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CG51
12-16-2007, 07:46 PM
UK has left behind murder and chaos, says Basra police chief (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,,2228690,00.html)

Blunt assessment delivered as British hand over security to Iraqis

Mona Mahmoud, Maggie O'Kane and Ian Black
Monday December 17, 2007
The Guardian (http://www.guardian.co.uk/)


The full scale of the chaos left behind by British forces in Basra was revealed yesterday as the city's police chief described a province in the grip of well-armed militias strong enough to overpower security forces and brutal enough to behead women considered not sufficiently Islamic.


As British forces finally handed over security in Basra province, marking the end of 4½ years of control in southern Iraq, Major General Jalil Khalaf, the new police commander, said the occupation had left him with a situation close to mayhem. "They left me militia, they left me gangsters, and they left me all the troubles in the world," he said in an in an interview for Guardian Films and ITV.

Khalaf painted a very different picture from that of British officials who, while acknowledging problems in southern Iraq, said yesterday's handover at Basra airbase was timely and appropriate.

Major General Graham Binns, who led British troops into the city in 2003, said the province had "begun to regain its strength". He added: "I came to rid Basra of its enemies and I now formally hand Basra back to its friends."
But in the film, to be broadcast on the Guardian Unlimited website and ITV News, Khalaf lists a catalogue of failings, saying:

· Basra has become so lawless that in the last three months 45 women have been killed for being "immoral" because they were not fully covered or because they may have given birth outside wedlock;
· The British unintentionally rearmed Shia militias by failing to recognise that Iraqi troops were loyal to more than one authority;
· Shia militia are better armed than his men and control Iraq's main port.
In the interview he said the main problem the Iraqi security forces now faced was the struggle to wrest control back from the militia. He appealed for the British to help him do that: "We need the British to help us to watch our borders - both sea and land and we need their intelligence and air support and to keep training the Iraqi police."

David Miliband, the foreign secretary, who attended the handover ceremony, acknowledged that the territory was not "a land of milk and honey" and promised Britain would remain a "committed friend" of Iraq.
But he insisted it was the right time to hand back control. "The key conditions for the transfer of security responsibility to the Iraqi security forces are whether they are up to it: do they have the numbers? Do they have the leadership and training to provide leadership for this province? And the answer to those three questions is yes," he said.

After the handover Des Browne, the defence secretary, praised British forces - 174 of whom have died since the start of the war in March 2003. "Their contribution has been outstanding and their courage inspiring," he said. A scaled-down UK force will remain in a single base at Basra airport, with a small training mission and a rapid reaction team on "overwatch".
Britain now has 4,500 troops in Iraq. The prime minister, Gordon Brown, has said numbers would shrink to 2,500 by mid-2008 though those released may be redeployed to Afghanistan.

Khalaf, who has survived 20 assassination attempts since he became police chief six months ago, said Britain's intentions had been good but misguided. "I don't think the British meant for this mess to happen. When they disbanded the Iraqi police and military after Saddam fell the people they put in their place were not loyal to the Iraqi government. The British trained and armed these people in the extremist groups and now we are faced with a situation where these police are loyal to their parties not their country."

He said the most shocking aspect of the breakdown of law and order in Basra was the murder of women for being unIslamic. "They are being killed because they are accused of behaving in an immoral way. When they kill them they put underwear and indecent clothes on them."

In his office Khalaf showed the Guardian a computer holding the files of 48 unidentified women. "Some of them have even been killed with their children because their killer says that they come out of an adulterous relationship," he said.

Vince Cable, the acting Lib Dem leader, called for a timetable to bring all British troops home from Iraq, adding: "If we are handing power back to the Iraqis, why are 4,500 British troops needed for what is essentially a training mission?"

· The General's Last Stand: a Guardianfilms/ITV News investigation can be seen now on the Guardian website and later tonight on ITV News at 6.30pm and 10.30pm

Calanen
12-16-2007, 09:51 PM
The British have done an excellent job, and put their lives on the line for a people far away from their own home.

Eventually, the British had to leave, they cannot stay their forever. At the end of the day, such chaos as there is, is now the problem and the concern of the Basra police chief and the central government. I think they should focus on what has been achieved and what needs to be done, rather than pointing the finger of blame.

Hollis
12-16-2007, 10:01 PM
The Basra Police chief real statement, "Holy crap, I have to work now,"



I agree with you Calanen, "The British have done an excellent job, and put their lives on the line for a people far away from their own home."

Urquell
12-16-2007, 10:49 PM
"When they disbanded the Iraqi police and military after Saddam fell the people they put in their place were not loyal to the Iraqi government. The British trained and armed these people in the extremist groups and now we are faced with a situation where these police are loyal to their parties not their country."

I am a guessing that a man that still gets to work despite twenty assassination attempts is devoted to his job, and tries to do his best. But that is one seriously messed up situation. What can he do really, when the AIF have infiltrated the ranks of the security forces, and apparently are so powerful that they are in control of their own areas, and even the port?

By the way, what is the opinion of British immigration authorities regarding the situation in Basra? Do they consider it to be safe enough to start sending refugees back? Here where I live we have a ton of refugees from Iraq. Sadly the authorities seems to consider it as too dangerous to send them back, they even keep coming in huge numbers.

Kilkenny
12-17-2007, 10:34 AM
I have a feeling what will come next to this thread.

welshmann
12-17-2007, 11:32 AM
Is it me,or every bloody tv prog or newspaper when interviewing iraq police chiefs etc,say one thing,The british made it worse,,,, blah blah blah
.............

Im i being too harsh to say ungrateful c***s!

Hollis
12-17-2007, 11:35 AM
Is it me,or every bloody tv prog or newspaper when interviewing iraq police chiefs etc,say one thing,The british made it worse,,,, blah blah blah
.............

Im i being too harsh to say ungrateful c***s!


I think it is all those who predicted failure from the beginning just do not want to see any signs of success.

With the success' now in Iraq, have you notice how A-stan is now the failure in news reports.

welshmann
12-17-2007, 12:36 PM
or the bloody tv networks media?

Piss me off when the TERMS seen in this weeks newspaper" britain fails in iraq"etc.the goverment maybe.

But being tarred with same brush is the lads & girls doing/done,a great job.

Good Quote from you: The Basra Police chief real statement, "Holy crap, I have to work now,"

Tokamak
12-17-2007, 03:12 PM
He said the most shocking aspect of the breakdown of law and order in Basra was the murder of women for being unIslamic. "They are being killed because they are accused of behaving in an immoral way. When they kill them they put underwear and indecent clothes on them."

Yes those terrible British . They came teaching them this kind of things!. That their society is all ****ed up with those types of beleives is not their fault.

G2Monkey
12-18-2007, 01:37 PM
I think that he needs to accept that the reason for the instability in Basra is not the British, but it is infact the citizens of Iraq. I was once told a great piece of advice by my grandfather... "Don't **** where you eat".

If they want Basra to be nice and sparkly and safe, they need to pull their fingers out and accept the actions of their fellow countrymen, and start getting in amongst it to sort it out. You reap what you sew etc etc.


and yes, he is a cheeky f**k

timetraveller
12-18-2007, 09:10 PM
Even though I have never been in Iraq but for someone to say that .. Is nowt more than 2 faced

clean
12-18-2007, 11:33 PM
Sir Donald Hawley, a british diplomat in Iraq back in the 60's said this about the Iraqis.
[They] are a very talented, intellectual people and have no lack of experts on many subjects. They have a tendency, however, not to agree with one another and are no strangers to violence. Late at night after several strong whiskies, they could be very frank on many subjects, including themselves, and would sometimes grow quite maudlin. We are a very bad people and very difficult to govern. Did we not kill Ali [the Prophet Muhammad's son-in-law, whom the Shias revere]? Did we not kill Hussain [his son]? Very few have successfully dominated us...Nuri Said [the pro-British prime minister, assassinated in 1958] too knew how to govern Iraq,” they would say. It is an Iraqi trait to admire strength and to respect it for the stability it can give.

It is an interesting situation now created with the British pulling out. A test case. It's up to them now. And, as intelligent and thoughtful people, we'll see how they adapt. For the war in iraq to end, Coalition troops need to pull out. It's a mini picture of what will happen when the US leaves as well.