Might president Bush's endorsement hurt john mccain?

[People's General]

[http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/world/john-mccain-gets-bush-endorsement/2008/03/06/1204402588568.html (http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/world/john-mccain-gets-bush-endorsement/2008/03/06/1204402588568.html)

WASHINGTON - US President George W Bush endorsed Republican nominee-in-waiting John McCain today, two bitter rivals from the 2000 presidential race joining together now in hopes of preventing Democrats from winning the White House in November.
"John showed incredible courage, strength of character and perseverance in order to get to this moment and that's exactly what we need in a president - somebody who can handle the tough decisions, somebody who won't flinch in the face of danger," Bush said, appearing with McCain in the White House Rose Garden.
Bush's embrace of the Arizona senator as the party's next standard-bearer comes a day after McCain clinched the Republican nomination by getting the requisite 1,191 convention delegates.
Republicans will not officially nominate McCain until early September at the party's national convention.
"A while back I don't think many people would have thought that John McCain would be here as the nominee of the Republican Party," Bush said.
"Except he knew he'd be here and so did his wife, Cindy."
With his low poll ratings and an unpopular war on his shoulders, Bush could hurt McCain with some groups, while helping with others.
"They're not going to be voting for me," Bush said.
"I've had my time in the Oval Office."
"It's not about me," Bush said. "I've done my bit."
McCain said he looked forward to campaigning with Bush at his side and said the president could be helpful in states such as Texas.
Bush pledged to do whatever he could - even getting out of the way when that would help.
"I got a lot to do, but I'm going to find ample time to help," Bush said.
"I can help raise him money, and if he wants my pretty face standing by his side at one of these rallies, I'd be glad to show up."
"But they're going to be looking at him. I'm going to be in Crawford (the location of Bush's Texas ranch) with my feet up," Bush said.
"He's going to be sitting in behind that desk making decisions on war and peace."
McCain's Washington visit amounted to a victory lap of sorts after a bruising 16-month Republican presidential primary.
He was visiting not only the White House he hopes to occupy but also the Republican National Committee headquarters that he essentially assumes control of now that he is the expected Republican nominee.
He was essentially laying claim to the entire force of the Republican Party apparatus as he plots his general election strategy and sets in motion his campaign - and that of the party - to keep a Republican at the White House helm.
For McCain, the general election campaign starts now even though Democrats still have not chosen a candidate.
Senators Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton continue a protracted battle for their party's nod, leaving McCain an opportunity to unify his party.
To that end, Bush's support sends a strong signal to Republican critics of McCain to fall in line.
The party's conservative base has resisted rallying around McCain, long viewing him sceptically for working across the aisle with Democrats on issues that the right flank detest.
Bush is the head of the Republican Party and he remains a well-liked figure with Republican rank-and-file.
Thus, he could be an asset in raising money and rallying the party base for McCain.
However, his job performance rating is at a low point and he is unpopular with the general public.
AP


well, my question is , might this endorsement backlash John Maccain in General Election, especially damage his influence among independence?:|

[Firetxmi]

One day its an illegitimate black child, the next its an endorsement for president. My how things change.

As far as hurting his credibility.... If it comes down to McCain v. Hillary then I don't think Bush's endorsement will matter to many. I will vote for McCain before I ever vote for Hillary.

Bush has lost all credibility in my eyes, but as far as him giving McCain an endorsement, it really doesn't matter to me. Of course he is going to give his parties candidate the endorsement. I would be a bit shocked if he didn't.

[hank]

The problem for McCain is that he doesn't energize the evangelical extreme right. Bush doesn't either right now. For that reason, I think this is a non-starter of an issue. I think the key for McCain is getting a running mate that will energize evangelicals like Huckabee did. May not be possible. If he doesn't, McCain will lose. If he can then he's at least got a chance.

hank

[Solomin]

The only voters it would matter to are the ones who won't vote for McCain in the first place. This is bs journalism trying to create a story.

[Firetxmi]

The problem for McCain is that he doesn't energize the evangelical extreme right. Bush doesn't either right now. For that reason, I think this is a non-starter of an issue. I think the key for McCain is getting a running mate that will energize evangelicals like Huckabee did. May not be possible. If he doesn't, McCain will lose. If he can then he's at least got a chance.

hank

Frankly thats why I would vote for McCain. He doesn't pander to the religious right. We don't need any more abstinence education and constitutional amendments.

Hillary is equally as polarizing, just on the opposite end of the spectrum. That, and I don't want the husband/wife team.

[hank]

Frankly thats why I would vote for McCain. He doesn't pander to the religious right. We don't need any more abstinence education and constitutional amendments.

I agree, but McCain's problem will be getting all the Huckabee voters to come out for him. If they are apathetice bc they don't like McCain (and polls show that to be the case) then he will lose. The all must vote for McCain for him to win and the fact is many of them may not vote for him or even vote at all.

Bush showed the way - First, energize the far right with you religious views, then Second, get the moderate vote through your other views. McCain is all backwards compared to that model. He started moderate and not appealing to the religious right. Now he'll really struggle to move to the right, and frankly Huckabee voters may not believe him even if he does. He's too far in the middle to follow Bush's model. It may be his downfall, or I could be full of s**t. Only time will tell.

hank

[Hollis]

My first thought is, it will not matter. Those who hate Bush are not going to vote for McCain regardless.

Interesting replies. I think part of the problem is not political positions of the candidates but personalities. Politically, I don't see a big difference between O, H and M.

Something on the lines of a Liberal Republican, a Moderate Democrat and a Liberal Democrat.

[hank]

Interesting replies. I think part of the problem is not political positions of the candidates but personalities. Politically, I don't see a big difference between O, H and M.

Which is M's biggest problem when it comes to the typical core Republican constituency. Or at least the core constituency in the last 4-5 presidential elections. He just doesn't excite the far right and that is a recipe for disaster when you have very moderate Democratic candidates. As much as we all hate H and O they really are pretty moderate for Democratic presidential candidates. He'll end up fighting with H or O for the middle vote and not get as much turnout from the far right as would a more conservative candidate like Bush (or at least someone with moderate positions on many issues but definite far-right positions on abortion and religion).

hank

[Hollis]

Hank, I agree, this election for the conservative Republicans is terrible. I think even the conservate D's are having problems in selecting a candidate. A lot of the conservative military people are very angry with M over the POW/MIA issue. That may help O, there is no love for H in that camp either.

[shocker1]

I don't care really. They are all the same, my vote will be for Ron Paul even if I have to write him in. This will not hurt or help McCain, I think most people have already made their minds up.

[hank]

I don't care really. They are all the same, my vote will be for Ron Paul even if I have to write him in. This will not hurt or help McCain, I think most people have already made their minds up.

I disagree to the extent that McCain cannot lafford to lose conservative votes. The reason Bush won is he got all the conservative votes and a lot of the moderate votes. He needed them both to beat Gore and Kerry. McCain will get a lot of moderate votes but that alone doesn't equal a presidency. He needs the far-right like you to come out in droves and that won't happen.

Thus, to the extent you are conservative and not voting for McCain it is a problem for McCain. The fact that not even a conservative running mate would sway you makes me think McCain loses to either H or O. That is my fear, anyway.

hank

[shocker1]

I do not see a radical difference between the parties when it comes down to it. They both think big Government is the answer for every problem and both enjoy globalism now so to hell with them all. The economy is a train wreck now some of which is a self fulfilling prophecy. So you are right McCain can't count on my vote even as a hedge against the Dems.

[FelixA9]

I do not see a radical difference between the parties when it comes down to it. They both think big Government is the answer for every problem and both enjoy globalism now so to hell with them all. The economy is a train wreck now some of which is a self fulfilling prophecy. So you are right McCain can't count on my vote even as a hedge against the Dems.


Interesting though. By not voting for McCain you are effectively voting for Hillary or Obama.

[shocker1]

Interesting though. By not voting for McCain you are effectively voting for Hillary or Obama.
Like I said, I don't really care. Same difference to me, this is the problem because I do not like the direction any of the 3 you mention want to take. That is my right and saying my vote is really a vote for the other people I do not like is ridiculous and undemocratic. My vote should be for what I want and I will make it as such. If the country wants the other folks then we shall lay in the **** together. If they want McCain I will be just as disappointed.

[Power_serj]

Bush's endorsement is does not hurt McCain, although it probably doesn't help either. McCain would be a great president, maybe even the next Reagan. Also, Bush isn't even a bad president like many people think. He's just a bad speaker which makes him an easy target for liberals, so everyone thinks he's such a bad president. Any other president would have been in Iraq also, and he's staying in there, and now we're winning against Al Qaeda. He's the best we could have had out of the elections against Bush. McCain is a good speaker, and he's got the smarts and experience to make this country great.

PS: This is a Capitalist country last time I checked, so no it's not President Bush's fault or even the governments fault of these bad times in the economy. A President can only make the economy worse by redistributing wealth. The only way to help the economy, is tax cuts and subsidizes to those who help our economy altogether.

[dangerclose]

3 words: Ruth Bader Ginsburg.


I'm voting McCain.

[dangerclose]

A President can only make the economy worse by redistributing wealth.


Amen. FDR's Raw Deal only exacerbated the Great Depression.

[Invisigoth]

Bush can still raise a ton of money for McCain so he's not gonna push him away, but I'd bet on the fact that we won't see any pictures of McCain and Bush together as the election approaches. :)

[California Joe]

As long as McCain doesn't start saying "New q ler" I'm cool with it.

[shocker1]

Amen. FDR's Raw Deal only exacerbated the Great Depression.
Not true, many parts of the New Deal shortened the depression and brought electricity to many places. This opened up industry and private sector jobs. Right plan at the right time IMO. I have some issues with it but over all very effective.

Take the TVA for example, the building of dams on the Tennessee river stopped flooding, created thousands of jobs, increased water resources, brought power to vast areas and improvements in roads. All of which did much good. Without the TVA the Southeast would be far behind where it is today. You would be hard pressed to find an old timer who has a sour opinion of the New Deal.

However there are problems like contracting practices, fleecing and dependence on big government that has been handed down.

The TVA still exists and my power bill is between $100 and $125. Sometimes Government does work. The TVA is an example of this. The reason it survives is because the voters here would riot at the prospect of privatization of the TVA.

[FelixA9]

That is my right and saying my vote is really a vote for the other people I do not like is ridiculous and undemocratic. My vote should be for what I want and I will make it as such.


Of course it is but not voting for McCain is in effect a vote for Hillary or Obama as it means it's one less vote they have to get to win. McCain, Mr "uh, I don't know $hit about business I just do what they tells me ta do" wasn't my first choice either but he's a damn sight better than Hillary or Obama. Ye, GODS how could fate inflict THAT on us? :cantbeli::cantbeli:

[shocker1]

No my vote is in effect a vote for Ron Paul. You want my vote then change your stand on the issues. Simple as that, I will not bend on this principle. Voting with the cleaner herd is not for me, voting my politics is. That is how we are supposed to do it. So get it through your head, I do not give a damn as all the "BIG NAMES" are gonna equally leave a bad mark.

[FelixA9]

No my vote is in effect a vote for Ron Paul. You want my vote then change your stand on the issues. Simple as that, I will not bend on this principle. Voting with the cleaner herd is not for me, voting my politics is. That is how we are supposed to do it. So get it through your head, I do not give a damn as all the "BIG NAMES" are gonna equally leave a bad mark.

So in essense "Hillary bad", "Obama bad", or McCain bad" are all equally palatable in your eyes?

[hank]

Dangerclose,

If I thought you really had any idea about any fact that related to ginsberg I might actually listen to you. But you don't. That is obvious from you posts.

Now, here is you assignment. Go read an opinion by Ginsberg. Then report back on the reasons you disagree. I disagree with her on most issues but recognize that she has a good reason to believe what she does.

Might do you some good to read something objective about her. Her story is amazing no matter your political beliefs.

But your uninformed opinions about her mean nothing cuz they are, well, uninformed.

And what the hell does any of that have to do with McCain and the Court members he would appoint? John Paul Stevens (the most liberal member of the Court ever in the opinions of a lot of constitutional scholars) was appointed by Gerald Ford. GWHB appointed Souter and he is liberal although not like Stevens. Conservative presidents don't necessarily equate to conservative judges.

hank

[dangerclose]

You're right, I just pulled Ginsburg's name out of my @ss with no regard to her judicial philosophy.

Fact: She's rejected a "stict constructionist reading" of the constitution because it is based on the authors' gender and class bias. Basically, disregard the intent of the framers of the constitution and those who ratified it and instead invoke foreign law i.e. the social concerns of western europe when making rulings. Germany's views on social issues in 2008 take precedence over what the original intent of the framers were. The 'living, breathing document' she wants the constitution to be is rendered meaningless.


Then there's the other left wing lunatic stuff like integrated prisons and abolition of the boys and girl scouts and mothers day because they foster gender stereotypes and discrimination. Oh and the age of ****** consent lowered to 12.


Yeah she came up from humble beginnings and survived cancer and that's wonderful but how is that relevant? Her jurisprudence is still far left lunatic fringe regardless of the reasons and good intentions she may have. And ok, she's the second most liberal justice behind Stevens. My point was for those who say there is no difference between a McCain and Clinton presidency there will be a marked difference in the type of supreme court justice appointed. At least in McCain's case there's a decent chance he'll appoint a constructionist compared to NIL if Hillary or Obama are elected.

Republican presidents have appointed justices who have turned into flaming libs on the bench but the converse isn't true. A president Clinton or Obama just about assures another Ginsburg.

[People's General]

PS: This is a Capitalist country last time I checked, so no it's not President Bush's fault or even the governments fault of these bad times in the economy. A President can only make the economy worse by redistributing wealth. The only way to help the economy, is tax cuts and subsidizes to those who help our economy altogether.
Oh, come one, Don't be too doctrinairism. Soviets collapsed as they strongly believe free market economic is heterodoxy, they failed in adaptive evolution.
and, when small population owning majority wealth,the society could hardly expand domestic demands, that make the whole country vulnerable in any economic recession.


Not true, many parts of the New Deal shortened the depression and brought electricity to many places. This opened up industry and private sector jobs. Right plan at the right time IMO. I have some issues with it but over all very effective.

Take the TVA for example, the building of dams on the Tennessee river stopped flooding, created thousands of jobs, increased water resources, brought power to vast areas and improvements in roads. All of which did much good. Without the TVA the Southeast would be far behind where it is today. You would be hard pressed to find an old timer who has a sour opinion of the New Deal.

However there are problems like contracting practices, fleecing and dependence on big government that has been handed down.

The TVA still exists and my power bill is between $100 and $125. Sometimes Government does work. The TVA is an example of this. The reason it survives is because the voters here would riot at the prospect of privatization of the TVA.
waaagh, I think I learn alot from Ur post, in my country's education system, scholars give high praise on New Deal, cause it increase demands, consumption, provide job to folks.
but they have never mentioned the disadvantage of new deal.
anyway, nothing is perfect.

[ren0312]

Dangerclose,

If I thought you really had any idea about any fact that related to ginsberg I might actually listen to you. But you don't. That is obvious from you posts.

Now, here is you assignment. Go read an opinion by Ginsberg. Then report back on the reasons you disagree. I disagree with her on most issues but recognize that she has a good reason to believe what she does.

Might do you some good to read something objective about her. Her story is amazing no matter your political beliefs.

But your uninformed opinions about her mean nothing cuz they are, well, uninformed.

And what the hell does any of that have to do with McCain and the Court members he would appoint? John Paul Stevens (the most liberal member of the Court ever in the opinions of a lot of constitutional scholars) was appointed by Gerald Ford. GWHB appointed Souter and he is liberal although not like Stevens. Conservative presidents don't necessarily equate to conservative judges.

hank

One thing I can not understand is why do Supreme Court judges serve for life, what is the philosophy behind that, why can not they have term limits just like other public officials?

[budgie]

My first thought is, it will not matter. Those who hate Bush are not going to vote for McCain regardless.


It won't matter - but for different reasons: Those Republicans who hate Bush would already have chosen McCain or Ron Paul or Huckabee for a host of reasons. They are unlikely change preference now just because the President did the inevitable and endorsed his party's candidate. It may even help McCain's chances as the Bush-lovers who previously didn't like him (such as those who preferred the Bush sequel promised by Thompson) might bother to get up and vote for him now.

All that aside the only person who can save McCain now....is Hillary Clinton.

[hank]

One thing I can not understand is why do Supreme Court judges serve for life, what is the philosophy behind that, why can not they have term limits just like other public officials?

That is what the Constitution says. It would require amendment to change it.

The rationale is that jurists/judges need to be free from fear that an unpopular decision could result in the removal or inability to get reelected or reappointed. A person found innocent of a terrible murder can result in public backlash against the judge. The theory is that if the judge doesn't fear reprisal he will do what they law say even when public opinion disagrees.

There are good arguments for against. If you agree with the judge you like it. If not you don't. The framers were rebelling against judges who followed public opinion and so they put this rule in place.

hank

[hank]

Then there's the other left wing lunatic stuff like integrated prisons and abolition of the boys and girl scouts and mothers day because they foster gender stereotypes and discrimination. Oh and the age of ****** consent lowered to 12.

Tie any of this to Ginsburg and you win the prize. I'll tell you what you win when you provide the information. Nice work not responding to my pm. I knew you wouldn't.

hank

[dangerclose]

Tie any of this to Ginsburg and you win the prize. I'll tell you what you win when you provide the information. Nice work not responding to my pm. I knew you wouldn't.

hank

Excerpts from "The Legal Status of Women Under Federal Law" co-written by Ruth Bader Ginsburg as part of the Columbia Law School Equal Rights Advocacy Project:

Integrated prisons

http://i31.tinypic.com/iekzo7.jpg


Boys and Girl Scouts

http://i28.tinypic.com/ayobc6.jpg
http://i25.tinypic.com/20j4qp1.jpg



****** consent lowered to age 12

http://i32.tinypic.com/11jxes2.jpg


http://www.eppc.org/docLib/20050608_Ginsburg2.pdf

[hank]

Well done, DC. Your prize is one free ticket to the first game Colt Brennan starts in the NFL. I really would debate this with you but so many of the big words obviously confuse you.

Fess up. Did you highlight that or did you get that online? And don't lie cuz I'll know. How much of this did you really think out for yourself and how much did you borrow from someone? Be honest.

And with all that you have posted, what justifies you denigrating her like you have? Don't you think she has thought her position out for herself? Have you? If she honestly believes what she wrote and thought about it before writing it is she justified in posting crap about your intentions in disagreeing with her and calling you names?

hank

[dangerclose]

lol this is pathetic and past boring. No, I obviously did not dig into my Ginsburg archives and highlight that myself. Let me condense this to the bare essential point I was making with my original post. I don't agree with Ginsburg's judicial philosphy. McCain is more likely to appoint another Roberts or Alito as Clinton or Obama are more likely to appoint another Ginsburg. That's it. I have nothing personal against her and wish her a happy and long retirement .. hopefully sooner than later.

And thanks for the CB ticket. I'll be looking forward to it by say .. week 5.

[Freedom-Fries]

Amen. FDR's Raw Deal only exacerbated the Great Depression.


McCain is looking very Presidential

[Bia]

[http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/world/john-mccain-gets-bush-endorsement/2008/03/06/1204402588568.html (http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/world/john-mccain-gets-bush-endorsement/2008/03/06/1204402588568.html)


well, my question is , might this endorsement backlash John Maccain in General Election, especially damage his influence among independence?:|
King George has zero credibility.

He lost the last scrap of it 4 years ago when he was insulting McCain.


I pray McCain wins....will be the first time I can have some pride in a president in MANY MANY years.