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n.ignomo
05-14-2004, 07:27 AM
Don't flame that one please !



Documents Show U.S. Relationship With Nazis During Cold War
By ELIZABETH OLSON

Published: May 14, 2004


ASHINGTON, May 13 - The American government worked closely with Nazi war criminals and collaborators, allowing many of them to live in the United States after World War II, and paying others who worked for West Germany's secret service, according to declassified documents from the F.B.I., C.I.A. and other intelligence agencies released Thursday.

The disclosures came as part of a project to place more than eight million government documents in the public domain, under legislation passed by Congress in 1998 to create the Nazi War Crimes and Japanese Imperial Government Records Interagency Working Group, or I.W.G.

"Although we have long known the outlines of the U.S. government's covert dealings with Nazi war criminals, the full scope of these relationships has never been fully documented or revealed," said Elizabeth Holtzman, a member of the working group and a former congresswoman from New York. "Until the work of the I.W.G., these relationships remained one of the great post-World War II secrets."

The 240,000 pages released Thursday reveal a pattern of American cooperation with questionable people who were protected on the grounds that they had valuable intelligence to offer during the cold-war period.

It was not that such collaborators fell through the bureaucratic cracks and were overlooked by the Immigration and Naturalization Service, said Norman J. W. Goda, an Ohio University history professor whose examination of the material is included in the book, "U.S. Intelligence and the Nazis," that the working group released Thursday.

"We had assumed that the I.N.S. dropped the ball, making only perfunctory background checks on these people," Mr. Goda said. "But the records show that immigration officials did investigate and tried to have these people deported."

"The problem," he said, "was that there were preferences in the C.I.A. and the F.B.I.," particularly of J. Edgar Hoover, the F.B.I. director, "to keep these people in the country so they could report on any Communist trends inside their own community."

Ultimately, Mr. Goda concluded, "such men added nothing except grist for the mill for their own propaganda."

Mr. Goda and other historians who studied the documents said that at least five associates of the Nazi leader Adolf Eichmann, each of whom had a significant role in Hitler's campaign to kill Jews, had worked for the C.I.A. The records also indicate that the C.I.A. tried to recruit another two dozen war criminals or Nazi collaborators. Some of them received employment and, in two cases, United States citizenship, according to the documents. The documents did not deal with those people who concealed their Nazi pasts in order to gain entry into the United States.

Also, several dozen people with criminal or dubious backgrounds were paid by the United States while they were employed by West Germany's secret service.

Timothy J. Naftali, an intelligence historian at the University of Virginia who examined the documents and also wrote chapters in the I.W.G. book, said: "We had no policies for helping Gestapo members, no disqualifiers unless the public knew about the crimes. It was kind of a 'don't ask, don't tell' culture."

The Interagency Working Group's mandate to examine declassified intelligence documents has been extended by one year, and its staff members said there would be a report in 2005 about activities in Asia and a final report later to summarize the group's findings.








By ELAINE SCIOLINO

Published: May 14, 2004



PARIS, May 13 — President Jacques Chirac of France and Chancellor Gerhard Schröder of Germany on Thursday criticized the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by American soldiers and expressed horror over the beheading of an American civilian.

Their comments, made to reporters after a meeting at Élysée Palace, coincided with a statement by France's new foreign minister, Michel Barnier, that France would never send troops to Iraq, not even as part of a peacekeeping force.
"It is out of the question," Mr. Barnier said in an interview published Thursday in Le Monde. "There will be no French soldiers in Iraq, not now and not later."

A senior aide to Mr. Chirac, asked about Mr. Barnier's declaration, said Mr. Chirac did not want the United States to think there was any possibility French troops would go to Iraq, even if the United Nations Security Council adopted a resolution endorsing the transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi people on June 30.

Both France and Germany opposed the United States-led war in Iraq and refused to contribute troops to the multinational occupation force there. Mr. Bernier's statement was the clearest articulation of France's opposition as well to providing troops to any peacekeeping force after the restoration of Iraqi sovereignty.

Although Mr. Barnier did not directly blame the United States for the violence raging throughout the Middle East, he described it in stark language unusual in diplomacy and in contradiction to optimistic predictions by the Bush administration that eventually the situation will improve.

"We must get out of this black hole that is sucking up the Middle East and, beyond that, the world," Mr. Barnier said in the interview in Le Monde. "What shocks me is the spiral of horror, the blood, the inhumanity that we see now on all fronts, from Falluja to Gaza, and in the terrible images of the assassination of this unfortunate American hostage. All of this gives the impression of a total loss of balance."

The deterioration in occupied Iraq combined with President Bush's support for Prime Minister Ariel Sharon of Israel's plans for a withdrawal from Gaza, has frustrated some European governments and made them less inclined than they might have been to help the United States in its efforts to stabilize Iraq. The revelations of abuse of Iraqi prisoners by American soldiers have worsened the atmosphere.

Asked about the photographs and stories of abuse by Americans against Iraqis, Mr. Chirac said: "We thought that those days were over, and that international obligations were now recognized and applied by everyone." He added, however, "Our American friends condemned these acts and have launched proceedings to punish those responsible."

Mr. Schröder also denounced the abuse of prisoners, but he commended the Bush administration's response, saying, "It speaks for the strength of American democracy how they have immediately started getting to the bottom of this."

The German chancellor was in Paris with most of his cabinet for the third in a series of meetings this year to mark the 40th anniversary of the signing of the Élysée Treaty, a friendship and reconciliation pact.

At their joint news conference, Mr. Chirac and Mr. Schröder said they were horrified by the gruesome beheading of Nicholas E. Berg, a 26-year-old businessman from Pennsylvania, by Islamic terrorists.

Mr. Chirac expressed "horror and indignation" over a killing he said was carried out "in conditions that were unimaginable in their barbarity." For his part, Mr. Schröder said, "Nothing can ever excuse such acts."

They also declared their commitment to work together to produce a Security Council resolution supporting the transfer of sovereignty to the Iraqi people.

Both France and Germany have expressed their determination that the transfer of sovereignty in Iraq be genuine, and in their meeting on Thursday the two leaders voiced concern that the United States intended to keep real power and influence all important decisions in Iraq even after June 30, a senior French official said.

Under present plans, after the transfer of sovereignty Iraq will be administered by an interim government until national elections can be in January.

In his interview, Mr. Barnier pushed a proposal by France and Russia calling for an international conference on Iraq, with the support of the United Nations and countries in the region, to help create the caretaker government. But he conceded that France had not yet persuaded the United States to go along.

"The real question is whether they are now ready to reach conclusions about the deterioration of the situation by accepting an authentic transfer of sovereignty," he said.

The categorical refusal by France to send troops to Iraq under any circumstances follows a declaration in an interview last week by Spain's new prime minister, José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero, that he would never send Spanish soldiers back to Iraq, even under the authority of the United Nations or NATO.

Mr. Zapatero incurred the wrath of the Bush administration when he fulfilled a campaign promise and ordered Spanish troops out of Iraq as one of his first acts after taking office last month.

catdat
05-14-2004, 07:50 AM
n.ignomo

The US involvement with Nazis Scientists and Spies has been well documented before. Try a google search for "OPERATION PAPERCLIP".
None of this is surprising. Where did Werner Von Braun come from? Why do you suppose the US would have any interest in Otto Skorzny? That they release documents at all is a testament to our democracy.

As far as Germany and France are concerned, Americans could really give two sh#ts about their intentions. France was a major player financing Saddam and wants it's blood money (2B?) paid back. They can rot in hell. They insult the thousands of Americans still alive who remember storming ashore in Normandy to liberate them from Germany. Strange bedfellows now huh?

mack pl
05-14-2004, 07:53 AM
Otto Skorzenny

n.ignomo
05-14-2004, 07:58 AM
Yesterday i met an american teacher which hated that kind of arguement. You can't always talk about Normandie. If now or anytime US were invaded, we would come and help you in a flash. In Irak you weren't defending youself -except of course anti-terrorism arguement. By the way why don't british, canadians, new zealanders of the 50 others countries in Irak didn't used that same arguement ? They landed in Normandie too.

Thx for telling me

Gringo
05-14-2004, 08:10 AM
Dr Strangelove.

"Mein Fuhrer! I mean Mr President"

"Mein Fuhrer! I can walk!!!" then the whole world goes kablooom :) :lol: