View Full Version : Borders go down tonight between west EU and new member states
Telmar
12-20-2007, 03:44 AM
At midnight tonight, Slovakia, Poland and Hungary among others enter the Shengen zone in the EU.
Police will no longer check documents at the border. The checkpoints have been removed. For the Berg border here between Bratislava and Austria, it now looks like a simple street.
Non EU members such as Switzerland are also planning to join.
As a consequence, the borders between the newly "Shengen" states have been reinforced.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schengen_Agreement
Slovakia on EU migration frontline (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7056441.stm) (BBC 22 october 2007)
It was only less than twenty years ago that the borders were sealed tight... Tonight marks the last step of the removal of the iron curtain.
Granit
12-20-2007, 01:05 PM
Yep, The world is changing this midnight. It reminds me the fall of Berlin Wall. Long life my slavic brother !
FutureGrunt
12-20-2007, 01:08 PM
It was only less than twenty years ago that the borders were sealed tight... Tonight marks the last step of the removal of the iron curtain...
...and establishment of human trafficking, drug trade, smuggling and illegal immigration :)
Granit
12-20-2007, 01:11 PM
...and establishment of human trafficking, drug trade, smuggling and illegal immigration :)
Why did you post so stupid commentary? Are you German?
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/9751/44313923schengen416mapyg5.gif (http://imageshack.us)
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/9751/44313923schengen416mapyg5.29884c22e8.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=505&i=44313923schengen416mapyg5.gif)
Thank christ for the sea.
Switek
12-20-2007, 02:20 PM
...and establishment of human trafficking, drug trade, smuggling and illegal immigration :)
Equal rights for everyone ... isn't it a main idea of Union of Socialist European States? ;)
...and establishment of human trafficking, drug trade, smuggling and illegal immigration :)
Yeah, because that didn't take place before :roll:
Nice to things progressing smoothly, soon I can drive all the way down to Greece without border stops or changing currency!
Kitsune
12-20-2007, 06:49 PM
Why did you post so stupid commentary? Are you German?
Well, this one of yours isn't too bright as well. Better luck next time...
Equal rights for everyone ... isn't it a main idea of Union of Socialist European States?
I have this one idea you know. One really should refound the USSR somewhere. A small region would be enough this time, preferably in some out of the way place (Eastern Siberia or something). Surround it with barbwire and then send two types of people there: firstly those who miss socialism (so that they can live how they want) and secondly those idiots who compare the EU with the Sovietunion, so that they can learn the difference.
Generally, I must say that I welcome the end of the border controls to Poland, Slovakia and Hungary. I admit that I was and am sceptical wether it was a good idea to enlarge the EU so soon as we did, but since we have chosen to do so, it is only consistent to do it all the way.
Granit
12-20-2007, 09:12 PM
"Generally, I must say that I welcome the end of the border controls to Poland, Slovakia and Hungary. I admit that I was and am sceptical wether it was a good idea to enlarge the EU so soon as we did, but since we have chosen to do so, it is only consistent to do it all the way."
Why you are sceptical? Can you elaborate on that? I'm curious about your opinion...
Ordie
12-20-2007, 09:17 PM
Now that the borders are droped between Czech Republic and Slovakia, can we call it Czechoslovakia again?
I really missed that country. It was fun to ****ounce it.
Telmar
12-21-2007, 04:13 AM
Now that the borders are droped between Czech Republic and Slovakia, can we call it Czechoslovakia again?
I really missed that country. It was fun to ****ounce it.
That is no doubt the biggest irony of it all...Interior Minister Kalinak was at one of the crossings the 14 year old Czech/Slovak border with his Czech counterpart.
People from Bratislava (the capital of Slovakia is right on the Austrian border) went to the Berg crossing. Big party and fireworks even with the cold. Flags of the EU and all of Slovak's neighbours were present. Well organized event.
For a video, follow the link
http://www.sme.sk/c/3646933/Berg-O-polnoci-otvorili-slovensko-rakusku-hranicu.html
Telmar
12-21-2007, 04:14 AM
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/9751/44313923schengen416mapyg5.gif (http://imageshack.us)
http://img505.imageshack.us/img505/9751/44313923schengen416mapyg5.29884c22e8.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=505&i=44313923schengen416mapyg5.gif)
Thank christ for the sea.
That's what I think all the time too! p-)
daily666
12-21-2007, 04:22 AM
I have this one idea you know. One really should refound the USSR somewhere. A small region would be enough this time, preferably in some out of the way place (Eastern Siberia or something). Surround it with barbwire and then send two types of people there: firstly those who miss socialism (so that they can live how they want) and secondly those idiots who compare the EU with the Sovietunion, so that they can learn the difference.
Generally, I must say that I welcome the end of the border controls to Poland, Slovakia and Hungary. I admit that I was and am sceptical wether it was a good idea to enlarge the EU so soon as we did, but since we have chosen to do so, it is only consistent to do it all the way.
Damn, bad news I always liked the thrill of approaching the gates at bordercrossing with Germany. You never knew what's gonna happen next. p-)
And I think Switek made a joke about the EU and USSR.
The Czechoslovakia thing, yeah, the irony.
But seriously, I admit I like this idea and this is the last symbol of the cruel system imposed on Eastern Europe by the Soviets that now have vanished. Churchill would approve it!
Kitsune
12-21-2007, 10:15 AM
@Granit:
I was sceptical about the EU enlargement simply because an ever larger number of member countries made it more and more difficult to agree on anything. It was already difficult with fifteen countries but with almost double that number it became almost impossible. And that at a time when the European Union had not even managed to decide on its basic game rules. As everyone knows there are considerable differences in opinion about how far Union authorities should extend and where they should stop. In my opinion it would have been wiser to work these problems out among the fifteen "West Europeans" nations before admitting the "East Europeans". This enlargement step is quite an undertaking, wether pure economics or politics are concerned and it would have been better to do it with an EU which has found a certain identity and knows what it is about and what it is not.
Anyway, this point is moot now since the ones who wanted enlargement first have won and that is now the world we live in and have to live with. That being so, the enlargement of the Schengen zone is only a consistent step.
Freibier
12-21-2007, 10:54 AM
Looking at that map - now would be a good time to kick out Britain and Ireland :D
Kitsune
12-21-2007, 11:10 AM
Looking at that map - now would be a good time to kick out Britain and Ireland :D
It's true that when one looks at that map those two nations seem pretty colorless indeed - but to kick them out? Wouldn't that be a bit too harsh? At least have mercy with the Irish, they are trying so hard. p-)
Freibier
12-21-2007, 11:14 AM
Yeah, forcing them back together with ze tommies would be harsh indeed
Switek
12-21-2007, 12:40 PM
@ Kitsune, :), daily was right. I was kidding with a little bit of sarcasm... ;)
I heard on the news, that finnish border guard gets over 1500 criminals/year in border by these border checkings etc.... And not anymore, when this is going to happen.
NuckmasterJ
12-21-2007, 01:37 PM
What happens when a criminal is fleeing from the law and crosses into another country? Someone has to get on the phone and let said country know he is coming or can law enforcement cross the boarder under the circumstance?
I was thinking, have the germans been buying up land in Preussen?
The prices on land there must be cheap by german standards and when you can cross the boarder just as easily as into another bundesland, plus the overall EU integration, it seems favourable.
Telmar
12-21-2007, 01:53 PM
What happens when a criminal is fleeing from the law and crosses into another country? Someone has to get on the phone and let said country know he is coming or can law enforcement cross the boarder under the circumstance?
Under Article 41 of the Schengen Agreement, police from one Schengen state may cross national borders to chase their target for up to 30 km ('hot pursuit'). The officers either have to wear their uniforms, or their vehicles have to be marked as police vehicles. The officers may only use their weapons for self-defence. Many neighboring Schengen states have introduced further bilateral measures for police cooperation in border regions, which are expressly permitted under Article 39 subsection 5 of the Schengen Agreement. Such cooperation may include joint police radio frequencies, police control centres, and tracing units in border regions.
Source:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schengen_Agreement
What happens when a criminal is fleeing from the law and crosses into another country? Someone has to get on the phone and let said country know he is coming or can law enforcement cross the boarder under the circumstance?
I live pretty close to the Dutch border. The police forces work together closely. I don't know the exact procedures, but for example i recall a case where the dutch set roadblocks after there was a bank robbery in our city and the attackers fled into the Netherlands. Or another one where a German 12 year old ran amok with a car and crossed into the Netherlands. They are closely knit and share intel. And i think the police can cross the border to a certain degree, but no need for when the others are already waiting. It's not so much different then between the different German states or maybe like in the U.S.
edit: read the post above
Telmar
12-21-2007, 01:57 PM
I heard on the news, that finnish border guard gets over 1500 criminals/year in border by these border checkings etc.... And not anymore, when this is going to happen.
Why? And from what border?
Why? And from what border?
Yeah, as if Russia is part of Schengen. Though he could mean the ferry traffic between Estonia and Finland. Doubt it though. p-)
Telmar
12-21-2007, 02:04 PM
I live pretty close to the Dutch border. The police forces work together closely. I don't know the exact procedures, but for example i recall a case where the dutch set roadblocks after there was a bank robbery in our city and the attackers fled into the Netherlands. Or another one where a German 12 year old ran amok with a car and crossed into the Netherlands. They are closely knit and share intel. And i think the police can cross the border to a certain degree, but no need for when the others are already waiting. It's not so much different then between the different German states or maybe like in the U.S.
...
Interesting and concrete illustration of it.
Mishka Zubov
12-21-2007, 02:12 PM
More concrete details:
They have this sophisticated database. Anytime a smuggler crosses the Ukrainian-Polish (Schengen) border with one carton of cigarettes too many he is immediately reported to that database. And the Dutch police will know it about it at once. :-)
SkyUS
12-21-2007, 02:19 PM
More concrete details:
They have this sophisticated database. Anytime a smuggler crosses the Ukrainian-Polish (Schengen) border with one carton of cigarettes too many he is immediately reported to that database. And the Dutch police will know it about it at once. :-)
Schengen Information System to be exact, I believe
Why? And from what border?
Helsinki border checkpoints,. mainly from ship traffic Helsinki-Tallinn for example.
Telmar
12-21-2007, 02:33 PM
The Estonians were only accepted because of their proved ability to monitor the border with non Shengen nations and their ability to share info on criminals with other police forces.
Finnish police are allowed to check for international criminals. And Finland may occasionnaly control its borders as it has done two years ago. (World athletics meeting I think)
As the Minister of the Interior of Slovakia said, Shengen only opens borders for decent people...
What crime did the criminals picked up at the Helsinki ferry terminal have time to do? Did they stick up a duty free shop? :)
daily666
12-21-2007, 02:44 PM
I was thinking, have the germans been buying up land in Preussen?
The prices on land there must be cheap by german standards and when you can cross the boarder just as easily as into another bundesland, plus the overall EU integration, it seems favourable.
They are not allowed to, untlil 2013 IIRC.
Interesting that there is such a provision, thanks.
Presuming that it doesnt apply to others maybe it would be a good idea to speculate in some land close to the german border and exit at some point after 2013.
As the Minister of the Interior of Slovakia said, Shengen only opens borders for decent people...
What crime did the criminals picked up at the Helsinki ferry terminal have time to do? Did they stick up a duty free shop? :)
Most of these 1500 criminals are people trying to drive drunk or people with outstanding fines, those can be caught without checking passports at the border. Organized crime hasn't been confined by national borders for years, if ever, it's about time ordinary citizens get to enjoy the same comfort. If anything, the increased cross border police cooperation will improve crime fighting.
Anyway, this was eventually going to happen one day, now is a good of a time as any.
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