Somalia's pirates

[Noob Brit]

A cruise ship sailing off Somalia has beaten back gunmen in speedboats who opened fire on it in an apparent pirate attack which terrified passengers.
At least two boats closed in on the Seabourn Spirit, reportedly firing automatic weapons and a rocket-propelled grenade.

But crew took evasive action, repelling the attackers without returning fire.

One crew member was lightly injured in the early-morning incident in waters notorious for pirate attacks.

The ship was hit by bullets but not, apparently, by the rocket-propelled grenade.

It used an on-board loud acoustic bang to deter the gunmen

Full Story (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/4409662.stm)

Lucky escape but nice sailing. Maybe it's time for "sea marshalls" on board these ships, this time it was piracy, next one could be AQ.

[TuNeRsHaRk]

an on-board Loud acoustic Bang, im guessing thats a simulated Gunshot with some kind of speakers?

i think every Cruise ship should have an armoury ;)

[joshfox0]

i think the big question is why were they sailing in that strectch of water known to be pirate infested?!

[MKtexan]

i think the big question is why were they sailing in that strectch of water known to be pirate infested?!

good point

do cruise ships have any weapons on board? i have never heard that they do....

[keat320]

The CNN article that I saw said that the ship escaped by outrunning the smaller boats.

[Violet Fashion by Mindy]

an on-board Loud acoustic Bang, im guessing thats a simulated Gunshot with some kind of speakers?

i think every Cruise ship should have an armoury ;)

They do.

AFAIK they are restricted or rather only have a few pistols and maybe 1 or two hunting rifles for crowd control if **** hits the fan.

[sp2c]

a while ago I read about a proposition of a dutch ex marine who wanted to set up a PMC company of ex marine types that would have small bases in danger zones and they'd then deploy their people (armed) on ships entering the area (for a price) to deter or even defeat pirates attacking the ship and then get of when the ships leaves the area (and go to another ship in need of armed security).

never heard anything of it since so the government probably killed it but it sounded like a good idea at the time

[ArmedPacifist]

These aren't REAL pirates...

[joshfox0]

These aren't REAL pirates...
yeh real pirates use wooden ships and cutalsses these guys were just wusses.

[ArmedPacifist]

yeh real pirates use wooden ships and cutalsses these guys were just wusses.

Harr! I mean....word.

[Chuckie]

The CNN article that I saw said that the ship escaped by outrunning the smaller boats.

I doubt that a Cruise Ship could outrun speedboats.

[BarkingSquirrel]

Couldn't have been that hard, just had to throw some bread in the water and turn in the opposite direction.

[Chuckie]

Okay the story is a little different than they are saying. The Cruise Ship got away buy heading into "High Seas" which the speedboats couldn't navigate. Also, this is a picture of one the the "guards" on the cruiseship. This definitly isn't a Carnival cruise line or anything.

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/afp/20051105/capt.sge.cor36.051105142258.photo00.photo.default-384x271.jpg

[KEEPER0311]

Okay the story is a little different than they are saying. The Cruise Ship got away buy heading into "High Seas" which the speedboats couldn't navigate. Also, this is a picture of one the the "guards" on the cruiseship. This definitly isn't a Carnival cruise line or anything.

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/afp/20051105/capt.sge.cor36.051105142258.photo00.photo.default-384x271.jpg
that would defiantly make for a relaxing and stress free cruise...p-)

[Atlantic Friend]

Full Story (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/4409662.stm)

Lucky escape but nice sailing. Maybe it's time for "sea marshalls" on board these ships, this time it was piracy, next one could be AQ.

In the Andaman straits, it's not a "sea marshall", they have full-fledged rapid response Marine response teams, because there piracy is so widespread that the pirates attack even large cargo ships.

[ed316]

Did they look like this...aaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrgggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://img111.imageshack.us/img111/8691/piratecrew1ap.jpg

[ArmedPacifist]

Barbossa!


Name yer terms.

[Yosy]

Ships of any kind aren't allowed to have weapons on board. In pirate dangerous areas (Somali coast, Malacca Strait, straits in Indonesia) is SOP to navigate with all crew looking out, trying to find speed boats, zodiacs etc, that could be pirates (not an easy task). All cabin doors are locked and the ship normally goes at the max speed allowed in the area.

The reason why ships take these routes is financial. The shipping companies don't give a **** if there are pirates or not - they want to make money and just using safe waters is a profit loss in the order of thousands or millions of dolars.

[ed316]

Barbossa!


Name yer terms.

Parlay!!!!! I invoke the right of parlay.p-)

[Rocky_Mt_Devildog]

The cruise lines oughta just put a couple quad-.50s on the bow in between the jaccuzi and the bar.

[Bombtrack]

I've heard of Cruise ships in the East using Gurkhas for on-board security against pirates

[KEEPER0311]

I've heard of Cruise ships in the East using Gurkhas for on-board security against pirates
now that would defiantly keep me from trying to take over. Those guys are tough as hell.

[Airborne44]

Cruise to Somalia- $500

Room with a view- $200

Roomservice- $50

Having your crusie ship over run by somali pirates- PRICELESS, ARRRRRRRRRR

[Chuckie]

Holy Crap, it's a cruise ship actually owned by Carnival out of Miami:

http://www.wnbc.com/travelgetaways/5258235/detail.html

[Michael RVR]

Strategy page is calling it a 'sonic weapon'




November 6, 2005: Incidents in which merchant ships have been captured by pirates off the Horn of Africa, since the beginning of 2005, total 12, two more than the equivalent period last year. In addition, several fishing vessels have been taken as well. Currently three freighters, from small “flag of convenience” countries, and three Taiwanese fishing boats are still in the hands of pirates, but are being closely observed by Western naval forces.

Recently, even a small (302 passengers and crew) cruise ship, 160 kilometers off the Somali coast, and headed for Kenya, was attacked by two speedboats full of heavily armed Somali pirates. The crew repelled boarding attempts using a sonic cannon, one of the many American developed “non-lethal weapons” to appear on the market in the last decade. The cruise ship had a plan for dealing with pirate attacks, and successfully carried it out in this case, getting away with only minimal damage to the ship (several bullet holes, one passenger cabin damaged by an RPG rocket and one injured crewman). The cruise ship believed itself relatively safe from Somali pirates, as there have never been attacks that far off the coast. The two speedboats were either operating from a larger ship, knew when the cruise ship would be in the area, or were just very reckless and lucky. The attack was made at 5:30 AM, and when the cruise ship got up to top speed, it was able to get away from the smaller (20-25 feet long) and slower pirate craft. There were apparently fewer than a dozen pirates involved, and it is interesting to speculate on what would have happened if they had gotten on board and taken control of the cruise ship. Among the 151 affluent passengers were carrying 48 Americans, 22 Britons, 21 Canadians, 19 Germans and six South Africans. A mass mugging may have ensued, but hostage taking (for ransom) was also a possibility.


While everything sp says has to be taken with a grain of salt 'we're for the general public, not experts', has anyone else heard about the weapons involved ?

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htseamo/articles/20051106.aspx

[sp2c]

http://www.samurize.com/userfiles/16879/Monkey-Island.jpg

arrrrrrrrrr, shiver me timber, rast the oars, arrrr

[toad]

http://www.samurize.com/userfiles/16879/Monkey-Island.jpg

arrrrrrrrrr, shiver me timber, rast the oars, arrrr


...they were gay pirates ??? ^

[sir-chimp]

wouldnt that be a butt pirate?

[TuNeRsHaRk]

it was a norwegian ship i beleive, well the crew was norwegian, they did some type of "classified" meneuver or something

[Hot Lips]

Okay the story is a little different than they are saying. The Cruise Ship got away buy heading into "High Seas" which the speedboats couldn't navigate. Also, this is a picture of one the the "guards" on the cruiseship. This definitly isn't a Carnival cruise line or anything.

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/afp/20051105/capt.sge.cor36.051105142258.photo00.photo.default-384x271.jpg

Geez, I hope they put that in the brochures. :-P

[ArmedPacifist]

Guybrush Threepwood!

A man who's sole ambition in life is to become a pirate.

[Ratamacue]

I've heard of Cruise ships in the East using Gurkhas for on-board security against pirates
My brother's friend, when he went on a semester at sea, had a US Navy escort while sailing between India and Africa. I'd say that's a pretty strong deterrent.

[BlackRain]

i think the big question is why were they sailing in that strectch of water known to be pirate infested?!


It is called Freedom of Navigation. The question is why were terrorists from Somolia in that stretch of water?

[Chuckie]

It is called Freedom of Navigation. The question is why were terrorists from Somolia in that stretch of water?
It wasn't an area known to be inhabited by Pirates. They said the pirate ships were too small to be that far out on their own and that there must have been a mother ship that they were operating from.

Sort of like the Tie Fighters and the Death Star.

[EvanL]

Grenades, not cutlasses
Canadians on cruise ship recount pirate attack

Mary Vallis
National Post; with files from news services

Tuesday, November 08, 2005

Moments before the pirates opened fire, the early morning sun woke Barbara Donaldson as the luxury cruise ship she was aboard steamed through the Indian Ocean toward Mombasa.

Ms. Donaldson, one of at least 18 Canadians on the Seabourn Spirit when it was attacked, had forgotten to close her curtains. She awoke at 5:30 on Saturday and turned on the television news. The ship was approximately 160 kilometres off Somalia's coast, east of Mogadishu.

Twenty minutes later, she heard a powerful thump. From her window she saw about 10 men approaching the ship in two small boats. They carried machine guns and grenade launchers and were firing just above her cabin. Some passengers said the attackers wore ski masks.

"We heard from the captain that this was not a drill and that we were under attack by pirates, that we were to stay in our cabins," Ms. Donaldson said in a telephone interview with the National Post yesterday.

The pirates launched a grenade at the deck above her, but it landed between two windows, so the woman in the room above was not hurt, Ms. Donaldson said.

"Otherwise, I think she wouldn't be here to tell us about it."

One veteran of the Second World War saw a pirate aim directly at him as he tried to photograph one of their boats.

"Needless to say, I dropped the camera and dived," said 78-year-old Charles Supple of Fiddletown, Calif. "I could tell the guy firing the bazooka was smiling."

Ms. Donaldson, the owner of a travel agency in Cambridge, Ont., locked herself in the bathroom and sat on the floor. Captain Sven Erik Pedersen quickly came back on the intercom and ordered the 151 passengers to gather in the dining room on the lowest deck.

The announcement woke up Peter Hay, a retiree from Toronto, and his wife, Edna. They, too, looked out the window and saw a small cutter alongside the cruise ship. It carried four or five pirates.

"They were wielding guns and a grenade gun," Mr. Hay said in an interview from his cabin yesterday. "All of a sudden I heard a thunk against the ship. Something hit, a grenade, I think. Then there were some popping sounds."

The Hays quickly dressed and rushed to the dining room. Many of the other passengers were still in housecoats. Crew members instructed the tourists to lie on the floor of the dining room, which had smaller windows than most of their cabins. Reports say the captain's decision to send them to a lower deck was unusual and likely saved their lives: Had Capt. Pedersen sounded the "usual alarm," they may have assumed the ship was on fire and run onto the deck, where they could have been shot.

As many of the passengers prayed, Capt. Pedersen directed the ship sharply to the right, and then to the left, in the hopes of ramming one of the pirates' cutters or creating wake large enough to swamp their boats. The turns were so abrupt that some passengers worried the ship was taking on water. The crew also used a high-decibel sonic gun to frighten the pirates.

Then the captain ordered full power, sped up and left the pirates behind. But the ordeal was not over: The Seabourn then received a distress call from another ship claiming it, too, was being attacked by pirates. Capt. Pedersen did not offer assistance: He later told his passengers that he believed the call was coming from the pirates' "mother ship," a rusted hulk that had helped bring the cutters so far from shore.

Capt. Pedersen set a new course for the Seychelles, where the ship safely docked late Saturday. He is being hailed as a hero, but Ms. Donaldson said he was clearly upset.

"You could tell by the captain's voice that he was very traumatized. His voice was shaking," she said. "But he was giving orders in no uncertain terms."

One crew member was taken to hospital with minor wounds from shrapnel after the 440-foot ship docked.

Miami-based Seabourn Cruise Lines has given the passengers vouchers for a free cruise in the future and quickly organized a day of activities in the Seychelles yesterday to buoy the tourists' spirits. While Ms. Donaldson snorkelled and toured a nature reserve, members of the U.S. Navy's explosive disposal unit investigated reports there was still an unexploded charge aboard the ship.

The technicians, who were already in the Seychelles to work on the USS Gonzalez, found the object was in fact the remains of a rocket motor from one of two grenades that hit the Seabourn. The damage is minor and the ship is expected to continue on its previous schedule to Singapore.

Ms. Donaldson said many of passengers -- who hailed from Australia, the United Kingdom and the United States, as well as other countries -- are flying home early. But she said none of the Canadians are among them: Ms. Donaldson, for her part, is flying to Mombasa today on her way to Nairobi.

"The Canadians have all stayed very calm. I think that's our way," she said. "We're calm and we're cool ... That was yesterday and today is today."

Ms. Donaldson said there were 21 Canadians on board during the pirate attack: four from Toronto; six from Alberta; two from Vancouver; two from Port Perry, Ont.; and seven from Quebec.

The federal government's count is 18. Dan McTeague, Canada's parliamentary secretary for Canadians abroad, said other passengers may be permanent residents of Canada or may have been travelling on other passports.

Australia's consular officials helped assist the Canadians in Seychelles.

While Australia's Foreign Minister has suggested terrorists may have been responsible for the attack, Mr. McTeague said they were more likely a "band of brigands," bandits who wanted to rob the ship.

"Incidents like this can happen anywhere in the world, and not necessarily for the reasons that we might think," Mr. McTeague said.

The International Maritime Bureau released a report yesterday that documents an "unprecedented increase" in the frequency of pirate attacks off Somalia; 23 incidents have been reported since March 15.

The pirates are becoming more brazen as they target passenger ships.

A vessel carrying cargo for the UN World Food Program into Somalia was recently seized by pirates and held for more than 14 weeks.

"There is no national law enforcement infrastructure in Somalia," said Captain Pottengal Mukundan, director of the ICC International Maritime Bureau.

"These waters have become a pirate's charter and unless the international community takes action against these criminals, vessels passing this coast face considerable danger."
© National Post 2005

[friendofafriend]

I don’t want to go off on a rant here but…

That place is a worthless, festering, maggot infested sore on the face of the planet. That apocalyptic wasteland continually seems to show up in the news, with nothing good to report. That place sux so bad, even their pirates are second rate. I cannot believe anyone goes within 100 miles of that hellhole. With any luck, another title wave will occur, and will mop that festering bag of feces right off the globe.

[ed316]

I don’t want to go off on a rant here but…

That place is a worthless, festering, maggot infested sore on the face of the planet. That apocalyptic wasteland continually seems to show up in the news, with nothing good to report. That place sux so bad, even their pirates are second rate. I cannot believe anyone goes within 100 miles of that hellhole. With any luck, another title wave will occur, and will mop that festering bag of feces right off the globe.

Maybe they had a "Black Hawk Down" theme ( Sarcasm). I totally agree you about Somalia. maybe the western Anarchist should go there and see what a country with no form of government really looks like.

[Para]

Many years a go during WW1 there was such a thing as a Q Ship. It was a merchant ship heavily armed but disguised to bring the U Boats top surface to sink the ship by gunfire. When most of the crew of the submarine were on deck the covers would be dropped from the guns and the sub sunk. Now this would be a good way of drawing out these bandits and allowing them to be dealt with.

[mattnwnc03]

its like the movie the road warrior, they wanted the gas."just walk away and nobody has to die, just walk away"!

[Kitsune]

Many years a go during WW1 there was such a thing as a Q Ship. It was a merchant ship heavily armed but disguised to bring the U Boats top surface to sink the ship by gunfire. When most of the crew of the submarine were on deck the covers would be dropped from the guns and the sub sunk. Now this would be a good way of drawing out these bandits and allowing them to be dealt with.

Yeah, hmmm, but in the case of the subs this Q-ship tactic just prompted ze Germans to sink freighters with a torpedo while staying submerged. And that is much more deadly for the crew. I think that is what they call escalation.

But then, since African pirates do not use subs (yet :P) Q-ships may work in this case. Let's give it a try.

[OldRecon]

These aren't REAL pirates...

Oh yeah?
They're just a poor bunch of hungry SOBs, right? :petting:


A snap of the pirates as they attempt to close in on the cruise liner
http://www.vg.no/bilder/bildarkiv/1131438392.6832.jpg


A close up of the rascals
http://gfx.dagbladet.no/pub/artikkel/4/44/448/448799/Cruise3_858.jpg

Let them phukin starve! :backhand:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------


A dud RPG round stuck in the hull side of the ship
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/images/051108cruise1.jpg


Another pic of dud RPG round stuck in the hull side of the ship
http://www.vg.no/bilder/bildarkiv/1131438515.51013.jpg


Hole in the hull side of the cruise liner after penetration by RPG
http://gfx.dagbladet.no/pub/artikkel/4/44/448/448799/Cruise_280.jpg


A pic of a sound gun similar to that used on board the cruise liner (not the M60 in the foreground, but the round shaped thing behind it)
http://gfx.dagbladet.no/pub/artikkel/4/44/448/448712/lrad_280.jpg


The captain of the cruise liner and his wife
http://gfx.dagbladet.no/pub/artikkel/4/44/448/448799/Cruise4_280.jpg


The cruise liner at harbour after arrival in the Seychelles
http://gfx.dagbladet.no/pub/artikkel/4/44/448/448712/Seabourn_503.jpg


Some of the passengers leaving for home at the airport in the Seychelles
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/images/051108cruise.jpg

[toad]

Thats not a 'dud'. The Warhead exploded, what you see there is a piece of the RPG's booster stuck in the hole.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/images/051108cruise1.jpg





http://www.news.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=20930
"Once aboard Spirit, the team made a thorough inspection of both the suspected unexploded ordnance and the impact area of the second RPG. The technicians determined that the object in question was actually the remains of a rocket motor and not the warhead from the RPG, which had detonated on impact." -EODMU-8

[OldRecon]

Thats not a 'dud'. The Warhead exploded, what you see there is a piece of the RPG's booster stuck in the hole.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/images/051108cruise1.jpg





http://www.news.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=20930
"Once aboard Spirit, the team made a thorough inspection of both the suspected unexploded ordnance and the impact area of the second RPG. The technicians determined that the object in question was actually the remains of a rocket motor and not the warhead from the RPG, which had detonated on impact." -EODMU-8

Indeed your right. I drew some wrong conclusions there. Maybe a bit mislead by the absence of the finns at the rear of the rocket on my part.

[Jedburgh]

Pirate 'mother ship' spotted (http://www.ds-osac.org/News/story.cfm?contentID=38391)

Officials are searching for a "mother ship" believed to be used to launch high-speed boats for several recent pirate attacks off Somalia.

Since November 5, when pirates tried unsuccessfully to attack a 440-foot cruise liner operated by Seabourn Cruise Lines, at least five other attacks have taken place, most of them northeast of Somalia, said Andrew Mwangura, program coordinator at the Kenyan Seafarer's Association.

Overall, he said, seven ships and crews have been taken into captivity in that section of the Indian Ocean.

Fishermen in the area spotted a "pirate mother ship" drifting off the Somali coast in July, on November 5 and earlier this week, Mwangura said. Only one mother ship has been spotted, but there may be more in existence. Officials think the smaller boats used in attacks are launched from the mother ship, he said.

[Count Lippe]

I think that the OEF taskforce at the Horn of Africa should take care of that ship...p-)

[ed316]

Sink it to Davy Jones' locker, arrrrrrrrrrr!

[TallGuy]

Leader of the pirates:

http://www.waterworldmovie.com/deacon2.JPG

[redflash]

thats nice... set it on fire and watch them burn.

[Pooga]

Sink it to Davy Jones' locker, arrrrrrrrrrr!

Aye matey, clamber 'pon the for'ard bowsprit and bellow some jolly taunts with y'old windbags: "Ahoy ye scallawags, I hears back at port you know there wheresbout of yon booty! Hand it over or I strike yar nosepicker off in a bloomin tick! Avast!" Then op'n gun ports and give em blood 'n vinegar me hearties!

ARRRRRHHH!!!

Seriously, these guys are no match for real pirates. Or a Sea Sparrow in the face.

[joshfox0]

i demand engagment using broadsides only!

[ed316]

The Navy should pull along side it and let the Marines get position in the superstructure and pick off those buttmonkeys.

[HoboWithAK]

A description of what it looked like or even a picture would be cool. Maybe it's about time to drop a boarding party onboard for a friendly VBS/S...

[Pooga]

Yeah, make it a training scenario of sorts. A very real training scenario.

Board the seascum!

[Kingswat]

i demand engagment using broadsides only!


I agree, bring back one of the iowa class for the job, just to make it look good.

[usafbalad]

Lets just get a submarine over there and sink that "mothership" ww2 u-boat style.

[hauptman]

Just send a submarine and everything will be fine ^^

[BlackRain]

These are not pirates. Pirates are not religiously driven but financially.

These are Islamic fundamentalist militia fighters with links to al-Qaida.

Even the Prime Minister of Somalia Ali Mohamed Gedi has urged neighboring countries to send warships to patrol Somalia's stretch of coast, which is Africa's longest and lies along key shipping lanes linking the Mediterranean with the Persian Gulf and Indian Ocean.

Who can forget the Semlow was the first U.N.-chartered ship to be seized while on a humanitarian mission to Somalia and the 10 crew members were held for more than three months this summer.

The Somali terrorists let the ship go after it ran out of fuel amid negotiations by Islamic clan elders.


Background -

Somali 'terrorists return home'
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/1706164.stm

[ed316]

http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/img/printer_friendly/news_logo.gif
US firm to fight Somali pirates
A US company has been given a two-year contract to help fight piracy off the Somalia coast - seen as among the world's most dangerous waters.
The $50m contract has been awarded by Somalia's transitional government.
Topcat Marine Security will target the "mother ship" launching pirate ships from the open sea, said the firm's Peter Casini.
Earlier this month, pirates fired rocket-propelled grenades at a US-based luxury cruise liner. There have been 32 pirate attacks off the Somali coast since March this year, according to the International Maritime Board.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/africa/4471536.stm

Published: 2005/11/25 17:19:21 GMT

© BBC MMV

[Limeyfellow]

There used to be a time they would just call in one of the world's navy in force, find them and blow the living crap out of them. Its sad that they have to even outsource one of the things the navy was quite good at.

[Hellfish]

http://www.topcatmarinesecurity.com/

Be interesting to see exactly what they intend to do.

[dacanadianbomb]

the question is, which navy has enough ships and manpower and money to do so realistically nowadays ?
And would be able to politically support it?

Along with that, taking offensive action and interdicting would actually make them mercenaries.
I knew the word would come up anyway, so I thought I would state it.

[Chuckie]

There used to be a time they would just call in one of the world's navy in force, find them and blow the living crap out of them. Its sad that they have to even outsource one of the things the navy was quite good at.

Probably afraid of it turning political. Could you imagine if the US Navy started attacking suspected ships off the coast (Not that I have a problem with that). I'm sure someone could twist things and turn it into a "US invading Africa" panic.

[Kaapeli]

I wonder why the Somali government would hire a US company to do the job (darn expensive for a developing country!). As if they didn't have enough cheap gunmen... I'm guessing USA or western companies are paying the bill mostly... Actually I'm almost sure of this.

[JoaMei]

The hard part is identification of the Pirate Ship and locate it. Its comparably easy to call one of the task force ships there to take it out.

@Kaapeli

Nearly all of these Gunmen are corrupt and will sell what they know to the Pirates. There is nobody you can trust, especcialy not the Goverment.

[toad]

One could wonder if the company would ever see the full amount of money for thier services... maybe not but thats a lot of cash for a poor country.

I don't think there even is a central government in place in Somalia the last few years. Could be that this is done pro bono...

[ed316]

One could wonder if the company would ever see the full amount of money for thier services... maybe not but thats a lot of cash for a poor country.

I don't think there even is a central government in place in Somalia the last few years. Could be that this is done pro bono...

where do you think the Samoli government get their money? Western Nations, we are going to pay for it.

[BloodyTalon]

Wars in the Middle East...

Violence breaking out in France...

Piracy...

Are we sure this is the 21st century?

[He219]

With all the maritime interdicition resources available out of Djibouti as part of Operation Enduring Freedom, I wonder how this Somali pirate 'Mothership' came to operate uncontested?!

[Argyll]

With all the maritime interdicition resources available out of Djibouti as part of Operation Enduring Freedom, I wonder how this Somali pirate 'Mothership' came to operate uncontested?!



Unlesss it's related to the GWOT then it's not a priority!!....p-)

[Iceman]

Wars in the Middle East...

Violence breaking out in France...

Piracy...

Are we sure this is the 21st century?

The history is known to repeat itself..... ships and tactics are better today but in the end it´s the same thinking.

[He219]

Unlesss it's related to the GWOT then it's not a priority!!...

What, piracy not considered a form of terror anymore?
Good thing we renamed the GWOT to G-SAVE or "global struggle against violent extremism" in Bible-beltwayese ..
Ahgrr!
p-)

[JoaMei]

What, piracy not considered a form of terror anymore?
Good thing we renamed the GWOT to G-SAVE or "global struggle against violent extremism" in Bible-beltwayese ..
Ahgrr!
p-)

Ok, there are thousands of ships daily leaving or entering that area. Would you want to send a boarding team to every of them or do the job yourself?

Think of the german auxilary cruisers in WW 1 and 2, its not easy to find the wulf among the sheep. Especcialy if it is dressed like a sheep.
p-)

[wulfstan]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/05/africa_enl_1131453888/img/laun.jpg

I would love to light those fvckers up with a .50 cal, can you imagine the carnage? Leave em for the sharks...

[He219]

Ok, there are thousands of ships daily leaving or entering that area. Would you want to send a boarding team to every of them or do the job yourself?

Think of the german auxilary cruisers in WW 1 and 2, its not easy to find the wulf among the sheep. Especcialy if it is dressed like a sheep.
p-)
^ Well, this isn't even the same situation as with the commerce raider- SMS Emden (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMS_Emden) in WWI.

This is 2005 (the last time I checked) and we have very sophisticated remote sensing techniques to track and intercept shipping in the horn of africa from small dhows to North Korean SCUD missiles smuggled in freighters.


Are you telling me that a Somali pirate mothership operating exclusively near Aden would not fall into the OEF dragnet patrolling in the area for years now and that some small PMC corporation could allocate more resources than the allied powers already have in theater?
;)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v101/He219/newest/pix/22ff9827.jpg

The frigate Emden (ironic, isn't it) leaves the naval port of Wilhelmshaven, northwest Germany, Wednesday, Jan. 2, 2002. Six German navy ships joined the U.S.-led war on terrorism Wednesday, setting off to patrol seas off the Horn of Africa in Germany's largest naval deployment since World War II. Two frigates and four support ships carrying 750 marines slipped out of the North Sea port of Wilhelmshaven on a mission to protect shipping and cut off any routes used by terror groups.(AP Photo/Joerg Sarbach)
http://www.marine.de/02DB070000000001/CurrentBaseLink/W26JDA7K897INFODE/$FILE/DEU_LUEB%20b-640x379.jpg

Fregatte LÜBECK (in See im Golf von Aden), 11/19/2005, Presse und Informationszentrum Marine - Außenstelle Djibouti.
Die deutsche Fregatte LÜBECK hat im Golf von Aden das Kreuzfahrtschiff MS DEUTSCHLAND begleitet. Das Schiff der Deutschen Marine informierte die Führungscrew des Traumschiffs u.a. über die Situation im Seegebiet. Die LÜBECK setzte nach gemeinsamen Fahrmanövern ihren Auftrag im Rahmen des Einsatzes ENDURING FREEDOM am Horn von Afrika weiter fort.

[usm2b]

When the world starts relying on private military's the world turns to sh*t. Didn't anybody learn anything from Splinter Cell Chaos Theory????

[Aerosoul]

When the world starts relying on private military's the world turns to sh*t. Didn't anybody learn anything from Splinter Cell Chaos Theory????

yes. nightvision is indeed, pimp.

[Hemaworstje]

totally agree on that private army's.. when you disgust pirates, but love buccaneers, then you think wrong.
this is like mopping a floor with the tap open, also happens around the Fillipines,Indonesia etc.
I don't want to spend one lousy tax cent to protect them , hire the escortvessel as a bodyguard and put it on their pricetag or take a short detour whatever.

I think its just fine by me that these rich people get a glimpse of the reality in this world instead of looking at the other way. ( oh it's tuesday , well then this must be Somalia, cute entertainment at 12 on the solardeck with fire works ).

[Kaapeli]

Why do ppl need to cruise near the Somali coastline anyway. It's not like there's anything to see there or you couldn't go around it.
Unless it's an adventure cruise and you want to have a shootout with tribal pirates.

[ed316]

Why do ppl need to cruise near the Somali coastline anyway. It's not like there's anything to see there or you couldn't go around it.
Unless it's an adventure cruise and you want to have a shootout with tribal pirates.

under age *** voyage

[JoaMei]

When the world starts relying on private military's the world turns to sh*t. Didn't anybody learn anything from Splinter Cell Chaos Theory????

So, your view on the world is in fact based on computer games?

Somehow I already knew that.....
:|

[usm2b]

So, your view on the world is in fact based on computer games?

Somehow I already knew that.....
:|

And how did you know that, stalker?

and i was being sarcastic, I would prefer Marines hand out that ass whipping then paying a "corporation" to do it.

[Argyll]

And how did you know that, stalker?

and i was being sarcastic, I would prefer Marines hand out that ass whipping then paying a "corporation" to do it.

And the cost of deploying Marines on a warship playing Hunt the Pirates is how much?

At the end of the day,if there's a takedown,does it really matter who gets the credit?

[usm2b]

And the cost of deploying Marines on a warship playing Hunt the Pirates is how much?

At the end of the day,if there's a takedown,does it really matter who gets the credit?


Probably less then hiring a corporation, either way taxpayers still pay.

[Pulsar]

only the weapons change, violence and aggresion never stops - its human nature

[Kaapeli]

I think there are more political problems with having military units there. Somalia doesn't exactly have a good reputation in USA and I think you also need some official permission to operate there anyway (if these raids actually happened inside Somalias waters)?

[XTC]

well then this must be Somalia, cute entertainment at 12 on the solardeck with fire works ).

rofl rofl rofl

[Kekkonen]

"Top Cat Marine Security and President Abdullahi Yusuf of Somalia establish new
Somalia Coast Guard and Security Forces." Seems like this goes far beyond just patrolling a little. I assume they will be given the authority to do pretty much what they want since they act under Somali law as the authority.

[Yosy]

I wonder HOW they are going to do it. It's very difficult to spot pirates: they look, dress and act as fishermen. And in Somalia is very frequent to find people with AK-47s. it should be the IMO doing something about this, not a PMC. But, as with many things in the UN, nothing gets done quickly.

[Argyll]

Yosy,
What makes you think that hte company given the task doesn't have the means to carry this out?.......they've obviously met the criteria asked for,and also obviously have the assets available to conduct their missions!!

As for the cost,well I don't know why people keep saying it's their taxes that will pay for it anyway,when they don't have a clue as to who,or where the finances come from for the PMC's to win the contract.
The cost of putting PMC's in the region are probably a lot less than it is to have Marines based on a Warship........last time I looked,a Warship ran into Billions in cost,say they were on an Arleigh Burke class frigate,that has a value of what?.......then you have the entire crew,not just Marines to pay,that's how many men? Then you have it's daily running costs,which I'm willing to bet are also not inexpensive,then you have to have logistical support in the form of other ships,oh and I'm guessing they'll have full compliments of crew too,and they'll have daily running costs,Fuel,Food etc too............so you see,it's not going to be as expensive giving this role to a PMC as you might think.

$50 million was awarded by the Somali's..........not by the USG,it probably costs that to have a Frigate and crew at sea for 60 days anyway!!

[easyand]

One of our frigates is in the arabic sea since September to escort ships from Somali pirates, there is also a navy SF team on board...

[mudbunny]

"One could wonder if the company would ever see the full amount of money for thier services... maybe not but thats a lot of cash for a poor country.

I don't think there even is a central government in place in Somalia the last few years. Could be that this is done pro bono..."

The lack of any accountability to any government is troubling here. Say these merc contractors mistakingly kill civilians thinking that they are pirates, who is accountable?

[Argyll]

If it doesn't concern you then keep your nose out of it!!

[JoaMei]

"One could wonder if the company would ever see the full amount of money for thier services... maybe not but thats a lot of cash for a poor country.

I don't think there even is a central government in place in Somalia the last few years. Could be that this is done pro bono..."

The lack of any accountability to any government is troubling here. Say these merc contractors mistakingly kill civilians thinking that they are pirates, who is accountable?

I dont think they will kill anybody that doesnt try to kill them before....

And if someone is shooting at me I dont give a **** if he is a pirate, smuggler, terrorist or somebody "innocent".

They are officialy acting as the somali coast guard and under control of the central goverment. That goverment isnt exactely controling the whole country but it is the only one they have.

[usm2b]

If it doesn't concern you then keep your nose out of it!!


Well! Isn't that the awnser for everything... so the next bitching session about the president or america..guess what, your not american so keep your nose out of it. ;)

[Argyll]

I work for an American corporation.....;)

This is a Somali issue,it has nothing to do with your taxes paying for it!!

[dacanadianbomb]

Yeah, whats up with people saying their dime is going for it ?
I dont think we have many somali users here :-)
And it really doesnt matter ROE whise whether you are being shot at by ronald macdonald , the fisherman from down the bay or Milli Vanilli, if he shoots at you, you shoot at him.
Seems logical doesnt it ?
Or is anyone for getting shot at and asking nicely for them to stop ?

[Yosy]

Yosy,
What makes you think that hte company given the task doesn't have the means to carry this out?.......they've obviously met the criteria asked for,and also obviously have the assets available to conduct their missions!!


It will be really expensive to control all these ****ers. When ships go into pirate-dangerous waters (like Somalia, Malaca Strait, etc) every crew member (except those in the engine room, obviously) is on the lookout for possible pirates trying to board the ship, and some still manage to do it.

[Argyll]

The only people on the lookout are those on duty watch,it's not Holywood movies,ships have radar as an aid,it's not a case of all hands on deck when in dangerous waters..........trust me,I've mates at sea,and they say it's not an everyday occurence,the Pirates pick and choose their targets

[Yosy]

The only people on the lookout are those on duty watch,it's not Holywood movies,ships have radar as an aid,it's not a case of all hands on deck when in dangerous waters..........trust me,I've mates at sea,and they say it's not an everyday occurence,the Pirates pick and choose their targets

No mate you're wrong. The radar is of very little help, because there are loads of false echoes; the pirates are just like fishermen and they follow the philosophy of "if you want to hide a tree, put it in a forest". Your only defence is people on the bow, stern, port and starboard - the pirates lauch arpoons to the deck so they can climb aboard; when that happens the sailors just go there and detatch the arpoons.

This is reliable, I study in a Merchant Marine Academy.

[usm2b]

Yeah, whats up with people saying their dime is going for it? I dont think we have many somali users here :-)


Ohhhhh, so the mighty somali gov't is financing this 50million dollar party? Or maybe its the somali citizens who pay their taxes. Oh sh8t I forgot...the Somali's don't have a friggin gov't and I doubt that the warlords realy handed over 50million bones if they even have that to stop their own pirates.

And....I will admit my taxes aren't directly paying this, but Uncle Sam just doesn't pull 50 million popsicles out his a8s. He takes them out of my paycheck and when I buy things he charges me extra. But, I guarantee that atleast 1 zillionth of a cent probably came from my pocket...but hey your canadian so you aren't paying anything.

[Argyll]

Go back to page one and read the part again where it says Somali Government.............you need to stop thinking,that the whole world is funded by Uncle Sam!!!!!..............why are you assuming it's Uncle Sam that's pulling money out his ass?.........There's not a single mention of America,other than the company that's been given the contract.....and if the funds are coming from the UN,then sorry but the Canadians are paying..!!

Yosy,
I said radar is an aid,a good operator can distinguish false echoes,Before I went to Iraq ,I was, amongst other things a fisherman,I know all about false images/echoes......and the crew of ships don't line the decks,because all of the crew have responsibilities,for the daily running of the ship,and besides it's small vessels with very little crew they're attacking,not the huge compliment ships,besides even large ships over 30,000 tonnes have a small crew due to modernisation,and technology.

[Kaapeli]

Well there is sort of a government in a part of Somalia and the other side is in anarchy. But I still find it difficult to believe that they would have 50 million to spare and hire foreign troops.

[usm2b]

Go back to page one and read the part again where it says Somali Government.............you need to stop thinking,that the whole world is funded by Uncle Sam!!!!!..............why are you assuming it's Uncle Sam that's pulling money out his ass?.........There's not a single mention of America,other than the company that's been given the contract.....and if the funds are coming from the UN,then sorry but the Canadians are paying..!!

alright...alright, I can take a hint when someone is a little pissed..., and I can admit that I was wrong by some of your points...but, I didn't know that the funds are comming from the UN...and I didn't know the US doesn't pay fees to the UN!!!!!!

[Argyll]

I said IF the funds are coming from the UN.........I didn't say they were...the funs are coming from the Somali Government,you know there's more than one country in the world that's put monies into Somalia mate,and then there's corporations on top of that,then there's the entrepaneurs.......get off your high horse that Uncle Sam does it all!!.....p-)

[Yosy]

Yosy,
I said radar is an aid,a good operator can distinguish false echoes,Before I went to Iraq ,I was, amongst other things a fisherman,I know all about false images/echoes......and the crew of ships don't line the decks,because all of the crew have responsibilities,for the daily running of the ship,and besides it's small vessels with very little crew they're attacking,not the huge compliment ships,besides even large ships over 30,000 tonnes have a small crew due to modernisation,and technology.

I was a cadet on a 5.000 GRT container ship (pic below) that had a crew of 12 (I think) and they're not always doing stuff on the ship. Specially on long hauls, most of the time is spent looking out and seeing just a big blue sea all around you.

http://www.transinsular.pt/navinsular3.jpg

This is the kind of ship that pirates might target. And the false echoes can be a killer for the eyes, experienced or not. Specially those old, orange monitors.

[usm2b]

I said IF the funds are coming from the UN.........I didn't say they were...the funs are coming from the Somali Government,you know there's more than one country in the world that's put monies into Somalia mate,and then there's corporations on top of that,then there's the entrepaneurs.......get off your high horse that Uncle Sam does it all!!.....p-)


Bah! Fine!






:)

[KB]

US Navy captures suspected pirates off Somali coast
Sat Jan 21, 6:14 PM ET

DUBAI (*******) - U.S. Navy vessels pursued a suspected pirate ship in the Indian Ocean off Somalia's coast and fired warning shots to capture its crew on Saturday, U.S. Navy Forces Central Command said.

The guided missile destroyer Winston S. Churchill and other U.S. naval forces located the vessel after receiving a report of an attempted act of piracy, but it failed to respond to orders to stop.

"Churchill began aggressive maneuvering in an attempt to stop the vessel. The vessel continued on its course and speed. (Then) Churchill fired warning shots," said a Navy statement.

"(Later) Churchill fired additional warning shots, and at that time the crew of the suspect pirate vessel established communications by radio and indicated that they would begin sending personnel to the Churchill via their small boat in tow."

The crewmembers were seized and U.S. Navy sailors who boarded the vessel discovered small-arms weapons on board, the statement said. It did not say how many suspects were held.

Piracy has become epidemic in the unpatrolled waters off the coast of lawless Somalia, where at least 23 hijackings and attempted seizures have been reported since mid-March.

Somalia has been without a central government since 1991, when rival warlords ousted Mohamed Siad Barre.

In November, the Somali government signed a two-year deal worth $50 million with a U.S. marine security firm in a bid to end piracy.

[Chulo]

i thought that a private firm was hunting the pirates down..

[AceoFBase]

Somalia has been without a central government since 1991, when rival warlords ousted Mohamed Siad Barre.

In November, the Somali government signed a two-year deal worth $50 million with a U.S. marine security firm in a bid to end piracy.


Do they have a government or not?

[chuckster]

Maybe they can hang the pirates from the top of the Churchill's highest mast. :)

[n4292936]

Do they have a government or not?
In Mogadishu I believe there is a semi-recognised power of sorts. The remaining provinces and outlying areas, including somaliland in the north are run autonomously by seperate groups/warlords/gangs/factions. The North has been agitating for defacto independence for some time now apparently. The longer they remain outside a formal system of governance the more reticent they will be to obey on imposed on them.

Piracy has been around for eons in this area - it has little to do with the lack of governance in Somalia

[ArmedPacifist]

Maybe they can hang the pirates from the top of the Churchill's highest mast. :)

If I am not mistaken I believe they still have the right to do so.

[SHAM]

i thought that a private firm was hunting the pirates down..

Private firm hunting pirates in international waters? Isnt that called being a pirate aswell?

[Darth Vidar]

Well, in the old days they did let the pirates try ‘dancing the hempen jig’.

and then:

http://www.piratesinfo.com/detail/detail.php?article_id=56

“After the hanging, the bodies of the less significant crew members, were buried face down, below the high water mark, or left hanging until three tides had passed over them. The bodies of the most notorious captains, were often embalmed in tar, encased in an iron framework or chains, and hung from a gibbet in a conspicuous place by the water edge, where they swayed in the wind, until nothing was left. This served as a frightening example to those leaning towards the tempting rewards of piracy”.

[AirCommando]

Private firm hunting pirates in international waters? Isnt that called being a pirate aswell?

Korsars? Like Sir Francis Drake 1540-1596. A Pirate on the order of Queen Elizabeth.

@chulo_allen
I think they train the coast guards of Djibouti and other states near the gulf of somalia and the red sea. I don´t think so that this guys go to priates-hunt for their own war.

[ED209]

U.S. Navy Seizes Pirate Ship Off Somalia p-)
By JIM KRANE , 01.22.2006, 10:20 AM


http://images.forbes.com/media/assets/spacer_white.gifThe U.S. Navy boarded an apparent pirate ship in the Indian Ocean and detained 26 men for questioning, the Navy said Sunday. The 16 Indians and 10 Somali men were aboard a traditional dhow that was chased and seized Saturday by the U.S. guided missile destroyer USS Winston S. Churchill, said Lt. Leslie Hull-Ryde of U.S. Naval Forces Central Command in Bahrain.

The dhow stopped fleeing after the Churchill twice fired warning shots during the chase, which ended 87 kilometers (54 miles) off the coast of Somalia, the Navy said. U.S. sailors boarded the dhow and seized a cache of small arms.

The dhow's crew and passengers were being questioned Sunday aboard the Churchill to determine which were pirates and which were legitimate crew members, Hull-Ryde said.

Sailors aboard the dhow told Navy investigators that pirates hijacked the vessel six days ago near Mogadishu and thereafter used it to stage pirate attacks on merchant ships.

The Churchill is part of a multinational task force patrolling the western Indian Ocean and Horn of Africa region to thwart terrorist activity and other lawlessness during the U.S.-led war in Iraq.

The Navy said it captured the dhow in response to a report from the International Maritime Bureau in Kuala Lumpur on Friday that said pirates had fired on the MV Delta Ranger, a Bahamian-flagged bulk carrier that was passing some 320 kilometers (200 miles) off the central eastern coast of Somalia.

Hull-Ryde said the Navy was still investigating the incident and would discuss with international authorities what to do with the detained men.

"The disposition of people and vessels involved in acts of piracy on the high seas are based on a variety of factors, including the offense, the flags of the vessels, the nationalities of the crew, and others," Hull-Ryde said in an e-mail.

Piracy is rampant off the coast of Somalia, which is torn by renewed clashes between militias fighting over control of the troubled African country. Many shipping companies resort to paying ransoms, saying they have few alternatives.

Last month, Somali militiamen finally relinquished a merchant ship hijacked in October.

In November, Somali pirates freed a Ukrainian ore carrier and its 22 member crew after holding it for 40 days. It was unclear whether a US$700,000 ransom demanded by the pirates had been paid.

One of the boldest recent attacks was on Nov. 5, when two boats full of pirates approached a cruise ship carrying Western tourists, about 160 kilometers (100 miles) off Somalia and fired rocket-propelled grenades and assault rifles.

The crew used a weapon that directs earsplitting noise at attackers, then sped away.

Somalia has had no effective government since 1991, when warlords ousted a dictatorship and then turned on each other, carving the nation of 8.2 million into a patchwork of fiefdoms.

[Resurrection]

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=69503

[EsoognomEhT]

My unit had a tour of the Churchill last year while we were in America, great ship. The petty officers mess is made to look like an English pub, complete with pumps and everything. Not connected sadly

http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/albums/mongoose/aae.sized.jpg

[Hawaii_Light]

yeah the American navy only allows one beer for every 90 days of sea deployment. bugger for them.

[Johnny_H02]

Well, in the old days they did let the pirates try ‘dancing the hempen jig’.

and then:

http://www.piratesinfo.com/detail/detail.php?article_id=56

“After the hanging, the bodies of the less significant crew members, were buried face down, below the high water mark, or left hanging until three tides had passed over them. The bodies of the most notorious captains, were often embalmed in tar, encased in an iron framework or chains, and hung from a gibbet in a conspicuous place by the water edge, where they swayed in the wind, until nothing was left. This served as a frightening example to those leaning towards the tempting rewards of piracy”.

Dude awsome find ive been reading this site for like a hour now ahaha its great thanks woot

Anyone have any idea what this is about ?

Recently, the pirates attacked a British registered racing yacht off the coast of Somalia. The small pirate craft fired a mortar at the yacht in the Gulf of Aden, and some of the pirates attempted to board the vessel. Fortunately, the pirates quickly fled when a container ship and a Canadian Navy vessel came to the yacht's rescue. http://www.piratesinfo.com/detail/detail.php?article_id=50

[Scottie]

A private firm? Any information on that?
Or is it just the US Navy being hired by the Somalis?
or an actual Security Contracting firm?

[Johnny_H02]

I think we should go after Pirates like back in the good old days, get the Royal Navy after them!

I think it would be sweet!

[SHAM]

A private firm? Any information on that?
Or is it just the US Navy being hired by the Somalis?
or an actual Security Contracting firm?

It couldnt happen, not in international waters, unless ofcourse they were just sinking them and saying nothing about it.
Private firms are employed in certain companies to provide security onboard some vessels in certains oceans / seas of the world.

[remo williams]

I'd say they were eligible for a trip to davey jones' locker.

[ed316]

Pirates seize South Korean trawler





(CNN) -- Pirates hijacked a South Korean trawler off the coast of Africa on Tuesday, escaping into Somalia's territorial waters after threatening the ship's crew, the U.S. Navy reported.
The 160-foot fishing vessel Dong Won 628 was nearly 70 miles off the Somali coast when its crew reported coming under fire, the Navy said in a written statement.
The guided-missile destroyer USS Roosevelt and the Dutch frigate Zeven Provincien attempted to intercept the ship before it entered Somali waters, but backed off after the pirates threatened the trawler's crew with guns, the Navy said.
Navy spokesman Cmdr. Jeff Breslau told The Associated Press that when the Dong Won turned toward Somalia, one or both of the U.S. and Dutch ships fired warning shots in its direction. Members of the South Korean crew were then seen on the deck of the Dong Won with guns pointed at them, so the U.S. and Dutch ships pulled back, he told AP.
"The top priority is the safety of innocent lives," the Navy statement said.
Somalia has been without a functioning central government for 15 years, and shipping insurer Lloyd's of London listed it as a "hot spot" for piracy in 2005. The targets are often U.N. World Food Program vessels carrying relief supplies and are frequently held for ransom.
Coalition officials fear Somalia could become a haven for the al Qaeda terrorist network, and a multinational task force has patrolled the waters off the Horn of Africa since late 2001. The Zeven Provincien is the task force's current flagship.
In March, two U.S. warships exchanged fire with suspected pirates off the coast, killing one and wounding five, the Navy said.
And in November, pirates aboard a speedboat fired rocket-propelled grenades at a 440-foot luxury cruise liner operated by Seabourn Cruise Lines. No one was hurt, and the liner's captain was able to get away before the pirates could board the ship.
CNN's Caroline Faraj contributed to this report.

Copyright 2006 CNN. All rights reserved.This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. Associated Press (http://www.cnn.com/interactive_legal.html#AP) contributed to this report.

http://images.clickability.com/pti/spacer.gif
Find this article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/africa/04/04/pirates/index.html

[saigonsmuggler]

What does a Korean trawler doing there to begin with? There are plenty of other safer water to fish! :roll:

[JoaMei]

Not to mention Al kaida is growing there in Somalia completely out of reach right now. :roll:

[ed316]

I bet they were doing some illegal fishing.

[JoaMei]

What does a Korean trawler doing there to begin with? There are plenty of other safer water to fish! :roll:

Safer yes, but because there is no extensive Fishing in Somali waters it is much more profitable. And 70 miles is quite far away from coast.

[sp2c]

translated from the Dutch ministry of defence website




http://www.mindef.nl/binaries/kaping%20b_tcm15-61538.jpg

Today the Royal Netherlands navy has acted with the Hr. Ms. Zeven Provincien to avoid a hijacking in the Indian Ocean at the height of Somalia

In the morning the Hr. Ms. Zeven Provincien recieved a warning about the hijacking of a Korean ship the 'Dong Won', that had set course in the direction of the Somali coast. Together with the Americans on board the ship USS Roosevelt the Hr. Ms. Zeven Provincien has applied presure on the hijackers in order to avoid the hijacking.

Both ships have fired warningshots, but the hijackers were not impressed. Just before the hijacked ship reached territorial waters, where the international ships can not go, they returned fire from the hijacked shops, but both naval vessels did not sustain any damage from this,

The Dutch and American vessels that are part of the Task Force 150 had done all they could, without endangering the crew of the hijacked vessel.

The Netherlands currently commandse 'Task Force 150', a maritime component of the operation 'Enduring Freedom'. from on board the Zeven Provincien. Main task of the unit is to combat terrorism in the waters around the Arabian Peninsula and the Indian Ocean.
http://www.mindef.nl/actueel/nieuws/2006/04/20060404_kaping.aspx

http://www.mindef.nl/binaries/kaping%20a_tcm15-61539.jpg

[saigonsmuggler]

Safer yes, but because there is no extensive Fishing in Somali waters it is much more profitable. And 70 miles is quite far away from coast.
hey as in life, you calculate your risk and u choose your path... sometime u make profit, sometime u get your head handed to you.

They chose poorly.

[AFJROTC55]

maybe I'm thinkin too D3LTA/SEALS but I say wait for night and try to board, i mean, these somalis cant be all that well armed or trained, however I cant honestly say what should go down because I'm not savy with the tactical situation but who knows, and an affair this small might not warrant a SOF callout.

1*

[vlun]

the south koreans have awesome UDT seals. they are badasses, and they train regularly with us navy seals. I think it warrants a standby for them.
vman

[remo williams]

Not to mention Al kaida is growing there in Somalia completely out of reach right now. :roll:
I know I've stated the same in threads past.It's only a matter of time before they are a formidible presence there. Fishing seems to be a little fishy. Isn't the coast of somalia a little bit of a trek from Sk? Anywho I'd be curious to see how long it takes for the ship to be liberated.And don't forget besides Rok and SEAL's I believe the Dutch have a formidible spec ops group also.p-)

[Scrat335]

When are we ever going to get rid of this enabling mentality?


Members of the South Korean crew were then seen on the deck of the Dong Won with guns pointed at them, so the U.S. and Dutch ships pulled back, he told AP.
"The top priority is the safety of innocent lives,"

Now the pirates know they can get away with it.:cantbeli:

[sp2c]

what would you have had them do?

shoot their guns out of their hands with 127mm shells?

[Scrat335]

Fishing seems to be a little fishy. Isn't the coast of somalia a little bit of a trek from Sk?

Those guys go all over the world. Usually in fleets, 6 or 8 trawlers and a factory ship. We had some illegally fishing off the Washington coast last year for Salmon. Japanese are big on it too.

[kinghk]

translated from the Dutch ministry of defence website

"Both ships have fired warningshots, but the hijackers were not impressed. Just before the hijacked ship reached territorial waters, where the international ships can not go..."



Why not? Somalia is no country, it is a anarchy with borders. What are they going to do about it if some Dutch naval vessels enters it terrotorial water?

[sp2c]

They will call the social party back home and they will camp out in front of the ministry of defence chanting dirty slogans

[Scrat335]

what would you have had them do?


Anything but let them go. Stop them and make it very clear that if the hostages died, they would be fishbait too. You can't be pansies with people like that. It emboldens them. Perhaps follow them back to the place where they came from and tell the people there that if the hostages are not freed immediately everything in sight will be destroyed.

Get tough.

[Bert]

I bet they were doing some illegal fishing.
Yeah. Those 'pirates' were just the law-enforcing 'Somalia Coast Guard'. They're environmentally aware. Damn right-wing neocon warhawk insertpoliticalbuzzwordhere media labelling them as pirates.

[sp2c]

Anything but let them go. Stop them and make it very clear that if the hostages died, they would be fishbait too. You can't be pansies with people like that. It emboldens them. Perhaps follow them back to the place where they came from and tell the people there that if the hostages are not freed immediately everything in sight will be destroyed.

Get tough.
but how???

there's nothing they could've done except sink the ship or board the ship, both would've led to high amounts of civilian casualties

best thing they can do is track the pirates, wait for them to release the hostages and then sail up to their harbor for a little gunboat diplomacy :D

[Mr Gently Benevolent]

I am not really sure if SK have a fisheries agreement with Somaliland but other nations do such as Yemen, I know every one thinks that it’s a big deal for fishing vessels to be working this far from home but its no big deal really, US (mostly flagged in Panama) and Spanish crews on Tuna pursers work away for about 8 month maybe even a year in the Indian Ocean.

[Scrat335]

best thing they can do is track the pirates, wait for them to release the hostages and then sail up to their harbor for a little gunboat diplomacy

Don't allow the pirates to think we will negotiate. Do like the Israelis do with hijackers, no talking. Let them know who is boss.

[sp2c]

This is not Hollywood, we do and will negotiate (well the south Koreans in this case probably will) if that saves lives

[Chucky]

Foreign Navies, Islamist Rise Deter Somali Pirates

More foreign navy patrols and the anti-piracy stance of Mogadishu’s new Islamist rulers have stemmed a wave of attacks in Somali waters that reached record proportions last year, a maritime group said on Aug. 2.

Despite several attempts, there have been no successful pirate attacks off the Horn of Africa since June, said Andrew Mwangura, coordinator of the Kenya-based Seafarers Assistance Programme, which monitors sailors’ welfare in the region.

That compares with four successful attacks before June, and 45 in 2005: the worst year in several decades of monitoring.

Read More:
http://www.defencetalk.com/news/publish/Foreign_Navies_Islamist_Rise_Deter_Somali_Pirates.php

[AFJROTC55]

i thought i read somewhere that Topcat MarSec, was gonna get contracted to go down and protect the routes and if not then straight attack the pirates, anybody else or am i imagining things

1*

[Beer Monster]

i thought i read somewhere that Topcat MarSec, was gonna get contracted to go down and protect the routes and if not then straight attack the pirates, anybody else or am i imagining things

1*

I think they won the contract to train/equip the Somali Coast Guard. See here (http://www.topcatmarinesecurity.com/tcms_pr9.html) for details.

[AFJROTC55]

ah, thankyou very much, initially i thought i heard they were taking an active roll in combating the threat, this however sounds more pheasible.

TH4x for the link

1*

[ed316]

Somali pirates captured by U.S. Navy get 7 years each

POSTED: 10:27 a.m. EST, November 1, 2006


MOMBASA, Kenya (AP) -- Ten Somali pirates who were captured by the U.S. Navy after hijacking a ship off their country's lawless coast were sentenced Wednesday to seven years in prison each.
The men, who were convicted October 26 of hijacking, could have received life sentences for seizing the Indian-based vessel, the Safina Al Bisaarat, in January.
Piracy is rampant off the coast of Somalia, which has no effective government of its own to respond. The Horn of African nation has been in chaos since warlords overthrew a dictator in 1991 and turned on each other.
Defense attorney Hassan Abdi said he would appeal the sentences. The suspects said during their trial that they were stranded fishermen who had been abducted from their boat.
U.S. sailors, who are part of an anti-terrorism task force based in Djibouti, detained the pirates on January 22 in an operation involving U.S. military helicopters and a warship that fired several warning shots. They were handed over to Kenyan authorities on January 29 and the trial was held at the main courthouse in Mombasa.
The U.S. Navy had been responding to a hijacking report from the International Maritime Bureau in Kuala Lumpur. They began tracking the Safina, and captive crew members displayed signs indicating a radio frequency they would use to communicate.
Another sign had the word "help" written on it.
Indian ship hijacked 2 days into voyage

The ship's Indian captain told the U.S. sailors that his vessel had been hijacked two days after leaving the Somali port of Kismayo en route to Dubai, United Arab Emirates. The pirates were armed with pistols, assault rifles and rocket propelled grenades.
During the trial, which began in February, Capt. Akbar Ali Suleiman said they had tried to outrun two speedboats used by the pirates. He said once the pirates boarded the vessel they beat up sailors and demanded money. The sailors were held captive for six days before being rescued.
U.S. sailors who searched the ship found an AK-47 assault rifle but the pirates threw most of their weapons into the sea when they spotted a U.S. Navy ship.
Days earlier the pirates tried to seize the MV Delta Ranger, a bulk carrier sailing under the flag of the Bahamas, 320 kilometers (200 miles) off the eastern coast of Somalia.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/africa/11/01/somali.pirates.ap/index.html

[MaydayJohnson]

just shoot them like the somalies were going to do if they borded the vessell.

thats why its a good idea to keep a rifle and a pistol if you go sailing in ****ty waters.

[jimmymac]

Pirates Sunk by Somali Islamists

http://www.spiegel.de/international/0,1518,433233,00.html

[ozz]

Is there even an active government at all in Somalia? Or after Mogadishu did everyone just give up on it?

[jimmymac]

Islamists have taken over most of Somalia. They have the interim government besieged and want them out. Sharia law is active in most areas, hence pirates have given up stealing. They are also starting again with Ethiopia and Kenya.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/6103494.stm

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601085&sid=azgnoY5KkCPQ

[AIC "Powder"]

It's nice to see they finally charged some of these guys. The Somalia pirates that fired on us (USS Gonzalez) got released with no charges.

[gustavski]

from the article it seem that the U.S fear that the interference from ethiopia might escalate regional war but from my point view is more than regional war it will escalate religious war between somalia and ethiopia, this kind of things really motivate jihadist to come over somalia to fight...

[jimmymac]

Fears of a wide scale war in Horn of Africa abound. Remember this is next door to Egypt which is very volatile after tensions resulting from the governments initial opposition to Hizbollah resistance of last summers Israeli invasion of Lebanon. The princes in Saudi Arabia, which is just across the Red Sea are also suffering from insecurity after their opposition to the now very popular Hizbollah. Would an Islamist revolt in the Horn of Africa not spread a bush fire that would burn all the way to Baghdad?

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,20687412-5005961,00.html

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L01588267.htm

[Satellite Weapon]

Is there even an active government at all in Somalia? Or after Mogadishu did everyone just give up on it? Somalia is well know for its poverty, chaos and anarchy

[ozz]

Yea, I know I've seen the documentaries, and heard enough stories. I was just wondering there was any government at all, from what I understood it was just Mogadishu and the area around it that were complete chaos. I guess it is the whole country though.

[Fiber]

[QUOTE=ed316;2043726]...Days earlier the pirates tried to seize the MV Delta Ranger, a bulk carrier sailing under the flag of the Bahamas, 320 kilometers (200 miles) off the eastern coast of Somalia...

320km is pretty far out to sea. What kind of vessels does these pirates use?

[darkninja]

Gator gets some against Somali pirates



By Andrew Scutro - Staff writer
Posted : Tuesday Jun 5, 2007 17:25:15 EDT
The dock landing ship Carter Hall shot flares, fired warning bursts and unleashed a volley that set fire to three skiffs towed behind a hijacked Danish cargo ship off Somalia on Tuesday, but it could not prevent the freighter from slipping out of international waters and towards a known pirate camp, the Navy said.
The Danica White, a Danish-flagged merchant vessel with a crew of five, was hijacked by pirates early Saturday in view of a French warship that could not cross into Somali territorial waters to offer help. The Danica White never radioed for assistance, but the Carter Hall called to ask if it needed help, said Lt. John Gay, a spokesman with Navy Forces Central Command in Bahrain.
“They made several calls and tried to hail the ship,” he said. “They responded they were under control of pirates.”
The hijacked ship then tried to get the Carter Hall to change course so it could proceed to Somali waters unobstructed, which was when American sailors spotted at least one armed man on the freighter’s bridge wing, Gay said. That’s when the amphib’s guns opened fire.
“The USS Carter Hall fired flares and several shots across the bow as well as several disabling shots at the three skiffs in tow,” he said. “They shot at the skiffs and they caught on fire.”
Sailors used the ship’s .50-caliber machine guns, 7.62 mm miniguns and 25 mm Bushmaster cannons in the encounter, Gay said.
“As long as they’re in international waters, they can engage,” he said.
But the hijacked Danica White made it into Somali waters and the Carter Hall had to back off and watch.
“We’re observing them at this point,” Gay said. “It’s ongoing.”
The Carter Hall, a ship designed to haul Marines and their gear, left its homeport of Naval Amphibious Base Little Creek, Va., on April 10 without a Marine contingent on what was described as catch-all “maritime security operations” in the Middle East. Gay said the Carter Hall is in the waters off eastern Africa specifically for “anti-piracy search operations.”
The waters off the vast coastline of lawless Somalia has proved a hazardous passage in recent years, with several pirate attacks on commercial shipping as well as cruise ships. Combined Task Force 150, a maritime force of warships from several allied nations, patrols the Gulf of Aden, Gulf of Oman, the Red Sea, the Arabian Sea and Indian Ocean against pirates and other transnational threats. Carter Hall is currently assigned to CTF-150.
On Friday, a U.S. Navy destroyer is reported to have bombarded a terrorist position in Somalia, although officials would not provide any details.






Just wish they could have gone after these "people" in a real hard way...whats with not being able to cross into Somali waters if you're chasing international criminals? I don't get it...

[Galileo]

Because the JAG lawers says : "Don't do that"

[SineJustitia]

Hey, I think I've heard this story before...

USN & RNLN vs The Law (http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/africa/04/04/pirates/index.html)

It's really nonsense. Just ask Somalia "hey, you guys mind if we help you get rid of your piracy problem?" and they will say yes. Especially if we give them some aid, or threaten to stop giving them aid.

International Law should be about improving safety, not about preventing it.

[Andrew Chalmers]

International Law should be about improving safety, not about preventing it.

International law is more concerned about maintaining the status quo, territorial borders and internal sovereignty than security. It is the western world that pretty much established the rules - and not necessarily the work of lawyers either. Kings, Queens, and Presidents alike would rather not have foreign forces in the pursuant of security violating sovereign borders. "Security" has too often used as a pretext for invasions & governments don't forget it easily.

[2Sheds_Jackson]

I caught a TV show the other day that discussed modern piracy. I was amazed how much of it still goes on. They literally steal entire ships -huge ones too - repaint and rename them (using forged papers) and sell the cargo. Half the time, it's with "inside" help from corrupt customs/military/police officials - so the fox is watching the hen house in much of the developing world. Happens about once a day - and those are just the reported ones (most goes unreported).

[jonoskarinn]

What is this Gator ??? is that a ship ???

[SineJustitia]

Happens about once a day - and those are just the reported ones (most goes unreported).

And there are reports and reports. A merchant colleague of mine once caught a distress signal from a Thai ship just outside some South-Eastern harbour they both were calling, with a perfect English-spoken voice calling for help as that colleague could see some RHIB's coming alongside and masked gunmen entering the vessel. Of course my colleague answered the call, and after some minutes a completely different, broken-English voice stated no help was needed as everything was under control. Of course, the incident was reported to harbour authorities by my colleague, but they bluntly stated nothing had happened and everything was okay with the ship and it's cargo. Upon checking with the IMB in Kuala Lumpur, even the ship owners never reported anything.

Harbour authorities never report anything because they fear ships will choose other ports, and ship owners just take their loses because they'd otherwise face immense increases in insurance premiums.

[oregongrunt]

"fired flares and several shots across the bow"

What a joke, I wouldn't have stopped either.

[2Sheds_Jackson]

Harbour authorities never report anything because they fear ships will choose other ports, and ship owners just take their loses because they'd otherwise face immense increases in insurance premiums.

...that show also said that a lot of times the shipping companies don't report this stuff either, because they can't afford to have a cargo ship with millions in inventory sitting in port somewhere for 2 to 3 weeks while an investigation is conducted. It's cheaper for them to just move on so they can meet the delivery dates they committed to.

[SineJustitia]

Jackson, you remember the name of that show and what station it was aired on? And, since I'm in the outback now, do you know if I can find it somewhere on the internet?

[Briggs]

Like the Somali's would care or have the capacity to control who enters their territorial waters...otherwise there wouldn't be much of a piracy problem.

[Andrew Chalmers]

Like the Somali's would care or have the capacity to control who enters their territorial waters...otherwise there wouldn't be much of a piracy problem.

You'll be surprised at the number of diplomatic protests, even by "modern civilized" western states that criticize another state for violating their sovereignty because of their own inability to deal with crime.

[Briggs]

You'll be surprised at the number of diplomatic protests, even by "modern civilized" western states that criticize another state for violating their sovereignty because of their own inability to deal with crime.


I'm aware of that. But I don't think the Somali government is in any power to control nor observe who infringes its territorial waters. Nor do I think they would mind it if someone would help with the piracy problems and nor do I believe they'd b*tch a lot against the US coz of the military aid & assistance it gets (through Ethiopia and more directly). Diplomacy thinks of that as well.

I know, there's the principle of non intervention in domestic issues and the principle of sovereignty and blablabla...I've been studying nothing but that the past days...you could look at it from a INTL Law focuspoint or from a normative perspective. I'm looking it more from a normative perspective and a realist perspective..

[jimmyboots]

Jackson, you remember the name of that show and what station it was aired on? And, since I'm in the outback now, do you know if I can find it somewhere on the internet?

I remember seeing something similar on the History channel. I don't remember the name, but it was a series, it had a show on DSS ops in Liberia, very interesting.

[usa320]

like somalia has a government anyways...they shoulda just crossed in and done battle.

haha and his name was Lt. John GAY.

[Galileo]

WFP has thanked France for its proposal to provide naval escorts to protect ships carrying food off the Horn of Africa from pirate attacks.

“We are grateful to the Government of France for this generous offer, which would reduce the threat of piracy and allow WFP to feed more hungry people in Somalia,” said WFP Executive Director Josette Sheeran at UN headquarters in New York.

Sheeran also thanked the multinational coalition naval force off Somalia for its increased surveillance in recent months and said she hoped it will continue.

High-level action

WFP and the International Maritime Organization (IMO) have jointly appealed for high-level international action to stamp out piracy in waters off Somalia, following a series of attacks including on two vessels that had just unloaded WFP food in Somalia.

In 2005, an upsurge of piracy in Somali waters, including the hijacking of two ships contracted for WFP, forced the UN agency to suspend all deliveries by sea for some weeks.

Some 80 percent of WFP food assistance for Somalia moves by sea, and pirate attacks have threatened to cut WFP’s main supply route, jeopardizing rations for the 1.2 million people WFP expects to be feeding by the end of 2007.

Attacks

Overall, there were 17 pirate attacks on ships in waters off Somalia in the first half of 2007, compared with eight attacks in the same period last year.

The French proposal envisions a two-month period during which naval vessels would escort ships carrying WFP food assistance as they traverse Somali waters. Ships would be escorted to the entrance of Mogadishu port.

WFP is increasing its food distributions in Somalia so has to ship more food just as the stormy monsoon season is coming to an end, Sheeran said.

Monsoon

Before the onset of the monsoon last June, increasing pirate attacks had cut by half the number of ships available to transport WFP food supplies.

Without escorts, WFP fears the pirates will return as the heavy monsoon seas calm, allowing them to start hunting for ships again.

Most of the pirate assaults did not appear aimed at seizing cargo but rather designed to force ship owners to pay ransom for vessels and crew held hostage.

The pirates are highly mobile, manning fast vessels and using satellite position-fixing gear to attack ships far out at sea, sometimes more than 200 nautical miles off the Somali coast.

http://www.wfp.org/english/?ModuleID=137&Key=2655

[SineJustitia]

Godsped France!

Blue-water counter-piracy is highly recommended. However, what will be their Somali TTW-mandate...? Escorting al the way to port will only be effective if they have more ROE's than the usual self-defence. And no, blasting pirates off other ships does not count as self-defence...

Ah well, it's a start.

[I can't think of a name]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/africa/10/29/somalia.pirates/index.html


WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A U.S. destroyer has entered Somali territorial waters in pursuit of a Japanese-owned ship loaded with benzene that was hijacked by pirates over the weekend, military officials said Monday.
http://i.l.cnn.net/cnn/2007/WORLD/africa/10/29/somalia.pirates/art.uss.porter.navy.jpgThe destroyer USS Porter, shown in 2006, sank pirate skiffs tied to the stern of the hijacked vessel.


http://www.cnn.com/.element/img/2.0/mosaic/base_skins/baseplate/corner_wire_BL.gif


The guided-missile destroyer USS Arleigh Burke entered Somali waters with the permission of the troubled transitional government in Mogadishu, U.S. officials said. In recent years, warships have stayed outside the 12-mile limit when chasing pirates.
The ongoing operation was confirmed to CNN by two military officials familiar with the details.
Gunmen aboard two skiffs hijacked the Panamanian-flagged Golden Mori off the Socotra archipelago, near the Horn of Africa, said Andrew Mwangura, a spokesman for Kenya's Seafarers' Assistance Programme.
The Golden Mori radioed for help Sunday night. The Burke's sister ship, the USS Porter, opened fire and sank the pirate skiffs tied to its stern before the Burke took over shadowing the hijacked vessel.
When the shots were fired, it was not known the ship was filled with highly flammable benzene. U.S. military officials indicate there is a great deal of concern about the cargo because it is so sensitive.

[KillerBD]

Nice, go USN

[bd popeye]

Outsatnding job by the Navy I love. I will post some pics if the USN releases any.

[KillerBD]

Off Topic, but anyways: bd popeye what ship did you serve on when in the Navy and/or where were you stationed?

[Calanen]

For those who are interested, the USN can do this because of the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea:


Article105
Seizure of a pirate ship or aircraft


On the high seas, or in any other place outside the jurisdiction of any State, every State may seize a pirate ship or aircraft, or a ship or aircraft taken by piracy and under the control of pirates, and arrest the persons and seize the property on board. The courts of the State which carried out the seizure may decide upon the penalties to be imposed, and may also determine the action to be taken with regard to the ships, aircraft or property, subject to the rights of third parties acting in good faith.

[helomech]

Good on the Swabbies,I'm sure there's more pirates out in the waters' nearby to be had....

[Noble713]

Awesome work! Somali pirates seem to pick the strangest targets IMO. They need to work on their intel.

[170/1]

Does anyone know what sort of ship the pirates were attacking / hijacking. I know that in recent times piracy has been targetted towards increasing numbers of cruising yachts etc that are sailing north towards the Suez.

[[WDW]Megaraptor]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/africa/10/30/somalia.pirates/index.html


(CNN) -- A crew battled pirates in a deadly fight Tuesday to regain control of a North Korean cargo ship off Somalia, the U.S. Navy said. The Navy is still chasing a second ship held by pirates in the area.

When the fight aboard the Dai Hong Dan was over, two pirates were dead and five others were captured, the Navy said, citing initial reports from the crew. Three seriously injured crew members were transferred to the destroyer USS James E. Williams, according to the Navy.

Pirates had seized the ship's bridge while the crew was holed up in engineering and steering compartments, the Navy said.

After the Navy received a radio report revealing the commandeered ship's location, the Williams steamed to intercept the Dai Hong Dan, ordering the pirates via bridge-to-bridge radio to give up their weapons.

At that point, crew members stormed the bridge, sparking the deadly battle. After the crew regained control, Navy sailors boarded the Dai Hong Dan to help with the injured.

The incident took place about 70 miles northeast of the Somali capital, Mogadishu, the Navy said.

It is the second incident of piracy reported in recent days. A second U.S. Navy destroyer was searching waters off Somalia hunting for pirates who hijacked a Japanese-owned ship, military officials said.

Over the weekend, gunmen aboard two skiffs hijacked the Panamanian-flagged Golden Nori off the Socotra archipelago near the Horn of Africa, said Andrew Mwangura, a spokesman for the Kenyan-based Seafarers' Assistance Program.

[jedisponge]

Sailors on the North Korean ship were injured during a struggle to regain control of the bridge, which had been seized by the pirates. The US Navy boarded the boat after control was restored by the sailors to render aid to the apparent North Korean sailors that were injured

No US personnel were injured.

[dedbunniez]

^ ^
Link? Also, I would hate a shootout on a ship....

[Jarhead]

Go Navy, get em

[jedisponge]

It's in the link above.


At that point, crew members stormed the bridge, sparking the deadly battle. After the crew regained control, Navy sailors boarded the Dai Hong Dan to help with the injured.
Unless my reading skill has deteriorated to a very sad level, that's what I got from the article.

Though you can fault CNN a little for this thread's misleading title, as whenever they "update" an article, they add updated snippets here and there. Sometimes this creates a retarded mess of reports that tend to repeat specific news bits a few times, or worse.

[[WDW]Megaraptor]

It's in the link above.


Unless my reading skill has deteriorated to a very sad level, that's what I got from the article.

Though you can fault CNN a little for this thread's misleading title, as whenever they "update" an article, they add updated snippets here and there. Sometimes this creates a retarded mess of reports that tend to repeat specific news bits a few times, or worse.

OK...so those were North Korean crew members of the hijacked ship that stormed the bridge?

On the first reading I thought they meant that it was a boarding party of the crew members of the US Destroyer that stormed the bridge. I guess it's not quite clear...

[TR1]

A US navy aiding a NK ship, interesting scenario.

[jedisponge]

It's not clear at all.

The news about the North Korean boat seizure was added to the original story about the Panamanian flagged "Golden Nori" seizure, which was added to a story about a Japanese ship that was seized over the weekend, which was an article created either Saturday or Sunday.

So in reality, this specific news page is a few days old that had more recent news added to it, and hence why it's a bit hard to read. Hence why I get frustrated at some CNN articles.

Anyway, this line (to me) shows US sailors weren't involved in the storming of the bridge:


After the crew regained control, Navy sailors boarded the Dai Hong Dan to help with the injured.

The fact that they differentiated "crew" and "Navy sailors" leads me to believe that American sailors weren't involved in the initial scuffle. This doesn't mean that the American sailors had any tougher of a job. In any event like this, I would assume everyone went in on high alert, like during this boarding in case any pirates weren't yet secured.

Edit: Plus, I'm sure if any Americans were killed, with reasonable/concrete evidence proving it, CNN would have made a nice, big and bold headline declaring it so.

[dedbunniez]

thanks for the explanation.

[[WDW]Megaraptor]

The fact that they differentiated "crew" and "Navy sailors" leads me to believe that American sailors weren't involved in the initial scuffle. This doesn't mean that the American sailors had any tougher of a job. In any event like this, I would assume everyone went in on high alert, like during this boarding in case any pirates weren't yet secured.

OK I think you're right. In fact, if you click the link it seems CNN has edited the article to clarify this:


North Korean crew recaptures hijacked vessel

The crew members of a North Korean freighter regained control of their ship from pirates who hijacked the vessel off Somalia, but not without a deadly fight, the U.S. Navy reported Tuesday.

Three wounded crew members from the cargo ship were being treated aboard the guided-missile destroyer USS James E. Williams.


Will the mods change the thread title please?

Of course as you say, the Navy was still involved. Apparently the North Koreans decided it would be a good time to try and retake the ship when they saw the USS James E Williams closing in.

[fish&chips]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7069026.stm

And there was much confusion. BBC says it's a South Korean vessel, also there's no mentioning of the USN in their article:


Pirates 'overpowered' off Somalia

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44203000/gif/_44203918_somalia_aden_oct07.gif
A group of pirates that hijacked a South Korean cargo ship in the waters off Somalia have been overpowered by the crew, according to one official.

The ship's capture was reported on Tuesday morning by the East African Seafarers' Assistance Programme.
But a few hours later, the programme's Andrew Mwangura said the ship's 22 crew had regained control of the vessel.
Somalia is notorious for piracy. Only Indonesia's waters are considered more ****e to pirate attacks.
Only on Monday, a Japanese vessel was seized off the East African coast.
After Tuesday's hijack, militiamen demanded a $15,000 (£7,250) ransom to free the vessel, said Paddy Ankunda, a spokesman for African Union troops in the Somali capital Mogadishu.
"The hijacking was masterminded by the same people who were supposed to bring it into the dock," he said.
The freighter had apparently unloaded its cargo - thought to have been sugar - by the time of its capture.
Mr Mwangura said the crew were sailing the ship back to Mogadishu after defeating the pirates.
"I hear the crew on the ship overpowered the gunmen. The crew were 22 while the gunmen were eight," he said.

[[WDW]Megaraptor]

"I hear the crew on the ship overpowered the gunmen. The crew were 22 while the gunmen were eight," he said.

And not only that, but according to BBC we have an extra gunman here...CNN reported 2 killed 5 captured, where did they get 8 from?

[velvet-cream]

We need good old fashioned marines to storm these vessels!!!

[Roaming East]

No Yardarm to hang captured pirates off of but im sure it would be a funny sight to string them to the Communications gear.

[kakitsubata]

South Korean Foreign Ministry announced that this wasn't South Korean vessel. While I think they are incompetant, I don't think even they would pubically deny such a thing unless they were sure.

Hmm, I suppose it's always possible that this was a special purpose ship under military or intelligence command. It's not that unusual to find North Korean military presence in Africa.

[I can't think of a name]

Damn pirates!!

[bd popeye]

As promised here's a pic of one of the pirate boats on fire after being struck with a USN 25mm. I will post any other pix if they are released by the USN.

http://www.dezh.de/imghosting/f1200e0106b35544563f4d5baacfd36a.jpg


INDIAN OCEAN (Oct. 28, 2007) - A pirate skiff burns after being hit by several rounds from a 25mm gun aboard guided-missile destroyer USS Porter (DDG 78). The skiff belonged to a group of pirates that boarded Panamanian-flagged cargo ship MV Golden Nori. U.S. Navy photo (RELEASED) Download HiRes (http://www.navy.mil/management/photodb/photos/071028-N-0000X-185.jpg)


http://www.dezh.de/imghosting/5cfb38d7a6dbaece124153479b3b39ca.jpg


INDIAN OCEAN (Oct. 28, 2007) - Members of the visit, board, search, and seizure (VBSS) team aboard guided-missile destroyer USS Porter (DDG 78) prepare their gear in case they must board a pirated vessel. The ship was responding to a distress call from aboard Panamanian-flagged cargo ship MV Golden Nori. The VBSS team is tasked with boarding suspicious ships to inspect them for any illicit activity. U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist 3rd Class Patrick Gearhiser (RELEASED) Download HiRes (http://www.navy.mil/management/photodb/photos/071028-N-4014G-002.jpg)

[LazerLordz]

So it's pirates vs the Fleet once more..

Go get em Navy.

[highdiver_2000]

I hope the NK sailors are ok and not get into any further trouble when they go home!

[LazerLordz]

I hope the NK sailors are ok and not get into any further trouble when they go home!

X2.

I hope they're not charged for receiving assistance from the imperialist pigs, and letting down the grand marital spirit of the Great Leader by allowing pirate scum to board their vessel of victory.



rofl

[Kaplanr]

Since it's harder to hang them, can they put the pirates in the skiff before they sink it?

[bd popeye]

A couple of more PIX concerning this matter of the Pirates.

http://www.dezh.de/imghosting/9b3c26d4d4c95f8a389144ded3cbdace.jpg


ARABIAN SEA (Oct. 30, 2007) - Boarding team members from guided-missile destroyer USS James E. Williams (DDG 95) head toward North Korean cargo vessel Dai Hong Dan to provide medical assistance. Pirates hijacked Dai Hong Dan Oct. 29, and the crew was able to regain control of their vessel before contacting the Williams for medical assistance. U.S. Navy photo (RELEASED)

http://www.dezh.de/imghosting/8dfbfa8aedfa2dc44254fc0461938c25.jpg


ARABIAN SEA (Oct. 30, 2007) - North Korean cargo vessel Dai Hong Dan transits off the coast of Somolia after the ship hijacked by pirates Oct. 29. The crew was able to regain control of their vessel before contacting guided-missile destroyer USS James E. Williams (DDG 95) for medical assistance. U.S. Navy photo (RELEASED) Download HiRes (http://www.navy.mil/management/photodb/photos/071030-N-0000X-001.jpg)

[Mastermind]

Day-UM! What a story! I remember reading somewhere that all NK ships at sea have military personnel as members of crew to keep possibilities of defections under control. The Muslim Pirates seem to have finally picked on the wrong damn boat.

I wrote a small letter to the State Dept some time ago suggesting we equip old freighters as "Q" ships...a few 37mm gats and some shoulder fireds manned by U.S. Marines and Navy personnel...and let these vessels ply around in those piratical waters....And would be nice to have a carrier group just over the horizon. The only ROE = Engagements should never produce captured pirates. I understand these waters are infested with large man eaters, too.

As for the NK getting into trouble...I doubt their Beloved Leader would be over dissappointed...considering the number of congratulations no doubt pouring in. I bet also, those ex-pirates are gonna need some dental work and a few may be getting colostomies from getting the siht kicked out of them..

AARGH!

[Galileo]

Pirates have boarded a luxury French yacht off the coast of Somalia, taking its all 30 crew hostage, a French military spokesman said.

The Ponant yacht "was the victim of an act of piracy", Christophe Prazuck was quoted as saying by AFP news agency.

The spokesman added that the vessel was sailing between Somalia and Yemen and had no passengers on board.

Somali coastal waters are among the most hazardous in the world, despite the presence of US navy patrols there.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7331290.stm

[Evolv5]

Somali pirates seize French yacht


http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/44217000/jpg/_44217615_pirates_ap203b.jpg Piracy is a major problem for shipping off Somalia

Pirates have boarded a luxury French yacht off the coast of Somalia, taking its all 30 crew hostage, a French military spokesman said.
The Ponant yacht "was the victim of an act of piracy", Christophe Prazuck was quoted as saying by AFP news agency.
The spokesman added that the vessel was sailing between Somalia and Yemen and had no passengers on board.
Somali coastal waters are among the most hazardous in the world, despite the presence of US navy patrols there.
Last year, pirates seized more than 25 ships in the area.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7331290.stm

A luxurious yacht according to the BBC.

[Ghostryder]

Bonjour, Monsieur Commando Hubert.

[boy1000]

Bonjour, Monsieur Commando Hubert.

Was thinking the same.....

France is not known to be friendly to persons who do things like this. Also with Djibouti around the corner I am guessing the pirates need some lessons on International Security policy....

Damn this is stupidity .....

[Galileo]

A maritime patrol plane and an aviso (Commandant Bouan) are currently tracking the ship, at least 10 pirates are aboard the ship and the french governement lauch the plan 'Pirate Mer' (Sea Pirate).

The Ponant:
http://www.yachtsgreece.com/charter/crewed/m-s/le_ponant/images/le_ponant.jpg

[G2Monkey]

it would be nice to see the French solution to this. Hopefully they'll get straight into it with no messing around. :)

[Benhurmarcel]

Bonjour, Monsieur Commando Hubert.

This is more the GIGN I would say, this is the team that is dedicated to the CTM.

[The Dane]

Something has too be done about that country at some point..:roll:
Next NATO mission?

[SineJustitia]

People, please! These are no rowdy pirates! These are gentle eco-protectionists....



February 5, 2008, 12:41 pm

A Green Jolly Roger? A Pirate Claims Environmental Concerns

By Mike Nizza (http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/author/mnizza/)

The latest pirate attack off Somalia, (http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5ipMHyUWWbt0DgJ6MbFCi3HeMrqFwD8UJIMOO0) which hit the news on Monday, took an odd turn today as a radio station published a report (http://www.garoweonline.com/artman2/publish/Somalia_27/Somalia_We_are_not_pirates_say_ship_hijackers.shtml) on its Web site with a sublimely contradictory lede paragraph:
The spokesman of a group of gunmen who hijacked two ships off of Somalia’s northeastern coast has said that they are not pirates.

No? Then what are they, exactly?

“We are the gentlemen who work in the ocean … since the [Somali] civil war began the ocean has been our Mother,” the man said.

[… The] “group’s name is the Ocean Salvation Corps, and they are a group of Somali nationalists who took it upon themselves to protect the country’s shores.”

While environmentally minded pirates might make a nice complement to the bishops who today (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/7226488.stm) urged followers to cut their carbon footprint for Lent, there was no way to verify the spokesman’s identity or what he said. (more) (http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/02/05/a-green-jolly-roger/)

Right. Now let's call in the Force Naval, secure the crew, passengers and ship (hey you gotta admit; these pirates got taste), and scuttle their skiffles without quarter.

[Hispeed1]

I hope the French kick their butts. I'm so tired of all the crap that the bad guys in Somalia do. I wish Somalia would get straightened out. Wishful thinking again just like for N. Korea.

[Meph]

I don't understand why noone has wiped these pirates out. It seems easy enough to bait them into coming close and then a few 50cals should end them quick.

[The Dane]

I pretty sure TF 150 is on the case.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combined_Task_Force_150

[Yosy]

I hope the crew gets out of this safely and that the french commandos kill these psychos. These pirates are assassins, psychopats that don't hesitate to kill us mariners, just for a few bucks.

[Semeru]

This definitely sounds like GIGN's type of gig, especially after they succesfully boarded the Pascal Paoli awhile back. However Mr. Hubert did some boarding with Delta on the Achille Lauro so I guess this one is up for grabs by either of them.

[Pooterman]

that ctf150 thing sounds like rainbow 6

[Kaapeli]

Why do people sail near the Somali coast? It has the worst pirate problem in the world at the moment. There is simply no reason to sail so close to the coast that the ships could easily be reached by these fastboats.

Anyway my guess is that France will negotiate. A commando rescue operation would be too risky for the hostages. Although I have no doubt that France has both the capability and will to solve the problem with force if the situation allows it.

[TimBa]

...where's Captain Jack Sparrow when you need him?

[Bulletproof]

The cruise ships have to keep a distance of 300 miles between them and the Somali coast when they pass there. What were they thinking?

[Hawaii_Light]

Im pretty sure there is a legitimate navigation reason, because so many ships are going through that area, perhaps to avoid a storm, or they were following a current?

[Galileo]

The cruise ships have to keep a distance of 300 miles between them and the Somali coast when they pass there. What were they thinking?

Look at a map and tell me how you can be at 300mn of Somali coast when you must go to the Suez canal from Indian Ocean?

[Rob1bureau]

This definitely sounds like GIGN's type of gig, especially after they succesfully boarded the Pascal Paoli awhile back. However Mr. Hubert did some boarding with Delta on the Achille Lauro so I guess this one is up for grabs by either of them.
Usually such an op is commanded by a HQ made of GIGN, commando Hubert and Marine Nationale (Navy) elements and involve both units. The GIGN commander directs the assault, and Hubert chief commands the search, hostage evacuation and the steerage of the ship.

Never heard of Hubert guys involved in the Achille Lauro affair. Never heard of D-Boys boarding the ship, nor SEAL Team 6 nor anyone at all.

[JJHH]

What the hell were they doing there sailing? That's not asking for trouble, that's inviting the trouble.

[Galileo]

What the hell were they doing there sailing? That's not asking for trouble, that's inviting the trouble.

Look at the map, you can see some civilain ships currently on the zone, there a lot of them, you must pass on the Gulf of Aden when you want to go to Indian ocean from Mediterranean.

http://www.sailwx.info/shiptrack/shiplocations.phtml?lat=13&lon=54.5&radius=1541

[CombatBoots]

I've heard that these pirates might be using bigger vessels than fastboats and zodiacs to support their operations... So supposedly 300nm is not a sure limit to feel safe by. Shame that crews can't be armed better.

This area could be a test of a navy's capability to face a terror threat from the sea, if they find themselves unable to control the boats in the region and finding the guns and pirates, they'll fail to do so in homewaters too.

[mas-36]

So what is the latest news from France? Any word or conformation of a anti-terrorist operation or rescue attempt?

[Martel]

So what is the latest news from France? Any word or conformation of a anti-terrorist operation or rescue attempt?
Heard yesterday that there was some GIGN guys in Djibouti. There are also many commandos around in TF150.
But operations in closed environment like ships is a real nightmare ...

[Galileo]

The aviso Bouan and an helicopter are tarcking the ship, apparently they are waiting she reach the Somali waters (and probably the island where the pirates have their base) and no more offical informations.

[Martel]

interesting picture posted on :
http://athena-et-moi.blogspot.com/2008/04/puisque-lon-parle-de-piraterie.html

http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/9146/unpiracymapfo6.jpg

[Kaapeli]

Doesn't France have a special group meant for these operation in particular.
"Escouade de contre-terrorisme et de libération d'otages". Apparently it's a French navy CT and hostage rescue unit for maritime operations.

[CombatBoots]

No change yet... Current course is towards Eyl in Puntland.
They will not reach land, last thing you want is these people on the move through Somalia with the hostages. I hope the pirates remain hopeful and that any operation against them will go swift and smooth.

[-Church-]

This is more the GIGN I would say, this is the team that is dedicated to the CTM.

I agree, I think hijacking a ship in France is technically considered an act of terrorism.


Anyway my guess is that France will negotiate. A commando rescue operation would be too risky for the hostages. Although I have no doubt that France has both the capability and will to solve the problem with force if the situation allows it.

Well yeah at first but right now the whole world is looking at France and the way she's gonna answer. Safety for the hostages goes first but if theres no way of getting what we want the diplomatic way they'll resolve to do what they have to do.

Also doing nothing or giving in would invite other incidents like that.

[Mordoror]

I agree, I think hijacking a ship in France is technically considered an act of terrorism.

not the point here
GIGN is the only entitled to sea actions to recue hostages
there is other SF units that are specialized in sea and boarding actions (Commandos marines for example) but their procedures are entitled to be anti-drug or anti-illegal fishing or anykind of illegal operations, not to hostage rescue

If any action occurs then the GIGN could have the back up of some of these units (there is already a Commando Marine unit in Djibouti and some commandos marines on any of the 12 french navy ships in the area) however action procedures are not the sames

Consequence, the standard procedure in a hostage issue for the GIGN is negotiation first so there will be a negotiation

Moreover boarding a ship covered with pirates heavily armed would not be easy either with a helo drop or with fast boat boarding so for the safety of our crews and gendarmes i will prefere that the pirates surrender themselves by negociation and psy ops pressure

[xav]

Navy commandos can perfectly rescue hostage without GIGN:

The Escouade de contre-terrorisme et de libération d’otages (ECTLO, “counter-terrorist and hostages rescue squad”), formerly named Groupe de combat en milieu clos (GCMC, “close quarters combat group”) is a special operations group of the French Navy specialised in maritime anti-terrorism. It is mainly composite of circa 30 men, split in two groups of 15 people, one under Commando Jaubert command, the other under Commando Trepel command.

The GCMC was founded in 1994, in the tradition of the former Élément léger d’intervention spéciale (ELIS, “special intervention light unit”). It is under direct command of COFUSCO. It has been renamed ECTLO in 2001.

The then-GCMC, backed by the commando Hubert and other units, is credited with the arrest of Momcilo Krajisnik in April 2000.

[xav]

Latest devlopments

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.meretmarine.com%2Farticle.cfm%3Fid%3D107333&langpair=fr%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8



Attacked yesterday afternoon in the middle of the Gulf of Aden, french Ponant yacht under the control of pirates, left international waters to enter the territorial waters of Somalia. It was sailing this afternoon, a dozen kilometres of coastline. "We received permission from the Somali authorities to follow," said Herve Morin on Saturday, Minister of Defence. The cruise ship of the Compagnie des Iles du Ponant is currently followed by the Commandant Bouan, an aviso from the Navy, and regularly over by military aircraft. Pistés, hackers have not yet decided to join one of their bases, but continue to remain at sea For the time being, the negotiation is preferred in order not to endanger the lives of the crew, 32 sailors, twenty of whom were French. Even with specially trained commandos to regain control of vessels hijacked, the success of a collision is, in fact, not guaranteed. There is therefore no question of risking a bloodbath on board the three-masted french flagged. However, this afternoon, the French authorities said that no contact had yet been reached with the pirates. The latter should, as every diversion off the coast of Somalia, require a high ransom to the owner, on this case, the CMA CGM Group, to release the crew.
88 meters long, the Ponant was attacked by a dozen armed men as he came from the Seychelles and was proceeding without passenger, to the Red Sea and the Mediterranean. Built in 1991, the luxury yacht is one of three units of IPC, a company created in Nantes two decades ago and again in 2005 by the group Maritime french CMA CGM.
Regarded as one of the areas most infested by pirates, the Horn of Africa has experienced 31 attacks on civilian vessels in the past year, mostly cargo.


Plus CNN article for those who dont like translated news http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/africa/04/05/cruiseship.pirates/index.html

[Rob1bureau]

GIGN is the only entitled to sea actions to recue hostages
Definitively false. Commando Hubert has a section specialized in MCT ops, and ECTLO is able to deal with such a situation. And if you go read the thread about the DGSE combat divers, you'll see guys training for a CT assault on a ship.

[easyand]

Ponant planimetry

http://www.zeco.com/upload/dek_2007-10-01_072116/Le-Ponant.gif

[Mordoror]

Navy commandos can perfectly rescue hostage without GIGN:

The Escouade de contre-terrorisme et de libération d’otages (ECTLO, “counter-terrorist and hostages rescue squad”), formerly named Groupe de combat en milieu clos (GCMC, “close quarters combat group”) is a special operations group of the French Navy specialised in maritime anti-terrorism. It is mainly composite of circa 30 men, split in two groups of 15 people, one under Commando Jaubert command, the other under Commando Trepel command.

The GCMC was founded in 1994, in the tradition of the former Élément léger d’intervention spéciale (ELIS, “special intervention light unit”). It is under direct command of COFUSCO. It has been renamed ECTLO in 2001.

The then-GCMC, backed by the commando Hubert and other units, is credited with the arrest of Momcilo Krajisnik in April 2000.

My wrong, I forgot the GCMC /ECTLO :cantbeli::cantbeli:but AFAIK the MCT hostage rescue team is automatically the GIGN. We are here dealing with hostages, not with a "simple" boat hijacking. and the GIGN has by far the best experience in hostage related situations.
Now no doubt the other team can deal with such kind of thing but as French you should know that a pure military unit (even if you can say that gendarmes are military) is seldom used when civilians are caught in the middle...
As i have said (and as the ECTLO and GIGN used to train together but their every day procedures being different) the navy commandos will certainly provide the back up for the gendarmes ...


And if you go read the thread about the DGSE combat divers, you'll see guys training for a CT assault on a ship.want to be sure we are talking about the same thing
for me a MCT action is different form a hostage rescue MCT action
both involve a boat but both do not involve hostages so sorry to argue but i do not see what DGSE divers could do in that kind of situation

[Kaapeli]

Whatever team or organization deals with it I sincerely hope they kick ass and double-tap those morons who chose to attack innocent people.

[Rob1bureau]

Well, in French military parlance MCT includes cases with hostages...

What's sure, GIGN, Section B/Hubert and ECTLO are all three capable to deal a hostage rescue-MCT op. So three units, not just the GIGN. Standard HR-MCT ops involve both GIGN and commando Hubert (it was the case in the Pascal Paoli affair).

Other commandos marine are able to do a VBSS. DGSE exact capabilities are unknown, just a photo of guys boarding a ship with a zodiac.

[Mordoror]

@Rob1bureau
Thanks for fixing the point

[sweeperone1975(ger)]

hi all,
i ve seen on german news tv that a french luxury yacht
has been boarded and the french navy is thinking about
rescue the hostages.


http://www.spiegel.de/panorama/justiz/0,1518,545566,00.html

greetings from sweeperone1975(ger)

[mikec62001]

It's a repost

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=131726