If you´re a jewish in the Temple Mount don´t even move your lips.

[Ariha]

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/940710.html

I´m for barring jewish presence in the Temple Mount in the first place on religious grounds, but if the government allows that, then how comes it forbids jewish religious displays in the jewish world´s most important place?

[Ordie]

I thought the Temple Mount site was the location of the Holy of Holies where traditionally only specific Jewish priests had access. I understand certian Jewish sects do not allow access based on this premise.

However, I may be wrong.

It was also the location of the Knight's Templars headquarters.

[Hollis]

I thought the Temple Mount site was the location of the Holy of Holies where traditionally only specific Jewish priests had access. I understand certian Jewish sects do not allow access based on this premise.

However, I may be wrong.

It was also the location of the Knight's Templars headquarters.


That is what I heard to.

Getting upset from a article from Haaretz, is like getting upset from a article from the NY Times or listening to Rush L.

[Ariha]

I think you´re right. The Temple was a complex, and the Holy of Holies was the most sacred part in which the Arc of the Alliance rested, access was very limited, and even the Grand Priest (?) would enter ponly in the High Holidays with a rope attached to his leg for fear he would die and would be necessary to extract his body.

In order to access to the premise the jews were to be "purified" by taking a "mikveh" (ritual bath), this and other conditions render the Temple Mount off limits for the Jews.

That´s why there isn´t an issue for me, and the behaviour of some jews who want to perform religious acts there stems (always in my opinion) from the fact that they want to assert their presence in face of the muslums who pillage and desecrate the site by removing religious artifacts from the I and II Temples periods. They feel insecure, the first two Temples were built on clear instructions of G-d, it is said that the III will be built by His Hand.

Knight´s Templars Hqs were above the place known as "Solomon Stables". But of course the jewish Temples and the Hqs are myths according to the muslum authorities (The Waqf), whose guides are instructed to deny the presence of the Temples.

[SeanAshi]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v320/SeanAshi/TempleMount.jpg

This does not include the Western Wall though the Waqf seems to think so.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Temple

[kamaz]

according to my fading Yeshiva knowledge, Har Habayit was only limited to the Cohens (the guys with the metal breastplate full of jewels - they had these guys in Indiana Jones and Last crusade)

only the Cohens were pure enough spiritually to enter it, whatever that means.

[Hollis]

according to my fading Yeshiva knowledge, Har Habayit was only limited to the Cohens (the guys with the metal breastplate full of jewels - they had these guys in Indiana Jones and Last crusade)

only the Cohens were pure enough spiritually to enter it, whatever that means.


yep, the Kohen Gadol was the only one premitted. There is more though. He also had a roped tied to him, to retreave the body if he wasn't so "pure".

I think a lot of this is political motivated on the part of the waqf. At one time, is my understanding, Jews were GTG to pray in a mosque.

[kamaz]

here we go, the chief Cohen


http://www.messianic-torah-truth-seeker.org/Torah/Kohen/kohen-garments.jpg

[Ordie]

Cohens were pure enough spiritually to enter it, whatever that means.

Borat can go in?

[kamaz]

Borat can go in?

actually as funny as this sounds, the etymology of his last name, Cohen - in all likelyhood he is descendant from the Cohen tribe, the very tribe that had access to the Temple Mount. Its nayiiiice!!

[Rifleman]

It's Kohen, there are very few alive today who are pure Kohen. As to the third temple, I'd say it will be built very soon.

[SeanAshi]

It's Kohen, there are very few alive today who are pure Kohen. As to the third temple, I'd say it will be built very soon.

The Temple Mount Faithful would like to build it now which would piss of the muslim world to no end but Israel wont allow it, there are no plans to build the third Temple.

[kamaz]

the last thing the entire world needs is religious nutjobs from both sides. In a perfect world, all these mosques and temple mounts would be paved over to make way for cancer reasearch laboratories or other institutions that actually benefit mankind, rather than drag it back to the primitive religious times.

[Ariha]

Borat can go in?

I wouldn´t recommend him to do if he wears this swimsuit.

http://www.bumperactive.com/images/blogPix/kyle/98/boratFront.jpg

Even the rope wouldn´t save him...

[Rifleman]

The Temple Mount Faithful would like to build it now which would piss of the muslim world to no end but Israel wont allow it, there are no plans to build the third Temple.

At most I say ten years.

[SeanAshi]

At most I say ten years.

In order to build it they will have to make room. What will become of the Dome of the Rock and al Aqsa mosque?

[Ordie]

In order to build it they will have to make room. What will become of the Dome of the Rock and al Aqsa mosque?

I don't think anyone will be alive to see it. We're all going to get nuked as a result.

If it does works out, I will get into the business of breeding Red heifers.

[Andreas]

Pretty cool suit, looks like something out of world of warcraft..

[FutureGrunt]

according to my fading Yeshiva knowledge, Har Habayit was only limited to the Cohens (the guys with the metal breastplate full of jewels - they had these guys in Indiana Jones and Last crusade)

only the Cohens were pure enough spiritually to enter it, whatever that means.

Or enough jewels and gold :)

[Hollis]

In order to build it they will have to make room. What will become of the Dome of the Rock and al Aqsa mosque?


I was listening to a guy, go over this. According to him there was room for both. According to him the Mosque is located in the court yard of the old temple. He seemed to know what he was talking about. Or ????

[IraGlacialis]

What?! Incorperate the Dome of the Rock into the Third Temple? That sounds too much like a practical compromise.

[Hollis]

What?! Incorperate the Dome of the Rock into the Third Temple? That sounds too much like a practical compromise.


Thats was part of his talk, It was doable. One of the biggest reservation on rebuilding the temple is the global Islamic response it the Mosque was harmed or destroyed.

[IraGlacialis]

Frankly I think it would be nice, if the Third Temple was to be built, the Dome should be incorperated. It is quite a beautiful structure that, despite the Quaranic writing on the sides, can be converted to a tri-religious structure.


Then again, on the other hand, one of my freinds said that there should be a ultimatum given to the Arabs and Israelis. If there is no visible peace process and negotiation, the entire Temple Mount (the hill itself and anything on it) would be completely leveled and reduced to dust (not even rubble). Then atheists and neo-pagans will dance on top of level ground.
Considering that I am quite religious, I don't quite agree with that idea, but I can see the philosophy behind it.

[Hollis]

Frankly I think it would be nice, if the Third Temple was to be built, the Dome should be incorperated. It is quite a beautiful structure that, despite the Quaranic writing on the sides, can be converted to a tri-religious structure.


Then again, on the other hand, one of my freinds said that there should be a ultimatum given to the Arabs and Israelis. If there is no visible peace process and negotiation, the entire Temple Mount (the hill itself and anything on it) would be completely leveled and reduced to dust (not even rubble). Then atheists and neo-pagans will dance on top of level ground.
Considering that I am quite religious, I don't quite agree with that idea, but I can see the philosophy behind it.


It is probably now mostly politically motivated. I would not discount the religious aspect either. Replacement theology has it's Achilles tendon when it comes to the predecessor religion making a come back.

[IraGlacialis]

It's quite old, but this guy had an interesting idea for the new Temple.
Have a hologram of the temple hovering above the Mount.
http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.04/holyland.html

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.04/images/FF_144_holyland_a.jpg

If anything, it seems that the evangelists here in the US are the loudest about the Temple Mount situation.

[LRPV]

the last thing the entire world needs is religious nutjobs from both sides. In a perfect world, all these mosques and temple mounts would be paved over to make way for cancer reasearch laboratories or other institutions that actually benefit mankind, rather than drag it back to the primitive religious times.

1. 'tick' ...absolutely correct.

2. Spot the atheist.

3. Thanks for the light, I was able to light my cigarette from the flames..

[LRPV]

If it does works out, I will get into the business of breeding Red heifers.


LOL.:)

The recorded instances so far have lost their red colour past the calf stage. Genetic engineering perhaps?

[SeanAshi]

I was listening to a guy, go over this. According to him there was room for both. According to him the Mosque is located in the court yard of the old temple. He seemed to know what he was talking about. Or ????

It being the 3rd holiest site in Islam they would never go for it. This is how serious they take that site.

The Northern Exit and Riots


Originally, tourists in the tunnel had to retrace their steps back to the entrance. A connection to the Hasmonean water system was made, but this still required tourists to eventually make a U-turn once they had reached the Struthion pool.

On 24 September, 1996, the then Prime Minister, Binyamin Netanyahu, ordered that a new exit be cut through from the Struthion Pool area to the Via Dolorosa nearby. Yasser Arafat commented on the event, alleging the real aim was to make the Haram al-Sharif collapse (though the tunnel follows the outside of the Western Wall and does not go under the Temple Mount). Riots erupted in which 70 Palestinians and 16 IDF soldiers were killed.



The Palestinians tried to instigate riots over this last year.
http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/Jerusalem+Capital+of+Israel/The+Mugrabi+Gate+Access+Restoration+Project+-+Feb+2007.htm

[Hollis]

It being the 3rd holiest site in Islam they would never go for it. This is how serious they take that site.


The Palestinians tried to instigate riots over this last year.
http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/Jerusalem+Capital+of+Israel/The+Mugrabi+Gate+Access+Restoration+Project+-+Feb+2007.htm


I am not sure if it is the 3rd holiest, maybe after 1948 it became that. It is not mentioned in the Qur'an, I am not sure if it is even mentioned in the Hadiths.

I would also suggest a person reviewing other Mosques that were built over another culture religious building. Let say India. The look at what is said about those Mosques.

I do agree with you contention, Political Islam will never go for it. I am not sure if Religious Islam will also.

[Limeyfellow]

I am not sure if it is the 3rd holiest, maybe after 1948 it became that. It is not mentioned in the Qur'an, I am not sure if it is even mentioned in the Hadiths.

Well there is the passage from the seventeenth Sura that refers to Mohummad's visit to the temple with the Archangel Gabriel amongst the winged steed El Burak, where he met with Moses, Jesus and other prophets and led them in prayer before being carried up into the heavens to meet Allah and be given instruction on how to live their lives, before being flown back to Mecca and formed alot of the teachings of Islam.

What I feel lost for is the Temple of Jupiter. No one ever cares about protecting that and it stood there for centuries.

The Dome of the Rock was then built on the rock as a representation of faith inspired by Mohummad's journey. There was also a political and religious conflict reasons that is was built there too. These range from the conflict when Mecca fell under a rival caliphate ruled over by Abd Allah ibn Zubayr. This it was left to Abd al-Malik to build in Jerusalem to convince the people not to go to Mecca and instead pray where they were. The other reason to build was as a rival to the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, which was at the time the most impressive religious building in the city and the proclaimed place where Jesus was crucified and raised from the dead and was considered a way to challenge the conversions of the native to Christianity instead of Islam.

[Hollis]

Limey, do you have the ayat. The current political view is Muhammed assended in to heaven from there, but that is not Qur'anic.

17th is Bani Israel,


Also one could claim in Al Maedah ayat 20-25 that it is clear that Israel belongs to the Bani Israel.

Jersusalem is not mentioned once in the Qur'an.

[Heinemann]

Well there is the passage from the seventeenth Sura that refers to Mohummad's visit to the temple with the Archangel Gabriel amongst the winged steed El Burak,

Visited the temple? History tells us the temple was destroyed 500 odd years before Muhammad was alive :cantbeli:

[Ariha]

Visited the temple? History tells us the temple was destroyed 500 odd years before Muhammad was alive :cantbeli:

Nevermind. The Al Aksa mosque was built 120 odd years after the tale Muhammad related. In fact in the Al Israa/Al Miraj tale he recounts his night journey on the back of the his flying horse Al Burak, he talks about the "masjid al aksa" that means "the furthest mosque" and gives no precision about its whereabout, because he probably spoke of a mosque that was just a little further than Mecca. When the Umayyads disputed the power to the Meccan rulers, they had the bright idea to build a mosque on top of the "Har Habayit" (Temple Mount) and they named it Masjid Al Aksa in order to displace some of the religious influence and have prestige by confusing the recent construction with the structure named in Ubul Al Kassims story.

[kamaz]

1. 'tick' ...absolutely correct.

2. Spot the atheist.

3. Thanks for the light, I was able to light my cigarette from the flames..

Im not an athiest. Im an anti-theist.

[Ariha]

Im not an athiest. Im an anti-theist.

From the way you "complicate" the concepts, no wonder :you´re jew.

[JJC]

the last thing the entire world needs is religious nutjobs from both sides. In a perfect world, all these mosques and temple mounts would be paved over to make way for cancer reasearch laboratories or other institutions that actually benefit mankind, rather than drag it back to the primitive religious times.

You say that and the small community of Gedolim can prove otherwise based on past and current history without any Torah lessons. woot

[MichaelF]

http://www.messianic-torah-truth-seeker.org/Torah/Kohen/kohen-garments.jpg

That is one dapper dude.

[Asheren]

the last thing the entire world needs is religious nutjobs from both sides. In a perfect world, all these mosques and temple mounts would be paved over to make way for cancer reasearch laboratories or other institutions that actually benefit mankind, rather than drag it back to the primitive religious times.

Well radioactive wasteland would also be acceptable.

[Hollis]

Well radioactive wasteland would also be acceptable.


I would advise not getting into "religion" bashing or flame baiting.

[h22chen]

http://www.messianic-torah-truth-seeker.org/Torah/Kohen/kohen-garments.jpg

That is one dapper dude.

Yea, cool. Each jewel = each tribe right?

[h22chen]

At most I say ten years.

I better get married ASAP then. p-)

[Asheren]

I would advise not getting into "religion" bashing or flame baiting.

I am just tired sometimes of all this muslim,jewish middle east thing. Sometimes i think it would be better to just let them all nuke eachother.