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Adux
07-30-2008, 06:37 AM
Why a full-blooded attack on China during Olympics is in India’s favour







One of the most important events of this decade, the Olympics, is being hosted by China from August 8. China wants to showcase itself to the world through the two-week event — rightly so, and the developed world wants to assess the Chinese potential in the light of its economic growth. Some sections of the developed world will of course try to disrupt the event citing “human rights violations,” etc to humiliate China. They perceive that Asia is replacing the West as the axis of global economic power and in that, China is going to play a very large role, which is not palatable to them.
India will send a contingent of nearly 60 competitors with more than— I guess —seven hundred officials, their families, relatives and friends. Other than this, we will find some politicians and Bollywood stars and business tycoons gracing the occasion. But the important strategic issue which we are missing is the opportunity such events present to influence and destabilise the Communist system in China.
The major change taking place in China is not related to the country’s growth rate or the Three Gorges Dam, or the shopping malls and the Olympics stadia. That is a typical Western way of viewing China and we should first learn to stop looking at China with Western glasses.

The significant change that is taking place in China is pertaining to religion. The keynote speech by the communist party general secretary Hu Jintao to the 17th party congress in October last year devoted a paragraph to religion. He stressed that religious people including priests, monks and lay believers played a positive role in the social and economic development of China. Hence, religion is not any more the opium of the masses.
The state-controlled Xinhua stresses that there must be freedom of belief. It says religion can play an important role in realising a “harmonious society,” which is the new political role of the party [Asia times Online July 3, 2008].

That is the main issue we in India should be interested in. A study based on more than 4,500 people conducted by two professors of China Normal University in 2007 concluded that more than 300 million people, namely 31% of the population, were religious and more than 60% of them are in the 16-40 age group. The number of followers of Christianity has increased to 12% from a low of less than 8% in the nineties. More importantly, China is opening what are called Confucius Institutes in more than 50 countries, which is similar to British Council efforts but more focused on China’s ancient wisdom.
In this context, there is a need for us to be more proactive. To recall the words of Hu Shih, former Ambassador of China to the USA (1938-1942), “India conquered and dominated China culturally for 20 centuries without having to send a single soldier across her borders.”
We should now be sending Sri Sri Ravishankar, Mata Amirtanandamayi, Swami Ramdev and Pramukh Swami Shankaracharyas Vaishnavite seers and other spiritual leaders, besides Bharatnatyam experts, musicians and other artistes in dozens to China to “ conquer and dominate” by our soft power.
We need to print millions of copies of Ramayana and Mahabharata and our Puranas and Gita in modern Chinese languages and make them widely available. The CDs of Mahabharata and Ramayana, etc can also be given free.
We should create a fund of at least Rs 1,000 crore for this effort. This is the only way to destabilise our younger brother by de-legitimising Communism. Olympics is the best time to start it and, there is a need to continue the efforts relentlessly.
Actually, China needs this more than the USA even though all our soft power is currently on show in the US. Economic growth bereft of spiritual underpinnings in the context of the death of Marxism is going to be a great challenge for China. As an elder brother, India should facilitate orderly transformation based on our common shared ancient wisdom.
Let us remember that China is also a multi-cultural and multi-religious society but interested in our shared past. According to Prof Wang Zhicheng, who has translated and published on Swami Vivekananda, bian in Chinese means spiritual discrimination or viveka, while xi implies ananda or bliss and fashi means a monk - Vivekananda thus becomes Bian Xi Fashi to the Chinese (Sri Ramakrishna Math magazine, April, 2007 - interview by Alan Hunter).
There is a statue of Kalidasa in the Shanghai theatreway, unveiled by the theatre academy. I can’t think of any metro in India, including the so-called “culture capital” Kolkata, having a statue of Kalidasa. At Kolkata, the theatre road became Shakespeare Sarani and not Kalidasa Marg. China has a thriving underground church, which is also of concern to the government. We should strategically recognise the weak point of China and also the need of its masses in the absence of Communism.
Many a Chinese even today believe that their next birth should be in India to reach salvation. Culture and religion are not taboos any more. But the South Korean way is not going to help China. In South Korea, the Christian President who wears his faith on his sleeves is not appreciated by the traditional Buddhists, who still think of Korea as a Buddhist country from the spiritual point of view.
There are other issues. Officially, China recognises or permits only five religions —- Buddhism, Islam, Taoism, Protestantism and Catholicism (1997 government white paper quoted by The Economist, February 1, 2007]. Hence, we should take steps to include Hinduism as one of the permitted religions.
The Indian government should take steps since four other religions of India are permitted.
The point is that our soft power in culture is interwoven in a tapestry form with the religion. Howsoever hard one might try, there is no separating the two. Carnatic music without bhakti is neither music nor art

The second issue is related to our own mindset. We tend to look at China either through the Western spectacles or through local Marxist spectacles, which have thicker glasses. We need to come out of it. Even when invitations come to Indian spiritual leaders, the Government of India is unenthusiastic and indicates its disinterest in the false assumptions regarding China’s political orientation. The policy formulators are still living in the sixties and seventies at a time when China is undergoing a gigantic social crisis due to material prosperity and spiritual vacuum.
That is the opportunity to us since it is better to have a competitor and neighbour sharing the past cultural commonness. This will be very useful when the world has two super powers from Asia, unlike the conflict of the last century between two super powers who did not have any shared cultural roots.
The strategy should be to encircle China with music, dance, art, yoga, ayurveda, spiritual texts, etc and capture the hearts of the middle classes as we have done for centuries. In the process, we should de-stabilise the current dispensation and de-legitimise the remnants of Communism.
Olympics is the best occasion to start doing it. And of course, the invasion should continue for many years. Many groups and sects from many a western country (with or without permission) are going to do the same - spread their influence and message - since this is an opportunity.
Are we ready to undertake such an invasion?
The author is professor of finance, Indian Institute of Management- Bangalore, and can be reached at vaidya@iimb.ernet.in.
Views are personal.



http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?newsid=1180369


Interesting read,

Adux
07-30-2008, 06:40 AM
Would love to hear Ordie's and Mastermind's view on this, India has actually done this before!!!!! Can soft power in a nuclear age be successful, since real war between this two countries will mean destruction of 2.5 billion people

Buffalo_soldier
07-30-2008, 07:11 AM
China would be better off keeping close tabs on religion.

Stainless Steel Rat
07-30-2008, 08:49 AM
China is our "Little Brother"?

"China needs this more than the USA even though all our soft power is currently on show in the US."??

"As an elder brother, India should facilitate orderly transformation based on our common shared ancient wisdom."???

Pray tell, what is the Indian word for "condescending"? Or perhaps Sactimonious P***k?

Send that communication to every Chinese and see how they like it....

LongShot
07-30-2008, 08:52 AM
Good read, thanks Adux.

alcatas
07-30-2008, 08:55 AM
"Many a Chinese even today believe that their next birth should be in India to reach salvation." I'm pretty sure this isn't the case. =/

Holycrusader
07-30-2008, 09:00 AM
http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?newsid=1180369


Interesting read,

I prefer communist than religious fanatics...

J-10
07-30-2008, 09:00 AM
:) Good read. At least yoga already invade China, many people favour it!

Paddy51
07-30-2008, 09:34 AM
Interesting read. Thanks.

Mastermind
07-30-2008, 09:50 AM
A good snapshot of what is going on...yes...it is a bit condescending....perhaps even paternalistic. But, a good take on things.

Thanks for posting.

Adux
07-30-2008, 12:39 PM
I dont agree with it, Not because it is condenceding, I care two hoots for that especially with the way Chinese spokesperson's love to talk.
Anyways India has

Chinese Ambassador to India " India has invaded China for centuries without even sending a single soldier across the Himalayalas"

A lot of cultural heritage in China comes from India, which happened before the decline of pre-medival India. During the times of Gupta and Mauryan Empire.
Anyways I dont think it will be successful, nor do I think it is effective apart from the fact that it shows the Chinese people the real enemies of India, is not the people but just the communist.

Adux
07-30-2008, 12:40 PM
Interesting read. Thanks.

I had a inkling you would be reading this topic.

Paddy51
07-30-2008, 12:44 PM
I had a inkling you would be reading this topic.

Now why would that be???? :)

Ordie
07-30-2008, 02:40 PM
Good read. A bit too self grandizement.

Chinese do not view religion in the same manner as the Indians.

Unlike other regions, the Chinese have a casual attitude towards religion and not to engage in dogma as in the west or middle east. It is very much in the same approach to Chinese cooking. The Chinese will cook a variety of dishes at each sitting each with its own unique texture, flavor, and ingredients. These dishes by themselves are good, but together, it creates a fanatstic feast for the palate.

Same is true with religion and tend to pick and choose.

Buddhism (originated in India) is often intertwined with Daosim along with Confusian Philosophy. The early Christain Jesuit scholars (Matteo Ricci) had to incorporate many eastern beliefs and science to win favor ofthe Imperial Court. The Jews of Kaifeng and Muslims were free to worship as well. The rule back then as it is today, in order to operate one must cooperate.

Another big difference about religion is its application in society. For India religion is used as a rational for a caste system. In China the "caste" system is based on merit through the Imperial Examination system.

Yoga in the US is very popular, it does not mean US will fall over night because of this. Same is true with China.

drunken sailor
07-30-2008, 02:57 PM
Would love to hear Ordie's and Mastermind's view on this, India has actually done this before!!!!! Can soft power in a nuclear age be successful, since real war between this two countries will mean destruction of 2.5 billion people

People have been smuggleing bibles and such into China for years. I know people who have done it and not been caught. What we all fear and their people fear is a North Korea type clamp down if the party feels pressured to much.

What is needed is another Tinemen square event sadly to put the pressure on the government, A event that never stops like last time and hopefully the troops side with the people this time and refuse to fire.

The people are given just enough not to cause something like this but as they see their government get rich and they dont things may change.

I would not be shocked if China tried to take Tiwaan while the games are on. I have many friends as well that have all had similar very real type dreams in where they see a major earthquake or war type event during the games in Bejing, China.

One thing is for sure it will be a interesting couple of weeks.

Ordie
07-30-2008, 03:12 PM
What is going on in China is class division.

Since 1989, the neo-liberal economic reforms has benefitted the educated, urban, and entrepeneural youth and society. So much so that calls for reform, traditionally from university students (i.e. May 4th movement) are absent.

However, today, calls for reform and transparency are coming from the poorer rural sector. That is why many of the demonstrations and uprisings are happeneng in the hinterland.

The majority of Chinese are very patriotic and supportive of the government at large. But there is growing fustration in the actions of local Communit Party bosses and elities over the abuse of power and neglect. Since there is no independent checks and balances and due process, people will riot to get the attention of Beijing.

Hu Jin Tao, China's president, wants to 'harmonize' the country by shifting priorities. Religion is seen a two edged sword, it plays a role in placating the masses or but it can organize the masses without government role.

Smuggling Bibles? I'm willing to bet the majority of Bibles are printed in China.

Adux
07-30-2008, 03:20 PM
Ordie,

That guy is a Prof at Indian Institute of Management, I expect them to bit of a nut and condecending, Why I find this topic interesting, is because India(not purposefully) has already did this. Though I dont believe it is going to be some Indian Culture or Yoga, rather Indian Freedom.

Ordie
07-30-2008, 03:40 PM
Ordie,

That guy is a Prof at Indian Institute of Management, I expect them to bit of a nut and condecending, Why I find this topic interesting, is because India(not purposefully) has already did this. Though I dont believe it is going to be some Indian Culture or Yoga, rather Indian Freedom.

Yoga is a fad very much like tai chi.

Adux
07-30-2008, 03:49 PM
Yoga is a fad very much like tai chi.

Guess what my Irish friend coming down November wants, she wants to meet best Yoga guy in my state!! I was like, of all the people...the irish!!, those drunk bastards!!!

seathru
07-30-2008, 06:33 PM
Pretty Indian girls and entertaining Indian movies will always be welcomed in China. But Indian cult leaders?

Zerazax
07-30-2008, 06:35 PM
Since when did cyber-nationalism become the cool thing to do these last 3-4 years?

Ordie
07-30-2008, 06:43 PM
But Indian cult leaders?

What's wrong with a hug from Amma the Hug Guru?
I think China needs more hugs.
http://www.rickross.com/images/amma2.jpg

Ordie
07-30-2008, 06:46 PM
Since when did cyber-nationalism become the cool thing to do these last 3-4 years?

Anonymity without dealing with consequences.
Otherwise people would not say what on thier mind in the firstplace with others face to face.

delio
07-30-2008, 07:30 PM
Forget Hinduism, send the snake charmers instead!

Carnatic music, Sri Sri Ravishankar, Mata Amirtanandamayi, Swami Ramdev and Pramukh Swami Shankaracharyas Vaishnavite? Yeah, good luck with that.

Chinese that look abroad are more interested with stuff that tend to yell 'status symbols,' which invariably seem to mean Western things - Western Classical music for the high-minded and Hip Hop for the youth.

http://beacononline.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/srisriravishankardarj.gif

Some of those Indian luminaries would probably be laughed out of China.

deagle
07-30-2008, 08:32 PM
:) Good read. At least yoga already invade China, many people favour it!

they already have a slow-paced martial art called Tai Chi.

ren0312
07-30-2008, 09:08 PM
What's wrong with a hug from Amma the Hug Guru?
I think China needs more hugs.
http://www.rickross.com/images/amma2.jpg

Si vis pacem, para bellum.-Vegetius.

Hollis
07-30-2008, 09:12 PM
I prefer communist than religious fanatics...


There is a difference?

Adux
07-30-2008, 11:01 PM
Delio,

I would have to agree with you on that, Indian Spiritualism is not even sought after in the youth of this country, forget China. But, there is a invasion of bollywood movies already happening into China.(I guess even chinese are facinated by running around trees singing doing pelvic thrusts)

rajkhalsa
07-31-2008, 02:02 AM
Pretty Indian girls and entertaining Indian movies will always be welcomed in China. But Indian cult leaders?
Because it's a Hindu leader, its a 'cult' leader? :roll:

Don't be daft

Ordie
07-31-2008, 02:23 AM
Some of those Indian luminaries would probably be laughed out of China.

Like Bhudda?

Holycrusader
07-31-2008, 03:06 AM
There is a difference?

Trust me there is... i.e. hardcore communist do not pray for the end of the world like some of the religious nuts...
Ps
In Poland religious fanatics have communist POV on economy, but they are very antisemitic and are less tolerant. Communist are really lesser evil compared to them...

Holycrusader
07-31-2008, 03:08 AM
Like Bhudda?

I would laugh at Bhudda

http://img2.travelblog.org/Photos/8583/38428/t/199159-Bubbly-Bhudda-0.jpg

delio
07-31-2008, 11:19 AM
Like Bhudda?

No, but I'm sure they would laugh at someone comparing any of these folks to Buddha.

Some of this luminaries - like Amma Hug - are indeed cult figures. A great number of Hindu probably consider them as such.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkznW59_-Rc&feature=related

Adux
07-31-2008, 12:20 PM
Delio,

They do. She is from a state, And I consider her nuts. Anyways you cant say who can or not have influence like Buddha. Though I agree it is difficult in this age of information and science to have an impact like Buddha

delio
07-31-2008, 01:18 PM
It's hard for most in the West to see this, but the reason Chinese are embracing so much of American culture (or Western culture in general) is because Western culture has an awesome ethos in China. I suspect the opposite is true when it comes to the way most Chinese that bother to form a view of India see it, which is perhaps mainly with native connotations - along the line of a poor and dirty country whose layman/popular culture should not be emulated.

As a silver lining, something Chinese have in high regard of is the high level of entrepreneurship taught in India's best universities. The general view of the Chinese elites on that is probably much along the line of the positive view of it that exists in America and Japan. Here in the United States, the average Indian-American is better educated and wealthier than even the average white American. The average income for an Indian-American family living in the Washington metro area is about $88,000 dollars. It is likely much over a hundred thousand dollars in Silicon Valley, and the San Francisco Bay area in general. In fact, there's one governor here whose parents are Indian, and who was himself conceived there. He may just become the next Cheney - the next Vice President of the United States of America.


http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/10/19/us/190louisiana.600.jpg



But more on topic, ..unfortunately, the view layman Chinese have of India is probably more along the line of that held in Dubai and the rest of Middle East than that held in Japan and the United States.

Adux
07-31-2008, 01:46 PM
Bobby Jindal.

Adux
07-31-2008, 01:49 PM
I would not be surprised about the view held by Middle east, and definitely the Chinese.

delio
07-31-2008, 03:27 PM
Bobby Jindal.

Yeah, he has a cute wife, and not just for a politician, ..p-)



http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/10/22/us/22louisiana.xlarge1.jpg



http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/10/22/us/governor650.jpg



Bobby Jindal, 36, a Republican and the son of immigrant parents, celebrated his election as Louisiana governor on Saturday surrounded by his family. He is the first Indian-American to win a governor’s race.

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2007/10/21/us/21louisiana.xlarge1.jpg


Bobby Jindal, center, with supporters on election night in the Louisiana governor's race.

Adux
07-31-2008, 03:30 PM
if you call that "San Fransisco Bridge" of a nose cute

damagejackal
07-31-2008, 04:08 PM
But more on topic, ..unfortunately, the view layman Chinese have of India is probably more along the line of that held in Dubai and the rest of Middle East than that held in Japan and the United States.

Nonsense, we don't look down on Indians. I see plenty of sucessful Indian IT professionals working in Shangai + Beijing also there seems to be a sizable expat community living in Shaoxing. You might get some curious stares in the mainland, but most urban Chinese are indifferent to foriegners

Ordie
07-31-2008, 04:41 PM
if you call that "San Fransisco Bridge" of a nose cute

There is no such thing as a San Francisco Bridge.

We have the Golden Gate Bridge and the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge.

Andrew Chalmers
07-31-2008, 05:19 PM
To recall the words of Hu Shih, former Ambassador of China to the USA (1938-1942), “India conquered and dominated China culturally for 20 centuries without having to send a single soldier across her borders."

How many Indian dynasties were there in Chinese history? 2000 years of cultural domination? Really?

Interesting read? More like the ramblings of a nationalist nut.

:roll::roll::roll::roll:

TR1
07-31-2008, 05:24 PM
There is no such thing as a San Francisco Bridge.

We have the Golden Gate Bridge and the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge.
Don't leave the Richmond Bridge out ( I know doesn't go in and out of SF but frankly its the best looking of them all IMO).

deagle
07-31-2008, 07:56 PM
india doesn't have the guts or abilities to quarrel with their closest ally in the continent. a partnership, however, would be most powerful.

Adux
07-31-2008, 11:38 PM
india doesn't have the guts or abilities to quarrel with their closest ally in the continent. a partnership, however, would be most powerful.


Guts and abilities are two different things

And who is this close ally?

Adux
07-31-2008, 11:55 PM
There is no such thing as a San Francisco Bridge.

We have the Golden Gate Bridge and the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/56/108954580_12a6783137.jpg?v=0


From all the watching, of Full House when I was young!!

SMYD
08-01-2008, 12:28 AM
:) So interesting article,the idea is fantastic!!I will be right here waiting for it. And then tell you the effects.