Is LOTR the greatest epic film ever?

[StarvingStudent47]

Is Lord of the Rings the greatest epic film (or epic film trilogy) ever? If not, say what is.

I think it is. From an apocalyptic battle between good and evil, to good acting, to great music, to amazing scenery (go New Zealand) and cinematography, it's got everything.

I've heard some complaints from the far right that the movie is "propaganda of the homo****** agenda," because of the slightly ambiguous relationships between Merry and Pippin, and between Frodo and Sam. And I've heard some complaints from the far left that the movie "presents a racist worldview," because The Armies of the West happen to be all caucasian, and the Uruk-Hai are dark-skinned, and some of Sauron's human allies seem to be from a Middle Eastern culture (the guys with the Oliphants). I've also heard a few people say that it was hard to follow if you hadn't read Tolkien's works, but I also know plenty of people who hadn't read the books but still loved the movies.

So did other folks like this film as much as I did? Is it the greatest epic ever?

[EvanL]

Dude.....Harry Potter is so much better. ;)

[Gringo]

**** no.

Erm. I like Lawrence of Arabia.

"He's dead", no **** you just shot him.

[bishop1]

it might be right now, but wait til Gates of Fire, thats gonna own all

[Tengu]

Yes!

I have never read the book and i must i sway i had no trouble understanding the movies.
I never heard those far left and right opinions (don't have anything against gays anyway) except some ppl were offended by the name "the two towers"; BS if you ask me.
If there ever was a war that you can compair with the battle for middle earth is would be the second world war.

[Tengu]

it might be right now, but wait til Gates of Fire, thats gonna own allNever heard of it, explain plz.

[Hot Lips]

I haven't seen the final films for LoTR nor Harry Potter so I really can't say. I always loved Star Wars and the Godfather Trilogies.

I guess so. LoTR definately has the wonderful indoor and outdoor scenes enhanced and/or made possible by CGI.

[Fintin]

lord of the rings....SUCKED....i wanted to hang myself after that rubbish...thats not saying too much...but still i would say the best fanticy films ever in my oppinion were the never ending stories....i havnt seen them sence they first came out....but i thought they were sweet back thenk...

[Fargin]

even "barbwire" was better than LOTR.

[ronin2172]

even "barbwire" was better than LOTR.
care to elaborate or are u just trying to look 'hip' and diss a film cause others like it? Or maybe u r trying to be funny....Anyway LOTR is the best epic ever.....it has everything u could ask for, huge battles, great villians, fantastic scenery, costumes, good actors. It is gonna be hard to get any better...

[California Joe]

It is a great series. Oustanding cinematography and it actually follows the story.

[Fargin]

Actually I thought is was pretty shallow. No character deept, just pure animation.

[ronin2172]

Actually I thought is was pretty shallow. No character deept, just pure animation.
rofl ok now u r just being silly.....did u ever read the book?

[California Joe]

Oh well, to each his own.

[Fargin]

We are discussing the flick or the book?

and yes I dislike the book too, painfully long.


Oh well, to each his own.
Roger, let's just end this discussion with: After the film I wasn't terrible impressed, a bit tired actually.

[zenmaster]

You are saying 'Barbwire' has more character development than LOTR? What? Nice job being a rebel, just like everyone else... :roll:

[ronin2172]

We are discussing the flick or the book?

and yes I dislike the book too, painfully long.
your answer says it all.....the reason i mentioned the book is usually books have way more depth than the movie based on them....however this is the first time which i felt the movie enhanced the book. In the book the battle for helms deep was short...not more than a page...the book glossed over the death of boromir...which is only some things the movie vividly portrayed.
Anyway u have yet to name a better epic film...

[California Joe]

I just think it's very well done.

[Fargin]

All Quiet on the Western Front, is just one.


And what is good, Phædrus,
And what is not good...
Need we ask anyone to tell us these things?

[ronin2172]

All Quiet on the Western Front
great movie...one of the greatest of all time...but not on the same scale...

[Seoulstriker]

I think that LOTR is the greatest epic of all time.

As for the relationship of merry and pippin: read the f***ing book. :roll:

[mocking_loudly_died]

Hobbits are always searching for those *faggots* in the forest.

[Ratamacue]

LOTR is definitely among them, though the original Star Wars trilogy is a timeless epic.

[Romulus]

Nope.... Austin Powers

[Ria]

I loove LotR, it is definitely the best epic, IMO. The old Star Wars were great as well.

[bishop1]

Tengu, you asked what Gates of Fire is. Pleasen forgive the attempted drama and storytelling but the point muct be made.
It is a book by Steven Pressfield and is being made into a movie. It is about the second Persian invasion of ancient Greece in 480 B.C. At a place called Thermopalyea (sp probably) nicknamed "the hot gates" (hence the title) 7,000 greeks assembled in a small narrow pass to defend as long as possible against the 300,000 Persian invaders. But surprisingly the Greeks have hope, because in their 7,000 men are 300 Spartans, 1 one of them being King Leonidas, the rest are his royal bodyguard. if you dont know anything about the Spartans look them up, they were the worlds greatest soldiers. Anyways, the 7,000 Greeks held the 300,000 persians for 3 days. When Leonidas ordered the men to retreat before the final battle most of them did, except the Spartans, they were taught to never surrender, and even if they did leave for home their wives and city wouldnt allow them back. They all stayed and died to a man. it was estimated the Greeks managed to kill 20,000 of the Persians.
But the cinemerography will be amazing, looks down the mountian and seeing miles and miles of soldiers and horses (sorta like LOTR but this happend for real, day long battles between people not Ogers or whatever. And many great quotes came from the Spartans at the battle too.
Anways, do some history on it or read the book if it in any way sounds intreasting.

[Seraphim]

Im waiting for King Arthur...mmmmmm Kiera Knightly. Where my drooling icon?

[bishop1]

Yeah, thats gonna be really good too

[Mark Sman]

Fistful of Dollars
A Few Dollars More
The Good, The Bad and The Ugly

All hail Sergeio Leone.

That being said though . . .

"Awrance, Awrance, Awrance!"

[Ballistic]

LOTR series is in my opinion the greatest motion picture epic ever told. I think as far depth goes, the books are better, and the movies did deviate a little from the original story, but all in all it's a fantastic trilogy which others can only hope to come up against in it's scope and story (original Star Wars being the only other that can come close AFAIC).

Gates of Fire sounds like an extremely good movie, hope more info comes out soon, and King Arthur is looking pretty good aswell.

[786mine]

Star Wars, period.

[Tengu]

thnx bishop1 sounds very good to me. Do you know when it will be released or is there a site?? Because i couldn't find it, i only found the book.

[Gringo]

Fistful of Dollars
A Few Dollars More
The Good, The Bad and The Ugly

All hail Sergeio Leone.

That being said though . . .

"Awrance, Awrance, Awrance!"

Hurray!!! :D

On LOTR:
Never read the book, but from the film it is not an epic, some of the huge battles seem to be animated.

The Good, The Bad, and the Ugly, could be. It had a huge epic battle near the end. The cemetary 'Sad Hill' was specially made for the film, he had people just digging up the earth, making a mound, planting grave stones and crosses. Some serious work went into that.

[mocking_loudly_died]

Computer generated armies are boring. LOTR is okay but it ain't no old skool star wars.

[Gringo]

Computer generated armies are boring. LOTR is okay but it ain't no old skool star wars.

yeah. Airfix models are he way to go :D ;)

[mocking_loudly_died]

Computer generated armies are boring. LOTR is okay but it ain't no old skool star wars.

yeah. Airfix models are he way to go :D ;)

No claymation.

[OldRecon]

As triology goes likes the Lord of the rings better than Star Wars.
Yet as single movie nothing compares to Apocalypse now (especialy the redux version).
Then you have the Godfather movies.

[mocking_loudly_died]

The best thing about the Lord Of The Rings movies was Clint Mansells Requiem For A Dream remix Lux Aeterna for The Two Towers.

It makes you want to ride around your room wielding plastic swords.

[Uncle Sam]

It was OK. Star Wars Trilogy (Original) much better.

What about The Godfather, Indiana Jones, Back to the Future, Clint Eastwoods movies, Beverly Hills Cop, Porky's, Alien, Mad Max, Evil Dead...Blah, blah...

[Gringo]

It was OK. Star Wars Trilogy (Original) much better.

What about The Godfather, Indiana Jones, Back to the Future, Clint Eastwoods <a href="http://www.ntsearch.com/search.php?q=movies&v=55">movies</a>, Beverly Hills Cop, Porky's, Alien, Mad Max, Evil Dead...Blah, blah...

Hooray for Eastwood woot



Epic

noun
1. An extended narrative poem in elevated or dignified language, celebrating the feats of a legendary or traditional hero.
2. A literary or dramatic composition that resembles an extended narrative poem celebrating heroic feats.
3. A series of events considered appropriate to an epic: the epic of the Old West.

adjective
1. Of, constituting, having to do with, or suggestive of a literary epic: an epic poem.
2. Surpassing the usual or ordinary, particularly in scope or size: “A vast musical panorama... it requires an epic musical understanding to do it justice” (Tim Page).
3. Heroic and impressive in quality: “Here in the courtroom... there was more of that epic atmosphere, the extra amperage of a special moment” (Scott Turow).

An epic could be any film that is brilliant.

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

Sorry folks its got to be Star Wars followed by Alien for me though I loved the original Tolkein books I thought the films lacked something though I must admit they were well made.

[ronin2172]

i think people r confused as to what an epic film is.....in the hollywood use of the term epic films are all about scale, epic films are movies told on a GRAND scale. Huge sets, huge casts, huge scenes (ie battles) let me give examples of epic films

LOTR, Spartacus, Ben-Hur, Lawrence of Arabia, The Ten Commandments, Cleopatra, How the West was Won.

Now u may consider a scene in a movie an epic moment in the film but that does not make the movie itself an epic. So Godfather, Clint Eastwood spaghetti westerns, Alien(s), Apocalypse Now et al don't count

[Gringo]

i think people r confused as to what an epic film is.....in the hollywood use of the term epic films are all about scale, epic films are movies told on a GRAND scale. Huge sets, huge casts, huge scenes (ie battles) let me give examples of epic films

LOTR, Spartacus, Ben-Hur, Lawrence of Arabia, The Ten Commandments, Cleopatra, How the West was Won.

Now u may consider a scene in a movie an epic moment in the film but that does not make the movie itself an epic. So Godfather, Clint Eastwood spaghetti westerns, Alien(s), Apocalypse Now et al don't count

if u class the films like that, I'd say LOTR is also off the list. Since most of it was computer animation. Now like I said The Good, The Bad, And The Ugly could be, as like I said all the sets, costumes and props had to be built nearly from scratch. The Cemetery is fake and had to dug up so it would had taken a long while to do that.

[ronin2172]

i think people r confused as to what an epic film is.....in the hollywood use of the term epic films are all about scale, epic films are movies told on a GRAND scale. Huge sets, huge casts, huge scenes (ie battles) let me give examples of epic films

LOTR, Spartacus, Ben-Hur, Lawrence of Arabia, The Ten Commandments, Cleopatra, How the West was Won.

Now u may consider a scene in a movie an epic moment in the film but that does not make the movie itself an epic. So Godfather, Clint Eastwood spaghetti westerns, Alien(s), Apocalypse Now et al don't count

if u class the films like that, I'd say LOTR is also off the list. Since most of it was computer animation. Now like I said The Good, The Bad, And The Ugly could be, as like I said all the sets, costumes and props had to be built nearly from scratch. The Cemetery is fake and had to dug up so it would had taken a long while to do that.
epic films in hollywood is alll about scale.....and lord of the rings is huge...not all of the characters in the battle scenes were computer generated...in fact a surprisingly large number of them were real actors...in fact LOTR used a lot of 'old school' techniques (models, forced perspective and so forth) the main times they used CGI was increating creatures and adding scale to the battles (there is no other practical way to have an army of 10,000 orcs)

[StarvingStudent47]

i think people r confused as to what an epic film is.....in the hollywood use of the term epic films are all about scale, epic films are movies told on a GRAND scale. Huge sets, huge casts, huge scenes (ie battles) let me give examples of epic films

LOTR, Spartacus, Ben-Hur, Lawrence of Arabia, The Ten Commandments, Cleopatra, How the West was Won.

Now u may consider a scene in a movie an epic moment in the film but that does not make the movie itself an epic. So Godfather, Clint Eastwood spaghetti westerns, Alien(s), Apocalypse Now et al don't count

if u class the films like that, I'd say LOTR is also off the list. Since most of it was computer animation. Now like I said The Good, The Bad, And The Ugly could be, as like I said all the sets, costumes and props had to be built nearly from scratch. The Cemetery is fake and had to dug up so it would had taken a long while to do that.

That's what I meant by "epic films." Other films I consider epics are Ben Hur, Braveheart, original Star Wars trilogy, etc.

For example, I think that Fight Club and Bend it Like Beckham are both "epic" in that they kick ass, but neither are "epic" in the way that Hollywood uses the term.

[mocking_loudly_died]

Right I just finished watching The Return Of The king.

Visually it's really good, but the battles are very boring and the music is very tiresome; a combination that leads to much thumb twiddling.

The director cannot master the art of decent battle action and the music department needs to be shot for it's dreadfully ordinary music score in key dramatic scenes.

Why is the Witch King so crap? - a couple of sword blows and the f*cker dies, what an anti-climax.

Still it's better than doing the laundry.

[StarvingStudent47]

Mocking--you think the Return of the King soundtrack is crap? More evidence that beauty is in the eye (ear) of the beholder. I own the soundtrack and love it. I really like the Fellowship soundtrack too, and own that, but it lacks the Rohan theme. I didn't like the closing credits music to The Two Towers, but that's the only soundtrack of the three that I don't own and love.

[ronin2172]

the battles were boring? Seeing the rohirm cavalry slam into the orc army was awesome, and just when they seem to win the fight here come the oliphants to change the momentum. When the armored cave trolls broke down the gates to the white city the look on Gandalf's face was priceless.

[MetalBoy]

I thought The Wild Bunch was pretty epic, from the huge bloody shot outs, to the way it encorporated the Mexican Revolution as a part of the story. And the final slaughter in the Mexican National Army base was the most epic gunfight/meatgrinder ever filmed.

[mocking_loudly_died]

the battles were boring? Seeing the rohirm cavalry slam into the orc army was awesome, and just when they seem to win the fight here come the oliphants to change the momentum. When the armored cave trolls broke down the gates to the white city the look on Gandalf's face was priceless.

I just can't empathise with cgi - obviously it's needed in a movie of this scale but I feel like there is this massive wall of unreality I personally cannot cross.

As for the music - yes it's fine in a pedestrian way in the filler scenes but at keen dramatic moments it's really bland.

I guess Lux Aeterna really set the benchmark the movie couldn't hold up too.

[ronin2172]

i can see your point about CGI...like it or not it was the only way the scenes could have been done. They actually did an awesome job of blending CGI, live action, and minatures to do the battle scenes. I feel the CGI in the star wars prequels is horrible, u can tell most of the scenes were shot on a sound stage and had the exterior shots added in post production damn ILM what happened to u?

[mocking_loudly_died]

i can see your point about CGI...like it or not it was the only way the scenes could have been done. They actually did an awesome job of blending CGI, live action, and minatures to do the battle scenes. I feel the CGI in the star wars prequels is horrible, u can tell most of the scenes were shot on a sound stage and had the exterior shots added in post production damn ILM what happened to u?

It's a heck lot better than the star wars prequels in script and effects. George Lucas has shat on his own creation. The new movies look like a straight to video event; yet my ****head friends think it looks amazing.....

Terrible pile of dog poo.

[ronin2172]

none of the clone troopers were actors in suits, it is so obvious when they r next to one of the 'live' actors....at least LOTR used real actors in outstanding makeup and costumes for close ups ...with the exception of gollum but then again there is no comparison between gollum and any other CGI character ever created.

[Mark Sman]

"GRAND scale. Huge sets, huge casts, huge scenes (ie battles)"

The Good, The Bad and The Ugly qualifys on all three. More so than LOTR.

Tuco: "God is with us because he hates the Yanks too!"

TMWNN: "Gods not on our side, cause he hates idiots also."

Gotta love TMWNN placing charges with the cigar in his mouth.

[Haiw]

none of the clone troopers were actors in suits, it is so obvious when they r next to one of the 'live' actors....at least LOTR used real actors in outstanding makeup and costumes for close ups ...with the exception of gollum but then again there is no comparison between gollum and any other CGI character ever created.
Though the appearance of Gollum was CGI all the moves and stuff were acted with mo-cap.

[Gringo]

"GRAND scale. Huge sets, huge casts, huge scenes (ie battles)"

The Good, The Bad and The Ugly qualifys on all three. More so than LOTR.

Tuco: "God is with us because he hates the Yanks too!"

TMWNN: "Gods not on our side, cause he hates idiots also."

Gotta love TMWNN placing charges with the cigar in his mouth.

that's what I've been trying to say. None of the other of Sergio Leone westerns come close as an epic to GBU. Yet I prefer Once Upon a Time In The West and For A Few Dollars More, GBU has the civil war as a backdrop, the two armies were played by the Spanish Army in Civil war costumes. The details at which Leone puts into his films are amazing, and GBU is the best of his films that shows how detailed he is.

Tuco: "See you soon id.... idi..."
Blondie: "Idiots"
Tuco: "Huh?"
Blondie: "It's for you"

[ronin2172]

"GRAND scale. Huge sets, huge casts, huge scenes (ie battles)"

The Good, The Bad and The Ugly qualifys on all three. More so than LOTR.

Tuco: "God is with us because he hates the Yanks too!"

TMWNN: "Gods not on our side, cause he hates idiots also."

Gotta love TMWNN placing charges with the cigar in his mouth.

lol at that one. The good the bad and the ugly had bigger battles.....lol, what battle in that movie was bigger in scale than the battle of helm's deep? Or the seige of Gondor? It had bigger scenes than the mines of moria? did it employ an army of people just to design and construct the costumes and make up effects? The sets in the good the bad and the ugly were relatively simple in construction. Was any of then as intricate as Bilbo's house? or Lorien? or Saruman's chambers in orthanic? or king theoden's throne room or the fact that they actually built that whole city around it? Did it virtually use an entire country as the backdrop? No, so to say it was more epic than LOTR is plain wrong, CGI or no CGI (which has nothing to do with whether a movie is epic or not).

[Gringo]

"GRAND scale. Huge sets, huge casts, huge scenes (ie battles)"

The Good, The Bad and The Ugly qualifys on all three. More so than LOTR.

Tuco: "God is with us because he hates the Yanks too!"

TMWNN: "Gods not on our side, cause he hates idiots also."

Gotta love TMWNN placing charges with the cigar in his mouth.

lol at that one. The good the bad and the ugly had bigger battles.....lol, what battle in that movie was bigger in scale than the battle of helm's deep? Or the seige of Gondor? It had bigger scenes than the mines of moria? did it employ an army of people just to design and construct the costumes and make up effects? The sets in the good the bad and the ugly were relatively simple in construction. Was any of then as intricate as Bilbo's house? or Lorien? or Saruman's chambers in orthanic? or king theoden's throne room or the fact that they actually built that whole city around it? Did it virtually use an entire country as the backdrop? No, so to say it was more epic than LOTR is plain wrong, CGI or no CGI (which has nothing to do with whether a movie is epic or not).

Yes it does. CGI makes it look like no effort was made.

The Union concentration camp, battle for the bridge, the Union troop train.

[ronin2172]

that is silly....LOTR had way more effort...c'mon get real...lol. There is no scene in that movie which outdoes LOTR in scope. Maybe u need to take a look at the behind the scenes making of LOTR....

[Haiw]

Maybe you oughtta look at which year GBU came out? :lol: Relatively speaking, especially for that time (everything took way more work back then) I don't think the difference is all that big.

[mocking_loudly_died]

I'm siding with Ronin on this one, having seen GBU a million times it is an epic western but you can't compare it to the effort of LOTR cosidering the thousands of people involved.

*unrelated* GBU has one of the best villians, Angel Eye's rocks

[ronin2172]

lol....i'm not saying it isn't a good movie...it is....it's one of the best westerns ever...but it isn't the greatest epic of all time...i can name a bunch of movie epics which r greater.....gone with the wind, spartacus, ben-hur, lawrence of Arabia, Star Wars, even Giant (all of which are older than GBU..except Star Wars of course)...now these movies r on the same scale of LOTR.

[California Joe]

GBU isn't even the best Clint Eastwood western for chrissakes. Josey Wales is a much better movie.

[mocking_loudly_died]

GBU isn't even the best Clint Eastwood western for chrissakes. Josey Wales is a much better movie.

No way, GBU, Pale Rider, Unforgiven are the bomb.

[ronin2172]

honestly, i think it is impossible for clint to make a bad western!lol I kinda like high plains drifter the best myself

[ZeroPositive]

it was really well made and I really enjoyed most of it the first one was a bit slow.

[Gringo]

*unrelated* GBU has one of the best villians, Angel Eye's rocks

Indio from For A Few Dollars More is better. imo


lol....i'm not saying it isn't a good movie...it is....it's one of the best westerns ever...but it isn't the greatest epic of all time

I never saif it is the greatest epic of all time


GBU isn't even the best Clint Eastwood western for chrissakes. Josey Wales is a much better movie.

I've never seen Josey Wales, but I reckon For A Few Dollars More is better then GBU.

[gaz]

I'm not going to weigh in on the epic argument because frankly I can't be arsed to think about it that much.

I will say though that the LOTR trilogy are great films, they're well written and well directed as well as beautifully filmed. I think the best accolade goes to the casting director, the casting in LOTR was for the most part perfect... Examples -

Ian McKellen as Gandalf
Bernard Hill as King Theoden
Sean Astin as Sam
Cate Blanchett as Galadriel
Viggo Mortensen as Aragorn
Hugo Weaving as Elrond
John Rhys-Davies as Gimli
Andy Serkis as Gollum
David Wenham as Faramir
Miranda Otto as Eowyn
John Noble as Denethor
Billy Boyd as Pip
Dominic Moghnahan as Merry

Everyone I've just mentioned was perfect for their role, the only ones that I were less than keen on were Liv Tyler, Elijah Wood and Orlando Bloom. Tyler and Wood was less than impressed with because I disliked their previous work and frankly I think Bloom has absolutely zero charisma.

[Trigger]

GBU isn't even the best Clint Eastwood western for chrissakes. Josey Wales is a much better movie.
Word.

On topic:
I voted yes for LOTR, but others have mentioned the original Star Wars trilogy and the Godfather series. Both are also fantastic.

[SerbPVO]

I'm no racist/skin, but just by watching LOTR, it brought out a sort of "white pride" in me. Don't know why that is.

[Seraphim]

I'm no racist/skin, but just by watching LOTR, it brought out a sort of "white pride" in me. Don't know why that is.

Correct me if im wrong, but it is based in europe.

[Seraphim]

One question...how do you define epic?

[Gringo]

One question...how do you define epic?

already been mentioned before

oh and LOTR is based in a fictional world

[Tengu]

fictional europe

[Seraphim]

One question...how do you define epic?

already been mentioned before

oh and LOTR is based in a fictional world

Fine you made me go read those previous pages, which you could have told me.


An epic could be any film that is brilliant.

[StarvingStudent47]

One question...how do you define epic?

already been mentioned before

oh and LOTR is based in a fictional world

Fine you made me go read those previous pages, which you could have told me.


An epic could be any film that is brilliant.

No no no no no! That's the whole point of the previous pages. "Epic" means something more specific for films. It means sweeping stories told on a large scale--Ben Hur, Braveheart, etc.

[StarvingStudent47]

fictional europe

Some have said that Middle Earth is WWI Europe (the Shire is rural Britain; Mordor is the Central Powers), but Tolkien himself NEVER said that. He went to great lengths to create a totally fantastic world, complete with its own mythology and creation stories (The Silmarillion).

[StarvingStudent47]

Everyone I've just mentioned was perfect for their role, the only ones that I were less than keen on were Liv Tyler, Elijah Wood and Orlando Bloom. Tyler and Wood was less than impressed with because I disliked their previous work and frankly I think Bloom has absolutely zero charisma.

I normally like Liv Tyler (and she was the only good thing about Armageddon), but I wasn't so convinced with her as Arwen. I liked Frodo's role--quite frankly, he reminds me of some drug addicts I know, and that was just right for Frodo. I personally like Orlando Bloom, and his slight build and delicate features were good for an elf.

Besides Arwen, the only casting call I disagreed with was Arwen's father (I'm blanking on his name). Too sinister to be a good guy, his features were too rugged for an elf, and I kept on wanting him to say "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson." I think someone like Jude Law would have been better in that role.

[ronin2172]

Everyone I've just mentioned was perfect for their role, the only ones that I were less than keen on were Liv Tyler, Elijah Wood and Orlando Bloom. Tyler and Wood was less than impressed with because I disliked their previous work and frankly I think Bloom has absolutely zero charisma.

I normally like Liv Tyler (and she was the only good thing about Armageddon), but I wasn't so convinced with her as Arwen. I liked Frodo's role--quite frankly, he reminds me of some drug addicts I know, and that was just right for Frodo. I personally like Orlando Bloom, and his slight build and delicate features were good for an elf.

Besides Arwen, the only casting call I disagreed with was Arwen's father (I'm blanking on his name). Too sinister to be a good guy, his features were too rugged for an elf, and I kept on wanting him to say "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson." I think someone like Jude Law would have been better in that role.
hugo weaving as elrond....lol..i actually liked him as the elvish king, i really thought the casting was almost perfect.

[Hullebullen]

I'm surprised that noone has mentioned Gladiator. By the way, the original Star Wars movies are better than LOTR...