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hist2004
10-10-2008, 10:58 AM
They came, they saw, then left the Afghan war without a single mission

09 October 2008

By Jerome Starkey in Kabul

GERMANY has admitted its Special Forces have spent three years in Afghanistan without doing a single mission, and are now going to be withdrawn.

More than 100 soldiers from the elite Kommando Spezialkrafte regiment, or KSK, are set to leave the war-torn country after their foreign minister revealed they had never left their bases on an operation.

The KSK troops were originally sent to Afghanistan to lead counter-terrorist operations.

But Frank-Walter Steinmeier, the foreign minister, admitted they had not been deployed "a single time" in the last three years, despite a desperate shortage of Special Forces units in the country.

Troops from Britain's Special Boat Service and the SAS work round the clock, across Afghanistan, alongside US navy Seals and Delta Force, to target terrorists, arrest drug lords and rescue hostages.

The KSK were part of the US-led Operation Enduring Freedom, which spearheads the international hunt for Osama bin Laden.

Senior military officials last night blasted the KSK commanders for keeping the troops in camp. One western military official accused Germany of "sitting on the sidelines while the rest of the world fights".

He said: "It's just unbelievable to think there have been 100 highly-trained troops sitting doing nothing for three years, while everyone else has worked their socks off. It's no good sending troops if they don't do anything. They might as well have stayed at home."

Another source said: "It's ludicrous that they would be here and not contributing."

Berlin is under almost constant pressure from the rest of Nato to increase its troop contribution and scrap special national caveats which prevent German troops deploying to volatile parts of the country, like Helmand. Last year it emerged that Norwegian troops, fighting alongside their German allies, were forced to abandon a battle at tea-time because German pilots refused to fly emergency medical helicopters in the dark.

Mr Steinmeier claimed the KSK's inactivity as an excuse to withdraw the Commandos from Afghanistan.

He said: "That's why the KSK element should be taken out of the OEF mandate."

Berlin was set to renew the KSK mission for another year in November, but they are now expected to fly home instead.

A spokesman for Operation Enduring Freedom said: "We don't have enough troops in Afghanistan."

But, he added: "Common sense says if they weren't being used, they won't be missed."

The KSK revelations came as Nato's leading commanders were renewing their calls for more troops.

Angela Merkel, the German chancellor, agreed to send an extra 1,000 troops to Afghanistan this week, but they will be confined to the north of the country which is relatively safe.

Most of Germany's troops are based in Mazar-e Sharif, at an airbase complete with a series of bars and a nightclub. Nato wants Germany to do more in Afghanistan, but the mission is deeply unpopular with German voters.

Mr Steinmeier told Der Spiegel newspaper: "You cannot just keep piling elements on without taking a critical look at our current responsibilities."

BACKGROUND

SOME 40 countries contribute troops to the 47,600-strong Nato mission in Afghanistan, led by the United States with some 18,000 troops and Britain with more than 8,000. Germany is the third largest contributor. The US is set to send an extra 14,000 troops to Afghanistan next year, and it has been rumoured there are British plans to send 4,000 more.

It is still British, American, Canadian, Dutch, Australian and Danish soldiers who bear much of the combat weight in the country, alongside the soldiers of the Afghan national army. A recent French deployment led to the death of ten soldiers in a Taleban ambush, leading to widespread calls to withdraw the troops.

Source (http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/world/They-came-they-saw-.4573584.jp)

Another view:

German Commandos Withdrawn From Afghanistan

October 9, 2008: Germany is pulling its commandos out of Afghanistan. The KSK commandos have been there for most of the last seven years. Many Germans, especially leftist politicians and journalists, have not been happy with that. This has resulted in several unflattering, and largely inaccurate, articles about the KSK in the German media. There was also an investigation of several KSK men, accused of kicking an Afghan prisoner. While the KSK were allowed to fight, they also operated under some restrictions. They generally could not fire at the enemy unless first fired upon. This led to at least one senior Taliban leader getting away from the KSK. The fleeing Taliban honcho was not firing at the pursuing KSK, so the commandos could not take him down.

Germany sent 120 KSK commandos to Afghanistan in late 2001. They were not given their own area of operation, but worked with American special forces and commandos as needed. The KSK commandos are the first German troops to engage in combat since 1945 (not counting some communist East German military advisers who may have had to defend themselves in places like Africa. German peacekeepers in the 1990s Balkans have not had to fight.) KSK's achievement was celebrated in late 2001, when a supply of quality German beer was flown in for the troops.

The KSK were respected by their fellow special operations soldiers, and particularly liked because the Germans were sent beer rations (two cans a day per man). The KSK troops would often share the brew with their fellow commandos, which sometimes resulted in favors in the form of special equipment or intel data. Even with the restrictions, the KSK saw lots of action, but little of it was publicized, lest it generate more criticism back home.

Source (http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htsf/articles/20081009.aspx)

The Dane
10-10-2008, 11:01 AM
Pathetic....

Silent Reader
10-10-2008, 11:04 AM
It has already been stated in several threads that the KSK only was not active under the OEF command.. they had (and i guess will continue to have) more than a few missions under ISAF command.

KSK was available for OEF but the US never used them for any missions but instead complained that Germany was not active in the south of Afghanistan although the German special forces could have been used there...

LineDoggie
10-10-2008, 11:07 AM
Ummm, didnt KSK get a US Navy Presidential Unit Citation for A-Stan in 2004?

How & or why would they get that with never getting into operations?

Something aint Jiving......

The Dane
10-10-2008, 11:09 AM
It has already been stated in several threads that the KSK only was not active under the OEF command.. they had (and i guess will continue to have) more than a few missions under ISAF command.

KSK was available for OEF but the US never used them for any missions but instead complained that Germany was not active in the south of Afghanistan although the German special forces could have been used there...

Well why send home then ? I'm pretty sure RC(S) could find some work for them...

Bulletproof
10-10-2008, 11:10 AM
This is pathetic indeed, but think about these guys, doing nothing (or small missions) for 3 years in the middle of nowhere, must be boring.

Silent Reader
10-10-2008, 11:13 AM
Well why send home then ? I'm pretty sure RC(S) could find some work for them...

as far as i remember it was never said that they would be sent home.. just that their mission under OEF would not continue which is more a publicity stunt since OEF is quite unpopular in Germany anyway. this means they still will be in Afganistan under ISAF or national/German command afaik

and concerning the south... they could have been used in the south for the past 3 years.. but nobody there gave them any missions

Alex-L
10-10-2008, 11:34 AM
as far as i remember it was never said that they would be sent home.. just that their mission under OEF would not continue which is more a publicity stunt since OEF is quite unpopular in Germany anyway. this means they still will be in Afganistan under ISAF or national/German command afaik

and concerning the south... they could have been used in the south for the past 3 years.. but nobody there gave them any missions

I highly doubt that a Special Operations force was in a country that could have used their skills and they were never given any missions.

And in the longshot of that happening, did anybody ever ask for a mission?

Additionally, do we know if this story is even true?

LazerLordz
10-10-2008, 11:55 AM
Who's to say that they have not conducted clandestine ops outside of the public domain?

Hmm..

Silent Reader
10-10-2008, 11:59 AM
Who's to say that they have not conducted clandestine ops outside of the public domain?

Hmm..

well our Foreign minister and Vice-Chancellor Mr. Steinmeier said that they have not been used under OEF command for the last three years. he himself said that KSK should be withdrawn from OEF - not withdrawn from Afghanistan! And as i mentioned.. they had operations in Afghanistan.. just under ISAF command. The article above is bs because it makes it look like KSK did nothing and now leaves Afghanistan.. and neither is true...

Source (German): Click (http://www.tagesschau.de/inland/afghanistaneinsatz102.html)

hist2004
10-10-2008, 12:05 PM
The article above is bs because it makes it look like KSK did nothing and now leaves Afghanistan.. and neither is true...

Source (German): Click (http://www.tagesschau.de/inland/afghanistaneinsatz102.html)

You didn't read the article I posted after the original for balance to the story....p-)

Hist2004

The Dane
10-10-2008, 12:18 PM
There are proberly some restrictions in KSK's mandat that makes them useless. SF units and regular infantry in Southern and Eastern Afghanistan is pretty hung up... Denmark sending a SF unit to RC(S) for hitting Taliban in their safehavens and SAS, SBS, Delta and many others SF's are already in the thick of it. There's some national restriction on KSK that make commanders use other units... ?

LazerLordz
10-10-2008, 12:24 PM
well our Foreign minister and Vice-Chancellor Mr. Steinmeier said that they have not been used under OEF command for the last three years. he himself said that KSK should be withdrawn from OEF - not withdrawn from Afghanistan! And as i mentioned.. they had operations in Afghanistan.. just under ISAF command. The article above is bs because it makes it look like KSK did nothing and now leaves Afghanistan.. and neither is true...

Source (German): Click (http://www.tagesschau.de/inland/afghanistaneinsatz102.html)

Alright, thanks for the clarification. So that means they have conducted ops, but just not under OEF auspices?

Carib
10-10-2008, 12:24 PM
well our Foreign minister and Vice-Chancellor Mr. Steinmeier said that they have not been used under OEF command for the last three years. he himself said that KSK should be withdrawn from OEF - not withdrawn from Afghanistan! And as i mentioned.. they had operations in Afghanistan.. just under ISAF command. The article above is bs because it makes it look like KSK did nothing and now leaves Afghanistan.. and neither is true...

Source (German): Click (http://www.tagesschau.de/inland/afghanistaneinsatz102.html)


thanks for clearing that up

James
10-10-2008, 12:50 PM
Ummm, didnt KSK get a US Navy Presidential Unit Citation for A-Stan in 2004?

How & or why would they get that with never getting into operations?

Something aint Jiving......

2004 was more than 3 years ago.

James
10-10-2008, 12:52 PM
well our Foreign minister and Vice-Chancellor Mr. Steinmeier said that they have not been used under OEF command for the last three years. he himself said that KSK should be withdrawn from OEF - not withdrawn from Afghanistan! And as i mentioned.. they had operations in Afghanistan.. just under ISAF command. The article above is bs because it makes it look like KSK did nothing and now leaves Afghanistan.. and neither is true...

Source (German): Click (http://www.tagesschau.de/inland/afghanistaneinsatz102.html)

Ah, interesting... Many don't realize that there are two parallel chains of command over here. ISAF and OEF are very much separate from each other.

sp2c
10-10-2008, 01:23 PM
and concerning the south... they could have been used in the south for the past 3 years.. but nobody there gave them any missions

with every single nation in regional command south begging everybody and the streetstones for more troops I find this somewhat hard to believe

there's more to this story then we are being told

GETSOME
10-10-2008, 01:32 PM
What a waste of good resources.:roll:

Johnny_H02
10-10-2008, 01:41 PM
My thoughts are with the German soldiers, I'm sure they wanted to participate as much as anyone else. They are only aloud to do as little or as much as their Government allows them to do. As a Canadian civilian I thank those German troops for their efforts regardless of what they did or didn't do while in theater.