Tank Paintball + APCs with Turrets

[Britboy]

Evening all,

I found a video on tank paintball, thinking it sounded a laugh:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5z8Q5Zg3qM

2 points came out of this:

1) Considering how awesome the idea of 'tank paintball' sounds, that didnt look too cool. I mean how can anything called 'tank paintball' be that tame?

2) They're using old FV432s which had turrets with 30mm RARDEN cannons.

So this made me think of the old APCs with turrets, believe there was an M113 version with a similar turret fitted too.

What was the purpose of these?

Was it a separate vehicle to provide fire support to dismounted mech infantry? Or would it still carry the section/squad in the back?

When the BMP rocked up and we all scrambled to build Warriors and Bradleys, was this the cheaper version proposed? Easier to upgrade APCs than build new IFVs?

Or were they our own experiments/trials in IFVs, before the Sovs made the BMP and we decided to go for new vehicles like Warrior/Brad too?

Its geeky I know, but I'm kinda interested. Its like an APC, before IFVs, but plus a turret, which pretty much makes it into an IFV...

Cheers
BB

[Straker]

IIRC the FV432 conversions were the turrets off Fox hulls which were decommissioned. Only a few prototypes made before the concept was abandoned (my hazy memory says they were a intended as a stopgap as the MICV-80 project, which became Warrior, was delayed).

They were sent to the Berlin Brigade, a few pictures off them there do exist but I can't discover any on google at the moment. The remaining Fox turrets were modernised a little and fitted to surplus Scorpion hulls to make Sabre CVRT. Which then equipped armoured infantry reconnaissance platoons.

I'm sure someone a little more knowledgeable will chime in, 1980's armour is not my area of expertise at all.

[Britboy]

Okay, so IFV stopgap, goodo.

Wasnt Sabre the one that was like Scimitar but had a 76mm? Was it in service with the RAF Regiment?

I saw a piccy of a Chieftain (I think) with the Berlin Brigade once, it had a great urban camo painted all over, in a kind've old digital layout. Looked good.

[Straker]

No the 76mm version was Scorpion, withdrawn due to the Conventional Forces in Europe treaty. Apparently anything over 75mm was treated in the same category as tanks.

The RAF had some in service along with some Spartan for the airfield defence role. Rumour has it that they discovered a very high level of Carcinogens from the 76mm being fired and the fume extraction being insufficient.

[Britboy]

Hmmm guess you could always do gunnery serials with your 'face-hugger' on tho...

http://www.probertencyclopaedia.com/cgi-bin/res.pl?keyword=Sabre+AFV&offset=0

Interesting, this says Sabre is almost identical to Scimitar, entered service in 1995.

http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.accurate-armour.com/images/Bfs2a.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.accurate-armour.com/articles1.cfm%3Fid%3D13%26navlevel%3D2&h=121&w=300&sz=14&hl=en&start=8&um=1&tbnid=QlIz7TSradMtxM:&tbnh=47&tbnw=116&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dchieftain%2Bberlin%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DX

Check the Pimp My MBT Berlin urban digital cammy Chieftain thing...

[Cdt.Hawkins]

My facts are probably a little sketchy here but the Australian army,during the late 60's early 70's,modified a standard m113 by putting a ferret armoured car turret on the top.Some were deployed to Vietnam I believe.
Anyway I'm fairly certain that they could no longer carry troops and they were mainly used for fire support.
Like I said I've probably got at least 1 thing wrong.

[Bushranger]

The Australian army used to have fire support vehicles M113 with turrets mounted first being saladin then the scorpion turret in the 80s this is what wikipedia had to say.

M113 Fire Support Vehicle (FSV) - The M113 FSV was a variant fitted with the turret from the Alvis Saladin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alvis_Saladin) armoured car. The FSV was introduced into Australian Army (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_Army) units in the mid-1960s following the withdrawal of the Saladins and was armed with a 76mm gun, a .30 calibre coaxial machine gun and a .30 calibre machine gun mounted on the roof of the vehicle's turret. The M113 was an interim vehicle and was replaced by the M113 Medium Reconnaissance Vehicle in the late 1970s. It was commonly referred to by Royal Australian Armoured Corps (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Australian_Armoured_Corps) crews as the "Beast".

http://svsm.org/gallery/M113A1FSV

http://www.armytankmuseum.com.au/i-vd.htm check this out it has some pics

[baboon6]

My facts are probably a little sketchy here but the Australian army,during the late 60's early 70's,modified a standard m113 by putting a ferret armoured car turret on the top.Some were deployed to Vietnam I believe.
Anyway I'm fairly certain that they could no longer carry troops and they were mainly used for fire support.
Like I said I've probably got at least 1 thing wrong.

If you're thinking of the M113 with the .50/.30 Brownings co-axial in a turret, then it is the Cadillac-Gage T50 turret. These vehicles were capable of carrying troops and did so in Vietnam.

[velvet-cream]

Here's some info on m113 from DMO.

http://www.defence.gov.au/dmo/news/ontarget/Oct05/rw.cfm

There's plenty of room in LRVs (fancy name for Australia's m113 APC with T50 turrets) to carry a section of soldiers + a couple of swags for the crew.