24 % of UK Midland Muslims Support Suicide Attacks

[Calanen]

Young Midland Muslims support suicide bombings new poll reveals

Oct 18 2008
ALMOST a quarter of young Muslims support suicide bombings, according to a shock new poll on an internet website.

Radicalised youths from the Midlands are among those to have posted messages backing terrorists on the www.ummah.com (http://www.ummah.com) forum.

One member had started the survey by asking users: “Do you agree with suicide bombings?”

Of those who responded, an alarming 24 per cent said they supported suicide attacks like the 7/7 tube bombings in London and the 9/11 atrocity in America.

One posting on the poll said: “I agree with suicide bombers. They should target Muslims too. They should also target those coward sleeping Muslims.”

[Note this statement - in Islam, one of the worst things a fellow Muslim can do is stand by while there is a jihad in progress and not get involved. It is a death sentence: Cal]

Another, calling himself Abu Mubarak, wrote: “I don’t particularly subscribe to the suicide bombings myself, if I were to go into battle, I would want to die in a blaze of gunfire, not by pushing a button.

“I will not say it is suicide, nor condemn them, or say they are cowards, or the rest of that nonsense, because it is NOT suicide, it is a form of fighting that instils a great terror into the hearts of the koffar (non-believers).”

Others argued that suicide bombings were unacceptable, with one contributor saying: “I don’t regard people who blow themselves up in market places packed with non-combatants as legitimate Mujahideen.

“I don’t believe it is responsible to kill a handful of bystanders for every enemy soldier killed. Finally, I don’t believe suicide bombing is Islamic.”
One senior Muslim cleric in Birmingham described the findings of the survey as “very worrying”.

Shouiab Ahmed Mirpuri, General Secretary of the Green Lane Mosque, which was featured in last year’s Channel 4 Dispatches investigation into radical preachers, believes the key to tackling extremism is education.

“Suicide bombing is not allowed in Islam,” he told the Sunday Mercury.

“Killing innocent people is not within the teachings of the Prophet Mohammed. Murder is haraam (forbidden), suicide is haraam, it is all against Islam.

[Really - depends on who you say is innocent. On one view, subscribed to by some muslims, anyone who is an infidel has committed the heinous crime of rejecting Allah - and so is not innocent, but deserving of severe punishment - Cal]

“I’m really shocked by this poll, which suggests there are a lot of people agreeing with suicide bombings.

“These people have clearly not been educated properly. Some may have been brainwashed into thinking this is acceptable.

“We should be living in the UK in peace and harmony. Even thinking about these things, or saying suicide attacks are okay is really disturbing.

“At Green Lane we are ensuring people are educated inside the Masjid (mosque).

[Well we've all seen (well hopefully we all have seen) what is taught in the Green Lane mosque on Channel 4 Undercover Mosque, courtesy of Saudi diplomats and other extremists. So I'd be really surprised if much is said to knock this on the head. Unless of course jihad is directed at the Saudi Royal family instead of infidels, now that really would be haram - Cal]

“We have to show young people that this has nothing to do with Islam. Obviously we don’t know that people are thinking individually, but as a community we stand against suicide bombings.

“If people are thinking like this it is very dangerous for all communities and we must teach them to follow only the Koran.

“I will be raising this poll and this topic in Friday sermons.”

http://www.sundaymercury.net/news/midlands-news/2008/10/18/young-midland-muslims-support-suicide-bombings-new-poll-reveals-66331-22065097/

[Tiny minority of extremists? You decide.]

[Mu-Meson]

Dude, I completely agree that calling it a tiny minority is absurd, but consider the source of this poll. Is this www.ummah.com a online site for radicals/fundamentalists? If so, its kinda like a poll on MP.net seeing how many people are interested in a career in the armed forces.

[Weasel]

Internet polls are serious business.

[Calanen]

Internet polls are serious business.

The poll at the ummah site, reflects similar figures found in a large number of other polls. Not just 'internet' polls.

http://www.*******.com/article/topNews/idUSN2244293620070522



By David Morgan

WASHINGTON (*******) - About one-quarter of young American Muslims believe to some extent that suicide bombings can be justified to defend Islam, while nearly 80 percent of all U.S. Muslims reject such attacks, a survey showed on Tuesday.



http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5iWFKT0dviFcq6GD_hJwnZVDB5n_g




In Lebanon, the number of Muslims who said suicide attacks can be justified often or sometimes in defense of Islam fell by 42 percent between 2002 to this year, the study showed.
But although down sharply from 74 percent six years ago, one in three Muslims in Lebanon still backed suicide attacks.
In Pakistan, support for suicide bombings has fallen by 28 percent to a scant five percent in the past six years.
In Jordan, support has dropped 18 points since 2002, but a quarter of Jordanian Muslims still support suicide attacks.


http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P1-51305887.html



00-00-0000
Headline: Most Palestinians support suicide attacks - poll Byline: LAMIA LAHOUD Edition; Daily Section: News Page: 03
Thursday, March 7, 2002 -- More than 60 percent of Palestinians support the continuation of the violence and suicide attacks against Israelis, according to a poll released yesterday by the Palestinian Center for Public Opinion. The poll also showed strong support for Palestinian Authority Chairman Yasser Arafat.
The poll, which has a margin of error of 2.47%, was conducted between February 25 and March 3 in the Gaza Strip, West Bank, and east Jerusalem.
Of the 571 people selected at random, 66.5% said they support the continuation of the intifada, ...

[Weasel]

The poll at the ummah site, reflects similar figures found in a large number of other polls. Not just 'internet' polls.

Do you still sleep at night?

[CMNot]

There are three types of lies.

1. Lies
2. Damn Lies
3. Statistics.

[pekka elo]

Then again 76% don't.

Internet polls aren't reliable anyways considering that a single site reaches only a certain demographic and there's always them internet trolls.

[Calanen]

There are three types of lies.

1. Lies
2. Damn Lies
3. Statistics.

There are three types of cliches,

1. Tedious cliches;

2. Damn tedious cliches;

3. Internet memes.

[Calanen]

Then again 76% don't.

And give or take, roughly speaking, how many people in the wider community would support suicide bombing? 1/4 or so do you think?


Internet polls aren't reliable anyways considering that a single site reaches only a certain demographic and there's always them internet trolls

As I said above, similar figures are shown from polls that are not internet polls - and I even posted examples.

[Lau]

www.ummah.com (http://www.ummah.com)
It's bull sh!t. So is the poll.

Calanen you propaganda machine. ;) Post some of the reliable sources you claim to have.

Thanks in advance.

[Ulytau]

then maybe they need to check about votes of the stormfront right?

[Calanen]

www.ummah.com (http://www.ummah.com)
It's bull sh!t. So is the poll.

Calanen you propaganda machine. ;) Post some of the reliable sources you claim to have.

Thanks in advance.

I already did. Scroll up. No thanks necessary.

[Calanen]

then maybe they need to check about votes of the stormfront right?

The second largest internet forum for muslims and the largest English online forum for muslims is the equivalent of Stormfront in your view?

http://www.big-boards.com/kw/islam/

[Lau]

I already did. Scroll up. No thanks necessary.

No, you posted different polls, subject is the same, but the result is not.

AFP:
The number of Muslims around the world who say suicide attacks are acceptable has fallen sharply in the past six years,

Jerusalem Post:
More than 60 percent of Palestinians support the continuation of the violence and suicide attacks against Israelis,

No **** Sherlock?

*******:


The nationwide poll of 1,050 Muslim adults by the Pew Research Center said the U.S. Muslim community is largely moderate, assimilated and happy.


The way you, Calanen, view polls, are disturbing.

[Ulytau]

The second largest internet forum for muslims and the largest English online forum for muslims is the equivalent of Stormfront in your view?

http://www.big-boards.com/kw/islam/

Know very well about kind of websites which making propaganda or support radicalism honestly didnt heard this link before too but which making terror propaganda mostly reported police from me and they totally closed in 2-3 days p-)

You can find enough video about stormfront too news report,radio programs who supportin em and easy to see they are seriously in contact and how organized they are.

What is the next?

All Muslims are takin breath and givin Co2 to atmosphere they are reason of the global warming or something?

[Calanen]

*******:


The way you, Calanen, view polls, are disturbing.

Yes, Im glad that Al Ja ******* could put a benign spin on the research that Pew does, in fact Pew does that themselves.

Let's see what someone else has to say about it:

by Daniel Pipes
New York Sun
June 27, 2006

[NY Sun title: "Survey of World's Muslims Yields Dismaying Results"]

How do Muslims worldwide think?

To find out, the Pew Research Center for the People & the Press carried out a large-scale attitudinal survey this spring. Titled "The Great Divide: How Westerners and Muslims View Each Other (http://pewglobal.org/reports/pdf/253.pdf)," it interviewed Muslims in two batches of countries: six of them with long-standing, majority-Muslim populations (Egypt, Indonesia, Jordan, Nigeria, Pakistan, and Turkey) and four of them in Western Europe with new, minority Muslim populations (France, Germany, Britain, and Spain).

The survey, which also looks at Western views of Muslims, yielded some dismaying but not altogether surprising results. Its themes can be grouped under three rubrics.

A proclivity to conspiracy theories: In not one Muslim population polled does a majority believe that Arabs carried out the attacks of September 11, 2001, on America. The proportions range from a mere 15% in Pakistan holding Arabs responsible, to 48% among French Muslims. Confirming recent negative trends in Turkey, the number of Turks who point the finger at Arabs has declined to 16% today from 46% in 2002. In other words, in every one of these 10 Muslim communities, a majority views September 11 as a hoax perpetrated by the American government, Israel, or some other agency.

Likewise, Muslims are widely prejudiced against Jews, ranging from 28% unfavorable ratings among French Muslims to 98% in Jordan (which, despite the monarchy's moderation, has a majority Palestinian Arab population). Further, Muslims in certain countries (especially Egypt and Jordan) see Jews conspiratorially, as being responsible for bad relations between Muslims and Westerners.

Conspiracy theories also pertain to larger topics. Asked, "What is most responsible for Muslim nations' lack of prosperity?" between 14% (in Pakistan) and 43% (in Jordan) blame the policies of America and other Western states, as opposed to indigenous problems, such as a lack of democracy or education, or the presence of corruption or radical Islam.
This conspiracism points to a widespread unwillingness (http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/573) in the umma to deal with realities, preferring the safer bromides of plots, schemes, and intrigues. It also exposes major problems adjusting to modernity.

Support for terrorism: All the Muslim populations polled display a solid majority of support for Osama bin Laden. Asked whether they have confidence in him, Muslims replied positively, ranging between 8% (in Turkey) and 72% (in Nigeria). Likewise, suicide bombing is popular. Muslims who call it justified range from 13% (in Germany) to 69% (in Nigeria). These appalling numbers suggest that terrorism by Muslims has deep roots and will remain a danger for years to come.

British and Nigerian Muslims are most alienated: Britain (http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,,1804078,00.html) stands out as a paradoxical country. Non-Muslims there have strikingly more favorable views of Islam and Muslims than elsewhere in the West; for example, only 32% of the British sample view Muslims as violent, significantly less than their counterparts in France (41%), Germany (52%), or Spain (60%). In the Muhammad cartoon dispute, Britons showed more sympathy for the Muslim outlook than did other Europeans. More broadly, Britons blame Muslims less for the poor state of Western-Muslim relations.

But British Muslims return the favor with the most malign anti-Western attitudes found in Europe. Many more of them regard Westerners as violent, greedy, immoral, and arrogant than do their counterparts in France, Germany, and Spain. In addition, whether asked about their attitudes toward Jews, responsibility for September 11, or the place of women in Western societies, their views are notably more extreme.

The situation in Britain reflects the "Londonistan (http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/298)" phenomenon, whereby Britons preemptively cringe and Muslims respond to this weakness with aggression.

Nigerian Muslims generally have the most belligerent views on such issues as the state of Western-Muslim relations, the supposed immorality and arrogance of Westerners, and support for Mr. bin Laden and suicide terrorism. This extremism results, no doubt, from the violent state of Christian-Muslim relations in Nigeria.

Ironically, most Muslim alienation is found in those countries where Muslims are either the most or the least accommodated, suggesting that a middle path is best - where Muslims do not win special privileges, as in Britain, nor are they in an advanced state of hostility, as in Nigeria.
Overall, the Pew survey sends an undeniable message of crisis from one end to the other of the Muslim world.

http://www.danielpipes.org/article/3706

[PeterG]

What's so incredible about these figure? I'm sure the truth is that much more than 24% support suicide bombings, and terrorism in general. I've heard so called 'secular' muslims, and moderately leftist norwegians say the same. 50-75% sounds more realistic - perhaps more. Even ordinary socialists in the west have a higher figure of support for Al Qaida, and terrorists in general. Haven't you heard such people say that the suicide bombers are 'desperate' with 'no other option to strike back' than blowing themselves up? Herocially standing up to the military might of the jews and the US.. I've heard this many times. From 'moderate' left wingers and immigrants. Bush is the 'real terrorist'.

Only 24% of young muslims supporting suicide bombers? Yeah right..!

[C.MAXIMUS]

I am not surprised at the findings, maybe not exact numbers but I dont think they are too far off.

[Atlantic Friend]

[Tiny minority of extremists? You decide.]

Yeah, let's get rid of the 76% who do not, while we are at it.

So what is your agenda, Cal ? What is your solution ?

[Lau]

Yeah, let's get rid of the 76% who do not, while we are at it.

So what is your agenda, Cal ? What is your solution ?

Let me fill you in on his agenda. It's clearly to post everything bad he can find on the Internet, about Muslims. In the short stay I have had here on MP.net, I have not seen him do anything else.

[Ali Baba]

Let me fill you in on his agenda. It's clearly to post everything bad he can find on the Internet, about Muslims. In the short stay I have had here on MP.net, I have not seen him do anything else.


Lmao Yea, its amusing though, hes working so hard to get the msg out. that all of us muslims are Evil, And all zzee sand was Evil Too, zee sand was Very Evil. Evil sand. p-)

[MostlyHarmless]

Regardless of Calanen's agenda or alleged bigotry, and with the demographic of the web site the original poll was taken brought into account, you have to admit the poll is still disturbing. So much hate.

[PaulClift]

99.9% of that 24% are going to be a bunch of spotty teenagers who may support it when there behind a keyboard but would do bugger all in real life.

[Calanen]

Let me fill you in on his agenda. It's clearly to post everything bad he can find on the Internet, about Muslims. In the short stay I have had here on MP.net, I have not seen him do anything else.

Search function. It's up to the right at the top of the screen.

And your agenda is to not ever to debate the issues at all, but just to use ad hominem attacks on me, including as many offensive labels as you can find. Although, it is pretty difficult to truly offend me, even if you were in person I would gladly debate you until I had all onlookers laughing at your ignorance and poor oratory skill.

Defaulting to criticising the speaker is the last refuge of people for whom the skills of debate are too difficult to master. So if you are unable to converse like an adult, then leave the conversing to adults.

[muck]

24 % of UK Midland Muslims Support Suicide Attacks
Islam is peace, didn't you know that.

[Atlantic Friend]

The poll IS disturbing. But it's a poll. If I had polled Americans, say, in 2003-2004, whether the US should bomb France, I'm pretty sure I would have found pretty disturbing figures as well. That wouldn't have meant :

- non-polled Americans would have held the same opinion, nor that
- polled Americans would have actually done anything, in speech or deed, to encourage the bombing of France.

In the end, the issue of domestic terrorism is, in my humble opinion, best handled by law-enforcement agencies than it is by pollsters. And so should be the issue of devising Britain's foreign policy. The general idea is not to cater to those 24% British Muslims nor to those who find their opinion or faith repugnant. It is to do what is best for all of Britain.

[vinny_121_ND]

Internet polls are serious business.

I don't believe the poll, after reading this.



One posting on the poll said: “I agree with suicide bombers. They should target Muslims too. They should also target those coward sleeping Muslims.”

[Calanen]

Lmao Yea, its amusing though, hes working so hard to get the msg out. that all of us muslims are Evil, And all zzee sand was Evil Too, zee sand was Very Evil. Evil sand. p-)

I've never said that all muslims are evil. Or that all muslims are terrorists. You can search all of my posts and see that this is the case.

And anything I say, on a forum board or in person - does far less to defame the supposed good name of Islam than the acts of the faithful on a daily basis, for reasons they say are connected with Islam. What does far more damage is the continued poor behaviour of those within the Islamic faith, for reasons that they say are ,mandated by the Islamic faith. Such examples occur by the thousands, and are largely whitewashed by the media and the liberal elite who would like to stifle free speech about this issue.

So instead of debating the reasons why it is again and again people from the same religious group that commit these acts or think these things - and who say 'I do this because Islam tells me too' - the champagne socialists and many muslims themselves, focus their attention on criticising anyone who *notices* what is going on all around them, and wishes to talk about it, so that they compete to hand out more perjorative labels.

Which is easier than debating the facts, or the reasons for what is going on - as that is a much harder debate to win.

[dava]

Of those who responded, an alarming 24 per cent said they supported suicide attacks like the 7/7 tube bombings in London and the 9/11 atrocity in America.

Oops Calanen, there goes your beloved theory about the silent muslim majority backing terrorism.

[Calanen]

I don't believe the poll, after reading this.


One posting on the poll said: “I agree with suicide bombers. They should target Muslims too. They should also target those coward sleeping Muslims.”

It is entirely consistent with the philosophy of jihad within Islamic scholarship, from Hasan Al-Bana's "Jihad", 1928:

Jihad is an obligation from Allah on every Muslim and cannot be ignored nor evaded. Allah has ascribed great importance to jihad and has made the reward of the martyrs and the fighters in His way a splendid one. Only those who have acted similarly and who have modelled themselves upon the martyrs in their performance of jihad can join them in this reward. Furthermore, Allah has specifically honoured the Mujahideen with certain exceptional qualities, both spiritual and practical, to benefit them in this world and the next. Their pure blood is a symbol of victory in this world and the mark of success and felicity in the world to come.

Those who can only find excuses, however, have been warned of extremely dreadful punishments and Allah has described them with the most unfortunate of names. He has reprimanded them for their cowardice and lack of spirit, and castigated them for their weakness and truancy. In this world, they will be surrounded by dishonour and in the next they will be surrounded by the fire from which they shall not escape though they may possess much wealth. The weaknesses of abstention and evasion of jihad are regarded by Allah as one of the major sins, and one of the seven sins that guarantee failure.

http://www.youngmuslims.ca/online_library/books/jihad/#all_muslims

[Calanen]

Oops Calanen, there goes your beloved theory about the silent muslim majority backing terrorism.

I've never said that.

[Lazy Lob]

Oops Calanen, there goes your beloved theory about the silent muslim majority backing terrorism.

Only Clark Kent has x-ray vision.

rofl learnin how to read is a skill

[Lau]

Search function. It's up to the right at the top of the screen.

I have seen enough.


And your agenda is to not ever to debate the issues at all, but just to use ad hominem attacks on me, including as many offensive labels as you can find.

I have no agenda. I stumbled upon one of your "Look at these Muslims, they are evil" threads, that you are so fond of, and I commented. If you don't like it when people criticize your threads, don't post such BS threads.


Although, it is pretty difficult to truly offend me, even if you were in person I would gladly debate you until I had all onlookers laughing at your ignorance and poor oratory skill.

Now your just being pathetic. :roll:



Defaulting to criticising the speaker is the last refuge of people for whom the skills of debate are too difficult to master. So if you are unable to converse like an adult, then leave the conversing to adults.

If the speaker has a clear agenda, and what he speak of is BS, I see no reason not to interfere. Most people on MP.net are adults, right now, you are acting like a cry baby because i criticize you. Take it like a man instead.


Regardless of Calanen's agenda or alleged bigotry, and with the demographic of the web site the original poll was taken brought into account, you have to admit the poll is still disturbing. So much hate.

True.


99.9% of that 24% are going to be a bunch of spotty teenagers who may support it when there behind a keyboard but would do bugger all in real life.

Even more true. But again, the poster of this thread rarely take these things into account, although he knows it's the truth, he is evading it all he can. It does not go hand in hand with the image he is trying to portray.

[Calanen]

I have seen enough.

So you say that I have posted nothing else, but when I indicate that is incorrect, you don't need to see it.


I have no agenda.

C'mon. And there is a bridge I can sell you for a nickel.


I stumbled upon one of your "Look at these Muslims, they are evil" threads, that you are so fond of, and I commented.

Your comments are normally directed at criticising me personally using schoolyard style taunts, which you somehow believe are devastating in their effect because I have called you on it.


If you don't like it when people criticize your threads, don't post such BS threads.

I actually do like it when people criticise my threads or my ideas, or anything I say. I do not expect people to agree with everything I say or do, or even most of those things. But what I do want people to do (which is a big ask sometimes) is to debate the topic or the point at hand. Instead we just see 4Chan style flamefests from internet warriors like yourself.


Now your just being pathetic. :roll:

Happy to debate you any time any place. We can video it and put it on youtube. And no doubt everyone will be impressed with what a superb public speaker you are.


If the speaker has a clear agenda, and what he speak of is BS, I see no reason not to interfere.

It is easy to call something 'BS' without ever having to debate the merits of the topic. So you have been appointed the sole arbiter of what is 'BS' -and that way, you never have to listen or consider any other point of view, save your own. Most convenient.


Most people on MP.net are adults, right now, you are acting like a cry baby because i criticize you. Take it like a man instead.

You call me a 'crybaby' and say to take it like a man? Your thought processes are still stuck in high school labels. In all of the flaming that has gone on, I've reported *one* person who said something particularly offensive and the mod agreed. If you have some sort of pathological disorder which means you have to frequently use schoolyard taunts on me, go right ahead - it can be part of my civic duty to assist you in this manner. May I suggest, as well as 'crybaby', that you add something like this to your sophisticated reportoire:



Baby baby suck your thumb
wash it off with bubble gum


Can be used with devastating effect. No really, I will be in therapy for weeks coping with the mental anguish.

[Atlantic Friend]

I've never said that.

Well, why don't you say something, then ?

What's the powerful ideal, driving force, leading rationale behind your posts ?

Like, what's the big idea with adding the "Tiny minority ? You decide" comment after the article. Because THAT goes beyond reporting and into pushing an agenda.

So, instead of pointing out what you didn't say, or didn't imply, why don't you tell us what your message is ?

[Lau]

C'mon. And there is a bridge I can sell you for a nickel.

Share with me then, what is my agenda, I would really like to know?



Happy to debate you any time any place. We can video it and put it on youtube. And no doubt everyone will be impressed with what a superb public speaker you are.

So, you want to videotape you and some guy you just met on a Internet board, debating?

That goes beyond pathetic!

Face it, your agenda is clear, why don't you just admit it and open some more threads?