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Desk Jockey
08-19-2007, 12:02 PM
Originally Posted by qtq http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?p=2714075#post2714075)

The height of tower is about 70m.Those blue beret rangers get 161 days of training.100 days more than US rangers.


I just tried to correct a Turkish member not his fault, (Turkish Media really) BTW new member 2nd post on a issue with the US Army Rangers and Turkish Ranger school.

Can some one in the know Ranger or not let me know if I gave him the correct gouge.

Below is my response,

Thanks in advance.

DJ

_______________________________________________________________


A Turkish friend emailed me about this, (if I am off a real deal plese correct me)

You have to understand the difference between being tabbed and scrolled.

There is a US Ranger school that is approximately as long as what you say, I think a phase was removed, you pass you can wear a Ranger tab on that left arm of your uniform, YOU ARE NOT a US Army Ranger. You have passed a school.

To be a Ranger you have to pass RIP (Ranger Indocrtrinaion Program) a flat out kick in the nuts, the you get assigned to one of three 3 Battallions of the 75th Ranger Regiment, more training and ton of new guy stuff, you then (and I am not sure of the probation or lack there of) you earn the right to wear a Ranger Scroll on your left arm. That means your a US Army Ranger.

Many troops pass Ranger school get the tab, but they are not considered Rangers. To do so you have to get through RIP get to a bat (survive there and get to stay) and get the scroll or get to keep it.

BTW Right arm scroll = your a BTDT = seen combat with a Ranger Unit.

I think it was the Turkish press, I did not watch the video entirely, but they somehow thought that passing Ranger School made you a Ranger. The road to earn the scroll is a great deal tougher.

Anladinmu? (Understand?)

Hos Geldeniz (Welcome)

Memnun Oldun (Nice to meet you)

DnA
08-19-2007, 12:37 PM
Once you pass RIP an get assigned to a Battalion, you wear the Battalion scroll, don't have to have any time in to get it. But to stay in the Battalion/Regiment you have to put up with a lot an be an outstanding soldier. After 6-12 months in Battalion an they feel confident that you can pass the Ranger course you will be sent on it to earn your tab.

As for the you're not a Ranger unless you have time in a Battalion, I'll leave that to a Ranger.



Also, RIP isn't the only way to get into the Regiment.

-DarthMaul-
08-19-2007, 12:37 PM
Were they talking about OUR Ranger Schools? I think thier system might be alot different then ours, where anyone who graduates Ranger, is considered a Ranger, and other Officers are just...thier own branch officers.(btw dont forgot ROP[Ranger Orientation Program]) And there are Four battalions not three(guys stop forgetting the STB[Specail Troops Battalion].

Well as I said they prolly think the American system is the same as thiers is. Your answer looks fine to me, but maybe someone else will spot something.

(DnA is right some of the lower enlistedmen will stay in a battalion for 2-6months before getting tabbed a Ranger from the school)

Desk Jockey
08-19-2007, 01:00 PM
Also, RIP isn't the only way to get into the Regiment.

Not all scrolled guys go through RIP or ROP?

@Darthmaul, Exactly, the Turkisk media presented it as US Ranger school makes you a Ranger just like the Turkish school.

Big emphasis was placed on the course length, hence I got the question from a buddy over there and this new cat thought the same, just a journalist not doing his home work.

justuser
08-19-2007, 02:26 PM
Not all scrolled guys go through RIP or ROP?

@Darthmaul, Exactly, the Turkisk media presented it as US Ranger school makes you a Ranger just like the Turkish school.

Big emphasis was placed on the course length, hence I got the question from a buddy over there and this new cat thought the same, just a journalist not doing his home work.

you can not take seriously what journalists write about military, they have absolutely no clue in 99 percents...

Desk Jockey
08-19-2007, 02:35 PM
you can not take seriously what journalists write about military, they have absolutely no clue in 99 percents...

Preaching to the choir brother.:)

MichaelF
08-19-2007, 02:50 PM
Ranger School is a high-intensity course in patrolling, small unit tactics and leadership. It is not a commando school, but a course meant to make better combat unit leaders.

Many Officers and NCOs attend. Not all, or even a very large percentage, are from the Ranger Battalions.

Desk Jockey
08-19-2007, 03:50 PM
Ranger School is a high-intensity course in patrolling, small unit tactics and leadership. It is not a commando school, but a course meant to make better combat unit leaders.

Many Officers and NCOs attend. Not all, or even a very large percentage, are from the Ranger Battalions.

Thanks, but just to answer the question very simply, you get the tab and call yourself a US Army Ranger and have not been in a batt then your basically posing. At least from the view of scrolled Ranger.

Don't wanna waste anyone's time and I apprecitate the answers fellas.

Maybe Matchanu can give us the dump or ask a scrolled member of the board he mods, if he doesn't pick this up I will PM him, I know the community of Rangers is very high on Socnet.

Again boys Cheers,

Chuck6d
08-19-2007, 04:31 PM
Tell a guy who went through Ranger School, he's not a Ranger. If he served in Regt or not.

Desk Jockey
08-19-2007, 04:36 PM
edited, got the dump from a real deal.

Desk Jockey
08-19-2007, 04:50 PM
I used to tell people after I got out that would ask me what I did when I was in, that I was a Ranger (a serious transgression to many battboys for which I now aplogize) but it was a lot less confusing than trying to quickly explain a LRSD to a civillian.
Finally a couple of Batt boys explained to me why they didnt like non batt boys calling themselves Rangers... I argued a bit about unit lineage, percentage of men that were tabbed, unit requrements and standards, etc... but I realized they were right. The only men (veterans and active) of the modern army that should be called Rangers are the men of the 75th.




I don't believe you should be able to stand up and say "I am a Ranger" when all you have done is attend the school. Being a Ranger is a career-way of life thing which you can claim after serving in the Regiment.



We are off track anyway, I have my answer from a 91W BTDT (Just Cause) scrolled / tabbed batt guy, mods feel free to close.

http://www.socnetcentral.com/vb/showthread.php?t=18399&highlight=tabbed+scrolled

Source was a PM to a dude I know over at SOCNET gave me the majority opinion and pointed me to a relevant thread.

Chuck6d
08-19-2007, 04:51 PM
Yeah you probably have more knowledge in this field. Keep using the computer there high speed.

Desk Jockey
08-19-2007, 04:55 PM
Yeah you probably have more knowledge in this field. Keep using the computer there high speed.

Have a nice day:)

Your bio is impressive and granted you know more about this then me, but I will take buddies my opinion. Again BTDT Ranger.

DNA was right, leave it up to a Ranger to form this opinion, which you were not, you did a hell of lot more than me or I ever will, but you were never a Ranger. (according to BIO)

Cheers

If you read the thread from the beginning

1. you would seen the reasoning behind the question.
2.Never claimed to be high speed sport.

Chuck6d
08-19-2007, 05:44 PM
Well out of all my time in the Infantry I never saw a guy from Rgr Bn tell a guy who just went to the school, he wasn't a Ranger. But hey what do I know. and stop editing your posts:)

Desk Jockey
08-19-2007, 05:48 PM
Well out of all my time in the Infantry I never saw a guy from Rgr Bn tell a guy who just went to the school, he wasn't a Ranger. But hey what do I know. and stop editing your posts:)

Cool dude thanks for your service and stay safe. re edits: some grammar but granted some temper.:)

Laters,

MichaelF
08-19-2007, 10:30 PM
Tell a guy who went through Ranger School, he's not a Ranger. If he served in Regt or not.

Those who are not currently serving with the 75th are not Rangers.

And yes, I have the tab, and am not a Ranger (I went through immediately after IOBC and BAC on the post-Commission tab hunt).

Chuck6d
08-19-2007, 11:14 PM
So how do they have the Best Ranger Competition? Soldiers compete from all different units. I guess those guys aren't Rangers either, because they're not in Regt. I guess if they won there title would be best soldier who won a ranger compitition....LOL

MichaelF
08-20-2007, 12:13 AM
So how do they have the Best Ranger Competition? Soldiers compete from all different units. I guess those guys aren't Rangers either, because they're not in Regt. I guess if they won there title would be best soldier who won a ranger compitition....LOL

Marines compete in, and have won, the Best Ranger Competition.

Are they Rangers? No.

But, hey! Knock yourself out.

szr
08-20-2007, 04:57 AM
Marines compete in, and have won, the Best Ranger Competition.

Are they Rangers? No.
They're Marines who are tabbed. Afterall it's the tab, not the scroll, that's the invitation to compete in LtGen Grange's competition.

Chuck6d
08-20-2007, 07:33 AM
So Michael from your experience, here's a scenario.. In your plt you have an E4 who came from Ranger Bn, didn't get his tab tho. Then you have 2 squad leaders and a Plt Sgt who have their tabs and did not serve in Regt. Who is the Ranger?

MichaelF
08-20-2007, 02:24 PM
So Michael from your experience, here's a scenario.. In your plt you have an E4 who came from Ranger Bn, didn't get his tab tho. Then you have 2 squad leaders and a Plt Sgt who have their tabs and did not serve in Regt. Who is the Ranger?

None of them. They are not currently serving in a Ranger Battalion (or the 75th HQ).

This isn't rocket science:

In a Ranger unit? You're a Ranger, tab or not.

Not in a Ranger unit? Not a Ranger, tab or not.

You were in the 75th, but are now in the 25th ID? Not a Ranger, tab or not. Former Ranger? Sure. Unlike SF personnel, however, being a Ranger does not result in a change of CMF or MOS, so when you leave that unit, you are just another Infantryman (Cook, 13F, etc).


Unless they are wearing a 75th scroll on their sleeve...not a Ranger.

MichaelF
08-20-2007, 02:30 PM
They're Marines who are tabbed. Afterall it's the tab, not the scroll, that's the invitation to compete in LtGen Grange's competition.

Correct.

12345789

seraosha
08-20-2007, 02:35 PM
If only soldiers "currently serving in a Ranger Battalion (or the 75th HQ)" can claim "Ranger" status, what about when these guys get transfered to a different unit?

Close to half of the guys in my troop came over from a Ranger Bat at Lewis before getting stuck at Polk in the 1/2 ACR...and they would have taken exception to being called anything other than "Ranger", tab or no tab.

*edit* saw the additional post...got a link to a Reg supporting that position, MichaelF (http://militaryphotos.net/forums/member.php?u=4333) ?

*edit 2 found a link on wiki...I am now informed.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Rangers

wolf9848
08-20-2007, 06:09 PM
Having worked with and been friends with a few members of the 75th Ranger Regiment, I view Rangers as anyone who has served in Regiment, tab or no tab. Those who pass the school, but have not served in the Regiment, are only Ranger Qualified. My friends tell me they having a saying in Regiment, "The tab is a school, the Scroll is a way of life".

grenadier07
08-20-2007, 06:30 PM
Tabs and various other skill badges are nice and everything and if you are tabbed I'll give you some respect because you did work hard to earn it, but at the end of the day it's still just a school and a little piece of cloth on your shoulder. It isn't certified to make you a better soldier. Served with plenty of people who had all kinds of badges or tabs and I thought they were ****bags. Like many people when they first get in I was impressed and somewhat in awe of people with jump wings or tabs or whatever, but stay in long enough and that awe goes away, or at least it did for me. To many people out there with cherry wings who did the school and never served with an actual jump unit or went to Ranger school and never did time with a batt. Show up with a scroll on your right sleeve or a combat star on your jump wings and that will impress me. Otherwise how do I know you aren't just some badge whore.

Chuck6d
08-21-2007, 12:21 PM
[QUOTE=MichaelF;2716113] Unlike SF personnel, however, being a Ranger does not result in a change of CMF or MOS,[QUOTE]

People who goto the school do however get a designation.
v=airborne ranger
g= non airborne

This seems something like a cultral argument more then anything.
All the units I've been in 101, 2ID, 10th Mtn.. I never heard the argument. But I understand where people in the Regt could have some issue with Rangers and Ranger qualified people. I believe personally anyone who makes it thru that suck (Ranger school) fest has every right to call themself a
Ranger.

BrianT
08-25-2007, 08:44 AM
Put it this way, did you go out and ride out in littlebirds in Ranger School? Did you fastrope out of MH47s or do airfield siezures, a Ranger signature? No? Ranger School may be a big suck fest, but high speed training it's not. Overseas a Ranger is doing something completely different than some tabbed out officer in 3rd ID. So there's alot of difference between a true battboy and someone that's Ranger-qualified.

I doubt you'll find anybody in batt calliing tabbed guys Rangers. You might even get the distinction of just being called a tabbed leg. Maybe not to your face, but it's what they think. You don't even have to be airborne qualified to go through Ranger School. Last time I recalled, it's been Airborne Ranger since the Korean War.

Uncle Sam
08-25-2007, 11:53 AM
Ranger? What's a Ranger?

digrar
08-25-2007, 09:23 PM
Ranger? What's a Ranger?

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http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/7061/2007fordrangerzr6.549f0fc22b.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=526&i=2007fordrangerzr6.jpg)