Who owns you Americans?

[maundy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KVTfcAyYGg

[unclechuckles]

I'm owned by internet explorer?

[Andreas]

Who owns Norway? Before it was Denmark and Sweeden but now I think we own ourselves... Or maybe its RUSSIA!!1!111!!!?

[Abbadon the Despoiler]

Who owns Norway? Before it was Denmark and Sweeden but now I think we own ourselves... Or maybe its RUSSIA!!1!111!!!?

haha.
6+9

[Shellshock1918]

Carlin is 100% correct. But this needs to be in the political section.

[LMAV]

LOL, coming from a guy who makes his money thanks to these people.

[Evolv5]

Support Firefox! No, but what he said is quite true, or, it seems true, from an European point-of-view that is.

[Macs.]

Support Firefox! No, but what he said is quite true, or, it seems true, from an European point-of-view that is.

George Carlin is a US-American, and the video was made by... a US-American. :roll:

[Evolv5]

George Carlin is a US-American, and the video was made by... a US-American. :roll:
No, what I mean is, I think it seems true, but I'd prefer to hear some Americans reply to it with their thoughts.

[SBL]

That's kind of how it works out in every society isn't it? You have a ruling class and then you have everyone else.

[shocker1]

You can deny it all you want but what he said is the truth. It is a club and they think you are dumb. Sad truth is most people are willingly dumb.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8JY_lFZjDc

[SBL]

You can deny it all you want but what he said is the truth. It is a club and they think you are dumb. Sad truth is most people are willingly dumb.


I'm not saying that what he said wasn't true, or that I even disagree. All I'm saying is that it's an inevitability of sorts.

[shocker1]

Oh I was not directing that at you.

[SBL]

^Gotcha.

-edit-
If anyone is interested on the subject, I'd recommend this book. My Dad loaned it to me one year and it's very interesting stuff. I'm no conspiracy theorist, but it certainly makes you think about things from another perspective.
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i228/Captainbadd/book-the-creature.jpg

[ESOGSteel]

Support Firefox! No, but what he said is quite true, or, it seems true, from an European point-of-view that is.

I like George Carlin, I think he is funny and I think he truly doesn't give a **** what people think about him or what he says. However, I do not believe that America is owned by corporations or that "the man" is out to get me. I do not believe that corporations dictate through their pockets what America truly is at it's core. I don't disagree that occasionally a corporation will get it's own way, but this does not happen day-in and day-out.

The truth of the matter is we Americans live in a free country and this video is proof of that. Just because we (or George Carlin) can say it does not mean it is the truth or what the majority thinks is right. George Carlin is merely speaking what he believes to be the truth and although there are Americans that will agree with him the majority of the people (I know) would not agree that we are owned by large corporations.

[ESOGSteel]

You can deny it all you want but what he said is the truth. It is a club and they think you are dumb. Sad truth is most people are willingly dumb.

So, if someone's opinion differs from yours (on this matter or any other) then they are dumb? Is that really what you are saying?

[Shellshock1918]

That's kind of how it works out in every society isn't it? You have a ruling class and then you have everyone else.
Maybe in Europe it is. But in the United States our Constitution puts limits on the government, it is not government putting limits on people. When we circumvent or ignore the Constitution we put ourselves in these situations. When we allow a private banking cartel, the Federal Reserve, to control our money and devalue it all while letting the federal government run education, health care and try to secure us. Its not working and it is destroying our Republic.

[shocker1]

The Federal reserve is a Private institution of international bankers. Loaning our own money to us at interest, that interest on the national debt is paid by you with the money they loaned you. So who owns you? Who keeps lowering interest rates even while the dollar is tanking to record levels? So tell me who owns you?

Dumb as in ignorant of the real power behind western governments.

[ESOGSteel]

The Federal reserve is a Private institution of international bankers. Loaning our own money to us at interest, that interest on the national debt is paid by you with the money they loaned you. So who owns you? Who keeps lowering interest rates even while the dollar is tanking to record levels? So tell me who owns you?

Dumb as in ignorant of the real power behind western governments.

Ah yes, ignorant because they don't believe what you believe.

Oh wise and all knowing shocker1 please tell me what the truth is so I can go forth and beat it into the heads of the ignorant, or the people who don't believe what you say is the truth. Hey, do you think I should use a really big gun and shove it in their face while I'm yelling at them to believe what I say is the truth? or should I use a really big stick?

You lack an open mind but it's not your fault, right? It's the governments fault, or maybe it's the Catholic Church? who knows.

[SBL]

When we allow a private banking cartel, the Federal Reserve, to control our money and devalue it all while letting the federal government run education, health care and try to secure us. Its not working and it is destroying our Republic.

The Fed has always controlled our money, in fact, they own it. At least it has since 1913 or so.

[shocker1]

Ah yes, ignorant because they don't believe what you believe.

Oh wise and all knowing shocker1 please tell me what the truth is so I can go forth and beat it into the heads of the ignorant, or the people who don't believe what you say is the truth. Hey, do you think I should use a really big gun and shove it in their face while I'm yelling at them to believe what I say is the truth? or should I use a really big stick?

You lack an open mind but it's not your fault, right? It's the governments fault, or maybe it's the Catholic Church? who knows.
You sir have the closed mind and using smart ass posts will not help. You are not worthy of my attention.

[ESOGSteel]

You sir have the closed mind and using smart ass posts will not help. You are not worthy of my attention.

How convenient for you to use my argument against me and then sweep my opinion under your high-and-mighty rug. You go run and hide now behind your "All my opinions are the only right ones" banner.

[clean]

How convenient for you to use my argument against me and then sweep my opinion under your high-and-mighty rug. You go run and hide now behind your "All my opinions are the only right ones" banner.

Shocker's laying out a rational thoughtful argument. And you're being a reactionary, sarcastic idiot. Why? Do you have a thought on this subject, a motive you want to share, or are you just flaming?

[Laworkerbee]

I was expecting a video of my girlfriend bitching at me to take out the garbage.

[Red]

The Federal reserve is a Private institution of international bankers. Loaning our own money to us at interest, that interest on the national debt is paid by you with the money they loaned you. So who owns you? Who keeps lowering interest rates even while the dollar is tanking to record levels? So tell me who owns you?

Dumb as in ignorant of the real power behind western governments.

Droping some knowledge on us Shocker. Debt makes the world go round p-)

[SBL]

How convenient for you to use my argument against me and then sweep my opinion under your high-and-mighty rug. You go run and hide now behind your "All my opinions are the only right ones" banner.

Look, the evidence is out there and being that we live in a free country, you're free to investigate it as much as you like. You don't have to believe anything just because somebody on here says so, but you're certainly not doing yourself any favors by choosing to stay in the dark.

[ESOGSteel]

Look, the evidence is out there and being that we live in a free country, you're free to investigate it as much as you like. You don't have to believe anything just because somebody on here says so, but you're certainly not doing yourself any favors by choosing to stay in the dark.

Oh boy! Listen shocker1 clearly stated that any other opinion on the matter was "ignorant of the real power behind western governments" I fail to see how that is being open minded.

Are you suggesting that I have not investigated the evidence on this subject?

Are you suggesting that I have not stated my opinion on this subject?

[shocker1]

I never said my opinion is right. My research into this area show that the old money elites manipulate elections, wars, education and media. Research will show you how the same bankers funded both sides of both world wars. The Central Bank Idea is something our founding fathers fought tooth and nail to stop. Thomas Jefferson was one who said those that control a governments money control the government. They were very aware of the European Bankers and their goal of a global system of money control.

Call it tin foil hat material or whatever but all the information to back up my claims and more are all over the mainstream news. there was a time when the NWO was some conspiracy nuts wet dream. Now people like Bush Sr and Jr talk openly of a NWO and Gary Hart just the other day. So if you want to ignore the erosion of the power of the people in this country that is fine. One should consider though these billionaire control freaks do not want more money. They want power they have all the money they want. I am not going to supply you with revelations and insights to change your mind. You will have to honestly look into how the geopolitical power system works and decide for yourself.

[ESOGSteel]

I never said my opinion is right. My research into this area show that the old money elites manipulate elections, wars, education and media. Research will show you how the same bankers funded both sides of both world wars. The Central Bank Idea is something our founding fathers fought tooth and nail to stop. Thomas Jefferson was one who said those that control a governments money control the government. They were very aware of the European Bankers and their goal of a global system of money control.

Call it tin foil hat material or whatever but all the information to back up my claims and more are all over the mainstream news. there was a time when the NWO was some conspiracy nuts wet dream. Now people like Bush Sr and Jr talk openly of a NWO and Gary Hart just the other day. So if you want to ignore the erosion of the power of the people in this country that is fine. One should consider though these billionaire control freaks do not want more money. They want power they have all the money they want. I am not going to supply you with revelations and insights to change your mind. You will have to honestly look into how the geopolitical power system works and decide for yourself.

which I have and my opinion differs from yours, which makes me ignorant towards the real truth?

[shocker1]

which I have and my opinion differs from yours, which makes me ignorant towards the real truth?
If you have really came to your individual opinion by honestly looking into it and came to that conclusion then that is fine. So in your opinion private bankers setting money supply for a nation does not control the nation? In this last credit crisis the Feds printed lots of cheap money.Which influenced the national banks to loan money to less worthy people at variable rates. Then the FED closes down that money tree and raises rates causing hundreds of thousands to loose their homes. Then the Congress debates a bail out of these half assed mortgage lenders. Who controls you?
I am sick of it so I have been buying gold for the past 10 years instead of an IRA, pension or 401K. I bought most of mine when it was under$400, when the dollar tanks further still and gold hits$1000 you will wish you had done as I. I find it very telling how FDR signed an order making it illegal for the private citizen to hold gold bullion in the 30's. Or how the FED act in 1913 was passed to stop wild economic fluctuations that were caused by the bankers themselves. Then the FED killed the money supply in 1929, all the big wheels were cash heavy and they sat back watched everything tank. Then bought up property and businesses for pennies on the dollar. That is what went on.

[AZRON]

My politics is quite different than Carlin's , I'm more of a right centrist and he is quite left of center.

But what he says isn't totally false. As elections get more and more expensive large corporations are going to be asked to contibute more and more. These corporations will include those leaning left on issues and those leaning right , generally one issue specific. If you think these corps. don't want a return on their investment to enhance their bottomline you live in Disney World.
Lawyers want laws passed it's their income stream , support the Dems.
Corporations want less regulation , support the GOP.
Many businesses support both sides or play the best chance winner.
Wall Street is throwing money at Hillary , Hillary proposes $5000 per kid 401k type Fed. program----- duh ? Who makes out ??????( Wall Street)
The only real solution is the Joe Biden one to have taxpayer money pay for elections not the money of the PLA or Citgo.

What alot of Americans don't realize is that China's PLA or Chavez's Citgo BUY more freedom of speech than they do.

[ESOGSteel]

So in your opinion private bankers setting money supply for a nation does not control the nation? In this last credit crisis the Feds printed lots of cheap money. Which influenced the national banks to loan money to less worthy people at variable rates. Then the FED closes down that money tree and raises rates causing hundreds of thousands to loose their homes. Then the Congress debates a bail out of these half assed mortgage lenders. Who controls you?

Me, I control myself I own myself, government does not nor will they ever.

[clean]

Hey, Shocker. Money is insured by the FDIC now, right? In contrast to '29.

But yeah, pensions, 401k, very vunerable.
Greenspan the other day on Jon Stewart, said, "The Feds job is to predict peoples reactions. And I've been doing it for decades, and I was as good at it then as I am now." (Meaning, he doesn't know. Didn't know then, didn't know when he retired).

[clean]

Me, I control myself I own myself, government does not nor will they ever.

Hopefully you'll never need medicare or social security.

[Red]

Hopefully you'll never need medicare or social security.

That's why we all should play the lottery.

[shocker1]

Me, I control myself I own myself, government does not nor will they ever.
Really? Do you pay taxes? Do you rely on the flow of oil? How about your electricity? Does the FDA control what you eat? Does the NEC not control your education? The government controls us in many ways, some righteous and good. Some not so much, but lets say you do not pay taxes and live off your own oil well. The IRS will control you in the pen.

So in reality the best example of the power of the people is at the local level. I can agree we are free to express ideas, have opinions, choose where we shop. However one thing controls our lives more than anything. The value of our money has the greatest long term impact on our lives. The flow of oil products is our basic economic necessity. Money and oil are controlled by corporations and that means they own our quality of life. To me that means people besides those in DC control this nation.

[ex-cop]

LOL Internet owns me

[Red]

Really? Do you pay taxes? Do you rely on the flow of oil? How about your electricity? Does the FDA control what you eat? Does the NEC not control your education? The government controls us in many ways, some righteous and good. Some not so much, but lets say you do not pay taxes and live off your own oil well. The IRS will control you in the pen.

So in reality the best example of the power of the people is at the local level. I can agree we are free to express ideas, have opinions, choose where we shop. However one thing controls our lives more than anything. The value of our money has the greatest long term impact on our lives. The flow of oil products is our basic economic necessity. Money and oil are controlled by corporations and that means they own our quality of life. To me that means people besides those in DC control this nation.
But to be honest Shocker, this is hardly an American phenomena. I can relate this same story the world over to a lot of Countries. I feel you on your point about people being purposefully ignorant. In other countries however, people are so hungry because thei governments are so corrupt and inept that the people don't even have the resources or literal strength to get all the information. Good post Shocker!

@ESOGSTEEL: This is a good convo so please add your own opinions in a respectful manner so that we can all have a good discussion and maybe some of us who are not up to speed on this issue can learn new things. Thanks!

[Laworkerbee]

That's why we all should play the lottery.

As a Latino I endorse this comment.

Heres a quick joke for you

Q. What has 5 balls and robs Mexicans blind

A. The lotto

:)

[shocker1]

But to be honest Shocker, this is hardly an American phenomena. I can relate this same story the world over to a lot of Countries. I feel you on your point about people being purposefully ignorant. In other countries however, people are so hungry because thei governments are so corrupt and inept that the people don't even have the resources or literal strength to get all the information. Good post Shocker!


Oh, I agree we live in a great nation. Where we can have access to the information to counter act the actions of the few. Not many have that and this is why we have so much as we do. However our media is controlled by a select few. Over the years small news outlets where bought up now we have, AOL-Time-Warner, Newscorp, ClearChannel ect.

One thing caught my attention about the FED recently is the interest rate to dollar value logic. It is the FED's legal responsibility to protect the value of our dollar as mandated by congress in 1913. The fact that they lowered rates when the dollar is dropping like a stone shines in the face of what is supposed to happen. They lowered rates to cover bad investments.

An example of will full ignorance is thinking the economy is doing great since the market is way up. Just remember your dollar invested in those markets is worth est 20% less than 8 years ago. Some return huh. The value of the dollar in my pocket is the health of our economy. Other nations are bailing out of the dollar and heading for the Euro. Makes you wonder about that international banker aspect to the FED.

[ESOGSteel]

Money and oil are controlled by corporations and that means they own our quality of life. To me that means people besides those in DC control this nation.

What a defeatist statement. You truly feel as if you have lost all power to control this country and your quality of life. You believe this because banks "own" the government? because they supply/ed money to the government? What a sad world you live in. But, if you so wish to live like that then by all means do so. I however believe that it is still possible for me, the individual, to control my fate and quality of life. I still believe that I can influence (greater then any bank or corporation) the direction of this nation.

Medicare and Social Security are for the weak. These government programs as just like welfare, nothing but government handouts. I prefer to save the money I make and know that it will be there once I retire.

[Aeroflot]

Nobody owns anyone.

[shocker1]

What a defeatist statement. You truly feel as if you have lost all power to control this country and your quality of life. You believe this because banks "own" the government? because they supply/ed money to the government? What a sad world you live in. But, if you so wish to live like that then by all means do so.

Medicare and Social Security are for the weak. These government programs as just like welfare, nothing but government handouts. I prefer to save the money I make and know that it will be there once I retire.
Nice how you come back in with some smart ass **** again with nothing to counter what I stated. That money you are counting on for retirement, how much will it be worth at the current rate in say 20 years? What if the market tanks your 401k. Or the dollar is worth as much as a peso when you go to draw your IRA at 20 year old tax rates.

I have owned my business for over ten years now and am very successful. A decades long member of the local chamber and active in politics. I am not some keyboard warrior spouting crap I saw on some end times docu. I have watched what has happened for a personal, political and business perspective. I watched as congress defeated the Associations Healthcare bill that I spent alot of time calling, writing and visiting about. Met with Senator Issacson about it with some other local leaders. That bill would have cut my medical insurance costs in half.

I have control as of this moment on my quality of life. However shut down a couple refineries, lower the interest rates even more and no none of us will be able to control our quality of life. Well unless you are filthy rich, I have nothing against being filthy rich. It is a goal of my own.

[Red]

As a Latino I endorse this comment.

Heres a quick joke for you

Q. What has 5 balls and robs Mexicans blind

A. The lotto
:)
Dude, Mexicans play the lottery like it's going out of fashion.


Oh, I agree we live in a great nation. Where we can have access to the information to counter act the actions of the few. Not many have that and this is why we have so much as we do. However our media is controlled by a select few. Over the years small news outlets where bought up now we have, AOL-Time-Warner, Newscorp, ClearChannel ect.

One thing caught my attention about the FED recently is the interest rate to dollar value logic. It is the FED's legal responsibility to protect the value of our dollar as mandated by congress in 1913. The fact that they lowered rates when the dollar is dropping like a stone shines in the face of what is supposed to happen. They lowered rates to cover bad investments.

An example of will full ignorance is thinking the economy is doing great since the market is way up. Just remember your dollar invested in those markets is worth est 20% less than 8 years ago. Some return huh. The value of the dollar in my pocket is the health of our economy. Other nations are bailing out of the dollar and heading for the Euro. Makes you wonder about that international banker aspect to the FED.
This is something I was talking about with a friend some weeks ago. He just like you invests in Gold because of the same reasons you mentioned above. The thing though is that through very careful phrasing of words in the media and our culture at large, opinions such as yours are labelled as "conspiracy theories". But if there is one thing I have learnt in life, it is that you cannot out anything underneath or above human beings. That also included the legths some people will go to acquire power. This is an excellent topic and one I don't know nearly enough of so I can't really add anything to this fasinating discussion.


What a defeatist statement. You truly feel as if you have lost all power to control this country and your quality of life. You believe this because banks "own" the government? because they supply/ed money to the government? What a sad world you live in. But, if you so wish to live like that then by all means do so. I however believe that it is still possible for me, the individual, to control my fate and quality of life. I still believe that I can influence (greater then any bank or corporation) the direction of this nation.

Medicare and Social Security are for the weak. These government programs as just like welfare, nothing but government handouts. I prefer to save the money I make and know that it will be there once I retire.

I don't interprete Shocker's post as deaftist at all. I see it as being one grounded in the facts of the day as they appear to him.

[Laworkerbee]

OK I'm getting depressed reading your posts Shocker

[Red]

OK I'm getting depressed reading your posts Shocker

It's kind of like the Matrix in terms of the shock people get when they are "unplugged" from the Matrix and then see how ****ty the real world is.

[Red]

I've been thinking of withdrawing most of my 401K and buying up gold and just stuffing it in a safe somewhere.

[shocker1]

OK I'm getting depressed reading your posts Shocker
So milk going from $1.99 to $5 a gallon in three years did not do it? I have done my part then.p-)

[Laworkerbee]

I've been thinking of withdrawing most of my 401K and buying up gold and just stuffing it in a safe somewhere.

How is it done, I got three 401k's from different jobs all doing their own thing, how do I get my hands on that money and shift it some where else?

Did you see my lotto joke? :roll:


So milk going from $1.99 to $5 a gallon in three years did not do it? I have done my part then.p-)

Not a big milk drinker Buddy, now if my Stella went from 9$ a six pack to 15$ then I would be up in arms

[Red]

How is it done, I got three 401k's from different jobs all doing their own thing, how do I get my hands on that money and shift it some where else?

Did you see my lotto joke? :roll:



Not a big milk drinker Buddy, now if my Stella went from 9$ a six pack to 15$ then I would be up in arms

I only just started looking into the 401k thing so I don't have enough info as of yet but once I do, I'll let you know.

I saw the lotto joke. And I don't even blame the Mexicans cause everyone needs to get paid. p-)

[Red]

So milk going from $1.99 to $5 a gallon in three years did not do it? I have done my part then.p-)

My 401k did loose value during the main pahse of the sub prime crisis.

[D-gin]

Shocker, well said.



Nobody owns anyone.

No, but I know of a place you can rent someone.

[shocker1]

Oh man LAWB, you should roll those into an IRA right now at least while the market is way up. I would not get in to precious metals yet. They are too high at the moment, since interest rates are lower get some T-bills or other US Treasury securities. Then when interest rates spike and they will you will be sitting pretty. Where is Mr. Fox when I need him? He is much smarter about this stuff than me.


Not a big milk drinker Buddy, now if my Stella went from 9$ a six pack to 15$ then I would be up in arms
Edit:)

[Red]

Shocker, well said.




No, but I know of a place you can rent someone.

Gosh, the chick in your avatar is HOT. She can call me if she needs some chocolate loving. p-)

[Red]

Oh man LAWB, you should roll those into an IRA right now at least while the market is way up. I would not get in to precious metals yet. They are too high at the moment, since interest rates are lower get some T-bills or other US Treasury securities. Then when interest rates spike and they will you will be sitting pretty. Where is Mr. Fox when I need him? He is much smarter about this stuff than me.
Ok question, my 401k is partly funded through matching contributions from my employer. If I rolled the 401K into an IRA, won't I loose out on the matching funds?

[shocker1]

Ok question, my 401k is partly funded through matching contributions from my employer. If I rolled the 401K into an IRA, won't I loose out on the matching funds?
You sir are one of the lucky few who has such a plan. Most of those are no more. You should stay anywhere someone matches your deposits. My last employer did but due to some shady deals i lost $5000 in it when the company shut down(2002). It shut down mainly because the new Bush budget did not have FTA funds for hybrid/electric transit buses. The stocks in the 401k it turned out where Coca Cola, BCBS and other Chattanooga based businesses. My stock options in the company is where I lost the money though. Could have been more if i had not been part of the management staff and in the all important engineering dept. I saw what was coming and sold out.

[Red]

You sir are one of the lucky few who has such a plan. Most of those are no more. You should stay anywhere someone matches your deposits. My last employer did but due to some shady deals i lost $5000 in it when the company shut down(2002). It shut down mainly because the new Bush budget did not have FTA funds for hybrid/electric transit buses. The stocks in the 401k it turned out where Coca Cola, BCBS and other Chattanooga based businesses. My stock options in the company is where I lost the money though. Could have been more if i had not been part of the management staff and in the all important engineering dept. I saw what was coming and sold out.

Oh ok. Shocker, you and Fox have challenged me today. I really need to up my game in terms of understanding the economic game more than I do now. Thanks for the education.

[Laworkerbee]

I took this job at my current company because I'm offered a 401K that matches me dollar for dollar up to $10,000 per year so it's like free money.

[shocker1]

Ignoring the value of the dollar. Simple terms, if rates are up buy stocks. When they go down buy Treasury Bonds. This is why the stock market goes up when rates fall. Margin investing does it (people who borrow money to invest in stocks) That is like borrowing money for the horse races. Loan sharks.

[Red]

Ignoring the value of the dollar. Simple terms, if rates are up buy stocks. When they go down buy Treasury Bonds. This is why the stock market goes up when rates fall. Margin investing does it (people who borrow money to invest in stocks) That is like borrowing money for the horse races. Loan sharks.

So for this time period we are in, should a person have a higher quota of stocks or T-bonds?

[shocker1]

I took this job at my current company because I'm offered a 401K that matches me dollar for dollar up to $10,000 per year so it's like free money.

I was offered a good Job at LADWP working with their electric vehicle program. I was scared to move so far away, sometimes I wish I had taken that offer. So we could hang out and get drunk on occasion you know.p-)

[Laworkerbee]

I was offered a good Job at LADWP working with their electric vehicle program. I was scared to move so far away, sometimes I wish I had taken that offer. So we could hang out and get drunk on occasion you know.p-)

Those pricks just got another pay hike up to 34% :bash:

*you should have taken it*

[shocker1]

So for this time period we are in, should a person have a higher quota of stocks or T-bonds?
I got a little of everything. I have had a big share in a microturbine generator company out of Woodlandhills, Fontana. I bought them during the IPO. It has split three times.woot I have T-bonds and most of the rest in coins(silver,gold US). I think it is best to have it spread around like that. I am in a sense running my own IRA. I would not have went this path if not for running my own business and looking for the best ways to fund my retirement.


Those pricks just got another pay hike up to 34% :bash:

*you should have taken it*
http://smileydatabase.com/s/914.gif

[Erik2a4]

Great. I take a look after a while away and MP.net has turned into CNBC.

Carry on, good info.

Oh, **** George Carlin, btw.

[Red]

I got a little of everything. I have had a big share in a microturbine generator company out of Woodlandhills, Fontana. I bought them during the IPO. It has split three times.woot I have T-bonds and most of the rest in coins(silver,gold US). I think it is best to have it spread around like that. I am in a sense running my own IRA. I would not have went this path if not for running my own business and looking for the best ways to fund my retirement.

http://smileydatabase.com/s/914.gif

I currently have a mix of 70% Stocks and 30% Bonds (not all are T-Bonds)

I do my 401K through Vanguard and I felt they did not have the best mix but once I get home today, I wil be giving my selections a second look.

[shocker1]

Yeah, if your employer is matching some portion of your 401k that is the greatest. You really can not go wrong but mind you that like the company I worked for. The 401k options were not fair really. Most of the businesses on mine where investors in the company I worked for. There were some investigations too after they closed down but i have not heard anything since.

Oh, they still owe me for a tool bag full of Snap On tools and electronic testing equipment for HVDC batteries. Stolen out of the engineering storage room.

[clean]

I had three 401ks from three different jobs. Two I rolled over into with the one I currently have, the other one, a T Rowe Price thing, was doing so well, I just took it out of the 401k and made it an investment account. I never lost the matching from my previous employers.

[Kilkenny]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=qp7G18nQxvU

[Laworkerbee]

I had three 401ks from three different jobs. Two I rolled over into with the one I currently have, the other one, a T Rowe Price thing, was doing so well, I just took it out of the 401k and made it an investment account. I never lost the matching from my previous employers.

How much did it cost you to get that investment account setup?

[clean]

I currently have a mix of 70% Stocks and 30% Bonds (not all are T-Bonds)

I do my 401K through Vanguard and I felt they did not have the best mix but once I get home today, I wil be giving my selections a second look.

70/30 I think is a pretty good mix right now. Though I see that changing around dec of 08. Make sure you're not investing too heavily in your own company. A la Enron. But a 70/30 stock/bond split is smart. Depending on your age, don't play it to safe, but somewhere in the middle. It'll pay off beter in the end.

[clean]

How much did it cost you to get that investment account setup?

3%, I think. Let me check.

Hell, maybe that was my home refi. Again. I'll check.

[Thor]

You can deny it all you want but what he said is the truth. It is a club and they think you are dumb. Sad truth is most people are willingly dumb.
I agree with that, the original video and the video you posted. In the sense that it's all factually true.

Very Chomsky-like. However what I think the critics fail to see is that people in general are well off in highly capitalist societies with concentrated ownership and influence. As crooked as it may be I don't think they will get people to complain much about it as long as they have a fair amount of liberty, 2-3 cars, a spacious home, good schools for their kids, vacations, a good retirement ahead of them etc.

[shocker1]

Make sure you're not investing too heavily in your own company. .
that was my big mistake. The promise of options and a bright future duped me. It was the late 90's and i was young. Things just seemed so perfect at the time. It seemed impossible for it to tank. It tanked, i learned a valuable lesson about CEOs boards and who they really look out for.

[Red]

70/30 I think is a pretty good mix right now. Though I see that changing around dec of 08. Make sure you're not investing too heavily in your own company. A la Enron. But a 70/30 stock/bond split is smart. Depending on your age, don't play it to safe, but somewhere in the middle. It'll pay off beter in the end.
I get your point. My employer is a private company so I can't invest in them even if I wanted to. I have been looking at changing up my mix as some of my stock picks have not been doing so great. I wanted to invest in energy companies but Vanguard was not offereing any at the time I made my choices. Once I get home, I will get out my Vanguard booklet and re-read the damn thing.

[Red]

I agree with that, the original video and the video you posted. In the sense that it's all factually true.

Very Chomsky-like. However what I think the critics fail to see is that people in general are well off in highly capitalist societies with concentrated ownership and influence. As crooked as it may be I don't think they will get people to complain much about it as long as they have a fair amount of liberty, 2-3 cars, a spacious home, good schools for their kids, vacations, a good retirement ahead of them etc.

We call that drinking the corporate kool aid. p-)

[clean]

that was my big mistake. The promise of options and a bright future duped me. It was the late 90's and i was young. Things just seemed so perfect at the time. It seemed impossible for it to tank. It tanked, i learned a valuable lesson about CEOs boards and who they really look out for.

Most people invest heavily in their own company because they work there and they seem to think they "know" their company. Unless they're in the executive suite, they don't.
I had options in the late nineties, company went under, options were useless AND I got taxed for them. Talk about being "owned."

[clean]

I get your point. My employer is a private company so I can't invest in them even if I wanted to. I have been looking at changing up my mix as some of my stock picks have not been doing so great. I wanted to invest in energy companies but Vanguard was not offereing any at the time I made my choices. Once I get home, I will get out my Vanguard booklet and re-read the damn thing.

Are you picking actual stocks to invest in, or categories? Like High Risk/ High return or Low Risk/ Low return. Or another way, financial categories, medical, energy, tech etc?

[Red]

Most people invest heavily in their own company because they work there and they seem to think they "know" their company. Unless they're in the executive suite, they don't.
I had options in the late nineties, company went under, options were useless AND I got taxed for them. Talk about being "owned."

In the immortal words of Eric Cartman, "Uber pwnage" p-)

[shocker1]

I think everybody was talkin options and such during those times. seemed like we were standing on concrete but alas it was a soapy bubble. Then Bush cut FTA programs and that was the death blow.

I see it about to happen again.

[Red]

Are you picking actual stocks to invest in, or categories? Like High Risk/ High return or Low Risk/ Low return. Or another way, financial categories, medical, energy, tech etc?

If I remember correctly, it broke them down into the low risk and return grouping you posted above but then we could also chose particular investments but not in the later grouping though. I just deduced their catergories from the names and description of the funds.

[Red]

Guys, I'm going home but this thread has been a wake up call for me. Thanks everone for the fantastic contributions. we've not had a thread like this on MP.NET in a while. Cheers!

[TR1]

It is my personal belief, that US americans are owned by the Iraq.

[clean]

Guys, I'm going home but this thread has been a wake up call for me. Thanks everone for the fantastic contributions. we've not had a thread like this on MP.NET in a while. Cheers!

Leaving at 5 on the dot, eh? What are you? Union? :)

[Shellshock1918]

It is my personal belief, that US americans are owned by the Iraq.

ROFLMFAO
GIVE US MAPS LOL

[clean]

It is my personal belief, that US americans are owned by the Iraq.

95% of americans would respond to you saying "Iraq? Is there something going on in Iraq?"

[AZRON]

I've been doing good on what are called ETFs in my IRA.
They are exchange traded funds similar to mutual funds but trade like stocks.
I trade through Scottrade at $7.00 per single transaction.
I pick my ETFs using the IBD website. But I'm never 100% fully invested in any one catergory such as stock funds , money market , cash account or whatever.
The hottest catergory has been BRIC ( Brazil , Russia, India and China)ETFs but that doesn't mean it will or won't stay hot.
Another interesting play is Canadian oil cos. that pay 8-9-10-11 % or more yearly dividends. Canadians especially love them , plus Americans get currency play to boot.

But I'm not telling anyone what to do , I'm telling what I do.

[clean]

AZRON, how many trades do you make in any given month? I'm terrified of picking my own stocks. I think I have a good overall feel of the markets and their trends, but not so much as to actually do single trades. Cool, that you're doing well.

[clean]

How much did it cost you to get that investment account setup?

Nothing. Rolled into a tax exempt IRA.

[CG51]

Gotta love Carlin, the man speaks the truth.

[AZRON]

AZRON, how many trades do you make in any given month? I'm terrified of picking my own stocks. I think I have a good overall feel of the markets and their trends, but not so much as to actually do single trades. Cool, that you're doing well.

I've made 17 YTD.
I tend to own only 10-12 stocks/ETFs .
I do make mistakes but I'm up 14% YTD , not very good.
But I have gone from 30-40% ETFs to now 80% ETFs.
I rode the August slide down and backup with 1 sale and no purchases.
But I'm up 38% from my lowest point during the course of the year.
The one sale cost me 5% of my money as it dove down and down.
It was a stupid IPO purchase which I won't repeat on that scale again.

You can role over and use the brokers best picks for 80% of your money and play the other 20%.
This is a personal decision , I'm not telling what to do only giving suggestions. It's up to your personal comfort zone what you do.

[shocker1]

Just a tip, this company is trading very low right now. It has been as high as $24 before the last split. Good buy right now IMO.
http://www.capstoneturbine.com/

Oh and if you buy one of the turbines. I am an ASP

[maundy]

Forget money and forget gold. If things get really bad then they will both be worthless.

Learn to sustain yourself, get a veggie patch that will support you and your family + more (trade/barter), learn to live off the land if need be, get some chickens, and learn to make vodka and distill it. Get an alcohol powered generator, a lathe and a milling machine. Get in cohorts with your neighbours.

Then you will at least have somethings that you can use to get other things.

At the end of the day gold does nothing for no one, and people are going to realise that.

www.cryptogon.com

http://www.cryptome.org/

[shocker1]

At the end of the day gold does nothing for no one, and people are going to realise that.

www.cryptogon.com (http://www.cryptogon.com)
Really? Gold has held value for the past 6000 years. Now if government collapses and total anarchy is the special of the day. Then a chicken would be worth more than gold to a hungry man. If it gets that bad, I am ready as i have relatives up in the mountians with lots of land, livestock, guns, bomb shelter and still. So bring it on.

[dimasorokine]

Great video, 100% true...for those of you that still believe you live in a free country, or that the video is a bunch of BS - try not paying your taxes, or climb a lamp post.

But what really makes it easy to control the US, and the whole world for that matter is NOT because of physical power and force. Its a control through ignorance, apathy and comfort.

-Dima

[maundy]

Really? Gold has held value for the past 6000 years. Now if government collapses and total anarchy is the special of the day. Then a chicken would be worth more than gold to a hungry man. If it gets that bad, I am ready as i have relatives up in the mountians with lots of land, livestock, guns, bomb shelter and still. So bring it on.

Yeah that's what I mean. Gold has value as long as people think it does. One day everyone is going to realise gold isn't worth ****. It is fairly useless. Iron/steel is way more valuable than gold. I'd start stockpiling that.

It's good to see that you're set up.

[LaoSexMachine]

No matter what country we live in. Everyone is own by someone. Same shyt different day.

[maundy]

You don't have to just accept it. Do something about it.

And yeah it is pretty much happening everywhere.

[Buckeye67]

Vote for Ron Paul.

[shocker1]

Vote for Ron Paul.
Hell yeah, I am with ya. Got his sign in the yard. While I do not agree with all his views, he is not part of the click. That is good enough for me. If the main stream media ignores him and the Neocons make fun of him he is the right man. The man has one hell of a grass roots machine going.

[LaoSexMachine]

You don't have to just accept it. Do something about it.

And yeah it is pretty much happening everywhere.

Like overthrow the government? Robin Hood type shat? Fvck society and go find myself and island and live there? Living in a capitalist society has it's downfalls. Is it bad? No. You have to put things in perspective. Money is the only God. Reality.

[CG51]

It's the same in every country. I rather be owned here than in some third world ****hole.

[little icebear]

I can´t believe it! shocker1 is a leftist! Cool! :)

[shocker1]

I can´t believe it! shocker1 is a leftist! Cool! :)
In your dreams.:)

I am Conservative, something Bush know nothing about.

[little icebear]

............

[little icebear]

Damn... I was just about to send you a Che T-Shirt along with a tinfoil-hat and the complete Michael Moore DVD-Collection.

[shocker1]

Send them, they will sale on Ebay

[IDF-Godzilla]

Who owns the Americans???
The answer is simple, the evil Zionists Jews! :fork:

[Kilgor]

Great video, 100% true...for those of you that still believe you live in a free country, or that the video is a bunch of BS - try not paying your taxes, or climb a lamp post.

But what really makes it easy to control the US, and the whole world for that matter is NOT because of physical power and force. Its a control through ignorance, apathy and comfort.

-Dima

Ultimately personal human survival depends on living in a organized civilization with effective government. Of course a human is never free, he has physical needs and requirements. One must work to put to put food on the table.

Apart from that of course Americans enjoy "freedoms" that many in other countries have died for. Freedom of expression, freedom of assembly , freedom to be involved in the politcal process, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly. , freedom of movement.

If you have a better example of a more "free " society other than western capitalist democracies, I would like to hear it.

[shocker1]

Who owns the Americans???
The answer is simple, the evil Zionists Jews! :fork:
Now I know why I own a business.p-)

[Redguy]

hahahaha, whats in the second part of this video? Him using terms like, proletariat and bourgeoisie, and over throw/ revolution?

[maundy]

Like overthrow the government? Robin Hood type shat? Fvck society and go find myself and island and live there? Living in a capitalist society has it's downfalls. Is it bad? No. You have to put things in perspective. Money is the only God. Reality.

Your selfish attitude will not get you far in life.

[maundy]

Someday we'll know
If love can move a mountain
Someday we'll know
Why the sky is blue
Someday we'll know
Why I wasn't meant for you

Someday we'll know
Why Sampson loved Delilah
One day I'll go
Dancing on the moon
Someday you'll know
That I was the one for you


............

[FutureGrunt]

Who owns the Americans???
The answer is simple, the evil Zionists Jews! :fork:

Stop instigating

[FutureGrunt]

After reading through this topic I must admit this was one of the most interesting and informative discussions on this forum (and no flame war, huh, well except for a weak attempt by above quoted individual)

[Mastermind]

"Ownership" of a nation has always been the case of the body politic. There really are no "free" people...everyone is owned by someone. We are merely people...we are just as susceptible to social influneces as any monkey, tiger, fish or elephant. With computers and mass communications, the "owners" have pretty much figured us out to the n-th degree. This is why there is now very little difference between the American political parties and why new political parties are basically shut out of the main stream. This is why all the news media read almost verbatim like eachother. This is why the politicians, like GW Bush, Nancy Pelosy and Harry Reid can say the damn dumbest, most idiotic things and walk away like nothing has happened...this is why there are no consequinces for massive economic blunders, like the Enron disaster and the recent Savings and Loan high risk mortgage fiasco. This is why there is no such thing any more as outrage. The most vile public behaviors and performances go by practically unmentioned in the media...the media are all "owned" by those who control things and thus, the public is left wandering in a morass of limp stories about little blond media sensations who get pregnant, get killed, get drunk or get arrested...and confused stories about the war, missing or not missing WMD's and soldiers up on charges of murder for doing their jobs...it is the reason we have so many hyphenated Americans...African-Americans, Hispanic-Americans, Gay-Americans, ...there really are damn few Just-Americans left...the "Owners" divide and conquer us. It is the reason we have so many victim Americans...we are weak in the face of the "owners" because we are treated like victims by them...we are on Social Security, we are on Welfare, we are on Workmen's comp, we are on socialized education, we are on unemployment, we are on Medicaid or Medicare and soon, if the "owners" have their way, we will be on "socialized medicine"..wholly dependant on our government for care and sustenance...each of us individually "protected and cared for" by our government (owners) from cradle to grave.

It is the slow, creeping desire of the individual to return to a cocoon...the protection of the womb....which people naturally, in some form or another, seek out. Now, it is almost irresistable, there are so many are so dependant..the mass of voters dare not resist...they will continue to vote liberals into office, seeking ever more warmth from the insidious gifts the "owners" offer...eventually, the people will get exactly what they want and what the "owners" insist they have...total security...of course, in order to have total security...one must sacrifice freedom. But, then, who cares?...so long as security is all you ever wanted.

I think H.G. Wells in his story "The Time Machine" carried this syndrome out to the ultimate final conclusion..the lowest denominator. His end of time people, the Morlocks and the Eloy....had devolved into the perfect symbiotic relationship...each group caring in their own way for the other...the Morlocks providing food and security for the Eloy, who in turn willingly provided food and sustenance for the canibalistic Morlocks. Think about that in contemporary terms...pretty spooky.

That's just my take on things.

[dimasorokine]

Ultimately personal human survival depends on living in a organized civilization with effective government. Of course a human is never free, he has physical needs and requirements. One must work to put to put food on the table.

Apart from that of course Americans enjoy "freedoms" that many in other countries have died for. Freedom of expression, freedom of assembly , freedom to be involved in the politcal process, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly. , freedom of movement.

If you have a better example of a more "free " society other than western capitalist democracies, I would like to hear it.

“Ultimately personal human survival depends on living in a organized civilization with effective government. Of course a human is never free, he has physical needs and requirements. One must work to put to put food on the table.”

Maybe the “survival” of the masses, but not the survival of the individuals who see themselves as individuals and can think for themselves. Humans are free to do what they like, but we are kept in check by the consequences that our governments enforce.

Quite honestly, I don’t see what me being allowed to smoke weed has to do with my survival. And not being a 50 – 50 partner with the government on all the money I make would only help my survival.

Apart from that of course Americans enjoy "freedoms" that many in other countries have died for. Freedom of expression, freedom of assembly , freedom to be involved in the politcal process, freedom of religion, freedom of assembly. , freedom of movement.

LOL, these freedoms really mean nothing to most people. These freedoms are only freedoms so long as they don’t interfere or seriously threaten the plans of the elite, or the “owners” as described by the video.

The obedience of the masses doesn’t come from them realizing that they are slaves, or owned by someone else. Most people think, and believe that they are free – and occupy their lives with things that don’t matter.

This is why I think the US and other western nations are so successful at controlling their populations – they give enough freedom to the masses to make them believe they are free.

If you have a better example of a more "free " society other than western capitalist democracies, I would like to hear it.

Well, that’s really the problem Kilgor. Most countries are run this way…maybe if you want less laws, and more real freedoms you buy yourself a lot of guns and move to a country in chaos (or maybe move to Holland) – by why should that be the only option?

The fact is there are HUGE problems with today’s most advanced, successful and “democratic” countries – why must we have to choose the best of the worse?

-Dima

[maundy]

Capitalism is fundamentally a flawed system.

Think about it;

people work for the capitalist system. The capitalist system pays them money. The money is then sent back in to the capitalist system, which then gives a small proportion back, and so on and so forth.

And one day it is going to come crashing down.

Socialism is flawed too.

[LaoSexMachine]

Your selfish attitude will not get you far in life.


Oh please great sage, tell me how you were able to toss off the yoke of capitalism and consumerism? Selfish? you should talk to my friends and see if they think I'm selfish.

[maundy]

Oh please great sage, tell me how you were able to toss off the yoke of capitalism and consumerism? Selfish? you should talk to my friends and see if they think I'm selfish.

Sounds to me like you had to buy your friends. Wow I envy you.

[LaoSexMachine]

Epic reply.


So tell us how. You seem to know the way.

[maundy]

Experiences are more valuable than anything money can buy. Try and experience things that you can't put a dollar figure on.

Stop thinking in terms of well my $ can get me to do this etc.

[LaoSexMachine]

Experiences are more valuable than anything money can buy. Try and experience things that you can't put a dollar figure on.

Stop thinking in terms of well my $ can get me to do this etc.

This aint news.

[maundy]

Try to make ends meet you're a slave to money then you die

Stop being a slave and free yourself.

[dimasorokine]

Maundy,

What do you do - as in, are you a business owner, self employed?

-Dima

[maundy]

I whore myself out as a subcontractor and only work when I feel like it.