British POW Mistreatment Accusations

[tuckerhat]

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/040430/325/esid9.html


Friday April 30, 11:40 PM


UK army probes alleged torture in Iraq

By Michael Holden

LONDON (*******) - A probe has been launched into allegations British soldiers tortured Iraqi prisoners, a day after similar revelations involving U.S. troops received widespread condemnation.

Britain's army chief General Sir Mike Jackson ordered an immediate inquiry after it emerged that the Daily Mirror in its Saturday editions was to publish photos of British soldiers abusing prisoners.

The paper told ******* the images included one of a British soldier urinating on a crouching, hooded Iraqi.

"I am aware of the allegations which have been made today of abuse of prisoners by British soldiers in Iraq," Jackson said in a statement.

"The allegations are already under investigation. If proven not only is such appalling conduct clearly unlawful it clearly contravenes the British army's high standards.

"If proven the perpetrators are not fit to wear the queen's uniform. They have besmirched the good name of the army and its honour."

The British probe comes after U.S. President George W. Bush said he was "deeply disgusted" by photos released this week showing American troops abusing Iraqi prisoners held at the Abu Ghraib prison, once a notorious centre of torture and executions under ousted President Saddam Hussein.

The U.S. military has brought criminal charges against six soldiers relating to accusations of abuses from November and December 2003 on some 20 detainees, including indecent acts with another person, maltreatment, battery, dereliction of duty and aggravated assault.

Prime Minister Tony Blair, who had earlier strongly condemned the abuse involving U.S. soldiers, gave his backing to the army's investigation.

"The prime minister fully endorses both the statement by General Sir Michael Jackson and the action he is taking as well as the speed with which the army is acting," his spokesman said.

"The prime minister agrees that allegations of this nature are treated most seriously, but they should not be taken as a reflection of the general behaviour of coalition forces and the work they are doing with the Iraqi people."

Britain's forces in Iraq, concentrated in the south of the country around Basra, have previously been praised for their conduct towards the Iraqi people.

There have been previous inquiries into allegations of abuse against British soldiers in Iraq, but none have warranted such a high-profile response from authorities.

The human rights charity Amnesty International said it had warned U.S. and British authorities in Iraq that captives were being abused.

"We have talked to ex-prisoners, who say when they were taken into custody they were hooded and beaten, sometimes numerous times and subjected on some occasions to psychological torture and acts of ****** humiliation," Amnesty's Neil Durkin told Sky News.

"They (the provisional authority) simply have not acted on these reports. There is on the face of it a pattern."

[WanderingNomad]

Yes, the Daily Mirror has a front page pic of a UK soldier urinating on a hooded Iraqi ... yuck!

I agree that these retards are only a minority in both the US and the UK army, but it kinda dampens the 'we're 100% perfect' speeches.

And isn't it even more so embarassing that even though the Iraqis had/have hostages, they didn't make such pics? (I may be wrong though and of course excluding the execution of the italian)

Anyway, apparently the people involved will get court-martialed. And it would be good to give those kids a quick lecture of the Geneva Convention before letting them 'interrogate' the prisoners.

[One?]

And it would be good to give those kids a quick lecture of the Geneva Convention before letting them 'interrogate' the prisoners.

isn't that the first thing they teach you in basic training?

[Jack Mehoff]

And it would be good to give those kids a quick lecture of the Geneva Convention before letting them 'interrogate' the prisoners.

isn't that the first thing they teach you in basic training?

Apparently not in your beloved Saddam's army.

[martinexsquaddie]

cretins
I would'nt fancy there chances with Gen michael Jackson pissed at them
he may be changeing his diet from babies for breakfast :lol:

[Chris1]

Anyway, apparently the people involved will get court-martialed. And it would be good to give those kids a quick lecture of the Geneva Convention before letting them 'interrogate' the prisoners.
All soldiers get an in-depth series of lectures and exercises on what the rules are, how you will apply them and what WILL happen to you if you think about breaking them during the work-up to a deployment
Interrogation is done by people whose sole job in the army is working out ways to make someone talk without putting the boot in.
I don't know what training they get in such matters, but it is certainly more than the extensive instruction given to the average soldier.
I've read the comments you're referring to, a military policeman claiming he had no training in how to handle prisoners;
It is bull****.
An excuse made by a piss poor NCO trying to account for the fact he has NO leadership qualities at all and should not be in charge of a teapot.
Martin, rofl

[HELEX]

It was much more then just urinating..... :roll:

(Text from Mirror.co.uk)

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/2/2/00070B15-4CBB-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
URINATED ON: A British soldier urinates on an Iraqi prisoner in a vile display of abuse.
The captive was beaten and hurled from a moving truck.
Army chiefs are investigating.
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/3/2/00049B0E-4D57-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
GUN TO HEAD: The terrified suspect cowers as a gun is placed at his head - then the rifle barrel was forced into his mouth
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/4/2/000D1B05-4DC0-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
BLEEDING: Blood seeps through the mask of battered suspect
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/1/2/0009DF21-4C67-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
BUTT IN GROIN: A rifle is cruelly jabbed in the young man's groin as his eight-hour nightmare goes on

[Argyll]

Is there any unit associated with these pics yet?

[mustamato]

It was much more then just urinating..... :roll:

(Text from Mirror.co.uk)

http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/2/2/00070B15-4CBB-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
URINATED ON: A British soldier urinates on an Iraqi prisoner in a vile display of abuse.
The captive was beaten and hurled from a moving truck.
Army chiefs are investigating.
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/3/2/00049B0E-4D57-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
GUN TO HEAD: The terrified suspect cowers as a gun is placed at his head - then the rifle barrel was forced into his mouth
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/4/2/000D1B05-4DC0-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
BLEEDING: Blood seeps through the mask of battered suspect
http://images.icnetwork.co.uk/upl/mirror/may2004/1/2/0009DF21-4C67-1093-953F80BFB6FA0000.jpg
BUTT IN GROIN: A rifle is cruelly jabbed in the young man's groin as his eight-hour nightmare goes on

I wonder, was those soldiers assraped by someone (kind of British dedovshina)
or what makes them capable of such cruelty? Ok ok, that man "might" be a insurgent,
but he is still helpless and can´t defend himself. It takes a very sick man to enjoy
beating and humiliating a helpless man like that.

[Argyll]

Mustamoto.......I agree with you,it takes a sickko to get their kicks from **** like this.

[weedman]

I wonder, was those soldiers assraped by someone (kind of British dedovshina)
or what makes them capable of such cruelty? Ok ok, that man "might" be a insurgent,
but he is still helpless and can´t defend himself. It takes a very sick man to enjoy
beating and humiliating a helpless man like that.I wonder how such lunatics could join an army.

Such things don't come on your mind spontaneous, you need to be a little bit damaged from the beginning on.

[mustamato]

Is there any unit associated with these pics yet?

1st batallion in

http://www.army.mod.uk/qlr/index.htm

[HELEX]

Sky news says the same: "Queen's Lancashire Regiment".

[Argyll]

QLR's.......IIRC they were the subject of an incident of the same nature immediately after the war,I'm just wondering if this is all part of the same thing?

[oldsoak]

all done in the back of a 4 tonner by the look of it. T*ssers

[ShadowNeo]

From what I have heard, the QLR aren't even listed as deployed to Iraq as there are so few elements of them there? I think the regiment is on a tour of duty in Cyprus right now.

The fact that this element of the regiment was involved in an incident before, in my opinion, reinforces the "rogue element" concept that has been suggested several times by the MoD.

[martinexsquaddie]

rumour control in basra is the QLR maybe on the list to be disbanded over so of the going-ons in Basra :(
some of the chain of command did'nt get a grip :(

[ShadowNeo]

A tad bit harsh eh? Considering that the vast majority (I believe) of the regiment isn't even in Iraq? :cantbeli:

[Chris1]

A tad bit harsh eh? Considering that the vast majority (I believe) of the regiment isn't even in Iraq? :cantbeli:
QLR were there a few months ago.
Use a bit of sense, the guys giving the mirror these photos would need to have completed their tour in order to hand over the photos.

[DPGLAW]

It a shame they did this in front of a camera, if they werent morons, they woudl of done it without the benefit of a camera then they wouldnt be in a ny trouble. I dont feel bad for the Iraq prisoners as you hae to remember what they did to our prisoners the first go around during GW1. What goes around, comes around...but just dont do it on camera

[Haiw]

It a shame they did this in front of a camera, if they werent morons, they woudl of done it without the benefit of a camera then they wouldnt be in a ny trouble. I dont feel bad for the Iraq prisoners as you hae to remember what they did to our prisoners the first go around during GW1. What goes around, comes around...but just dont do it on camera
Riiiight....and of course every simple conscript that threw up his hands in the beginning of the war was a die-hard intelligence service 'interrogator' in 1991? :roll:

[ShadowNeo]

QLR were there a few months ago.
Use a bit of sense, the guys giving the mirror these photos would need to have completed their tour in order to hand over the photos.

I was aware of that, but I was always under the impression that the pictures were of something that happened recently, until now. As for how the photos were handed over, it was never stated when they were in articles I have read so far, so I had no "on paper" idea.

[ShadowNeo]

I dont feel bad for the Iraq prisoners as you hae to remember what they did to our prisoners the first go around during GW1.

One of the British pilots who was captured and tortured during GW1 at the same prison the American-mistreatment recently occurred, was on TV a while ago commenting on it.

He was captured and tortured himself, and he expressed his disgust at what had happened to those Iraqi prisoners. If someone who was tortured themselves can show enough dignity to see that it is wrong whoever does it, why can't you?

[martinexsquaddie]

new rumours these images may be fake

[DeltaWhisky58]

There are now very serious doubts about thse pix.

1. The SA80A1 shown in the picture was not deployed to Iraq.
2. The QLR did not wear Bonnie hats in Iraq, thery wore helmets or berets.
3. The Type of Bedford truck shown in some of the pictures was not used in Iraq.

See the full report from the BBc here http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3677311.stm