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Jaegermeister + Red Bull
07-11-2007, 04:08 AM
China's grave offense: Ghost wives
(http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China/IF29Ad02.html)By Antoaneta Bezlova


BEIJING - Ghost stories might have been recently exorcised from bookshelves by Chinese censors for the horror they inflict on the public, but equally grisly tales of "ghost wives" have been unfolding in real life.

When Shen Wentang, a peasant from central China's Hebei province, bought a "ghost wife" for his dead father, he asked no questions about where the body had come from - and showed little curiosity about finding this out.

He knew that things had changed from the past, when an afterlife marriage was nothing out of the ordinary and families of both the

"bride" and "groom" would have celebrated it with toasts and a feast. Authorities now frown on these feudal customs, so Shen wanted the marriage done quickly and without much ado. Still, he was grateful that the body of the ghost wife was dressed in a shroud in the auspicious color for weddings - red.

He had had to borrow funds to pay for the body, and 3,500 yuan (US$454) exceeded the annual earnings of many of his home village. Then, working swiftly with two relatives one spring dawn, Shen unearthed his father's grave, lifted the coffin's lid and slipped the female body inside.

All he remembered of the woman later on were the red dress and her age - about 40. Shen's father, whose wife had walked away years ago, now had a new woman to keep him company in the netherworld. He could rest in peace.

Little did Shen know that the ghost wife - a mentally retarded woman - had been lured to her death by a profit-seeking peasant. The ghost wife and five other women had been murdered by Song Tiantang, from Hebei's Linzhang county, so he could sell their corpses to be married in the afterlife.

"I only helped them to go to heaven earlier," Song said when detained by the police in April, according to Chinese press reports. Ironically for a mass murderer, Song's given name, Tiantang, means "heaven" in Mandarin.

In an interview with Beijing's Xinjingbao newspaper, he unabashedly described how he always chose his victims from among the mentally retarded or single migrant women.

"They are muddle-headed and never put up too much of a fight," he said. "No one would make much fuss about deranged women. As for those who come from other places, they would simply disappear, and their relatives back home would not know anything."

The custom of marrying bachelors posthumously and burying them together with dead women goes back a few hundred years to the Ming Dynasty. Chinese people believe that the journey to the netherworld needs to be a shared one. In the past, they also used matchmakers to find partners for their dead relatives.

Zhao Shu, an expert on China's folk customs, reckons that the tradition of marrying people in the afterlife is nowadays merely a vestige of the country's long feudal history, practiced only in a few isolated areas.

But he admits that some families still pay a high price to procure a bride for the deceased. "It is seen as a last comfort for the dead," he said.

The current resurrection of these feudal customs in Hebei bears an unusually ugly twist.

When Song embarked on his moneymaking scheme, he first sought to dig up and steal dead women's bodies. But he soon realized that the price of a desiccated corpse was just a fraction of what he could earn for "fresh goods" - women who had died only recently. Then he started to murder women.

Song's killing spree was exposed by China's increasingly daring media as yet another unforeseen dark side of the country's headlong pursuit of economic growth. With millions of rural people left on the fringes of the economic boom, more and more cases of moral degradation have come to light as people are willing to go to any lengths to make money.

The story of murdered ghost wives has appeared almost simultaneously with the uncovering of a wide slave-labor network in China's backward hinterland provinces, where thousands of migrant workers and children were forced to work in illegal brick kilns (see Lessons from China's slavery scandal (http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China_Business/IF20Cb02.html), June 20). They were beaten, starved and overworked under the watch of guards and dogs.

Some of the workers and children were abducted from rural train and bus stations or persuaded to travel to the kilns with bogus offers of good pay. Once there, they were prevented from leaving, and those who failed to work fast enough were beaten, some of them to death.

"Whether it is the slave-labor scandal or the ghost wives, it is all a testimony to moral depravity brought on by the extreme pursuit of material gains," said an opinion piece in the liberal Southern Weekend last week. "It shows the collapse of moral and spiritual values at this time of rapid social changes."

As in the slavery case, the murders of ghost wives occurred in some of China's poorest provinces. Song Tiantang hailed from Linzhang county, Hebei province, and scouted neighboring counties for his victims.

An investigation by Southern Weekly uncovered similar cases of women murdered to be sold as brides in marriages in the afterlife in the provinces of Shanxi and neighboring Shaanxi.

Some have speculated that the murders have been prompted by the mounting death toll in China's mining industry, which has pushed up demand for ghost wives for casualties. In many of the interior provinces where coal is produced in small and unsafe mines, deadly accidents have been happening weekly. China's official tally of coal miners' deaths for 2006 stood at 4,746, or an average of 13 each day.

With so many male miners dying prematurely, there is a booming market for ghost wives, one middleman told Xinjingbao. "If the groom has died in a coal-mine accident, my commission for finding a bride is higher," the man, identified as Wang Zengxi, told the paper.

But even if confined to just several provinces, the commercialization of ghost wives could have social implications for this country of 1.3 billion people, where demographers estimate that some 40 million girls are already "missing" because of infanticide or neglect, and as a result of China's one-child policy.

In their 2004 book Bare Branches: The Security Implications of Asia's Surplus Male Population, Valerie Hudson and Andrea den Boer warn about the looming danger of social and political instability stemming from a glut of young men with no prospects of marriage.

8thidpathfinderpower
07-11-2007, 06:59 AM
This story is not as far fetched as it seems. And, the author of the book on the looming instability crisis are very much right.

Population control through man made means (Chinas one child policy for example) is not only a dangerous way to tamper with nature, but a very dangerous way to start new and devestating diseases, social unrest, and genocide.

Calanen
07-11-2007, 08:39 AM
The Chinese Communist Party does not like ghosts or undead much for some reason (see the first part of the article). They censor anything like that in books, movies, comics...even World of Warcraft for China release has had its skeletons removed.

As my grandma used to tell me 'It's not the dead that will hurt you son, but the living.'

Kaapeli
07-11-2007, 08:47 AM
Population control through man made means (Chinas one child policy for example) is not only a dangerous way to tamper with nature, but a very dangerous way to start new and devestating diseases, social unrest, and genocide.

What do you think would happen if we didn't try to control population growth?
Earths limited resources are under increasingly heavy strain and competition.
All we need is another billion people trying to take their share of the cake striving to live extravagantly like we do now. Now THAT is when we will see diseases, social unrest, genocide, wars and much much more.

China's population control policy is one of the better ideas to come out of that nation and we should support it.

Calanen
07-11-2007, 09:06 AM
China's population control policy is one of the better ideas to come out of that nation and we should support it.


Well you should support everything the Central Government says or does there, to avoid your head being airconditioned with an AK47 bullet.

That aside, the problem is you have many men who will never marry because of your one child policy. They will grow up to be angry, disillusioned men. That is a real worry. Population control sure, but imbalancing the sexes, is a recipe for disaster and civil disorder.

Kaapeli
07-11-2007, 09:46 AM
That aside, the problem is you have many men who will never marry because of your one child policy. They will grow up to be angry, disillusioned men. That is a real worry. Population control sure, but imbalancing the sexes, is a recipe for disaster and civil disorder.

The gender imbalance is caused by the Chinese bias towards male children, not by the one child policy. Though it does add to the problem but you have the same gender imbalance in other many Asian other nations too where there are no limits on the number of children.

Mu-Meson
07-11-2007, 12:31 PM
What is China going to do with 100 million young males with no women. Mayhaps they join the PLA? One of the reasons the British Empire was so powerful during its height was that it had a surplus population with which to fill in the ranks, and man its empire. Will China embark on military conquests to keep these guys busy? I don't know, but Siberia and Far Eastern Russia is pretty close, and pretty empty.

Laworkerbee
07-11-2007, 01:43 PM
China's population control policy is one of the better ideas to come out of that nation and we should support it.

Thats just crazy, do you have any idea the social pressures their society is feeling because of that policy?

Ordie
07-11-2007, 04:03 PM
If you did a comparision with the PRC and the ROC in social development, you will find that the PRC did alot of social engineering, while the ROC maintained traditional norms.

Since the late 1940's both PRC and ROC were on an equal footing.

The PRC embarked on centralized social-economic policies such as the "Hundred Flowers", "Great Leap Forward", "Cultrual Revolution" and the "One Child Policy". Each of these programs had a profound effect on Chinese society and the Chinese family. During these upheavals families were split in geographic terms, education, gender and generational (old vs. new, red vs. expert). To this day the detremental effects from these social engineering programs are still being felt.

The probelm of the One Child policy is not only in gender inbalance, but also one of welfare and social security. In traditional Chinese families, childeren are also viewed as the primary provider for senior citizens. The single child is not only expected to provide for him/herself, but also her/his parents or in-laws. Which means less money to circulate and invest.

Moreover it causes rifts between the haves and have nots. When I visited Guelin in Southern China, my cab driver openly complained about the government's one child policy. He had another child, the local party hack had his familiy kicked out of government housing, forced to paid a heavy fine and is blackballed for life. While the newly rich, have more than enough to pay the fine, own homes, and are not blackballed.

The ROC on the otherhand preserved and encouraged the traditional Chinese family values and norms. This had given the families more control in matters of education, finance and social norms. Population was kept in check partly due to education and maintaining economic well being. The higher the education, the fewer children you'll have, the better off you are. The downside in the ROC is the heavy weight placed upon Taiwanese in meeting social obligations (Guangxi or network system).

Personally I enjoyed the story of "ghost wives". It would make a great horror film. Which brings another point.

Newspapers are very competitive and good news never sells. China is no exception. Since they are restricted from getting dirty laundry from Beijing, newspapers will seek easy, non political targets.

As China will enter the spotlight in the next year, expect more news of this kind.

8thidpathfinderpower
07-11-2007, 04:28 PM
What do you think would happen if we didn't try to control population growth?
Earths limited resources are under increasingly heavy strain and competition.
All we need is another billion people trying to take their share of the cake striving to live extravagantly like we do now. Now THAT is when we will see diseases, social unrest, genocide, wars and much much more.

China's population control policy is one of the better ideas to come out of that nation and we should support it.



Chinas birth control policy has one very little to curb population growth. And, it has even gone as far as to create 2 seperate classes of people, those with 2 child families, and those who do not.

Nature depends on balance. And, when something becomes out of balance, nature corrects the error. Chinese government and society has effectively tampered with nature, without realizing the outcome. Now, there is a problem, which can lead to further troubles down the road, especially with such a huge male population. I am going to name one as an example....

Incest/inbreeding. The results will not be readily noticed at first, but 5 to 6 generations later. Mental retardation, new genetic diseases, and other social problems are the results. And this would be possibly fueled by the lack of females in their society.

Kaapeli
07-11-2007, 05:20 PM
Chinas birth control policy has one very little to curb population growth. And, it has even gone as far as to create 2 seperate classes of people, those with 2 child families, and those who do not.

The one child policy has been succesful in slowing down the population growth significantly. The Chinese fertility rate has fallen to 1.7 which is far below world average and on par with most first world countries. This is mostly thanks to the one child policy.
Compare that to Indias 3.0 and USA's 2.0.


Nature depends on balance. And, when something becomes out of balance, nature corrects the error. Chinese government and society has effectively tampered with nature, without realizing the outcome. Now, there is a problem, which can lead to further troubles down the road, especially with such a huge male population. I am going to name one as an example....

Nature? We are humans, not animals. We can control ourselves and our breeding with contraception and family planning etc.
You could just as well claim that using condoms is dangerous tampering with nature.
And I think China has saved itself and us from much trouble in the future by controlling overpopulation when the nation is already on the verge of overheating with economic growth and social change.


Incest/inbreeding. The results will not be readily noticed at first, but 5 to 6 generations later. Mental retardation, new genetic diseases, and other social problems are the results. And this would be possibly fueled by the lack of females in their society.

China has over a billion people and it's seeing fast urbanization, industrialization and globalization. I don't think they are going to have problems with "inbreeding". On the contrary the population is just now beginning to really mix up when people are moving around more and look for partners somewhere further than next door. Many Chinese men are actually importing wifes from all over Asia.

Ordie
07-11-2007, 06:03 PM
And I think China has saved itself and us from much trouble in the future by controlling overpopulation when the nation is already on the verge of overheating with economic growth and social change.

What about the question of social security? How can a single child expect to support his/her parents while he/she is expected to support themselves and/or their families.

Given that there is a growing middle class in China, demands for economic security, welfare and transparency will grow as well.

Remember, welfare has to do with the difference between what you have and what you expect. If people expect more, then people will become unhappy.

2Sheds_Jackson
07-11-2007, 06:37 PM
Nature? We are humans, not animals. We can control ourselves and our breeding with contraception and family planning etc.
You could just as well claim that using condoms is dangerous tampering with nature.

I don't think the question is one of capability - of course we can control ourselves. It's a question of the state controlling what is a very basic desire of human beings. The pursuit of happiness and all that. One could easily launch a rhetorical argument comparing a government's right to restrict abortion to a government's right to penalize not having an abortion.

Solvent
07-11-2007, 08:59 PM
What about the question of social security? How can a single child expect to support his/her parents while he/she is expected to support themselves and/or their families.

Given that there is a growing middle class in China, demands for economic security, welfare and transparency will grow as well.

Remember, welfare has to do with the difference between what you have and what you expect. If people expect more, then people will become unhappy.

Sounds terrible. But actually, things don't work this way. Chinese are very good at saving money. Especially for older generation, they almost deposit every penny they get. As far as I know, in most cases, young people always get big money from their parents for wedding, buying apartment and so on. At this point, who raises who.
The kids are real burden for Chinese families right now. Under the current raising cost, one kid is almost enough. Two will be the upper limit for regular parents.

8thidpathfinderpower
07-12-2007, 12:17 AM
The one child policy has been succesful in slowing down the population growth significantly. The Chinese fertility rate has fallen to 1.7 which is far below world average and on par with most first world countries. This is mostly thanks to the one child policy.
Compare that to Indias 3.0 and USA's2.0.



Nature? We are humans, not animals. We can control ourselves and our breeding with contraception and family planning etc.
You could just as well claim that using condoms is dangerous tampering with nature.
And I think China has saved itself and us from much trouble in the future by controlling overpopulation when the nation is already on the verge of overheating with economic growth and social change.

I mentioned inbreeding, as an example,because of the opposite of China having not enough women,and this closed in society has too many women. In breeding regularly occurs in polygmist communities of Hilldale, Utah, and Colorado City Arizona. The results, of which can be seen now,5-6 generations later.









China has over a billion people and it's seeing fast urbanization, industrialization and globalization. I don't think they are going to have problems with "inbreeding". On the contrary the population is just now beginning to really mix up when people are moving around more and look for partners somewhere further than next door. Many Chinese men are actually importing wifes from all over Asia.


And,yes somewhere along the line, China will have problems associated with inbreeding. It is a reality, now.

8thidpathfinderpower
07-12-2007, 12:23 AM
The one child policy has been succesful in slowing down the population growth significantly. The Chinese fertility rate has fallen to 1.7 which is far below world average and on par with most first world countries. This is mostly thanks to the one child policy.
Compare that to Indias 3.0 and USA's 2.0.



Nature? We are humans, not animals. We can control ourselves and our breeding with contraception and family planning etc.
You could just as well claim that using condoms is dangerous tampering with nature.
And I think China has saved itself and us from much trouble in the future by controlling overpopulation when the nation is already on the verge of overheating with economic growth and social change.



China has over a billion people and it's seeing fast urbanization, industrialization and globalization. I don't think they are going to have problems with "inbreeding". On the contrary the population is just now beginning to really mix up when people are moving around more and look for partners somewhere further than next door. Many Chinese men are actually importing wifes from all over Asia.



Here is a big problem. Whether wel ike it or not, we are animals. Just a little more highly evolved. But,people are people. And no matter what yu do, you cannot change human nature. You can try to control it, and thats all governments can do. Somewhere along the line, China will have problems with inbreeding. Weak genetics, and the possibility of new diseases are the possibiity.

Calanen
07-12-2007, 03:23 AM
The gender imbalance is caused by the Chinese bias towards male children, not by the one child policy. Though it does add to the problem but you have the same gender imbalance in other many Asian other nations too where there are no limits on the number of children.

You cannot have one without the other....because Chinese people can only have one child, they want it to be a boy, so they use either legal or illegal means to make sure that comes about. That's why the one child policy is leading to an imbalance in the sexes. Anyway - your issue, and you will pay for it, at some point. I just hope the rest of the world does not have to pick up the tab as well at in the future.

Kaapeli
07-12-2007, 06:24 AM
I don't understand the inbreeding argument. Care to explain it?


You cannot have one without the other....because Chinese people can only have one child, they want it to be a boy, so they use either legal or illegal means to make sure that comes about. That's why the one child policy is leading to an imbalance in the sexes. Anyway - your issue, and you will pay for it, at some point. I just hope the rest of the world does not have to pick up the tab as well at in the future.

People can't always have and do what they want. It is a matter of cultural change and education for the Chinese to realize that a girl child is just as precious as a boy. We have learned it and they can too.
It's tough but the overpopulation problem is and would be even tougher.

Durandal
07-12-2007, 08:03 AM
This story is not as far fetched as it seems. And, the author of the book on the looming instability crisis are very much right.

Population control through man made means (Chinas one child policy for example) is not only a dangerous way to tamper with nature, but a very dangerous way to start new and devestating diseases, social unrest, and genocide.

It was also one of the few ways to control the population before it hit massive stone wall at 90 miles an hour.

Like it or not, and I admit the outcome has been crazy, it was necessary.

Whether that will lead to genocide and unrest, who knows. If the government falters once or twice and shows a level of weakness...and I am talking about more than corruption...the nation is wrecked. We are talking about a severely xenophobic society where town of and provincial area of origin is the same thing as race to some. Oh yeah, and they have nukes.

People simply cannot comprehend the levels of numbers of when dealing a population of this size.

Now, what will wreck the region in terms of health and disease is the utter lack of anything governing pollution and a complete lack of transparency when it comes to stuff like SARS and Bird Flu.

Durandal
07-12-2007, 08:08 AM
People can't always have and do what they want. It is a matter of cultural change and education for the Chinese to realize that a girl child is just as precious as a boy. We have learned it and they can too.
It's tough but the overpopulation problem is and would be even tougher.

People do not seem to get this. The problem has progressed passed several generations now. Its not as if its suddenly a new thing. This is a massive social problem effecting over a BILLION people and cannot be fixed in the next two generations. Its going to take a century to correct this, even if the Chinese suddenly became female friendly over night.

There are simply not enough women increase the numbers fast enough.

Ordie
07-12-2007, 02:09 PM
There are simply not enough women increase the numbers fast enough.

The females are there. But many are abandoned in orphanages and adopted by American families.

This is partly due to the one child policy and the societal norm for preferrence towards male children.

Durandal
07-12-2007, 02:28 PM
The females are there. But many are abandoned in orphanages and adopted by American families.

This is partly due to the one child policy and the societal norm for preferrence towards male children.

When you are talking about TENS OF MILLIONS of single men (in the 2000 census there were 19 million more boys ages 0-15 than women in the same age bracket) that will NEVER be able to marry a mainland Chinese woman, the less than TEN THOUSAND chinese babies (almost all female except special needs children), is not even an issue.

Like I said, when you start looking at ratios of 120 to 100 ratios of girls to boys with a 1.3 billion population that grows 1.29% a year the problems can be enormous.

If the reports are to believed, there are some provincial areas where there are in balances bordering on 25 to 35%. Which is going to have massive repercussions.

I cannot even fathom what human trafficking is going to look like in another decade, with the population and criminal activity/corruption China has.