In U.S., Will Republicans Learn a Lesson?

[XShipRider]

Doubtful. They are, as I stated in another post, trying to become Democrats.


Will GOP Learn from This?

by Michael D. Tanner

This article appeared in the Orange County Register on November 4, 2008.

The Republican Party is on the verge of its second consecutive election debacle. In two years, the GOP will likely have lost the presidency, more than a dozen Senate seats, and more than 50 seats in the House—if it's lucky. Republicans will have gone from controlling every arm of government to controlling none.

As it emerges from the electoral rubble, the Republican Party must decide what it actually believes in before beginning rebuilding its battered fortune.

On one side is a growing chorus that believes Republicans need to become more like—well, Democrats. In books like "Grand New Party," by Ross Douthat and Reihan Salam; "Heroic Conservatism," by Michael Gerson; and "Comeback: Conservatism that can Win," by David Frum, big-government conservatives have argued for a more activist federal government that embraces the goals, and sometimes even the means, of liberalism.

Read the rest of the article here... (http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=9770)

[Bia]

The extreme right will likely further split the GOP. Their absurdity in the last half year has reached a new extreme.

Just my opinion.

[Skutatos]

The republican party will have recovered just fine in two years time and they cant really be blamed for anything that goes wrong in the first two years of Obama's presidency as everything is democrat controlled.

[Bia]

The republican party will have recovered just fine in two years time... I hope you're right... but it isnt likely. Massive breakdown and failure on the GOP will take more than that. The shame is obvious... through the forced laughs and ripping apart Obamas term before it even begins. Past two days... the die hard repubs I know... are walking around in a daze. Making up wild excuses and stories.... as if maybe.... there's still hope God above will pull a miracle for them. I almost feel sorry for them and then faces like Cheney & Rumsfeld pop in my mind and I breathe a sigh of relief and L0L.

[budgie]

Past two days... the die hard repubs I know... are walking around in a daze. Making up wild excuses and stories.... as if maybe.... there's still hope God above will pull a miracle for them.

Yeah and we all know what they hope that 'miracle' will be...some of them were even kind enough to voice it on these forums before CJ waved the ban stick.

This could go either way for the party. They might collectively become more moderate and centrist in attitude or they could stubbornly dig their heels in and become even more right-wing. If they move toward the center then anything can happen in the future. Usual dips and swings.

However if they keep pushing hard toward the right then only a major failure of the Obama administration and the Democratic party will help them in future elections.

[LineDoggie]

"through the forced laughs and ripping apart Obamas term before it even begins."


Uh huh, funny guess you dont remember that Bush was ripped to pieces from the day of the 2000 election onwards with no break.

There were posters of Bush with Swastikas on Canal Street in NYC in January 2001. I had some schmucks calling him a Fascist while I guarded the World Trade Center the Day Bush was there, corner of West and Chambers street. Our Scouts were still finding Body Parts on the rooftops that week, and People were already blaming Bush.

He's been compared to a shaved chimp, Hitler, etc. for 8 years mostly by Democrats who couldnt accept Nov. 2000. So Spare me the Poor Obama routine.

Reap what you sow, you cant rip Bush for 8 years and expect all Ice Cream and Lollypops and Unicorns for Obamas Time, Aint gonna Happen.


My Turn now.

[Macs.]

Uh huh, funny guess you dont remember that Bush was ripped to pieces from the day of the 2000 election onwards with no break.

There were posters of Bush with Swastikas on Canal Street in NYC in January 2001. I had some schmucks calling him a Fascist while I guarded the World Trade Center the Day Bush was there, corner of West and Chambers street. Our Scouts were still finding Body Parts on the rooftops that week, and People were already blaming Bush.

He's been compared to a shaved chimp, Hitler, etc. for 8 years mostly by Democrats who couldnt accept Nov. 2000. So Spare me the Poor Obama routine.

Reap what you sow, you cant rip Bush for 8 years and expect all Ice Cream and Lollypops and Unicorns for Obamas Time, Aint gonna Happen.


My Turn now.

So because some people act like dorks who can't think straight you decide to... Act like a dork too ?

[LineDoggie]

So because some people act like dorks who can't think straight you decide to... Act like a dork too ? Seems to work for the Democrats, dont it?

[Bringer of Greater Things]

Uh huh, funny guess you dont remember that Bush was ripped to pieces from the day of the 2000 election onwards with no break.

There were posters of Bush with Swastikas on Canal Street in NYC in January 2001. I had some schmucks calling him a Fascist while I guarded the World Trade Center the Day Bush was there, corner of West and Chambers street. Our Scouts were still finding Body Parts on the rooftops that week, and People were already blaming Bush.

He's been compared to a shaved chimp, Hitler, etc. for 8 years mostly by Democrats who couldnt accept Nov. 2000. So Spare me the Poor Obama routine.

Reap what you sow, you cant rip Bush for 8 years and expect all Ice Cream and Lollypops and Unicorns for Obamas Time, Aint gonna Happen.


My Turn now.



So you'll be lowering yourself to Democrat standards?
What are you, 12?

[budgie]

It's actually kind of refreshing now the debate has turned to the recovery of the GOP, and I've weighed in on a couple of threads, the tone is noticably more civil and the nastiness seems to be gone. It's as if MP.net has returned to its senses again.

[I can't think of a name]

So you'll be lowering yourself to Democrat standards?
What are you, 12?

No, but thanks for pointing out the democrats are.

[szr]

Democrats have been saying for 8 years that it's their patriotic duty to question the president at every chance, to express dissent at every step of the way, to resist the president at all costs. My question is does that still stand or is that all out the window now? What happens to those who continue their patriotic duty through the Obama Administration? Are they free to dissent without fear of intimidation or persecution, or do they get 'Joe-The-Plummer'd' by the New York Times?

Will be interesting to see how all this develops..

[Buckeye67]

John McCain just spent the last year being "the nice guy".

[BugHunt]

Uh huh, funny guess you dont remember that Bush was ripped to pieces from the day of the 2000 election onwards with no break.

There were posters of Bush with Swastikas on Canal Street in NYC in January 2001. I had some schmucks calling him a Fascist while I guarded the World Trade Center the Day Bush was there, corner of West and Chambers street. Our Scouts were still finding Body Parts on the rooftops that week, and People were already blaming Bush.

He's been compared to a shaved chimp, Hitler, etc. for 8 years mostly by Democrats who couldnt accept Nov. 2000. So Spare me the Poor Obama routine.

Reap what you sow, you cant rip Bush for 8 years and expect all Ice Cream and Lollypops and Unicorns for Obamas Time, Aint gonna Happen.


My Turn now.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/picture.php?albumid=229&pictureid=7622

Sorry couldnt resist p-)

[MichaelF]

Personally, I'd like to see a move away from the "Big Tent" GOP.

I just don't think it's feasible to get all the differing factions to pull together and still generate a Congressional Majority or 270 Electors.

Libertarians (sane and otherwise).
Fiscal Conservatives.
Social Conservatives.
Religious Conservatives. Who are especially problematic, as they don't like anyone in the GOP who isn't visibly
religious (preferably Protestant) and willing to pay homage to it's leadership.
Centrists (somewhat conservative).
Etc.

Most of the outliers tend to "protest" vote, such as voting for a 3rd Party that doesn't stand a chance of seeing a single Electoral Vote (Bob Barr, etc), but function as a net drain on the GOP total vote (Barr took 7% of Republicans and only 5% of Democrats).

Trying to satisfy a dozen masters is just not going to work anymore. The Religious voters and the Libertarians are especially ****e to take their ball and vote for a 3rd Party (in reality, a functional vote for the Democrats) to "punish" the GOP for moving to the Center.

The GOP cannot win if it's just the Party of those who "Do Not Want" the Democrats. That's not enough to generate the necessary party discipline amongst the voters.

The question is: Can the GOP show these groups the door and still get ~50% of the popular vote (putting them in contest for the Swing States that make the difference between 270 and 180 Electors)? The Evangelicals, especially, would be hard to replace as they are both numerous and active (volunteers, donations, campaigning).

Could the GOP essentially become the US Tory Party and pull away enough conservative Democrats (or enough new voters) to replace the Right-most segment of the Party it would lose by such a shift?

Irregardless, the GOP has to do a better job of getting people registered (as Republicans) to vote. They can simply copy what the Obama Campaign did this year.
They also need to understand that the Internet is the way to communicate with anyone under 30. Not talk radio.

[ren0312]

John McCain just spent the last year being "the nice guy".

I just think McCain is mjust too "weak", for lack of a better term to be a proper presidential candidate.

[Bia]

Uh huh, funny guess you dont remember that Bush was ripped to pieces from the day of the 2000 election onwards with no break.No, I was 15



Reap what you sow, you cant rip Bush for 8 years and expect all Ice Cream and Lollypops and Unicorns for Obamas Time, Aint gonna Happen.


My Turn now.Typical conservative jackass... two wrongs make a right.

[timetraveller]

Doubtful. They are, as I stated in another post, trying to become Democrats.



Read the rest of the article here... (http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=9770)


Does anyone think that the Republican Party should change it's name ...


IE Conserative or Liberal or ANP - American National Party

I think the name republican has run it's course ..

[ren0312]

Does anyone think that the Republican Party should change it's name ...


IE Conserative or Liberal or ANP - American National Party

I think the name republican has run it's course ..

I think one of the biggest problems the US faces is an urban vs. rural divide I think the main danger for the Republican party is that it will split into a Barry Goldwater wing and a William Jennings Bryan wing.

[LineDoggie]

No, I was 15


Typical conservative jackass... two wrongs make a right.
Oh, I'm a Typical Conservative Jackass?

The Original Wrong was ripping the Man to pieces for 8 years. Then most of those same People asking for Kid Glove Treatment for a Man who Berated the President for his entire Campaign. A Man who claims My Comrades died for a mistake, who wishes to run from Iraq leaving the Iraqi People to the tender mercies of radical fundies. A Man who is allowed to skate answering some tough questions about Associates who today would listed as Domestic Terrorists in the same vein as a Terry Nichols & Timmy McViegh


Sorry, If Obama Makes IMO a Mistake/Bad Choices, etc. or Gets My Comrades Starched by His actions/inactions you can BELIEVE I will call him on it. It's My Patriotic Duty to call him on it, to dissent, to resist

And frankly, until You've picked up a weapon up to defend this country, dont presume to tell me how I should feel or act.

I think I've earned that right.

[iLikeFlickerstick]

Oh, I'm a Typical Conservative Jackass?

The Original Wrong was ripping the Man to pieces for 8 years. Then most of those same People asking for Kid Glove Treatment for a Man who Berated the President for his entire Campaign. A Man who claims My Comrades died for a mistake, who wishes to run from Iraq leaving the Iraqi People to the tender mercies of radical fundies. A Man who is allowed to skate answering some tough questions about Associates who today would listed as Domestic Terrorists in the same vein as a Terry McViegh


Sorry, If Obama Makes IMO a Mistake/Bad Choices, etc. or Gets My Comrades Starched by His actions/inactions you can BELIEVE I will call him on it. It's My Patriotic Duty to call him on it, to dissent, to resist

And frankly, until You've picked up a weapon up to defend this country, dont presume to tell me how I should feel or act.

I think I've earned that right.

In case you didn't know, Obama didn't berate the president or the presidency like you imply. He went out of his way to talk about the issues, even when he was being called a terrorist.

In my opinion the president was directly responsible for a lot of the issues most Americans are concerned about. So it's only obvious that the President is going to have his feet put to the fire. They're suppose to WORK for and represent the American people, did you know?? So don't tell me I gotta get shot at first before I earn the right to berate a man who works for me and screws up.

[vryhpyammoadded]

The people will need to suffer under the fiscally unsustainable big government entitlement nanny state awhile before the Republicans can get back to what made them so strong. The sheeple are feeling insecure and want sugar daddy right now and any talk of…

A smaller Federal government
A return to Federalism with greater states rights and responsibilities
Radical tax reform, such as national sales or flat tax
Term limits
Trust busting regulatory changes

will fall on mostly deaf ears.

But, then again, I'm not saying the "new" (wink, wink) Republican party will follow through with these issues, only it will pay lip service during a future election to gain seats, entrench, secure the tap into the revenue stream for its backers, and go over the same old big, bloated, controlling Fed DC road just as Pelosi, Reid, Murtha, Frank,and the rest of the Dems will do.

But, who knows. Maybe Obama can walk on water. I await his miracle.

[BugHunt]

A smaller Federal government

On what planet did Bush stand for small government?

[vryhpyammoadded]

LOL, you’re still jumpy from the election Bug, less ready, fire, aim.

I didn’t say Bush stood for smaller government. I said the Republicans have a stronger chance of winning elections when they “promise” smaller government along with the rest of that list during an election.

But, the problem is that this platform is unsustainable due to the powerful interests who fund campaigns. They overwhelmingly prefer the big, meddling, byzantine nanny state because a corrupt and easily greased politicians palm makes it far easier to pass legislation and regulations favoring unfair regulatory advantages and nearly assured easy money for those with pets on the Hill or in the White House.

The Democrat party sold its soul to this system decades ago while the Republicans still have a huge block of voters who refuse to accept the Plutocracy/Kleptocracy, therefore, the party continues to come off appearing as some neurotic, bi polar, chronic lying nut case.

The only time the Republicans get any good done is when those wacky anarcho-capitalists get the chance to run the party and take the filleting knife to all the Federal bureaucratic fat the RINO’s and allied Democrat factions build up while robbing the national piggy bank using tricks playing out before you right now.

But like I said, if Obama can walk on water, the cycle will be broken. But, can the Democrat party socialist monkeys let go their greedy little hands of that Federal revenue banana in the jar? We anarcho-capitalist types figure they can’t change their nature and await the eventual opportunity to throw the greedy monkeys in a cage.

The Republicans will be back, human avarice dictates so.

[BugHunt]

The Republicans will be back, human avarice dictates so.


Your faith in humanity is heartwarming p-)

[Breakfast in Vegas]

Uh huh, funny guess you dont remember that Bush was ripped to pieces from the day of the 2000 election onwards with no break.

There were posters of Bush with Swastikas on Canal Street in NYC in January 2001. I had some schmucks calling him a Fascist while I guarded the World Trade Center the Day Bush was there, corner of West and Chambers street. Our Scouts were still finding Body Parts on the rooftops that week, and People were already blaming Bush.

He's been compared to a shaved chimp, Hitler, etc. for 8 years mostly by Democrats who couldnt accept Nov. 2000. So Spare me the Poor Obama routine.

Reap what you sow, you cant rip Bush for 8 years and expect all Ice Cream and Lollypops and Unicorns for Obamas Time, Aint gonna Happen.


My Turn now.Maybe you ought to grow up. Or buy a skateboard.

The Bush slandering crowd make idiots out of themselves with some of their ridiculous statements/actions. Why be like them?

That said... Obama hasn't even been in office a day and you've already made up your mind on him and his politics. How about waiting 2-3 years and seeing if he can help resurrect the country from the ditch Bush and the Republicans have dug for it?

He deserves a chance.

[philbob]

Xxxxxxxxxx

[philbob]

Maybe you ought to grow up. Or buy a skateboard.

The Bush slandering crowd make idiots out of themselves with some of their ridiculous statements/actions. Why be like them?

That said... Obama hasn't even been in office a day and you've already made up your mind on him and his politics. How about waiting 2-3 years and seeing if he can help resurrect the country from the ditch Bush and the Republicans have dug for it?

He deserves a chance.

Didnt Bush? (to begin with, not after what took place) but in the end it is better to come off better then your rival which to a degree republicans have