Belgian minister sparks US genocide row

[budanski]

Belgian minister sparks US genocide row
Jacob Kell
Expatica (http://www.expatica.com/source/site_article.asp?channel_id=3&story_id=6502)

BRUSSELS - Belgian Defence Minister Andre Flahaut has come under heavy criticism for approving an official document that says the United States is responsible for the biggest genocide committed during the past 500 years.

The claim appeared in an official defence ministry magazine as part of a 16-page report on genocide around the world.

The report was published to commemorate the 10th anniversary of the 1994 genocide in Rwanda, which left up to a million people dead.

According to the report, the worst genocide committed in the past 500 years has been the extermination of native Americans in what is today the US. The study said this mass killing began in 1492, when Christopher Columbus first landed in America, and that the genocide has claimed 15 million lives.

The report gave no clear end date for the US genocide, implying, said some analysts, that the extermination of native Americans is still continuing today.

Number two on the list of the world's greatest genocides was the extermination of native peoples in south America, the report continued.

US furious at Belgian minister's vote comment

Bush thanks Belgium

Flemish newspaper De Standaard vehemently criticised Flahaut for allowing the study to be published.

"This publication puts our relations with all north and south American countries at risk," the paper said in an angry editorial, adding that it considered Flahaut to be "unfit or incompetent".

Flahaut has already angered Washington in the past. Earlier this year he said in a magazine interview that he would vote Democrat if he were American. He was also a vocal opponent of the war in Iraq and briefly threatened to close Belgian airspace and the port of Antwerp to the American military ahead of last year's invasion of the middle eastern state.

The Belgian authorities have sought to play down the impact of the report. A government official quoted on the website of national broadcaster RTBF called the furore surrounding the document "a storm in a teacup".

Despite this, sources say Belgian Foreign Minister Louis Michel, who was in Rwanda to commemorate the victims of that country's genocide when the furore blew up, has already spoken to the US ambassador in Africa's great lakes region in a bid to head of an embarrassing diplomatic spat.

Michel was on Friday also set to discuss the affair with his US opposite number Colin Powell, sources added.

Before Flahaut's latest diplomatic gaffe, relations between Belgium and the US appeared to be improving after two decidedly frosty years.

Earlier this week it emerged that US President George W Bush had written to Belgian Prime Minister Guy Verhofstadt to thank him for the role his country has played inside the Nato alliance and also for Brussels' efforts to tackle terrorism.
So the Belgian colonization and exploitation of Rwanda wasn't a factor? France's arming and training of Hutu extremists (http://www.guardian.co.uk/france/story/0,11882,1188188,00.html)played no part? It was all America's fault because we might have been able to do something about it? Its true, us ignorant americans can't quite grasp this one. :roll:

[Kilgor]

The study said this mass killing began in 1492, when Christopher Columbus first landed in America, and that the genocide has claimed 15 million lives.




Wouldnt that make them europeans ?

[Jack Mehoff]

The study said this mass killing began in 1492, when Christopher Columbus first landed in America, and that the genocide has claimed 15 million lives.




Wouldnt that make them europeans ?


Exactly. :lol: United States of America wasn't even on the map until 1776

[Kilgor]

yeah.. just because your on someone elses soil doing your dirty work, it doesnt change your nationality.

Ie.. the spanish ****ed over the whole of south america plus more, but they werent south americans.

Btw, I thought stalin's and Mao's controlled faminies and purges were pretty bad ?

[Jack Mehoff]

Some cockslap politician in Belgium probably has nothing to do so he thought of this bull**** instead.

[1Cie GevGn]

Oh god no...

It hasn't been the first time that my future employer (that's right, me = Belgian and soon-to-be in the military) did it again...

And since I haven't been having much sleep last night, I'll take this opportunity to vent my angers, if y'all don't mind.

Anyone remember that docu on Belgian TV recentely about how Leopold I ruled Africa/Congo as a dictator? And how it continued up till the final independance of Congo? I'm sorry to say that this paper is completely useless and will only make the US-Belgium relationship worse.

Also, on a sidenote, there has been some commotion last months about the Belgian Army Medical Centre in Neder-Over-Heembeek. It's a army hospital famous for it's burnvictim-unit. I actually went there for my medical 2 months ago. Well, there has been a strike by most of the surgeons, because they have huge problems with the officer running the hospital. They wanted him sacked for various understandable reasons, but Flahaut didn't want to. Ofcourse it's a political thing, and there is still no solution up to this day.

Another thing, we use the M109A2 howitzer, a great piece of machinery (I'm actually looking into going for gunner/loader on one of them ;) ), but they are getting old! Instead of selling them, and getting some money to buy new equipment he has decided to modernize them! This will be a multi-million Euro operation, conducted by a Belgian contractor.

I do hope things like this will not happen anymore, and I hope the Belgian governement will clean up his mess <AGAIN> and this will all be over soon. And, to finish, I just want to apologize a little bit for him, and make sure all the American's out here know that not everybody in Belgium is as contra-US as it seems. Not by a long shot woot

Now, I need some breakfast. And I need to go downtown to city hall to get some papers fixed. And we all know what that means. I better pack some f00d p-)

[cut]

Belgian minister sparks US genocide row
Jacob Kell
Expatica (http://www.expatica.com/source/site_article.asp?channel_id=3&story_id=6502)

BRUSSELS - Belgian Defence Minister Andre Flahaut has come under heavy criticism for approving an official document that says the United States is responsible for the biggest genocide committed during the past 500 years.

The claim appeared in an official defence ministry magazine as part of a 16-page report on genocide around the world.

The report was published to commemorate the 10th anniversary of the 1994 genocide in Rwanda, which left up to a million people dead.

According to the report, the worst genocide committed in the past 500 years has been the extermination of native Americans in what is today the US. The study said this mass killing began in 1492, when Christopher Columbus first landed in America, and that the genocide has claimed 15 million lives.

The report gave no clear end date for the US genocide, implying, said some analysts, that the extermination of native Americans is still continuing today.

Number two on the list of the world's greatest genocides was the extermination of native peoples in south America, the report continued.

US furious at Belgian minister's vote comment

Bush thanks Belgium

Flemish newspaper De Standaard vehemently criticised Flahaut for allowing the study to be published.

"This publication puts our relations with all north and south American countries at risk," the paper said in an angry editorial, adding that it considered Flahaut to be "unfit or incompetent".

Flahaut has already angered Washington in the past. Earlier this year he said in a magazine interview that he would vote Democrat if he were American. He was also a vocal opponent of the war in Iraq and briefly threatened to close Belgian airspace and the port of Antwerp to the American military ahead of last year's invasion of the middle eastern state.

The Belgian authorities have sought to play down the impact of the report. A government official quoted on the website of national broadcaster RTBF called the furore surrounding the document "a storm in a teacup".

Despite this, sources say Belgian Foreign Minister Louis Michel, who was in Rwanda to commemorate the victims of that country's genocide when the furore blew up, has already spoken to the US ambassador in Africa's great lakes region in a bid to head of an embarrassing diplomatic spat.

Michel was on Friday also set to discuss the affair with his US opposite number Colin Powell, sources added.

Before Flahaut's latest diplomatic gaffe, relations between Belgium and the US appeared to be improving after two decidedly frosty years.

Earlier this week it emerged that US President George W Bush had written to Belgian Prime Minister Guy Verhofstadt to thank him for the role his country has played inside the Nato alliance and also for Brussels' efforts to tackle terrorism.
So the Belgian colonization and exploitation of Rwanda wasn't a factor? France's arming and training of Hutu extremists (http://www.guardian.co.uk/france/story/0,11882,1188188,00.html)played no part? It was all America's fault because we might have been able to do something about it? Its true, us ignorant americans can't quite grasp this one. :roll:

lol

it doesn't say the US was responsible for Rwanda, you should read the article before **** talking France for the sake of it.

[seruriermarshal]

He is a really sh*t , when he said something ......

[Romulus]

He (and this paper) don't know **** about Native Americans. If it was genocide alot of us Americans wouldn't be here today and I wouldn't have Cherokee blood flowing through my veins. The vast majority of North American Indians who died did so as a result of diseases to which they lacked natural immunity (80 percent without ever seeing a white man). Those of us who hail from other parts of the world can hardly be held morally culpable for that, anymore than we can hold the Indians responsible for any of our number who died from their diseases. Many of the other who died did so in wars which were made necessary by armed resistance on the part of various Indian bands.

Alot of Native Americans ended up assimilating into the colonial culture.What is wrong with assimiliation? Over the course of history, we all are products of assimiliation. I mean, who among us is "purely" descended from the people who walked out of Africa and the Middle East?

So I say eat shat Mr.Andre Flahaut. Come to America and live here and learn something then you can spout your bull**** to the world. As the Cherokee say Duk-shan-ee.

PS....... I still love Belgian Frites!!!!

[Kilgor]

I wonder whats next, denile of the holocaust or blaming americans for it ?

any bets ?

[1Cie GevGn]

There was a report on tv here not too long ago, it's a program called "man bijt hond" or "man bites dog" where they draw a straight line thru a country and visit common peeps alongside that line, they are doing Seattle-Miami now I think.

They interviewed the producer, he said the American people are the most friendly he has encountered so far, he had nothing but good words for them. He said that when the topic changed to "war", or "Bush", the people became very serious, and he discovered most of them don't like the president but they do respect the presidency, almost everybody had a relative in the army.

Also quite noticable where the flags and portraits of relatives in service; I think Europe could do with some of the pride the US have for their country.


PS....... I still love Belgian Frites!!!!

Yeah I know, THAT I am proud of ;)

http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/5898/Fries.JPG

[Romulus]

rofl

I hope thats Mayo on those Frites! ;) :lol:

[1Cie GevGn]

LOL ofcourse, you know us Belgians (and Dutch)

I'd tell ya, we know some good ol' friteries in the neigbourhood, they make awesome fries, and it's just not complete without some mayo woot

[-Max2-]

This fu%^ing Flahaut again... :roll:

I just hope that he will be replaced by a new Defence minister in a few weeks. We have elections here next month...

[Fioraon]

They interviewed the producer, he said the American people are the most friendly he has encountered so far, he had nothing but good words for them. He said that when the topic changed to "war", or "Bush", the people became very serious, and he discovered most of them don't like the president but they do respect the presidency, almost everybody had a relative in the army.

Bit of a shock for some Europeans I bet. Starting in Seattle is a good thing, but we really aren't nice up here. Its all just an act we put on when Europeans come here. We are monsters at heart.

[citizen-k]

rofl

The bodies in Congo are still warm and he dares to talk about genocides? :roll:

Diamonds are much more expansive the oil, which probably makes him think it was justified.

[1Cie GevGn]

This fu%^ing Flahaut again... :roll:

I just hope that he will be replaced by a new Defence minister in a few weeks. We have elections here next month...

Yeah well don't count on it, I do look forward to it, first time voter here, next time it'll prolly be "oh **** a whole day wasted" ;)

Man, I do hope the VLD and Groen!!!!!! get their asses kicked, as well as the SPA. Too bad the VB is going to gain much ground. But I don't expect to see much changes, pity though.


Bit of a shock for some Europeans I bet. Starting in Seattle is a good thing, but we really aren't nice up here. Its all just an act we put on when Europeans come here. We are monsters at heart.

LMAO yeah really, he said the worst thing about doing the show in the States was it was such a pain getting away, people were willing to give up their entire day for the show, I bet it opened some eyes here woot

[Kitsune]

Budanskis anger seems a bit artificial to me.

There is quite some truth to what is said about the mass murder. The Americas, including North America had thriving Indian nations and cultures everywhere. They were ruthlessly conquered by "the white man" that is also true. But much of this happened before the USA were even founded. Another point is that the number one killer were the diseases the Europeans brought with them from the Euro-Asian continent (Siphilis was a notable exception, that came from America and was propagated by Sailors and certain ladies all over the world). These diseases decimated the population of the Americas severly, a good thing for the Europeans, enabling them to settle much of it without fighting.
Its anyones definition, when to start calling thoses whites "Americans", also the killing of Indians by no means stopped with the founding of the USA. It went on in the 19th centuries (as did European imperialism, the Americans killed reds in America, Europeans killed black or yellow skinned people in Africa and Asia), and even in the 20th century Indians complain about mistreatment now and then. (As do Africans).
But all in all, there is no reason to give anyone the stick because of this. Its the whole, so called, western civilisation that is in this. Should be quite obvious, in fact.

[Haiw]

So the Belgian colonization and exploitation of Rwanda wasn't a factor? France's arming and training of Hutu extremists (http://www.guardian.co.uk/france/story/0,11882,1188188,00.html)played no part? It was all America's fault because we might have been able to do something about it? Its true, us ignorant americans can't quite grasp this one. :roll:
How France got into this really amazes me, but hey, I guess I'm lacking some monkey logic... p-)

Either way, the politician is wrong; even IF you could put 15 million at the US's account then the winner would propably still be Russia (and Chine might 'outdo' the US as well). Also I'm really confused why he's digging up stuff that happened centuries ago...I thought they only did that in the Balkans? ;) :roll:

[Smintjes]

I apologize in the name of all Belgians. Ministre Flahaut's reputation in Belgium isn't very good either. He still replaces senior civil servants with friendly ones (not done in today's Belgium), he throws around chairs during meetings and is considered to be "tilting towards passive corruption".

I'm surprised it has taken until this week for the genocide story to reach the States this week, it was all over the Belgian newspapers three weeks ago.

[Romulus]

I'm surprised it has taken until this week for the genocide story to reach the States this week, it was all over the Belgian newspapers three weeks ago.

I'm not surprised at all this hasn't been on the US networks. Why? Abu Grahb is being shoved up our asses every 20 minutes on ABC,CBS,NBC, and CNN. Hell even Fox news didn't carry this story. Selective broadcasting my friend, thank god for the internet.


PS. I still love Belgian waffles. ;)

[1Cie GevGn]

Ah too bad we're out, I would have posted a pic ;)