View Full Version : Angry crowd kills passenger in car that struck child
Secret Squirrel
06-20-2007, 07:35 PM
AUSTIN, Texas (AP) -- An angry crowd beat a man to death after a vehicle he was riding in struck and injured a child, police said Wednesday.
The driver had stopped to check on the young girl at the entrance to an apartment complex when a group of men attacked him Tuesday night, authorities said.
The passenger, David Rivas Morales, 40, got out to try to help the driver, but the crowd turned on him, said police Commander Harold Piatt.
Morales was beaten to death by as many as 20 men and left lying in a parking lot, Piatt said. A preliminary autopsy listed blunt force trauma as the cause of death.
Margaret Morales said she found her brother sprawled on the pavement, battered and choking on blood.
John Morales, the victim's brother, said doctors told him and his family that they could not control the bleeding in his brain and that his heart kept stopping in the emergency room.
"I just want the people caught and brought to justice," said Elizabeth Morales, another sister. "I want them to feel the same pain that they caused my brother."
The girl, 3 or 4 years old, was taken to a hospital with non-life threatening injuries.
An estimated 2,000 to 3,000 people were in the area for a city-sponsored festival for Juneteenth, which commemorates Texas slaves getting the word in 1865 that they had been freed.
The driver, who got away from the crowd, is cooperating with investigators, police said.
Piatt did not know how many witnesses had been identified. He said no guns or knives appeared to have been used in the fatal attack.
link (http://edition.cnn.com/2007/US/06/20/crash.assault.ap/index.html)
The sad thing is that this will probably lead to more hit and runs.
wait how is it a hit and run
maybe I misunderstood the story, but it says that the driver stopped and came out to help the child, and then a wild mob attacked him.
I dont see how this is a hit and run
2Sheds_Jackson
06-20-2007, 07:49 PM
Nothing says "happy Juneteenth" quite like a deadly mob beating.
cover2
06-20-2007, 07:50 PM
wait how is it a hit and run
maybe I misunderstood the story, but it says that the driver stopped and came out to help the child, and then a wild mob attacked him.
I dont see how this is a hit and run
Duh. The poster said it might lead to more, b/c people who hear this story may not stop the way this guy did. Thus they will "hit" and "run". Tough jump of logic there.
Laworkerbee
06-20-2007, 07:55 PM
I would not have stopped I ain't going out like Reginald Denny
Macs.
06-20-2007, 08:01 PM
Year 2007.
Ordie
06-20-2007, 08:13 PM
Unfortunately it may create more 'hit and run' incidents.
Because people who normally will stop and assist may think otherwise and and drive away to a safer location.
One outcome may be to change the definition of "hit and run" to one of "Hit, seek safety, and call 911".
WarriorMonk
06-20-2007, 09:33 PM
wasn't this a CSI episode...?
noname
06-20-2007, 09:45 PM
shouldn't this be in the off topic and humor section?
Firetxmi
06-20-2007, 10:14 PM
shouldn't this be in the off topic and humor section?
And how is this in any way humorous?
Calanen
06-20-2007, 10:33 PM
Its a worry. There was a crash and rob in my street not so long ago, maybe 2 months ago. Car rammed the back of this BMW, driver got out, perps attacked, took the BMW. Reason they did that, the rammer car was out of fuel. And gas stations have cameras, so cant refuel there. So, ram another car and keep going.
His friend was beaten to death, which is very sad. There is a high price for being a good samaritan these days. Or perhaps there always was.
BearInBunnySuit
06-20-2007, 11:07 PM
When I read the title of the thread, I thought the incident occured in a 3rd world country. Then I read the story and found out it happened in the bucolic town of Austin, Texas of all places. Chit, what is America coming to...
I thought people in Austin would be too mellow to do something like this.
krasnayaarmiya
06-20-2007, 11:59 PM
I would not have stopped I ain't going out like Reginald Denny
If you hit a child with your car, you wouldn't get out to help her? You're a winner
jdslow300
06-21-2007, 12:12 AM
http://www.breitbart.tv/html/1962.html
theres video of a seperate but still shocking incedent in milwaukee
Laworkerbee
06-21-2007, 02:41 AM
If you hit a child with your car, you wouldn't get out to help her? You're a winner
Nope not with an enraged mob swarming me! what good would stopping serve in a scenario like that?
more than likely your question is just an attempt to throw out some flames.
Durandal
06-21-2007, 08:53 AM
Just read a couple more news articles on this...
Hispanic dude, gets jumped by a black crowd and Hispanic and Black leaders are asking for calm hoping this won't incite race clashes.
All is alive and well in America.
I wonder if they'll slap on a "hate crime" charge in addition to whatever else the throw out when the find the wastes of flesh that did this.
joe mama
06-21-2007, 10:21 AM
...I wonder if they'll slap on a "hate crime" charge in addition to whatever else the throw out when the find the wastes of flesh that did this.
Hate crime? Silly boy, hate crimes are only committed by whites against the poor downtrodden [archie bunker]minororities[/archie bunker].
When an angry black mob beats a hispanic man to death over an accident, it's (you choose):
1) justifiable homicide
2) due to white people making black people and hispanic people dislike each other
3) part of the culture, and must be respected, you racist fcuk
4) the fault of the white car company that built the car, and/or the white construction company that built the street, and/or the white traffic engineer who designed the intersection/street
joe mama
06-21-2007, 10:24 AM
The sad thing is that this will probably lead to more hit and runs.
Actually the sad thing is what will happen to the animals that did this (probably not much), vs what would happen if it had been a white crowd and a hispanic or black victim: (insert jesse jackson/al sharpton/spike lee/kanye west/louis farrakhan rant about white racists here)
Mu-Meson
06-21-2007, 11:14 AM
joe mama's right. It don't fit the grand narrative spewed by a certain political ideology, therefore it is going to be largely ignored by the certain politcal ideologies cheerleaders in the media. Just like the Christian-Newsom murders.
Did they beat him to death because he was hispanic? I don't understand why the hate crime label is now being thrown around. I'll wait and see what the cops say but if there was no racial element for his death then it can't be a hate crime. That's what we call murder on the other hand if there was a racial element to it then it is a hate crime plus murder. Get a grip folks.
Miles.
06-21-2007, 12:02 PM
Don't run over black children if you ain't black.
Don't run over black children if you ain't black.
piss off mate.
joe mama
06-21-2007, 12:42 PM
Did they beat him to death because he was hispanic? I don't understand why the hate crime label is now being thrown around. I'll wait and see what the cops say but if there was no racial element for his death then it can't be a hate crime. That's what we call murder on the other hand if there was a racial element to it then it is a hate crime plus murder. Get a grip folks.
I'm interested in if it's labeled a hate crime or not because I suspect that if it were a white crowd and a black victim, regardless of the true reason they beat him, there'd be much gnashing of teeth and wailing about racism and screeching for hate crime status by certain people.
Durandal
06-21-2007, 12:48 PM
Did they beat him to death because he was hispanic? I don't understand why the hate crime label is now being thrown around. I'll wait and see what the cops say but if there was no racial element for his death then it can't be a hate crime. That's what we call murder on the other hand if there was a racial element to it then it is a hate crime plus murder. Get a grip folks.
Just point out obvious wonderings...
In my book, if it was an all black crowd beating up a single Hispanic, it was a hate crime.
Don't like it...get rid of the law, which I am all for. Regardless of the reasons a murder is a murder and assault is assault.
velvet-cream
06-21-2007, 12:55 PM
There may be racial elements contributing to this, but I would leave that.
I think the critical issue now is whether this incident would lead to a common law defence of a "hit and run" charge. I'm sure someone will try to argue this in the future, and create a precedent that would really f**k things up when prosecutors try to charge hit and run drivers.
Unfortunately I think this would be the case, unless lawmakers specifically exclude it in statute as a defence.
joe mama
06-21-2007, 01:00 PM
There may be racial elements contributing to this, but I would leave that.
I think the critical issue now is whether this incident would lead to a common law defence of a "hit and run" charge. I'm sure someone will try to argue this in the future, and create a precedent that would really f**k things up when prosecutors try to charge hit and run drivers.
Unfortunately I think this would be the case, unless lawmakers specifically exclude it in statute as a defence.
Prediction:
If a white person hits a black kid in a black neighborhood and drives away, claiming it's not really hit and run because if they'd stopped they'd get beaten to death, they'll be crucified for being a racist.
If a black person hits a white kid in a white neighborhood and drives away, claiming it's not really hit and run because if they'd stopped they'd get beaten to death, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Amos & Andy, and Minister Farrakhan will be there to testify to the truth of this statement and sell a few bean pies.
Mr Gently Benevolent
06-21-2007, 01:10 PM
Was it not only last year that a Gypsy mob in the countryside in the Czech Republic beat a driver to death after he hit a child.
Just point out obvious wonderings...
In my book, if it was an all black crowd beating up a single Hispanic, it was a hate crime.
Don't like it...get rid of the law, which I am all for. Regardless of the reasons a murder is a murder and assault is assault.
Why get rid of a law that punishes a crime based on a particular intent - race? I don't know the motivations of the crowd that did this nasty thing but if it was racial then charge them with a hate crime. After all people still get angry to the point of violent rage minus racial factors playing a role in their actions. I'll adopt a wait and see approach like I always do.
velvet-cream
06-21-2007, 01:55 PM
They could charge them with hate crimes (if that is a crime in the particular jurisdiction). But why bother going there? Keep it simple, and charge them for murder first. Sure you can tack on the hate crimes later on, but I wouldn't want to overwhelm/confuse the jury that the issue in question was whether it was a "hate crime". The main issue is murder, full stop. If you complicate things in a trial, the law favours an acquital (presumption of innocence etc).
Get them convicted for murder, and they'll be locked up for 20+ years (depending on jurisdiction). And even if you convicted them for "hate crimes", so what? The punishment for "hate crimes" would probably compose of a lessor custodial sentence, and probably be served concurrently (depending on judge/jurisdiction). So in the end, the criminal would spend the same amount of time in prison.
Note: I acknowledge that some jurisdictions may have a single charge of "murder caused by hate crimes", which may have a longer penalty than "normal" murder. In that case, it may be better to charge them with that crime. However, I think murder is probably one of the worst crimes out there, and should have the most severe penalties anyway.
2Sheds_Jackson
06-21-2007, 04:15 PM
As far as I'm concerned, the definition of a "hate crime" is a crime where the perpetrator can be demonstrated to show any animosity, past or present, against the victim's race, gender, religion, or choice of footwear - which invariably will have influenced their decision to act.
We really can't know that, unless and until we do an in-depth profile on each perp. That means that each of them must be put on the stand, put under oath, deposed at length, presented with witnesses from their past, to find out if they've ever used any racial epithets against Hispanics, ever told any racial jokes, or made offhand comments in private. And lord help them if they have.
>edit< it occurred to me that maybe people think I'm serious about this. I'm not. I think they should go to jail or not based on what they did, not why they did it.
Firetxmi
06-21-2007, 08:11 PM
>edit< it occurred to me that maybe people think I'm serious about this. I'm not. I think they should go to jail or not based on what they did, not why they did it.
So no difference between Murder and Pre-meditated Murder? Or how about Justifiable Homicide... Its still killing someone (murder).
Duh. The poster said it might lead to more, b/c people who hear this story may not stop the way this guy did. Thus they will "hit" and "run". Tough jump of logic there.
Hmmm I never even thought about it that way, to me that is a flawed logic, no matter what the person needs to stop, maybe tay in the car but stop
LapuaMag
06-21-2007, 09:14 PM
Lets remember this is Texas. If the criminals that commited this horrific act are brought to justice and convicted of murder they very well may fry. I believe Texas is the leading state in death row executions. Could be wrong but I know there up there in the top 5.
helomech
06-21-2007, 11:03 PM
Nice to see that mob mentality is alive and well in this day and age...:-(
Hollis
06-21-2007, 11:11 PM
Nice to see that mob mentality is alive and well in this day and age...:-(
That is a great point and one does not have to travel far to experience it.
helomech
06-21-2007, 11:13 PM
That is a great point and one does not have to travel far to experience it.
Word........
krasnayaarmiya
06-21-2007, 11:36 PM
Nope not with an enraged mob swarming me! what good would stopping serve in a scenario like that?
more than likely your question is just an attempt to throw out some flames.
What part of the article stated that the mob was yet swarming when he got out? There is not a good chance the driver was so caught up with the image in his rearview of the injured kid that he didn't see the crowd a distance away? My question is flame bait?, but someone who suggested he would hit & run a child is not saying anything provocative?
LaoSexMachine
06-21-2007, 11:37 PM
Juneteenth. Nuff said.
krasnayaarmiya
06-21-2007, 11:43 PM
Prediction:
If a white person hits a black kid in a black neighborhood and drives away, claiming it's not really hit and run because if they'd stopped they'd get beaten to death, they'll be crucified for being a racist.
If a black person hits a white kid in a white neighborhood and drives away, claiming it's not really hit and run because if they'd stopped they'd get beaten to death, Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Amos & Andy, and Minister Farrakhan will be there to testify to the truth of this statement and sell a few bean pies.
Dang, black people have really hurt your feelings, huh?
krasnayaarmiya
06-21-2007, 11:48 PM
Nice to see that mob mentality is alive and well in this day and age...:-(
It was like the time a bunch of Saudis attacked the military and economic capitals of America, but then mob hysteria induced America to mistakenly initiate warfare on Iraq instead. Mob mentality, indeed.
edit: stay on topic
-b
krasnayaarmiya
06-21-2007, 11:53 PM
Juneteenth. Nuff said.
No, say more, guy. What is wrong with release from human bondage again?
LaoSexMachine
06-22-2007, 12:03 AM
No, say more, guy. What is wrong with release from human bondage again?
Well tell it to the people who actually go and don't know jack what's it all about except macking on bitches and showing your hood.
Please, spare me your BS I been to some here in Houston and there's always fights and 99% of the crowd doesn't know it was about emancipation.
LaoSexMachine
06-22-2007, 12:04 AM
It was like the time a bunch of Saudis attacked the military and economic capitals of America, but then mob hysteria induced America to mistakenly initiate warfare on Iraq instead. Mob mentality, indeed.
Keep reaching, son.
Merfeller
06-22-2007, 12:17 AM
It was like the time a bunch of Saudis attacked the military and economic capitals of America, but then mob hysteria induced America to mistakenly initiate warfare on Iraq instead. Mob mentality, indeed.
Any opportunity to relate something - anything - to Iraq will do, eh?
LaoSexMachine
06-22-2007, 12:21 AM
Lets remember this is Texas. If the criminals that commited this horrific act are brought to justice and convicted of murder they very well may fry. I believe Texas is the leading state in death row executions. Could be wrong but I know there up there in the top 5.
And your point is?
2Sheds_Jackson
06-22-2007, 02:22 AM
So no difference between Murder and Pre-meditated Murder? Or how about Justifiable Homicide... Its still killing someone (murder).
Yeah I probably didn't put that very well.
Being charged with a hate crime can add decades to a sentence, right? Can anybody here prove or disprove whether or not anybody kicked Mr. Morales a little harder because he was Hispanic? What if prosecutors could do some digging and prove that some of the perps had a history of racism against Hispanics, and others didn't? What if they could show that some were shouting non-racial comments while others were throwing racial insults? Do those guys deserve more time for doing the same thing?
krasnayaarmiya
06-22-2007, 03:56 AM
Keep reaching, son.
Yeah, I guess you shot down my analogy by calling me son, kid. Fine point.
krasnayaarmiya
06-22-2007, 04:10 AM
Well tell it to the people who actually go and don't know jack what's it all about except macking on bitches and showing your hood.
Please, spare me your BS I been to some here in Houston and there's always fights and 99% of the crowd doesn't know it was about emancipation.
Yeah, yeah, I live in a chocolate city, too, the home of crack and sydeshows, but somehow I don't view the weakest portions of society with such fear, which is what this thread is all about. It's a chance for angry men with a penchant for guns and uniforms to spew their bile.
As for the violence, well violence begets violence, no?
Hell, I'm as interested in means of violence as any Texan, but let's be honest. Most of the posts on this thread are racist. I'm not saying you are, as you were only commenting that this is Juneteenth, a rather crunk affair, but most of the posts are barely-veiled racist, like the dude who said he'd hit & run a little girl, who by context would be black. What do I know, racists are people, too:|
Keepin it Real
Real Dumb
quinsen
06-22-2007, 05:55 AM
reminds me of south-africa.
So I was listening to NPR on my way to work this morning, and it seems all the hysteria some folks on this thread had worked up was all for nothing. The Police have admited the information the released earlier about the incident was misleading. They have clarified that the beating death had nothing to do with the event going on which was blocks away. The spokesperson also said that they were revising their earlier statement about 20 people being involved with the beating death of that man. As it stands now, they believe that up to 20 people witnessed the beating while close to 3-6 people may have participated. The police do not believe race played a role and they also said that people have been stepping up to give information. Sorry to spoil your fun dudes but you guys wound yourselves up for nothing. All you need is wait and get facts before jumping to conclusions.
Sabre
06-22-2007, 08:18 AM
Juneteenth, eh? Never heard of it. Not the most inspiring, or informative of names either. Sad that someone was killed because of it.
krasnayaarmiya
06-22-2007, 10:47 AM
Juneteenth, eh? Never heard of it. Not the most inspiring, or informative of names either. Sad that someone was killed because of it.
Read the comment prior to this one.
Laworkerbee
06-22-2007, 12:06 PM
most of the posts are barely-veiled racist, like the dude who said he'd hit & run a little girl, who by context would be black. What do I know, racists are people, too:|
Keepin it Real
Real Dumb
Where did I imply race in any of my posts you ****?
I said I'm not stopping when a mob is approaching my vehicle for any god damned reason. Drive to a safe area and call it in to police and fire dept's but getting out of my vehicle and dealing with mob justice serves no purpose.
Wanker
VansRV
06-22-2007, 12:19 PM
reminds me of south-africa.
Yea, your right:
http://www.rjgeib.com/heroes/amy/amy.html
2Sheds_Jackson
06-22-2007, 12:34 PM
My point in all this is not to suggest that there was a racial component to this attack - but that if demographics were different, there certainly would be.
Call me crazy, but I bet that if some black guy was beaten to death in the street in a white neighborhood, by 6 whites, while 20 other whites watched, and nobody came forward - I think Sharpton and Jackson et al would be on the Travelocity talking to the gnome about buying airline tickets. If it's appropriate to see race in an attack like that, then it's appropriate to see it here, right? It's the "subtle racism" of the double standard that gets me. I love that term; "subtle racism". I use it all the time. When the wife won't give me any, I accuse her of "subtle racism". It works for everything.
BTW, I think it's kind of silly for the city to deny a connection between the Juneteenth celebration and the attack. Obviously a beating death was not on the city's official list of events for the day, but it seems rather fanciful to imagine that the crowd was in no way associated with the events of the day. I don't know what other people's streets are like, but there aren't 30 people on my street just standing around doing nothing. If there are 30 people out there, they are attending some kind of function. Doesn't mean anything of course, just sayn' it looks like the city has been talking with their lawyers..
krasnayaarmiya
06-22-2007, 01:06 PM
Where did I imply race in any of my posts you ****?
I said I'm not stopping when a mob is approaching my vehicle for any god damned reason. Drive to a safe area and call it in to police and fire dept's but getting out of my vehicle and dealing with mob justice serves no purpose.
Wanker
Remember when I asked you where in the article it said that a mob was approaching the car at the moment the driver stopped to check on the girl? If we cannot assume that they were approaching the vehicle at the time of alightment from said vehicle, then we can assume the driver was being a normal person for getting out to check on the girl he just creamed. Well, if there is no mob approaching at that moment, then one would be duty-bound to get out. Look, the mob was clearly angry, and the driver was in the wrong place at the wrong time. Ever been in or near a riot, and I don't mean from behind some shield? It is chaotic. If it's chaotic, then things occur by happenstance. Ish happens, you know, but when you run over a little child, you have to go check. My point is that we don't know that the driver saw any mob. What if those 6 guys ran up from behind a fence. You don't know but the whole "I'd just run over a child and bounce" attitude is filthy. You have poor reading comprehension skills.
Peace in your pants
krasnayaarmiya
06-22-2007, 01:08 PM
Yea, your right:
http://www.rjgeib.com/heroes/amy/amy.html
What's the problem? She was from Orange County.
Laworkerbee
06-22-2007, 01:09 PM
Once again I ask you to point out where I stated race was a factor, since you implied my post was tainted by race.
Go ahead and use your vast comprehension skills.
krasnayaarmiya
06-22-2007, 01:53 PM
Once again I ask you to point out where I stated race was a factor, since you implied my post was tainted by race.
Go ahead and use your vast comprehension skills.
After you, kind sir. Your comment about running over a child and fleeing the scene to avert a "Reginald Denny" was based on an assumption that the driver saw or had a chance to see his would-be assailants. I was challenging that initial lapse in logic. PLUS, you suck.
eat a dirk
Laworkerbee
06-22-2007, 02:00 PM
Ok sport you go on and keep Monday morning quarter backing. I myself have been in civil disturbances such as these before and could give a rats ass what you think.
your argument goes soft and you play the race card, your pathetic.
krasnayaarmiya
06-22-2007, 02:30 PM
Ok sport you go on and keep Monday morning quarter backing. I myself have been in civil disturbances such as these before and could give a rats ass what you think.
your argument goes soft and you play the race card, your pathetic.
Yeah, you still failed to read the article correctly. You're the man.
"Reginald Denny" was a willy-nilly reference to a polarizing race riot? And I brought up race? That line of thinking doesn't cohere to what has been previously posted.
You ain't subtle.
Thanks for the banter, rick
Peace in Your Mouth
LapuaMag
06-22-2007, 04:55 PM
And your point is?
My point was everyone was talking about what the perps of this crime would/will be charged with. I meant, it doesn't matter what their charged with, if convicted of murder in Texas they very well may fry. Get my point?
Miles.
06-24-2007, 10:30 PM
gulp.......
...but it seems rather fanciful to imagine that the crowd was in no way associated with the events of the day.
Exactly...
pure damage control.... or at least an attempt at it.
lolZ
joe mama
06-25-2007, 04:49 PM
...I think Sharpton and Jackson et al would be on the Travelocity talking to the gnome about buying airline tickets...
Jesse and Al buy tickets from that WHITE gnome? that WHITE gnome with big nose? That gnome is practically eating a knish and juggling matzo balls whilst forcing the oppressed minor-or-it-tees to spend more than they can afford on airline tickets. Jesse and Al know he represents teh j00z!
GromGrad
06-25-2007, 06:41 PM
I think this is justifiable homo side. You hit my kid with a car in front of me, you are gonna die. Simple as that.
Hollis
06-25-2007, 09:16 PM
I think this is justifiable homo side. You hit my kid with a car in front of me, you are gonna die. Simple as that.
Did you miss the part, that the passenger was murdered. Or does it matter?
Durandal
06-25-2007, 10:00 PM
And the child had MINOR injuries?
a_very_ex_STAB
06-26-2007, 06:30 AM
I think this is justifiable homo side. You hit my kid with a car in front of me, you are gonna die. Simple as that.
Huh?
That has to be one of the dumbest statements I've ever seen on the net and we get a lot of them on here.
And what if the driver was driving with due care and attention and observing the local speed limit etc and your kid caused the accident by just stupidly running out in the street? Kids do stupid stuff you know :roll:
Love the spelling - 'homo side'
LOL
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