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Ordie
01-31-2008, 01:39 AM
Bill offers rebates, exacts fees based on car emissions




Buyers would get money back on autos with lower emissions and be charged extra on higher polluters.

By Margot Roosevelt, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer

Say you buy a car that coughs out a lot of greenhouse gases. Should you pay more for the privilege of polluting?

And say your neighbor buys a car that spews out far less. Should he be rewarded for helping to save the planet?
This week, the California Assembly is expected to vote on the California Clean Car Discount Act, which, if passed, would be the nation's first "feebate" law, imposing charges and granting rebates based on a vehicle's emission of carbon dioxide and other gases.

One-time registration fees of up to $2,500 would be levied on new gas guzzlers, such as Hummers, Dodge Vipers and Chevy Tahoes. Some cleaner sport utility vehicles, pickups and minivans would be exempt from any charge, while the Toyota Prius, Honda Civic, Nissan Sentra and other fuel-efficient cars would get hefty rebates.

The bill, AB 493, is among a raft of measures under consideration in the Legislature and, behind the scenes, by officials at California's powerful Air Resources Board, to press the auto industry to do its part to fight global warming.

"We put 1.8 million vehicles a year on the road in California," said Assemblyman Ira Ruskin (D-Redwood City), the bill's author. "We have to find ways to get more clean cars on the road and more dirty cars off. There's no time to waste if we're to avoid the catastrophes ahead from global warming."

A previous version of the bill was narrowly defeated in the Assembly in June after seven Democrats from the Los Angeles region, under heavy lobbying from auto dealers, abstained from the vote. Strategists say supporters of the bill need five of those seven legislators if it is to pass this time.

The fence-sitters included Mike Davis (Los Angeles), Mervyn Dymally (Compton); Hector De la Torre (South Gate); Tony Mendoza (Artesia); Felipe Fuentes (Sylmar); Edward Hernandez (West Covina) and Jose Solorio (Santa Ana).

This time the measure may have a better chance. The state is reeling from the Bush administration's refusal to allow enforcement of a 2002 state law to cut carbon emissions from vehicle tailpipes by 30% in the next eight years.

Unless that decision is reversed in court, overruled by federal legislation or withdrawn by the next president, those tons of emissions must be cut by other means.

Feebate laws have been enacted in Canada, Finland and France, and in the European Union overall, countries are moving to tax cars based on carbon emissions. In the United States, feebates have also been considered in New York, Massachusetts, Connecticut and Vermont.

"Industry argues that market signals don't exist for consumers to buy low-greenhouse-gas and fuel-efficient vehicles," said Daniel Sperling, director of the UC Davis Institute of Transportation Studies and a member of the Air Resources Board. "This bill fixes the market forces."

Even if California is able to enact limits on tailpipe emissions, other strategies would be needed to meet the state's broader commitment to slash heat-trapping gases to 1990 levels over the next 13 years, officials say. That goal requires radical cuts in transportation emissions, which are responsible for about 40% of California's carbon footprint, according to the air board.

While the board has not formally endorsed the bill, Chairwoman Mary Nichols said, "We've been looking at feebates for a long time. A modest break for consumers to buy cleaner cars is a good deal."

Auto companies, whose profit margins are higher on big cars, vigorously oppose feebates.

"Feebates harm businesses and consumers who need a range of vehicles," said Gloria Bergquist of the Washington, D.C.-based Alliance of Automobile Manufacturers, noting that carbon emissions will drop due to a new average fuel economy standard of 35 miles per gallon by 2020.

Brian Maas, a lobbyist for the California Motor Car Dealers Assn., predicted a dip in sales tax revenue from the law. "If it is successful, and more people buy fuel-efficient vehicles, those are smaller, less expensive cars. We're talking about a hit to local and state government in the millions of dollars."

Under the bill, the air board would rank passenger vehicles, beginning with 2011 models, according to the amount of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases they emit.

Fees and rebates would be applied on a sliding scale. About a quarter of vehicles would be unaffected, and about 35% would be charged a fee collected by auto dealers and sent to the State Board of Equalization. The fees would pay for rebates to about 40% of purchasers.

The Union of Concerned Scientists, an advocacy group that worked closely with Ruskin, estimates that California's emissions could drop by as much as 57 million metric tons a year by 2030 as a result of the feebates. That would be equivalent to taking about 9 million cars and trucks off the road.

Opponents, including automakers and the United Auto Workers, warn that the fees could have a disproportionate effect on lower-income buyers who may need large family cars and businesses that haul equipment.

"What if some poor guy in Watts retires and says, 'I want an SUV,' " Dymally said. "Do you punish him for that?"

The bill exempts low-income buyers -- defined as those at or below twice the federal poverty level -- as well as businesses with fewer than 25 workers, from surcharges.

And even for those without exemptions, "there would be a tremendous amount of choice in each category," Ruskin said.

Advocates counter that air pollution aggravated by global warming disproportionately affects poor neighborhoods. A cleaner fleet, they say, would reduce the asthma, heart disease and other illnesses that plague poor communities.

So far, 83 organizations, nearly twice as many as last year, have endorsed Ruskin's bill, including the American Lung Assn. and the Silicon Valley Leadership Group, a business coalition. But the opposition has powerful allies too, including the California Chamber of Commerce.

Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger, a Hummer driver, has yet to take a position.

Regardless of whether the feebate bill passes, pressure is mounting to find new ways to deal with transportation emissions.

In a letter last month, Senate President Pro Tem Don Perata (D-Oakland) urged the air board to move beyond the battle with the federal government over tailpipe standards and "to act with appropriate speed and creativity" on such measures as "efficient car purchase incentives, smart growth investments, increased transit usage and other means."

Some environmentalists want the board to use its "zero-emission vehicle" regulations to require auto companies to move to a 100% hybrid-electric fleet by the end of the next decade. Others want to bring automakers under a statewide cap on emissions so that they would have to seek offsets in order to sell vehicles that emit more than a certain level of greenhouse gases.

State Atty. Gen. Jerry Brown, the Legislature and the air board are all grappling with how to encourage cities and counties to control sprawl and promote mass transit as a way to reduce driving.

State officials are optimistic that they will win their court fight against the federal Environmental Protection Agency over tailpipe standards and make a big dent in auto emissions through regulations that 16 other states have pledged to adopt. But they intend to forge ahead with other strategies in the meantime.

"Everything is on the table," Sperling said.

Source:http://www.latimes.com/news/custom/scimedemail/la-me-feebate27jan27,0,1436409,full.story

2Sheds_Jackson
01-31-2008, 12:38 PM
IMHO this has nothing to do with helping the environment or encouraging conservation - just a plain old money grab. They should either outright ban cars they don't like, or forget about it.

WARPIG
01-31-2008, 12:41 PM
Sounds like state sponsored social engineering as well. I guess the hippy state is looking more and more like a dictatorship than the rest of us "squares."

Just sort of helps illustrate how communism is basically a liberal ideal.

Laworkerbee
01-31-2008, 01:30 PM
I'm fine with One-time registration fees for huge vehicles that people can't drive for crap here and don't need, hell I'm for the fee's simply because those vehicles take up too much parking space.

But I'm dead set against rebates.

I find the quote from the United Auto Workers guy pretty funny

"What if some poor guy in Watts retires and says, 'I want an SUV,' " Dymally said. "Do you punish him for that?"

How in the hell is a poor guy from a bad neighborhood going to afford an SUV, let alone the gas and insurance on such a monster?

wotsnext
01-31-2008, 01:34 PM
"Congestion charge" coming to a city near you soon p-)

noname
01-31-2008, 05:26 PM
Hand over your papers comrade.

deagle
01-31-2008, 05:37 PM
i think its the big wigs finally putting their money where their mouths are, always spewing about environment, and finally passing rules that would help. why can't manufacturers make all cars environmentally fuel efficient (maybe one day i hope).

Ought Six
01-31-2008, 11:34 PM
LAwb:
"I'm fine with One-time registration fees for huge vehicles that people can't drive for crap here and don't need...."Nice to know that you are out there deciding what the rest of us do and do not need. :|

Laworkerbee
02-01-2008, 04:24 PM
LAwb:Nice to know that you are out there deciding what the rest of us do and do not need. :|

The only I decide whats right for my corner of the world is in the voting booth Pal ;-)

shocker1
02-01-2008, 04:28 PM
The only I decide whats right for my corner of the world is in the voting booth Pal ;-)
Stop electing these people your corner of the world sends it's ideas East.:)

BugHunt
02-01-2008, 05:43 PM
Feebate if done correctly is a intelligent method of encouraging better technology....

http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/view/id/51

Ordie
02-01-2008, 05:54 PM
Stop electing these people your corner of the world sends it's ideas East.:)

We need to balance the crap somehow.

shocker1
02-01-2008, 05:57 PM
We need to balance the crap somehow.
It is just a plot to sell more Secondary Air pumps.

Merfeller
02-02-2008, 12:28 AM
I'm fine with One-time registration fees for huge vehicles that people can't drive for crap here and don't need, hell I'm for the fee's simply because those vehicles take up too much parking space.

But I'm dead set against rebates.

I find the quote from the United Auto Workers guy pretty funny


How in the hell is a poor guy from a bad neighborhood going to afford an SUV, let alone the gas and insurance on such a monster?

Who says a gas guzzler has to be expensive or new? What if I'm poor and I buy a raggedy old Suburban for a few hundred bucks? I still have to go to the DMV and obtain plates and reg. I suppose this person could be grandfathered out of the fee, but you get my point...exceptions breed loopholes. People will always find a way to circumvent the system.

Laworkerbee
02-02-2008, 12:09 PM
Who says a gas guzzler has to be expensive or new? What if I'm poor and I buy a raggedy old Suburban for a few hundred bucks? I still have to go to the DMV and obtain plates and reg. I suppose this person could be grandfathered out of the fee, but you get my point...exceptions breed loopholes. People will always find a way to circumvent the system.

Very true

Lots of folks with money drive to Oregon to purchase cars because there is no sales tax there, though illegal I see Oregon plates on expensive cars often.

Same thing will happen with this law.

perdurabo
02-02-2008, 03:07 PM
Who says a gas guzzler has to be expensive or new? What if I'm poor and I buy a raggedy old Suburban for a few hundred bucks? I still have to go to the DMV and obtain plates and reg. I suppose this person could be grandfathered out of the fee, but you get my point...exceptions breed loopholes. People will always find a way to circumvent the system.
there is also other option for poor - don't buy used suburban, buy some smaller car like 2-3 years old skoda fabia, toyota yaris or other city carp-)

SOG
02-02-2008, 09:21 PM
Decent law if it worked. But just like the California State Tax on Soda, nothing but a grab for more tax money. I would have no problem if this actually ushered in a grand scheme/plan to reduce emissions and possibly give those who purchase a hybrid of sorts a discount that the state picks up. Tax the lottery more or some ****.

cbreedon
02-03-2008, 02:35 AM
I really wish Cali would seceed....

Ordie
02-03-2008, 07:00 PM
I really wish Cali would seceed....
Me too.......