WW 1 French Trench Raiders

[Salonen]

In french, nettoyeurs de tranchées, I think. Does anyone knows how they were organized, when they were created, their history, etc, etc?

Looking forward hearing from all.

[stonecutter]

I believe that trench raiding was a little tradition started by Canadian troops, as a way of gathering intel, demoralizing the enemy, and keeping the men occupied. Liason officers then passed on the details to interested French officers. Can't remember where I read this, maybe in Pierre Burton's book Vimy.

*edit* sorry, the nettoyeurs de tranchees (literally: trench cleaners) were used for mopping up operations, not raiding... Here's some info, if you can read French: http://www.faurillon.com/nettoyeurs.htm

[ex1cdo]

There's an entire chapter dedicated to Canadian trench raiders in Tim Cook's recent At The Sharp End (http://www.canadaandthegreatwar.com/).

Well worth a read.

[Salonen]

If the nettoyeurs de tranchees were used for mopping up operations, what was french trench raiders called, if there were any organized french raider units?

Looking forward hearing from all.

[baboon6]

I don't know about France but in Commonwealth armies trench raids were carried out by all infantry units.

[Johnny_H02]

I believe that trench raiding was a little tradition started by Canadian troops, as a way of gathering intel, demoralizing the enemy, and keeping the men occupied. Liason officers then passed on the details to interested French officers. Can't remember where I read this, maybe in Pierre Burton's book Vimy.

*edit* sorry, the nettoyeurs de tranchees (literally: trench cleaners) were used for mopping up operations, not raiding... Here's some info, if you can read French: http://www.faurillon.com/nettoyeurs.htm

While it is fact that Canadians had the most initial success in trench raids, we didn't invent it nor were we the first to do so. Imperial troops carried out the first trench raids but the first raids with great successes were carried out by Canadian troops, so much so that some of them were tasked with Training, British and Aussie units on the tricks of the trade.

Not all were successful though, some were down right sham's and suicidal.
But hindsight is 20/20. One thing about Burton is that he is a excellent writer but often his writings are "popular history" he skims other peoples works and puts them together in his book, and writes rather "Creatively" an example in Vimy is he mentions a German Regiment coming into the line to face the Canadians and his words roughly are "and the tall guards of (insert Guards Regiment here) sneered down at the Canadians" ... its a little sensationalized to say the least. Sorry for the lack of exact quotes but I'm laid up in bed and tired and should be asleep, and im certainly not arsed to go flip through the book for the quote.

Good book though, was a fun read.

[loganinkosovo]

I don't know about France but in Commonwealth armies trench raids were carried out by all infantry units.

Yes. And tactics were constantly changing and evolving. At one point squads were broken down into Riflemen, Bombers and LGM sections. This was a short lived tactic which lasted until some Bombers, who were only armed with grenades, ran up against targets where rifles were needed. :)

http://www.greatwardifferent.com/Great_War/Trench_Raids/War%20Illustrated%20-%20Trench%20Raid%20005.jpg


http://www.greatwardifferent.com/Great_War/Trench_Raids/War%20Illustrated%20-%20Trench%20Raid%20001.jpg

[roland]

"Nettoyeurs de tranchées" aren't raiders. The "Nettoyeurs de tranchées" were units that followed the first or second wave during an offensive. There mission was to "clean" the trenches from the enemy soldier still alive on enemy trenches once our first waves went over it.
That way the assault troops didn't had to waste time completing the job and could continue on there elan without risk of being attacked from the back.

Here is a little sumary of what you can find on internet french pages about the "nettoyeurs de tranchées":

Like often in the french army of WWI it started from local initiatives based on experience. The "nettoyeur de tranchées" job was formalized only in 17.
There weapons were grenades, hand guns, knives and "home made" tools like sharpened Shovels. Mostly grenades. At the beginning the french soldiers didn't had knives. They used "home made" knives modifying bayonets or sabres. But they got army knives as soon as 1915, 100,000 were ordered in october.

here is some nettoyeurs de tranchée, with unregular equipments
http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/4433/corpsfranc2az.jpg


But I guess Salonen wanted to speak of trench raiders, what we would call Commandos today. The few I know about it: those troops existed as well but unlike the "nettoyeurs de tranchée" never were officialized.
France was a country of paysants and hunters, there were always enough volonteers to infiltrate on the no man's land to take prisonners or destroy an observation point before an offensive or when we needed to have some intelligence about the enemy.
In the book "La main coupée", Blaise Cendrars speak a little about them. Don't know the title of the book in English.

[Salonen]

Thanks Roland.

One more question. During 1939-40 the French Army had organised commando/reconnaisence units called "Corps Francs", part of infantry regiments, again I think. Were they allready part of an infantry regiment, or were they created when the war started?

Looking forward hearing from all.

[Nansouty]

To add on what Roland said, there si also a novel, Capitaine Conan, which was writen in 1934 by Roger Vercel (he won the Prix Goncourt that year ). Of course, it is fiction, but the author served with the Armée d'Orient during WW1, so he must have some experience of what he writes about.

[David Lehmann]

Thanks Roland.

One more question. During 1939-40 the French Army had organised commando/reconnaisence units called "Corps Francs", part of infantry regiments, again I think. Were they allready part of an infantry regiment, or were they created when the war started?

Looking forward hearing from all.

Hello,

The corps franc is a special infiltration and deep reconnaissance unit. It is the equivalent of the German Stosstruppen. Concerning WW2, these corps francs were created in September 1939 with specially selected volunteers at the battalion, regimental and/or divisional level. These elite troops had the mission to infiltrate behind the enemy lines, to collect information, to organize ambushes or raids and to take prisoners.
The smallest element of a corps franc is a team of 6 men called “l’équipe” (= the team) or “sizaine”. All the members of the team have a combat knife, a handgun (revolver or pistol) and many grenades for close combat. These men are usually armed with the mousqueton (carbine) Berthier Mle1892 M16 and in each team there are usually 1-2 SMGs (typically Erma-Vollmer but also MAS38 SMGs, Suomi M31 from which 150 had been sent on the north-eastern front in 1939 and even German captured SMGs and even German captured SMGs) and 1 FM 24/29 LMG to increase the firepower (some captured MG34s are also used). Some shotguns were also used during the patrols. They carried also satchel charges if the mission required explosives. Several teams could be grouped together, for example a squad of 12 men will include 2 FM 24/29 LMGs and 2-4 SMGs and has therefore more automatic weapons than a regular infantry squad. The bigger unit including several teams is called the “groupe franc” (or “trentaine”) with 5 teams (30 men), it corresponds roughly to a platoon. The “groupe franc” is generally commanded by a lieutenant and is completely independent. Several “groupes francs” can be grouped for a specific mission into a “groupement franc”. Such a “groupement franc” includes usually a maximum of 6 “groupes francs” (180 men), roughly a company.

The "SES" = "Section d'Eclaireurs Skieurs" (ski-scouts platoons) are elite deep reconnaissance troops. They play the same role than the corps francs but they are specialized in mountain warfare and winter conditions. They are included in the mountain infantry units.

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The first French airbore troops were e.g. used as groupes francs in 1939.

Fred Geille was born on 19 November 1896. In November 1914, at 18 years old he enlisted in the infantry and fought bravely on different fronts. He is wounded during an assault in April 1915. In 1917, his platoon leader is killed; he takes the command of the unit and pulls the Germans back. He is then promoted 2nd lieutenant and is awarded a citation by the division.
But Geille had a passion for aviation and in 1917 he is formed as aerial observer and enlisted in the BR 7 squadron. He behaved with the same bravery as in the infantry during various missions over the enemy lines. On 15 November 1918, he is awarded a second citation. In July 1919, he is sent in Poland in general Haller’s “blue division”, which was fully armed and equipped in French gear. He earns in Poland a third citation as excellent observer. On 25 May 1919, he flew during a reconnaissance over Tarnopol, 150km behind the enemy lines. The aircrafts was damaged by enemy fire at low altitude but he managed to bring back precious intelligence. Note that he married a Polish wife and had 3 girls with her: Danouta, Maryla and Héléna.
Back in France, he earned is pilot wings on 7 October 1920 and served successively in France, in North Africa and in the Levant (Syria and Lebanon), where he is promoted captain at Christmas 1927. Back in France, he will be in 1935-1937 at the origin of the first French airborne troops.

In 1935 an airborne training center is created by capitaine Geille at Avignon-Pujaut. The first French airborne troops were called "infanterie de l'air" and officially created on 1 April 1937, after a decision taken on 20 October 1936. Two "Groupes de l'Infanterie de l'Air" (GIA.) were formed (601st in Reims and 602nd in Baraki in Algeria).

Each group is composed of:
• one HQ
• one transport aircraft squadron
• one airborne infantry company (= CIA = Compagnie d'Infanterie de l'Air) : 175 men organized in 3 platoons + 1 support platoon (with 2 37mm TR infantry guns and 2 Hotchkiss Mle1914 HMGs).

Groupe de l'infanterie de l'air 601 (1937)
• commander : commandant Mayet (after commandant Arsac)
• commander of the infantry company: capitaine Sauvagnac assisted by lieutenant Glaizot (the lieutenants in the squads are Le Bourhis, Mayer, Audebert, Lespina, Fournier and Foucault)

Groupe de l'infanterie de l'air 602 (1937)
• commander : commandant Michel
• commander of the infantry company: capitaine Loizeau assisted by lieutenant Dupouts (the lieutenants in the squads are Fleury, Morel, Chevalier, Lemaître, Lemire and Bastouil)

Each 12-men squad is armed with Mousqueton Berthier Mle1892 M16, 2 FM 24/29 LMGs per squad, one VB launcher and hand grenades (36 carbines and 6 LMGs in one platoon). The MAS36 CR39, a MAS 36 with foldable stock specially designed for airborne troops was never put into service before the armistice. Seven Boys anti-tank rifles were also already used in the Corps Francs in 1939. The 37mm infantry guns and HMGs are launched in separate containers in the bomb bay of the planes but the small arms are attached to the men during the drop.
The doctrine and formation are inspired from the big Russian trainings observed in Kiev in 1935. Many specific equipments, girdles for the fixation of various equipments, the leg bag etc. are specially studied and realized by the French Air Force. These equipments were presented to the British forces in 1939 and adopted by the British SAS. The parachutes are first American Irvin sport models imported by the SGP (Société Générale des Parachutes) from the factory in England and Russian copies of the Irvin model and later French models: the Aviorex 120 and 130 models.

Concerning the transport aircrafts squadrons:
• GIA 601 started with Potez 650 and received Farman 224 in September 1939
• GIA 602 started with LeO 213 and was equipped with Potez 650 in March 1938

On 7 October 1937, capitaine Sauvagnac beats the world record of free fall without inhalator with 74 seconds.

At First the doctrine is concerning the use of small saboteurs groups for the destruction of factories or bridges. Much training was organized for the new airborne troops. For example in August 1937 the 601st CIA seized a bridge on the Durance and in September 1937 after a drop of 100m only in a rainy sky they seized by surprise the HQ of a whole division.

In October 1938 the whole 601st CIA is dropped on BA112 airbase by 5 planes and in less than 3 minutes after the beginning of the dropping the first 37mm rounds were shot. The German observers invited to this presentation were impressed and unlike the French high command they used these lessons.

In September 1939, the 601st CIA is based in Avignon-Pujaut and the 602nd CIA in Montélimar. In November 1939 they are directed towards Calais where they keep on alert, ready to embark in Farman 224 planes during one week. They were thought to jump over the Flessingue airbase and Arnemuisen isthmus in the Netherlands but the operation was never launched.

The French airborne companies are then used to form 4 "groupes francs" (52 men from the 601st CIA and 91 men from the 602nd CIA commanded by capitaine Glaizot) under the authority of the 28th alpine infantry division in Alsace. These groups are based in the no man's land, in Lembach (Alsace), 12 km NE of Niederbronn (in the operational area of the 7th and 27th BCA - bataillon de chasseurs alpins -, alpine troops).

On February 14, 1940, the four "Groupes Francs":
• Lieutenant Chevalier (based in Lembach)
• Lieutenant Le Bourhis (based in Lembach)
• Lieutenant Audebert (based in Obersteinbach, at 15 km west of Lembach)
• Lieutenant Lemaître (based in Obersteinbach, at 15 km west of Lembach)
are commanded by capitaine Henri Glaizot whose HQ is in Lembach.

Usually the work is divided into 3 days of patrol and 1 resting day during which capitaine Glaizot who is also a pilot, uses a recon plane from the observation squadron of Haguenau.

From 14 February to 11 March 1940 they led 28 patrols and 23 ambushes, sometimes more than 3 km behind the German lines. They lost only 2 KIAs (sergent Baratte - 602nd CIA - on 24 February and sergent Solacroup - 601st CIA - on 7 March) and 3 WIAs. They scored about 30 German soldiers KIA.
From 11 to 17 March, they returned in Niederbronn in the French lines and 54 French parachutists were awarded citations and on 22 March the groupes francs are disbanded, the men return to their infanterie de l'air companies.

Regards,

David

[Salonen]

@ Nansouty. Seen the film, Captain Conan, still have to read the book. But it was the film which made me wonder about about WW 1 french trench raider/commando units.

@ David. Thanks for the Corps francs info. Strange to think, that Joseph Darnard of the milice, served in a CF unit in 1939-40.

[Salonen]

Just read the book Captain Conan by Vercel, and it was really good, can recommend it warmly.

But who knows when the French army started using the star badge/insignia for their corps francs units? It is supposed to be before 1939, because I have seen it mentioned in a french uniform book from 1937-38.

Looking forward hearing from all.