discharge.

argyll- someone was talkin to me about sandbox- you facing much trouble on the strip? also- who did you serve with before you werew contracted?

B

[DeltaWhisky58]

I wasn't going to join this thread, but my anger now forces it.

Incidents such as these happen everywhere, in every conflict. I have little doubt that the incidents pictured are genuine and not staged. However vile they are, we have to taken them in context - what would the hooded Iraqis do to Tommy Atkins if the proverbial boot was on the other foot.

OK, so this is not cricket, but why should it be seen by our former colonial friends as being so much worse than this week's pix from the US-run jail?

IMO, the worst incident of this entire episode would be the involvement of a female soldier in some of the US-origin pix, surely under Islam, this would be particularly degrading, although the urination incident would have to rank pretty highly.

No-one has a clean record here - I hope those responsible are dealt with severely just as Gen. Jackson and the US generals promise, but we also have to remember why this sort of thing happens. I am in no way trying to justify it, but out there in The Sandbox or in The Stan values are different.

Just remember one thing, if your country's troops have a clear conscience over their actions in similar conflicts over the past few decades feel free to criticise, otherwise stop being so hypocritical and zip it!

[Fox2]

I wasn't going to join this thread, but my anger now forces it.

Incidents such as these happen everywhere, in every conflict. I have little doubt that the incidents pictured are genuine and not staged. However vile they are, we have to taken them in context - what would the hooded Iraqis do to Tommy Atkins if the proverbial boot was on the other foot.

OK, so this is not cricket, but why should it be seen by our former colonial friends as being so much worse than this week's pix from the US-run jail?

No-one has a clean record here - I hope those responsible are dealt with severely just as Gen. Jackson and the US generals promise, but we also have to remember why this sort of thing happens. I am in no way trying to justify it, but out there in The Sandbox or in The Stan values are different.

Just remember one thing, if your country's troops have a clear conscience over their actions in similar conflicts over the past few decades feel free to criticise, otherwise stop being so hypocritical and zip it!

Don't get so worked up, bud. :)

Who is saying it is worse or better than the actions of the US guards revealed recently? So far I've only read one person here. Singular, not plural.

My personal feeling is that it is wrong, just as the US guards who did similar were wrong. Those responsible for both actions will be punished, most likely.

Just don't take the comments of few (or one) to represent any large group. ;)

[mocking_loudly_died]

Man, It's ridiculous to start comparing western military standards to what happened under Saddams rule, for f*cks sake every Brit on this board is always banging on about the high f*cking moral ground their troops operate on and when this **** is found out – we receive immediate dismissal followed by much introspective reflection about third world dictators.

If you are going to preach about “our” acceptable standards, YOU CAN'T HAVE THE F*CKING CAKE ALL THE TIME. This **** shouldn't be on – and all the worry over media interpretation is irrelevant to the fact that some ****heads damaged the reputation of their unit and their country.

Just deal with it.

[DeltaWhisky58]

Mocking

Firstly, I tried to keep my post polite and lacking in profanity - any chance you might do likewise.

Secondly I'm not trying to sit on any moral highground - all such incidents are equally appalling, but why is it that the British one has been used by so many to take the heat of the Americans.

All people involved deserve equal punishment, and I hope that they get it.

[Fox2]

Man, It's ridiculous to start comparing western military standards to what happened under Saddams rule, for f*cks sake every Brit on this board is always banging on about the high f*cking moral ground their troops operate on and when this is **** is found out – we receive immediate dismissal followed by much introspective reflection about third world dictators.

If you are going to preach about “our” acceptable standards, YOU CAN'T HAVE THE F*CKING CAKE ALL THE TIME. This **** shouldn't be on – and all the worry over media interpretation is irrelevant to the fact that some ****heads damaged the reputation of their unit and their country.

Just deal with it.

I agree. What Hussein did does not justify the actions of these men.

There's always one or two bad apples in the barrel.


Secondly I'm not trying to sit on any moral highground - all such incidents are equally appalling, but why is it that the British one has been used by so many to take the heat of the Americans.

What is this "so many" number? ONE GUY in this thread alluded to that. One (1).

No one is "taking the heat off the Americans." The US soldiers involved in the other incident will most likely get court martialed, and their actions are equal in reprehensibility to those committed by the British soldiers.

Perhaps now you feel a bit of a taste of what it is like to be an American and being bombarded with such hostility in the media. :P


All people involved deserve equal punishment, and I hope that they get it.

I agree.

[weedman]

Mercs are probably also engaged in this... (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1207458,00.html)

[ibstolidude]

so I wonder when staged incidents will start?

I'm not sure I understand. Could you clarify your train of thought?

(Sorry for the two posts, should have combined them)

I mean what I stated: I wonder when people are going to start "creating" incidents. I know I would as a propogandist for the opposition, I will be shocked if not only ME groups don't do this but western groups as well.

[ibstolidude]

Mercs are probably also engaged in this... (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1207458,00.html)
How come your definition and the UN's differ so greatly?

[Argyll]

Mercs are probably also engaged in this... (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1207458,00.html)
How come your definition and the UN's differ so greatly?

Oh come now Stoli,considering the influx of Anti Americans here recently,and their "media based opinions" should we expect anything different? ;)

[foxtrot023]

To all folks that are ranting on the coalition soldiers for the events pictured, it all comes down to a simple question: If you became a POW, would you rather be a POW captured by:

A) The Coalition (US or UK)
B) A Western Country (Spain, Italy, Denmark, Canada, etc)
C) Saddam goons
D) A dictatorship or similar type of government (take your pick- North Korea, China, Lybia, Syria, Iran, etc)

I am sure not many would vote for C or D. AS mentioned above, the culprits will be punished, but those iraqis prisioners should still be thankful they weren`t captured by Saddam Hussein.

[khukuri]

foxtrot

so your argument is
okay were atleast not as bad as the saddami regime
as an iraqi i supported the coalition

but seeing this makes me wish that the SOB get shot and killed. I actually serously hope that.

[Jack Mehoff]

foxtrot

so your argument is
okay were atleast not as bad as the saddami regime
as an iraqi i supported the coalition

but seeing this makes me wish that the SOB get shot and killed. I actually serously hope that.

Your law would not even put a child-killer-rapist on the electric chair. Now you want someone die because he humiliated a POW? You are no difference than your high horse ****head Euro buddies.

WTF??!!! :roll:

[foxtrot023]

foxtrot

so your argument is
okay were atleast not as bad as the saddami regime
as an iraqi i supported the coalition

but seeing this makes me wish that the SOB get shot and killed. I actually serously hope that.

No. My argument is that for all the bitching that went on because of the mistreatment (which is correct in the point that it should not be done and the culprits should be punished), these cases are the exception to the rule. Cases like these are very seldomly seen, and very frown upon by the military and western society at large. When compared to values in other countries, Western Societies treat their prisioners far better than western POW were treated when captured by other nationalities, in which case these POW, while what was done to them was depicable, it is still nothing compared with the kind of tortures Saddam did to POW and other kind of prisioners under his regime.

regards

[khukuri]

foxtrot

so your argument is
okay were atleast not as bad as the saddami regime
as an iraqi i supported the coalition

but seeing this makes me wish that the SOB get shot and killed. I actually serously hope that.

Your law would not even put a child-killer-rapist on the electric chair. Now you want someone die because he humiliated a POW? You are no difference than your high horse ****head Euro buddies.

WTF??!!! :roll:

yea i know
how crazy you become when you see **** like this
:lol:

edit:

When you see something happen, you get angry of course, if see some child rapist, or criminal i would maybe want to shoot them on the spot, but afterhand i wouldnt think it was a good thing. Thats why its good to have a police and law and not that citisents takinbg the law in their hands. Actually if somebody would steal my bike i would like brake their bones because of anger, but it wouldnt be a good thing to do.

This is my answer to you considering how the law looks in my country and what I would like to do with some people.

[ibstolidude]

Mercs are probably also engaged in this... (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1207458,00.html)
How come your definition and the UN's differ so greatly?

Oh come now Stoli,considering the influx of Anti Americans here recently,and their "media based opinions" should we expect anything different? ;)
eat my shoe, you MERC!
hahahahahaha

sorry couldn't resist the stupid is contagious!

thanks again, dude.

[Argyll]

Mercs are probably also engaged in this... (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1207458,00.html)
How come your definition and the UN's differ so greatly?

Oh come now Stoli,considering the influx of Anti Americans here recently,and their "media based opinions" should we expect anything different? ;)
eat my shoe, you MERC!
hahahahahaha

sorry couldn't resist the stupid is contagious!

thanks again, dude.

rofl Takes one to know one!!

[Javehn]

**** this **** , mate . What about your photos ? Did you photographed Britney there ?

[DeltaWhisky58]

There are now very serious doubts about thse pix.

1. The SA80A1 shown in the picture was not deployed to Iraq.
2. The QLR did not wear Bonnie hats in Iraq, thery wore helmets or berets.
3. The Type of Bedford truck shown in some of the pictures was not used in Iraq.

See the full report from the BBc here http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3677311.stm