video of italian fighting in nasiyriah

[irra!]

http://www.studioaperto.it/video/popup/videopopup_7383.shtml

they are lagunari p-)

[severino]

http://www.studioaperto.it/video/popup/videopopup_7383.shtml

they are lagunari p-)

It seems that the Browning .50 operator on the top of the VM had serious jammimg problems with his gun. :cantbeli:
He will have to make many push-ups on his return to base. :roll:

[gilgoul]

SWEET :P

[Javehn]

Nice .. What are those cars ?

And what da hell they are doing ? Scanning with a fire or something like this ?

[irra!]

Nice .. What are those cars ?

iveco vm 90 torpedo

And what da hell they are doing ? Scanning with a fire or something like this ?

they are shooting against rebels that have attacked them with ak and 3-4 rpg

[dumdidum]

Nice .. What are those cars ?

iveco vm 90 torpedo

And what da hell they are doing ? Scanning with a fire or something like this ?

they are shooting against rebels that have attacked them with ak and 3-4 rpgThey seem to be very badly cordinated. Jumping in and out behind the cars, squesing away the occasionla bullet. NOT the thing you will want to do if you have been fired upon with a rpg. You will want to get away from the vehicles a fast as possible.

[AMBUSH]

That .50 with the jamming problem sounded like it had timing issues. I bet after that engagement he doesnt have that problem again. Cause somebody is gonna square his butt away.

[Javehn]

Nice .. What are those cars ?

iveco vm 90 torpedo

And what da hell they are doing ? Scanning with a fire or something like this ?

they are shooting against rebels that have attacked them with ak and 3-4 rpg

You will have to excuse me my good mate , but i have very big difficulties to bellieve that (perhaps the ancor that had it all wrong) .
Firstof all , if they are responding to fire source indeed , then the guy with that non working Browning wouldn't stand like that - This guys is visible for miles , it's like yelling , "Shoot me in the head" . Hard to bellieve he would stand that high if there was any shooting around - he would be low down profile .

The soldiers aren't engaging the enemy and all they do is sneak shooting from time to time . If they just want to get away from the place , walking behind a car that driving 3 km/h is not very bright way to accomplish it . Specially if they are engaging guys with RPG's , who can bust the **** out of this slow moving poor armored vehicle .

People is all happy and waving there , hard to bellieve they are engaging someone .


And lastly , the Browning . It can be many things . It can be bad test of "Go no go , fire no fire" , the barrel was connected to much inside , and not 3 clicks outside , ot more probably it wasn't connected all the way back as it should ... Anyway , in the war zone , this kind of **** can get someone ass get in the coffin . Very sorrow performance .

[Dutchman2]

That .50 with the jamming problem sounded like it had timing issues. I bet after that engagement he doesnt have that problem again. Cause somebody is gonna square his butt away.

I was thinking the same thing. Proberly he found the Go/No Go gauges useless when he installed the barrel :D !

[UNDERDOG1]

Either the soldiers are very poor trained or that was a mock showoff for TV.

Being Italian myself, ad thinking highly of our troops, i favour the second guess.

[tenda]

....italian guy's give severeal problem to iraqi bandit's rofl rofl

[kenshiroIT]

I dont know, but either the movie is incomplete and they took just few clips online (witch I do belive) or is that a small propaganda movie (they r election in Italy right now).

[Javehn]

I dont know, but either the movie is incomplete and they took just few clips online (witch I do belive) or is that a small propaganda movie (they r election in Italy right now).

Well , if it's a propaganda , they probably should have reshoot the scene with that Brouning misfire ...

I never saw a misfire in Browning . First time for everything :) .

[kenshiroIT]

Well , if it's a propaganda , they probably should have reshoot the scene with that Brouning misfire ...


Agree, but IMHO the movie maybe recived some heavy cuts and then it was uploaded on the web.
Who knows.......

[Damian]

....italian guy's give severeal problem to iraqi bandit's rofl rofl

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

italian soldier don't fight in iraq like the American soldier they simply stay in their bases and sometimes check some iraquis building.... so don't write bullsh**

[memphiz]

I love the one Italian soldier waving to the camera as the car drove by rofl

[tenda]

...sure how about nassiryah bridge's fighting ...??
read before speak...!! :bash: :bash: :bash:

[kenshiroIT]

italian soldier don't fight in iraq like the American soldier

agree, we dont kill unarmed civilians and we dont torture prisoners....

[Fargin]

git some, git some!

[Falco]

italian soldier don't fight in iraq like the American soldier

agree, we dont kill unarmed civilians and we dont torture prisoners....

5 4 3 2 1 FLAME WAR :slap:

Seriously, comments like this are only meant to be inflamatory.

[Damian]

...sure how about nassiryah bridge's fighting ...??
read before speak...!! :bash: :bash: :bash:

First of all: I haven't spoke anything..... I have wrote....

2nd Nassiriyah's bridges was controlled by iraquis militiamen for hours or days before italians reconquered they after tryin' a TRUCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! with those bastar**** stop dreamin'

3rd Several times when iraquis militiamen shot against italian they don't shoot back and run like hell...

4rd About 1300 italians fight in afghanistan last year BUT NO ONE WAS KILLED WHY ?.... Just last month 7 American soldier died in that country...

5rd How many militiamen italians have killed or capture in this year, how many militiamen's weapon have been sequestrated

And much more

fact not bullsh**

use your brain when you're writin' please

[mack pl]

Hey boys, I was thinking that US and Italians were allies :roll: Did I missed something?Maybe they aren't?[sarcasm]

STFU all :bash:

Big respect for brave Italians and US soldiers who are fighting against terrorists woot

regards

[mack pl]

...sure how about nassiryah bridge's fighting ...??
read before speak...!! :bash: :bash: :bash:

First of all: I haven't spoke anything..... I have wrote....

2nd Nassiriyah's bridges was controlled by iraquis militiamen for hours or days before italians reconquered they after tryin' a TRUCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! with those bastar**** stop dreamin'

3rd Several times when iraquis militiamen shot against italian they don't shoot back and run like hell...

4rd About 1300 italians fight in afghanistan last year BUT NO ONE WAS KILLED WHY ?.... Just last month 7 American soldier died in that country...

5rd How many militiamen italians have killed or capture in this year, how many militiamen's weapon have been sequestrated

And much more

fact not bullsh**

use your brain when you're writin' please

Are you serious kid???
7 USA soldiers were killed, and none italians, and what??? that mean Italians were hiding in fukin caves?????

They are runing away like hell, and dont shoot back??????? You saw that??

OMG what a BS !!!!

STFU man.

[tenda]

Hey boys, I was thinking that US and Italians were allies :roll: Did I missed something?Maybe they aren't?[sarcasm]

STFU all :bash:

Big respect for brave Italians and US soldiers who are fighting against terrorists woot

regards
........sorry .......about it.......!! :hug:
but if somebody offend my brave's.....!!! :roll:

[Damian]

italian soldier don't fight in iraq like the American soldier

agree, we dont kill unarmed civilians and we dont torture prisoners....

STFU MF you killed a lot of unarmed civilians like the other Coalition's soldier (Check Corriere Della Sera out for example) it's inevitable. And you can't torture prisoners cauz you have NO prisoners

[Damian]

...sure how about nassiryah bridge's fighting ...??
read before speak...!! :bash: :bash: :bash:

First of all: I haven't spoke anything..... I have wrote....

2nd Nassiriyah's bridges was controlled by iraquis militiamen for hours or days before italians reconquered they after tryin' a TRUCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! with those bastar**** stop dreamin'

3rd Several times when iraquis militiamen shot against italian they don't shoot back and run like hell...

4rd About 1300 italians fight in afghanistan last year BUT NO ONE WAS KILLED WHY ?.... Just last month 7 American soldier died in that country...

5rd How many militiamen italians have killed or capture in this year, how many militiamen's weapon have been sequestrated

And much more

fact not bullsh**

use your brain when you're writin' please

Are you serious kid???
7 USA soldiers were killed, and none italians, and what??? that mean Italians were hiding in fukin caves?????

They are runing away like hell, and dont shoot back??????? You saw that??

OMG what a BS !!!!

STFU man.

Maybe it means that italians don't search for terrorist like the American, I say again How many weapons italians sequestrated? How many talibans italians killed or captured?

Check Italians newspaper for all the episodes when italians don't shoot back at iraquis. You can check www.corriere.it if you don't belive me.... these are some keywords: ospedale soldati italiani - macchina soldati italiani

[Damian]

Hey boys, I was thinking that US and Italians were allies :roll: Did I missed something?Maybe they aren't?[sarcasm]

STFU all :bash:

Big respect for brave Italians and US soldiers who are fighting against terrorists woot

regards

Yeah big respect for brave Italians and US soldier that FIGHT terrorists no way...

[mack pl]

Well, im Pole, not Italian, so I cannot talking about what(and how) they were doing in war against terror, coz Im interesting what poles are doing there, not italians. But Im sure italians know what to do, if someone shoot to them, and they aren't pussys. Maybe sometimes they dont shoot back, but hey, maybe they wasn't sure from where terrorists shooting to them-soldiers cannot shoot like fukin blinds, everywhere to anyone-they have some action drills or something like that. And about this weapons, captured and killed talibans-well, they have smaller contingent than USA, so maybe they cannot found so many weapons etc., or maybe Italians media know **** about real results of Italians troops actions? I dont know that, and i think you cannot be so sure too.

once again- BIG RESPECT FOR ALL ITALIANS AND USA SOLDIERS woot

regards

[Rilence]

how old are you guys? :|

[homerjsimpson94]

That .50 with the jamming problem sounded like it had timing issues. I bet after that engagement he doesnt have that problem again. Cause somebody is gonna square his butt away.

Yup, headspace and timing... :bash:

[anonymous individual]

Does the .50 jam as much as it is in the video?

[Chrome Beretta]

It seems the guy with the .50 on the top of the car is havin a problem gettin it to shoot ;) .

[MEGR]

WTF is with the flaming? Anyways, I hope those Italians turned the tangos into the meatballs they are..

[scrybe]

It actually appeared to me that the video was cut and edited, so that the same couple of shots of the MG jamming were recycled within the movie.

[kenshiroIT]

2nd Nassiriyah's bridges was controlled by iraquis militiamen for hours or days before italians reconquered they after tryin' a TRUCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! with those bastar**** stop dreamin'

I hope U are joking...really!


3rd Several times when iraquis militiamen shot against italian they don't shoot back and run like hell...


Yeah in your world maybe, but the true world it's different.


4rd About 1300 italians fight in afghanistan last year BUT NO ONE WAS KILLED WHY ?.... Just last month 7 American soldier died in that country...


Whait a moment u wrong, there was some firefight and Talebans was killed (not big firefight after all) anyway, we scared the talebans away ;)


5rd How many militiamen italians have killed or capture in this year, how many militiamen's weapon have been sequestrated

And much more



More than u imagine, and weapons are sequestrated everyday.
Tell me what do u read? Mickey Mouse?

Anyway I dont understand what r u whinning for...


fact not bullsh**


excuse me, but how old r u?

[kenshiroIT]

It actually appeared to me that the video was cut and edited, so that the same couple of shots of the MG jamming were recycled within the movie.

agree I have the same impression......

[kenshiroIT]

Seriously, comments like this are only meant to be inflamatory.

agree and I apologice to everybody.
It's not true americans kill unarmed civiians, and of course only few morons did the torture....

[FB]

...
I never saw a misfire in Browning . First time for everything :) .

Maybe because you don't remember (or you haven't read) the official reports concerning the 507th Maintenance Company (Jessica Lynch's Unit).

All their .50 cal, not mentioning the M16 etc., jammed.

Best regards

[kenshiroIT]

true on military.com there r lots of topics (see marine forum) about the inadeguacy of the M16vsAK47 (somebody call the M16 the jammer or the loosie sucker) and other weapons who does anything else than fire when needed....

[Javehn]

...
I never saw a misfire in Browning . First time for everything :) .

Maybe because you don't remember (or you haven't read) the official reports concerning the 507th Maintenance Company (Jessica Lynch's Unit).

All their .50 cal, not mentioning the M16 etc., jammed.

Best regards

I will repeat then . I never saw in my service not one Browning misfire . I only heard about one accident where Browning exploded , because one of our company officers didn't performed Go/No Go test after barell connection to the Browning body .
The fact that Browning misfires is a problem of those who taking care of them , and not the weapon itself . Infact , unlike M16 it's very sturdy and reliable weapon . If weapon have jamming , then the weapon is not blame , but those who failed to perform maintance on it .

Best Regards to you .

[REMOV]

true on military.com there r lots of topics (see marine forum) about the inadeguacy of the M16vsAK47 (somebody call the M16 the jammer or the loosie sucker)If the M16/M4 jammed so often why the majority of special forces uses this assault rifle? Why the private military contractors choice M4 over other rifles? They are not forced to do it by their own governments, aren't they?

[kenshiroIT]

simply, because the M16 (and u can ask some veterans from Vietnam or other places) isnt so realible than somebody do belive.

[FB]

...
I never saw a misfire in Browning . First time for everything :) .

Maybe because you don't remember (or you haven't read) the official reports concerning the 507th Maintenance Company (Jessica Lynch's Unit).

All their .50 cal, not mentioning the M16 etc., jammed.

Best regards

I will repeat then . I never saw in my service not one Browning misfire . I only heard about one accident where Browning exploded , because one of our company officers didn't performed Go/No Go test after barell connection to the Browning body .
The fact that Browning misfires is a problem of those who taking care of them , and not the weapon itself . Infact , unlike M16 it's very sturdy and reliable weapon . If weapon have jamming , then the weapon is not blame , but those who failed to perform maintance on it .

Best Regards to you .

Agreed. The problems with the Browning aren't to be blamed on the weapon. To the personnel taking care of it as a source for those problems, it is maybe possible to add the ammos that are feeded to it.

Best regards

[Porta_jon]

If we had some Ham we could have some Ham and Eggs, if we had some Eggs.

:| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :| :|

[REMOV]

simply, because the M16 (and u can ask some veterans from Vietnam or other places) isnt so realible than somebody do belive....you know all the SF units make very hard tests of this assault rifle, so...

[Dutchman2]

I never saw a misfire with the Browning M2 either. That weapon just fires when you push in the trigger lever. When you install a -new/ cool- barrel, you have to put a iron plate (Go- No Go) between the boldhead and the rear of the barrel (headspace timing), because the firingpin will be released when the rear of the barrel (where the bold slides in) passes a exact point in the receiver. This timing must be very accurate, because the barrel and bold have to be totaly forward together when the lockinglug drops in the receiver body. When the bold releases the firing pin when the lockinglugs arn't totaly down (because of bad timing), it will misfire.
In cases of emergency, you can twist the barrel in totaly, and then two turns back. But that will not be the most adviceble thing to do.

About all M16 variants: It can be the most popular assaultrifle in the world, but it's not the most relaible or maintenace friendly design around. It's succes is because there are millions around, and you can buy need toy's for a m16 around the world. Almost every company makes gadgets for the M16 family. And it's a very accurate rifle.That makes it popular, not because it's so relaible cause it isn't. It's a poorly designed weapon, wich only functions relaible when you give it many hours of care and maintenace, and shoot it with good quality ammo.
Personaly, I like the M16/ AR15, because it's a very accurate rifle for matches with a great 'shoulder'. But I was issued with the Diemaco C7 in the Army, and I received it after 6 months of UZI and FN FAL experiances, and compared to the FAL, the Diemaco is realy unrelaible :( ! Even our drill instructors told us it was a piece of ****, made from plastic and aluminium. But I like it as a targetrifle ;) !

Greets,

Roger

[Herrmannek]

What is GO, NO GO procedure and what you mean when saying timing and spacing?

[PaoloAR15]

Check Italians newspaper for all the episodes when italians don't shoot back at iraquis. You can check www.corriere.it if you don't belive me.... these are some keywords: ospedale soldati italiani - macchina soldati italiani

Newspaper of the Italian disinformation systems? The Corriere was the same newspaper that told that the rifle used to shot Chirac two years ago was holding "five rounds in the barrel".... c'mon... NOT our soldiers are sitting inside the bases all day long: those ones are ITALIAN JOURNALISTS.

[PaoloAR15]

simply, because the M16 (and u can ask some veterans from Vietnam or other places) isnt so realible than somebody do belive.

Bull****s

1) M16/M4 are LESS reliable than an Ak47, but try to hit with an AK47 something smaller than a human torso at a distance greater than 100 meters if you can...

2) M16s used in Vietnam are COMPLETELY different than actual M16A2/A4 and M4/A1. And much more reliable. Btw, the ones that jammed (alongside the M2 and SAW249) of the 507 coy. where made in Belgium by FN with STRICTER tolerances: very good to be used at match competition but not suitable for desert combat situations. Colt (M4 and M16A2) and Bushmaster (M4) are made with less stringent tolerances and if you keep them enough clean they will work flawlessly, as a sgt. from 82nd Airborne Div. told me.

Still with this old Vietnam story... friend, this are OLD common places.

No flame intended, of course.

[PaoloAR15]

Personaly, I like the M16/ AR15, because it's a very accurate rifle for matches with a great 'shoulder'. But I was issued with the Diemaco C7 in the Army, and I received it after 6 months of UZI and FN FAL experiances, and compared to the FAL, the Diemaco is realy unrelaible :( ! Even our drill instructors told us it was a piece of ****, made from plastic and aluminium. But I like it as a targetrifle ;) !

Greets,

Roger

I spoke with Israelis that used FN FAL in combat and they told me that they cursed the day they got it in replacement of UZI and Mausers. The damn thing was continuosly jamming.

The happy day was when FN FAL was replaced with Galil and M16. The M16 (they have both M16A1 and a version of M4 and some M16A3 for DM...) are less reliable than Galil, but neverthless they are preferred over the Galil because the advantage of the lightweight and ergonomy is compensating the few time the gun is jamming.

And there is also desert sand there in the Negev...


PS.

Your instructor shoudl be FIRED... ;)

[Dutchman2]

What is GO, NO GO procedure and what you mean when saying timing and spacing?

The "Go/ No Go" is a tool to measure the proper distance between the rear of the barrel and the bold head when a new barrel is installed. Its a iron plate that put between the bold and the barrel, and when the tool is clamped between the barrel and boldhead, the measurment is good. you need to do this with 2 person (old version Browning M2): One is pulling the bold back a few inches, and the other one is placing the new barrel.

The "timing" is difficult for me to explane (I'm Dutch, I don't know how to explane in english, but I'll try :oops: !). The barrel is fitted in a threath in a slide where the bold rides in. First you must know that the barrel and bold are moving back a few inches together, when a round is fired. This time that they are locked togheter, is the time the bullet need to fly out of the barrel. At a sercent point in the receiver, a notch is pushing the lockingblock in the bold up and out of the barrel/ boldcarrier. the barrel (barrel/ bold carrier) stops moving, and the bold has the space to move back alone, pulling a new round out of the belt, ejecting the empty shell ( it's simply pushed out by the new round that is pushed down in line with the chamber), cocking the firingpin, and move back forward.
There, the barrel is allready back in the forward position, and the bold chambers the new round, the notch/curve in the bold/ receiver forces the lockingblock back in the barrel/ boldcarrier, and the system is ready to fire (when the lever is puched in, the sear will also release the firingpin and activates the new round).
In that moment of locking/ chambering/ firing the new round, each part has to be on the exact place in the weapon, otherwise a round will not be fired, or the sear is released to soon, creating to fast activated round, or no firing at all. That is called timeing. You can recognize bad timing on the ssound of a M2 in action: The rate of fire isn't in rythm. When the timing is realy bad, it jams like in the video.

Pfffff :lol: ! A long story, and hard for me to explane!!! :D

greets,

Roger

[kenshiroIT]

Paolo I know, the AK47 r imprecise, buuut it kills with one shot!
How many 5,56 do u need before the target goes down? many...
of course at long distance....

[Herrmannek]

What is GO, NO GO procedure and what you mean when saying timing and spacing?

The "Go/ No Go" is a tool to measure the proper distance between the rear of the barrel and the bold head when a new barrel is installed. Its a iron plate that put between the bold and the barrel, and when the tool is clamped between the barrel and boldhead, the measurment is good. you need to do this with 2 person (old version Browning M2): One is pulling the bold back a few inches, and the other one is placing the new barrel.

The "timing" is difficult for me to explane (I'm Dutch, I don't know how to explane in english, but I'll try :oops: !). The barrel is fitted in a threath in a slide where the bold rides in. First you must know that the barrel and bold are moving back a few inches together, when a round is fired. This time that they are locked togheter, is the time the bullet need to fly out of the barrel. At a sercent point in the receiver, a notch is pushing the lockingblock in the bold up and out of the barrel/ boldcarrier. the barrel (barrel/ bold carrier) stops moving, and the bold has the space to move back alone, pulling a new round out of the belt, ejecting the empty shell ( it's simply pushed out by the new round that is pushed down in line with the chamber), cocking the firingpin, and move back forward.
There, the barrel is allready back in the forward position, and the bold chambers the new round, the notch/curve in the bold/ receiver forces the lockingblock back in the barrel/ boldcarrier, and the system is ready to fire (when the lever is puched in, the sear will also release the firingpin and activates the new round).
In that moment of locking/ chambering/ firing the new round, each part has to be on the exact place in the weapon, otherwise a round will not be fired, or the sear is released to soon, creating to fast activated round, or no firing at all. That is called timeing. You can recognize bad timing on the ssound of a M2 in action: The rate of fire isn't in rythm. When the timing is realy bad, it jams like in the video.

Pfffff :lol: ! A long story, and hard for me to explane!!! :D

greets,

Roger

Thanks I understood you well...

[Dutchman2]

Thanks I understood you well...

Your welcome :D

[Damian]

2nd Nassiriyah's bridges was controlled by iraquis militiamen for hours or days before italians reconquered they after tryin' a TRUCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! with those bastar**** stop dreamin'

I hope U are joking...really!


3rd Several times when iraquis militiamen shot against italian they don't shoot back and run like hell...


Yeah in your world maybe, but the true world it's different.


4rd About 1300 italians fight in afghanistan last year BUT NO ONE WAS KILLED WHY ?.... Just last month 7 American soldier died in that country...


Whait a moment u wrong, there was some firefight and Talebans was killed (not big firefight after all) anyway, we scared the talebans away ;)


5rd How many militiamen italians have killed or capture in this year, how many militiamen's weapon have been sequestrated

And much more



More than u imagine, and weapons are sequestrated everyday.
Tell me what do u read? Mickey Mouse?

Anyway I dont understand what r u whinning for...


fact not bullsh**


excuse me, but how old r u?

1 I'm not joking the chief of italian forces in iraq general Chiarini (I think) said that....

2 No it happened two times this month: one against militiamen into an hospital and one against militiaman into a ride....

3 we mustn't scare talibans we must KILL or capture talibans.... THIS IS THE POINT and 2 - 10 talibans killed in months and months aren't a good score....

4 I asked for fact e.g. Sequestrated 10 ton of rifles, killed at least .... , captured ...... . No i read Corriere della Sera the most important Italy's newspaper and sometimes RAIDS, but i also will buy Micky Mouse for you by tomorrow, are you happy now?

5 More than you

However i made i mistake sayin' "italians run like hell" sometimes they simply didn't shoot back and went away...

[severino]

4 I asked for fact e.g. Sequestrated 10 ton of rifles, killed at least .... , captured ...... . No i read Corriere della Sera the most important Italy's newspaper and sometimes RAIDS, but i also will buy Micky Mouse for you by tomorrow, are you happy now?



rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl
rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl rofl

Trying to find a reliable military news on the Corriere is like making a gold rush inside a cotton field.... unfortunately this is true for ALL the other italian media.... :cantbeli:

[kenshiroIT]

1 I'm not joking the chief of italian forces in iraq general Chiarini (I think) said that....

I wonder where did u learn read Italian? the first and the second bridges was conquered really quickly, the thirdt there was civilians (maybe hostages, maybe dressed militia men's I dont know) and the action was stopped.
5 hours later the militians (after a agreement with the locals religious autorytis the militians was throwed out of the town) was forced away and the bridges was under our control.
Now, the are two aspect in this fire clash, let's start with the good one.
Good training and motivation from our troops, we left the battlefield with around 200 deads and unknown wounded, with the cost of only 11 slightly injured italians (whom three of them had to be flyed back to italy, and the others was allready back to duty), between the victims, I dont have the numbers but mustly militians and sadly some civilians(but there r a suspicious about dressed militians, some soldiers reported some civilians was fighting against us), more than 50.000 bullets and 400 RPG had been shot against us, and we only got 11 injured guys. That's good!
About the civilians (if they was...)That's the price of a urban fight. No matter how much carefull U R somebody will get hurt no matter what.

Another good aspect of the clashes, was the diplomacy, we did the local Naseriah autorities (especially the religious one) to cooperate to remove the militians (not wanted by the locals) from the city. With this diplomatic act, the locals R more willing to cooperate, already the intelligence had
information about the militans R preparing another assoult.
But this time we r ready p-) .

Now the bad one, ingagement rules, italians should not open fire, only for selv defence. After the bridges clashes there was open a investigation and Im not sure, but maybe somebody was punished about the fight.
In the second battle, this time, the soldiers respected the orders from the governement and withdraw form the battle (not after hours long fight), uintil the governement didnt gave the military blank paper (fire at will) and the outpost was reconquested and the militians scared away in at least 15minuts. 70 shell of 105/51 of the centauros was fired!
Second, the equipment, completely inadeguate, light armed, and moving on open truck (like the one U saw in the movie).
But the ingament rule now r changed (fire at will, no more wait orders from Rome) armored veihicles are send to Iraq, including VCC80 dardo (a bradley like vehicle) and the Ariete our main battle tank.
We shouldn have problems anymore now.



2 No it happened two times this month: one against militiamen into an hospital and one against militiaman into a ride....

no, there was never been fired nothing from a hospital, that was a bad report, and about the second, the militians run away before we could fire back, but they left theyr weapons.



3 we mustn't scare talibans we must KILL or capture talibans.... THIS IS THE POINT and 2 - 10 talibans killed in months and months aren't a good score....

Wrong, the mission was US controlled, and we cooperated with other units, and that isnt our fault if there wherent any in that place, in that moment. But we find lot of abandoned weapons.
About the fights, the italian base at Afghanistan was attacked several time, and the attackers was killed.



4 I asked for fact e.g. Sequestrated 10 ton of rifles, killed at least .... , captured ...... . No i read Corriere della Sera the most important Italy's newspaper and sometimes RAIDS, but i also will buy Micky Mouse for you by tomorrow, are you happy now?

:roll: if U read that, why U dont read the good stuff like RID or panorama difesa? there u can find step by step about what happen in Iraq and other places...
Anyway I give U a link www.analisidifesa.it that's a army magazine online, it's free and there R a english version to.
That's not the best of the best.....but it's realible and first at all it's free!!!
Read it there U have all the fact U want, number of killed, units, weapons ect ect.



However i made i mistake sayin' "italians run like hell" sometimes they simply didn't shoot back and went away...

When'n'where? give me name, dates, units....

[kenshiroIT]

sorry I forgot, il Corriere, r side biased.
Not realible, forget this newspaper if you want some serious news about italy and the war.

[irra!]

Nice .. What are those cars ?

iveco vm 90 torpedo

And what da hell they are doing ? Scanning with a fire or something like this ?

they are shooting against rebels that have attacked them with ak and 3-4 rpg

You will have to excuse me my good mate , but i have very big difficulties to bellieve that (perhaps the ancor that had it all wrong) .
Firstof all , if they are responding to fire source indeed , then the guy with that non working Browning wouldn't stand like that - This guys is visible for miles , it's like yelling , "Shoot me in the head" . Hard to bellieve he would stand that high if there was any shooting around - he would be low down profile .

The soldiers aren't engaging the enemy and all they do is sneak shooting from time to time . If they just want to get away from the place , walking behind a car that driving 3 km/h is not very bright way to accomplish it . Specially if they are engaging guys with RPG's , who can bust the **** out of this slow moving poor armored vehicle .

People is all happy and waving there , hard to bellieve they are engaging someone .


And lastly , the Browning . It can be many things . It can be bad test of "Go no go , fire no fire" , the barrel was connected to much inside , and not 3 clicks outside , ot more probably it wasn't connected all the way back as it should ... Anyway , in the war zone , this kind of **** can get someone ass get in the coffin . Very sorrow performance .

i've seen another video of this story and the situation was this:

a patrol of lagunari was transporting various civilians (journalists) along a road near a river when on the other side of the river (about 500 mt) someone into the bushes that there are on the banks began to fire against italians.

then our troops came down from the vehicles (on vehicles remained drivers ,journalists and the machine-gunners) repairing themself behind the vehicles and doing cover fire while the convoy went away from the area

lagunari could not see the enemies because they were hidden into the bushes

I have only felt the noise of ak's and not of rpg's

[Javehn]

Yes , that's what i thought more or less .
But the covering fire is not performed that way .If they want to see real covering fire performed from convoys , they should check US example (which they learned from us) . There is somewhere in the net video of it . Covering fire should be rapid , fast , covering big area , and dence , violent and non stoping .
And it's not done while from time to time some soldier is peeping from behind the car , and shooting bullet and a half , while someone is firing from the ever sow Browning . If that was the case , they got lucky this time .

Who are Lagunari ? And what are those trucks ?

[FB]

The Lagunari are a Regiment of the Italian Army whose "specialty" is anphibious operations.

The vehicles are IVECO VM90T (for Topredo) which is the "soft skin", open one and IVECO VM90P (for Protetto = Protected) the "closed" one. This last is protected from small arms fire.

Here a link to a page where you can see the vehicles. Scroll down to about the middle of the page, on the right, where it says "IVECO model 40.10WM (4x4)".

Best regards

[mack pl]

The Lagunari are a Regiment of the Italian Army whose "specialty" is anphibious operations.

The vehicles are IVECO VM90T (for Topredo) which is the "soft skin", open one and IVECO VM90P (for Protetto = Protected) the "closed" one. This last is protected from small arms fire.

Here a link to a page where you can see the vehicles. Scroll down to about the middle of the page, on the right, where it says "IVECO model 40.10WM (4x4)".

Best regards

Maybe Im blind, but I dont see any link p-)

BTW Polish paras tested armoured version of IVECO 40.10. Maybe we will buy this stuff.

Regards :)

[kenshiroIT]

lagunare are not marines (the san marco are) the lagunary are specialized
to fight from beach to beach. Also lagoon troops!
They was designed to defend venice if italy was attacked. Today if Im not mistaken, they r a support unit of the san marco regiments.
The main difference is the lagunari belongs to the army, and the san marco to the fleet.

[mack pl]

They was designed to defend venice if italy was attacked.
Bad Slovenia p-)

But this Lagunari could make assault from sea, yes? Or only defend beach??

[Javehn]

They was designed to defend venice if italy was attacked.
Bad Slovenia p-)

But this Lagunari could make assault from sea, yes? Or only defend beach??

As I understood , they job is to defend bitch in case of invasion , and not amphibious attack . From the words "Lagoone" ... ;)

[mack pl]

They was designed to defend venice if italy was attacked.
Bad Slovenia p-)

But this Lagunari could make assault from sea, yes? Or only defend beach??

As I understood , they job is to defend bitch in case of invasion , and not amphibious attack . From the words "Lagoone" ... ;)
Ohhh, so, they are "Obrona wybrzeża" units :lol:

[kenshiroIT]

defend a bitch? :D
Here there is the lagunari's url :http://www.lagunari.it/reg_ing.htm

[Javehn]

beach :oops:

Interesting march music ... :)

[mack pl]

defend a bitch? :D

:lol: Ohh well, If its your Bitch, you must defend her ;) :lol:

[kenshiroIT]

:D :D

[FB]

The Lagunari are a Regiment of the Italian Army whose "specialty" is anphibious operations.

The vehicles are IVECO VM90T (for Topredo) which is the "soft skin", open one and IVECO VM90P (for Protetto = Protected) the "closed" one. This last is protected from small arms fire.

Here a link to a page where you can see the vehicles. Scroll down to about the middle of the page, on the right, where it says "IVECO model 40.10WM (4x4)".

Best regards

Maybe Im blind, but I dont see any link p-)

BTW Polish paras tested armoured version of IVECO 40.10. Maybe we will buy this stuff.

Regards :)

No you are not blind at all: it's me that forgot to actually attach the link. Sorry about that.

Anyway here it is:

http://www.army-technology.com/contractors/vehicles/iveco/

And kenshiroIT is correct: San Marco Regiment is part of the Italian Navy, while the Lagunari (Serenissima Regiment) are part of the Italian Army. Both are anphibious troops, but historically speaking, the Serenissima Regiment saw its born with the need of defending the lagoon areas near Venice.

Best regards

[tenda]

in origin the lagunari are descending from navy infantry troop finally they are rested with italian army for defend the north est region ....they can patrol river, fight on anfibius contest and operate on armoured coloum's..... ;)