9/11 Conspiracy Theorist Gut Punched by the History Channel

[SeanAshi]

9/11 TRUTHERS GUT PUNCHED BY HISTORY CHANNEL
CATEGORY: Moonbats, History, Science
In what will surely be seen as a defining moment for the 9/11 truther movement, the History Channel has delivered a blow for sanity and rationalism by airing a superior documentary entitled 9/11 Conspiracies: Fact or Fiction.

There’s no other way to say it; the truthers got reamed.

They got reamed to the point that the truthers who produced the internet video Loose Change are scrambling to alter the third version of their conspiracy mongering tripe, even going so far as to drop any reference to the twin towers being blown up by the government (they continue to insist WTC #7 was brought down by explosives).

The documentary took no prisoners as it destroyed almost all of the major conspiracy theories associated with 9/11 while revealing the real motivations of the truthers; that they are part of a political movement driven by raw, unreasoning hatred of George Bush, the American government, and to some extent, America itself.

Prominently featured were historians like David Brinkley, Editor in Chief of Popular Mechanics James Meigs, and structural engineers, explosives experts, and a host of scientists, military experts, and eyewitnesses to the disaster. The cumulative effect of the testimony of the anti-conspiracists was absolutely devastating. The show left little doubt of the unhinged nature of the truthers, showing many of them – including radio host Alex Jones who has given vast amounts of air time to every kook, crazy, and nutcase with a theory on 9/11 – looking like the anti-intellectual fruitcakes they truly are.

The format was perfect. A truther would lay out a conspiracy theory which was then immediately debunked by 2 or 3 experts. Over two hours, a couple of dozen myths associated with 9/11 were laid to rest permanently including the “missile” that hit the Pentagon, the shoot down of Flight 93, the “implosion” of the towers,” and other theories not based on fact.

The implosion theory was debunked several times over. First, by the best forensic structural engineer in the country who, with the help of some excellent graphics and animation, showed exactly how the planes caused the towers to fall. An explosives expert (a young guy who was flabbergasted at the ignorance of the truthers regarding demolition) pointed out it would have taken weeks to rig the buildings for implosion and would have involved stripping drywall and ripping out walls. The nail in the coffin was supplied by one of the engineers who prepared the final report (working for the independent American Society of Civil Engineers) who showed how the collapse of the towers accounted for such things as the puffs of smoke seen in lower floors as the collapse was occurring as well as the speed of the collapse.

By the end of their presentation, I was on my feet cheering.

The emotional highlight of the documentary occurred when they had members of the victims families responding to the truthers. A confrontation at Ground Zero on the anniversary of 9/11 with the truthers screaming at family members who disagreed with them was shocking. One family member said every time she heard one of the conspiracy nuts it was like “a stab in the heart.”

Not that these nutcases care much. As the documentary showed, the truthers real goal is to blame Bush. And the disturbing poll numbers showing that 46% of the country believing the whole truth about 9/11 is being hidden by the government shows why this documentary should be viewed by everyone.

You can tell how deeply this program hurt the truther movement by the fact that they didn’t try to answer any of the points made by the piece but rather attacked the source:

http://rightwingnuthouse.com/archives/2007/08/21/911-truthers-gut-punched-by-history-channel/

[Herrmannek]

where I can see it free?

[seraosha]

It'll be on youtube in no time.

I have it "tivo'd" to share with friends.

[Paltcon]

I watched that last night too, not the whole thing but just the first half. I was pleased with the result but I won't be surprised when the truthers deny everything on the program and come up with some new "evidence" to prove The History Channel wrong.

[-OceanKill-]

I watched that last night too, not the whole thing but just the first half. I was pleased with the result but I won't be surprised when the truthers deny everything on the program and come up with some new "evidence" to prove The History Channel wrong.

There already on it

http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/history_channel_hit_piece_dirty_tricks_malicious_lies_journalistic_fraud.htm

:roll:

[lightfire]

^^^^^
It's all those coorporations and they,you know, coorporations, they..coorporate, and and do buisness, steal from the people of USA, and coorporations, they they <sputum>, you see they lie, they all lie, it's a great conspiracy, and they are controoled by coorporate bosses, doing secrect inside jobs, and and, well here you go..

[Gryphon81]

anyone have a line on a torrent or something ?

[shocker1]

There already on it

http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/history_channel_hit_piece_dirty_tricks_malicious_lies_journalistic_fraud.htm

:roll:


He is famous for the smear job documentary on Michael Jackson and makes a career out of conning people and then stabbing them in the back.
I bet that documentary was hard to spin in a negative light.:)

What is with Texas and the nuts? Check out Pastor David Smith, I bet Alex Jones goes to church there.
http://www.newswatchmagazine.org/
I listened to a few of his sermons on the site after a customer gave me a book he wrote. Crazy

[Hunterhr]

There already on it

http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/history_channel_hit_piece_dirty_tricks_malicious_lies_journalistic_fraud.htm

:roll:

"Media whore stooges"

Awesome. :)

[BloodyTalon]

There already on it

http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/history_channel_hit_piece_dirty_tricks_malicious_lies_journalistic_fraud.htm

:roll:
Osama bin Laden could walk up to Alex Jones at tell him face-to-face that he was behind 9/11 and the "truth movement" would still find ways to claim it was by the government.

[muttbutt]

Osama bin Laden could walk up to Alex Jones at tell him face-to-face that he was behind 9/11 and the "truth movement" would still find ways to claim it was by the government.
Of course, one of the abiding ideas is that OBL was a plant for the JOOOs, if not infact Jooish himself...conspiracies give people the sense that they have the inside track on things, it makes them feel importent and knowing, Governments don't help matters with some of the crap they get up to, but hardcore conspiraciy nuts drive it on

[snoddy]

there was this guy at work who tried to tell me everyday, that explosives were used when the towers collapsed you could see windows get blown out floors below all the way down on both towers...

he also said there was no reason why tower 7? should have collapsed being so far away...

he was kind of weird like that, upset that he couldnt get into the service...

[ewing2001]

"9/11 Conspiracies" was not a "hit piece", it worked for the Truthlings
A review by ewing2001
August 21, 2007

Both Miltary Ignorants + History Channel ignore evidence on 9/11 TV Fakery, FCS/DEW

While Average Flagwaver might laugh at the average 'conspiracy buff', the show actually offered an expected limited hangout spin of the so called Orwellianized 9/11 truthlings to escape from the evidence on

a)
9/11 TV Fakery
see http://www.livevideo.com/socialservice

http://liveu-99.vo.llnwd.net/livevideo/image/99/194899/228144_5s.jpg

b)
The integration of manipulated and/or georegistered "footage" with help of FCS aka Future Combat System

c)
Another multiple function of FCS which also integrates Directed Energy Weapons, which is most obviously one of the main weapon suspects which destroyed the Twin Towers -and NOT Steven Jones' "thermite".

Jones is a WarCriminal and deceptive Infiltrator of the 9/11 "Truth" movement, who himself worked at Los Alamos to cover up their development of exoW [exotic weaponry] of any kind.

Among them Neutrino Weapons (in Cooperation with KEK, Japan), Antimatter (TRIUMF Laboratory, Vancouver), Sonolumiscence, weaponised ColdFusion and any other types of DEW.

Regular Members of militaryphotos.net do know that these weapons do work and exist, also in mobile form!
[see also "Current known mobile and stationary DEW Systems " "http://forum.911movement.org/index.php?showtopic=331&st=15


Furthermore the current drill in Portland "Noble Resolve" proves the significance of Directed Energy Weapons (DEW) into FCS and can be traced back years before 9/11.

During 2000/01, DEW was integrated into a 40+ Contract Pool on FCS, run by Boeing, SAIC and others.

This team obviously also worked close together with the False Flag Team which planned and executed 9/11, including the destruction of the Twin Towers.


The Hearst Channel is well aware of the popularity of BOTH evidence of 9/11 TV Fakery and the use of exoW on 9/11, but needs to keep the MSM myth alive of other unconventional nonsense, among them also the myth on real planes, which was debunked several times.

HISTORY CHANNEL censored the "no-planer" evidence on Monday,
while 9/11 Truth Activists argue, they wouldn't miss such Opportunity
to "discredit the movement".

However, where was the rant on "no-planes", a hint on popular representatives of this research and more *controversial*, why wasn't Jim Fetzer asked on his *own support on 9/11 TV Fakery evidence and a most obvious use of exoW of any kind on 9/11?

Surely this wasn't a mistake of the editor or producer but a well calculated censorship of the Hearst Apparatus, while neo-larouchies or other Cultists within the 9/11 "Truth" Movement pray yet another alleged breakthrough of facts presented in MSM, while politically they still getting played by Media and worse- by the Anti-War Movement Leaders, who don't care about 9/11 'Truth' because Infiltrators and *pro-war* themselves.

Since cowards, brainwashed tools or other ignorants of similar coleur do represent the majority of sheeple and truthlings within the 9/11 Untruth Movement, nothing will change and the anniversary is already pre-programmed to talk about "9/11 Air" instead anyway.

Therefore the dog-and pony show between "flagwavers" and "9/11 Truthlings" will continue, supported by MSM, among them HISTORY, CNN or PBS- it doesn't matter.


If real patriots would be on this forum at "Miltaryphotos.net", they would speak out. However the chances might be small as well, therefore please
accept this review as your personal pocorn for your own 'jerk-off' hour on *exotic kooks* or whatever title you will come up for the reviewer.


Check the sources on FCS/DEW also here:

[see also http://www.jfcom.mil/about/experiments/nobleresolve.html

http://www.jfcom.mil/about/fact_jfl.htm

"...Examples of recent projects include Multinational Experiment 4, Urban Resolve 2015..."

[see also FCS- JFCOM connection at http://www.fcw.com/article98147-04-04-07-Web

"...Noble Resolve, a series of experiments...is a follow-on to the Urban Resolve experiments JFCOM ran in 2006....

...Noble Resolve will examine how to deter, prevent and respond to a nuclear attack on the United States.... ...UR2015 brought together dozens of military simulations in a federated architecture. The Army’s Omni Fusion simulation, which models their Future Combat System, was part of UR2015..."

http://integrator.hanscom.af.mil/2006/October/10262006/061018-F-6240A-233.gif

(Photo: Air Forces experiments with directed energy weapons at the Pentagon during USJFCOM's Urban Resolve 2015)

[see also http://forum.911movement.org/index.php?showtopic=331&st=15

"...The Sentient World Simulation (SWS), as it is called, is the latest invention by the US Department of Defense. It is a simulated environment to test their psychological operations (PSYOPs)... ...Right now, the 62 simulated nations in SEAS depict humans as composites, at a 100-to-1 ratio.. ...Noble Resolve 07. They are planning an experiment in domestic defense that in August will simulate crisis scenarios in the United States from coast to coast..."


http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/images/logo.gif

In September 2000 -one year before 9/11, Randy Buff,
"a scientist at the Army Space and Missile Defense Command",
confirmed that his office is considering to integrate
"use of high-energy laser weapons for FCS..."

( nationaldefensemagazine.org )
http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/iss.../Twenty-Ton.htm (http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/issues/2000/Sep/Twenty-Ton.htm)

"...The FCS will be the platform for what the Army calls the "objective force,...

http://forum.911movement.org/index.php?showtopic=331&st=15

smdc.mil September 28th, 2001
17 days after 9/11

(U.S. Army Space and Missile Defense Command/ARSTRAT =Army Forces Strategic Command )

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o15/ewing2001/ATLaser_SMDC_Oc2001.jpg


http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o15/ewing2001/HELSTF_0928_2001.jpg

(sic: photo above) Using a giant pair of scissors (from
left to right), Lt. Col. Lynn Tronti, director,
HELSTF, Dr. William H. Goldstein, associate
director, physics and advanced technologies,
Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory, Brig.
Gen. Stephen J. Ferrell, special assistant to the
commanding general, SMDC, and Dr. Randy
Buff, program manager, SSHCL at SMDC cut
the ribbon during the ceremony at HELSTF...


...
...Tactical High Energy
Laser (THEL) that was tested on
a variety of air-borne targets
from 1999 to 2004. ..

...In 2001, Lt. Gen. John Costello, the
USASMDC commander, observed that
“directed energy technology has the
potential to be a key component in the
Army transformation effort.”...
... the Command and the
Department of the Energy signed an
agreement to support an Army Directed
Energy Center of Excellence at USASMDC...


http://helstf-www.wsmr.army.mil/images/sshcl.jpg

...HELSTF has been testing a
Solid State Heat Capacity Laser
(SSHCL) since August of 2001.


...

http://911bloglines.com/node/11
Future Combat System (FCS) Video Sources

9/11 Video Mashups about FCS
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=future+combat+system+bsregistration


http://youtube.com/bsregistration

http://img.youtube.com/vi/HLROLbkfc5o/default.jpg (http://youtube.com/watch?v=HLROLbkfc5o)

911 Octopus - The Up and Up (http://youtube.com/watch?v=HLROLbkfc5o)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=HLROLbkfc5o
09:15
Added: 1 month ago
Views: 7,412

http://img.youtube.com/vi/k5elUcG8zMQ/default.jpg (http://youtube.com/watch?v=k5elUcG8zMQ)

Full Spectrum Treason - 911 Octopus (http://youtube.com/watch?v=k5elUcG8zMQ)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=k5elUcG8zMQ
09:32
Added: 1 month ago
Views: 11,266

http://youtube.com/img/icn_star_full_11x11.gifhttp://youtube.com/img/icn_star_full_11x11.gifhttp://youtube.com/img/icn_star_full_11x11.gifhttp://youtube.com/img/icn_star_half_11x11.gifhttp://youtube.com/img/icn_star_empty_11x11.gif

FCS 2000 Contractors, alphabetically listed

* Aurora Flight Sciences [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* Battelle Institute [Team Gladiator (Consortium)], also [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* Boeing [The Boeing Team]
* Carnegie Mellon [Team Gladiator (Consortium)]
* CSC/Nichols Research [Team Gladiator (Consortium)]

* General Dynamics Land Systems Inc. [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* Honeywell [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* IITRI/AB Technologies[Team Gladiator (Consortium)]
* ITT Industries [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]
* Krauss-Maffei Wegmann (KMW), Germany [The Boeing Team]

* Lockheed Martin [Team Gladiator (Consortium)]
* Logistics Management Institute (LMI) [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]
* Los Alamos National Laboratory [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* Maxwell Physics International [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* NIST National Institute of Standards and Technology [The Boeing Team]

* New Definitions, Inc., Tacoma, WA [The Boeing Team]
* Northrop Grumman Corp [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]
* Omnitech Robotics International LLS [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]
* Raytheon Company, Plano, Texas [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* Rockwell Science Center, Thousand Oaks, CA [The Boeing Team]

* SAIC [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]
* Sensis [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* Sensor.com Wireless Integrated Network Sensors [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* Signature Research, Inc., Calumet, MI [The Boeing Team]
* SRI International [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]

* Stanford Research Institute International [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* Sterling Heights [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]
* Strategic Perspectives Inc. [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]
* TRW [Team Gladiator (Consortium)]
* United Defense, LP [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]

* University of Texas Center for Electromechanics [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]
* Vector Research, Inc./ERIM, Ann Arbor, MI [The Boeing Team]
* VRI [Team Full Spectrum/SAIC]
* Whitney, Bradley & Brown, Inc., Vienna, VA [The Boeing Team], also [Team FoCus Vision (Consortium,), led by General Dynamics]

[BloodyTalon]

^^^

Wait up: you are actually claiming that the towers were brought down by a friggin lazer?!

Someone's been watching way too many movies...

[shocker1]

That is an unorganized calamity of a post there Mr Ewing. Your credibility is shot to hell unless you can clean that up. You know use the quote function and link sources to quotes. My eyes hurt from trying reconstruct that disaster.

[orange]

^^^

Wait up: you are actually claiming that the towers were brought down by a friggin lazer?!

Someone's been watching way too many movies...
That's just an awesome first post he did there. He'll be a longtime member will he not?

Is he serious?rofl

[Alpheus]

Jones is a WarCriminal and deceptive Infiltrator of the 9/11 "Truth" movement, who himself worked at Los Alamos to cover up their development of exoW [exotic weaponry] of any kind.

Among them Neutrino Weapons (in Cooperation with KEK, Japan), Antimatter (TRIUMF Laboratory, Vancouver), Sonolumiscence, weaponised ColdFusion and any other types of DEW.
The Hearst Channel is well aware of the popularity of BOTH evidence of 9/11 TV Fakery and the use of exoW on 9/11, but needs to keep the MSM myth alive of other unconventional nonsense, among them also the myth on real planes, which was debunked several times.
HISTORY CHANNEL censored the "no-planer" evidence on Monday,
while 9/11 Truth Activists argue, they wouldn't miss such Opportunity
to "discredit the movement".

However, where was the rant on "no-planes", a hint on popular representatives of this research and more *controversial*, why wasn't Jim Fetzer asked on his *own support on 9/11 TV Fakery evidence and a most obvious use of exoW of any kind on 9/11?

Surely this wasn't a mistake of the editor or producer but a well calculated censorship of the Hearst Apparatus, while neo-larouchies or other Cultists within the 9/11 "Truth" Movement pray yet another alleged breakthrough of facts presented in MSM, while politically they still getting played by Media and worse- the Anti-War Movement Leaders, who don't care about 9/11 'Truth' because Infiltrators and *pro-war* themselves.

Since cowards, brainwashed tools or other ignorants of similar coleur do represent the majority of sheeple and truthlings within the 9/11 Untruth Movement, nothing will change and the anniversary is already pre-programmed to talk about "9/11 Air" instead anyway.

Therefore the dog-and pony show between "flagwavers" and "9/11 Truthlings" will continue, supported by MSM, among them HISTORY, CNN or PBS- it doesn't matter.


If real patriots would be on this forum at "Miltaryphotos.net", they would speak out. However the chances might be small as well, therefore please
accept this review as your personal pocorn for your own 'jerk-off' hour on *exotic kooks* or whatever title you will come up for the reviewer.
roflroflrofl

This is the real meat-and-bones of his illiterate post. The rest is just background to his idiotic ramblings. I didn't even bother with the videos.

I love how he calls the planes hitting the towers "unconventional nonsense"

[ltrowley]

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/7568/wtcsunriseps6rg1.jpg

Now I'm no expert on anything even remotely related to 9/11 but....

This picture does'nt exact inspire the words "757 proof" or "mini-Yield Nuke" or "Laser beams" or "Pre-wired thermite bombs" in fact the word "Fragile" come to mind....

[Buckeye67]

blahblah psychobabble blah

Paranoid rambling: CHECK
Psuedo-intellectual (not to mention misspelled) verbage: CHECK
Links to moonbat websites/videos: CHECK
List of completely unverifiable references: CHECK
"Lasers brought down WTC" theory: CHECK

Survey says: COMPLETE NUCKING FUTTER.

[shocker1]

The same people that credit Bush and crew with somehow with pulling 911 off. Are the same ones who think he is a dumb chimp. If BushIlluminatiCheney pulled that off why in the hell did the Empire not plant a nice selection of WMDs in Iraq? Really that would have been a breeze for such a master conspirator and crew.

I am still waiting for JR to clean up his one and only post so I can read something that is at least organized. Instead of copy past spam.

[Heazy]

Jetfuel does NOT burn my tinfoil hat

[Calanen]

Ewing needs more bolds and underlinings together with italics and capitals to add to his credibility. Any good distributor of end of the world literature on street corners can tell you that!

[BloodyTalon]

The same people that credit Bush and crew with somehow with pulling 911 off. Are the same ones who think he is a dumb chimp. If BushIlluminatiCheney pulled that off why in the hell did the Empire not plant a nice selection of WMDs in Iraq? Really that would have been a breeze for such a master conspirator and crew.

I am still waiting for JR to clean up his one and only post so I can read something that is at least organized. Instead of copy past spam.
Here's basically Ewing's post in a nutshell:


http://youtube.com/v/aYDMLQZWm4U
See that blue light of death? THATS what brought down the twin towers. Not planes, not thermite, not a mini nuke; it is a giant space laser that we just happened to have lying around and never bothered to use until 9/11 and have decided not to use since then for ****s and giggles.

[Buckeye67]

You know, he may actually be onto something. I remember seeing a program about the development of this space-laser system thing:

http://www.youtube.com/v/-lIfcV1NETk

[shocker1]

If real patriots would be on this forum at "Miltaryphotos.net", they would speak out. However the chances might be small as well, therefore please
accept this review as your personal pocorn for your own 'jerk-off' hour on *exotic kooks* or whatever title you will come up for the reviewer.
Whoa!!! I missed this little tid bit in his post. His English shows his stripes as his conjugations are all out of whack. This SOB does not even know what a ****** patriot is. :bash:

Space lasers has to be the dumbest idea for 911 yet. You don't have the balls to hang around for a bit and debate the ignorant ideas you posted. There are people here in the know and we know you are.....http://ugly-halloween-costumes.com/scary/Spam/spam-big.jpg
King of Mystery Meat and copy paste


edit:I see that right now 1:30am eastern that you are logged in. I must go to bed but please expand on your thoughts while I am away.

[ewing2001]

...at least you guys have some humor ;

thx for the warm welcome. It's very ironic that you ignored your own sources so far,
since militaryphotos.net is talking about directed energy weapons for years, i.e.
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=18362 i',
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif Directed Energy Weapons - Good? Or Evil?

i'm not here to waste time with a debate either, i'm just on some promo tour on the latest and thought i take a rest at militaryphotos.net ;)

I enjoyed the last two *videos*.
Hollywood actually prepared us on Directed Energy Weapons for years as well.

It's up to you to prove, that the Twin Towers were NOT destroyed by DEW and their related genres. Same to the planes.
Prove that they did not fake the live broadcast. They didn't show you real planes and they screwed up but noone cares,
because the war to bancrupt the U.S. has to continue to be beaten by China's DEW one day
Since this is a military photo forum, i'm sure more videos are allowed too ;

Here is mine:
http://www.livevideo.com/video/0985482048234FECB1B46DDEBC904136/ewing2001-pres-dj-jeff-pumpit.aspx?lastvcid=303256

http://liveu-74.vo.llnwd.net/livevideo/image/36/48536/191074_27s.jpg (http://www.livevideo.com/video/0985482048234FECB1B46DDEBC904136/ewing2001-pres-dj-jeff-pumpit.aspx?lastvcid=303256)

ewing2001 pres. DJ Jeff Pumpitout: 9/11 *was* FCS ! (Hunting Steven "LosAlamos" Jones BeBop Wescam M (http://www.livevideo.com/video/0985482048234FECB1B46DDEBC904136/ewing2001-pres-dj-jeff-pumpit.aspx?lastvcid=303256)
11:49


And here is where they produced the weapons for 9/11:

http://helstf-www.wsmr.army.mil/

http://helstf-www.wsmr.army.mil/images/site-and-bird.gif

AFRL DIRECTED ENERGY DIRECTORATE PRODUCT LINES
http://www.kirtland.af.mil/library/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=7971

http://www.kirtland.af.mil/shared/images/main%20photo%20copy1.jpg

and here is how Buildings look after wiped with DEW and Partners:

http://drjudywood.com/articles/DEW/dewpics/Image28.jpg

And here is a military photo of the 9/11 'live' CGI aircraft:

http://www.911closeup.com/nico/WABC_startof2ndhit_clip.jpg

And here is a video including a military video of a 9/11 non-live CGI glitched aircraft ;

http://youtube.com/watch?v=u9Egx-r2D9Y
Mirror-Plane

http://img.youtube.com/vi/u9Egx-r2D9Y/default.jpg (http://youtube.com/watch?v=u9Egx-r2D9Y)
Mirror-Plane (http://youtube.com/watch?v=u9Egx-r2D9Y)
00:42


funny, isn't it ? ;

[-OceanKill-]

Can this guy be DAOTW?

I find it funny people actually believe in this kind of crap.

[Abolith]

ermm... the ignorance is strong in this, it is....

[AlterMega]

Prove that they did not fake the live broadcast. They didn't show you real planes and they screwed up but noone cares,

say what!?

[Calanen]

...
It's up to you to prove, that the Twin Towers were NOT destroyed by DEW and their related genres. Same to the planes.
Prove that they did not fake the live broadcast. They didn't show you real planes and they screwed up but noone cares,
because the war to bancrupt the U.S. has to continue to be beaten by China's DEW one day


That is pure gold right there.

I think it's now up to you to prove first that you are not legally insane.

[BloodyTalon]

LOL LAZORZ!

rofl i knew it; you have been watching too many movies.


You give our DEW programs waaaaaay too much credit for starters. The vast majority of them are still being researched, and the DEWs that have been made are nowhere near powerful enough to destroy a target as large as a building. The most powerful laser we have right now is MIRACL in New Mexico, which can fire a 14 x 14 cm beam for only 70 seconds. It was used to destroy cruise missiles and was also used to disable a satelite in 1997.


Now for your theory to hold any water, the US government would need to be in possesion of a DEW that was A) able to create a beam capable of decimating an entire building, and B) can maintain that beam from 8:46 (when the north tower showed signs of impact) to 9:56 (when the south tower collapsed). Oh yeah, did I mention the laser itself would have to be at least within a 270 mile radius of the towers and have a clear sight of them to work?

And that's not getting into Occhams Razor. You would also need people to create and operate a DEW somewhere in New York and somehow hide it from the populace. And of course you would have higher-ups in the military and executive branch who would know about this, and the Pixar staff who according to you made the holographic planes that everyone saw and took pictures and video of. And yet not a single person has blown it, especially at a time when the more controversial operations of the government (warrantless wiretaps, overseas prisons, etc.) are told to the highest bidder.

[ltrowley]

Prove that they did not fake the live broadcast. They didn't show you real planes and they screwed up but noone cares

BBBbbbut there were WITNESSSES, I even know someone who saw the planes going in. OMG my reality is crumblimg around me :cantbeli:

[Buckeye67]

BBBbbbut there were WITNESSSES, I even know someone who saw the planes going in. OMG my reality is crumblimg around me :cantbeli:

They are obviously payroll of the CIA and the OMGBUSHAMERIKKKAILLUMINATI.

Duh.

[Telmar]

No doubt that 9/11 conspiration believers worship their messy YouTube videos and use internet to spread it as a tool. Watching those videos myself, I have difficulty believing some preacher telling me with a serious voice so I can believe it that : this was just a blob, look this is photoshopped, that is a bird not a plane. 9/11 conspiration believers have their anti American or anti Bush belief so deep down that just about anything will do to suit their lazy minds.

To be a little provocative with the "Wow moon bats" people, Right wingers have their conspiracists too. I was amazed on a conservative and well known forum how many people actually believe TWA800 was shot down by a terrorist missile, and that Clinton hid the facts because he was soft on terror. (NOTE some left loonies like the missile theory, but prefer it to have been launched by the US Navy).

Being influencable and a lazy thinker makes you a easy prey for conspiration theories. And that goes for all sides of the political spectrum.

[martinexsquaddie]

I like the way the US covert spooks can commit mass murder get away with it.
but are too squeamish incompetent to off a few conspiracy buffs.
it it was me I'd have jason bourne on there tail armed only with blender.
purely for comedy effect.
moonbat conspiracy freak will they blend :)

[lightfire]

some people just need to be hospitalised for their own sake, and that's it. Such category of freaks includes from hardcore conspiracy theorists to westbrochurch fanatics, just insane people that makes the world a sad panda.

[Telmar]

some people just need to be hospitalised for their own sake, and that's it. Such category of freaks includes from hardcore conspiracy theorists to westbrochurch fanatics, just insane people that makes the world a sad panda.

But they are so entertaining...

[Chops]

...at least you guys have some humor ;;

I don't. Go read the rules of this forum, particularly the one about 9/11 conspiracies and then go and **** yourself.

****.

[Dr_ColoSSus]

...at least you guys have some humor ;

thx for the warm welcome. It's very ironic that you ignored your own sources so far,
since militaryphotos.net is talking about directed energy weapons for years, i.e.
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...ad.php?t=18362 (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=18362) i',
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif Directed Energy Weapons - Good? Or Evil?



'why don't you and the laser get a freakin room already'

Dumbarse of the week anyone?

back on topic, it is about time the voice of reason challenged some of these amateurish assertions that we have seen from conspiracy nuts over the years. Now a laser boguht down the twin towers? gimme a break.

[LillaMy]

Ok...but how about some torrents for the documentary!? Anyone?

[-OceanKill-]

Apparently it is coming on again at Saturday, August 25th, 8PM

[Paltcon]

The amount of energy that it would take to fire a laser strong enough to destroy a building (let alone two) is more then the entire Earth produces in a year.

[Poccington The 3rd]

There is some really, really, really crazy people in this world.

[timetraveller]

There is some really, really, really crazy people in this world.


There always has been and always will be ...

[shocker1]

Well seems someone shot JR Ewing down.

[LMAV]

http://www.history.com/search.do?searchText=9%2F11+Conspiracies%3A+Fact+or+Fiction&x=9&y=10&action=scheduleSearch


Sunday, August 26 12 am 9/11 Conspiracies: Fact or Fiction (http://www.history.com/shows.do?episodeId=240087&action=detail)
Saturday, August 25 8 pm 9/11 Conspiracies: Fact or Fiction (http://www.history.com/shows.do?episodeId=240087&action=detail)
Here is the torrent if you don't want to wait: http://www.mininova.org/get/850334

[DaGreatRV]

I can remeber a few months ago on Dutch TV (ned3), they first aired "Loose change" directly after that a documentary debunking it. (could be that 'history channel' documentary that the topicstarter is refering to)

But anyway, it was quite entertaining :).

[Russian_dude]

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/7568/wtcsunriseps6rg1.jpg

Now I'm no expert on anything even remotely related to 9/11 but....

This picture does'nt exact inspire the words "757 proof" or "mini-Yield Nuke" or "Laser beams" or "Pre-wired thermite bombs" in fact the word "Fragile" come to mind....

I think this single picture debunks all those "planes can't bring down a tall building nonsense."

[KaceCoyote]

Anyone want to do the math of how much force a 747 can produce traveling like oh 380mph? How many tons of sheere force does that generate in a single peak load?

[free speech]

THE WTC WAS DESIGNED TO SURVIVE
THE IMPACT OF A BOEING 767.


Fact. The twin towers were designed to withstand a collision with a Boeing 707.

The maximum takeoff weight for a Boeing 707-320B (http://www.boeing.com/commercial/707family/product.html) is 336,000 pounds.
The maximum takeoff weight for a Boeing 767-200ER (http://www.boeing.com/commercial/767family/pf/pf_200prod.html) is 395,000 pounds.

The wingspan of a Boeing 707 is 146 feet.
The wingspan of a Boeing 767 is 156 feet.

The length of a Boeing 707 is 153 feet.
The length of a Boeing 767 is 159 feet.

The Boeing 707 could carry 23,000 gallons of fuel.
The Boeing 767 could carry 23,980 gallons of fuel.

The cruise speed of a Boeing 707 is 607 mph = 890 ft/s,
The cruise speed of a Boeing 767 is 530 mph = 777 ft/s.

So, the Boeing 707 and 767 are very similar aircraft, with the main differences being that the 767 is slightly heavier and the 707 is faster.

In designing the towers to withstand the impact of a Boeing 707, the designers would have assumed that the aircraft was operated normally. So they would have assumed that the aircraft was traveling at its cruise speed and not at the break neck speed of some kamikaze. With this in mind, we can calculate the energy that the plane would impart to the towers in any accidental collision.

The kinetic energy released by the impact of a Boeing 707 at cruise speed is
= 0.5 x 336,000 x (890)^2/32.174
= 4.136 billion ft lbs force (5,607,720 Kilojoules).

The kinetic energy released by the impact of a Boeing 767 at cruise speed is
= 0.5 x 395,000 x (777)^2/32.174
= 3.706 billion ft lbs force (5,024,650 Kilojoules).

From this, we see that under normal flying conditions, a Boeing 707 would smash into the WTC with about 10 percent more energy than would the slightly heavier Boeing 767. That is, under normal flying conditions, a Boeing 707 would do more damage than a Boeing 767.

In conclusion we can say that if the towers were designed to survive the impact of a Boeing 707, then they were necessarily designed to survive the impact of a Boeing 767.

So what can be said about the actual impacts?

The speed of impact of AA Flight 11 was 470 mph = 689 ft/s.
The speed of impact of UA Flight 175 was 590 mph = 865 ft/s.

The kinetic energy released by the impact of AA Flight 11 was
= 0.5 x 395,000 x (689)^2/32.174
= 2.914 billion ft lbs force (3,950,950 Kilojoules).

This is well within limits that the towers were built to survive. So why did the North tower fall?

The kinetic energy released by the impact of UA Flight 175 was
= 0.5 x 395,000 x (865)^2/32.174
= 4.593 billion ft lbs force (6,227,270 Kilojoules).

This is within 10 percent of the energy released by the impact of a Boeing 707 at cruise speed. So, it is also a surprise that the 767 impact caused the South tower to fall.

Overall, it comes as a great surprise that the impact of a Boeing 767 bought down either tower. Indeed, many experts are on record as saying that the towers would survive the impact of the larger and faster Boeing 747. In this regard, see professor Astaneh-Asl's simulation of the crash (http://www.911review.org/Wget/www.nerdcities.com/guardian/wtc/wtc-microsoft.htm) of the much, much larger and heavier Boeing 747 with the World Trade Center. Professor Astaneh-Asl teaches at the University of California, Berkeley. Although the jet fuel fires have been ruled out as the cause of the collapses, it should still be pointed out that the fuel capacities of the Boeing 707 and the Boeing 767 are essentially the same. And in any case, it has been estimated that both UA Flight 175 and AA Flight 11 were carrying about 10,000 gallons of fuel when they impacted. This is well below the 23,000 gallon capacity of a Boeing 707 or 767. Thus the amount of fuel that exploded and burnt on September 11 was envisaged by those who designed the towers. Consequently, the towers were designed to survive such fires. It should also be mentioned that other high-rise buildings have suffered significantly more serious fires than those of the twin towers on September 11, and did not collapse.

[seraosha]

Wow, like moths to the flame.

Everyone get out your tinfoil hats, it's going to be a bumpy ride.

[JKD]

You're treating the kinetic damage and fire damage as if they occured seperately and not in the same incident.

The buildings did survive the impact and they might have survived the fire(I'm no engineer) if not for the structural damage of the crash. 9/11 Conspiracy theorists always look at things as if they happened by themselves and not in conjuction with many other things.


...conspiracy theorists are funny.

[ltrowley]

free speech would'nt be erwin by any chance?.?.?

And (once again) I'm no mathematician but how do you calculate the impact energy of a boeing? Would you not have to factor in what it is hitting and how it is hitting it? The mind boggles. goodnight.

[Herrmannek]

I'm always curious what means that building was designed to withstand a plane hit... As for WTCs they withstood impact of the planes, what brought them down was progressing erosion far beyond any knowledge or simulation available to men of the time those were constructed...

I can imagine constructors just took the wingspan of the target plane and calculated maximal amount of supporting beams that could be cut in half in full head on crash that went completely trough(give or take) and calculated that with this damage in any configuration building will stand still, and it stood, giving chance for the most* people to escape...


*Anyone know how many people was actually evacuated?

[Telmar]

THE WTC WAS DESIGNED TO SURVIVE
THE IMPACT OF A BOEING 767.


....
Overall, it comes as a great surprise that the impact of a Boeing 767 bought down either tower. Indeed, many experts are on record as saying that the towers would survive the impact of the larger and faster Boeing 747. In this regard, see professor Astaneh-Asl's simulation of the crash (http://www.911review.org/Wget/www.nerdcities.com/guardian/wtc/wtc-microsoft.htm) of the much, much larger and heavier Boeing 747 with the World Trade Center. Professor Astaneh-Asl teaches at the University of California, Berkeley. Although the jet fuel fires have been ruled out as the cause of the collapses, it should still be pointed out that the fuel capacities of the Boeing 707 and the Boeing 767 are essentially the same. And in any case, it has been estimated that both UA Flight 175 and AA Flight 11 were carrying about 10,000 gallons of fuel when they impacted. .

I am suprised to see that the fires had been rules out as the cause. I thought that the heat had more to do on the collapse than the initial shock.

I am no building specialist but saw a documentary on how the towers were built in a new structural design using more but much lighter structures.
The new design allowed the towers to be built at record speed. But the steel structures being lighter were more affected (and probably in less time) by the heat.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2004/10/20/news/wtc.php?page=1



...The infernos that erupted in the towers are to blame for the collapse, the reports found. As temperatures rose, the remaining core columns softened and buckled, shifting much of the burden to the exterior. The floors, which largely remained intact outside the impact zone, reacted by pulling the exterior columns inward, adding to the extreme stress on the exterior columns...


But maybe this is not the latest news...

[shocker1]

As an engineer those calculations do not take into account the energy from shock wave effects on concrete. Also the effects of the shock wave on fire proofing material. The energy calculations of the fire that came after must include wind variables for oxygen supply to the fire. Also the heat from the interior amenities is also left out of your theory. In short many factors including building design gave us the spectacular seemingly controlled demolition of the buildings.

I am not a dumb American and stop posting information that assumes most Americans are.

[free speech]

By Suzanne Dean
For the Deseret Morning News
Published: April 10, 2006 9:28 a.m. MDT



EPHRAIM — A Brigham Young University physicist said he now believes an incendiary substance called thermite, bolstered by sulfur, was used to generate exceptionally hot fires at the World Trade Center on 9/11, causing the structural steel to fail and the buildings to collapse. "It looks like thermite with sulfur added, which really is a very clever idea," Steven Jones, professor of physics at BYU, told a meeting of the Utah Academy of Science, Arts and Letters at Snow College Friday.
The government requires standard explosives to contain tag elements enabling them to be traced back to their manufacturers. But no tags are required in aluminum and iron oxide, the materials used to make thermite, he said. Nor, he said, are tags required in sulfur.
Jones is co-chairman, with James H. Fetzer, a distinguished professor of philosophy at the University of Minnesota of Scholars for 9/11 Truth, a group of college faculty members who believe conspirators other than pilots of the planes were directly involved in bringing down New York's Trade Towers.
The group, which Jones said has 200 members, maintains a Web site at www.st911.org (http://www.st911.org/). A 40-page paper by Jones, along with other peer-reviewed and non-reviewed academic papers, are posted on the site.


Last year, Jones presented various arguments for his theory that explosives or incendiary devices were planted in the Trade Towers, and in WTC 7, a smaller building in the Trade Center complex, and that those materials, not planes crashing into the buildings, caused the buildings to collapse.
At that time, he mentioned thermite as the possible explosive or incendiary agent. But Friday, he said he is increasingly convinced that thermite and sulfur were the root causes of the 9/11 disaster.
He told college professors and graduate students from throughout Utah gathered for the academy meeting that while almost no fire, even one ignited by jet fuel, can cause structural steel to fail, the combination of thermite and sulfur "slices through steel like a hot knife through butter."
He ticked off several pieces of evidence for his thermite fire theory:
First, he said, video showed a yellow, molten substance splashing off the side of the south Trade Tower about 50 minutes after an airplane hit it and a few minutes before it collapsed. Government investigators ruled out the possibility of melting steel being the source of the material because of the unlikelihood of steel melting. The investigators said the molten material must have been aluminum from the plane.
But, said Jones, molten aluminum is silvery. It never turns yellow. The substance observed in the videos "just isn't aluminum," he said. But, he said, thermite can cause steel to melt and become yellowish.
Second, he cited video pictures showing white ash rising from the south tower near the dripping, liquefied metal. When thermite burns, Jones said, it releases aluminum-oxide ash. The presence of both yellow-white molten iron and aluminum oxide ash "are signature characteristics of a thermite reaction," he said.
Another item of evidence, Jones said, is the fact that sulfur traces were found in structural steel recovered from the Trade Towers. Jones quoted the New York Times as saying sulfidization in the recovered steel was "perhaps the deepest mystery uncovered in the (official) investigation." But, he said, sulfidization fits the theory that sulfur was combined with thermite to make the thermite burn even hotter than it ordinarily would.
Jones said a piece of building wreckage had a gray substance on the outside that at one point had obviously been a dripping molten metal or liquid. He said that after thermite turns steel or iron into a molten form, and the metal hardens, it is gray.
He added that pools of molten metal were found beneath both trade towers and the 47-story WTC 7. That fact, he said, was never discussed in official investigation reports.
And even though WTC 7 was not connected to the Trade Towers — in fact, there was another building between it and the towers —and even though it was never hit by a plane, it collapsed. That suggests, he said, that it came down because a thermite fire caused its structural steel to fail.
Jones said his studies are confined to physical causes of the collapses, and he doesn't like to speculate about who might have entered the buildings and placed thermite and sulfur. But he said 10 to 20 people "in the know," plus other people who didn't know what they were doing but did what they were told, could have placed incendiary packages over several weeks.

[Beowulf]

I don't. Go read the rules of this forum, particularly the one about 9/11 conspiracies and then go and **** yourself.

****.

Thats why I love this guy.

[Beowulf]

almost no fire, even one ignited by jet fuel, can cause structural steel to fail

reminds me of Rosie O'donnel

[shocker1]

I was gonna debate that last tid bit about sulfur in steel, plastic, carpet, foam, printer, pc's ect but why bother. Then again the aluminum from the air craft was pure molten material. No mention of paint, fuel, plastics, wiring. Man this is ridiculous. Hey it is a bunch of Professors, they speak truth no agenda!

[Telmar]

By Suzanne Dean
For the Deseret Morning News
Published: April 10, 2006 9:28 a.m. MDT



EPHRAIM — A Brigham Young University physicist said he now believes an incendiary substance called thermite, bolstered by sulfur, was used to generate exceptionally hot fires at the World Trade Center on 9/11, causing the structural steel to fail and the buildings to collapse. "It looks like thermite with sulfur added, which really is a very clever idea,"


Damn termites!!! Is'nt wood enough!!!

[shocker1]

Damn termites!!! Is'nt wood enough!!!





Brigham Young University physicist said he now believes an incendiary insect called Mormon Crickets, bolstered by sulfur, was used to generate exceptionally hot fires at the World Trade Center on 9/11,

That works better:)

[Mu-Meson]

Lazorz!? Lol. The comedic value of 9/11 Truthers almost makes up for their incredibly annoying resilience to reality. ****ing idiots.

One question though, has there been any videos of the plane that hit the pentagon? Nutjobs bring this up all the time and I was just wondering what the rebuttal to that point is. Are there any videos? Have any been released? If not, why not? Note I said "plane". Please don't anyone call me a conspiracy theorist, but if someone could help clear this up for me.....

[seraosha]

google
"pentagon plane footage"

Too many to wade through, but you'll find it on one of the thousands of sites listed.

[JKD]

It wasn't lasers, thermite, a secret government earthquake machine, or a telekinetic squirrel kept in the basement of CIA headquaters...it was Kyle Broflovski.
http://www.youtube.com/v/zpzlYxUGfZk

EDIT: the board seems to have a problem with b r o f l o v s k i
heh

[Mu-Meson]

google
"pentagon plane footage"

Too many to wade through, but you'll find it on one of the thousands of sites listed.

Did that, and all it brought up was a god-awful pile of Truther sites. The only footage I could find was the stills taken from the CCTV camera. They don't show a conclusive picture of a plane. Something to do with the plane going too fast, and the camera designed to see license plates or something. Its a shame there aren't any really conclusive videos. Its too late now in 2007 to release new footage I guess because conspiranoids would just say its fake. Oh well, I guess I'll just have to trust the 83 or so eyewitness who all say the same thing. AA plane hit the pentagon.

[DaGreatRV]

Just to bring it up again, according to 'the discovery channel', the blast wave of the planes impacting blew away the fire resistent material around the structural steel.
Thus the well fuelled airplanes caused a big fire (wich we've all seen on the manipulated recordings :roll:) . Fire weakend the structure and it collapsed.

If there was no fire, the buildings would have survived, but would have to be torn down because of the massive damage the planes caused.


BTW, about the pentagon plane causing to 'little' damage, those are think concrete walls, wich were recently(before 9/11) coated with special blast proof paint and the windos and window frames were reinforced aswell.
And to ad to that, if a plane hits a concrete wall it vaporises, exept for the engines and landing gear.

A4 vs concrete
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zl0MhOdkREQ

[SeanAshi]

What does everyone think about Dylan Avery and the other Loose Change idiots abandoning the demolitons theory bringing down tower's 1 and 2?

[LillaMy]

http://www.history.com/search.do?searchText=9%2F11+Conspiracies%3A+Fact+or+Fiction&x=9&y=10&action=scheduleSearch
Here is the torrent if you don't want to wait: http://www.mininova.org/get/850334

Thanks a bunch!

[MetroN]

Not to start a new debate war here, but some of the conspirators (at least they I know of) base their theory's on the fact that OBL is on the FBI's most wanted list, but he isn't wanted for anything related to the World Trade Center attack. At least that's what I've heard them say.

So they go from there...

[BloodyTalon]

What does everyone think about Dylan Avery and the other Loose Change idiots abandoning the demolitons theory bringing down tower's 1 and 2?
Very interesting and telling of how desperate the movement is. Do you have a link?

[Herrmannek]

I'm little disappointed by the documentary... Debunks where just a bouncing on the surface. I actually would like learn something about crashing planes and destroying buildings... Someone write letter to mythbusters to make in detail follow ups :)

[shocker1]

The more "documentaries" you throw out there the more accept it becomes. In the mind of an American the word Documentary denotes truth in some way. If it was labeled as a report or special presentation it would cause less instant acceptance by those who manipulate logic.

How can one manipulate logic some may ask? Logic is relative and is not exclusive therefore bits of truths mixed with politically relevant logic can mean whatever you need them to. It just depends on what you truly want to believe.

That is why just the facts is what we should want but truly rarely get. This whole flawed way of viewing new and events such as 911. This variable logic mixed with politics, hate, money and ignorance, is why we 6 years later hear the same old lines about conspiracy.

[JJC]

The sad part is that if you go to the twin towers cite in the city, you will see the 9/11 truth moonbats making good money selling their "truth about evil american empire" crap to tourists.

[Henry's Fork]

Not to start a new debate war here, but some of the conspirators (at least they I know of) base their theory's on the fact that OBL is on the FBI's most wanted list, but he isn't wanted for anything related to the World Trade Center attack. At least that's what I've heard them say.

So they go from there...

Yup, dip****s the lot of them. OBL was on the FBI list long before 9/11 happened.

Conspiracy nuts make me more sick than any gun grabbing welfare state liberal ever could. Whats worse is that alot of people high in academia tout the conspiracy line as well. And they are educating our children. :-(

[shocker1]

The sad part is that if you go to the twin towers cite in the city, you will see the 9/11 truth moonbats making good money selling their "truth about evil american empire" crap to tourists.
Now see here in my neck off the woods people like that are either not around or in hiding of their opinions. We don't take kindly to those who think America is evil. It is just not very good to be Mr. hippy anti______ loudmouthed trouble maker here. You will get put on your ass by the POPO for disturbing the damn peace!

[JJC]

Well here in my neck of the woods, the city provides police protection to those "save the world from America types", and boy if anyone dares touch them the ACLU will make sure you get 10 to life, while at the same time defending Mumiya Abu Jamal..

[shocker1]

Well here in my neck of the woods, the city provides police protection to those "save the world from America types", and boy if anyone dares touch them the ACLU will make sure you get 10 to life, while at the same time defending Mumiya Abu Jamal..
It is not so much suppressing as they will throw anyone in jail for disturbing the peace. There have been legitimate protests for and against the war, anti-Bush ect. if people would act like adults and use intelligence the POPO could not arrest them. It is the public that will run you off, people here are more laid back and tend to get pissed when some group of loudmouthed ungrateful ****s screw up traffic and pan handle their wares. It is just not done here.

[Herrmannek]

@shocker1
Explain this. Do you say that in USA if someone calls his tv_show Documentary it makes it instantly more believable if it was advertised as a report or sth else? Why people do care how thing is called?

[SeanAshi]

Very interesting and telling of how desperate the movement is. Do you have a link?

It was in the documentary.


They got reamed to the point that the truthers who produced the internet video Loose Change are scrambling to alter the third version of their conspiracy mongering tripe, even going so far as to drop any reference to the twin towers being blown up by the government (they continue to insist WTC #7 was brought down by explosives).

I will have to watch it again because I don't remember what he said word for word but Dylan said that it was such a senstive issue they dropped it. Loose Change also claimed that the phone calls from Flight 93 were fake and after the outrage from family members who spoke with their loved ones on air phones and cell phones they dropped that as well.

[shocker1]

@shocker1
Explain this. You say that in USA if someone calls his tv_show Documentary it makes it instantly more believable if it was advertised as a report or sth else? Why people do care how thing is called?
That is my observation. People tend to grant credibility to that word for some reason. If you notice how such shows on the internet are grouped in a docu section right next to actual respected Docus by National geographic or BBC. Most all programming has the makers bias ingrained into the work. It is when the bias is calculated into the peice where we end up with something other than a documentary. To me that word means learning, facts, information all in one. To some it means truth.

[Mu-Meson]

Michael Moore is all the evidence you need on the corruption of the term 'Documentary'.

[Herrmannek]

That is my observation. People tend to grant credibility to that word for some reason. If you notice how such shows on the internet are grouped in a docu section right next to actual respected Docus by National geographic or BBC. Most all programming has the makers bias ingrained into the work. It is when the bias is calculated into the peice where we end up with something other than a documentary. To me that word means learning, facts, information all in one.

Oh now I understand. I agree. I'm really angry when I have to sort out through this bunch of homemade* crap on tv-links.co.uk to find something that can be really interesting...

[AlbertPike]

I've been collecting videos on this from both sides for quite some time now, listening to both sides of the story, and paying attention as to how they try to grab my attention, etc.
With a subject as huge and far reaching as this one, it would not help in any way if I sat here and bashed on the official story, or bashed on the Conspiracy Historians or the Conspiracy Theorists. All I would be doing it tossing around names and dates, and trying to convince people that are set in there believes religiously for what ever reason. Which isn't how things are supposed to work anyhow. No one needs to bully, anyone into anything. If something is honest and worth looking into, then it should be presented without dogma, so that the one investigating the material is not mentally, or emotionally manipulated before hand. It's supposed to be both an American and Christian value, not to mention a value which I'd say people world wide, with or without religion can relate to.

Anyhow, without further delay and meaningless talk, the links:

History Channel - The 911 Conspiracies:

http://www.torrentbox.com/torrent_details?id=125450

And two links from Alex Jones sites about the video.

http://prisonplanet.com/articles/august2007/020807hitpiece.htm

http://www.infowars.com/articles/sept11/history_channel_hit_piece_dirty_tricks_malicious_lies_journalistic_fraud.htm


911 Mysteries - Demolitions

http://torrentchannel.com/9-11/911-Mysteries_-_Demolitions_Part-1


PBS Nova - Why The Towers Fell

(Emule)



David Ray Griffin:
911 and the American Empire

http://torrentchannel.com/9-11/911_and_the_American_Empire_-_David_Ray_Griffin



CNN - America Remembers

(emule)


What a Blast (demolitions video)

(emule)

A Short History of Tall Buildings:


http://www.pirateuropa.com/details.php?id=192591


William Rodriguez - What Really Happened on 911?

(emule)

911 In Plane Site Director's Cut:

http://thepiratebay.org/tor/3518568/911_In_Plane_Site_Directors_Cut


Flight 91

http://www.torrentspy.com/torrent/725661/Flight_93_2006_DvDrip_AC3_Eng_aXXo


United 93

http://www.torrentz.com/1a0ae19db43fbd9b1cb1c24bbac3d5f057246281

National Geographic – Inside 911

http://www.mininova.org/tor/508192

http://www.mininova.org/tor/508194

The History channel commission report

(emule)



Use those noodles!!!

[shocker1]

It's supposed to be both an American and Christian value, not to mention a value which I'd say people world wide, with or without religion can relate to.
This coming from a member who calls himself Albret Pike? I wonder what your last username was?

[ginge51]

The sad part is that if you go to the twin towers cite in the city, you will see the 9/11 truth moonbats making good money selling their "truth about evil american empire" crap to tourists.
That is something iv`e been suprised by as it just weakens there effots to proove what there trying to say obviously as every1 will respond by "your just trying to make money out of this by selling the stuff your studying"
It just makes there arguments so much more weaker :(
If they were free maybe more people would listen.

[ginge51]

if people would act like adults and use intelligence the POPO could not arrest them
But if you do speak out against them what would happen there?
That`s like saying what bush said in his statement "Youre either with us or the enemy"
They don`t want any1 speaking out against them because "they" and only they are right nobody else is.

[shocker1]

But if you do speak out against them what would happen there?
That`s like saying what bush said in his statement "Youre either with us or the enemy"
They don`t want any1 speaking out against them because "they" and only they are right nobody else is.
If you are disturbing the peace speaking out against disturbing the peace. you will argue in the jail house. When protests do well here they are organized and do not break the law. It seems today most anti____ movements do neither when they protest. There is a difference between a protest and a disturbance. The people here are for the most part are down home types who have no desire to tolerate anarchy with a cause.

One example is Westboro Baptist church. they came here once. Waved signs for 15 min and had to flee the mob at the National Cemetery. We have had several fallen since then and not a peep from them here again. I am surprised they did not try to sue someone.

[AlbertPike]

shocker1: I'm impressed! Thank you for recognizing that he was an Evil Man. I just figured I would use it for a bit of irony, and to see who was familiar with unfamiliar history.

Nice avatar BTW!

[shocker1]

shocker1: I'm impressed! Thank you for recognizing that he was an Evil Man. I just figured I would use it for a bit of irony, and to see who was familiar with unfamiliar history.

Nice avatar BTW!
Why in the hell would you do such a thing? You could have tested peoples knowledge in other ways besides making your permanent user name that of a Satanist, racist and center piece of the Free Mason- Illuminati Rule By Secrecy conspiracy theories. You posted a balanced selection of 911 docus. Was this to divert attention from that Nut case Alex Jones's "documentaries" and the American Empire selection that you posted? Alex Jones alone shot your post to hell.

I do not ignore what people say and write. I know a bit about these theories and NWO conspiracies. Some aspects of globalization fit nicely into those lines of thinking.

Now if you tell me that government used the real terrorist attack on 911 to further a globalist agenda. Then I give that conspiracy theory some credibility. I am not a member of the sheep but I am also intelligent enough to know bull **** when I see it.

A good book for those who do not understand these ideas and conspiracies should read Rule By Secrecy by: Jim Marrs. I do not buy into all that crap but one must understand what is going on in order to debate. The best conspiracies are mixed with truth, while lies are the base for such thinking.

I will quote myself.

That is my observation. People tend to grant credibility to that word(documentaries) for some reason. If you notice how such shows on the internet are grouped in a docu section right next to actual respected Docus by National geographic or BBC. Most all programming has the makers bias ingrained into the work. It is when the bias is calculated into the peice where we end up with something other than a documentary. To me that word means learning, facts, information all in one. To some it means truth. 13 Hours Ago 04:52 PM

[-OceanKill-]

I just got done watching it a few minutes ago on Itunes(Downloaded and Converted it into Mpeg Format, Then threw it on my iPod)

It really was a good documentary, Its funny how Alex Jones keeps clinging on to his Wild Theory's and how he compared him self to Galileo Galilei rofl

I sent a long E mail to one of my teachers who keeps telling me and a group of kids how the Rothchilds and the Rockefellers and even Pakistan caused 9/11, He keeps claiming how he has studied these groups sense the 1980s or the 1990s:roll:

[Mastermind]

I saw the documentary on the History Channel and was quite impressed....and thankful. While I was watching, I was thinking after every logic nail was decisivly drivin into the conspiracy theory coffin...."Well, at last that's put to rest." After it was over, I realized, it would do no good....the agenda driven conspiracy people are very much like "Flat Earthers"...no amount of evidence, logic or demonstration of science will ever convince them to give up their "baby". Besides, it's not about 9/11 and buildings...it's all about hating Bush and America. The emotional argument can never be defeated by the logical argument. Insane people just don't work that way.

[seraosha]

I sent a long E mail to one of my teachers who keeps telling me and a group of kids how the Rothchilds and the Rockefellers and even Pakistan caused 9/11, He keeps claiming how he has studied these groups sense the 1980s or the 1990s:roll:

Any chance he used to teach philosophy at San Marcos Jr. College in the late 80's, early 90's? Saw the Cali loc., thought I'd ask.

[orange]

...
I sent a long E mail to one of my teachers who keeps telling me and a group of kids how the Rothchilds and the Rockefellers and even Pakistan caused 9/11, He keeps claiming how he has studied these groups sense the 1980s or the 1990s:roll:
I hate it when teachers teach their own ideas, views and agendas. I had a commie teacher back in highschool and she was a like sorta like your random troll in here. Her teachings were correct and that was that. To say the least, we got into a 'few' arguments.

[AlbertPike]

Why in the hell would you do such a thing? You could have tested peoples knowledge in other ways besides making your permanent user name that of a Satanist, racist and center piece of the Free Mason- Illuminati Rule By Secrecy conspiracy theories. You posted a balanced selection of 911 docus. Was this to divert attention from that Nut case Alex Jones's "documentaries" and the American Empire selection that you posted? Alex Jones alone shot your post to hell.

Actually I was supposed to have a silly avatar to go along with the name, but for some reason I can't get my avatar to upload. Just think "mellow mellow".

And why did I post a balanced selection of videos. Well why does one need silence when they golf? To concentrate, likewise in order to learn well, one must have acess to information from both sides of the road. It would not be fair if I just did a little interview with who ever, then cut out bits and pieces, then re-presented what they said to the audiance as if that is there feeling. That would be a bit un-fair and un-journalistic now would it not be? So the best choice is to show things un-cut, which is what the media NEEDS to do for the public, is make available on-line the full versions of the film they edit before putting on TV. You would think that's why they want Internet 2, so they can make information more readily available to an information starved public, but we know it is not so. And we know that in order to be complacent enough to enter a 1984 era, you got to be in a Brave New World era first.

And now a quote from everyone's favorite mad man, Adolf Hitler:

The people gaze fascinated at one or two familiar superficialities, such as possessions, income, rank and other outworn conceptions. As long as these are kept intact, they are quite satisfied. But in the meantime they have entered a new relation: a powerful social force has caught them up.


He's an idiot through and through, but he had a point, he made an observation that he was 100% correct about. What people allow themselves to be distracted, mezmorized, and bought out with is meaningless and without value or substance, and yet you can get them to do what ever you want them to as long as those things are in place. Just like Pavlo's dog, and I know that we are more than mere animals, more than organic "things" to be corrected by deadly perscription, so what is it about us that we allow things to get this far out of hand, that we do not control the state as the fore father said, that we sit around so complacent convinced that our faith is correct without ever challenging our faith with information, but rather shooting down the messenger bird, gotta keep things the same, predictable, snug, boring, dangerous.

[shocker1]

It is funny how you bring up 1984 when if one wants to watch those videos they can. Plenty of outlets for that type media. Your reference to Hitler and his words in comparison to some draconian Neocon/Bush media spin machine is plain ignorant. To tell you the truth I am pretty sick of Hitler references as they are the tail end of a weak argument. So you have covered all the Bases, 1984, Adolf Hitler and fascists in general. Anymore buzz words to trump up those theories?

So are you like devils advocate with AlbertPike and the UN/NWO avatar?

[AlbertPike]

Who said anything about NeoCons. I dont' believe "Neocon's" exsisted during Albert Pike's time and he has had a MAJOR influence over our world today, even more so than Hitler, and he is still a hero to some.

I think you are generlalizing with me? Perhaps you watched the History Channel's new video too many times? Trying to lump me into a catagory so I can be done with and put to the side and consider me a case closed? Seriosly man,"mellow mello"! :)

[shocker1]

Who said anything about NeoCons. I dont' believe "Neocon's" exsisted during Albert Pike's time and he has had a MAJOR influence over our world today, even more so than Hitler, and he is still a hero to some.

I think you are generlalizing with me? Perhaps you watched the History Channel's new video too many times? Trying to lump me into a catagory so I can be done with and put to the side and consider me a case closed? Seriosly man,"mellow mello"! :)
Look you lumped yourself in with you user name and 1st post. Neocons are the bad guys in a few of the videos you posted that support your 1984 theory and Albert pike reference. Yes Alex Jones blames Neocon's, so since you associated you theory in line with his well I call em like I see them. Neocons are compared to fascists in one of those videos so yes you deserve everything I said.

Good luck with it.

[AlbertPike]

:) Spoken like a true fascist.

[Beowulf]

:) Spoken like a true fascist.

I've given you a yellow card for flame bait because you're new.

Make sure that you read the posted forum rules.

[shocker1]

Look I do not want to end this in a negative way so. You make a valid point about the responsibility of being aware as a citizen of what is going on. However I totally disagree with the notion that the Bush Admin or any other government entity somehow manipulated 911 into taking place or using it to steal my freedoms. It is just not going on no matter how much flashy media material is produced.

[AlbertPike]

And I did not try to impose that belief upon you. Not once did I say a thing about the Bush Administration, let alone the Clinton Administration because if it were true, both parties would have to be equally guilty, but again I never said that, I just dropped in and shared a few links from both sides of the story since equal representation isn't something you find every day, ecspecially on those boxes we sit in front of all day in total faith that they will light the way.
Besides I know full well that our real problems are MUCH MUCH older than the Bush Family, and there ties with the Nazi's and so on and so forth. And ironically it is a problem that was never adressed to me in school even though Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, Lincoln, etc. Spent all of there lives battling just that. There letters and books are crammed full of discussion of our true problem, the true enemy. Who would know better than how to avoid slavery than slave owners themselves egh? ;)
Of course another good resource would be Lies My Teacher Told Me (author is a cool guy, my X met him actually and said he was this silly bearded mennonite guy), and of course A People's History of the United States, which is of course history as told from the point of view of the individuals, and not the state.

Anyhow, I've already got a drill sargent like PM from an admin about fighting in here, and I just wanted to say I wasn't trying to fight, I was just a smart ass because I wasn't fully sure that you were serious. See the forums I frequent we pretty much mess with new comers and stuff like that, but typically don't have any serious flame wars, so it's sometimes tricky to get used to the forums that are restrictive and flooded with rules and regulation.

No offence ment, but I still think your a fascist. ;) Joking.

[DeltaWhisky58]

AlbertPike - you had a warning from Beowulf, you also got one from me. You sent me a wise ass answer and posted the same here. Joking or not you just don't call a respected member a Fascist and get away with it.

I don't give a damn how you behave on other forums, you don't do it here. I suggest you take your views elsewhere.