Venezuela Spares no Efforts to Widen Iran's Presence in Latin America

[shocker1]

Chavez:
Venezuela Spares no Efforts to Widen Iran's Presence in Latin America
TEHRAN (Fars News Agency)- Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez stressed in a meeting with Iranian Foreign Minister Manouchehr Mottaki in Caracas on Friday that his country would spare no efforts to help boost Iran's presence in Latin America.

http://media.farsnews.com/Media/8503/Images/jpg/A0198/A0198689.jpg
A report released by the Foreign Ministry's Information and Press Bureau said that also during the meeting, Mottaki extended his congratulations to Chavez on Venezuela's National Day, and mentioned that appearance of the new generation of Latino leaders promises a new world, the most important characteristic of which is solidarity of the said leaders with their people and their justice-seeking orientation.

Describing the Middle-East and Latin America as two significant world regions where the United States was forced to experience failure in the last year, he pointed to the simultaneous visits to Latino states by Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez and US President George W. Bush, and said, "Despite all the negative and comprehensive propaganda launched by the US and the West against Chavez, the world witnessed wide public welcome to the Venezuelan president and growing hatred and demonstrations against Bush's presence in Latin American countries.

Elsewhere, Mottaki referred to the two countries' bilateral ties, and called for the combination of the new wave of vigilance with economic potentials in a bid to institutionalize independence-seeking political movements.

He further described the unjust and imposed international monetary and financial system as among the challenges of the developing countries, and said, "We can lay a proper ground for further growth and link the two regions to each other through the revision of monetary and financial system and establishment of a new one."

For his part, Venezuelan president reminded that Latin America used to be viewed as the United States' backyard, and continued, "The United States has looted our interests and oil for 200 years and sold its products to our people at high prices."

Chavez stressed that he and his comrades would continue the present campaign until achievement of full independence all across Latin America.

Also noting the two countries' good relations, he said Iran-Venezuela relations should not experience disruption even for one single second, and called for the two states' joint investments to pave the ground for cooperation in and with other countries, in addition to the two countries' mutual investments.

"We will spare no efforts for facilitating the presence of Iran, which is our strategic friend, in Latin America," the Venezuelan President underscored.

"All my efforts are aimed at expansion of ties with Iran and our government serves this aspiration," Chavez concluded.
http://www.farsnews.com/English/newstext.php?nn=8602010261

[Dasein]

So where's the American diplomacy to counter this? What alliances has the US created in either the mid-east or Latin America to present an alternative to the Venezuela-Iran bloc?

[shocker1]

So where's the American diplomacy to counter this? What alliances has the US created in either the mid-east or Latin America to present an alternative to the Venezuela-Iran bloc?
It's just an easy reflex to shoot off and blame the US huh?. What the hell have these two nations done to tone down the back and forth? Really what kind of grand bloc is this? What wonderful vision of mankind do they have? I would say we have more friends in Latin America than Chavez or Iran for that matter. So go ahead and blame America, parties and politicians. While these two nations use that partisan BS to their advantage. Yeah, it's just too bad we are not fluffing the pillows of the Latin American strongmen and the Persian peace maker. I mean we have fluffed dirty pillows before, why not now?

[Dasein]

Where do you see that I am blaming the US. Obviously you and the author see this as something we should concern ourselves with, so I am asking what is being done to counter this allaince. As this is fundamentally a diplomatic issue, it follows that we should and need to present a diplomatic solution. So, again I ask what diplomatic steps is the US taking to counter this?

[shocker1]

Where do you see that I am blaming the US. Obviously you and the author see this as something we should concern ourselves with, so I am asking what is being done to counter this allaince. As this is fundamentally a diplomatic issue, it follows that we should and need to present a diplomatic solution. So, again I ask what diplomatic steps is the US taking to counter this?
So once again you ignore the two nations here working against us. We have many good friends in Latin America. Diplomacy? what do you mean? I agree to a point that our diplomatic efforts are snobbish. I support calling these countries out with very high level talks, with play by plays on the news for the world to see that these two nations have no interest in us making out good on anything. Our diplomats have been threatned by Chavez too you know and of course Iran takes them hostage and holds them.

[Zuze]

I would say we have more friends in Latin America than Chavez
Hmm, are you sure about that? Most of Latin American governments are leftish and their population don't like gringos from the north. Maybe you have forgot hundreds of thousands anti-Bush protesters in recent US president Latin America visit?
Correct me if I am wrong but only Columbia, Mexico and Brazil has "pro" US governments.

[Dasein]

So once again you ignore the two nations here working against us.

No I'm not, I'm asking what we're doing about them. In other words, I am pressing for us to sure up our alliances in the region to counter this initiative.


We have many good friends in Latin America.

Do our friends know this? Do they know they can count on the US to support them, or does the US see that friendship only working one way?

[krasnayaarmiya]

"Quote:
Originally Posted by Dasein http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?p=2450963#post2450963)
So where's the American diplomacy to counter this? What alliances has the US created in either the mid-east or Latin America to present an alternative to the Venezuela-Iran bloc?

It's just an easy reflex to shoot off and blame the US huh?. What the hell have these two nations done to tone down the back and forth? Really what kind of grand bloc is this? What wonderful vision of mankind do they have? I would say we have more friends in Latin America than Chavez or Iran for that matter. So go ahead and blame America, parties and politicians. While these two nations use that partisan BS to their advantage. Yeah, it's just too bad we are not fluffing the pillows of the Latin American strongmen and the Persian peace maker. I mean we have fluffed dirty pillows before, why not now?"

You accuse him of being knee-jerk, but you quote his QUESTION as an accusation. That, in itself, is a knee-jerk reaction.

[krasnayaarmiya]

Hmm, are you sure about that? Most of Latin American governments are leftish and their population don't like gringos from the north. Maybe you have forgot hundreds of thousands anti-Bush protesters in recent US president Latin America visit?
Correct me if I am wrong but only Columbia, Mexico and Brazil has "pro" US governments.
And Lula is not gung-ho pro-American, IMHO.

[shocker1]

Ok when the Mullas start moving in we will see. Bush gets protested all out in the States. It means nothing when leftists organize a Bash Bush protest. To all those in Latin America wondering what America will do for them. What the hell is your own country doing for you? You guys are something else really, all your posts in this thread are directed at America. You still have not answered what good can come of this? Nor have you offered any suggestions other than what's America doing.

Middle ground as Dasein should agree. Like you said Diplomacy with no highminded BS and a firm direct to the point stand. The first question to those two nations should be. What do you really want? The second question should be what do you think we want? I bet the answers will bring us no closer together in the end. No matter how nice we are and generous with bribe money. Hate America has become an Industry for people like these to stay in power by blaming us for everything.

[shocker1]

"Quote:

You accuse him of being knee-jerk, but you quote his QUESTION as an accusation. That, in itself, is a knee-jerk reaction.
You know he is an excellent poster here and makes his points well. So your knee jerk defense is not needed. He is fully capable of debating his point. You will find that those who debate positions knee jerk as a means of ramping up debate. So instead of leaning on me with your kee jerk reaction to a post for someone else offer up what you think we should do.

No I'm not, I'm asking what we're doing about them. In other words, I am pressing for us to sure up our alliances in the region to counter this initiative.

Do our friends know this? Do they know they can count on the US to support them, or does the US see that friendship only working one way?
Good points. We are not doing enough and our past in the region does lend to difficulty. I hope the world lasts long enough for us to have a State Dept that works overtime with fresh ideas and a President willing to act on threats. Right now we only have the later. In the end though the majority of the blame sits on these two nations for the hostility.

[krasnayaarmiya]

So once again you ignore the two nations here working against us. We have many good friends in Latin America. Diplomacy? what do you mean? I agree to a point that our diplomatic efforts are snobbish. I support calling these countries out with very high level talks, with play by plays on the news for the world to see that these two nations have no interest in us making out good on anything. Our diplomats have been threatned by Chavez too you know and of course Iran takes them hostage and holds them.
So Iran took our diplomats hostage in what historical context? Did we forget about Shah Reza Pahlavi's government being a client to the US? Did we forget about the CIA backing of the SAVAK Iranian secret police, who angered the populace and POLARIZED them by killing and maiming all the moderates first? Did we forget about the popular Iranian resentment against the Shah who spent all his oil revenue on advanced military hardware (Iran was the only other country in the world to possess the F-14, now decommissioned by the US) while leaving huge swathes impoverished while buying solid gold toilets for his palaces?
The hostage-taking was clearly an egregious action, and one for which there was no redress, it is true. I am not suggesting that the US should have been OK with it, but it seems in light of our CRIMES in Iran (overthrow of their only democratically ected government in 1954), it really doesn't seem quite as offbase as if we look at the embassy seizure without context. Any thoughts?

[krasnayaarmiya]

You know he is an excellent poster here and makes his points well. So your knee jerk defense is not needed. He is fully capable of debating his point. You will find that those who debate positions knee jerk as a means of ramping up debate. So instead of leaning on me with your kee jerk reaction to a post for someone else offer up what you think we should do.
I can appreciate that response. Point taken.

I see you are a son of the Confederacy. Do you like Shelby Foote's The Civil War? I just finished with the chapters on Chickamauga, so Missionary Ridge is coming soon, I think. What do you think of Shelby Foote?

[shocker1]

So Iran took our diplomats hostage in what historical context? Did we forget about Shah Reza Pahlavi's government being a client to the US? Did we forget about the CIA backing of the SAVAK Iranian secret police, who angered the populace and POLARIZED them by killing and maiming all the moderates first? Did we forget about the popular Iranian resentment against the Shah who spent all his oil revenue on advanced military hardware (Iran was the only other country in the world to possess the F-14, now decommissioned by the US) while leaving huge swathes impoverished while buying solid gold toilets for his palaces?
The hostage-taking was clearly an egregious action, and one for which there was no redress, it is true. I am not suggesting that the US should have been OK with it, but it seems in light of our CRIMES in Iran (overthrow of their only democratically ected government in 1954), it really doesn't seem quite as offbase as if we look at the embassy seizure without context. Any thoughts?
Oh for sure the CIA. They have caused alot of **** to happen over the years. Yep we make everybody do bad things so it must be our evil need to be......... I understand what you are saying and the Shah was bad all around, about like Saddam. However the regime that took it's place is much worse in the end.
So we have established all the bad things America does to cause this. What about the other parties? No critique for them?

[shocker1]

I can appreciate that response. Point taken.

I see you are a son of the Confederacy. Do you like Shelby Foote's The Civil War? I just finished with the chapters on Chickamauga, so Missionary Ridge is coming soon, I think. What do you think of Shelby Foote?
One of the best Civil War historians that has lived so far. I received the book as a gift a few years back. Just sits on the coffee table though. His narrative on PBS with the Civil War was awsome. It is almost like he comes from that time. My house is close to Braggs Station and even closer to Hoods camp on the west side of Missionary ridge. You reminded me of my book, thanks. I need to read it.

dasein, After pondering krasnayaarmiya's critique of my knee jerk approach. Maybe saying your blaming the US went a little to far for reasonable discussion. My point still stands though we let these guys off with too much. Time to even out the blame.

[krasnayaarmiya]

Oh for sure the CIA. They have caused alot of **** to happen over the years. Yep we make everybody do bad things so it must be our evil need to be......... I understand what you are saying and the Shah was bad all around, about like Saddam. However the regime that took it's place is much worse in the end.
So we have established all the bad things America does to cause this. What about the other parties? No critique for them?
It is a matter of fact that MI6 and the CIA overthrew Mohammed Mossadeqh in 1953. I wrote 1954 in previous post. The coup was led by CIA agent Kermit Roosevelt, Jr. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kermit_Roosevelt%2C_Jr.)[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mossadeqh#_note-guardian)[6] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mossadeqh#_note-dmnow1), the grandson of U.S. President Theodore Roosevelt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodore_Roosevelt), and came to be known as Operation Ajax (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Ajax)[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mossadeqh#_note-guardian), after its CIA cryptonym (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_cryptonym).

That last bit with the links was from Wikipedia, cause I went there to verify the year of the coup. There is alot of info on this, it is not a conspiracy theory. Alot of the players involved have talked openly about his.

[krasnayaarmiya]

One of the best Civil War historians that has lived so far. I received the book as a gift a few years back. Just sits on the coffee table though. His narrative on PBS with the Civil War was awsome. It is almost like he comes from that time. My house is close to Braggs Station and even closer to Hoods camp on the west side of Missionary ridge. You reminded me of my book, thanks. I need to read it.

dasein, After pondering krasnayaarmiya's critique of my knee jerk approach. Maybe saying your blaming the US went a little to far for reasonable discussion. My point still stands though we let these guys off with too much. Time to even out the blame.
3000 frickin pages long!! I have been reading it since last summer.

[krasnayaarmiya]

My bad
Oh, I seemed to have misread your reply. My previous response to this is therefore moot.

[shocker1]

Oh, I seemed to have misread your reply. My previous response to this is therefore moot.
I know TV and the Internets have damaged my reading desire. I am a speed reader too but I tend to get headaches when I do that now. I need to work on that.

Back on topic. One of the worst things to happen was the Coup attempt against Chavez. Made him a powerful hero in the end. If he was left alone I bet he would be gone by now. Unless he pulled out the military card.

[krasnayaarmiya]

I know TV and the Internets have damaged my reading desire. I am a speed reader too but I tend to get headaches when I do that now. I need to work on that.

Back on topic. One of the worst things to happen was the Coup attempt against Chavez. Made him a powerful hero in the end. If he was left alone I bet he would be gone by now. Unless he pulled out the military card.
I am a reader of the slowest order. I ate paint chips as a child.

[Ordie]

Iran Air started new services linking Tehran via Damascus to Caracas flying 747-SP. Average passenger loads are 33 passengers.

I'd bet flights between Miami and Caracas are 1000% much higher.

What American diplomacy fails in the region is made up by the hundreds of thousand Latin American friends and families linking with loved ones in thier home countries. The personal visits, remittances, and business creates solid long term bonds between North and South America regardless of the rhetoric.

[krasnayaarmiya]

Chavez is just being contrary. He's not Stalin. He is trying to needle the US and find any other regional powers with whom he can do business.