South African perceptions of the US

[Trident-za]

http://www.news24.com/News24/South_Africa/Bush_in_Africa/0,,2-7-1505_1382966,00.html

It pains me to post this link, because I am pro-US. But, in the interests of free speech, and the right of my fellow countryman to express their opinion, here it is.

Truth is often less important than perception..... if any of you Americans wondered how South Africans viewed your country, here is the answer (unfortunately).

[Again, this is NOT my view, but democracy rules, yes?]

[You should, if you read the entire article, see lots of anti-SA politican stuff too - this country is an unhappy place right now - too much politician bull****]

[ibstolidude]

I actually don't see anything so negative with posting this...
this is no different than in the US:
- some people hate Bush (policies, party, whatever)
- some people like Bush
- some people are indifferent
- some people take the middle

I would venture that a similiar email survey could be done for policies of South Africa on the same website and you would get responces for and against - some educated and some not. - no different.

I would also say that about most governments...

On the other hand I certainly would agree that many of the policies of Bush make those lines of for/against very clearly defined, and draw up rather emotional responses in many people.

Interesting Post - thanks

[Trident-za]

I was not trying to post something "anti-US" - merely trying to give you guys an indication of what (some) people in SA think of the US. Simple.

Might I please add that I am personally embarssased at the prospect of "anti-american" sentiment cropping up in the Bush visit to SA. Democracy is a good thing, unless 85% of the electorate are uneducated and illeterate. However, I've not seen the US complaining about this when Sa elections crop up, so I guess they need to feel the "downside" of democracy?

[MEGR]

Never hurts to see things from a different perspective :)

[budanski]

Not surprising when you have someone like Mandela slamming the U.S. (http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/01/30/sprj.irq.mandela/index.html)

Seems oppression is acceptable towards Iraqis and not on South Africans especially under Winnie's rule.

Bush could only hope next time (http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30200-12358798,00.html) ;)

[Trident-za]

Winnie's Rule? She is currently in jail ....for fraud. And what exactly do you mean by "someone like Mandela"? Just curious....

[cut]

Nelson Mandela is one the most respected figureheads in the world but I think he might just be losing his marbles..

[Argyll]

I think he's refering to the fact that Mandela was a convicted terrorist for the ANC under aparthied(spelling),and when he was in gaol,it was his wife Winnie who led the party in his "absence"..........or maybe there's something else!!?

[budanski]

I was just assuming since Mandela has alot of influence in South Africa. Many have a bad perception of America.

I was kidding about Winnies rule cause I read somewhere that while Mandela was in jail. She ran some sort of extortion scam using street thugs and such. Did I read it correctly?

[Argyll]

Thats right Bud,I'm sure it was called something obscure like a football team,I can't remember the name.
She was implicated in the murder of a young boy called Stompie Muketzoi(spelling)and thus began her downfall!!

[Trident-za]

Winnie Mandela was/is one seriously nasty piece of work. Argyll is right - she WAS implicated in the murder of Stompie (he was an "informer"), but never convicted (she did it, though - just had strong political connections). She has been implicated in numerous criminal activities over the years, but has FINALLY landed up in jail - for fraud.

Nelson Mandela... well. I was raised to believe that he was the devil. I admire the man for going throgh 27 years of jail without feeling animosity (some people on this forum feel animosity for a few KIAs in Iraq, which were to be expected). I don't know any other world leader who could do that. I don't necessarily agree with everything he says (in particular with regard to the coalition), but bear in mind that the man has suffered a lot, and still has PEACE foremost in his mind. I will always have a hard time thinking "bad" of the man purely because he could quite easily have lead this country into a DRC type situation, but he didn't. It's easy to make war, a lot harder to make peace in the face of war....

Losing his marbles? Yes... I think he is. But then, he is 85 or so, so I guess his mental faculties are going. Sad, really... especially for my country :(

I think this all misses the point, though, It's easy to dismiss the current "negative feelings" towards the US in South Africa by blaming it on Nelson and/or Winnie. Neither is really in a position to dictate public feeling much these days, so that theory falls flat.

Please see my other thread about how many people turned up at the "anti-US" mass rally in South Africa :) :) :) There are people in SA who are anti-Bush, but they are not the only people living here :)