Posts on Kosovo

[Snoshi]

MOSCOW, Feb 15 (*******) - Russia will change its policy towards the Georgian breakaway regions of Abkhazia and South Ossetia if Kosovo is recognised as independent, Interfax news agency quoted the foreign ministry as saying on Friday.

"The declaration and recognition of Kosovo independence will force Russia to adjust its line towards Abkhazia and South Ossetia," Interfax quoted a foreign ministry statement as saying. (Reporting by Chris Baldwin; writing by Christian Lowe; editing by Dmitry Solovyov)
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L15582195.htm

[Afro-European]

Russia won't do nothing other than recognized the independance of those breakaway regions.I still fail to understand the "uniqueness" of Kosovo.


http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L15582195.htm

[angry cow]

If WWIII starts over Kosovo I'm going to punch someone in the throat. Probably my Albanian neighbor, I like the guy, but I don't know any Kosovars so he'll just have to do.

[naymeria]

Kosovo breakaway illegal, says Putin

President Vladimir Putin yesterday accused Europe and the United States of double standards over their support for an independent Kosovo, and warned that any declaration of statehood by Pristina would be "illegal, ill-conceived and immoral".

Putin said that Russia remained utterly opposed to Kosovo breaking away from Serbia. If Kosovo's Albanian leaders ignored Russian objections and announced independence this Sunday Moscow would be forced to act, he said.
He did not spell out what precisely Russia would do. There has been speculation that Moscow could retaliate by recognising the breakaway Georgian republics of Abkhazia and South Ossetia, and the separatist Moldovan enclave of Trans-Dniester.
"Other countries look after their interests. We consider it appropriate to look after our interests. We have done some homework and we know what we will do," he warned.
Speaking at his annual press conference in the Kremlin - his last before stepping down as president in May - Putin insisted that Kosovo did not deserve special status. "I don't want to say anything that would offend anyone, but for 40 years northern Cyprus has practically had independence. Why aren't you recognising that? Aren't you ashamed, Europeans, for having these double standards?" he said.
He went on: "Why do we promote separatism? For 400 years Great Britain has been fighting for its territorial integrity in respect of Northern Ireland. Why not? Why don't you support that?" he asked a journalist from German TV.
Putin insisted that "unified rules should be applied" when dealing with separatist conflicts. He complained: "International law doesn't guard the interests of small countries." Russia supported Serbia's call for an urgent meeting on Kosovo at the UN security council, he added.
But Putin hinted that Russia would not ape the west by immediately recognising the independence claims of Abkhazia, South Ossetia and Trans-Dniester. "We won't behave like monkeys," he said. "If someone backs an illegal and ill-conceived position we will not follow suit. We will react to preserve our interests."

Video at source:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/feb/15/russia.kosovo

[Kap]

Russia seems to be doing a lot of threatening lately. :|

[sosed]

The West want to start WW3 in the way to provoke others to do the first step. But it will not start in Kosovo, Serbia and Russia will not fall on this trick. The West will have to start WW3 with attack on Iran. On the other hand Kosovo will do a great job as Trojan horse, when islam forces will conquer Europe.

[Cap'ndaddy]

Curses! Sosed has discovered our evil plans for western domination!

Now we must instigate plan B, and destabilize the world through irresponsible financial practices........

[sosed]

I know it seems now crazy and funny, but when it will become reality, there will be no reason for fun.

[Migman]

Any word on Russia's stance towards NKR if Kosovo gains independance?

[Createdeemcee]

The West want to start WW3 in the way to provoke others to do the first step. But it will not start in Kosovo, Serbia and Russia will not fall on this trick. The West will have to start WW3 with attack on Iran. On the other hand Kosovo will do a great job as Trojan horse, when islam forces will conquer Europe.


Never!! There arent enough virgins in hell!

[Igor01]

Any word on Russia's stance towards NKR if Kosovo gains independance?

Likely, they won't interfere openly although may provide some quiet support to the Armenians. Russia needs both Armenia as a strategic ally and host country for a Russian base in the Caucasus and Azerbajan to continue cooperation on gas and oil.

[V.I.D.]

The things are heating up. So much about the "uniqueness" of Kosovo's situation:

from B92 website:
Kosovo crisis to spill to Bosnia? 15 February 2008 | 11:44 | Source: B92 BANJA LUKA -- As the Kosovo Albanians prepare to declare independence, the situation in the Republic of Srpska, RS, is also heating up.

Along with the announcement that a referendum for secession from Bosnia-Herzegovina will be asked for, the association of non-governmental organizations stated that if Brussels recognizes Kosovo, the Republic of Srpska would ask for independence as well.

The government has yet to give genuine assurances that it will be able to keep things under control, observers say.

RS Prime Minister Milorad Dodik said recently that if Kosovo's independence is proclaimed, “various ideas can develop elsewhere as well,” adding that the institutions in the Republic of Srpska are following the Kosovo situation closely.

Dodik said that the Republic of Srpska will not recognize Kosovo independence and that it will make sure through its representative that Bosnia-Herzegovina does the same.

Just days after talks of an eventual referendum for the independence of the Republic of Srpska, the association of non-government organizations SPONA has taken it one step further.

If any of the countries of the former Yugoslavia recognize Kosovo, the organization will ask for the 52 authorities passed over the the level of Bosnia-Herzegovina be given back to the Republic of Srpska.

If the European Union recognizes Kosovo independence, SPONA official Branislav Dukić said that the organization will make radical demands.

Dodik said that if Kosovo is granted independence, there will be room made for similar political ideas and does not see SPONA's demands as surprising.

Republic of Srpska will not recognize Kosovo, but it will work on maintaining peace and security, Dodik said.

Though tensions tied to Kosovo's looming declaration of independence are evident, there has yet to be any announcements of planned protests.

There have been some calls for protest however, though in the circle of Banja Luka's student population, many are questioning the background of such initiatives.

Leaders of the student union claim that the public calls to students are being made by people "who can in no case be deemed their legitimate representatives."

But the planned protest in the Bosnian Serb entity are likely to be led by the NGO sector there

[Difool]

An independant Kosovo will hardly have any industry, tourism or natural recources. Only criminals or islamic funamentalist could be exportet. But the EU is gonna pay for this nonsence. So lets raise some more taxes.

[Mundzos]

An independant Kosovo will hardly have any industry, tourism or natural recources. Only criminals or islamic funamentalist could be exportet. But the EU is gonna pay for this nonsence. So lets raise some more taxes.

Kosovo is very rich in some natural resources. So just do some research before posting...

[naymeria]

Kosovo is very rich in some natural resources. So just do some research before posting...
It still remains a nonsense and we of the eu will still have to pay for it.
Nay

edit: no, i'm not happy that once again international law is breeched. Nor of the double standards.

[NavyTimes]

I say split Kosovo in two and let the serbian part stay with Serbia. And if the albanians want to be so independent, they probably want to be independent of foreign aid as well.

[drunken sailor]

Russia will intervene in this matter now that they are stronger than when we had NATO get involved. Russia sees Serbia as you would see a little brother. Russia will send troops in forcing the NATO troops to evacuate and Turkey will rush in to stop them and Greece will join Russia in fighting the Turks. This is the worst case scenario and it would rip NATO apart.

[themacedonian]

Yugoslavia was and still is a test case scenario of New World Order.

The current "peacekeeping" interventionist policies were tested and justified in the former yugoslavia. Justifications like preventing genocide were first tested and implemented there.

The separation of the republics was easy using a referendum and was allowed and legal and only stumbling block now is separation of a territory from an existing regonised borders of a country.

Kosovo will be the first country since WWII that will be created without UN approval with the recognition of several "important" countries.

If this trend is followed.

"Several Important" countries under pressure from "public" opinion prepare and recognise Darfur (alleged genocide) because if it done once then the justification is there to do it again.

Iraq can much easier be partitioned.

The idea of a nation state with sovereign borders is non existent as soon as its governance over its territory is questioned.

UN WILL lose its status like the League of Nation and a new UN (world government) will be proposed after the "unavoidable" BIG war.

The issue is simple Russia and China want to preserve the current World Order and the West wants a New World Order.

Which ever way you stand on the Kosovo issue you will look back on this as the time and place when THINGS changed in the world. A state of 2 million will affect 6 billion.

[BW2]

As it is the UN is well on the way to ending up like the former "league of nations". In case anyone forgot, the last time someone sent Serbia a ultiamtum it left 40 million war dead, another 50 million from disease and finally the complete collapse of the world economy...

This is as any legal expert would say "A precedent setting case" and the precedent has already been set. I am deeply disappointed with the West. They really swam to the wrong side of the river this time round...

Well you've made your bed, the EU and US taxpayers will have to cough up more cash that would likewise have been used for their own good to support a already failed crime infested, Jihadist breading ground in the Balkans with billions in aid, divert 16 000 troops that would be a god sent gift to ISAF in Afghanistan right now for the foreseeable future.

[Dercius]

I think that if western goverments accept Kosovo´s declaration of independence, they will be opening the pandora box.

What will they do to oppose the creation of a kurd state in northern Irak?? And in this situation, what will they do to prevent a war between this kurd state and turkey??

If shiites in south irak want to split away and join Iran, they will have no moral reasons to stop them. And Russia will be more than happy about supporting their cause in UN, and may be providing them some rpg´s under the table.

And what do you say about Cyprus, its the pottential grave of NATO.

What if russia promotes and recognizes an independent state in the Ukraine areas with russian population??

Will west recognize an independent state in Santa Cruz province in Bolivia??

Will be recognized an independent state in: Corsica, Sardinia, North of Italy (Padania), french bretagne, Basque, Catalonia, Scotland, northern Ireland, Quebec etc...?????

Its better if our politicians think twice about starting to play with double standards, because they will probably dont like how this game ends.

And for those kosovo´s politicians talking about joining EUroflroflrofl, I will just tell them to keep on dreaming. Lots of countries will think about ripping apart the Schengen pact, and closing their borders. Thats the reason why Turkey has not been accepted (and in my opinion thats the reason why it won´t be accepted).

About EU funding this Kosovo State, come on, our stupid politicians need to burn our money in some stupid chimeric dream. I still remember them pouring zillions of euros in that palestinian state, paying the bills and salaries of the whole goverment and civil servants, while they rulers spend their revenues in weapons and evaded millions to their secret bank accounts in Switzerland.It just make me sick how our politicians(EU) play their games without thinking about the consequences and without assuming responsability for their actions.

[Afro-European]

Huh?? Are kidding? If Russia attacks Nato soldiers or the other way around,then be ready to seek a nuclear shelter.The West and Russia are smart enough to solve this problem peaceful.


Russia will intervene in this matter now that they are stronger than when we had NATO get involved. Russia sees Serbia as you would see a little brother. Russia will send troops in forcing the NATO troops to evacuate and Turkey will rush in to stop them and Greece will join Russia in fighting the Turks. This is the worst case scenario and it would rip NATO apart.

[Afro-European]

The vast majority of people from Transsinistrie don't want to be with Moldovia,South Ossetians and Abkhazians don't want to be with Georgia,
same with South Cyprus yet the West won't recognize their independances if they have to declare it.The West is making a huge mistake coz in like after 10 years,Kosovo will be a breeding ground for terrorists as Afghanistan is today.History will repeat itself.

[vinko]

Kosovo is very rich in some natural resources. So just do some research before posting...


kosovo is famous as big producer of babies,bakers and drog dillers

[Kilgor]

Yugoslavia was and still is a test case scenario of New World Order.

The current "peacekeeping" interventionist policies were tested and justified in the former yugoslavia. Justifications like preventing genocide were first tested and implemented there.

The separation of the republics was easy using a referendum and was allowed and legal and only stumbling block now is separation of a territory from an existing regonised borders of a country.

Kosovo will be the first country since WWII that will be created without UN approval with the recognition of several "important" countries.

If this trend is followed.

"Several Important" countries under pressure from "public" opinion prepare and recognise Darfur (alleged genocide) because if it done once then the justification is there to do it again.

Iraq can much easier be partitioned.

The idea of a nation state with sovereign borders is non existent as soon as its governance over its territory is questioned.

UN WILL lose its status like the League of Nation and a new UN (world government) will be proposed after the "unavoidable" BIG war.

The issue is simple Russia and China want to preserve the current World Order and the West wants a New World Order.

Which ever way you stand on the Kosovo issue you will look back on this as the time and place when THINGS changed in the world. A state of 2 million will affect 6 billion.

Seriously, put down the crack pipe. NWO talk is a sign of a nutter.

[LEGEND]

It will never get recognized by the UN, and without UN recognition its as good as the paper that they will write their declaration on. This does set a dangerous precedent though, this will revert the border demarcation to "you keep what you conquer"

[SrB-23Q]

if the Kosovo Albaninas get an independant Kosovo then i think its only fair for Republika Srpska in Bosnia to get exactly the same...but this will probably not happen since its not in NATO'S interests to be supporting Serbia but ripping it appart..

[BadKarma26]

there are talks about us going to Kosovo. I wonder what could possibly be in store for us, and i wonder if this is a result of these developments

[virtual]

If Albanians declare independency, then Serbs in Bosnia have the same right to do so (Republic of Srpska).
Albanians were minority in former Yugoslavia and now they are getting their own state - Kosovo, as Serbs were constitutive part and nation of former Yugoslavia, not a minority, like Albanians.

If you want to have a peace in the Balkans, then justice for all !!

[themacedonian]

Seriously, put down the crack pipe. NWO talk is a sign of a nutter.

When I heard serbs talking about NWO in 1991 it was a sign on a nutter and believe me I thought it was crazy talk. Now it is done deal.

If the order of the world is changed and the current world political rules are changed then what else do you call it other than New World Order.

Enjoy it.

[themacedonian]

If Albanians declare independency, then Serbs in Bosnia have the same right to do so (Republic of Srpska).
Albanians were minority in former Yugoslavia and now they are getting their own state - Kosovo, as Serbs were constitutive part and nation of former Yugoslavia, not a minority, like Albanians.

If you want to have a peace in the Balkans, then justice for all !!

That is the trap Europe falls into. If one is allowed then all need to follow.
This will lead to break up and conflict of Europe.

The Russian Foreign minister was right, he said allow Serbia and Kosovo into European Union then do what ever inside Europe, then it is their problem now it is supposed to be UN problem.

Russians are right. Europeans are fools.

[chris450]

If Albanians declare independency, then Serbs in Bosnia have the same right to do so (Republic of Srpska).
Albanians were minority in former Yugoslavia and now they are getting their own state - Kosovo, as Serbs were constitutive part and nation of former Yugoslavia, not a minority, like Albanians.

If you want to have a peace in the Balkans, then justice for all !!

infact they have declared they will do so..the Serbs of Kosovo are ready to declare their own independance and join Belgrade taking up arms to protect themselves if nessesary..

our northern neighbours also have every reason to worry,this will quite possibly mean a new albanian insurgency in Tetovo

we are steaming towards a very very big pile of ****,i hope everybody sees that before its too late

[AlexMartin2]

Seeing last years how people can be easily manipulated, I'd say that any multi-ethnic region of the world can repeat former Yugoslavia's fate. Especially when other powers wants this region to desintegrate. Very dangerous situation.

[Afro-European]

This independance causes unease in several countries over the precedent Kosovo's secession would set and over the ability of the corruption-plagued government in the ethnic Albanian province to rule.Several countries, especially those with their own restive ethnic minorities, have raised objections and indicated that they will not recognize a new Kosovo state.Spanish First Deputy Prime Minister Maria Teresa Fernandez de la Vega said friday:"Spain does not favor any unilateral declaration of independence".
"For the government of Spain, the fundamental priority is a solution that respects international law and that guarantees regional stability."
With similar worries regarding minority groups, Greece, Romania, Cyprus, Belgium, Bulgaria and Slovakia, from within the 27-member European Union, joined Spain in expressing reservations over Kosovo's secession.Many European leaders are disenchanted by Kosovo's failure, in the last nine years, to build state institutions, to create a viable economy and to rein in flourishing criminal entreprise yet they are ready to put more dough into it.Most of those Kosovo's leaders are former guerrilla fighters with little experience in governing; more than two-thirds of the work force is unemployed; and people are mired in poverty, despite contributions from Europe of many billions of dollars.It will interesting to see how this all will play out.

[themacedonian]

for people living under a rock ...

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/politics/transformed-un-proposed-to-create-new-world-order-771416.html

By Andrew Grice in Delhi
Monday, 21 January 2008

Gordon Brown has begun secret talks with other world leaders on far-reaching reform of the United Nations Security Council as part of a drive to create a "new world order" and "global society".



The Prime Minister believes the UN is punching below its weight. In 2003, it failed to agree on a fresh resolution giving explicit approval for military action in Iraq. George Bush then acted unilaterally, winning the support of Tony Blair. (UN did not approve invasion that is a problem)


Mr Brown will unveil a proposal for the UN to spend £100m a year on setting up a "rapid reaction force" to stop "failed states" sliding back into chaos after a peace deal has been reached. Civilians such as police, administrators, judges and lawyers would work alongside military peace-keepers. "There is limited value in military action to end fighting if law and order does not follow," he will say. "So we must do more to ensure rapid reconstruction on the ground once conflicts are over – and combine traditional humanitarian aid and peace-keeping with stabilisation, recovery and development."

http://www.int.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&click_id=22&art_id=nw20080124110650396C598696

Searching for a new world order in Davos

Davos, Switzerland - The spectacular rise of China and India coupled with a decline in US influence has prompted heated debate in Davos this year over possible scenarios for a new world order.

For Gareth Evans, former Australian foreign minister and now president of the International Crisis Group, even those countries with a deep resistance to intervention were starting to recognise that egregious crimes against humanity could not go unchallenged.

"There is now the beginning of a global consensus that sovereignty doesn't mean a license to kill, doesn't mean a license to stand back and allow killing of that order to take place," Evans said.

"This is a very real phenomenon, that sovereignty is not what it was and can't be what it was," he added.


2008 is the year of NWO. enjoy.

[Stonewall71]

infact they have declared they will do so..the Serbs of Kosovo are ready to declare their own independance and join Belgrade taking up arms to protect themselves if nessesary..

our northern neighbours also have every reason to worry,this will quite possibly mean a new albanian insurgency in Tetovo

we are steaming towards a very very big pile of ****,i hope everybody sees that before its too late


apparently that will not happen...:-(

already there are rumours that Russia will support unilateral declarations of Independence of Abhakzia and South Ossetia , in Georgia...the domino effect....

I do not understand how can Europe can still going by US's leach , for USA of course is not a problem but EU will have regional conflicts spreading near it's borders and even inside (Catalunya, basque Country, Corsica..etc etc)

Hard for me to believe they almost all EU leaders will accept war within Europe just to please the "Big Brother":|:-(

[Stonewall71]

when you think that this "nice person" will soon rule a country...:roll:

Hashim Thaçi
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/3/31/Hashim_Thaci.jpg/172px-Hashim_Thaci.jpg
Hashim Thaçi (sometimes Thaqi, often referred to as Thaci in English-language media; Serbo-Croat: Hašim Tači) (born 24 April 1968) is the Prime Minister of Kosovo, the President of the Democratic Party of Kosovo (PDK) and former political leader of the Kosovo Liberation Army (KLA).
Thaçi was born in Broćna (Albanian: Burojë) in the municipality of Srbica, northwest of Drenica valley, in Kosovo, Serbia, Yugoslavia. When he graduated, Thaci attended postgraduate studies in the University of Zurich, in the history of Southeast Europe and international relations departments. During his university years, he was one of the Albanian student leaders, and the first student president of the parallel Albanian University of Prishtina that broke off in 1989 (and organized in the early 1990s) from the real University due to Kosovar Albanians' boycott of Milosevic's new imposed status of Kosovo and Metohija.
Before Thaçi emigrated to Switzerland, he studied philosophy and history at the University of Priština. By 1993, Thaçi joined the Kosovar Albanian political emigration in Switzerland. There he became one of the founders of the People's Movement of Kosovo (LPK), a Marxist-Leninist[1][2] political party in Kosovo devoted to Albanian nationalism and the movement to unify all Albanian-populated areas into one state. In 1993, Thaçi was sent in and became a member of the inner circle of the KLA. Thaçi (nom de guerre "Gjarpëri" [the Snake]) was responsible for securing financial means, training and armament of recruits, teaching them in Albania under the auspices of its Kosovar-sympathetic government, to be dispatched to Kosovo.
Hashim Thaci also founded the "Drenica-Group" an underground organization that is estimated to have controlled between 10% and 15% of all criminal activities in Kosovo (smuggling arms, stolen cars, oil, cigarettes and prostitution). The Group relied on its close connection to the Albanian, Czech and Macedonian mafia; one of the most important factors in these connections being Thaci's sister's marriage to Sejdija Bajrush, one of the largest Albanian mafia leaders.[3] One of the group's first military activities in Kosovo was the May 25 1993 attack on the railroad crossing in Glogovac in central Kosovo, when a band composed out of Thaci and his closest Drenica friends, Rafet Rama, Jakup Nuri, Sami Ljustku and Ilijaz Kadriju; killed four Serbian policemen and severely wounded three. On 17th June 1996 Thaci and several other members of the KLA opened fire on a Serbian police car in Sipolje in northern Kosovo, on the Kosovar Mitrovica-Pec road. Later the same year another unit under Thaci threw hand grenades into the Serbian military barracks "Miloš Obilić" in Vučitrn in central Kosovo.[3]
In July of 1997, the District Court of Priština sentenced Thaçi to 10 years of prison in absentia for criminal acts of terrorism. It is because of this that on 11th July 1997 Thaçi and his Drenica unit went into hiding in the woodlands in Drenica, although they continued to often visit Albania and Switzerland, not remaining in Kosovo in hiding. In February of 1998 the government in Belgrade headed by Slobodan Milosevic issued an arrest warrant under the condemnation for having ambushed and attacked patrolling Serbian policemen.
In March 1999, Hashim Thaçi was promoted into a political leader of the KLA and as such participated at the Rambouillet negotiations as the leader of the Kosovar Albanian team. At present, he leads the major opposition political party in Kosovo and is a leading member of the Kosovo team in the internationally-mediated process of negotiations for the final status of Kosovo.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hashim_Tha%C3%A7i

[themacedonian]

Apparently this is the plan for sunday 17th.

9:00am Tachi calls Kosovo parliament to hold a session.

14:00 parliament session held

17:00 media press conference by president, prime minister

17:30 an Obelisk of Independence will be erected. (interesting :))

19:00 concert in the main pristina square.

21:50 Taci will address people on the square

22:00 Fire works

[chris450]

oh there will be fireworks alright

[KninGrad]

When I heard serbs talking about NWO in 1991 it was a sign on a nutter and believe me I thought it was crazy talk. Now it is done deal.

If the order of the world is changed and the current world political rules are changed then what else do you call it other than New World Order.

Enjoy it.

I remember even 13-14 years ago (while Krajina still existed) people were saying how west (they mostly used krauts (germany) and Vatican) will try to destroy Serbia and basically take away Krajina, Bosnia, Kosovo, Montenegro, Sandzak, southern Serbia, Vojvodina etc. At that time it was funny and they were considered paranoid but now ....

[Stonewall71]

Apparently this is the plan for sunday 17th.

9:00am Tachi calls Kosovo parliament to hold a session.

14:00 parliament session held

17:00 media press conference by president, prime minister

17:30 an Obelisk of Independence will be erected. (interesting :))

19:00 concert in the main pristina square.

21:50 Taci will address people on the square

22:00 Fire works


It will be a great day for State-Terrorism , no doubt about it...

[Afro-European]

Voivodina will be the next to declare its independance from Serbia.

[zg18]

Voivodina will be the next to declare its independance from Serbia.

Not likely...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vojvodina

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Vojvodina_ethnic2002.png

[Afro-European]

You may be right after reading this.


Not likely...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vojvodina

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Vojvodina_ethnic2002.png

[Dukagjin]

who gives a shhhhhhhhhhh about russia , serbia an so on ...

now its time for independence of kosova

:) :) :) :) :)

im soooo happy

[knowitall]

"Russia will send troops in forcing the NATO troops to evacuate"

will they bollocks, how will they get the troops to kosovo?

serbia is sorounded by countries that are either in NATO/the EU or want to be, odds are they wont give russian troops permision to cross their terratory

they tried this stunt with pristina airport, then realised they couldn't re-supply, so much so the brits had to supply them with food and water


Ksovo will declare independance, Serbia and russia will wail, cry, stamp their feet..............and do nothing

Live with it

[BW2]

Ksovo will declare independance, Serbia and russia will wail, cry, stamp their feet..............and do nothing

Live with it

Will they now? Look who's become the next top notch political analyst to judge the likes of Putin. :roll:

Will Russia send troops to Kosovo? No and neither will Serbia, war isn't cheap and its even cheaper when you have the law on your side (AKA Serbia's claim to Kosovo) so why go through all the trouble of mobilizing and logistics supply when this can all be settled in the court of law? Serbia has already won the legal aspect of this mess.

Besides its not Russia or Serbia NATO might have to fight, its terrorist goons the likes of the KLA that they will be most worried about. Imagine how embarrassing it would be for the newest US/EU sponsored nation to going on a massive ethnic cleansing and killing spree of the Serbian population or whats left of it in the coming days of independence.

Kosovo independence is economically not viable, the EU for the most part will have to provide the billions in aid in a black hole thats already sucked up most of the initial aid handed over, as I said before those 16 000 NATO troops would be great reinforcements to the Afghan mission now wouldn't they? Yep to bad their gonna have to stay behind and keep a good eye out for oppression of the Serb population in the province for the next decade. Lets see who will be crying and stomping their feet in the next months...

[drunken sailor]

Russia may not ask to cross into Serbia. You think one of those little countries would put up a fight against Russia? The Ukraine I know wont. Romania would fall quickly. I guess it depends on how important this is to Russia. I know they are big brothers to the Serbs and Russia is not as weak as it was when NATO first intervened. Russia just may put its big foot down and halt what they see as encroachment into their backyard.

[Kilgor]

"Spain does not favor any unilateral declaration of independence".
"For the government of Spain, the fundamental priority is a solution that respects international law and that guarantees regional stability."



Spain protested to Russia Friday over remarks by President Vladimir Putin in which he likened the situation in Kosovo to that in Spain's Basque and Catalan regions, said a foreign ministry source.

"What's the use of encouraging separatism? People don't want to live in a Spain in the heart of single state. Well, let's support them then!" he said, in reference to the separatist movements in Spain northern Basque Country and eastern region of Catalonia.

Id expect a mistake like that from Bush, but Not Putin. He should check before alienating his friends with childish tantrums.

[NavyTimes]

Russia is going to be the big winner here. They can use the presedence in the power play around its borders, and Europe is going to pay the dole for the big bandithole that is Kosovo.

[Kap2406]

Spain protested to Russia Friday over remarks by President Vladimir Putin in which he likened the situation in Kosovo to that in Spain's Basque and Catalan regions, said a foreign ministry source.

"What's the use of encouraging separatism? People don't want to live in a Spain in the heart of single state. Well, let's support them then!" he said, in reference to the separatist movements in Spain northern Basque Country and eastern region of Catalonia.

Id expect a mistake like that from Bush, but Not Putin. He should check before alienating his friends with childish tantrums.
First of all, Bush would not know where Spain isp-)
But anyway, I think that Putin could not use Abhazia and S. Ossetia as examples for obvious reasons. So he used an example directly related to the West. Spain is upset because their territotial issues were mentioned on the world stage, and people/media/whoever might pay more attention to that issue now.

[Kilgor]

First of all, Bush would not know where Spain isp-)
But anyway, I think that Putin could not use Abhazia and S. Ossetia as examples for obvious reasons. So he used an example directly related to the West. Spain is upset because their territotial issues were mentioned on the world stage, and people/media/whoever might pay more attention to that issue now.

Putin was foolish to use that example and antagonize a "ally". I can't see why he would deliberately upset Spain on this issue other than a genuine mistake. Putin is not a infallible leader btw.

And yes, Bush would probably think Spain is in south America.

[Johan M]

The West want to start WW3 in the way to provoke others to do the first step. But it will not start in Kosovo, Serbia and Russia will not fall on this trick. The West will have to start WW3 with attack on Iran. On the other hand Kosovo will do a great job as Trojan horse, when islam forces will conquer Europe.

indeed,

but we have thougt about that: there are 18 000 NATO-troops present in Kosovo, so they won't have a chance to fulfill their roll as trojan horse.

[SniperVRS]

In case Kosovo declares independence, Serbia has quite a few options here. For the first time in Europe since cold war, there will be a barb wired, heavily defended border, maybe even Gaza style wall. That will be a death sentence in itself as the only viable road supply to the region will be cut off. Serbia will definately cut off electricity and any other utilities it was providing up to the point of independence. EU/US/UN you name it, will have to take care of it. From the surrounding countires only Albania and maybe Bulgaria will support the independence. I don't see how Montenegro can support it. Macedonia has a similar problem with Albanians so i don't see them supporting it either. Greece won't support it. Muslim/Croat part of Bosnia probably would support it but the beauty of that government is if all 3 sides don't agree to it, no side can do anything on its own. With roadblocks on all sides, all essentials down to food itself(Kosovo cannot feed its own population) will have to be shipped to Albania and taken to Kosovo or airlifted to Prishtina. Kosovo's economy if it has one cannot take such expenses. Our friends in the west will have to take care of it, lets see how long they're willing to provide services without gaining anything in turn. So in short, lets all welcome a new Palestine in Europe. Long live Kosovo, but i doubt it.

[Brute]

Putin was foolish to use that example and antagonize a "ally". I can't see why he would deliberately upset Spain on this issue other than a genuine mistake. Putin is not a infallible leader btw.

And yes, Bush would probably think Spain is in south America.

The foolishness you speak of is one of EU's, not Putin's. His was just an example - one of several (N. Ireland and Cyprus among them) and was meant to demonstrate the stupidity and the double standard of seeing Kosovo as a unique case and, thus, giving it an independence as such. Spain overreacted, plain and simple. Not surprising, I guess, since, lately, it's become fashionable in the West to jump at any chance to misconstrue/overreact to Putin's statements (as you just so delightfully did, one can almost see the saliva and hear the patronizing tone of yours) As to his character and intelligence, I've yet to see such a smart, no-nonsense leader anywhere in the world.

[Kilgor]

The foolishness you speak of is one of EU's, not Putin's. His was just an example - one of several (N. Ireland and Cyprus among them) and was meant to demonstrate the stupidity and the double standard of seeing Kosovo as a unique case and, thus, giving it an independence as such. Spain overreacted, plain and simple. Not surprising, I guess, since, lately, it's become fashionable in the West to jump at any chance to misconstrue/overreact to Putin's statements (as you just so delightfully did, one can almost see the saliva and hear the patronizing tone of yours) As to his character and intelligence, I've yet to see such a smart, no-nonsense leader anywhere in the world.

Ill ask again, What did Putin gain by antagonizing a "ally" with Spain ?

[ZeroZen]

Is that tomorrow?
I believe this it a bad signal and a good for one.

[Annihilator9112]

hmm
it is sunday 17th here in Aus. man im moving to europe because of this timezone.

[frenchy]

What I don't understand, before the war, kosovo was serbian ?

Serbs went exiled from them and muslims from kosovo became a majority in the area.

And now they claim independance.

If each time we give independance for minorities like in this case we'll have problems.

It's like we'd give independance to the muslim minorities in our french suburbs.

[Brute]

Ill ask again, What did Putin gain by antagonizing a "ally" with Spain ?


Read what I wrote. It's all in there. If Spain chooses to misinterpret Putin's original meaning and be offended then that's their choice. Furthermore, Spain as a member of EU bears all responsibility for all the consequences that will arise with Kosovo's recognition as an independent state by EU. If they had been a Russian ally, they would've blocked the EU mission to the province.

[KninGrad]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jWsPeJFnNg&feature=related

[naymeria]

"Russia will send troops in forcing the NATO troops to evacuate"

will they bollocks, how will they get the troops to kosovo?

serbia is sorounded by countries that are either in NATO/the EU or want to be, odds are they wont give russian troops permision to cross their terratory

they tried this stunt with pristina airport, then realised they couldn't re-supply, so much so the brits had to supply them with food and water


Ksovo will declare independance, Serbia and russia will wail, cry, stamp their feet..............and do nothing

Live with it
Sorry to disillusion you, but russia already has the permission since this summer from rumenia. Of course, noone considers that serbia must have a treaty with russia that would legittimize a military occupation of her territory in case of a sovregneity violation. Kustinica has already passed a motion some days ago declaring kosovo's declaration as such. So the probabilities that russia simply moves in and legittimately are high. At that point what would usa and eu do? Nothing and if russia asks them leave, they have to. Only a madman could on onto an illegal war with a legittimized russia. It would be a heavy historic burden to bear. and for kosovo?
Whether then russia decides to try other diplomatic pressure or to move in kosovo is another thing. But the potentiality is there.

Nay

edit : personally i think russia wants kosovo resolved exactly as all the rest of world wants. But it has to be done without violating international law for several resons which for brevity i would summarize as that it simply doesn't exist that kosovo leaders can think they can pound their fists to the world and get all they want.

[Brute]

http://www.sff.net/people/hmm/images/popcorn.gif


p-)

[Vorian]

Russia will intervene in this matter now that they are stronger than when we had NATO get involved. Russia sees Serbia as you would see a little brother. Russia will send troops in forcing the NATO troops to evacuate and Turkey will rush in to stop them and Greece will join Russia in fighting the Turks. This is the worst case scenario and it would rip NATO apart.

In which world are you living?

According to you:

a)Russia is willing to start WW3
b)Turkey is willing to engage a major power for nothing. Rushing to stop them, where in Kossovo?? Any idea how are they going to transport the troops? Or will they open a front in Caucasus?
c) In a NATO-Russian conflict, Greece a NATO member, is going to attack another NATO member siding with Russia.....................................................................


no comment

[Afro-European]

"Russia will send troops in forcing the NATO troops to evacuate"

will they bollocks, how will they get the troops to kosovo?

serbia is sorounded by countries that are either in NATO/the EU or want to be, odds are they wont give russian troops permision to cross their terratory

they tried this stunt with pristina airport, then realised they couldn't re-supply, so much so the brits had to supply them with food and water


Ksovo will declare independance, Serbia and russia will wail, cry, stamp their feet..............and do nothing

Live with it

Your post shows your utter arrogance and ignorance.Do you think that Kosovo's problems will be solved after it gets its independance?Is than region even economically viable.Kosovo received(and still receive) billionds of $ for its reconstruction but what did their corrupt leaders do with that money.Pop some champagne(or vodka if you want), celebrate, eat, drink, dance etc it's all ok.We will talk about Kosovo one year from now to see what it has acheived.

[Afro-European]

I don't think Russia and Nato will end up fighting over Serbia,unless one of the sides shoot first,which will be a huge mistake.I can't just image they gonna kill each other for that ,mismanaged,poor,corrupt ridden,mafia lead region.


Russia may not ask to cross into Serbia. You think one of those little countries would put up a fight against Russia? The Ukraine I know wont. Romania would fall quickly. I guess it depends on how important this is to Russia. I know they are big brothers to the Serbs and Russia is not as weak as it was when NATO first intervened. Russia just may put its big foot down and halt what they see as encroachment into their backyard.

[Switek]

I don't think Russia and Nato will end up fighting over Serbia,unless one of the sides shoot first,which will be a huge mistake.I can't just image they gonna kill each other for that ,mismanaged,poor,corrupt ridden,mafia lead region.


I don't think either. As for me a deal was made. Now we have just only political performance for public opinion... IMHO p-)

[Vorian]

Kosovo is doomed to be an eternal protectorate of the West.

When West's interests move from this region it will be either absorbed by Albania or Serbia. Kosovo alone isn't viable as many others explained before me

[Switek]

Kosovo is doomed to be an eternal protectorate of the West.

When West's interests move from this region it will be either absorbed by Albania or Serbia. Kosovo alone isn't viable as many others explained before me


Well I rather do not believe that project called "independent Kosovo" will be a success for its citizens and international community.

There is no single good soulution for this region, anyway.

[sosed]

Serbia will go back in Kosovo for sure. Not now, they will wait the right time, when NATO could not do anything, like WW3.

[drunken sailor]

In which world are you living?

According to you:

a)Russia is willing to start WW3
b)Turkey is willing to engage a major power for nothing. Rushing to stop them, where in Kossovo?? Any idea how are they going to transport the troops? Or will they open a front in Caucasus?
c) In a NATO-Russian conflict, Greece a NATO member, is going to attack another NATO member siding with Russia.....................................................................


no comment

Greece and Turkey are not friends, A conflict between them has long been a fear of NATO. What I stated is exactly what ancient Greek prophecy says about a coming war. I talked with Greek about this for along time and that person had the proof of the prophecy and what it said.

[Vorian]

Greece and Turkey are not friends, A conflict between them has long been a fear of NATO. What I stated is exactly what ancient Greek prophecy says about a coming war. I talked with Greek about this for along time and that person had the proof of the prophecy and what it said.

LOL. I am a Greek too you know.

Prophecies about wars coming exist since the dawn of time. Never came true. Is your Greek friend ultra-nationalist by chance?

And a conflict between Greece and Turkey is possible but over things that matter (like the Aegean dispute, Cyprus etc), not Kosovo for Christ's shake.

In a NATO-Russia conflict both would fight with USA. End of story.

[kefalo]

This is not good...i dont know why is USA supporting this when they know it will cause nothing but BIG trouble....

[Vorian]

This is not good...i dont know why is USA supporting this when they know it will cause nothing but BIG trouble....

Come on, it's not like they don't plan things beforehand.

I mean, nobody expected the mess in Iraq, oh wait...

[cinoeye]

So why the hell should I care about USA, EU...when they openly support occupation of my country?!?
Wheel of history is still turning, and pay back time will come.
My fatherland will be free again!!!

[Snoshi]

PRISTINA - Parliament in Kosovo started a special session on Sunday to declare independence from Serbia, ending a long chapter in the bloody break-up of Yugoslavia.

Speaking before the assembly, Prime Minister Hashim Thaci declared that Kosovo would never again be ruled by Belgrade.

"From today onwards, Kosovo is proud, independent and free," said Thaci. "We never lost faith in the dream that one day we would stand among the free nations of the world, and today we do."
Parliament speaker Jakup Krasniqi told the assembly: "Kosovo is turning a new page in its history. We are committed to a democratic state for all citizens, in cooperation with the international community."

The United States and most European Union members are expected to recognize the new state. Serbia and Russia are fiercely opposed.
http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/955031.html

[BetaVodka68]

Happy Independence Kosovo!

[KninGrad]

So why the hell should I care about USA, EU...when they openly support occupation of my country?!?
Wheel of history is still turning, and pay back time will come.
My fatherland will be free again!!!

"Kosovo" will crumble in 1-2 years due to total isolation and if current Serbian government does not impose total sanctions on them they will basically lose on incoming election. Also, Russia say they will impose certain measures against countries that recognize Kosovo and even if they increase the price of gas I will be so happy because they are the only true "friend" Serbia has now (also Slovakia, and I thank them).

[BlisteringFreakachu]

It's now on the brink of independence according to BBC.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7249034.stm

[knowitall]

"Kosovo" will crumble in 1-2 years due to total isolation

what total isolation...bar the largest trading block in the region (the EU)?

"if current Serbian government does not impose total sanctions on them they will basically lose on incoming election"

if they do impose "total sanctions" they can expect recipricol sanctions from the E.U. and the U.S. to start with

"Russia say they will impose certain measures"

will they bollocks, they need to sell the gas as much as we need to buy it, theyve got to much to loose to start a trade war on your behalf

as I said they'll make lots of noise.........then do shag all

[kleos]

Happy independence Kosova

[NuclearHead]

I'm very happy for Kosovo. They've been wanting this for quite a while.
I just hope things don't get violent.

[Wall]

Yes, indepence day in Kosovo today.

[NuclearHead]

Lets all give a warm welcome to a new member of the international community. I'm very happy for the Kosovo people; their dream is finally materializing.

[foreward russia]

cool, albanians are being given a second state by the us. waiting for the day when the us will give berlin to the turks, hey it's the second largest turkish city in europe and they breed fast.

[NuclearHead]

They can't join Albania, that was part of the agreement. I don't think Kosovo is in any position to break any agreements with the West.

[Shadowstorm]

Nice to hear. I hope Kosovo Independence goes smooth and safe.

[szr]

I wish Kosovo the best in peace and prosperity.

[chris450]

the fronpage of Kosovar newspaper Express ...clearly exressing the feelings of Kosovars against Belgrade and the remaining Serbs in Kosovo....

now if i was a Serb in -lets say- Mitrovica i would begin to really worry about my future...

http://bp2.blogger.com/_OPg-Kn4CzDg/R7gScFdUt2I/AAAAAAAABrs/4j69JhfmUHs/s400/015.JPG

thank you for igniting the Balkan powderkeg ...

[TheStorm]

Kosovo declares independence from Serbia

By NEBI QENA and WILLIAM J. KOLE, Associated Press Writers 7 minutes ago

Kosovo declared itself a nation on Sunday, mounting a historic bid to become an "independent and democratic state" backed by the U.S. and key European allies but bitterly contested by Serbia and Russia.

"Kosovo is a republic — an independent, democratic and sovereign state," parliament speaker Jakup Krasniqi said as the chamber burst into applause. Krasniqi, Prime Minister Hashim Thaci and President Fatmir Sejdiu signed the declaration, which was scripted on parchment.

Across the capital, Pristina, revelers danced in the streets, fired guns into the air and waved red and black Albanian flags in jubilation at the birth of the world's newest country.

Serbian President Boris Tadic immediately rejected the independence bid, saying his country will never accept Kosovo's "unilateral and illegal" declaration.

Sunday's declaration was carefully orchestrated with the U.S. and key European powers, and Kosovo was counting on swift international recognition that could come as early as Monday, when EU foreign ministers meet in Brussels, Belgium.

"From today onwards, Kosovo is proud, independent and free," said Thaci, a former leader of the Kosovo Liberation Army, which battled Serbian troops in a 1998-99 separatist war that claimed 10,000 lives. "We never lost faith in the dream that one day we would stand among the free nations of the world, and today we do."

"Our hopes have never been higher," he told the assembly. "Dreams are infinite, our challenges loom large, but nothing can deter us from moving forward to the greatness that history has reserved for us."

Thaci pledged that the new nation would be "a democratic, multiethnic state" — an attempt to reach out to Serbs who consider Kosovo the cradle of their medieval culture and religion.

But he also had stern words for the Serbian government, which last week declared secession illegal and invalid, saying in the Serbian language: "Kosovo will never be ruled by Belgrade again."

Reacting to the declaration, Serbian President Tadic urged international organizations "to immediately annul this act, which violates the basic principles of international law."

Source. (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080217/ap_on_re_eu/kosovo_independence)

Kosovo MPs proclaim independence


Kosovo MPs proclaim independence
Kosovo's parliament has unanimously endorsed a declaration of independence from Serbia, in an historic session.

The declaration, read by Prime Minister Hashim Thaci, said Kosovo would be a democratic country that respected the rights of all ethnic communities.

The US and a number of EU countries are expected to recognise Kosovo on Monday.

Serbia's PM denounced the US for helping create a "false state". Serbia's ally, Russia, called for an urgent UN Security Council meeting.

Correspondents say the potential for trouble between Kosovo's Serbs and ethnic Albanians is enormous.

Serbia's Prime Minister Vojislav Kostunica blamed the US which he said was "ready to violate the international order for its own military interests".

"Today, this policy of force thinks that it has triumphed by establishing a false state," Mr Kostunica said.

"Kosovo is Serbia," Mr Kostunica said, repeating a well-known nationalist Serb saying.

Search for equality

The declaration was approved with a show of hands. No-one opposed it.

"We have waited for this day for a very long time," Mr Thaci told parliament before reading the text, paying tribute to those who had died on the road to independence.


KOSOVO PROFILE
Population about two million
Majority ethnic Albanian; 10% Serb
Under UN control since Nato drove out Serb forces in 1999
2,000-strong EU staff to take over from UN after independence
Nato to stay to provide security

"The independence of Kosovo marks the end of the dissolution of the former Yugoslavia," the prime minister said - Kosovo was a unique case that should not set a precedent.

He said it would be built in accordance with the UN plan drawn by former Finnish President, Martti Ahtisaari - at the end of negotiations which did not produce a deal.

The international military and civilian presence - also envisaged by the Ahtisaari plan - was welcome, he added.

There should be no fear of discrimination in new Kosovo, he said, vowing to eradicate any such practices - and conveying a similar message in Serbian. President Fatmir Sejdiu had a similar pledge - also addressed in Serbian.

The declaration was then signed by all the MPs present.

Kosovo's top leaders are due to go to a sports hall later where the Kosovo Philharmonic Orchestra is expected to play Beethoven's Ode to Joy.

They are also due to sign their names on giant iron letters spelling out the word "newborn" which was to be displayed in Pristina.

Fireworks and street celebrations will follow. Thousands of people have poured onto the streets.



Some ethnic Albanians, who make up the majority of Kosovo's population, earlier laid flowers on the graves of family members killed by Serbian security forces during years of conflict and division.

The BBC's Nick Thorpe in the flashpoint town of Mitrovica says local and UN police, as well as the Nato troops, are maintaining a high profile to reassure all the citizens of Kosovo that they have nothing to fear.

Limitations

The declaration approved by Kosovo's parliament contains limitations on Kosovan independence as outlined in Mr Ahtisaari's plan.

Kosovo, or part of it, cannot join any other country. It will be supervised by an international presence. Its armed forces will be limited and it will make strong provisions for Serb minority protection.

HAVE YOUR SAY Unfortunately today Kosovo and Serbia are to become two dispensable chess-pieces of EU/NATO and Russia Mat, Ljubljana, Slovenia

Recognition by a number of EU states, including the UK and other major countries, will come on Monday after a meeting of EU foreign ministers in Brussels, says the BBC's Paul Reynolds.

The US is also expected to announce its recognition on Monday.

Three EU states - Cyprus, Romania and Slovakia - have told other EU governments that they will not recognise Kosovo, says our correspondent.

Russia's foreign ministry has indicated that Western recognition of an independent Kosovo could have implications for the Georgian breakaway provinces of Abkhazia and South Ossetia.

The UN has administered Kosovo since a Nato bombing campaign in 1999 drove out Serb forces.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/europe/7249034.stm

Published: 2008/02/17 15:42:58 GMT

[Deloma]

Nice to hear. I hope Kosovo Independence goes smooth and safe.

I don't understand EU and US regarding Kosovo.
They seem to have very little insight in what is actually going on in the balkans. They seem to have very little knowledge of ethnic groups and their history.

First of all, this is clear violation of international law.

Secondly, Albanians are imigrants in that area which includes besides Kosovo parts of Macedonia and also parts of Montenegro. It's not unsual for Albanians to have more than 5 children sometimes even around 10-12. Emagine what such birth rate does to demographics of a country.
If this indpendance is considered OK then I sure hope all regions accross Europe and World wishing for independance get it.

Europe is full of different imigrant groups, is it OK if these people achive independance because I know they make up majority in some areas? What will happen in 50 years in Europe? We will have 100 small countries. Is that what we want?

What would you say in US if for example hispanics wanted independant state on the West Coast? Would you allow it?

These hispanic groups have their own native countries and so do the Albanians living in Kosovo. It would be slightly different if they didn't have an own country but in this case they clearly do. If somebody comes to my country and doesn't like the way we run things around here then I say return to your native country since you don't agree on our way of living.

Why don't we give a independance to the Kurds? They don't even have a land area to go to. What about Palestinians? Cyprus?
What is happening in Northern Ireland. England is protecting an area that doesn't even belong to them geographicaly.

Future will show that this was a great misstake not only because other regions in the World but I'm afraid it might affect Albanian people in the whole region. Serbia can not do anything about this right now but I don't think they will forget, they ill just sit around and wait for the right moment and when that happens I sure wouldn't like to be Albanian living in Kosovo nor anywhere else in the region.

[Vorian]

Another country in the Balkans...interesting times ahead.


Btw, i think the threads should be merged.

[TheStorm]

Another country in the Balkans...interesting times ahead.


Btw, i think the threads should be merged.

Yes, I just noticed there was another thread, sorry.

[Shadowstorm]

That's ok man, it happens.

[Zeev]

a very sad day and a fantastic sign of encouragement to all separatist groups across the world, nice job Mr Clinton, bravo..

[Dr.Piloolkin]

Well now the convicts run the jails. Enjoy everyone.

[Snoshi]

MOSCOW, Feb 17 (*******) - Russia on Sunday urged the United Nations to annul Kosovo's declaration of independence and said it could cause an escalation in ethnic violence in the region.

"We expect the U.N. mission and NATO-led forces in Kosovo to take immediate action to carry out their mandate ... including the annulling of the decisions of Pristina's self-governing organs and the taking of tough administrative measures against them," the foreign ministry said in a statement.

"The decisions by the Kosovo leadership create the risk of an escalation of tension and inter-ethnic violence in the province and of new conflict in the Balkans," it said.

(Reporting by Dmitry Solovyov; Writing by Christian Lowe; Editing by Peter Millership)
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L16351132.htm

[signatory]

Europe is full of different imigrant groups, is it OK if these people achive independance because I know they make up majority in some areas? What will happen in 50 years in Europe? We will have 100 small countries. Is that what we want?

Just like your words is nothing more than opinion as is today's decleration nothing but words. Independence comes with international recognition.

Each situation is unique.

[Shadowstorm]

All I can say, I hope for the best for them.

[Midav]

I never agreed with this to begin with. Kosovo is Serbian territory and we never should have interfered.

[syncmaster001]

so which is next?

[Snoshi]

so which is next?

It will be interesting to see who recognized Kosovo as independent country.

[kosse]

^ Looks like a tabloid that's just rying to stir sh!t as much as possible.

Anyway, I have very mixed feelings about Kosovo's independence. Maybe international community should have forced them to become a widely autonomous region instead of this.

[Switek]

I see many troubles are coming. In many places in Europe and the rest of the world... http://www.nfow.pl/images/smiles/sad2.gif

I'm starting to organize a separatist group and I'm going to declare an independence of my region. Why not?

[Vorian]

US, UK, Germany and France for a start.

Well if you have the big ones you don't need anyone else.

[Spy]

US, UK, Germany and France for a start.

Well if you have the big ones you don't need anyone else.

so the US and the EU (especially Germany and France) support an independence of Kosovo, but strictly oppose one for Taiwan (and Tibet)...

[Xaito]

a very sad day and a fantastic sign of encouragement to all separatist groups across the world
x2 - I really hoped it wouldn't come to this.

[sexyhamburger]

oh boy. does anyone else see this independence as a little wrong? i don't want to start a flame war or anything but i just don't know if this is such a good idea. But whatever, too late now right?

[Shadowstorm]

so the US and the EU (especially Germany and France) support an independence of Kosovo, but strictly oppose one for Taiwan (and Tibet)...
I agree, they should let Taiwan and Tibet be their own countries.

[Lokos]

Each situation is unique

Clearly, the principle is implicit; the uniqueness of each situation is comprised of and defined by its tangible circumstances. The principle, however, underlying as it is, remains unchanged. It's an old principle - a Wilsonian one. Self-determination for peoples who by force, ethnography, influence or a combination thereof can override existing international law and impose upon a host country a violation of its sovereignty and integrity.

It's a sad day.

All of you fools wishing your newfound neighbours and friends in the international community a happy existence, may your country, too, enjoy the fate of mine, and may the ashes of defeat taste as sweet.

Lokos

[Violet Fashion by Mindy]

Awesome another two bit piss ant country that will no doubt require huge amount of money from the industrialized nations to survive.

I'm simply over the moon.

[Switek]

I agree, they should let Taiwan and Tibet be their own countries.


Why Not Northen Irealnd, Scotland, Flanders, Transnistria, Abkhazya, Chechnya, South Ossetia, Basque Country, Nagorno Karabah, Northen Cyprus and many other hot and ponentialy hot conflict zones?

[Dercius]

Well, its done. I think its like trying to extinguish a fire with gasoline. Now I suppose serbs in bosnia (republic Skrapsk or whatever) will also be granted independence and support by EU, US???

I think we (EU) screwed it big time, because this creates a dangerous precedent.

The same should then be applied for Tibet, Taiwan, Kurdistan, Darfur, Corsica, Sardinia, Basque, Bretons, etc.........

And after that, 10-20 little wars around the world thanks to our irresponsible politicians setting such a precedent.

Pandora box is open.

[Vorian]

Why Not Northen Irealnd, Scotland, Flanders, Transnistria, Abkhazya, Chechnya, South Ossetia, Basque Country, Nagorno Karabah, Northen Cyprus and many other hot and ponentialy hot conflict zones?

They must first start an armed struggle and then wait for Obama's or Hilary's first *** scandal.

[Shadowstorm]

Why Not Northen Irealnd, Scotland, Flanders, Transnistria, Abkhazya, Chechnya, South Ossetia, Basque Country, Nagorno Karabah, Northen Cyprus and many other hot and ponentialy hot conflict zones?
Really, Taiwan is it's own country.

[chris450]

could be ,but "Sun" readers dont stroll around London with AKs

..neither burn Serbian houses..with Serbs in em

[Lokos]

Well, its done. I think its like trying to extinguish a fire with gasoline. Now I suppose serbs in bosnia (republic Skrapsk or whatever) will also be granted independence and support by EU, US???


No, no, don't you see? The Bosnian Serbs - an absolute majority on the territory they control - cannot have the Kosovo principle applied to their situation. Kosovo is unique. It's special.

And, besides, the EU has definitively set an upper limit on the number of states allowable in the Balkans. Perhaps when Kosovo joins Albania there'll be another opening, but the Albanians of Macedonia will be contesting the spot.

There have been few times in my life that I have been as disgusted with the world in general as I am now. In all seriousness, this is despicable, and the people responsible should be ashamed.

Lokos

[Violet Fashion by Mindy]

I'm now taking bets at 14-1 that Bavaria will be the next country to declare independence and be ruled by a constitutional monarchy headed by the The Wittelsbach family.

[cmc]

Sad day for Europe.

[California Joe]

I admit I am woefully ignorant as to the inner workings of the history of the Balkans but I cannot help but think that no good will come from this.

[Midav]

No, no, don't you see? The Bosnian Serbs - an absolute majority on the territory they control - cannot have the Kosovo principle applied to their situation. Kosovo is unique. It's special.

And, besides, the EU has definitively set an upper limit on the number of states allowable in the Balkans. Perhaps when Kosovo joins Albania there'll be another opening, but the Albanians of Macedonia will be contesting the spot.

There have been few times in my life that I have been as disgusted with the world in general as I am now. In all seriousness, this is despicable, and the people responsible should be ashamed.

Lokos

I'm ashamed as well.

Have said that this is wrong since day one.

[Deloma]

No, no, don't you see? The Bosnian Serbs - an absolute majority on the territory they control - cannot have the Kosovo principle applied to their situation. Kosovo is unique. It's special.

And, besides, the EU has definitively set an upper limit on the number of states allowable in the Balkans. Perhaps when Kosovo joins Albania there'll be another opening, but the Albanians of Macedonia will be contesting the spot.

There have been few times in my life that I have been as disgusted with the world in general as I am now. In all seriousness, this is despicable, and the people responsible should be ashamed.

Lokos


And what happened to Serb majority in some parts in Croatia? They tried to establish a state back in the 90s but Croatians drove them out permanently in 95 with help of US and EU? Why weren't they granted independance? They were also a majority. Many of those that fled from Croatia ended actually up in Kosovo. What now? Where should they go now?

There is no justice in the world. As with animals same thing applies for human race. The biggest and strongest indvidual/community rules the rest. Keep also in mind that chopping up countries is a good thing for US and EU. It's much easier to rule 5 small countries then one large.

[phoebus]

That's something the entire international community must be ashamed of. It is sad that each of the EU governments, including mine, did nothing to prevent this pupet, joke of a state from emerging and quite frankly helped in that direction.

Reminds me when Montenegro became independent for an "EU acceptable" result of the tune of 0.something%. On the meantime lets concentrate on Afghanistan and burn all our money there, because apparently us Europeans have nothing better to do in our house, other than embracing multiculturalism, division, immigrants and investment opportunities for those who qualify (ie quite a few lads).

Bravo Europe.

[kNikS]

All of you fools wishing your newfound neighbours and friends in the international community a happy existence, may your country, too, enjoy the fate of mine, and may the ashes of defeat taste as sweet.




There have been few times in my life that I have been as disgusted with the world in general as I am now. In all seriousness, this is despicable, and the people responsible should be ashamed.


Well put, bro.

[Dukagjin]

serbs and proserbs dont cry . kosova never was yours .

r.i.p. the all the kosovar victims of serbian state terror and occupation , the work is done ........... independence of kosova :):):):):):):)

a geat day for europe and the whole democratic world
god bless the united states and great britain , a middlefinger for russia !

[Vorian]

serbs and proserbs dont cry . kosova never was yours .

r.i.p. the all the kosovar victims of serbian state terror and occupation , the work is done ........... independence of kosova :):):):):):):)

a geat day for europe and the whole democratic world
god bless the united states and great britain , a middlefinger for russia !


You should try being less provocative the mods are quite strict here.

This is your great day, enjoy it and party on the streets until the Serbians cut off electricity.

And I agree R.I.P. to the victims from the terror unleashed by both sides.

[Paya]

True, a sad day, but this is definitely not over. Serbia will never, and I mean NEVER, give up Kosovo. As our Government has already stated, our struggle will be a diplomatic one, as long as the Serbs in the province are safe and unharmed. If the Albanians try to ethnically cleanse the remains of the remains of the Kosovo Serb population, there will be another war in the Balkans.

I can only hope that this conflict will remain frozen.

[MichaelF]

It'll be amusing (for others) when this principle gets applied to, oh say, New Mexico...

[Moledet]

a very sad day and a fantastic sign of encouragement to all separatist groups across the world, nice job Mr Clinton, bravo..
I don't think we are in a position to criticize here, their story is similar to ours.

Happy independence day Kosova.

[phoebus]

a geat day for europe and the whole democratic world
god bless the united states and great britain , a middlefinger for russia !

The means under which the Serbian region of Kossyfopedion (Kossovo plains in Hellenic) was separated from the motherland was solely based on foreign military aggression, terrorism, occupation, ethnic division & cleansing and finaly an externaly imposed separation.

In other words it has nothing to do with the Democracy whatsoever.

[Lokos]

serbs and proserbs dont cry . kosova never was yours .

r.i.p. the all the kosovar victims of serbian state terror and occupation , the work is done ........... independence of kosova

a geat day for europe and the whole democratic world
god bless the united states and great britain , a middlefinger for russia !

Yaaay! Europe's new black hole for drug running, human trafficking and contraband smuggling is risen! Joy to the world. Oh goodness gracious me, do enjoy your victory. What I find most humorous about your post is that you put 'Serbian state' and 'terror' together - I mean, given the KLA's background and all. Whatever. This is going to turn into a flamewar. No willpower here for that, right now. It's all just sad and pathetic.

Lokos

[sosed]

WW3 will start very soon and US and Europe will be destroyed and at the end Kosovo will be again in Serbia.

[shatro]

I don't think we are in a position to criticize here, their story is similar to ours.

Happy independence day Kosova.

Care please to enlighten me, whose story is similar to yours?

[Switek]

serbs and proserbs dont cry . kosova never was yours .

r.i.p. the all the kosovar victims of serbian state terror and occupation , the work is done ........... independence of kosova :):):):):):):)

a geat day for europe and the whole democratic world
god bless the united states and great britain , a middlefinger for russia !

I'm not pro Serb. Rather I'm more "anti" Serb... ;) but in Kosovo case and further possible scenarios I'm just realist.

Independence of Kosovo will not solve any single problem of its citizens. It just an opportunity for Kosovars but economic basis of your country makes me pessimistic about your abilities to suvive as an independent state. Sorry mate but big problems are coming for you and for whole Europe.

[Breakfast in Vegas]

Wyoming will one day be free again!

[Lokos]

I don't think we are in a position to criticize here, their story is similar to ours

Are you talking about the Palestinian situation? If anything, I'd see that as a reason to criticize - given the disparity in Arab/Jewish birth rates in Israel itself. Wouldn't it be highly ironic if Israel, having fought for its existence for half a century, succumbed to an entirely background ethnographic change?

Lokos

[Nebelwerfer.]

WW3 will start very soon and US and Europe will be destroyed and at the end Kosovo will be again in Serbia.

And this time next year I'll be a millionaire... :roll:

[mas-36]

So will Kosova's flag be identical to that of Albania, or will there be slight differences? How can two neighboring states share the same flag if both deny they're wanting a "greater state"? They look the same to me, unless I'm missing something.

[Vorian]

Wyoming will one day be free again!

Τhank God we can get some humor out of this mess. :D



So will Kosova's flag be identical to that of Albania, or will there be slight differences? How can two neighboring states share the same flag if both deny they're wanting a "greater state"? They look the same to me, unless I'm missing something.

I read somewhere about the map with 5 or 6 stars but most probably a variation of the Albanian

[KninGrad]

I don't think we are in a position to criticize here, their story is similar to ours.

Happy independence day Kosova.

How is their story same as your ???

[mas-36]

Wyoming will one day be free again!

I think there's a pair of dogtags in your avi, but it's difficult for me to see them. p-)

[Nebelwerfer.]

So will Kosova's flag be identical to that of Albania, or will there be slight differences? How can two neighboring states share the same flag if both deny they're wanting a "greater state"? They look the same to me, unless I'm missing something.

Nope, completely blue with yellow map of Kosovo and six white stars above it.

[Shadowstorm]

WW3 will start very soon and US and Europe will be destroyed and at the end Kosovo will be again in Serbia.
Whatever man.

[daily666]

My two eurocents:

A Bad Idea!

We should wait for the UN Security Council within couple of hours. I'm not a diplomat but can anything be done to prevent this?

[phoebus]

So will Kosova's flag be identical to that of Albania, or will there be slight differences? How can two neighboring states share the same flag if both deny they're wanting a "greater state"? They look the same to me, unless I'm missing something.

Apparently their flag(s) is also similar to the US flag, maybe they can become an overseas unincorporated territory or something and join the club with Virgin Islands. Some lads are carrying the stars and stripes way to much down there...

More votes for Hillaryrofl

[Vorian]

WW3 will start very soon and US and Europe will be destroyed and at the end Kosovo will be again in Serbia.

Not wanting to sound rude but if US and Europe are destroyed, pretty much the whole world is going down.

[Moledet]

Care please to enlighten me, whose story is similar to yours?
As far as I see it and I don't know much here, immigrants came over, slowly took over the land, were slaughtered by the locals, created a state.

[kNikS]

Not wanting to sound rude but if US and Europe are destroyed, pretty much the whole world is going down.
Where do I sign for this? p-)

[Lokos]

Moledet, if you don't know much about a situation, don't posit an opinion. I'm not being hostile, but that sentence tells me all I need to know.

L.

[Nebelwerfer.]

Just took a screen capture of new flag since press conference was breaking news on Croatian national television...

http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/1136/kosovogg6.jpg

[KninGrad]

As far as I see it and I don't know much here, immigrants came over, slowly took over the land, were slaughtered by the locals, created a state.

yeah ,,,,, who was slaughtered OR r u still in 98' and believe stories of 500 000 people being murdered and other rubbish like that

[Vorian]

@ Il-28

The two-headed eagle is better. You could have it in blue

[Lokos]

Wow, that flag looks so European. Clearly, Kosovo is ready for Europe.

Lokos

[m.i.t]

Nice to hear. I hope Kosovo Independence goes smooth and safe.

[lider_r]

I don't think we are in a position to criticize here, their story is similar to ours.


well said



happy independence day kosovo

[phoebus]

As far as I see it and I don't know much here, immigrants came over, slowly took over the land, were slaughtered by the locals, created a state.

I like the "slowly took over" part.

But I don't remember NATO launching airstrikes and all the rest, prior to the declaration of the Israeli independence... The differences are huge and I beleive that many Israelis would not share any sort of solidarity with the Albanian-speaking population of Kossovo region.

[Nebelwerfer.]

@ Il-28

The two-headed eagle is better. You could have it in blue

"You"? My friend, I'm no Albanian but CroatoCzech or CzechoCroat... p-)

[Lokos]

Nice to hear. I hope Kosovo Independence goes smooth and safe.

And I hope the PKK is to you what the KLA was for us. Like I said, may you someday enjoy the very same situation. What goes around...

Lokos

[syncmaster001]

I wonder which fighter jet they will choose for their air force. and I wonder more where will they fly them?

[Dukagjin]

Joy to the world.

Lokos
lokos :hug: no flame , today is a good day even for our serbian neighbours

as you said joy to the world :):)
im sooo happy i cant describe it !

[Lokos]

today is a good day even for our serbian neighbours

Really? Have you been to see your Serbian neighbours? They may - and I say this delicately - disagree with you.

Lokos

[phoebus]

Just took a screen capture of new flag since press conference was breaking news on Croatian national television...

http://img128.imageshack.us/img128/1136/kosovogg6.jpg

Now that's promising, it brings to mind the state flag of Bosnia.

[Dercius]

Now, EU and USA have strap down the troops currently on the ground for......... lets say 20 years. The minute the troops are not there, the problems will start, and I wonder if it will not be needed to raise their numbers to keep both communities separated.

For sure that there are going to be troubles during this euphoric moments (for someone), but I think that we (EU) have gained nothing with the independence of kosovo (just another hole to burn EU taxpayers money). I mean, agraviating serbia (and Russia) will not make them more receptive to our political system and ideas (in the case our system and ideas were the good ones).

[kNikS]

Nice to hear. I hope Kosovo Independence goes smooth and safe.
That for sure is not going to happen.. starting from the fact that they won't have control on whole territory (isn't that ironic?), UN chair, electricity...

[Basillicus]

Gongratulations to the new nation. I hope people in the region will stay cool, and leaders of Kosovo govern their new country wisely.

[Peris]

I like the "slowly took over" part.

But I don't remember NATO launching airstrikes and all the rest, prior to the declaration of the Israeli independence... The differences are huge and I beleive that many Israelis would not share any sort of solidarity with the Albanian-speaking population of Kossovo region.


don't forget the Israeli military advisors to Milosevic in 1999.
not much to say but with the US chaotic policy in the Balcans i wonder if the US policy makers have the opinion that they serve the interests of the American people:roll:

[Peris]

I hope people in the region will stay cool,.


you are kidding, right?:)

[Vorian]

"You"? My friend, I'm no Albanian but CroatoCzech or CzechoCroat... p-)

Ooooops...

[phoebus]

I hope people in the region will stay cool.

Well after the Albanian-speaking people in the region adopted a strategy which resembles a borderline declaration of war, I wouldn't share your wishfull thinking. In a broader European perspective this is a birth of more problems and potentially violent ones in the near-future.

[shatro]

As far as I see it and I don't know much here, immigrants came over, slowly took over the land, were slaughtered by the locals, created a state.

Kosovo is ancient Serbian land. Same as the Palestine is ancient Jewish land.
During the past centuries under the Turkish occupation of the Balkans the Christian Serbs were driven out in masses and the Muslim Albanians were settled on the Serbian land.

[Switek]

Wow... Wikipedia has been just updated...

Kosovo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovo)

[phoebus]

don't forget the Israeli military advisors to Milosevic in 1999.
not much to say but with the US chaotic policy in the Balcans i wonder if the US policy makers have the opinion that they serve the interests of the American people

Surely not everyday American people but more likely some well-known "investement hawks", preferably of US-Hungarian origin.


Kosovo is ancient Serbian land. Same as the Palestine is ancient Jewish land.
During the past centuries under the Turkish occupation of the Balkans the Christian Serbs were driven out in masses and the Muslim Albanians were settled on the Serbian land.

+1

[Snoshi]

I don't think we are in a position to criticize here, their story is similar to ours.

Happy independence day Kosova.

Molodet actually there are no similarities between Kosovo and Israel.

[mas-36]

Kosovo is ancient Serbian land. Same as the Palestine is ancient Jewish land.
During the past centuries under the Turkish occupation of the Balkans the Christian Serbs were driven out in masses and the Muslim Albanians were settled on the Serbian land.


My wife is American Indian, a full-blooded Wyandot. Would you like to know what her perspective is with all this talk of original inhabitants and independence stuff? :)

[FDF_Hemppis]

Wow, that flag looks so European. Clearly, Kosovo is ready for Europe.

Lokos

You got that right.

None of the balkans is :|

[Peris]

Kosovo is ancient Serbian land. Same as the Palestine is ancient Jewish land.
During the past centuries under the Turkish occupation of the Balkans the Christian Serbs were driven out in masses and the Muslim Albanians were settled on the Serbian land.


actually Palestine is both the ancient land of Jewish people, of the Palestinians and other tribes who lived there. You are correct about the expulsion of Serbs. Albanians were made an artificial majority over the years and this is the most scandalous part of the story.

[Basillicus]

you are kidding, right?:)

Yeah, well I know Serbs don't like this situation one bit, but hopefully they don't do anything stupid.

[Vorian]

Wow... Wikipedia has been just updated...

Kosovo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovo)


LOl, official languages: Albanian, Serbian AND English rofl

Independent state alright.

[Snoshi]

actually Palestine is both the ancient land of Jewish people, of the Palestinians and other tribes who lived there. You are correct about the expulsion of Serbs. Albanians were made an artificial majority over the years and this is the most scandalous part of the story.

I dont want to go off-topic, but who are the so called "Palestinian People", you mean Arabs?

[shatro]

My wife is American Indian, a full-blooded Wyandot. Would you like to know what her perspective is with all this talk of original inhabitants and independence stuff? :)

Yeah sure, shoot :)

[phoebus]

My wife is American Indian, a full-blooded Wyandot. Would you like to know what her perspective is with all this talk of original inhabitants and independence stuff? :)

Please tell.

Not that enlightening us on her opinions will have anything to do with the issue at hand though.

[Fade]

Serbia has endured much throughout history, but this I don't know about.

[V.I.D.]

"Lokos :hug: no flame , today is a good day even for our serbian neighbours

as you said joy to the world :-):-)
im sooo happy i cant describe it !"


Don't you worry pal, the hangover will come at a very high price. Like they said in "The Layer Cake": Good times today, stupor tomorrow.

[Martel]

Sad for Serbia ...
Shame on us for allowing such a thing ...

[Dercius]

Yeah, well I know Serbs don't like this situation one bit, but hopefully they don't do anything stupid.

Yeah, I hope they dont do anything stupid, but how could I blame them for doing something stupid when we (EU) have just done something stupid and needless???

[Vorian]

Yeah, I hope they dont do anything stupid, but how could I blame them for doing something stupid when we (EU) have just done something stupid and needless???

Serbia doesn't need to go to war, they will just cut off all electricity and water supply. They can't provide it free to a foreign country, can they?

[IDF_TANKER]

I don't think we are in a position to criticize here, their story is similar to ours.

Happy independence day Kosova.

Well, I waited to see it coming. Didn't expect to come it from you, though, Moledet. First, the position of Kosovo vs. Serbia is nothing like ours - for start the consensus in Israel is that Palestinian territories should be a state(and this is even before the historic Serbia/Kosovo beckground, which has nothing in common with ours).If anything, the closest resemblance I can think of is the Russia vs. Chechnya conflict...

This is a very sad day for all the world. This is one of the most dangerous precedents in the modern post-WWII history. And what makes it especially dangerous, that this precedent was established due to direct assistance or ignoring of the leading international powers. This process(process of repartitioning of states and creation of new ones) which has started as a result of Yugoslavian wars, now seems to get to its culmination.

United States trapped in its foreign policy, based on anti-Russian geopolitical games and desire to win a few points in the Muslim world by supporting by any cost the Kosovar Albanians, made a terrible mistake. We can only guess now what a tragic chain of events this "accomplishment" will ignite. This just might mark the end of the stable balance of powers created in the post-WWII Europe (eventually all the world). Maybe I exaggerate, the time will show...

I can only put my signature under this post of Lokos:

Clearly, the principle is implicit; the uniqueness of each situation is comprised of and defined by its tangible circumstances. The principle, however, underlying as it is, remains unchanged. It's an old principle - a Wilsonian one. Self-determination for peoples who by force, ethnography, influence or a combination thereof can override existing international law and impose upon a host country a violation of its sovereignty and integrity.

It's a sad day.

All of you fools wishing your newfound neighbours and friends in the international community a happy existence, may your country, too, enjoy the fate of mine, and may the ashes of defeat taste as sweet.

Lokos

[Xaito]

Yeah, well I know Serbs don't like this situation one bit, but hopefully they don't do anything stupid.

it would be more stupid not to do anything.

[phoebus]

LOl, official languages: Albanian, Serbian AND English rofl

Well the region seems to have thousands of foreign KFOR troops, including 1.000 members of the Hellenic Army.

On our side I would hope we pull out our troops asap; as a sign that we don't like to participatre in that farce anymore. But then again we have a responsibility towards the Serbs and their centuries-old civilisation in Kossovo, which we tried to protect for so many years... Tough decision.

[mas-36]

Yeah sure, shoot :)


Please tell.

Not that enlightening us on her opinions will have anything to do with the issue at hand though.


Suffice it to say, she isn't too happy with the rock-strewn sectors of Kansas her people recieved. Her question is: why are some people granted the right of independence on the basis of ancestral claims, while others are not? Yes, I did see some people brought up the issue of Tibet and Taiwan on this thread.

[IDF_TANKER]

I wonder what happens from now on. I mean, there will be a vote in the UN assembly or something?

[daily666]

I wonder what happens from now on. I mean, there will be a vote in the UN assembly or something?

A Security Council meeting. I think they will decide wheter to give NATO mandate to stay in Kosovo or not. Not sure what can be done other than that. Russia will not give it back as easily as in 1999.

[Vorian]

I wonder what happens from now on. I mean, there will be a vote in the UN assembly or something?

Since Russia will block any UN decision it's up to individual countries to recognise it. You can bet they won't see the doors of UN for the next years.

[AlexMartin2]

Just heard from the news: There are 200 ethnical conflicts around the world. Wonder, who is next to declare independance?

[Mundzos]

No, no, don't you see? The Bosnian Serbs - an absolute majority on the territory they control - cannot have the Kosovo principle applied to their situation. Kosovo is unique. It's special.

And, besides, the EU has definitively set an upper limit on the number of states allowable in the Balkans. Perhaps when Kosovo joins Albania there'll be another opening, but the Albanians of Macedonia will be contesting the spot.

There have been few times in my life that I have been as disgusted with the world in general as I am now. In all seriousness, this is despicable, and the people responsible should be ashamed.

Lokos


Bosnian Serbs can't have the same principle applied because they gained absolute majority with killing, ethnic cleansing of Catholic and Muslims...Their military and political leaders are wanted to crimes they orchestrated....And the whole world knows that...So that is not the same as Kosova...Serbs should be happy that they even have RS, since their whole entity is based on genocide against other religions....

[Rumcajs]

So why the hell should I care about USA, EU...when they openly support occupation of my country?!?
Wheel of history is still turning, and pay back time will come.
My fatherland will be free again!!!

I support you, majority of the Czechs are against something as "independent Kosovo", Kosovo is part of Serbian state, even our idiotic president is agaist alblablablabanian robbery in Kosovo

[muck]

DER SPIEGEL reports in a breaking news headline that a bomb detonated near a UN facility in Mitrovica.

[phoebus]

A Security Council meeting. I think they will decide wheter to give NATO mandate to stay in Kosovo or not. Not sure what can be done other than that. Russia will not give it back as easily as in 1999.

And at this point it makes you wonder what would be China's* stance, given that they do face separatism issues as well.


*PRC

[Switek]

Just heard from the news: There are 200 ethnical conflicts around the world. Wonder, who is next to declare independance?

me ;)

Look here (http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showpost.php?p=3053668&postcount=24)

[Vorian]

Bosnian Serbs can't have the same principle applied because they gained absolute majority with killing, ethnic cleansing of Catholic and Muslims...Their military and political leaders are wanted to crimes they orchestrated....And the whole world knows that...So that is not the same as Kosova...Serbs should be happy that they even have RS, since their whole entity is based on genocide against other religions....


*coughs*

And KLA only took care of puppies in Kosovo.

I think one of the greatest injustices in the whole story is that only Serb war criminals were arrested while everybody else is a saint and victim.

[Dercius]

Since Russia will block any UN decision it's up to individual countries to recognise it. You can bet they won't see the doors of UN for the next years.

Neither China will recognise it, so you already have 2 vetos

[GREENMILITIA]

Hope it won't happen to Serbia giving away their land but if does happen then hope someday that UN and even the author AMERICA would give DAKOTA to the AMERICAN NATIVE INDIANS or like AUSTRALIA giving the ABORIGINES the whole TASMANIA... etc....

[Vorian]

Neither China will recognise it, so you already have 2 vetos

One is enough ;)

[phoebus]

Bosnian Serbs can't have the same principle applied because they gained absolute majority with killing, ethnic cleansing of Catholic and Muslims...

Yeah we know... Apparently Serbs in 2008 cannot have the same rights, because according to a 90's hype their fathers were the sole, pure-evil butchers of the Balkans et all.

That stereotype doesn't work anymore.

[cbreedon]

this is wrong.... It would be like if a the international community imposed a new country in Philadelphia. People in the US would go ape. I feel for the Serbs.

[Switek]

A Security Council meeting. I think they will decide wheter to give NATO mandate to stay in Kosovo or not. Not sure what can be done other than that. Russia will not give it back as easily as in 1999.


And at this point it makes you wonder what would be China's* stance, given that they do face separatism issues as well.


*PRC

The result will be 3 pros vs 2 cons as for permanent members stances

[Basillicus]

it would be more stupid not to do anything.

I don't see that at this point there's much anything they could do that would help.

[sosed]

Kosovo independence is the biggest strategic mistake which will lead to greatest disaster in history. For the safe of Europe, when WW3 begun, Serbia must immediately occupy Kosovo to get direct ties with Greece to defend Europe on Balkan front. If they fail Europe will fall from two directions, one through Balkan, second through Spain.

[Mundzos]

*coughs*

And KLA only took care of puppies in Kosovo.

I think one of the greatest injustices in the whole story is that only Serb war criminals were arrested while everybody else is a saint and victim.


There were crimes everywhere, especially by individuals, but Bosnian Serbs military and political leader planned and led in Ethnic Cleansing and Genocide....Let's just say Srebrenica...

[phoebus]

The result will be 3 pros vs 2 cons as for permanent members stances

Err we're talking about UN-Sec. Council here. I'm sure you're familiar with the veto concept, right?

No 3vs2 or 4vs1 logic applied. One is enough to kill a resolution, but usually it's good to veto along with another member, as a show of an "axis" backing the decision.

[Hollis]

Word of Caution.............


KEEP IT CIVIL.

Keep it on topic.


Thanks,

[-DarthMaul-]

Never mind someone beat me to it lol.

And I think its a good thing. IF they want to be free and happy, why stop them? Its a small f***ing country..


With the difference that all these happened when international law didn't exist. As for Israelis it's a completely different situation.

How is it different? Its the same exact thing...at least in the case of the Albanians there was no mass exodus from another continent, with the intent to scede, and create militant groups.

[kNikS]

There were crimes everywhere, especially by individuals, but Bosnian Serbs military and political leader planned and led in Ethnic Cleansing and Genocide....Let's just say Srebrenica...
I'm not sure that International Court of Justice used such formulation...

[Hellfish]

I'm not happy. I don't think Albania or Kosovo are worth fighting over. And I don't think it's in the American best interest to antagonize Serbia and Russia because of those dumps.

[MG 3]

Happy independence day!

[phoebus]

There were crimes everywhere, especially by individuals, but Bosnian Serbs military and political leader planned and led in Ethnic Cleansing and Genocide....Let's just say Srebrenica...

You are using the rather serious term Genocide out of context, as it is wrongfully done in many mainstream media and other organisations concerning that issue.

Yet, to imply that nowdays due to Srebrenica and past war-crimes of certain individuals, all of Serbians in Bosnia are not entitled to follow the (illegal yet de-facto) precedent of Albanian-speaking Kossovars; is simply biased and flawed logic.

[Vorian]

Kosovo independence is the biggest strategic mistake which will lead to greatest disaster in history. For the safe of Europe, when WW3 begun, Serbia must immediately occupy Kosovo to get direct ties with Greece to defend Europe on Balkan front. If they fail Europe will fall from two directions, one through Balkan, second through Spain.


Start packing supplies everyone.



How is it different? Its the same exact thing...at least in the case of the Albanians there was no mass exodus from another continent, with the intent to scede, and create militant groups.

I just didn't want to turn the thread into Arab-Jewish confrontation . It's about Kosovo.

Btw, about the bomb that somebody mentioned. Any more info?

[boreal]

This is a big shame for Europe.

[Peris]

There were crimes everywhere, especially by individuals, but Bosnian Serbs military and political leader planned and led in Ethnic Cleansing and Genocide....Let's just say Srebrenica...


Srebrenica is connected to the Bosnian Muslim Naser Oric slaughter of the Serb inhabitance of Bratunac.

I bet you hear the name Bratunac for the first time:)

[Switek]

Err we're talking about UN-Sec. Council here. I'm sure you're familiar with the veto concept, right?

No 3vs2 or 4vs1 logic applied. One is enough to kill a resolution, but usually it's good to veto along with another member, as a show of an "axis" backing the decision.

But veto des not change anything in such situation. SCUN is not a body priviliged to approve or reject somebody's else independence. In this case it's only manifest of political will.

[cinoeye]

If genocide justifies independence, that Serbs in Bosnia and Croatia have full right to separate, sicne more than a million where slaughtered during the ww2.

This is a shame, but this is just a first half...

[Shadowstorm]

I think some of you guys are overreacting over this. I remember some people saying WWIII will begin when Montenegro declared independence a year ago. Now days, you don't hear much about that country. I very doubt U.S, Russia and other countries are going to start a shooting war over this.

[m84a4]

Kosovo independence is the biggest strategic mistake which will lead to greatest disaster in history. For the safe of Europe, when WW3 begun, Serbia must immediately occupy Kosovo to get direct ties with Greece to defend Europe on Balkan front. If they fail Europe will fall from two directions, one through Balkan, second through Spain.

If Europe depends on Serbia then Europe deserves to fail.

[Power_serj]

this is wrong.... It would be like if a the international community imposed a new country in Philadelphia. People in the US would go ape. I feel for the Serbs.

That really isn't a valid comparison. Remember, Yugoslavia was one country in a constant civil war between ethnic groups, they are not immigrants. That is like calling the Kurds in Turkey immigrants.

:bash:

[Vorian]

That really isn't a valid comparison. Remember, Yugoslavia was one country in a constant civil war between ethnic groups, they are not immigrants. That is like calling the Kurds in Turkey immigrants.

:bash:

But the Albanians in Kosovo WERE immigrants!

[Peris]

I think some of you guys are overreacting over this. I remember some people saying WWIII will begin when Montenegro declared independence a year ago. Now days, you don't here much about that country.



just wait when the Albanians of Montenegro will ask independence too. btw comparing the Montenegro thing and Kosovo is totally wrong. The Montenegrins were separated after agreement with Serbia,they have ties with Serbia and they were not waving US flags in the steets.

[phoebus]

SCUN is not a body priviliged to approve or reject somebody's else independence.

According to the broader international community, UN is, so their government will fall in the category of puppet states or protectorates (ie Occupied Territories in Cyprus, or the Rebublic of Aztarkh in Nagormo Karabakh).

If you get independent without a green light fom UN there will be problems ahead for everyone following that road or unilateraly recognising them.

[Mat_fr]

clash between riot police and demonstrators outside US ambassy in Belgrade, acording to BBC news..

mat

[Celeon999]

Has any country officialy recognized Kosovo's independence and offered diplomatic relations yet ?

Ive heard that Germany will do so soon.

[m84a4]

Is it possible to compare Kosovo 2008 with Texas 1836 considering the legal rights for independence?

[Vorian]

clash between riot police and demonstrators outside US ambassy in Belgrade, acording to BBC news..

mat

Oh, God. Here we go.

[Shadowstorm]

Yeah, but like I said. I very doubt their going to be a major shooting war.

[phoebus]

That is like calling the Kurds in Turkey immigrants.

Quite the contrary actually, I won't go on that issue here.

[Vorian]

Yeah, but like I said. I very doubt their going to be a major shooting war.

War can't erupt with international forces in Kosovo. The only pretext will be if Albanians attack Serbian communities which is why all effort is directed to prevent such incidents.

[Peris]

[quote=Vorian;3054058]War can't erupt with international forces in Kosovo. quote]

conventional war no. Other types?

[[WDW]Megaraptor]

Has any country officialy recognized Kosovo's independence and offered diplomatic relations yet ?

Ive heard that Germany will do so soon.

United States will establish diplomatic relations tomorrow as will the UK.

Romania, Slovackia, Serbia, Russia, China and Cyprus are refusing to recognize Kosovo.

BBC reporting two hand grenades thrown at international organization's buildings in Mitrovica:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7249034.stm


The first sign of trouble in Kosovo came in the ethnic Serbian area of the flashpoint town of Mitrovica, where two hand grenades were thrown at international community buildings.
One exploded at a UN court building while the other failed to go off outside offices expected to house the new EU mission.

In Belgrade, the US embassy was pelted with stones as up to 2,000 demonstrators clashed with hundreds of riot police. "Kosovo is the heart of Serbia," the protesters shouted.

[Vorian]

I don't think so. Again cause of NATO forces.

[pacifist]

Now Carl Savich will burn his fuse and another BS story about Finland.

[Deloma]

Btw, about the bomb that somebody mentioned. Any more info?

According to BBC:

"The first sign of trouble in Kosovo came in the ethnic Serbian area of the flashpoint town of Mitrovica, where two hand grenades were thrown at international community buildings.

One exploded at a UN court building while the other failed to go off outside offices expected to house the new EU mission.

In Belgrade, the US embassy was pelted with stones as up to 2,000 demonstrators clashed with hundreds of riot police. "Kosovo is the heart of Serbia," the protesters shouted"

[[WDW]Megaraptor]

I don't think so. Again cause of NATO forces.

Unless someone with a lot of power does something really really stupid...

[AlexMartin2]

Has any country officialy recognized Kosovo's independence and offered diplomatic relations yet ?

Ive heard that Germany will do so soon.

Only 3: Estonia, Albania and Ireland. Even USA didnt do it yet.

[Hollis]

Now Carl Savich will burn his fuse and another BS story about Finland.


Why don't you PM me, what this has to do with this thread. Your developing a tendancy to "derail" threads with off the wall comments, Keep it up, and you will not be on this forum.

[Fade]

Russia denounces Kosovo declaration


MOSCOW - Russia has denounced Kosovo's independence declaration Sunday.

It has called for an emergency meeting of the UN Security Council, underlining its opposition to the Serbian province's Western-backed bid for statehood. In a statement, the Foreign Ministry says Russia supports Serbia's "just demands to restore the country's territorial integrity".

It also says that Russia wants the Security Council to renew efforts to reach a settlement on the issue of Kosovo's status.

Link (http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/2008/02/17/4854649-ap.html)

[GodlessAmerica!]

divide et impera

[sosed]

I think a lot of people is watching only fragments and don't see the whole mosaic. The whole world is in the same chain. The WW3 will not start in Kosovo, but with attack on Iran. Anyway result will be the same, because all those hot spots are connected in clash between the same power blocks.

[spale]

OK, well its time for Republika Srpska to declare independence from Bosnia.

They don't want to live in Bosnia as much Albanians don't want to live in Serbia.

There was a war in Bosnia as well as in Kosovo.

There is an international agreement that guarantees Bosnia to stay in one piece as much as an agreement to keep Serbia in one piece.
One is broken, why not the other??

Serbs living in northern Kosovo will never accept Albanian authorities, so why not declare independence from independent Kosovo??

When all the above happens, THAN we can talk of "last" pieces of the ex Yugoslavia puzzle sorted in place.
Not just giving Kosovo their own state.

[Riker]

I would wish to congrat the Kosovo on their independance, it must be a big day for them, and I wish them all the best.

I also wish that no opposing party tries to act stupid because if you act stupid, stupid thing will be happening to you before you know it, so...

I know what the atmosphere was in Croatia when we claimed our independence 18 years ago, it was a bit shaky first few days, and yes Serbia denied it but hey, who listens to them anyway...

I see it's a emotional moment for them, so, congratulations again...

[boreal]

War can't erupt with international forces in Kosovo. The only pretext will be if Albanians attack Serbian communities which is why all effort is directed to prevent such incidents.

We have +800 troops in Kosovo for protect churches, monasteries and the serbian population from terrorist attacks. I thinks that this population also has his right to annex to Serbia with his territories, another unilateral action.

[Vorian]

We have +800 troops in Kosovo for protect churches, monasteries and the serbian population from terrorist attacks. I thinks that this population also has his right to annex to Serbia with his territories, another unilateral action.

I can't see how Serbians can remain in a united Kosovo. It should be divided in two parts.

PS: How do we ****ounce Srpska??????

[Hollis]

Because the Kosovo Post are developing a common theme, I merged them into this one. Let's keep this topic in one thread.


Thanks.

H.

[Mat_fr]

well we also have +2000 soldiers there.. but i'm pretty anxious tonight ..

mat