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Lancero
04-01-2008, 12:16 PM
April 2, 2008

Negotiations May Lead to Mugabe’s Exit in Zimbabwe

By THE NEW YORK TIMES
HARARE, Zimbabwe (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/international/countriesandterritories/zimbabwe/index.html?inline=nyt-geo) — The opposition leader Morgan Tsvangirai (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/t/morgan_tsvangirai/index.html?inline=nyt-per) is in talks with advisers to President Robert G. Mugabe (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/reference/timestopics/people/m/robert_mugabe/index.html?inline=nyt-per) of Zimbabwe, amid signs that some of those close to Mr. Mugabe may encourage him to resign, a Western diplomatic source and a prominent Zimbabwe political analyst said Tuesday. The negotiations about a possible transfer of power away from Mr. Mugabe began after he apparently concluded that a runoff election would be demeaning, a diplomat said.
A resignation by Mr. Mugabe, one of Africa’s longest-serving leaders, would be a stunning turnabout in a country where he has been accused of consistently manipulating election results to maintain his lock on power.
There is no guarantee the negotiations will succeed, and the situation could still deteriorate. But a Western diplomat and a political analyst said the opposition was negotiating with Zimbabwe’s military, central intelligence organization and prisons chief.
“The chiefs of staff are talking to Morgan and are trying to put into place transitional structures,” said John Makumbe, a political analyst and insider in local politics who has spoken in the past in favor of the opposition.
“The chiefs of staff are not split; they are loyally at Mugabe’s side,” Mr. Makumbe said. “But they are not negotiating for Mr. Mugabe. They are negotiating for themselves. They are negotiating about reprisals and recriminations and blah blah blah. They are doing it for their own security.”
A spokesman for Mr. Tsvangirai, George Sibotshiwe, said, “I don’t know anything about such meetings.”
The diplomat said the joint chiefs had entered the negotiations after receiving feelers from Mr. Tsvangirai. The Western diplomat then said the leaders of the armed forces advised Mr. Mugabe on Monday to engineer a second-round runoff in the presidential race, but Mr. Mugabe responded that a runoff would be a humiliation to him.



source (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/02/world/africa/02zimbabwe.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin)




AP: Mugabe's aides discuss ceding power
HARARE, Zimbabwe (AP) — Advisers of Zimbabwe's president and main opposition leader are discussing Robert Mugabe relinquishing power, the Associated Press learned Tuesday from a businessman close to the state electoral commission and a lawyer close to the opposition.
The businessman said Mugabe has been told he is far behind Tsvangirai in preliminary results from Saturday's presidential elections and that there could be an uprising if Mugabe were declared the winner. Both sources spoke on condition they were not identified because of the sensitivity of the issue.
Several diplomats said they had heard similar reports but could not corroborate the information. Asked about the report in a telephone call, Tendai Biti, secretary-general of Tsvangirai's party, said, "It's rubbish," and hung up.
Zimbabwe's security chiefs have told the Electoral Commission to issue results portraying a close race, to prevent celebrations that could ignite violence with rival party militants, the businessman said.
Political analyst John Makumbe said he had learned from military sources that they would honor the results of the elections. That would indicate a change of heart since the security chiefs the day before the elections warned they would not serve anybody but Mugabe and would not tolerate an opposition victory.

Tsvangirai on Tuesday postponed his first public statement since the elections until later in the day. His spokesman George Shibotshiwe said that was because the opposition party had received "a tremendous breakthrough in the numbers coming in" from Saturday's voting.
The opposition already has claimed victory in the elections that hinged on the destruction of the economy with people suffering to survive inflation soaring beyond 100,000%.
Tsvangirai has vowed not to entertain an alliance with Mugabe but has said previously that he is ready to negotiate an exit package for Zimbabwe's ruler for 28 years. He also has said that Mugabe should be tried for human rights abuses, possibly in an international court.
It appeared Mugabe was persuaded into talks by the possibility of a runoff presidential race, which the businessman said he would find too demeaning.
In a statement late Monday, the independent Zimbabwe Election Support Network said that according to its random representative sample of polling stations across the country, Tsvangirai won just over 49% of the vote. A presidential candidate needs at least 50% plus one vote to avoid a runoff.
A runoff would have to be held within 21 days, leaving it close to the 28th anniversary of independence on April 18, 1980. Mugabe, who led a guerrilla movement that fought a seven-year war to end white minority rule, regards the anniversary as a potent symbol of his rule.


source (http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2008-04-01-zimbabwe-election_N.htm)

jokuvaan
04-01-2008, 12:21 PM
Run or die.

Bushranger
04-02-2008, 02:05 AM
lets hope he leaves & they get the country back on its feet. hopefully they realise they need the white farmers to give them an economy.

T3ngu
04-02-2008, 02:08 AM
Possibly stupid question, where can he run to?

retrobob
04-02-2008, 02:53 AM
Possibly stupid question, where can he run to? Tanzania and Libya possibly and maybe DPRK or PRC, and he can take that other monster Mengistu with him(comrade Bob kindly gave him asylum after he fled Ethiopia where he has been sentenced to death)Would be interesting to see if S. Africa would allow him to stay.

Billy No Mates
04-02-2008, 03:19 AM
Possibly stupid question, where can he run to?

He is still a bit of a hero in countrys he hasnt actually run for his participation in 'the struggle' i would think its a fair bet that he has stolen shed loads of cash and can pay handsomely for his place in the sun .

Slaaibak
04-02-2008, 03:50 AM
Possibly stupid question, where can he run to?

Sure Mbeki won't mind giving him shelter... they are old friends from the struggle days....

the_hog
04-02-2008, 04:05 AM
Sure Mbeki won't mind giving him shelter... they are old friends from the struggle days....
For Fok sake lets hope not, I hope the MDC take him to the town square and let him loose into the baying hoards.

Alpheus
04-02-2008, 04:08 AM
Damn. And there I was, hoping he would be leaving feet first. Oh well.
Seriously though, I do hope they get rid of the ****er, he really has ruined Zimbabwe.

gaijinsamurai
04-02-2008, 05:18 AM
Good riddance.

maybe Kim Jong Il can offer him asylum in North Korea!

the_hog
04-02-2008, 05:33 AM
Power crazy a$$hole will try depose Kim Jong and rule Korea as well.

marius72za
04-02-2008, 05:37 AM
Mugabe was a struggle hero, we must remember what he did for the peoples of Africa Zimbabwe and South Africa, he also provided Sweden and Norway and Holland the opportunity to donate food and medicine to a Liberation movement.

Afro-European
04-02-2008, 06:27 AM
Mugabe was a struggle hero, we must remember what he did for the peoples of Africa Zimbabwe and South Africa

Well,you said it he WAS.If you see now what he done to his beloved country after 28 years of a brutal dictatorship,he really deserve...(i leave it to your imagination).

Violet Fashion by Mindy
04-02-2008, 07:47 AM
People need to learn some history. Mugabe like Mandela were leaders of what we would now call terrorists organisations.

Rhodesia was a unique case. There was nothing inherently bad about it's system of government nor was it inherently racist.

To be eligible to vote one simply had to meet certain educational and financial criteria. Even white Rhodesians were ineligible to vote.

Rudolph
04-02-2008, 08:16 AM
South Africa would give Mugabe shelter any day... just like they are doing with Aristede. Our government also said things like "why would there be any problems with an election in Zimbabwe?".

"People need to learn some history. Mugabe like Mandela were leaders of what we would now call terrorists organisations."

Ja, I always wonder what the Cuban victims think of Mandela, praising Castro after the end of apartheid, while thousands of political prisoners were held, tortured, murdered, at the same time.... true heroes, by African standards.

Rudolph
04-02-2008, 08:37 AM
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080402/ap_on_re_af/zimbabwe_elections;_ylt=AnHPiR2.NW9bPUKTacwAB11vaA8F

Opposition claims victory.

Rudolph
04-02-2008, 08:45 AM
Well,you said it he WAS.If you see now what he done to his beloved country after 28 years of a brutal dictatorship,he really deserve...(i leave it to your imagination).

Seriously, though, they should simply let him stay in the country as Ian Smith and PW Botha were allowed to, respectively. Many African countries violently depose their dictators and then hold a public execution, but that hateful revenge does more psychological damage than good, I believe.

I am worried about Morgan S., though. He is only the lesser of two evils, not a good man by any standard - except compared to Mugabe's. Never forget that he was a big fellow in Mugabe's party until they had differences... he must be watched closely. The Western media must be careful not to make him untouchable as they always do in such cases.

the_hog
04-02-2008, 08:55 AM
Ja Morgan is not squeeky clean but I dont think he is as radical as mugabe. I do think that Morgan will allow the farmers to continue un mollested perhaps even invite farmers to return to Zim to try and help re build the economy instead of them all going to Moz.
I dont know about allowing mugabe to stay though, he still has a lot of influence and maybe a trial by the Zimbabwean people and a long stay in Chikurubi prison will let him have the time to reflect on how he ruined on of the most beautiful countries in Africa.Hy moet in die tronk sit en vrot.

BugHunt
04-02-2008, 09:45 AM
Id love to see that repressive bastrd negotiated out of there on a slab....


Lets hope he finally thinks of his country again and steps down peacefully.

baboon6
04-02-2008, 09:49 AM
Id love to see that repressive bastrd negotiated out of there on a slab....


Lets hope he finally thinks of his country again and steps down peacefully.

I hope I'm wrong but I don't see it happening

baboon6
04-02-2008, 09:59 AM
Seriously, though, they should simply let him stay in the country as Ian Smith and PW Botha were allowed to, respectively. Many African countries violently depose their dictators and then hold a public execution, but that hateful revenge does more psychological damage than good, I believe.

I am worried about Morgan S., though. He is only the lesser of two evils, not a good man by any standard - except compared to Mugabe's. Never forget that he was a big fellow in Mugabe's party until they had differences... he must be watched closely. The Western media must be careful not to make him untouchable as they always do in such cases.

Tsvangarai was never a big guy in ZANU-PF, although he was Secretary-General of the ZCTU, the trade unions which were allied to ZANU-PF until the 1990s. He has been a mineworker and then trade union official his whole life. I agree he may not be squeaky-clean either.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgan_Tsvangirai

Violet Fashion by Mindy
04-02-2008, 10:51 AM
Being a unionist he has my vote

Fade
04-02-2008, 11:03 AM
The people of Zimbabwe need a change for the better, I hope this is it...

the_hog
04-02-2008, 12:39 PM
The economy of the country is in tatters and will take years to rebuild after 28 years of ruin and bankrupcy. The infra structure will need to be started again, remember when Rhodesia had rich tin, nickle ,coal etc mines,well I dont think they have run at propper production level since the mid 80's so all of that is going to have to be done but how to pay the costs, this is where the problem lies, the country's coffers are so empty they echo, mugabes bitch used the cash to jet set all over the world shopping.
At least if they get him out that is step one of many steps to the rebuilding of what was a prosperous nation.

duhblow7
04-02-2008, 03:28 PM
The fate of Mugabe? One doesn't have to look far.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Taylor_%28Liberia%29

duhblow7
04-02-2008, 03:34 PM
http://www.time.com/time/photogallery/0,29307,1726919,00.html

http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_01.jpg

Iron-Fisted Ruler
Mugabe first rose to power as the leader of the Zimbabwe African National Union (ZANU) a guerrilla movement against white-minority rule in Rhodesia, the former British colony now known as Zimbabwe.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_02.jpg

Nationalist Leader
In 1975, Mugabe was freed from prison, having served ten years for "subversive speech," and outmaneuvering a rival for control of ZANU. The movement waged a guerrilla insurgency against the white regime of Rhodesia from bases in neighboring Zambia and Mozambique. In this 1977 photo, Mugabe attends a summit of the "Front Line" African states, a regional grouping dedicated to achieving black majority rule throughout Southern Africa.



http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_03.jpg

Uneasy Ally
During the liberation struggle, Mugabe's ZANU was rivaled by the Zimbabwe African People's Union (ZAPU), led by Joshua Nkomo. When the British brokered an end to the civil war by sponsoring parliamentary elections in 1980, the two parties campaigned jointly as the Patriotic Front, although ZANU trounced ZAPU in the vote count, making Mugabe prime minister.



http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_04.jpg

U.S. Support
Mugabe's democratic triumph in Zimbabwe was welcomed by the U.S. and Britain. After he became prime minister in 1980, Mugabe visited President Jimmy Carter in the White House.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_05.jpg

The World Stage
By the mid-1980s, Mugabe has become one of Africa's most visible leaders. In this photo, he attends a Commonwealth Heads of Government Meeting in London in 1986.



http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_04.jpg

U.S. Support
Mugabe's democratic triumph in Zimbabwe was welcomed by the U.S. and Britain. After he became prime minister in 1980, Mugabe visited President Jimmy Carter in the White House.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_05.jpg

The World Stage
By the mid-1980s, Mugabe has become one of Africa's most visible leaders. In this photo, he attends a Commonwealth Heads of Government Meeting in London in 1986.



http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_06.jpg

Strong Man
Even as his economy was struggling in the late 1990s, Mugabe sent 12,000 troops to support Congo's president Laurent Kabila in a fight with rebels backed by Uganda and Rwanda.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_07.jpg

Honored
In 1994, Queen Elizabeth II bestowed an honorary Knight Commander of the Order of the Bath on Mugabe, the equivalency of knighthood for foreigners. Although a British parliamentary foreign affairs committee has called for the title to be revoked, no action has been taken.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_08.jpg

Powerful
Mugabe gained additional powers for himself by abolishing the title of Prime Minister and assuming the role of Executive President. He was re-elected in 1990, 1996 and 2002 amid claims of vote-rigging and voter intimidation.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_10.jpg

Land Seizures
Under growing political pressure as a result of economic failures, Mugabe sought to shore up his support by rewriting the constitution to allow his government to confiscate white-owned land for redistribution to black farmers without compensation. In this photo, pro-Mugabe militants sing revolutionary songs outside the electric fence of a white farmer's homestead.



http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_11.jpg

Last Harvest
Brendan Fox, a white landholder, watches as his personal goods are loaded onto a truck and removed from his farm.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_12.jpg

Empty Shelves
During the last ten years, Zimbabwe's agricultural production has plummeted. Once the "bread basket" of Africa, it now depends on food programs and support from outside to feed itself.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_09.jpg

Forced Relocation
In 2005, Mugabe's government launched a campaign to systematically destroy shanty towns that had grown up around major cities. Because the urban poor who inhabited these settlements were overwhelmingly pro-opposition, Mugabe's campaign of forced removals, that displaced more than 2 million people, was widely viewed as politically motivated.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_13.jpg

Ace of Diamonds
A photograph taken in South Africa in 2007 shows a set of playing cards that poke fun at the Zimbabwean leader. Despite the world's highest inflation rate, Mugabe himself continues to live in extraordinary wealth.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_14.jpg

Crackdown
Mugabe has proved himself intolerant of political opposition. In this photo, riot police clear the streets of Harare during a strike led to protest his government's policies in 2003.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_15.jpg

Offices of the Opposition
The chief challenger to Mugabe's hold on power is Morgan Tsvangirai, the leader of the Movement for Democratic Change. In March 2007 Tsvangirai was arrested and his offices ransacked shortly before a party press conference.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_16.jpg

Torn Legacy
An election poster hangs from a wall in Bulawayo in late March. Mugabe has retained his hold on power by consistently manipulating election results.




http://img.timeinc.net/time/photoessays/2008/robert_mugabe/robert_mugabe_17.jpg

Under Threat
Though he is clearly isolated and unpopular, it is far from certain that Mugabe will relinquish power should his rival Tsvangirai prevail in the 2008 election.

the_hog
04-03-2008, 04:05 AM
mugabe reminds me of an animal I saw in the bush once, it was picking fleas off another similar animal.