Israeli soldier shoots arrested Palestinian on FILM

[eurekaa]

Israeli soldier shoots arrested Palestinian on film
Rights group released video of tied up man getting shot

http://www.onlines.ws/wp-content/uploads/soldiershootpalestinian-180x120.jpg


See the related Video (http://www.onlines.ws/?p=829)

An Israeli soldier is seen shooting an arrested and bound Palestinian in the leg with a plastic bullet, in a video released by an Israeli human rights group on Sunday.

B’Tselem’s footage shows the Palestinian demonstrator — identified as Ashraf Abu Rahman, 27 — with handcuffs and a blindfold, as a lieutenant colonel holds him by the arm.

Abu Rahman was lightly wounded in the incident which took place on July 7 in Nilin, a West Bank village where regular protests are held against Israel’s separation barrier by stone-throwing demonstrators, the group said.

The army, which says five border guards, three soldiers and two laborers working on the wall were injured during protests in June, announced the launch of an inquiry after the video was shown on Palestinian television.

Israel says the barrier is needed to stop potential attackers from infiltrating Israel and Jewish West Bank settlements, but Palestinians say it is a land grab aimed at undermining the viability of their promised state.

The International Court of Justice in 2004 issued a non-binding resolution calling for parts of the barrier inside the West Bank to be torn down and for a halt to construction there.
Israel has ignored the ruling.

To see the related film - click here (http://www.onlines.ws/?p=829)

[vinny_121_ND]

we just had this discussion. It got locked.
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=138252

[Hollis]

Maybe watch the video, why does it goes weird and then the "next" scene is obviously sometime later?

It really does not show what is reported.

[WarDancer]

Firstly, the title of the article is misleading. One, without reading the article, would assume the Israelies simply captured a Palestinian and just shot him on sight with a real bullet. Secondly, video can be manipulated, cut and edited to show whatever the maker wants the viewer to see, or think he's seeing.

[Holycrusader]

Maybe watch the video, why does it goes weird and then the "next" scene is obviously sometime later?

It really does not show what is reported.

14 yrs old girl film that. Its normal that people panic when they see things like that and hear gunshot...
Why trying to found excuses when even the IDF Spokesperson's Office released a statement calling the incident "grave" and saying that it was in "direct contradiction with IDF values and principles."




http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=850_1216570971



Raw Unedited : Israeli Troops Shoot Palestinian Point Blank Range.
Mature, Featured
The IDF has launched a probe into the conduct of soldiers who were caught on camera two weeks ago shooting a rubber bullet at a blindfolded and handcuffed Palestinian in the West Bank.

The incident took place on July 7 near the village of Nil'in which has been the scene in recent weeks of almost daily violent demonstrations against the construction of the West Bank security fence nearby.

According to the videotape, which the military said was reviewed by Judge Advocate General Brig.-Gen. Avichai Mandelblit, a Palestinian demonstrator - Ashraf Abu Rahma - is seen handcuffed and blindfolded and being led to a jeep by a high-ranking IDF officer

The video clip shows a soldier aim his weapon at the demonstrator's legs from about 1.5 meters away and then fire a rubber bullet at him. Abu-Rahma said the bullet hit his left toe and that he received treatment from an army medic and was then released by the soldiers.

The shooting took place in the presence of a lieutenant colonel, who is seen holding Abu Rahma's arm when the shot is fired.

A fourteen-year-old Palestinian girl from Nil¹in filmed the incident from her house in the village, and B'Tselem received it this morning and immediately forwarded a copy to the Military Police Investigation Unit, with a demand that an immediate investigation be launched into the incident.

In response, the IDF Spokesperson's Office released a statement calling the incident "grave" and saying that it was in "direct contradiction with IDF values and principles."

"Military laws forbid inflicting harm on detainees and obligate soldiers to show them respect and ensure their safety. Incidents when detainees are harmed are, in accordance with IDF policy, forwarded to the Military Police for investigation. As in this case, after reviewing the videotape, the JAG Brig.-Gen. Avichai Mandelblit ordered the opening of a probe into the incident. It should be mentioned that the Palestinian was inspected at the scene by an IDF doctor and was found to have sustained a light injury to his right toe. The Palestinian was released to his home without requiring medical treatment," the statement read.

[Moledet]

Looks more like an accidental discharge than anything else. Soldier is probably going to say he fired blank.
If he indeed tried to fire at the Arab he must be seeing double because he doesn't aim at him.

[Bia]

Looks more like an accidental discharge than anything else. Soldier is probably going to say he fired blank.
If he indeed tried to fire at the Arab he must be seeing double because he doesn't aim at him.

Nope... he pulls gun up and takes careful aim.

Not taking camera perspective into account is your mistake. Very common ;)

[IDF_TANKER]

Soldier who fired in Naalin incident arrested

(VIDEO) Criminal investigation launched against soldier caught on tape firing towards bound Palestinian. Regarding late response to incident, military officials say that despite presence of officer at scene, investigation was launched only after tape was submitted
Ali Waked

VIDEO - The incident in which an IDF soldier fired rubber bullets at a bound Palestinian who had been arrested in Naalin reached the Investigating Military Police (IMP) only after the military advocate general watched the documentation of the incident, despite the fact that it was witnessed by an Armored Corps regiment commander and several other soldiers in the vicinity.

Military officials told Ynet that the firing soldier had been arrested. According to one source, "he was questioned a short while after the incident, but only today, after the military advocate general watched the video tape, a criminal investigation was launched."





Immediately after the incident an inquiry was made by the brigade commander responsible. Commander of the Judea and Samaria division, Brig.-Gen. Noam Tivon, also conducted an investigation into the matter.
IDF sources refused to comment on the words spoken before and after the shooting by the firing soldier and the regiment commander who held the Palestinian man's arm, as the affair is still being investigated.

The regiment commander will undergo questioning in the near future, as well as the other soldiers who were present at the scene.

In the incriminating video, the soldier can be seen aiming his weapon from a distance of about 1.5 meters from the bound demonstrator, and firing rubber bullets towards the ground near his feet. According to the testimony given by the detainee, Ashraf Abu-Rahma, his big toe was injured in the shooting and he received medical treatment from a military medic, after which he was released by the soldiers.
"During the demonstration the soldiers caught me, arrested me – and after a few moments I heard shots and felt a fire in my body. I was afraid and didn't know what it was," Abu-Rahma said. The shots were fired while the officer was holding the Palestinian's arm.
'Not a rare incident'

Left-wing representatives active in the Naalin protests responded to the publication of the tape by saying that this was not a rare incident. "The incident you have witnessed is not at all rare; it appears rare because it was filmed, but during protests we are forced to deal with this kind of behavior on a daily basis," said Aahad Khawaja, chairman of Naalin's anti-fence committee.

"I have been beaten and shot with tear gas in a direct manner while I was holding a 9-year old boy. I have seen them beating and shooting at an Israeli and later attacking him and beating him with clubs after he had fallen," he continued.
Jonathan Polk, who frequents anti-fence rallies, claims that the violent acts committed by IDF soldiers have become methodical. "It's a method of violence that is launched at protestors in a brutal and excessive fashion, and most of the time the violent suppression is led by the officers at the scene," he said.
Polk claims that the story only received coverage by the media because of the tape documenting it. "Usually the behavior is similar. We cry out that the army is using excessive violence and this time it has been proven on tape. I am not claiming that the protestors don't throw stones but I do claim that in 90% of cases the army is the first to open fire at the protestors, even when they do not constitute an impediment to the construction of the fence."




Following the initial investigations no steps were taken against the soldier, but after the tape was made public the IDF acted quickly.

The IDF Spokesperson's Office stated that "this is a very serious and unlawful incident that negates the values of the IDF, in which firing as a means for the scattering of protests (not 'live' fire) was used against a Palestinian detainee, who had been arrested by our forces, after he had taken part in a violent demonstration against the construction of the separation fence in the village of Naalin.

"The army's code strictly prohibits the injuring of detainees and requires the soldiers to maintain respect for them and the wholeness of their bodies. Incidents of injured detainees are transferred, according to IDF policies, to the IMP to be investigated. In this case, following the transfer of the tape, Military Advocate General Brig.-Gen. Avihai Mandelblit has ordered the IMP to launch an investigation into the matter."


http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3570784,00.html

[IDF_TANKER]

The guy who got shot:
http://www.ynetnews.com/PicServer2/02012008/1554768/20-07-08_1525_hh.jpg


His badly hurt toe:
http://www.ynetnews.com/PicServer2/02012008/1554790/20-07-08_1524_hh.jpg


Ugly and stupid incident. With all the frustration and tension for the soldiers this was an idiotic thing to do. Said that, there is way to much "shot at point blank" fuss around it.

[IsraDani]

I think most of you are missing the point.He got arrested and will have a trial.Such a behaviour cant be defended,it goes against our same rules.And I blame more the commander than the soldier because he didnt report it immediatly after.He should know our stupid government allows every kind of stupid activist tape all idf does.We send people in jail for a bad handled hand grenade or idiotic games with discharged m4s.This is way more serious.Nekuda.

[IsraDani]

Soldier who fired in Naalin incident arrested

His badly hurt toe:
http://www.ynetnews.com/PicServer2/02012008/1554790/20-07-08_1524_hh.jpg



I should call b'tselem after my hikes in Arava,maybe ill become a shaheed too.rofl

[Holycrusader]

I think most of you are missing the point.He got arrested and will have a trial.Such a behaviour cant be defended,it goes against our same rules.And I blame more the commander than the soldier because he didnt report it immediatly after.He should know our stupid government allows every kind of stupid activist tape all idf does.We send people in jail for a bad handled hand grenade or idiotic games with discharged m4s.This is way more serious.Nekuda.

Actually it look like this soldier acted in presence of his commander. Thats why commander is the first person to blame. Commander issue that order to do that or he did not stop soldier from doing this. And of course he did not report this...
That kind of bahaviour is barbaric...

[Big Lebowski]

Barbaric is maybe a bit over the top... more like mental retardation :)

[IDF_TANKER]

Actually it look like this soldier acted in presence of his commander. Thats why commander is the first person to blame. Commander issue that order to do that or he did not stop soldier from doing this. And of course he did not report this...

According to the soldier he was ordered by the officer. According to the officer, he takes the whole responsibility, although his intention was that the soldier only frighten the detainee, not shot him.



That kind of bahaviour is barbaric...
These incidents always have a context (not necessarily a justifying one). You should understand that this Pali was not an innocent white dressed ballerina (see picture above), but a violent bad mouthed asshole. And the reason why they shot him in the toe was probably because they got fed with what he said or did. And the reason why Palis allow to themselves behavior like this is because they know that as rule soldiers couldn't and wouldn't do anything to them.[edit] Not to mention that only moments before that he was hurling blocks on these soldiers.

[Nickchios]

I do not agree with such actions......

but

i think the sound of fire is very loud according the distance.... so?????...........

[IDF_TANKER]

I do not agree with such actions......

but

i think the sound of fire is very loud according the distance.... so?????...........

No Pallywood in this case, mate.

[Holycrusader]

I do not agree with such actions......

but

i think the sound of fire is very loud according the distance.... so?????...........

Nothing... Good camera give us quality sound.

[Holycrusader]

According to the soldier he was ordered by the officer. According to the officer, he takes the whole responsibility, although his intention was that the soldier only frighten the detainee, not shot him.


These incidents always have a context (not necessarily a justifying one). You should understand that this Pali was not an innocent white dressed ballerina (see picture above), but a violent bad mouthed asshole. And the reason why they shot him in the toe was probably because they got fed with what he said or did. And the reason why Palis allow to themselves behavior like this is because they know that as rule soldiers couldn't and wouldn't do anything to them.[edit] Not to mention that only moments before that he was hurling blocks on these soldiers.

I expect more profesionalism from soldiers and their officers...

As to the officer - they should arrest him in that case for bad order.

[Nickchios]

Nothing... Good camera give us quality sound.

Ok, but...

there is something strange here. There is a sound from the gun at 0:11 sec, then the video is off, at 0:12 sec another loudly shot and after the video is on again several sec or minutes later.......

[Holycrusader]

Ok, but...

there is something strange here. There is a sound from the gun at 0:11 sec, then the video is off, at 0:12 sec another loudly shot and after the video is on again several sec or minutes later.......


Strange things happen when film is maked by 14yrs old girl...

[kosse]

Are these guys conscripts? That said, conscript armies usually have the best of the best and the worst of the worst in their ranks. Someone might be a nuclear physicist but then some are so dumb you didn't even know could exist. When too many tards wind up in the same unit anything can happen. Good to know anyway that Israelis are investigating the matter.

[Big Lebowski]

They already admited to shooting the F'ing guy so quit the conspiration theories already.

Yes it was wrong, but it was really a minor incident as i see it. They tryed to scare him and the retard with the rifle ****ed up, and hit his foot/toe.

If he had shoot him in the leg intentionally (which i thought was the case to begin with) it would have been a different matter.

[Macs.]

Stupid incident, totally blown out of proportion...

Everything is news these days.

[Snoshi]

Stupid incident, totally blown out of proportion...

Everything is news these days.

X2.. It made it on the first page on BBC... :roll:

[Moledet]

X2.. It made it on the first page on BBC... :roll:
Made it to the cover? Nice.

[Lov3ll]

X2.. It made it on the first page on BBC... :roll:

Where? I've looked on the BBCs site and have only been able to find a video and that was after a bit of searching.

[Big Lebowski]

I cant find it either...

[Snoshi]

I cant find it either...

It was yesterday.

[kamaz]

a guy goes to jail for violating IDF standards and ROE. I'm waiting for the day BBC prints out a front page story of palestinian gunmen being persecuted for violating Geneva Convention every time they fire a rocket at schools and hospitals. Not a chance.

this incident just shows you how this whole 'cycle of violence' bullsht is just that, bullsh1t.

the 2 sides have different values, rules, and judicial systems.

[ozumn]

No suprise here after seeing Aftershock.

[wigon]

Look people. Listen to IDF Tanker. He knows what he's talking about. Case close. It was a stupid incident, done by a stupid soldier. While the video looks dodgy, the discharge from the muzzle is clearly seen and the area the soldier is pointing at corresponds with the wound. It was just plain stupid, and the soldier responsible should be given a light punishment such as docked pay in order to pay for the medical treament of the prisoner. If such action is cool with you guys, then you (who are Americans) should support your local police department in beating the hell out of (and shooting) every gangbanger they catch and just go ahead and trash the constitution and just beat them, torture them, or kill them.

If they were attempting to commit a terrorist act, then they should be treated as criminals. But that does not mean those who capture them should act in the same manner just as Western police departments should not act like the people they arrest. We hold them to a higher standard. Is it easy? No. But that is the hard part about doing such a job.
I should also note, that most IDF soldiers do not act like that. There are many who have a strong sense of honor, morality and discipline. Like American troops in Iraq, its always just a small number who do stupid crap and dishonour their comrads.

Wigon

[JJC]

a guy goes to jail for violating IDF standards and ROE. I'm waiting for the day BBC prints out a front page story of palestinian gunmen being persecuted for violating Geneva Convention every time they fire a rocket at schools and hospitals. Not a chance.

this incident just shows you how this whole 'cycle of violence' bullsht is just that, bullsh1t.

the 2 sides have different values, rules, and judicial systems.

I'm waiting for this week's special report from Honest Reporting.com tearing apart the usual suspects in the media, BBC, *******, Guardian,etc, for creating a drama skit out for this incident that never happened. :)

[wigon]

I'm waiting for this week's special report from Honest Reporting.com tearing apart the usual suspects in the media, BBC, *******, Guardian,etc, for creating a drama skit out for this incident that never happened. :)



That never happened? So are you saying the muzzle smoke from the barrel of the soldier's M4A1 was fake? It looked pretty damn real to me having fired such weapons. Again, read IDF-Tanker's post. Stupid incident by a stupid soldier. Nobody killed, only a light injury. Nothing more, nothing less. It should be dropped. Everyone's trying to make it into a big deal when in reality it is not. There are far worse things that have been done on both sides of that conflict that deserve international attention.

Quite frankly I am PIIIIIISSSSED at both sides of the conflict. I know EXTREMELY amazing people on both sides both Israeli and Palestinian and its always the assholes on both sides that make everyone's life miserable. It's time we put aside our biases and identify the specific assholes regardless of what side they are on and go after them.


Wigon

[Fliptape]

You should understand that this Pali was not an innocent white dressed ballerina (see picture above), but a violent bad mouthed asshole. And the reason why they shot him in the toe was probably because they got fed with what he said or did.


So you say in clear text that if a person is guilty or not and the following punishment should be decided by the soldier that detains him/her....?!?



And jezes, people should stop calling these bullets "rubber bullets", they are rubber coated STEEL bullets with a weeker than normal powderload and they have killed lots of people before

[wigon]

We should issue rubber 9mm bullets to all our police in the United States so that if you mouth off to the cops...BAM! They shoot ya! That'll teach you to mouth off to the Police! Cuz you KNOW YOUR GUILTY if the po-po come after you! We should get rid of courts as well, because the police and our military know best. That way no more lawyers! YEAah!!!!

Who's with me for a FREEDOM FIGHTING POLICE STATE OF AMERICA!!!??? Anyone? Where's your patriotism? You guys don't trust your police or military??? They are there to keep you safe and FREE!
Well..unless you're poor or brown....cuz then you might be a commie or terrorist and they gotta make sure you ain't one of them cuz ya know you probably are!

Wigon

[Pezy]

(...)
And jezes, people should stop calling these bullets "rubber bullets", they are rubber coated STEEL bullets with a weeker than normal powderload and they have killed lots of people before

Indeed, rubber bullets can kill or cause permanent injury. I guess it has to do with which part of the body they hit e.g. kidneys, eyes, neck.
I'm speculating here but I imagine that the effect of a rubber bullet hit would be similar or less severe to that of a small calibre handgun shot on a bullet-proof vest protected body. I also heard that rubber bullets hurt more than the real ones because they damage more nerves. Perhaps some other member could enlighten us.

But throwing stones could also be interpreted as a deadly use of force, although that would be a little stretched and no Police force responds to it as such.
A few stones thrown from a distance is like "stay away, we don't like you" and people can take cover, but a vicious attack from a proximity justifies the use of rubber bullets. Normally the Israelis would respond with rubber bullets, but it seems they have a policy not doing so in these 'bulldozer incidents' because they are constantly filmed and that's frustrating. Obviously they get the chance to deliver justice as they see it when noone is watching.

[little icebear]

We should issue rubber 9mm bullets to all our police in the United States so that if you mouth off to the cops...BAM! They shoot ya! That'll teach you to mouth off to the Police! Cuz you KNOW YOUR GUILTY if the po-po come after you! We should get rid of courts as well, because the police and our military know best. That way no more lawyers! YEAah!!!!


And I thought that´s what you use Tazers for in the States. p-)


@ Threadstarter: Did you pick the stupid threadtitel yourself or did you copy it from somewhere? Utterly misleading. The soldier was a **** and is going to be punished. Still - no horrible massacre here... move on... hardly anthing that deserves to be international news.