Urgent Plea From the Front Lines Iraq

[seruriermarshal]

Urgent Plea From the Front Lines Iraq

By 1st Lt. Robert L. Nofsinger USMC

I(Hugh Hewitt) received the following e-mail today, and hope you will encourage others to read it and pass it on:

"Hello Everyone,

I am taking time to ask you all for your help.

First off, I'd like to say that this is not a political message. I'm not concerned about domestic politics right now. We have much bigger things to deal with, and we need your help.

It seems that despite the tremendous and heroic efforts of the men and women serving here in Iraq to bring much needed peace and stability to this region, we are losing the war of perception with the media and American people. Our enemy has learned that the key to defeating the mighty American military is by swaying public opinion at home and abroad. We are a people that cherish the democratic system of government and therefore hold the will of the people in the highest regard. We love to criticize ourselves almost to an endless degree, because we care what others think. Our enemies see this as a weakness and are trying to exploit it.

When we ask ourselves questions like, "Why do they hate us?" or "What did we do wrong?" we are playing into our enemies' hands. Our natural tendency to question ourselves is being used against us to undermine our effort to do good in the world. How far would we have gotten if after the surprise attacks on December 7, 1941 at Pearl Harbor, we would have asked, "Why do the Japanese hate us so much?" or "How can we change ourselves so that they won't do that again?" Here in Iraq the enemy is trying very hard to portray our efforts as failing and fruitless. They kill innocents and desecrate their bodies in hopes that the people back home will lose the will to fight for liberty. They are betting on our perceived weakness as a thoughtful, considerate people. Unfortunately our media only serves to further their cause.

In an industry that feeds on ratings and bad news, a failure in Iraq would be a goldmine. When our so-called "trusted" American media takes a quote from an Iraqi doctor as the gospel truth over that of the men and women that are daily fighting to protect the right to freedom of press, you know something is wrong. That doctor claimed that out of 600 Iraqis, that were casualties of the fighting, the vast majority of them were women, children and the elderly. This is totally absurd. In the history of man, no one has spent more time and effort, often to the detriment of our own mission, to be more discriminate in our targeting of the enemy than the American military. The Marines and Soldiers serving in Iraq have gone through extensive training in order to limit the amount of innocent casualties and collateral damage.

Yet, despite all of this, our media consistently sides with those who openly lie and directly challenge the honor of our brave heroes fighting for liberty and peace. What we have to remember is that peace is not defined as an absence of war. It is the presence of liberty, stability, and prosperity. In the face of the horrendous tyranny of the former Iraqi regime, the only way true peace was able to come to this region was through force. That is what the American Revolution was all about. Have we forgotten? Freedom is not free and "peace" without principle is not peace. The peace that so-called "peace advocates" support can only be brought to Iraq through the military. And we are doing it, if only the world will let us! If the American people believe we are failing, even if we are not, then we will ultimately fail.

That is why I am asking for your support. Become a voice of truth in your community. Wherever you are fight the lies of the enemy. Don't buy into the pessimism and apathy that says, "It's hopeless," "They hate us too much," "That part of the world is just too messed up," "It's our fault anyway," "We're to blame," and so forth. Whether you're in middle school, working at a 9-5 job, retired, or a stay-at-home mom you can make a huge difference! There is nothing more powerful than the truth. So, when you watch the news and see doomsday predictions and spiteful opinions on our efforts over here, you can refute them by knowing that we are doing a tremendous amount of good. Spread the word. No one is poised to make such an amazing contribution to the everyday lives of Iraqis and the rest of the Arab world than the American Armed Forces. By making this a place where liberty can finally grow, we are making the whole world safer. Your efforts at home are directly tied to our success. You are the soldiers at home fighting the war of perception. So I'm asking you as a fellow fighting man: Do your duty. Stop the attempts of the enemy wherever you are. You are a mighty force for good, because truth is on your side. Together we will win this fight and ensure a better world for the future.

God Bless and Semper Fidelis, 1st Lt. Robert L. Nofsinger USMC Ramadi, Iraq "

[Uninen]

Source? http://GodBlessTheGreatestNationOnEarthUnitedStatesOfAmericaAndPleaseRememberToVoteForGWBush.com ?

[seruriermarshal]

http://www.hughhewitt.com/

[Kilgor]

Source? http://GodBlessTheGreatestNationOnEarthUnitedStatesOfAmericaAndPleaseRememberToVoteForGWBush.com ?

www.getstuffedeurofags.com

[SeanAshi]

Is this propaganda, Uninen?

[scm77]

http://www.shutupunineneverythingyoupostisjusttostartaflamewar.com/youareanass.html

[jlanni]

thats so true...

[Uninen]

Is this propaganda, Uninen?


our media consistently sides with those who openly lie and directly challenge the honor of our brave heroes fighting for liberty and peace.
Yep, go and take a look at http://www.cbsnews.com or at http://www.cnn.com and you should soon realize that what this person is claiming is full of ****.

And i wont even bother to go down all the other biassed **** posted at here.

[usa320]

http://www.shutthefeckupuninenandstopbeingaeurofagandstopwiththatannoyingbluewritingbecauseitsannoyingaskidneystones.com

[the_spec]

When we ask ourselves questions like, "Why do they hate us?" or "What did we do wrong?" we are playing into our enemies' hands. Our natural tendency to question ourselves is being used against us to undermine our effort to do good in the world. How far would we have gotten if after the surprise attacks on December 7, 1941 at Pearl Harbor, we would have asked, "Why do the Japanese hate us so much?" or "How can we change ourselves so that they won't do that again?"
"But thank god we're not like that and solve all problems with military force." rofl

That's great. I always thought that the americans don't question what they're doing and for what, but what a suprise to find out that it's actually a natural tendency of them and they just downplay it, so to not play into their enemies hands. :roll:

[Argyll]

Is this propaganda, Uninen?


our media consistently sides with those who openly lie and directly challenge the honor of our brave heroes fighting for liberty and peace.
Yep, go and take a look at http://www.cbsnews.com or at http://www.cnn.com and you should soon realize that what this person is claiming is full of ****.

And i wont even bother to go down all the other biassed **** posted at here.


rofl and where pray tell me do you get all your bona fide information about Iraq,seeing as the nearest you've been to Iraq is an Atlas you clown!

The media are trecherous wankers in Iraq,they are nothing but ****e hawks,tell you this much if and this is a probability,a newsteam were being abducted or attacked by insurgents in full view of either a PMC or a regular Army unit they leave tha bastards to their fate,as they will wait by an ambush site and film the death and destruction about to be witnessed,they get no foking symapthy from me...........they are the lowest form of life here in Iraq.

[juhae]

The media are trecherous wankers in Iraq,
http://www.kevinsites.net/ (An NBC journalist's personal blog, his conversation about the role media in Iraq with a Marine [Monday, 3rd of May] alone makes it worth checking out.)

[HELEX]

Office for Strategic Information at work, just BS.... :cantbeli:

http://images.ucomics.com/comics/bd/2004/bd040502.gif

[Luxembourger]

they are the lowest form of life here in Iraq.

fully agree on that , I mentioned once that they should urge all media guys get out of iraq . The media gets worse and worse . They show only the bad things going on in iraq., they don t show the construction of schools nor the improving of the lives of the people .

[Trident-za]

fully agree on that , I mentioned once that they should urge all media guys get out of iraq . The media gets worse and worse . They show only the bad things going on in iraq., they don t show the construction of schools nor the improving of the lives of the people .

Yeah, thats true.... the only problem is that if the media left Iraq, the only "news" source we would have is the Pentagon.... and I wouldn't trust them to tell the "the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth" either.

And I guess it should be asked whether the media in Iraq is different to the media anywhere else?

[Trident-za]

http://www.kevinsites.net/ (An NBC journalist's personal blog, his conversation about the role media in Iraq with a Marine [Monday, 3rd of May] alone makes it worth checking out.)

Haven't had a chance to really look at the site, but it looks interesting.... is this quote what you were referring to?


"They always seem to focus on the negative--guys getting hurt or killed out here," he tells me."

I nod; waiting, listening for more. There is none. So I try to explain the intentions of my profession--with the same care and detail that military men and women have used to explain to me theirs over the last year.

"If we don't cover those things we don't honor the sacrifice that person has made," I say, "whether it's with their lives or limbs or whatever. For instance, if something happens to me out here, say we hit an I.E.D. (improvised explosive device) or an RPG (rocket propelled grenade), I don't want to die in the dark. I don't want my loved ones to be wondering what happened to me. I want them to know. And I want that sacrifice to be remembered by others too, however briefly."

He listens closely as I continue. I'm wound up now, because I've given this stump speech so many times--and because I want him to understand it.

"We do cover others things in Iraq, good things, when they happen. However, the news that stays in peoples' minds is the most dramatic moment. We can do five stories on school openings or rebuilding projects or an unusual act of kindness. And we have. But always the story that people end up taking away with them, the one that stays in their heads is the one in which a human being dies. There's no greater event in our lives, nothing that ultimately connects us more to each other."

When I'm finished he has the same look that I probably had after his briefing; tidbits of useful information as well as some frightening ones all washing over him, answering some questions, creating more.

[Tane Angle]

When we ask ourselves questions like, "Why do they hate us?" or "What did we do wrong?" we are playing into our enemies' hands. Our natural tendency to question ourselves is being used against us to undermine our effort to do good in the world.

While I'm not laughing about it, I do have to say that it is usually worth it to learn the other sides' ways and logic, even if it is wrong. It is usually worth it to understand what they believe, and why they believe it, both religiously and in terms of why they fight.

Now this is by no means a dig at the Marines, especially not this officer. I think most of you know that I have the utmost respect for the US Marines, having served alongside them and witnessed their extreme courage and stalwart fortitude.

Have a good one, and just some thoughts...

[HELEX]

All those "Propaganda Letters" are faked....!


US Army's 'fake' letters cause stir
A series of letters supposedly written by US troops in Iraq detailing their successes in the country were all written by their commander, it has emerged.
The publication of the letters, in several US newspapers, comes as the Bush administration has stepped up efforts to win over an American public increasingly sceptical of its handling of the situation in Iraq.

Critics said if the letters were found to be part of an organised effort by the military to win over US hearts and minds regarding the conflict it could be a violation of military ethics.

However, the soldiers' commander, Lieutenant Colonel Dominic Caraccilo, told ABC News on Tuesday his staff had written the letters merely to get "good news" back to the US more efficiently.

He says he then sent it round to his soldiers saying they could send a copy home if they wanted to.

"We thought it would be a good idea to encapsulate what we as a battalion have accomplished since arriving Iraq and share that pride with people back home," he said.

'Positive aspect'

The missives detailed the lives of soldiers from the 2nd Battalion of the 503rd Infantry Regiment and their efforts to re-establish law and order in the northern Iraqi city of Kirkuk, where they are based.

The soldiers "wrote" of rebuilding police and fire departments and of repairing water and sewer plants in the area.

The letters came to light when some of the soldiers' families sent them to local newspapers.

Editors became suspicious when they noticed the letters had identical phrases even though they were signed by different soldiers.

"After nearly five months here, the people still come running from their homes, into the 110-degree heat, waving to us as our troops drive by on daily patrols of the city," read one line.

One soldier's mother said she knew it was not her son's words as he did not have the linguistic ability.

But Amy Connell told the New York Times she passed the letter - signed by her paratrooper son, Adam - to the Boston Globe newspaper because she was proud of his achievements.

"I wanted the positive view put out there,'' she told the



http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3190934.stm

[Argyll]

Prior to my Deployment to Iraq I used to be pretty middle of the road where the media was concerned,I was fairly impartial and was always open to listen to both sides of the coin so to speak.
That changed when I began listening to Security guys and Soldiers stories of the media exploits,and from seeing them 1st hand for myself,I'm almost embarrassed at my previous perception of the media,and felt a touch of apathy towards them in the past and the roles they undertook in Iraq.
But when they cross the line,and in some cases instigate attacks on Coalition vehicles/personnel just to get that "exclusive"then being impartial goes right out the window as far as I'm concerned.They are like the angels of death,when you see them perched on a flyover,death is but moments away for someone ,something........and that disgusts me,it disgusts me more than so called fake letters........some people here need to go to Iraq and see for themselves

[Elmo]

I'm sure there are many fortune seekers in Iraq and that probably includes reporters hunting for exclusives. Many many people gain financially out of misery/coming democracy of others, referring to it as "going to sandbox protecting people/taking photos/constructing". There must already be too many peace and stability loving westeners adding their armed/unarmed contribution to the bitter Iraqi cuisine so perhaps we should let you take care of educating us about Iraq exclusively, Argyll...since you have already been there and all.

[weedman]

Office for Strategic Information at work, just BS.... :cantbeli:

http://images.ucomics.com/comics/bd/2004/bd040502.gif :lol:

[M1A2U2]

I find it very sad that a letter like this is still ignored and called proganda.

[Argyll]

I'm sure there are many fortune seekers in Iraq and that probably includes reporters hunting for exclusives. Many many people gain financially out of misery/coming democracy of others, referring to it as "going to sandbox protecting people/taking photos/constructing". There must already be too many peace and stability loving westeners adding their armed/unarmed contribution to the bitter Iraqi cuisine so perhaps we should let you take care of educating us about Iraq exclusively, Argyll...since you have already been there and all.

By the very nature of your contents I wouldn't entertain you,you have a single mind opinion that is not swayed by others experience,hence I'd just be wasting my breath,and you missed the point completely about the media,instead you tried to make it a PMC issue,tell me this what is it about you Finns that has you living in Judgement of others?I mean it's not like you have contributed in any wars ,you sit on the sidelines and pass judgement on others it seems,yet you are never there to assist in any way other than ****ty mobile phones?

Would you even be prepared to listen to what I seen in Iraq?,because your other countrymen all seem well versed in the truth about Iraq despite never having been?

[chauncy republicans]

tell me this what is it about you Finns that has you living in Judgement of others?
Actually Argyll, you and the Americans and the Isrealis are always the ones passing judgement. You guys are like prophets...

[Argyll]

Prophets or profits? ;)

do prohets pass judgements?

proph·et ( P ) ****unciation Key (prft)
n.
A person who speaks by divine inspiration or as the interpreter through whom the will of a god is expressed.
A person gifted with profound moral insight and exceptional powers of expression.
A predictor; a soothsayer.
The chief spokesperson of a movement or cause.

I like being a prophet if these are the interpretations!
I used to think Insparation was when you ran a lot it made you all wet and sticky ;)

Are you not an American as well?

[Tane Angle]

Argyll can tell the future. Can so. Yesterday he told me it was going to be hot, sunny, and sandy here today, with a moderate chance of roadside bombings. Good prediction, bud. p-)

[mustamato]

tell me this what is it about you Finns that has you living in Judgement of others?I mean it's not like you have contributed in any wars ,you sit on the sidelines and pass judgement on others it seems,yet you are never there to assist in any way other than ****ty mobile phones?

You mean except participating in


Siinai 1956-1957, UNEF I
• Komppania

Libanon 1958, UNOGIL
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Intia ja Pakistan , UNMOGIP 1961–
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Lähi-Itä, UNTSO 1967–
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Kypros, UNIFICYP 1964–
• Pataljoona (kotiutettiin 1977)
• Nykyisin muutaman miehen osasto

Siinai 1973-1979, UNEF II
• Pataljoona

Golan 1979-1993, UNDOF
• Pataljoona

Libanon 1982-2001, UNIFIL • Pataljoona

Afganistan ja Pakistan 1988-1990, UNGOMAP
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Afganistan ja Pakistan 1990-1992, OSGAP
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Irak ja Iran 1988-1991, UNIIMOG
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Namibia 1989-1990, UNTAG
• Pataljoona
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Irak ja Kuwait, UNIKOM 1991–2003
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Somalia 1992-1993, UNOSOM I
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Kroatia, UNPROFOR 1992-1993
• Rakentajapataljoona
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Makedonia, UNPREDEP 1993-1999
• Aluksi komppania
• Pataljoona vuodesta 1994
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Bosnia-Hertzegovina 1996, IFOR
• Rakentajapataljoona

Bosnia-Hertzegovina, SFOR 1996–2003
• Rakentajapataljoona,
muutettiin vähitellen
jääkäripataljoonaksi
• CIMIC-komppania

Kroatia, UNTAES 1996–1997
• Sotilastarkkailja

Kroatia, UNMOP 1996– 2002
• Sotilastarkkailijoita

Makedonia, EUFOR 2003
• Sotilasosasto

Kosovo, KFOR 1999 –
• Pataljoona
• Lisäksi muun muassa
esikuntaupseereja

Kosovo, UNMIK 1999–
• Esikuntaupseereja

Etiopia ja Eritrea, UNMEE 2000–
• Sotilastarkkailijoita
• Esikuntaupseereja

Afganistan, ISAF 2002–
• Cimic-osasto • Yhteysupseereita

Afganistan, UNAMA 2003–
• Sotilasneuvontaja

http://tietokannat.mil.fi/rauhanturvaajat/images/fiilis_unefi_iso.jpg
My avatar in Sinai by the way :)

[Argyll]

and I missed out the part where it was still pissing down in Scotland! ;)

[Salty Dog]

www.clown*****.fart

[duck]

Mustamato,

Why did you do your military service in Sweden and not in Finland? Obviously you have the wrong passport...

[Elmo]

By the very nature of your contents I wouldn't entertain you,you have a single mind opinion that is not swayed by others experience,hence I'd just be wasting my breath,and you missed the point completely about the media,instead you tried to make it a PMC issue,tell me this what is it about you Finns that has you living in Judgement of others?I mean it's not like you have contributed in any wars ,you sit on the sidelines and pass judgement on others it seems,yet you are never there to assist in any way other than ****ty mobile phones?

Would you even be prepared to listen to what I seen in Iraq?,because your other countrymen all seem well versed in the truth about Iraq despite never having been?

Oh, I'm jealous not being able to go to war against evil governments around the globe that are threatening my freedom. I'm never going to be able to be all I can be, to make a difference...damn government is not willing to contribute. I'm also too chicken**** to go to Baghdad myself and experience the nightlife. That is why I am eager to judge.

****ty mobilephones, agreed.

And yes, I'm all ears about your experiences in Iraq.

Finally, I just added an another perspective to foreign people in Iraq who have arrived there after the invasion...in no way did I miss your point about media, those people are vultures...and some others too.

[Trident-za]

and I missed out the part where it was still pissing down in Scotland! ;)

I must be a prophet too then - I can predict the weather in Scotland... all the way from South Africa, and be right 80% of the time! :lol:

On a serious note, you make good points about the media Argyll. It's obviously something you have to see/experience, which counts most of us here out. Glad you can pass on a bit of truth and reality mate.

[WARPIG]

What gives? No matter who comments.. how it is written… where the source comes… US hating seems the fashionable thing. Media from every country in the world is notorious for reporting bull**** as it suits them. No surprise, no real argument.. unless it supports anti-US sentiment. Of course then it becomes irrefutable fact. If you get your education from the media… you are content with ignorance. No amount of experience is enough.. no measure of common sense is attainable.. and no amount of individual thinking is possible.
Europe in general seems very entertained whenever negative press is aimed toward the US. But on this forum, Finland seems to have a strong showing. Why is that? Of all the countries that should be outspoken about the War in Iraq…. Finland should be the last.
Of all the countries that have any credible vantage from which to criticize… Finland again.. last.
When a country as a whole contributes nothing, risks nothing, neither achieves nor fails nothing… why would so many from there feel so obliged to criticize another country? Apathy and anonimity must truly be a safe haven for the ignorant. I don’t mean to generalize all Finns, or all Europeans for that matter. I just can’t seem to understand why so many have taken such an obviously spiteful point of view. It just seems like the fashionable thing to do.
War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.
~John Stuart Mill

[Argyll]

and I missed out the part where it was still pissing down in Scotland! ;)

I must be a prophet too then - I can predict the weather in Scotland... all the way from South Africa, and be right 80% of the time! :lol:

On a serious note, you make good points about the media Argyll. It's obviously something you have to see/experience, which counts most of us here out. Glad you can pass on a bit of truth and reality mate.

Its also common sense mate,the problem with the media is it is their sole job to make you believe that their story is in fact correct.

One news network can report a story about an incident and another will report about their NOT being an incident,it is the Anchors job to make you believe,it's called media manipulation.

The odd thing is that despite this manipulation we all sit glued to the screens each night to see and listen to what THEIR interpretation of the days events.........odd isn't it,all we did was yell at the telly ,and say how much we all wanted to "roger" Lisa Holland and the Irish girl who does the weather on sky news!!

[Elmo]

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.
~John Stuart Mill

What is this quote? What are you trying to tell about Iraq? Oh, I think I know already and it makes me laugh. I'm not sure if I should cry instead, though. Really Warpig, you and your kind don't have to protect my freedom in the Iraqi oilfields with your war of aggression, I don't even have a car.

BTW, anti-Americanism is not fashionable. Anti-American foreign policy is the case here, and it doesn't have anything to do with fashion.

[n.ignomo]

I don't want to start a thread so i put it here. Today in France, a program shew the vid with the 3 guys getting shot from an apache (you know truck, tractor and pickup). Seems that this "shoot the wonded" is growing and growing more and again....now many chanels around the world are trying to get this vid.
Something i add which had been said during that prog : with all the privates working for the DoD, for sure infos of all kinds just go where it shouldn't.

[WARPIG]

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.
~John Stuart Mill

What is this quote? What are you trying to tell about Iraq? Oh, I think I know already and it makes me laugh. I'm not sure if I should cry instead, though. Really Warpig, you and your kind don't have to protect my freedom in the Iraqi oilfields with your war of aggression, I don't even have a car.
It was a quote.. no more no less. Funny how the words "better men than himself." seemed like a roll call. Thanks for checking in.
As the purely unfashionable voice of reason here... answer this for me Elmo....

As the dolt posting after you seemed to try and point out... if the war in Iraq can be fought from the air... why are my brothers and sisters in arms on the ground? If we are simply killing at will for oil, why not do it from the safety of a bomber? Why is it that the oil that we are supposed to fight for never shows up in this country? Wouldn't it have been easier just to fight the Taliban and Al Queda in Afghanistan and just do what the rest of the world was doing and take oil under the table from Saddam? We could have just leveraged the oil out of him instead of putting my life at risk.... or worse.. making me kill. Why is that? It couldn't possibly be because we are trying to save civilian lives by fighting the insurgents at the street level. No, we must be on the ground to protect that oil that is driving the cost of gas down so much. If my sarcasm fails to transcend the language barrier... I will add some ridiculous smileys.

BTW, anti-Americanism is not fashionable. Anti-American foreign policy is the case here, and it doesn't have anything to do with fashion.

[2Sheds_Jackson]

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.
~John Stuart Mill

What is this quote? What are you trying to tell about Iraq? Oh, I think I know already and it makes me laugh. I'm not sure if I should cry instead, though. Really Warpig, you and your kind don't have to protect my freedom in the Iraqi oilfields with your war of aggression, I don't even have a car.

BTW, anti-Americanism is not fashionable. Anti-American foreign policy is the case here, and it doesn't have anything to do with fashion.

Unless you're an American, it's not the US military's job to protect you. So you may want to find out who's job that is, just in case something does happen that involves you.

But is there anything that you'd consider fighting for? I mean, you personally. That's what warpig's quote is talking about. Are you stating that nothing is worth fighting for? For example, if you believed you/your family/neighbors etc. were threatened - would that be worth fighting for? Or would you simply be content to live at the whim of others who would dominate you?

Anti-Americanism can't really be called fashionable...more accurate to say "flavor of the week". Media outlets don't give a rat's a## about the subject matter - their job is to produce sensationalist content in order to sell advertising. And once they have something they can sink their teeth into, that money just rolls in.

n.ignomo - that video is old, and has been posted here at least twice before that I'm aware of. If I'm not mistaken, they had an RPG (believe that part is often left out of retransmissions). Yes, it's unpleasant to see people being shot - but they made the choice to answer the call to arms. And they paid the price.

[mustamato]

Unless you're an American, it's not the US military's job to protect you.

Because of political reasons, "coalition of the willing", US considers Finland as an
ally. And hm, US military is intended to protect allied countries as well?

http://www.centcom.mil/Operations/Coalition/joint.htm
Elmo´s country is on the list...

[FinnishMF]

Unless you're an American, it's not the US military's job to protect you.

Because of political reasons, "coalition of the willing", US considers Finland as an
ally. And hm, US military is intended to protect allied countries as well?

http://www.centcom.mil/Operations/Coalition/joint.htm
Elmo´s country is on the list...
so is Sweden ? :O

[WARPIG]

Unless you're an American, it's not the US military's job to protect you.

Because of political reasons, "coalition of the willing", US considers Finland as an
ally. And hm, US military is intended to protect allied countries as well?

http://www.centcom.mil/Operations/Coalition/joint.htm
Elmo´s country is on the list...

Little things affect little minds. Keep focusing on the details and not the big picture.

[afrographX]

Source? http://GodBlessTheGreatestNationOnEarthUnitedStatesOfAmericaAndPleaseRememberToVoteForGWBush.com ?

word!!!!! :D

[Elmo]

It was a quote.. no more no less. Funny how the words "better men than himself." seemed like a roll call. Thanks for checking in.

Oh, you are really rubbing it in my face, aren't you? Listen, you'd be better off without all that psycho babble about characteristics of different people based on their nationality...apathy a safe haven for the ignorant...and all that, which apparently is related to that completely out of context quote.


As the dolt posting after you seemed to try and point out... if the war in Iraq can be fought from the air... why are my brothers and sisters in arms on the ground? If we are simply killing at will for oil, why not do it from the safety of a bomber? Why is it that the oil that we are supposed to fight for never shows up in this country? Wouldn't it have been easier just to fight the Taliban and Al Queda in Afghanistan and just do what the rest of the world was doing and take oil under the table from Saddam? We could have just leveraged the oil out of him instead of putting my life at risk.... or worse.. making me kill. Why is that? It couldn't possibly be because we are trying to save civilian lives by fighting the insurgents at the street level. No, we must be on the ground to protect that oil that is driving the cost of gas down so much. If my sarcasm fails to transcend the language barrier... I will add some ridiculous smileys.

Sure thing. It's the civilian life you are protecting. First and foremost. The insurgents started the mess in the first place. It doesn't have anything to do with geopolitics.

[duck]

Elmo,

What if Saddam had launched missiles at your cities like he did to Israel and Saudi Arabia in GWI?

What if his sons had abducted and raped your sisters for their pleasure like they did to ordinary Iraqis every day?

What if your family members had been tortured and murdered by his thugs on a massive scale?

Lucky guy, you and your country do not need oil, gas or nuclear power to sustain your lifestyle. Must be paradise.

[usa320]

as they will wait by an ambush site and film the death and destruction about to be witnesse

Thats always pissed me off. Reporters watching Insurgents set up IED's and RPG sites, and the cameramen sitting idly by, waiting for a patrol to move though, instead of tipping off the soldiers.

ANNOYS ME ****LESS.

[mustamato]

as they will wait by an ambush site and film the death and destruction about to be witnesse

Thats always pissed me off. Reporters watching Insurgents set up IED's and RPG sites, and the cameramen sitting idly by, waiting for a patrol to move though, instead of tipping off the soldiers.

ANNOYS ME f***.

Given that the camera images are shaky as a maracas, and taped with a Walmart
video camera with extreme low quality I doubt that we are taking about professional
camera men from Al-Jazeera.

[Elmo]

Unless you're an American, it's not the US military's job to protect you. So you may want to find out who's job that is, just in case something does happen that involves you.

But is there anything that you'd consider fighting for? I mean, you personally. That's what warpig's quote is talking about. Are you stating that nothing is worth fighting for? For example, if you believed you/your family/neighbors etc. were threatened - would that be worth fighting for? Or would you simply be content to live at the whim of others who would dominate you?



Yes indeed, I do know whose job it is to protect my hedonistic world. That would be me...as long as Finland is not in the NATO. If they decide to go there, I'll send my military passport back to the Army and become a conscientious objector. In that case it would be someone else's job to protect my selfish needs while I plant trees in a work camp where they order objectors from the reserves for a week or two. (beer is allowed there, I have heard)

[duck]

Elmo,

In what way are American national interests opposed to Finnish ones? If you could just give a few convincing examples?

[Elmo]

Elmo,

What if Saddam had launched missiles at your cities like he did to Israel and Saudi Arabia in GWI?

What if his sons had abducted and raped your sisters for their pleasure like they did to ordinary Iraqis every day?

What if your family members had been tortured and murdered by his thugs on a massive scale?

Lucky guy, you and your country do not need oil, gas or nuclear power to sustain your lifestyle. Must be paradise.

Yeah. But those weren't the reasons for the invasion -until recently.

[Argyll]

as they will wait by an ambush site and film the death and destruction about to be witnesse

Thats always pissed me off. Reporters watching Insurgents set up IED's and RPG sites, and the cameramen sitting idly by, waiting for a patrol to move though, instead of tipping off the soldiers.

ANNOYS ME f***.

Given that the camera images are shaky as a maracas, and taped with a Walmart
video camera with extreme low quality I doubt that we are taking about professional
camera men from Al-Jazeera.

I'm not just talking about Al Jazeera here Musty,some major Networks have been known to turn up at the right time,some already in Position awaiting the event.......some foreign Networks some US networks.....great journalism or insider info........you tell me?
I'll tell you this much it scares the **** outta you when you see a TV crew(westerners) mounted cameras pointing towards where you are driving!!
its pedal to the metal and hell mend anything stupid enough to cross your path

[big_les]

I find it very sad that a letter like this is still ignored and called proganda.

You don't have to ignore it, but it *is* in my opinion propaganda. The weary, tear-in-the-eye US soldier emailing home to express his feelings over the job he's doing and its variations is getting more and more common. Don't discount Helex simply because you don't agree with his viewpoint. I don't doubt real US servicemen are emailing home with similar sentiments, but this type of forwarded letter is a positive myth made by well-meaning (I think( individuals to rally home support.

I apologise if a letter has been received from someone known to the poster here, but I have seen such email forwards several times now and they follow a very similar pattern.