South Texas deputies authorized to fire into Mexico

[LaoSexMachine]

South Texas deputies authorized to fire into Mexico

By CHRISTOPHER SHERMAN Associated Press



EDINBURG — Authorities in South Texas said today that they won't be intimidated by increasingly violent drug smugglers, announcing a larger Border Patrol presence and that more heavily armed deputies will be authorized to return fire across the Mexican border.
Operation "River Freedom Denial" will target areas along the Rio Grande in the southern tip of Texas where violence has risen lately with more ground and air resources, said Border Patrol sector chief Ronald Vitiello.
Standing with a Texas Department of Public Safety captain and the Hidalgo County Sheriff, Vitiello cited an exchange of gunfire between his agents and drug smugglers Monday and another incident this week of a smuggler ramming an agent's truck in making his escape.
Hidalgo County Sheriff Lupe Trevino said the deputies he will assign to the operation along the river will all be issued fully automatic rifles and authorized to return fire.
"We are not going to be intimidated by the increased aggression," Trevino said.
He recalled an incident in 2006 when more than 300 shots were fired across the river at his deputies and Border Patrol agents. At that time he decided to pull his deputies back from the river for their safety.
Not this time.
"If fired upon we will respond in kind," he said.
Tension along the border has increased this week with a shootout in downtown Matamoros, Mexico across the river from Brownsville, Thursday afternoon and shots fired at or near the U.S. Consulate in Monterrey, Mexico twice this week. In the first incident, a grenade was lobbed at the consulate that did not explode.
Vitiello and Trevino declined to offer more details about the operation, content with sending a message that law enforcement at all levels along the border is cooperating and will not tolerate violence.
Vitiello attributed the uptick in aggression in part to frustration of drug cartels who are facing a Border Patrol with more manpower and resources.
Cases of violence against Border Patrol agents in the Rio Grande Valley sector have increased for three consecutive years. This year there have been more than 130 incidents including assaults and people throwing rocks at agents, said Border Patrol spokesman Dan Doty.
Violence at this end of the Rio Grande pales in comparison to West Texas where more than 1,100 people have been killed in drug cartel violence this year in Juarez, Mexico, across the river from El Paso.


http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6064257.html

[Bia]

"return fire" should be a galactic rule!

:P

+rep

[Laconian]

There is nothing in anyone's Use of Force policy that I know of that requires the you to be in the same country as the guys taking you under fire. They should have the right to defend themselves.

[D-gin]

"We are not going to be intimidated by the increased aggression," Trevino said.
He recalled an incident in 2006 when more than 300 shots were fired across the river at his deputies and Border Patrol agents. At that time he decided to pull his deputies back from the river for their safety.
Not this time.
"If fired upon we will respond in kind," he said.


Good.


........

[JJB1970]

In a somewhat related border story, the Department of State updated the travel alert for Mexico...


Travel Alert

U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE
Bureau of Consular Affairs

Mexico

October 14, 2008

This Travel Alert updates security information for U.S. citizens traveling and living in Mexico. It replaces the Travel Alert for Mexico dated April 14, 2008, and expires on April 14, 2009.

While millions of U.S. Citizens safely visit Mexico each year, including thousands who cross the land border every day for study, tourism or business, increased levels of violence make it imperative that travelers understand the risks of travel to Mexico, how best to avoid dangerous situations, and whom to contact if one is a victim of crime. Common-sense precautions, such as visiting only legitimate business and tourist areas, avoiding areas where prostitution and drug dealing might occur, and exercising prudence in where one visits during the evening hours and at night, can help ensure that travel to Mexico is safe and enjoyable.

Violence Along the U.S. - Mexico Border

Mexican drug cartels are engaged in an increasingly violent fight for control of narcotics trafficking routes along the U.S. - Mexico border in an apparent response to the Government of Mexico’s initiatives to crack down on narco-trafficking organizations. In order to combat violence, the government of Mexico has deployed military troops in various parts of the country. U.S. citizens should cooperate fully with official checkpoints when traveling on Mexican highways.

Some recent Mexican army and police confrontations with drug cartels have taken on the characteristics of small-unit combat, with cartels employing automatic weapons and, on occasion, grenades. Firefights have taken place in many towns and cities across Mexico but particularly in northern Mexico, including Tijuana, Chihuahua City and Ciudad Juarez. The situation in northern Mexico remains fluid; the location and timing of future armed engagements cannot be predicted.

A number of areas along the border are experiencing rapid growth in the rates of many types of crime. More than 1,600 cars were reportedly stolen in Ciudad Juarez in the month of July 2008, and bank robberies there are up dramatically. Rates for robberies, homicides, petty thefts, and carjackings have all increased over the last year across Mexico generally, with notable spikes in Tijuana and northern Baja California. Cuidad Juarez, Tijuana, and Nogales are among the cities which have recently experienced public shootouts during daylight hours in shopping centers and other public venues. Criminals have followed and harassed U.S. citizens traveling in their vehicles in border areas including Nuevo Laredo, Matamoros, Tijuana, and along Route 15 between Nogales and Hermosillo.

The situation in Ciudad Juarez is of special concern. Mexican authorities report that more than 1,000 people have been killed there this year. U.S. citizens should pay close attention to their surroundings while traveling in Ciudad Juarez, avoid isolated locations during late night and early morning hours, and remain alert to news reports. A recent series of muggings near the U.S. Consulate General in Ciudad Juarez has targeted applicants for U.S. visas. Visa and other service seekers visiting the Consulate are encouraged to make provisions to pay for those services with something other than cash.

U.S. citizens are urged to be alert to safety and security concerns when visiting the border region. Criminals are armed with a wide array of sophisticated weapons. In some cases, assailants have worn full or partial police or military uniforms and have used vehicles that resemble police vehicles. While most of the crime victims are Mexican citizens, the uncertain security situation poses risks for U.S. citizens as well.U.S. citizen victims of crime in Mexico are urged to contact the consular section of the nearest U.S. consulate or Embassy for advice and assistance. Contact information is provided at the end of this message.

Crime and Violence Throughout Mexico

While the largest increase in violence has occurred near the U.S. border, U.S. citizens traveling elsewhere in Mexico should also exercise caution in unfamiliar areas and be aware of their surroundings at all times. Mexican and foreign bystanders have been injured or killed in some violent attacks, demonstrating the heightened risk in public places. In recent years, dozens of U.S. citizens have been kidnapped across Mexico and many cases remain unresolved. U.S. citizens who believe they are being targeted for kidnapping or other crimes should notify Mexican officials and the nearest American consulate or the Embassy as soon as possible. U.S. citizens should make every attempt to travel on main roads during daylight hours, particularly the toll (“cuota”) roads, which are generally more secure. U.S. citizens are encouraged to stay in well-known tourist destinations and tourist areas of the cities with more adequate security, and provide an itinerary to a friend or family member not traveling with them. U.S. citizens should avoid traveling alone, and should carry a GSM-enabled cell phone that functions internationally. Refrain from displaying expensive-looking jewelry, large amounts of money, or other valuable items.

Demonstrations and Large Public Gatherings

Demonstrations occur frequently throughout Mexico and usually are peaceful. However, even demonstrations intended to be peaceful can turn confrontational and escalate to violence unexpectedly. People have died during violent demonstrations, including an American citizen who was killed in Oaxaca in 2006. During demonstrations or law enforcement operations, U.S. citizens are advised to remain in their homes or hotels, avoid large crowds, and avoid the downtown and surrounding areas. Since the timing and routes of scheduled marches and demonstrations are always subject to change, U.S. citizens should monitor local media sources for new developments and exercise extreme caution while within the vicinity of protests. The Mexican Constitution prohibits political activities by foreigners, and such actions may result in detention and/or deportation. Therefore, U.S. citizens are advised to avoid participating in demonstrations or other activities that might be deemed political by Mexican authorities. In a recent incident, a Mexican Independence Day celebration was the target of a violent attack. As is always the case in any large gathering, U.S. citizens should remain alert to their surroundings.

SOURCE: http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/pa/pa_3028.html#

[Calanen]

There is nothing in anyone's Use of Force policy that I know of that requires the you to be in the same country as the guys taking you under fire. They should have the right to defend themselves.

The chats I've had with the border patrol guys in San Diego were to the effect that there is the willingness to shoot back from their side, just not the political will for the mess that would ensue. I made them all laugh when I said if it was up to me, I'd authorise them artillery fire support.

[Laconian]

I think a lot of that is going to change soon. Administrators are going to have to deal with the fact that it is crazy along the border and getting worse. Tolerance for getting shot shot is very low.

[LineDoggie]

Wasnt a US Park Service Ranger Murdered recently by Mexican Smugglers with an AK?

[INAT]

The chats I've had with the border patrol guys in San Diego were to the effect that there is the willingness to shoot back from their side, just not the political will for the mess that would ensue. I made them all laugh when I said if it was up to me, I'd authorise them artillery fire support.


A political mess? From killing some scum that is bringing narcotics into this country? Why would Mexico care if the US kills criminals that fire on American agents?

I am surprised there is no diplomatic effort between Mexico and the US
to give US law enforcement more control with border protection. Mexico
seems to be unable to do the job. Am I wrong in saying that? Are they doing more with border issues?

[Laconian]

There is a bunch of joint stuff going on. One of the main ones comes out of ATF's Project GunRunner referencing traces on seized firearms to stem the flow of weapons.
http://www.atf.treas.gov/press/factsheets/0908-factsheet-project-gunrunner.pdf

[JJB1970]

I think a lot of that is going to change soon. Administrators are going to have to deal with the fact that it is crazy along the border and getting worse. Tolerance for getting shot shot is very low.

Certainly, nobody is in any hurry to accelerate what is looking like an ugly mess, but I am surprised at what seems like the lack of urgency to all of the armed incursions across the border. Sometimes it seems like illegal aliens are more an issue than armed gunmen trying to kill law enforcement officers.

Laconian, might you know if federal agents, sheriff's deputies, etc. under pressure to avoid any type of confrontation at all costs? (I don't mean any nefarious conspiratorial kind of pressure). It is (and has been) a very, very bizarre situation.

[Laconian]

Wasnt a US Park Service Ranger Murdered recently by Mexican Smugglers with an AK?

A female Forest Service Law Enforcement and Investigations Officer was shot and killed in September, but that was in Washington State. The report mentioned only one actor who killed another person while stealing his truck and was subsequently shot and killed by local deputies.
I hadn't heard of any more recent than that.

[Laworkerbee]

There is a bunch of joint stuff going on. One of the main ones comes out of ATF's Project GunRunner referencing traces on seized firearms to stem the flow of weapons.
http://www.atf.treas.gov/press/factsheets/0908-factsheet-project-gunrunner.pdf

That's some welcome news.

[Laconian]

...
Laconian, might you know if federal agents, sheriff's deputies, etc. under pressure to avoid any type of confrontation at all costs? (I don't mean any nefarious conspiratorial kind of pressure). It is (and has been) a very, very bizarre situation.

I've never worked down there, but I'm not aware of anything like that.

[JJB1970]

Wasnt a US Park Service Ranger Murdered recently by Mexican Smugglers with an AK?

I actually hadn't heard about one recently. I would hope not. But, the national parks have long been known to be dangerous for Park Service Rangers. I'll have to snoop the Internets, but I remember a few years ago the Park Rangers were unwilling to patrol the Organ Pipe National Forest. The park (on the AZ-Mexico border) was considered too remote and far too dangerous to patrol alone.

Wiki to the rescue.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_Pipe_Cactus_National_Monument

The incident there happened back in 2002. That's just messed up. I think there were three rangers for the whole park at that time.

[AKS]

There is nothing in anyone's Use of Force policy that I know of that requires the you to be in the same country as the guys taking you under fire. They should have the right to defend themselves.

Do you mean in the US or internationally?

because about 11 years ago, I was in Czech Republic and the border police gave our class a presentation, and they stated that they cannot fire if the suspect is on the other side of the border

[Supe]

Do you mean in the US or internationally?

because about 11 years ago, I was in Czech Republic and the border police gave our class a presentation, and they stated that they cannot fire if the suspect is on the other side of the border

Surely that would be null in defence of your life or someone else whose life was in danger? I can understand if you mean't that this pertained to a suspect fleeing the area - and where no danger exists to Officer's life or those they are duty bound to protect. Common sense need apply.

[Silent Reader]

i guess there could be soe political mess afterwards.. because if you shoot at someone across the border.. like in this case in Mexico.. wouldn't Mexico then have to treat the shooting officer as a civilian or something like that? after all he is not part of their LE agencies and and was not authorized by the country that controls this territory.

of course it is common sense to defend yourself.. and if both countries have an agreement i wouldn't see a problem there.. but if only the US says that they will do this.. without consent of the Mexican government there could be problems.

just imagine there are some illegal immigrants.. trying to cross the border.. and one of the trafficers shoots on the US officers... they shoot back and kill one of the civilians by accident...

[notherhen40]

What is shocking, is that there are not only armed confrontations between law enforcement officers on our side and smugglers, but armed incursions by smugglers and Mexican military as well. (or smugglers posing as Mexican military)

The united States should deploy combat troops in a more active engagement role, because in some instances, shooting at police officers and border agents, and crossing the border to do so, is considered an act of war.