Army's New Sniper Rifle

[Sand Man]

I hope it's not a repost...


Take a Look at the Army's New Sniper Rifle

By now it is well known that the U.S. Army established a need to standardize a sniper rifle in 7.62x51mm NATO caliber. This was necessary in order to field one such rifle for precision sniping and to replace the literal myriad of sniper rifles currently in the system. For the record, these sniper rifles include the venerable M14 semi-automatic rifle and the M24 Remington bolt action rifle, the Mk 11 and others, which have been purchased by individual SOCOM units.

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/9255/xm110nx2.jpg

In the wake of 9/11 and America's entry into the Global War On Terrorism (G-WOT), most of the remaining 40,000 M14 rifles in the U.S. military's inventory (mostly the U.S. Navy) have been taken out of storage in order to be re-built as precision semi-automatic rifles for sniping use. Many of these rifles that weren't destroyed during the Clinton Era were given to "friendly" countries and there has also begun a move to "buy" some of them back.

The M14's popularity as a sniper rifle dates back to its development as a National Match competition rifle during the 1960's, its evolution into the M21 Sniper Rifle used in the Vietnam War, and its evolution into the XM25 Sniper Rifle by the U.S. Army and Navy in the years that followed. Properly fitted, the M14 is capable of extremely good accuracy and is highly reliable, but it has had less than optimum results from being used with a sound suppressor. Still, the M14 has made the transition into a 21st Century Sniper Rifle as the DMR (Designated Marksman Rifle) by the United States Marine Corps and its more recent transformation by the U.S. Special Operations Command (USSOCOM).

Being a highly modified Model 700 Remington bolt-action repeating rifle, the M24 is capable of great precision accuracy. However, lessons were relearned in Somalia and in target-rich environments encountered in the G-WOT that a self-loading rifle can be fired in succession 4 to 5 times faster than a bolt action rifle. Thus, the Army was determined to standardize a semi-automatic sniper rifle.

The third rifle mentioned is the Mk 11, a refined version of the SR- 25 (Stoner Rifle-25) rifle, which is made by Knight's Armament Company, of Titusville, Florida. Like the others, the Mk 11 is chambered for the 7.6x51mm NATO cartridge, but it contains modifications dictated by the U.S. Navy SEALS, which is a member of the SOCOM. However, using the Mk 11 identified issues that the Army found desirable in an AR10-style sniper rifle...

LINK: http://www.defensetech.org/archives/003668.html

[n7sen]

Same thing?
http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/9484/mod0dl6.jpg

[Little J]

So where does the SCAR-Heavy fit into all this? Are they saying that the mk.11 is the new std, because the SCAR-H was designed to replace all 3 wasn't it?

[Kilkenny]

Same thing?
http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/9484/mod0dl6.jpg
Is this a .338 Lapua?

[Rakki]

Like the original Stoner-designed Armalite AR-10 rifle built by Armalite during the early 1950's and the AR- 15/M16, SR-25 and Mk 11 rifles that followed, the XM110 operates by direct gas instead of using a gas piston system.

Uh. Oh. not this again...

[alvarhanso]

"Is this a .338 Lapua?"

No, i believe it's 7.62x51...the 338 is a way to big of a round for this magazine on the rifle.
BTW, i don't think there's AR-10 version in 338 Lapua.

[H2O MAN]

The M14's popularity as a sniper rifle dates back to its development as a National Match competition rifle during the 1960's, its evolution into the M21 Sniper Rifle used in the Vietnam War, and its evolution into the XM25 Sniper Rifle by the U.S. Army and Navy in the years that followed. Properly fitted, the M14 is capable of extremely good accuracy and is highly reliable, but it has had less than optimum results from being used with a sound suppressor.

Me thinks they never tried the Crazy Horse SASS.

http://www.smithenterprise.com/images/Slide7-2.jpg

[Triggahappy13]

sorry to get off topic but is there a hi-res of above pic of those M14's?

[SMGLee]

Same thing?
http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/9484/mod0dl6.jpg

nope. that is not a KAC M110. I think that is one of those COTS that the military might have received in small qty.


So where does the SCAR-Heavy fit into all this? Are they saying that the mk.11 is the new std, because the SCAR-H was designed to replace all 3 wasn't it?


SCAR is a SOCOM only project, the M110 is intended to replace the M24 for the big green machine... or maybe its the big ACU machine nowadays.

Marine went with the upgraded MK11Mod1 which is the M110 upper mate to the MK11Mod0 lower



Me thinks they never tried the Crazy Horse SASS.

http://www.smithenterprise.com/images/Slide7-2.jpg

It might be accurate, but it does not provide the right capability as the current crop of SASS. and the M14 takes a long more maintenance then the M110 to remain accurate.

[H2O MAN]

the M14 takes a long more maintenance then the M110 to remain accurate.

Cleaning.
That's all it takes for the Crazy Horse to remain accurate, just periodic cleaning - less cleaning that the M110 requires.

[andreen]

Are they really thinking of replaceing the the standardize sniper rifle to a semi-automatic rifle, or are we talking about a DMR here?
I know that the semi-automatic mechanism have come a long way, but compared to bolt-action mechanism it's still a inaccurate mechanism.
I would not want to drag around a rifle with that meny moveable parts if I was a sniper in "mud-country" for 14 days waiting for the target, and then relying on it not to fail.

But then again I maybe old fashion.

[Ngati Tumatauenga]

The M110 doesn't have nearly the same accuracy as the M24 between 600-1000m.

Added to which when it heats up with sustained firing, more than four rounds a minute, it's grouping capacity expands exponentially.

The M110 is obviously effective in an urban environment where multiple targets need to be engaged but It's just not capable of replacing the M24 or any other bolt action across the spectrum of necessary capabilities.

[FROGFOOT-MKDN]

Little off topic:

Operational experience prompts rifle shoot-off reliability trials

A variety of specially selected assault rifles are competing against Colt Defense's M4 carbine in extreme dust environment tests in response to concerns over its reliability on operations in Afghanistan and Iraq. The tests, which starts on 21 August at the Aberdeen Proving Ground, Maryland, are aimed at recreating operational conditions where fine particles of sand can cause multiple weapon stoppages

[first posted to http://idr.janes.com - 14 August 2007]

[angry cow]

FN SCAR is a SOCOM-only project (for now at least.)

Experience has shown the need for rapid engagement of multiple targets. Enough so that snipers have been dragging M107's around Baghdad just for the semi-auto capability. Yeah I didn't believe it either, but they are, remember the video of the snipers slugging it out on Haifa street a few months back?

Let's evaluate the competition:
M14-based rifles - as mentioned by someone else, take a lot of maintenance to maintain accuracy, especially under frequent use.

M-24 - slight increase in accuracy, huge disadvantage in rate of fire. Right now ROF is more important. A soldier carrying an M-24 carries 3 weapons of 3 different calibers into the fight. M24, M4, and M9. This is a no-go. With the M110 he can carry just the rifle and his sidearm.

[BillySing]

M-24 - slight increase in accuracy, huge disadvantage in rate of fire. Right now ROF is more important. A soldier carrying an M-24 carries 3 weapons of 3 different calibers into the fight. M24, M4, and M9. This is a no-go. With the M110 he can carry just the rifle and his sidearm.

The m-24 has far more accuracy over that of a gas operated m-14. Not to say that the M-14 is an inaccurate firearm, I've got one myself (and it's the match version) But I can safely say that the accuracy of the M24 is far more consistent. After all, Accuracy is Consistency.

[Ngati Tumatauenga]

M-24 - slight increase in accuracy, huge disadvantage in rate of fire.

Versus M110, slight increase in accurate ROF, huge decrease in accuracy between 600 - 1000m



Right now ROF is more important.

Than accuracy?


The M110 is incapable of replacing the M24 capability for capability. It can certainly compliment the M24 and cover that platforms performance shortfalls but the M24 in turn makes up for what the M110 lacks.

[....]

I'll just throw this out there. I'm not in the position to know, but this isn't SOCNET and I'm not an airsofter. I don't think the army will every replace the m24 with the sr25 variant. I'm going to have to agree with angry cow, the SOCOM guys have had good luck with spr's, sr25/mk11's, and m14's. Even in the last few pics (sof), they've mostly had sr25/mk11's for this role.The army is just trying to give a weapon that everybody can work on, unlike the m14, it looks like an M16 family rifle, is semi-auto, and you can carry just the rifle and a handgun. Basically like the israelis, with dmr m16/m4's, sr25's, and m24's for long range precision shooting. This is just my idea, it's not worth anything.

[Hollis]

. . . . I don't agree with with angry cow ROF is everything. No one weapon does it all, no one soldier does it all. That is why there are weapons platoon, squad weapons etc. A soldier can only carry so much.

[....]

. . . . I don't agree with with angry cow ROF is everything. No one weapon does it all, no one soldier does it all. That is why there are weapons platoon, squad weapons etc. A soldier can only carry so much.

No, I agree, no weapon is perfect. I wouldn't want to engage bad guys in relatively close range with a scoped sr25/mk11 rifle. I think the army is just trying to fill the gap/void, and they see this as an option.

[ABNINF]

Here's what I predict happening. The Army switches over to the M110 for political and financial reasons, KAC and the US government have a comfortable relationship. M24's get placed back in the arms rooms, only to be drawn back out and refurbished, down the road, when it's decided that they're still needed. I'm with Ngati on this one. The M110 should complement, not replace the M24.

[jcareaga]

Same thing?
http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/9484/mod0dl6.jpg


That things a beast!

[....]

The M110 should complement, not replace the M24.

As a civilian observer I agree.I don't see basically an sr25 as a serious replacement for the m24, all I mean't is I think the army knows there's a need for something like it, the dmr m16's idea fell through, so this to them is the most realistic option.

[Ngati Tumatauenga]

The problem is that TACOM has apparently stated that the M110 will replace the M24.

[ABNINF]

No, I agree, no weapon is perfect. I wouldn't want to engage bad guys in relatively close range with a scoped sr25/mk11 rifle. I think the army is just trying to fill the gap/void, and they see this as an option.

Remember guys, the spotter is there to protect the sniper. Also, for mainstream units, the days of the lone sniper pair out in "indian country" are over. Sniper elements are 4+ now. 2 long riflemen for precision shots, with 2 riflemen/ DM/ spotters for faster aquistions provides a solid capability, or a sniper pair with a fireteam as security, either way, ROF is not an issue. Whoever is making this decision at the top is avoiding basic sniper doctrine. One of the main reasons snipers use a bolt gun is to avoid the tell-tale "flash" of a spent cartridge. This is just another case of the top brass "dictating" what is best for soldiers without listening to the actual soldiers that have to use the equipment.

[Rifleman]

The most recent issue of American Rifleman has a good article about the M14 and the challenges of keeping it in the field. The jest of it is, there is simply no supply/support available. They are doing buy backs from the civillian market for mags and parts....I encourage all to read the article.

[Hollis]

The most recent issue of American Rifleman has a good article about the M14 and the challenges of keeping it in the field. The jest of it is, there is simply no supply/support available. They are doing buy backs from the civillian market for mags and parts....I encourage all to read the article.


Thanks to the Clinton administration who had most if not all surplus M14 stuff destoryed.

. . . ., I agree that the Army is looking to plug a hole or find some better alternatives between the worlds of CQC and long range shooting in today's changing landscape.

[H2O MAN]

They are doing buy backs from the civillian market for mags and parts....I encourage all to read the article.

How old is the information in the article?
New USGI mags have been in production for over a year, new production gas cylinders are available and more new parts (bolts and op rods) are coming.

[....]

Remember guys, the spotter is there to protect the sniper. Also, for mainstream units, the days of the lone sniper pair out in "indian country" are over. Sniper elements are 4+ now. 2 long riflemen for precision shots, with 2 riflemen/ DM/ spotters for faster aquistions provides a solid capability, or a sniper pair with a fireteam as security, either way, ROF is not an issue. Whoever is making this decision at the top is avoiding basic sniper doctrine. One of the main reasons snipers use a bolt gun is to avoid the tell-tale "flash" of a spent cartridge. This is just another case of the top brass "dictating" what is best for soldiers without listening to the actual soldiers that have to use the equipment.

I understand. Even with a spotter+ a security element, it can get very dangerous I'm sure in places like iraq. I'm getting at that marine scout sniper+ security element that was taken out. I don't know the full circumstances, but in city fighting like Iraq, I'd feel more comfortable with something like a sr25 than a bolt gun. just me though.

[....]

The problem is that TACOM has apparently stated that the M110 will replace the M24.

Do you think there's any chance they may upgrade completely to .300 or .338 boltguns to fill the long range(m24) but still under 50 bmg void?

[andreen]

I think it's dangerous to let go of the capacity to make one shot one kill in the 600-1000 meter spectrum. Nobody knows where the next big conflict is gonna to be played out, not even the US.Army. It may be in the vast areas of the African landscape or in a jungle like the central america. Landscapes that both have seen the efficiency of a sniper team. The bolt-action rifle maybe not the ideal sniper rifle for Iraq and Urban fighting, but then standardize a DMR in 7,62 instead. And don't throw away a capability.

I also know that countries use their snipers different and this also affect their choice of rifles, and for that I will explain generally how our sniper teams works in a rifle platoon (Air Assault Inf). A platoon generally contain a command group two rifle groups and one support group. The two rifle groups and the support group all have one DM (skarkskytt) in their group. The command group don't have a DM but they have a two man sniper team. The team either works within the group as platoon fire support or is tasked by the platoon commander to recon ahead or take out enemy machine gun strong holds and enemy mortal crews. To aid the platoon in their fighting.

Sweden uses the Accuracy International L96A1 AW (Psg90) for this job.

[Death.]

From the article brought up about the lack of parts for M14s in service..might be 1 or 2 typos, did it quickly.

"Specialized M14s In Service Today"


...There is less sanguine aspect to the wide variations seen on M14s carried in the field. That is, there is essentially no support available through Department of Defense channels-no parts, accessories, magazines, tools or documentation beyond a new Preventive Maintenance Magazine comic book and 40-year-old manuals printed from on-line PDF files. The Army has made some efforts to buy back parts surplused decades ago, and to purchase new walnut stocks, for example. Most components, however, are either acquired by individuals using personal funds or by combat units directly from stateside sources or scavenged from cannibalized rifles. As one DoD official put it, "Better to ship M14s to troops asking for them than to leave rifles languishing in boxes on a shelf." While there are "Class A" M14s coming out of long-term storage complete with magazines, cleaning kits and slings, early on in the war M14s were being scavenged from wherever they could be found. In addition, 7.62mm ammunition for the M14 hasn't been packaged for many years. Thus, M14 users are forced to de-link M80 Ball from m240G belts to fill the magazine they get from their friends stateside. Further, current 7.62mm Ball is of only "machine-gun" quality; its lot-to-lot performance is all across the board. Good M118 match ammunition is highly prize, when it can be found.
That those who field the M14 are undeterred by all these obstacles to its use as a testament to how highly they value the M14 and its 7.62mm cartridge.

The experience of the troops with the M14 seems to fall into one or the other of two categories. For some, the M14 is a lengthy, unwieldy, heavy club unsuited for their style of motorized urban warfare. As one Air Assault trooper put, "With the full-length barrel, dismount is terrible." They find it much easier to maneuver an M4 inside a HMMWV, for example; the extra punch of the 7.62mm is unnecessary for room cleaning, they feel. However, even some of these soldiers admit they appreciate having an M14 in the HMMWV rifle rack for those times when they man a roadblock. When an M240 7.62 mm machine gun isn't available, they have found that the M14 is a far better tool than the M4 for stopping a car before it becomes a car bomb.

The other camp is populated by troops who have the need and ability to take full advantage of the M14. Whether it is on a rooftop overwatch, or punching through a wall to reach the insurgent hiding behind it, or reaching from ride to ride across a mountain valley, the range and power of the M14 are deeply appreciated fully 50 years after the rifle's initial adoption.

- Page 76, American Rifleman September 2007

I can type out the entire article if people are interested..it's a good read.

[deagle]

the m14 has still proven to be an excellent rifle, and we're proud that it can rifle the infamous ak47 as well. of course it has its draw-backs, like anything else, but i'm glad to hear it is still servicable.

from what i'm hearing its still effective, but has room for improvement.

*HINT HINT to DOD*

it would be interesting to get input directly from the troops to make the necessary improvements to improve fighting ability and effectiveness. they already have the supply and if not, it can give new meaning to "made in the USA", infecting funds within the nation too boot by contracting within. it'll save $ on costly experimental and development projects as well (comanche anyone, lol).

[Rifleman]

Nice Avatar D3eath and thx for posting the article.

Someone asked how recent the supply problems are, they are ongoing. Hollis hit on part of the problem, but another cause of the shortage is that the government sells surplus to the private sector to cut warehousing cost with the idea that in time of need it can be bought back, at an inflated cost. But, we are told that this is still cheaper than keeping it in storage.

Should have never closed the Springfield Armory, IMO, but then again, I think BLO smells soooo good.

[SMGLee]

I am not sure what is all the hoopla about rather M110 should replace the M24, this is already happened, US Army has select the contract winner of the SASS competition and the replacement to the M24 is the M110 by KAC. A big congrats to Lt Col Daivd Lutz(retired) for winning this project for KAC.

I have seen the M110 in action at the KAC range and also else where. out to 500m, I can say for sure that M110 is every bit as accurate as a bolt gun such as the M24. I have not seen any thing further then 500m. but the group are actually superior at 500m with the M110 then the M24. the M24's life cycleis unknown, so I can not atest to the condition of the barrel and other components.

Special operations and other specialized sniper units will always have specialize weapon, such as bolt gun in the role which requires a bolt action rifle, but in the end, US Army will go ahead and replace the M24 and the M110 seems to be the next step in the ever revolving battlefield.

[Rakki]

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/armytrng/a/sniperschool.htm


According to the U.S. Army, the average soldier will hit a man-sized target 10 percent of the time at 300 meters using the M16A2 rifle. Graduates of the U.S. Army sniper school are expected to achieve 90 percent first-round hits at 600 meters, using the M24 Sniper Weapon System (SWS).

The Marine snipers are of course trained to get first-round hits on targets at 1000 yards - and presumably special forces have their own standards. However, for the Army in general, if 600m is what they are aiming for, then a semi-auto that gives good accuracy at 500m (and up to 600m) is certainly tactically more flexible than a bolt-action M24.

[akmarksman]

fack..just give everyone in the DMR/scout sniper team a M82/M107..either standard length or the new shorter version..suppressed or not..
forget about all this political crap..just give them good mags,a good scope and some decent ammo..for the fun times..APIT..for when accuracy counts..Match grade..
handgun?..give them a Glock or a HK..have the unit "de-mil" the M9..and say it was an IED or some bupkis..

[maw]

I have seen the M110 in action at the KAC range and also else where. out to 500m, I can say for sure that M110 is every bit as accurate as a bolt gun such as the M24. I have not seen any thing further then 500m. but the group are actually superior at 500m with the M110 then the M24.

i've fired both (m24 and mk11). a lot (run a search). at 100 yards the difference is negligible. at 300 yards the m24 has better accuracy. this trend continues the further out you go. getting rid of the kac 2 stage trigger on the mk11 helped some and replacing the leupold for some better optics helped too (mob six replaced the glass on their mk11's and always carried a spare bolt and extractor). but apples to apples when you upgrade the 700 platform with a match trigger etc you get similar improvements. i've seen a fully pimped mk11 with a upgraded trigger and a big nightforce on top give pretty consistent 1" groups at 300 yards, bone stock out of the caase from kac they vary but will all be under 1 moa. a fully pimped 700 (gap scle out of the box) with equivalent glass, with the right load will consistently give you .5" at 300 yards. do the math.

kac's relationship with dod is incestuous. i suppose it's just like it is with other defense contractors. sr-25's are decent guns but the bolts run very hot after extended shooting and after a while things start getting loose inside and start rattling around. as i recall the fm says not to shoot more than 20 rounds a day! they are maintenance intensive.

there are better solutions out there.

[SMGLee]

there are better solutions out there.

There is always better, but KAC does have the manufacturing capability to supply the armed forces with alrge qty of M110 as it is slowly replacing the M24.

I have seen the Mk11 and M110 side by side, pretty similar but seen like the newer M110 shot better, of course, the Mk11 was a older gun but it had Giselle trigger and NF optics.

[Ravage]

How does a match trigger improve accuracy ? And why does the Leupold scope need replacing ? (no sniper here, just asking)

[Ravage]

supply the armed forces with alrge qty of M110 as it is slowly replacing the M24.

Nagi already wrote that the M110 is not to replace the bolt-action rifles - or is it ? replace a bolt action with a semi auto ?

[maw]

There is always better, but KAC does have the manufacturing capability to supply the armed forces with alrge qty of M110 as it is slowly replacing the M24.

i've heard that point made before. i suppose it's better than awarding the contract to the lowest bidder. but arguing that manufacturing capacity as the exclusive basis for awarding the contract to kac doesn't fly in my book. remington was willing to pony up with large scale production with the dpms gun, which imho shoots just as well. but did you see the unit price vs. kac? forget the nvg, the can, the case etc. just the rifle was almost half the price. makes you wonder... hence my comment regarding the incestuous nature of dod budget spending.


Giselle trigger and NF optics.
giselle's are very nice. and they seem to run. on the other side i've seen a bunch of timney's fail.

Chen - you're a good guy and i always enjoy your posts, be there here or elsewhere. we've invariably had different experiences and may have subsequently formed different opinions, i just don't want to come across as disagreeing with for the sake of being a ****.

[maw]

How does a match trigger improve accuracy ? And why does the Leupold scope need replacing ? (no sniper here, just asking)

improved ergos and consistency through adjustable trigger weight, adjustable travel, adjustable reset position and a precise break point that feels like a thin glass rod snapping. great for putting holes in paper but not necessarily reliable to take into the suck with dust and **** everywhere.

leupold make good optics. the big nf/s&b/uso scopes primarily offer higher magnification. they also have marginally better glass which allows you to read mirage further out. some of the higher end scopes offer specialized reticles and windage enhancements such as the horus chrismas tree on some of the nf scopes and the EREK knobs on the uso's. this is a lengthy topic on its own and i could go on, but i only have a few minutes and it was look at some **** (j/k) or take a gander over at mp.net...

when the cool kids received their mk11's, the first thing they replaced was the charging handle and the glass. they messed around with the trigger but choose to go with reliability and stuck with with the factory 2 stage.

[Sand Man]

I have seen the Mk11 and M110 side by side, pretty similar but seen like the newer M110 shot better, of course, the Mk11 was a older gun but it had Giselle trigger and NF optics.

Are the triggers on the KAC M110 the ones termed as "2-stage" triggers?

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=72500


http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/2396/308pouch20ex4.jpg

[Ravage]

I've read about the horus chrismas tree reticle, but never read an actual opinion. Thanks maw :hug:

How does the trigger weight/force with which You pull the trigger effect the accuracy of the shot ?

[maw]

I've read about the horus chrismas tree reticle, but never read an actual opinion. Thanks maw :hug:

How does the trigger weight/force with which You pull the trigger effect the accuracy of the shot ?

i messed around with the horus but found it personally to be too busy. it was great for acquiring range very quickly (much faster than mil dots). imho, if you needed a reticle to range multiple targets at multiple distances (under 800 yards) quickly it was a good idea. good choice for a dmr or even this sr-25 we're talking about here. at longer range the reticle became annoying.

a good trigger reduces the brain/machine (in this case a rifle) interface so that the process of firing a shot becomes a reflex caused by a thought. i really don't know how to explain it any better, but after a lot of shooting trigger control becomes subconscious because of muscle memory. eventually you combine it with a constant breathing cycle and the entire cycle becomes automatic and firing becomes an extension of your thought process. ymmv.

[gilgoul]

That is "funny", in Israel, the doctrine was for years to equip "snipers" with galatz (sniper galil in 7,62) and M21, relegating the bolt actions (there were old mauser and enfields, and a few high end modern rifles) to highly specialized jobs.
Then, HQ recognized the need to revert the policy and both renewed long range training as well as procured M24 in quantities.
I'm no sniper, and can hardly fathom the difficulty of the job (I only shot FRF2 and Barret) but I would be kind of worried by this development.

[PvtPyle]

ARSOF is not dumping the M24, they are being upgraded to the M24A2. New bbl, Ops Inc can and detachable mags. ARSOF is also getting the MK13 and MK15 as another bolt action precision rifle.

The MK11 has so far recieved negative reviews from several Groups and the USMC. We took 12 of them to Afghanistan and within 90 days 8 of them were down. We have received a new issue and there are already some reliability and accuracy problems. QC has been hit and miss at best.

And to say they relationship between Knight and the DOD is incestuous is being generous. Ask Crane.......

[Herrmannek]

My civilian thinking is that for ranges well above 600metres and really valuable targets guys should use some spikes or javelin, or hellfire from drone... for front line sniping job one shot one kill at super far distances wasn't that important, although I repeat that after German WWII snipers you can read about in history and tactics section of the forum, they said ROF wasn't that important either but if this is what USA wants... As for ejected case give away I'm curious if said rifles have any gas disconnector...

[SMGLee]

Ask Crane.......


LOL......I am speechless.

Hey.. I think i am going to visit Ohio and then Salt lake or vise versa in the next month.. I am gonna give you a shout when i am in the area.

[Ravage]

ARSOF is also getting the MK13 and MK15 as another bolt action precision rifle.


What is the Mk13 and Mk15 ? any pics ?

[Kocur]

sr-25's are decent guns but the bolts run very hot after extended shooting and after a while things start getting loose inside and start rattling around. as i recall the fm says not to shoot more than 20 rounds a day! they are maintenance intensive.


Wait a minute... "FM" like official US Army Field Manual? And TWENTY rounds A DAY? :cantbeli:

[PvtPyle]

Hell yeah man! Drop by we will go shoot some machineguns! It will be great to see you again. PM me and lets set it up!

[hejab99]

Our designated marksman carried the M14 during our OIF III deployment--I think the last time it was out of the vault before that was Vietnam.

[Sand Man]

Video: Aberdeen Outtakes: The M110 Sniper Rifle (http://www.defensetech.org/archives/003822.html)

[REMOV]

BTW - is the (X)M110 SASS sniper rifle officially adopted (i.e. when the "X" letter was removed from a name)?

[8thidpathfinderpower]

Personaly, I still do not seewhat the hoopla is about concerning the M110 SASS. Accuracy wise, I am no sniper, but I bet it is every bit as accurate as the M24 out to the ranges the Army says it is.

[HK in AK]

Here is my package. 24 inch bull barrel with threaded end for supressor. Configured with Michulek break. Smooth shooting rifle and very accurate either cold bore or all warmed up.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2353/1883991430_8f5e9ebd19_b.jpg

[EIREGOBRACH]

A very impressive looking weapon!

[JC0352]

What is the difference between the army's M110 and the Marine Corps' Mk 11? besides optics of course...

Also, I noticed that II MEF is acquiring its own version of the Mk 12 SPR. Fielding this new weapon seems like a waste of time and money since they could just order more SAM-R's. It seems the only difference is the SPR's ability to accept a suppressor and the front sight is located on the RAS instead of the gas block. Except for that, same optics, same KAC free float RAS, match trigger and barrel... Any thoughts?

[Roy Batty]

Out of my lane here but if you, as the origional article stated , were planning to replace 3 rifles with 1 why choose 7.62 over some of the "newer" sniper rounds (such as .338 Llapua)?

Also I'm interested to know if the US has a dedicated but seperate long range system and medium range system as the CF does?

[SMGLee]

What is the difference between the army's M110 and the Marine Corps' Mk 11? besides optics of course...

Also, I noticed that II MEF is acquiring its own version of the Mk 12 SPR. Fielding this new weapon seems like a waste of time and money since they could just order more SAM-R's. It seems the only difference is the SPR's ability to accept a suppressor and the front sight is located on the RAS instead of the gas block. Except for that, same optics, same KAC free float RAS, match trigger and barrel... Any thoughts?


SGT,

the Marine's MK11 is the MOD1 version. which is exact like the M110 except for the adjustable stock and a lot less accessories that is supposed to be packaged in the storm case.

[JC0352]

It's crazy how US military weapons have evolved since GWOT started.

[HK in AK]

Out of my lane here but if you, as the origional article stated , were planning to replace 3 rifles with 1 why choose 7.62 over some of the "newer" sniper rounds (such as .338 Llapua)?

Also I'm interested to know if the US has a dedicated but seperate long range system and medium range system as the CF does?

I know that there have been discussed the use of the 408 cheyenne tactical which I started using almost 5 years ago. It is incredible how accurate that rifle can be.

[Roy Batty]

I know that there have been discussed the use of the 408 cheyenne tactical which I started using almost 5 years ago. It is incredible how accurate that rifle can be.

That's why I was asking. I know that the .338 Llapua lileratly (no pun intended) blew away the competition for the CF MRWS.

[Bulletproof]

Another argument the army put on the table, was the M110 could help to conceal the identity of a sniper in his platoon, since the M110 look like a M16 and therefor avoid to be the prime target of insurgents.

[KBar666]

I have seen the Mk11 and M110 side by side, pretty similar but seen like the newer M110 shot better, of course, the Mk11 was a older gun but it had Giselle trigger and NF optics.[/quote]

The MK11/SR-25 and M110 are in fact one in the same,in fact u can find a close of the left side of the Magazine well om an M110 it says SR-25,thats because SR-25 is actuly the civilian name from the manufacturer,Knights Armament.(yes for a pretty penny you ca actuly buy your own.)

The only reason it shot was most likely do to age of the MK11.