Mexico-News, politics, education, etc.

[Tokamak]

Here you can make all the comments you want about politics, education, immigration, etc. I hope this eliminates all the problems that these topics were creating in the PICS thread.

[Tokamak]

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=gKHqFzeh_s8

I couldn't find it in English sorry. It says that Mexico is like that because of their people not because of their politicians. Recommended by JKLV.

[Shadowstorm]

Nice, maybe it will stop the bickering and backering in the other thread.

[jupiter]

wootGreat! Thanks. Now we can discuss all those issues that we wish.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Well, I don't even know why we need this thread... I never have anything political to say.

[jupiter]

Well, I don't even know why we need this thread... I never have anything political to say.
It in't just political, you can say wethever you want, ask or just post pics of your car.

[Sasori]

i havent seen that video that jkvl recommended but how is it our own fault our country is the way it is. For one thing i know were not lazy or uneducated so how could it be our own fault.

I dont agree with that assesment? Any ideas.

[Ordie]

Well, I don't even know why we need this thread... I never have anything political to say.

Because there's more text, rants and chingaderas than pictures on the other thread.

Good move Tokamak.

[Tokamak]

Well, I don't even know why we need this thread... I never have anything political to say.

Specially you!.

[indiana46767]

What the heck is going to happen with the "energy reform" proposed by the senate? What things are going to change... pluses minuses? Lets get started!

[Felix U. Gómez]

Ok, I'll go first.
I hereby declare that anything that wolfpack says is wrong and unjustified from here on forward. Except of course if he says I'm right, in that case the previous statement is declared invalid.

[indiana46767]

Ok, I'll go first.
I hereby declare that anything that wolfpack says is wrong and unjustified from here on forward. Except of course if he says I'm right, in that case the previous statement is declared invalid.

lol. THere he goes again. I knew it wouldn't last. JP Felix. I agree with you though. Wolfie is kinda out there sometimes :S

[Dragunov]

Juan Camilo Mouriño (RIP) and Energy Reform in Mexico

Monday, November 10, 2008



Juan Camilo Mouriño (RIP) and Energy Reform in Mexico



By George Baker



It is a shock for the Mexican political system – and for me personally – to face the death of the 37-year-old Interior Minister (and de facto vice president) of Mexico owing to a bizarre airplane crash – not in a remote site in the Sierra Tarahumara mountains of Chihuahua, but on a main boulevard in Mexico City and just a few miles from the national airport (and yet fewer miles to the Presidential Residence).


In Mexico, it is always important to try to distinguish between events and meta-events. The latter are message-events intended to convey a message to one or multiple public or private constituencies. Given the pattern of assassinations of top police officials in 2008, especially of those connected to President Felipe Calderon's anti-drug campaign, it was immediately imaginable that the airplane crash in which this official and others, plus pedestrians and motorists, died was an assassination (hence, meta-event), not a mere accident (event).


The Interior Ministry manages one of the four intelligence agencies of the government (CISEN), and the ministry was involved in the planning of the government's security and anti-drug efforts. Assassinating the interior minister would be a message that no one in the government who opposed the narcos was safe.


There is much about Mr. Mouriño that is not in the public record: What is known is that he was born in Madrid, the son of a Spanish father (and, he said, a Mexican mother). In Mexico, he was a child of privilege, owing to his family's lucrative contracts with Pemex in the State of Campeche. He obtained a BA in economics from the University of Tampa, with subsequent graduate work in accounting at the University of Campeche.


In 2000, he was elected a federal congressman, and, without prior experience (except for that of his family's business) was named to head the Energy Commission of the Chamber of Deputies.
It is not in the public record when he became part of the inner circle of Felipe Calderón, but, when Mr. Calderón was appointed Energy Minister in September 2003 (after the hapless Ernesto Martins), Mr. Mouriño followed him to the ministry as an advisor. In 2004, he was appointed Under Secretary for Electricity.


He left the Ministry four months after Mr. Calderón was dismissed in May of 2004 (technically, Mr. Calderón resigned on May 31). Briefly, he was Acting Secretary of Energy prior to the nomination of Fernando Elizondo.


Mr. Mouriño became the executive coordinator of the then-underdog campaign of Mr. Calderón to be the PAN presidential candidate, and later the coordinator of the PAN presidential campaign with Mr. Calderón as the candidate.


Mr. Mouriño was campaign coordinator in the spring of 2006 when I had lunch with him and Ernesto Cordero (who also had served in the Energy Ministry with Mr. Calderón, as Under Secretary for Planning, and who would later be appointed to a cabinet ministry in the government). The lunch, at the Suntory Restaurant near the World Trade Center in Mexico City, was arranged by Ricardo Silva, a Pemex platform contractor from Jalisco.


The conversation, which was in Spanish, revolved around the issues that a Calderón administration should pay attention to in the energy sector. I recall few details beyond that of my emphasizing the importance of developing a strategy for deepwater and cross-border oilfields. He and Ernesto expressed interest in these topics, but they revealed little of what was on their minds in the way of policy. As is usual from such encounters, there was little or no follow-up. I sent emails to him, but never received a reply.

After the election on July 2, Mr. Mouriño became the head of the Calderón Transition Team. The September 26, 2006 issue of Poder y Negocios featured the photograph of the strikingly handsome Mr. Mouriño on the cover, and he was described as the leader of Calderón's kinder (all young) of advisors and the person who would likely be the strong man in the next administration.


For the first two years of the Calderón administration, he was the chief of staff of the President, and then head of the Office of the President, substituting for Francisco Acuña, the former governor of Jalisco. He served just ten months in this position.


As the Interior Ministry is the official body of the executive branch that communicates with the Congress, all policy initiatives passed across his desk. It was rumored that he was the intellectual author of the Calderón energy reforms. Mr. Mouriño came under attack by Andrés Manuel López Obrador, who accused him of enriching his family business by arranging improper contracts with Pemex when he was a congressman and later when he was in the energy ministry (La Jornada, Feb. 28, 2008; NYT, March 15, 2008).


At the time of his death Mr. Mouriño was working to achieve a PAN majority in the Lower House of Congress from the elections scheduled for July 5, 2009. One line of speculation is that the reforms that were not passed in 2008 might be possible with a PAN-majority Lower House during the 2009-12 legislative period.


Mr. Mouriño's energy legacy is mixed: The energy reforms of 2008 are likely to benefit those service companies that, already, have lucrative contracts with Pemex. The reform of Article 33 of the Federal Administration Law provides that the Energy Ministry will submit to the Foreign Ministry (SRE) proposals for agreements and treaties for cross-border oilfields.


But neither Mr. Calderón nor Mr. Mouriño took up the heavy lifting of insisting – despite the populist rhetoric to the contrary – that the Mexican Constitution is neutral about the role of oil companies in Mexico. It is the Petroleum Law of 1958 that invents – without constitutional foundation – the notion that payment for the activities of exploration and production cannot be made as a percentage of production, a concept that was clearly stated in Articles 8 of the Petroleum Law of 1941.


Nor did either one, in the design of the Pemex Law of 2008, propose any measure that would fix the dysfunctional organization of the upstream subsidiary. In practice, as the oil companies have learned, combining the function of exploration with that of production is a great mistake. True, the Transitional Articles hint that there may be an important restructuring ahead in relation to the subsidiaries, but such a hint is no substitute for recognizing in the Senate Energy Forum that there are serious problems in Pemex Exploration & Production (PEP) – starting with the flawed logic of its very existence.


Finally, it was a big policy defeat for the Calderón administration not to prevail over the trucking lobby of Pemex jobbers (including the Mouriño family business Grupo Energético del Sureste).
Given the demonstrated skill with which Pemex, over the years, has kept the federal government in the dark about the degree to which Pemex is not in alignment with international practices, it is likely that Mr. Mouriño died unaware of the real reforms that are needed in Pemex and the energy sector.



——————————

George Baker is the director of Energia.com, a publishing and consulting firm based in Houston. He can be reached via e-mail at g.baker@energia.com.

http://www.mexidata.info/id2055.html

[jupiter]

Because there's more text, rants and chingaderas than pictures on the other thread.

Good move Tokamak.
Amen, brotherp-)

[alexgodinez]

hmmm i gues fx-05 is not cancelled.

[Dragunov]

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/americas/11/12/mexico.kidnappings/index.html?section=cnn_latest

27 farm workers kidnapped, Mexican authorities say

From Krupskaia Alis
CNN

MEXICO CITY, Mexico (CNN) -- Police were looking Wednesday for 27 farm workers who were kidnapped in northwestern Mexico, authorities said.

Gunmen in at least 20 vehicles descended on the farm workers' homes Monday morning, roused them from sleep and drove away with 27 men, witnesses said.

The kidnappers ordered women to remain in a barracks and told them not to call authorities during their roughly 30 minutes at the workers' compound, witnesses and relatives said.

The abductions happened in the Mexican state of Sinaloa.

Alfredo Bernal, a justice official in that state, said authorities have interviewed witnesses and are trying to find out what happened and to find the kidnap victims.

State and federal police told reporters they had no information on the victims' whereabouts. They have not ruled out the involvement of organized crime figures.

The abductions happened in an agricultural field known as "La Guajira," which is near a highway between the cities of Culiacan and El Dorado, in the municipality of Navolato.

The incident stirred fear among farm workers in northwestern Mexico.

They were left to wonder whether the kidnappers targeted the men for a specific reason or whether the abductions signal "the beginning of something that could affect all of us," said Manuel Tarriba, president of the Confederation of Agricultural Associations in Sinaloa.

It's the second mass kidnapping in two months in Mexico.

In September, the bodies of 24 men who had been kidnapped were found in Ocoyoacac, in central Mexico. That case remains under investigation.

[indiana46767]

Mexico, in November. 12, 2008 .- The Budget Committee of the Chamber of Deputies passed unanimously in the general opinion of the Expenditure Budget of the Federation for 2009, amounting to three trillion 45 thousand 478 million pesos.

After a meeting that began on Tuesday at 11:00 am, members of the committee on Wednesday approved the opinion, which will be printed and sent to the full chamber for analysis and, where appropriate, approval.

One of the last points in the annex was approved for the Special Concurrent Program for Campo, whose resources were set at 858.4 million 235 thousand pesos, exceeding the 214 million contained in the proposal by the Federal Executive.

The chairman of the board of the Chamber of Deputies, Cesar Duarte, reported that resources were approved by 48 billion pesos for the road sector, 32 billion for water infrastructure and 235 thousand 858 million for the field.

In an interview following the meeting of the Budget Committee, said that in the opinion was endorsed 37 proposals for the legislative committees that are integrated into the Expenditure Budget of the Federation.

The PRI legislator praised the unanimous passage in committee and hoped that this scenario could be repeated in the plenary vote, and if not, at least "by a huge majority."

Duarte stressed that the cut at the Federal Electoral Institute will be for 900 million pesos, but will be included in a transitional budget for that if required, the Ministry of Finance allocate additional resources to this body.

The opinion also included increases to the budgets of the National Autonomous University of Mexico (UNAM) for 700 million pesos to the National Polytechnic Institute (IPN), for 400 million, and the Autonomous Metropolitan University (UAM), by 350 million .

The legislator also said that this budget will be prioritized in the areas of public security, social development, the countryside, health and education.


Excellent!

[Felix U. Gómez]

Mexico, in November. 12, 2008 .-
The legislator also said that this budget will be prioritized in the areas of public security, social development, the countryside, health and education.

Excellent!

That's for Joker, who was complaining about the money for education.

[KoolD]

Gunmen kill Mexican police chief
http://imgs.xinhuanet.com/icon/2006english/2007korea/space.giffrom www.chinaview.cn (http://www.chinaview.cn) MEXICO CITY, Nov. 12 (Xinhua) -- Armed attackers on Wednesday killed the director of Mexico's Municipal Public Security Service and another policeman, and injured several others in the western city of Patzcuaro.
The General Prosecutor's Office of the western state of Michoacan said the attack occurred on Wednesday morning in front of the municipal prison, in the center of Patzcuaro.
The director, Miguel Angel Gonzalez Zambudio, and the policeman were shot dead by at least three gunmen when they were inside their patrol car. Another policeman who was near the site at the time of the attack, was seriously injured. President Felipe Calderon declared war on drug trafficking and organized crime when he took office in December 2006, but drug trafficking groups have launched even more fierce attacks. So far this year, violence linked to organized crime in the country has killed at least 3,000 people.

[Ordie]

Rosarito Beach losing tourists to crime fears

The mayor still pushes his seaside city as a cut-rate paradise. 'Tourists are not targeted,' he says. But violence linked to the drug war has made it a harder sell.
By Richard Marosi

November 12, 2008

Reporting from Rosarito Beach, Mexico — Mayor Hugo Torres has always pitched his seaside city as a cut-rate paradise. But even this relentless hometown booster is stumped these days: How do you sell the Mexican good life in the midst of a drug war?

The city's bustling main drag, Benito Juarez Boulevard, has been the scene of two shootings since September, including a drive-by slaying of a 15-year-old boy and three others in a pet store filled with frenzied puppies and canaries.

Gunmen shot down one police officer guarding a park. Two more officers were killed after finishing their shift, another two while on patrol. After the seventh cop killing in one month, officers in October marched on City Hall asking Torres for bulletproof vests and more guns. About 30 police officers have resigned in recent weeks.

Torres, a trim 72-year-old, surfs in front of his oceanfront home, which is guarded by six heavily armed officers. He used to visit California regularly to promote Rosarito Beach. There's not much point now, he said.

"I need something to tell the American people, what we have accomplished," Torres said in his exquisitely appointed City Hall office. "We have to fix the drug war."

As Mexico's offensive on organized crime has pushed the death toll in drug-related violence to about 4,000 this year, U.S. officials have warned citizens about travel in border areas because of the "increasingly violent fight for control of narcotics trafficking routes."

Their Mexican counterparts, however, say the nation's resort towns are safe, and Mexico's tourism board said the number of travelers to the country increased by about 5% in the first seven months of this year, compared with the same period last year.

If that's so, they don't appear to be showing up much in Rosarito Beach.

Once the economic engine of this city of 140,000 people, tourism has declined to such a degree that some hotels are considering closing for the winter. Dozens of curio shops and restaurants already are shuttered. And mega beach clubs that once attracted hordes of college students sit empty.

"It feels as quiet as an Oregon beach town. It's like: Where are all the people?" said Margaret Barr, a visitor from Portland.

No tourists killed

Torres invariably answers concerns with a statistic seldom mentioned in the sensational headlines: No tourists have been killed or targeted in Rosarito Beach, he said. And unless people come to sell or use drugs, they shouldn't encounter problems.

"Tourists are not targeted; citizens are not targeted. But the violence makes it feel dangerous to be around," Torres said. "It's very hard to know who's going to be hit next."

But even Torres acknowledges that it is difficult shaping perceptions when grim-faced federal agents patrol the town in Hummers, and tourists are stopped at checkpoints by Mexican marines with 50-caliber machine guns.

The owner of the landmark Rosarito Beach Hotel, the mayor long ago hitched his fortunes to the city, which he helped incorporate in 1995. In its heyday, the hotel, which sits on a pristine stretch of sand, drew stars such as Marilyn Monroe and Frank Sinatra, and it remains a favorite of Southern Californians who fill the hotel on summer weekends. Or used to fill it.

After serving as the town's first mayor, Torres returned to managing the hotel, watching Rosarito Beach double in size and become one of the fastest-growing cities in Mexico.

The city also became known for its corrupt police department, where officers supplemented their $800 monthly salaries by extorting money from tourists, many of them guests at one of the area's eight large hotels.

Torres said he decided last year to come out of retirement to clean up the corruption.

"If I owned a hot dog stand, I'd probably move. But I can't move my hotel, so I have to change the town," Torres said.

It hasn't been easy. Within two weeks of his hiring a reformer as secretary of public security last December, 12 police officers tried to kill the secretary in a shootout at police headquarters. A bodyguard died in the attack.

In September, the gang war in nearby Tijuana spilled over the arid hills, with rival factions of the Arellano Felix drug cartel vying for control of key trafficking corridors through the area's marina and isolated coastline.

Since September, at least 31 people, most of them with links to organized crime, have died in Rosarito Beach, according to the Baja California attorney general's office. On Tuesday, the body of a 28-year-old man was found in an empty lot. A loaded .22-caliber handgun was in his belt, authorities said.

Torres has received a couple of threatening phone calls from people claiming to be linked to a drug cartel. He now travels everywhere with a heavily armed security detail. A mild-mannered grandfather of five, Torres plays down the danger.

"If I don't forget about these things, I wouldn't sleep at night," Torres said. "And I sleep every night."

Many in the American expatriate community of about 14,000 say the mayor is putting up a good fight. Few U.S. retirees have been affected by the violence and most residents don't plan to move from a place where their fixed incomes afford them oceanfront views.

"We're sort of pretty resilient," said Anne Hines, a Canadian married to an American who publishes a newsletter for expatriates. "We're distressed more for Hugo Torres than our own particular safety."

Active mayor

Torres, who works 12-hour days, veers from routine duties to war-like crises. He visits poor colonias where residents thank him for paving roads or delivering electricity, and holds meetings at his city hall office for people concerned about rumors that their children will be kidnapped from schools.

On Halloween, the mayor urged children not to wear masks, lest criminals take advantage of the merriment to wreak more havoc. Halloween went off without incident.

Torres also encourages fellow business owners to lower their hotel and restaurant prices. At the Rosarito Beach Hotel, the midweek rate for a standard room is about $29.

There are bright spots. Next year, Hollywood is coming to town: The third film in the "Chronicles of Narnia" series is scheduled to begin shooting at nearby Baja Studios, which should pump millions of dollars into the local economy.

Torres claims to have wrested control of the police department from corrupt officers. And the drug war can't last forever, he says.

"I'm an optimist," Torres said. "My destiny is tied with Rosarito."

Source:http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-rosarito12-2008nov12,0,7904864,print.story

[indiana46767]

Source:http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-rosarito12-2008nov12,0,7904864,print.story


NOt good at all considering that the world economies are already bringing down tourism worldwide including mexico. This is another blow to the tourism industry...:roll:

[Felix U. Gómez]

Actually, if it weren't for the bad publicity, the world economic situation would probably be good for our tourist industry. We would be a cheap alternative for both Europeans and U.S. tourists. Unfortunately, I think that things will only get worse before they improve. Right now in Ciudad Juárez things seem a little bit out of control. I think that we need to fire our mayor. He's a pansy a** coward. His name is José Reyes Ferris and he seems do do nothing in the face of rising crime rates but say that everything is fine and dandy and then he goes and hides under his desk.

[Tokamak]

Actually, if it weren't for the bad publicity, the world economic situation would probably be good for our tourist industry. We would be a cheap alternative for both Europeans and U.S. tourists. Unfortunately, I think that things will only get worse before they improve. Right now in Ciudad Juárez things seem a little bit out of control. I think that we need to fire our mayor. He's a pansy a** coward. His name is José Reyes Ferris and he seems do do nothing in the face of rising crime rates but say that everything is fine and dandy and then he goes and hides under his desk.

Maybe, but tickets are getting way too expensive. If you don't buy them ontime you can pay up to 1000 pounds for one ticket. Obviously you always have the option to go to CanCun where you can find "cheap" packages that include the flight and accomodation.

[Ordie]

Americans are now doing the 'staycations' (vacation at home). Hotels are now marketing weekend retreats to local residents.

[indiana46767]

Americans are now doing the 'staycations' (vacation at home). Hotels are now marketing weekend retreats to local residents.

Really? Where is this? I guess that would be the safe alternative, but sucks for the worldwide tourism industry which is subsequently impacted by the economic situation.:cantbeli:

[Felix U. Gómez]

Tokamac,

You are right, plane tickets are getting too expensive and several of the new "low-fare" airlines that popped out during the last years have either stopped being low-fare or gone under. I've wanted to take a short weekend getaway to Oaxaca or Chiapas but the prices are getting ourtrageous.

Maybe when resorts and vacation destinations start feeling the pinch, they will lower prices and become bargains for those of us lucky to still have jobs.

[Ordie]

Really? Where is this? I guess that would be the safe alternative, but sucks for the worldwide tourism industry which is subsequently impacted by the economic situation.:cantbeli:

Mexicana has cut flights to tourist and ex-pat destinations from San Francisco. They are now introducing more direct flights from SFO-MEX aimed at business travelers.

The security situation and the state of the economy has many Americans thinking twice about going to Mexico. Moreover, many Mexican residents are foregoing the annual Christmas trips.

I was in Monterey, California last weekend (90 minute drive from San Francisco). The place was packed with local tourists from the Bay Area. It has beaches, attractions, nature, good food and history. No need to go to Mexico if you can have fun at home on the cheap.

[Ordie]

Maybe when resorts and vacation destinations start feeling the pinch, they will lower prices and become bargains for those of us lucky to still have jobs.

Not if the new Obama administration chooses to normalize relations with Cuba.

[Felix U. Gómez]

We could always give out addresses and go visit each other? What do you think? I guarantee that if you come to Ciudad Juárez you won't get bored? Lot's of stuff to see.
:roll:
Lot's of neat interesting stuff.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Not if the new Obama administration chooses to normalize relations with Cuba.

You can always go to Cuba through México you know?

[Ordie]

You can always go to Cuba through México you know?

Not since the Mexican Govt. started to pass information to the US Govt. about Americans flying to and from Cuba.

[alexgodinez]

you dont need planes to travel.. i always travel using bus. turimex.

[Tokamak]

http://videos.eluniversal.com.mx/n_videos/showVideo.php?id=9289


http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/notas/555588.html


It seems that the death of Murino was an accident.

[Dragunov]

Gunmen attack police convoy in Tijuana

Gunmen attack police convoy in Tijuana
10 hours ago

TIJUANA, Mexico (AP) — Gunmen attacked a state police convoy on a main boulevard in the Mexican border city of Tijuana, seriously wounding three policemen, state prosecutors reported Saturday.

A store owner was found shot to death nearby, though it was not clear if he was killed in Friday's attack on police or in a separate incident.

Attacks on lawmen have become increasingly brazen in many parts of Mexico as drug gangs try to intimidate honest officers pursuing them or to kill corrupt police in the pay of rival gangs in a rising wave of drug violence.

Tijuana police said Saturday they had found a man's severed head bound in duct tape beside a sign threatening members of a gang he allegedly belonged to. Three other bodies, all with bullet wounds, were also found on Friday in Tijuana.

In the nearby city of Tecate, an investigative police officer was found shot to death, and the body on another man — apparently an assailant killed while attacking the officer — was found nearby.

Also Saturday, Mexico's Defense Department reported that a regional military commander, Gen. Jorge Cardenas Canton, had committed suicide after suffering a sudden depression.

Cardenas Canton commanded army troops in Mexico's Yucatan Peninsula. Like all Mexican military officers, part of his duties included combating drug trafficking.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5gHWLUm1UtoG95H7QyRg_-GiMC4HQD94FJ2GG2

[LineDoggie]

you dont need planes to travel.. i always travel using bus. turimex.

Amphibious Buses to Cuba?

Schweet

[indiana46767]

Well i got some horrible news this weekend group, that my cousin was being chased by the B*stard "Zetas" or otherwise known as Gulf Cartel and he was involved in an automobile accident where he past. From what i hear they were trying to take his mustang, and opted to flee.. Makes me hate those B*stard that much more.. I hope they rot in h*ll... Things are getting better in Tamaulipas but in Reynosa the area is still too hott..

[Felix U. Gómez]

Really sorry to hear about your cousin. Things in Ciudad Juárez are still very hot too. The local police force is still not up to task and the army and feds are taken out to be sent to other hot spots around the country. The state police really isn't much help either. Still, there are a few successes against criminals once in a while.

[Dragunov]

Mexico top export market for Oregon Christmas trees

by Len Reed
Sunday November 16, 2008, 12:42 PM
SALEM -- Mexico is again the top export market for Oregon Christmas trees this year.

Oregon Department of Agriculture officials say the state remains the nation's top producer of Christmas trees and expects to sell as many as 8 million trees this holiday season. About 13 percent of the state's harvest will be bound for Mexico.


Trees are already headed for Pacific Rim countries, Puerto Rico, and other faraway markets.

Domestic sales are expected to be stable despite the national economic meltdown.

Industry officials say they actually see more Christmas tree sales during a soft economy.

-- The Associated Press

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/index.ssf/2008/11/mexico_top_export_for_oregon_c.html

:) Navidad is here guys.

[jupiter]

Well, things going to be worst. Zetas and Family and whethever narcos will try to respond agresivily. we'll see serious episodes of violence. But hope is there. Far still.

[indiana46767]

After the tragedy in which he died the Interior Minister Juan Camilo Mouriño, and 13 others, authorities and experts raised the need for pilots of the Mexican Air Force (FAM), under orders of the Presidential General Staff (EMP) tripulen are those who travel by all public officials and not just the President.


The regulation stipulates that EMP is for the General Staff "to provide the air transport service of the President, as well as public servants and public figures to be determined by the president himself."


The pilot who manned the jet where Mouriño died was a commercial pilot.


Jorge Luis Sierra, a specialist in issues of security, said that "there was a lack of compliance with the work of the EMP" by failing to certify pilots who manned the ship of Mouriño.


Jose Carreno Carlon, spokesman of former president Salinas, stressed that when he was in presidency did not know which planes were manned by commercial pilots, but the FAM.


Luis Tellez, Secretary of Communications and Transport, said that only the president has pilots of the FAM, but acknowledged that after the tragedy, "it has to be extended to all civil servants."


http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/primera/31970.html

Lets see if this prevents this act from happening

[jupiter]

Question: where are Thejocker, dragunov, indiana, even wolfpack in this thread?.

[indiana46767]

Question: where are Thejocker, dragunov, indiana, even wolfpack in this thread?.


Im here. What was the question?

[indiana46767]

Does anyone know the specifics as far as the energy reform is concerned. How many refineries are to be built. What are the limitations as far as contacts to third parties is? Are they still thinking about having a third party company run the refineries???

[jupiter]

Does anyone know the specifics as far as the energy reform is concerned. How many refineries are to be built. What are the limitations as far as contacts to third parties is? Are they still thinking about having a third party company run the refineries???
It is still a mess. 1 refinery, location unknown. And are you crazy? The Union(sindicato) willnot tolerate anybody else run "their prerogatives"p-)

[Felix U. Gómez]

Question: where are Thejocker, dragunov, indiana, even wolfpack in this thread?.

Dragunov and Indiana are both here, Thejocker got suspended for a while, and wolfpack, well, he really has nothing interesting to contribute. :roll:

[indiana46767]

It is still a mess. 1 refinery, location unknown. And are you crazy? The Union(sindicato) willnot tolerate anybody else run "their prerogatives"p-)

HOpe you are right because i don't approve of this either. We have great refinery workers to be outsourcing these jobs.

[jupiter]

Dragunov and Indiana are both here, Thejocker got suspended for a while, and wolfpack, well, he really has nothing interesting to contribute. :roll:
Only what his brother do!p-)

[jupiter]

HOpe you are right because i don't approve of this either. We have great refinery workers to be outsourcing these jobs.
What PEMEX needs is drill deeper in the Gulf. But with no technology...I'm afraid the reserves will go lower every year. Believe me, if they do nothing, 5-6 years from now we'll see bad things in Mexico.

[indiana46767]

What PEMEX needs is drill deeper in the Gulf. But with no technology...I'm afraid the reserves will go lower every year. Believe me, if they do nothing, 5-6 years from now we'll see bad things in Mexico.

I coincide with your point. If drilling in the "Hoyo de dona" is not done, then what is going to probably happen is that the US platforms are going to suck out the reverse through the straw effect. Not good news concidering that the treaty is expiring within the next year or two...:bash:


http://pocamadrenews.files.wordpress.com/2008/06/hoyo-de-dona-oeste-2.png


A thousand meters deep seabed (approximately between 2500 to more than 3500 meters) lie extraordinary deposits of hydrocarbons that, in some cases, are divided between two or more countries, thus exceeding the limits of each.

This is called cross-deposits in Mexico known as pits of gifts, or that have holes, much less form of bread.

The term "donut hole" is associated with certain geological formations that are located in the geographic space in the adjacent marine jurisdictions in the United States and Mexico.

In reality it is the geographic area located in the western Gulf of Mexico (beyond 200 nautical miles), also known under the name Western polygon, a territory of 17 thousand 190 square kilometers, of which, through a agreement, 61.78% related to Mexico and the remaining 38.22% to U.S.

[Tokamak]

What PEMEX needs is drill deeper in the Gulf. But with no technology...I'm afraid the reserves will go lower every year. Believe me, if they do nothing, 5-6 years from now we'll see bad things in Mexico.

There is still a good amount of oil inland and in shallow waters, and PEMEX is already obtaining oil (three platforms as far as I remember) from deep waters. I agree PEMEX needs more resources for technology, but made in Mexico.

[indiana46767]

There is still a good amount of oil inland and in shallow waters, and PEMEX is already obtaining oil (three platforms as far as I remember) from deep waters. I agree PEMEX needs more resources for technology, but made in Mexico.

There is inland oil but i think that PEMEX needs to look beyond the obvious reserves that we have before we lose them to other more $$$ driven oil companies. Lets put more money for exploration and technology. I would accept a third party company to come help us drill the oil out, but to pay them in $$ not oil.

[Dragunov]

Interesting Video reports of the Mexican Menonites. According to stadistics there are 60,000 living in Mexico.

http://www.youtube.com/v/S6ZBIkE8I5g
http://www.youtube.com/v/C3uQgEJeic8
http://www.youtube.com/v/NwULYWuaO4E

[jupiter]

There is still a good amount of oil inland and in shallow waters, and PEMEX is already obtaining oil (three platforms as far as I remember) from deep waters. I agree PEMEX needs more resources for technology, but made in Mexico.
But is it not easier to get the technology tha'ts already there? yes, Pemex wil pay extra for use it, but rather use it right now, instead of use several years to develop it in the country.

[Felix U. Gómez]

There is still a good amount of oil inland and in shallow waters, and PEMEX is already obtaining oil (three platforms as far as I remember) from deep waters. I agree PEMEX needs more resources for technology, but made in Mexico.

I agree that, when available, we should use and develop our own technology, but when the need is urgent, we should take advantage of what is already out there. What is wrong with hiring the services of people or companies that have considerable experience in exploring, finding, drilling, building, and extracting in these deep ocean areas if the oil is still ours? We pay them for their services and stamp Pemex on the drums. Everybody does it. No big deal. Later, the technology and know-how will be ours. Both Jupiter and Indiana are right; if we don't use it, we loose it.

[jupiter]

Now, now, now. It's urgent. I may sound alarmist; but it's a matter of a country survival. No oil, no revenue. No revenue...:-(

[Tokamak]

I agree that, when available, we should use and develop our own technology, but when the need is urgent, we should take advantage of what is already out there. What is wrong with hiring the services of people or companies that have considerable experience in exploring, finding, drilling, building, and extracting in these deep ocean areas if the oil is still ours? We pay them for their services and stamp Pemex on the drums. Everybody does it. No big deal. Later, the technology and know-how will be ours. Both Jupiter and Indiana are right; if we don't use it, we loose it.

That oil is extracted with technology from other companies not PEMEX, so it is already possible to do that without the so called "Reforma".

[indiana46767]

By: Roberto Morales
A Mexican built Spy plane flies routinely by Georgia as part of the operations to prevent illegal or improper incursion of any ship in its heritage of the Black Sea area. This is one of eight unmanned surveillance aircraft that the company Hydra Technologies has sold since December 2007, at a cost of between 800,000 USD and 3 million each.

The aircraft has a range of flight of eight hours, has three cameras, an electro, another high-definition and one more with infrared equipment, and is controlled from a central phone installed in a vehicle.

The Colombian government has acquired another vessel to monitor the armed forces against drug trafficking and guerrillas. And one more was placed in the U.S., where they can define a path to tankers so they do not collide with whales on their way through the Bering Strait.

Alvaro Gutierrez, director of Marketing for the company hopes to put two other aircraft before the end of the year.

Excellent start for the exportation of these planes.

[alexgodinez]

By: Roberto Morales
A Mexican built Spy plane flies routinely by Georgia as part of the operations to prevent illegal or improper incursion of any ship in its heritage of the Black Sea area. This is one of eight unmanned surveillance aircraft that the company Hydra Technologies has sold since December 2007, at a cost of between 800,000 USD and 3 million each.

The aircraft has a range of flight of eight hours, has three cameras, an electro, another high-definition and one more with infrared equipment, and is controlled from a central phone installed in a vehicle.

The Colombian government has acquired another vessel to monitor the armed forces against drug trafficking and guerrillas. And one more was placed in the U.S., where they can define a path to tankers so they do not collide with whales on their way through the Bering Strait.

Alvaro Gutierrez, director of Marketing for the company hopes to put two other aircraft before the end of the year.

Excellent start for the exportation of these planes.

wehn did we make spy planes???i am wayyyyy behind..

[indiana46767]

wehn did we make spy planes???i am wayyyyy behind..

Are you serioussss?!

Here let me update you with our technological advancements...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9a/S4ehecatl3.jpg/800px-S4ehecatl3.jpg (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/S4ehecatl3.jpg)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/67/Gavilan2.jpg (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/6/67/Gavilan2.jpg)

Hydra Technologies of Mexico

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Hydra Technologies of MexicoType (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Types_of_companies)Private (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privately-held_company)Headquarters[/URL]Mexico (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Flag_of_Mexico.svg)Industry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industry)Aerospace (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerospace)Products (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Product_(business))Unmanned aerial vehicles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unmanned_aerial_vehicle)Employees (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Employment)100 (2008 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008))Website (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Website)http://www.hydra-technologies.com (http://www.hydra-technologies.com/)Hydra Technologies of Mexico (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexico) is a firm dedicated to the design and development of unmanned aerial vehicles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unmanned_aerial_vehicle) for surveillance operations. The company has one hundred employees and as of mid-2008 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008) has two operational models, the S4 Ehécatl (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_Eh%C3%A9catl) and the E1 Gavilán (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_Gavil%C3%A1n).
Contents

[hide (javascript:toggleToc())]
<LI class=toclevel-1>1 Operations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#Operations) <LI class=toclevel-1>2 S4 Ehécatl (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#S4_Eh.C3.A9catl) <LI class=toclevel-1>3 E1 Gavilán (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#E1_Gavil.C3.A1n) <LI class=toclevel-1>4 In Development (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#In_Development) <LI class=toclevel-1>5 Awards (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#Awards) <LI class=toclevel-1>6 See also (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#See_also) <LI class=toclevel-1>7 References (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#References)
8 External links (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#External_links)

[edit (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico&action=edit&section=1)] Operations

The S4 Ehécatl and E1 Gavilán are used in Mexico for ecological supervision, civilian protection, surveillance (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surveillance) and the War on Drugs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_on_Drugs).[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_note-0) The State of Jalisco (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jalisco) use them for detection of polluting sources in Río Grande de Santiago (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%ADo_Grande_de_Santiago) and for surveillance over Guadalajara (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guadalajara,_Jalisco) in search for flooding-sensitive zones. They are also used by other countries.[2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_note-Hydra_milenio-1)

[edit (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico&action=edit&section=2)] S4 Ehécatl

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9a/S4ehecatl3.jpg/200px-S4ehecatl3.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:S4ehecatl3.jpg)
The S4 Ehécatl (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:S4ehecatl3.jpg) landing


Main article: Hydra Technologies Ehécatl (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_Eh%C3%A9catl)
Development began in 2002 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002) as a joint effort between the Government of Mexico (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_of_Mexico), the Financial Sector, and Mexican academic and scientific institutions.[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)] Its main function is to provide security and surveillance capabilities in support of the Armed Forces, as well as civilian protection in hazardous situations. According to the manufacturer, the drone "observes what happens by land or sea. Because of its unmanned nature, it can enter dangerous zones being undetected"[cite this quote (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citing_sources#When_quoting_someone)] and is "an effective solution of the border problems between the U.S. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States) and Mexico."[3] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_note-2)
The S4 Ehécatl has a complex electronic system designed to provide up to eight hours of autonomous flight in either daytime or nighttime conditions. It is controlled from a mobile central facility installed in a specially-equipped three-man ground vehicle[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)]. Apart from an American-made FLIR (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forward_looking_infrared) thermal video (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermography) system, all of the craft's components are designed, developed and manufactured in-house (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In-house).[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)]

[edit (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico&action=edit&section=3)] E1 Gavilán

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/6/67/Gavilan2.jpg/200px-Gavilan2.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Gavilan2.jpg)
The [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_Gavil%C3%A1n"]E1 Gavilán (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Gavilan2.jpg) in flight


Main article: Hydra Technologies Gavilán (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_Gavil%C3%A1n)
This is a miniature UAV (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniature_UAVs) with ninety minutes of flight autonomy, controlled by a single user through a portable GCS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geographic_coordinate_system). As the S4 Ehécatl, the E1 Gavilán is the result of a joint effort of the institutions mentioned above[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)] and is also equiped with a FLIR thermal video system, which allows nightime operation. It was presented on June 10th (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/June_10th) in San Diego (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Diego), California (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California), in AUVSI (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_for_Unmanned_Vehicle_Systems_International_(AUVSI))'s Unmanned Systems North America 2008, an important event for this particular industry. The european (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe) debut (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debut) took place on July 14th (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/July_14th) of the same year at the Farnborough Airshow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farnborough_Airshow).

[edit (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico&action=edit&section=4)] In Development

As of 2008, the company has another model in process of design, the S5 Cuculcán (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hydra_Technologies_Cuculc%C3%A1n&action=edit&redlink=1). It will be able to fly up to sixteen hours without detection and provide a portable data recovery (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_recovery) system.[2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_note-Hydra_milenio-1)

[edit (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico&action=edit&section=5)] Awards


Al Aube Outstanding Contributor Award for the development of the S4 Ehécatl by AUSVI (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_for_Unmanned_Vehicle_Systems_International_(AUVSI)) (2007 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007))[4] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_note-3)
Leonardo Da Vinci award for the development of the S4 Ehécatl and the D1 Gavilán by the International Aeronautics Congress of Mexico (2008)
Special award by the Jalisco State Council of Science and Technology for its contribution to the Information, Microelectronics and Communication Industries in Mexico (2008)

[edit (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico&action=edit&section=6)] See also


Hydra Technologies Ehécatl (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_Eh%C3%A9catl)
Hydra Technologies Gavilán (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_Gavil%C3%A1n)

[edit (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico&action=edit&section=7)] References

<LI id=cite_note-0>^ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_ref-0) Martínez Carballo, Nurit (2008 - 08 -13). "Vuela alto el Politécnico (http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/sociedad/511.html)" (in Spanish), El Universal. Retrieved on 13 August 2008. <LI id=cite_note-Hydra_milenio-1>^ a (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_ref-Hydra_milenio_1-0) b (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_ref-Hydra_milenio_1-1) Estrada Cortes, Jesús (2008). "Industrias electrónicas presumen expansiones (http://www.milenio.com/guadalajara/milenio/nota.asp?id=642754)" (in Spanish). Retrieved on 2008-08-4. <LI id=cite_note-2>^ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_ref-2) Quoted from press release, Hydra Technologies (2007)
^ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydra_Technologies_of_Mexico#cite_ref-3) Hydra Technologies (2007).

[indiana46767]

Financial group Inbursa, Carlos Slim, acquired for $ 134 million 26 million shares of Citigroup

MEXICO CITY, Mexico, in November. 25, 2008 .- Carlos Slim, through Grupo Financiero Inbursa, bought $ 134 million on 26 million shares of Citigroup.

According to Bloomberg.com portal, Mexican businessman bought the shares through a series of transactions that began on Nov. 19.

Following the announcement by the U.S. government for a package to heal the finances of the banking giant, Citigroup shares have risen 60 percent.

Carlos Slim is considered the second richest man in the world.

http://www2.esmas.com/noticierostelevisa/mexico/026439/slim-compra-134-mdd-acciones-citigroup

This is what blows me outta the water, we have the second richest man in the world are they country is still financially struggling...

[AztecMex]

By: Roberto Morales

A Mexican built Spy plane flies routinely by Georgia as part of the operations to prevent illegal or improper incursion of any ship in its heritage of the Black Sea area. This is one of eight unmanned surveillance aircraft that the company Hydra Technologies has sold since December 2007, at a cost of between 800,000 USD and 3 million each.


The aircraft has a range of flight of eight hours, has three cameras, an electro, another high-definition and one more with infrared equipment, and is controlled from a central phone installed in a vehicle.


The Colombian government has acquired another vessel to monitor the armed forces against drug trafficking and guerrillas. And one more was placed in the U.S., where they can define a path to tankers so they do not collide with whales on their way through the Bering Strait.


Alvaro Gutierrez, director of Marketing for the company hopes to put two other aircraft before the end of the year.



Excellent start for the exportation of these planes.

This is the best news i have read all day :)

[Felix U. Gómez]

By: Roberto Morales
A Mexican built Spy plane flies routinely by Georgia as part of the operations to prevent illegal or improper incursion of any ship in its heritage of the Black Sea area. This is one of eight unmanned surveillance aircraft that the company Hydra Technologies has sold since December 2007, at a cost of between 800,000 USD and 3 million each.

The aircraft has a range of flight of eight hours, has three cameras, an electro, another high-definition and one more with infrared equipment, and is controlled from a central phone installed in a vehicle.

The Colombian government has acquired another vessel to monitor the armed forces against drug trafficking and guerrillas. And one more was placed in the U.S., where they can define a path to tankers so they do not collide with whales on their way through the Bering Strait.

Alvaro Gutierrez, director of Marketing for the company hopes to put two other aircraft before the end of the year.

Excellent start for the exportation of these planes.


Sweet!!!!

I wonder how many (if any) we have operating? We need them!

[jklv]

Awesome! Mexico is a competing UAV power :)

[Felix U. Gómez]

Look guys, this is what I call B.S. (chingaderas), the president submitted his proposal for reforms for laws having to do with security and the left and the PRI are just trying to find ways to gain political capital on this rather than doing things quickly to aleviate the situation. In Ciudad Juárez we are rapidly nearing 1400 deaths since January and these idiots say that there is no rush. I guess that's easy to say when you walk around with tax payer sponsored body guards. Sometimes I wonder if a "Fujimorazo" wouldn't be such a bad thing, but my democratic vocation gets the better of me. :roll:

Members of the Democratic Revolution Party (PRD) said that his bloc will not give its approval to an opinion of General Law of Public Security as a term of the current negotiation, so that there will be no draft to be presented to the plenary on Tuesday.

Lawmakers Juan Guerra, Andres Lozano and David Mendoza thwarted agreements of the coordinators of the Congress, that morning listed four projects, which are part of reforms in public security.

They reported that while the PAN is agreed that the President of the Republic at the head of the Consultative Council of Public Security, the PRD bloc demand that the law leaves out any form of "overrepresentation" and therefore argue that there is "concurrent responsibilities. "

David Mendoza, who is secretary of the pubic Security Commission, explained the concept of overlapping of responsibilities PRD.

It is, he said, "that not everything is in charge of the Federation."

Perhaps it will be approved by the Chamber of Deputies, in this and next week, the General Law of Public Security, said legislator Juan Guerra.

And this project will result in any case, other laws, such as the Federal Police.

He said that this day is only a discussion of the General Law of Public Security, and considers the remote possibility that San Lazaro in the commission dealing with revising the draft Federal Police.

Guerra said that "time is not a problem," since that issue may be cause for a special session in January or in any case be entered on the themes of the period commencing in February 2009.

The commitments of the Chamber of Deputies pointed to pass before December 15 of the Laws of Public Security, the Federal Police and anti-legislation.

During the afternoon of Monday, at San Lazaro have been convened to deliberate on these matters commissions of Public Security and Justice, in separate sessions.

The PRD said they should make the exercise of debate, without the imposition of majorities, given that the closer the positions of parliamentary groups is one of the virtues of legislative work.

MMA / MLF

http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/notas/559627.html

mothef....s

[Airgun_Hunter]

Hey Felix.

That is indeed F'ed up news. In TJ there was a 42 death toll just the weekend. Violence between druglors are getting worse each time and the sad part is that innocent people get killed.

Beheaded, dismembered bodies are the usual, it sickening that we're kind of getting used to watching this kind of sorry @ss news every day.

All this chaos is just beneffiting the opposing political parties to throw more crap into the fan pointing to the party in power right now to blame them for all the PRI allowed to do during their 70 something years reign of terror.

[jupiter]

Hey guys, sadly but it's Mexico's politicians. First them and second them. They care nothing about the population, blaming the president's party, instead of for once, use de common sense, but noooooooooooooooooooooooooo, they're using the body counting as a measure for the president's failure, more bodies, more blaming, but what about the legislation to help control the violence?. We'll see more of this *****it near the midterm elections. Only gains for they're owns parties and the rest of Mexico? Just electoral meat, that's all.

[Felix U. Gómez]

I want to buy a gun for self defense. Do any of you guys know if .380 caliber is legal? According to what I read in other forums it is.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Hey Felix.

That is indeed F'ed up news. In TJ there was a 42 death toll just the weekend. Violence between druglors are getting worse each time and the sad part is that innocent people get killed.

Beheaded, dismembered bodies are the usual, it sickening that we're kind of getting used to watching this kind of sorry @ss news every day.

All this chaos is just beneffiting the opposing political parties to throw more crap into the fan pointing to the party in power right now to blame them for all the PRI allowed to do during their 70 something years reign of terror.

I think that both Tijuana and Cd. Juárez are going through the same thing at the moment. I never remember things being so bad as the current moment. The only difference right now I think is that the narcs here have yet to grow balls large enough to stand face to face with the army. The closest they've gotten is a drive by. Bunch of maricas. But they are as bloody and disgusting as anywhere, with decapitations and all. This weekend they killed eight guys in a restaurant. It seems like the pendejos might have made a mistake and got the wrong guys. SOB's

[jupiter]

In USA you may buy any caliber. Even a Barret. In Mexico, well...

[jupiter]

Better the Beretta 9mm.

[indiana46767]

I want to buy a gun for self defense. Do any of you guys know if .380 caliber is legal? According to what I read in other forums it is.

From what i understand it is legal for mexican citizens to posses firearms but through SEDENA, licensing and purchasing from them. It's my guess that a gun like 9mm would be the max allowed??? Correct me if im wrong...

[indiana46767]

In USA you may buy any caliber. Even a Barret. In Mexico, well...

Yea that would be mostly true.

[jupiter]

Indiana, did you see the news yesterday?. Most of the weapons to the narcos come from Houston.

[indiana46767]

Indiana, did you see the news yesterday?. Most of the weapons to the narcos come from Houston.

No shocker there, they are also LOTS of gunshops springing up in the valley of Texas because of the Narco shopping sprees that the suppliers conduct.
I can tell you guys that one time i went to the gun range over here in West Houston i saw a Mexican national "paisano" buying 3 glocks with extended clips Cash. I could almost guarantee you that these were giong to be exported to mexico. The gun shop owner mentioned to me, "Man this guys must really like his glocks. He came in last week and bough the same ones with extender clips cash" - In the back of my mind i was like, man are you seriously that dumb? But what can you do, we have the right to bear arms here in the states and well sometimes idiots make a profit at the cost of others lives... :cantbeli:

[jupiter]

Agree; moreover, when you buy a gun: don't you have to fill out a form?, that paperwork is investigated by the FBI (ID, Adress,) an AFTER several days the gunshop calls you back, and you may pickup your gun. So my guess is that the clerks in Houston just don't care where the guns end, Just money, money. And the sales in cash, should be reported also to the FBI or Homeland Security or other department.

[indiana46767]

Agree; moreover, when you buy a gun: don't you have to fill out a form?, that paperwork is investigated by the FBI (ID, Adress,) an AFTER several days the gunshop calls you back, and you may pickup your gun. So my guess is that the clerks in Houston just don't care where the guns end, Just money, money.

Yes you must fill out official paper work to send it to the FBI for a background information. They are more careless at gun shows...badddd...since they are usually there for days at a time, they just give you a quick check and your gone.

[Felix U. Gómez]

From what i understand it is legal for mexican citizens to posses firearms but through SEDENA, licensing and purchasing from them. It's my guess that a gun like 9mm would be the max allowed??? Correct me if im wrong...


No, 9mm is definitely out of the question. It is considered a military caliber and therefore restricted only to the armed forces and police. I think that the largest caliber handgun that you can legally posses is a .380. I want something not large (a 9mm would be out of the question unless I want to end up in jail) and with the largest punch possible, therefore .380 is the only way to go, the rest being too little, like .22, .25, and .32. .357 is not allowed. I was considering the Ruger .380 LCP but there is currently a factory recall and they are hard to find.

[Shadowstorm]

No shocker there, they are also LOTS of gunshops springing up in the valley of Texas because of the Narco shopping sprees that the suppliers conduct.
I can tell you guys that one time i went to the gun range over here in West Houston i saw a Mexican national "paisano" buying 3 glocks with extended clips Cash. I could almost guarantee you that these were giong to be exported to mexico. The gun shop owner mentioned to me, "Man this guys must really like his glocks. He came in last week and bough the same ones with extender clips cash" - In the back of my mind i was like, man are you seriously that dumb? But what can you do, we have the right to bear arms here in the states and well sometimes idiots make a profit at the cost of others lives... :cantbeli:
What I also found strange you got to be a U.S citizen to own a gun, but just like you said, those gunshop owners care about money and could careless who they sold it to.

[indiana46767]

What I also found strange you got to be a U.S citizen to own a gun, but just like you said, those gunshop owners care about money and could careless who they sold it to.

Correction you have to minimum resident. Sorry, i just remember that my roommate is a resident and he purchase a .40 Glock..

[Shadowstorm]

In USA you may buy any caliber. Even a Barret. In Mexico, well...
If you had a Class 3 license, you can military small arms like the M-4, MP-5, M-249 and grenade launchers like M-203, but you have to have a clean record to have it though.

[indiana46767]

If you had a Class 3 license, you can military small arms like the M-4, MP-5, M-249 and grenade launchers like M-203, but you have to have a clean record to have it though.

Are you talking about in the States? Really? Well honestly i don't know why anyone would go to get that license when you can practically buy military weapons but in semi auto.. Don't

[indiana46767]

If you had a Class 3 license, you can military small arms like the M-4, MP-5, M-249 and grenade launchers like M-203, but you have to have a clean record to have it though.

Are you talking about in the States? Really? Well honestly i don't know why anyone would go to get that license when you can practically buy military weapons but in semi auto.. Don't get me wrong room. I love the right that i have to own guns, because i think that one must have the right to protect their domain, its just that some of my comrads take the right and turn it into profit...< not good.

[Shadowstorm]

Well it's a federal license when you get from BATF agency. However, the people who gets this license are mostly from security, PMC's and other companies, while some are gun collectors.

[indiana46767]

Well it's a federal license when you get from BATF agency. However, the people who gets this license are mostly from security, PMC's and other companies, while some are gun collectors.

Very interesting.

[Shadowstorm]

Are you talking about in the States? Really? Well honestly i don't know why anyone would go to get that license when you can practically buy military weapons but in semi auto.. Don't get me wrong room. I love the right that i have to own guns, because i think that one must have the right to protect their domain, its just that some of my comrads take the right and turn it into profit...< not good.
True, you always got people who wants to f**k s**t up for other people who's obeying the law.

[indiana46767]

SALTILLO, Mexico, in December. 2, 2008 .- With 22 votes for and 10 against, the Congress of Coahuila tonight approved the initiative which envisages the death penalty for kidnappers to kill their hostages.


In this way, the local Legislature will ask the Congress to reform Articles 14 and 22 of the Constitution of the United Mexican States, to empower the states to establish their local laws applying the death penalty.


The opinion of the Commission of Government was approved by Congress in the state, with 22 votes cast by members of the PRI, PVEM and Democratic Unity of Coahuila, while 10 legislators of the PAN and PRD covered against.


The Commission of Government presented the opinion on the initiative presented last Friday by Governor Humberto Moreira Valdes to the State Congress, so as to promote an initiative in this respect to the Congress.


This opinion has caused an Risp debate between deputies of the Institutional Revolutionary party (PRI) and National Action (PAN), which lasted six hours, until at 22:22 hours was endorsed the opinion.

=====================================================

Yes! This is fair and correct, im glad one state in the repulic is taking the steps required to correct this issue.

[Shadowstorm]

That's good news.

[Airgun_Hunter]

SALTILLO, Mexico, in December. 2, 2008 .- With 22 votes for and 10 against, the Congress of Coahuila tonight approved the initiative which envisages the death penalty for kidnappers to kill their hostages.


In this way, the local Legislature will ask the Congress to reform Articles 14 and 22 of the Constitution of the United Mexican States, to empower the states to establish their local laws applying the death penalty.


The opinion of the Commission of Government was approved by Congress in the state, with 22 votes cast by members of the PRI, PVEM and Democratic Unity of Coahuila, while 10 legislators of the PAN and PRD covered against.


The Commission of Government presented the opinion on the initiative presented last Friday by Governor Humberto Moreira Valdes to the State Congress, so as to promote an initiative in this respect to the Congress.


This opinion has caused an Risp debate between deputies of the Institutional Revolutionary party (PRI) and National Action (PAN), which lasted six hours, until at 22:22 hours was endorsed the opinion.

=====================================================

Yes! This is fair and correct, im glad one state in the repulic is taking the steps required to correct this issue.


About dammmmned time if you ask me. I saw an interview witth the governor of Coahuila and he seemed very convinced about the death penalty and he made some interesting remarks about congress... questioning on whose part they are, with the murderers or with the people that with their votes put them in those positions?

I'm all for the death penalty for high profile criminals, I just hope that if they make it right, gather proof to convict them and sentence them and not more than 1 year 'till death by firing squad or hanging takes place.

I don't like how it's done in the US. Waiting for 6-10 years in death roll 'till their time is up and they still can get out of it by asking mercy from the governor or presindent.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Four words: ain't going to happen

[indiana46767]

Four words: ain't going to happen

It should be law that they give the states the right to enforce a death penalty through the voters. Have a Pebecito, or citizens vote and if the citizens vote yes, let it be. They are the victims in most cases and should have their say. THe constitution in this aspect is outdated and should be ratified. We have a president that i think would approve this new measure.

[indiana46767]

We have the Death penalty here in the states that is very different than what is to be the death penalty in mexico. The differnce is that the death penalty in mexico would be strictly for kidnappers who continue killing their victims, over here its for someone who murders someone. Think about, if it was your family member that was killed by these crooks wouldn't you want them to pay for it with their life? Rot in jail at the taxpayers expense, or eye for an eye? Think about it for a min.

[Felix U. Gómez]

It should be law that they give the states the right to enforce a death penalty through the voters. Have a Pebecito, or citizens vote and if the citizens vote yes, let it be. They are the victims in most cases and should have their say. THe constitution in this aspect is outdated and should be ratified. We have a president that i think would approve this new measure.

I'm not arguing against it when I say that it isn't going to happen, quite frankly I've grown so tired of the situation and have grown to despise kidnappers to such an extent that I personally would like them to be tortured for a while before being executed (preferably if we could bring back burning at the stake, or the "bellowing bull" from the Minoan culture). However the subject is very politically charged in Mexico and those who would argue against it would have a very strong argument. To begin with, they would argue that countries like the U.S. that have the death penalty for murderers have not managed to dissuade people from committing murders. They would also argue that if Mexico approved the death penalty it would be joining a select group of countries around the world that do have it, like China, the U.S., Iraq, Saudi Arabia, and Lybia, I think. Not a very distinguished crowd. No European country has it, as a matter of fact, the U.S., while having a larger murder rate, is the only developed nation in the world that has the death penalty. They would also argue that the death penalty almost always favors the wealthy (who can afford the good lawyers) and is always unfavorable to the poor (they would be screwed). Besides, I would bet anything that the Catholic Church would put up a big fight against that one as would all human rights organizations (ironically, no one thinks about the human rights of the victims do they?). So, you see, to reinstate the death penalty in Mexico would be an uphill battle that would take a long time. We need to focus the pressure on getting kidnappers and traitors (anyone in government who cooperates with organized crime or enemies of the state) life sentences that stick.
I really think that life in prison is worse than the death penalty. The death penalty is an easy way out, while life with prison you have every day for the rest of your life to think about all the good things that they are missing.
That's just my two cents. If they where to actually implant it, I would be OK with it.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Here, see what I mean. Just the mention about the possibility brings out opponents to the issue:


EFE
El Universal
Mexico City Friday, 05 December 2008
12:26

Amnesty International (AI) today criticized the sectors that justify the restoration of the death penalty in Mexico, following the debate emerged this week that the request was made by a state to the federal Congress to discuss the matter.

"The proposals and initiatives that seek an easy way out to the situation in the country only serve to reinforce a climate of social revenge," said AI.

The organization has, moreover, that "there is a danger not only to justify the use of the death penalty, but the commission of other serious violations to human rights such as the use of torture, abuse, executions or arbitrary detention. "

These measures, he said in a statement, would create "lawlessness, injustice and insecurity."

Amnesty International stated that "the reintroduction of the death penalty as a method of deterring crime has been proven as useless and ineffective in a wide variety of countries and contexts."

It requested the authorities not to forget that "the Mexican State, as a signatory of the American Convention on Human Rights, has the distinct inability to reinstate the death penalty in its judicial system."

The state of Coahuila, in northern Iraq and border with Texas (USA), on Tuesday asked Congress to approve an amendment to the Constitution to restore such punishment in the case of the hijackers who murdered their victims.

Several governors of other states, representatives of political parties, deputies and senators have expressed favorable to the project or at least to consider the initiative.

In this regard, AI regretted that "both political parties as representatives of government used the issue of public safety in an irresponsible manner suggesting that the reimposition of the death penalty will mean an effective response against crime."

"It is essential that the government show leadership to confront these purposes wrong and dangerous to the public to withhold full commitment to abolish the death penalty," concluded the organization.

The death penalty, which is not in the criminal codes of any of the 32 states included in the Constitution until 2005, the year in which it was abolished for cases of treason, parricide, aggravated murder and other crimes .

However, it did not apply in the country since 1961, when a soldier was executed in Saltillo, Coahuila's capital precisely.

The unstoppable escalation of violence by organized crime, which this year has left more than five thousand murders, almost twice that in 2007, as well as the increasing reports of abductions, have again brought the issue to the fore publicly.

jigh




EFE
El Universal
Ciudad de México Viernes 05 de diciembre de 2008
12:26
Amnistía Internacional (AI) criticó hoy a los sectores que justifican el restablecimiento de la pena de muerte en México, a raíz del debate surgido esta semana por la solicitud que hizo un estado al Congreso Federal para que discuta el asunto.

"Las propuestas e iniciativas que buscan una salida fácil a la situación que vive el país no hacen más que reforzar un clima de venganza social", opinó AI.

La organización consideró, además, que "se corre el riesgo, no solo de justificar el uso de la pena de muerte, sino la comisión de otras violaciones graves a los derechos humanos tales como el uso de la tortura, el maltrato, las ejecuciones o las detenciones arbitrarias".

Estas medidas, agregó en un comunicado, provocarían "ilegalidad, injusticia e inseguridad".

Amnistía Internacional recordó que "la reimplantación de la pena de muerte como método de disuasión de la delincuencia ha sido probada como inútil e ineficaz en una gran diversidad de países y contextos".

Además, pidió a las autoridades que no olviden que "el Estado mexicano, como signatario de la Convención Americana sobre Derechos Humanos, tiene la clara imposibilidad de reincorporar la pena de muerte a su sistema judicial".

El estado de Coahuila, en el norte del país y fronterizo con Texas (EE.UU.), solicitó el pasado martes al Congreso Federal que apruebe una reforma a la Constitución para restablecer ese castigo en el caso concreto de los secuestradores que asesinen a sus víctimas.

Varios gobernadores de otros estados, representantes de partidos políticos, diputados y senadores se han mostrado favorables al proyecto o, al menos, a considerar la iniciativa.

Al respecto, AI lamentó que "tanto partidos políticos como representantes de gobierno utilicen el tema de la seguridad pública de manera irresponsable sugiriendo que la reimposición de la pena de muerte significará una respuesta efectiva frente a la delincuencia".

"Es esencial que el Gobierno demuestre liderazgo para enfrentar estos propósitos erróneos y peligrosos con el pleno compromiso público de retener la abolición de la pena de muerte", concluyó la organización.

La pena de muerte, que no está en los códigos penales de ninguno de los 32 estados, figuraba en la Constitución mexicana hasta 2005, año en el que fue abolida, para los casos de traición a la patria, parricidio, homicidio agravado y otros delitos.

Sin embargo, no se aplicaba en el país desde 1961, cuando fue ejecutado un soldado en Saltillo, precisamente la capital de Coahuila.

La imparable escalada de violencia del crimen organizado, que este año ha dejado más de cinco mil asesinatos, casi el doble que en 2007, así como las crecientes denuncias de secuestros, han llevado de nuevo la cuestión a la palestra pública.
jigh

http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/notas/560763.html

[Shadowstorm]

Amnesty International always bitches about everything about the death penalty even here in the United States. However, they support abortion and euthanasia which is now supported in Mexico City.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Personally I don't think that there is anything wrong with euthanasia, especially if the person makes a conscious desition and the illness is terminal and incurable and the person will have to go through much suffering before dying as will their family members. In regards to abortion, I believe that it should be the individual's right to decide, not the state, but that's just my opinion and it's one of those things that many people know nothing about and find easy to judge and critizice until they go through something like that.
Abortion is legal in Mexico City, but it currently is the only entity in Mexico where it is. I don't think that Amnesty International had anything to do with that. How come AI is only taken seriously in the U.S. when they point the finger at human rights abuses in other countries (especially on the U.S.' sh_t list, but not when they happen in the U.S.?

[Shadowstorm]

Personally I don't think that there is anything wrong with euthanasia, especially if the person makes a conscious desition and the illness is terminal and incurable and the person will have to go through much suffering before dying as will their family members. In regards to abortion, I believe that it should be the individual's right to decide, not the state, but that's just my opinion and it's one of those things that many people know nothing about and find easy to judge and critizice until they go through something like that.
Abortion is legal in Mexico City, but it currently is the only entity in Mexico where it is. I don't think that Amnesty International had anything to do with that. How come AI is only taken seriously in the U.S. when they point the finger at human rights abuses in other countries (especially on the U.S.' sh_t list, but not when they happen in the U.S.?
I definitely agree, but I never said Amnesty International was involved in Mexico City ruling about abortion or euthanasia. However, they support abortion and euthanasia, but not the death penalty because it's cruel to the killers despite what they do to their victims. I kind see this as paint the kettle the black argument IMHO.

[Shadowstorm]

Will AI looks at United States about the death penalty issue which they don't support and they want it ban it. However, the majority of people support it while others don't want it.

[Felix U. Gómez]

I definitely agree, but I never said Amnesty International was involved in Mexico City ruling about abortion or euthanasia. However, they support abortion and euthanasia, but not the death penalty because it's cruel to the killers despite what they to their victims. I kind see this as paint the kettle the black argument IMHO.

The main problem that I see with adopting and implementing the death penalty in Mexico (and anywhere else) is that who can guarantee that it will be applied efficiently and justly? Our system is not perfect, especially our judicial system. It could be used simply to get rid of individuals who are on somebody's sh-t list. You guys know better than I do that in the U.S. they have discovered many cases where individuals were executed who were latter found to be innocent. Who is to say that that won't happen to us? Who can guarantee that we can do it better? You implement a punishment that can be flawed but whose mistakes can't be corrected, God knows the ramifications that that would bring us?

[Felix U. Gómez]

Will AI looks at United States about the death penalty issue which they don't support and they want it ban it. However, the majority of people support it while others don't want it.

Have you ever heard of mob mentality? Sometimes the majority can be wrong. People tend to think with their guts and not their heads when it comes to this issue.

[Shadowstorm]

Have you ever heard of mob mentality? Sometimes the majority can be wrong. People tend to think with their guts and not their heads when it comes to this issue.
Yep, I heard of it before and trust me I always think with my head when it comes to those issues.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Yep, I heard of it before and trust me I always think with my head when it comes to those issues.

I have no doubt about that. I have always known you to be an intelligent individual. I'm just arguing that implementing such a punishment (banned in most of the world) would not be easy in Mexico. It's opponents have a lot of ammo and justification. Used in the wrong hands it would be devastating (imagine an Hugo Chavez with it?).
It is true that the majority of the people would support it in Mexico, rescent surveys demonstrate it, but sometimes what the majority wants isn't always the best thing. Imagine if we were to put the issue of taxation on a plebiscite, what do you think that people would want? They would preffer not to be taxed, but then what would happen? It is just a fact that the majority is not always right. Just before the invasion of Iraq, the majority of the US population were for it, now, the majority are against it. Were they wrong in 2003? You bet they were.

[Shadowstorm]

I definitely agree with there, even though I do support the war in Iraq and still do to this day. Thanks for the complement Felix, I respect that personally.

[jklv]

I disagree with the death penalty, given the corruption in our country. What if someone who knows "someone" doesn't like you and get's you accused of a death penalty worth crime? Political enemies and such. If our country was not so corrupt and had a professional criminal prosecution process then yeah. But it's far from reality. Anyway, I do believe the ****bags (kidnappers and murderers, etc.) deserve death, even torture if it was possible like a slow and horribly painful death. But then again, corruption and unprofessional criminal prosecution services is what makes me disagree with a death penalty initiative.

Now changing subject. There is a spot from PRD taking the credit for the energy reform. I was like "WTH?" they were 100% opposed to it, calling traitors and sellers of our sovereignty and all that crap, and now this little girl says that the PRD was the main supporter of it. Politics eh?

[Sinaloense]

If people in the U.S are executed wrongly, imagine what can happen in Mexico? Besides, the death penalty does not really work as a deterrence.

[indiana46767]

If people in the U.S are executed wrongly, imagine what can happen in Mexico? Besides, the death penalty does not really work as a deterrence.

I strongly disagree with you Sinaloense. Its a strong deterent(sp). It would be ideal for the death penalty to be implemented for kidnappers only.

[jupiter]

And cop killers.

[indiana46767]

And cop killers.

Honestly if i had it my way i would make it a possiblity for Cop killers/kidnappers/Military Deserters hitmen.
But i was reading an article today on Eluniversal that the PAN and PRD are not wantin to hear arguements about the death penalty after they had agreed to talk about it... STupidity man. old laws are for old times. !!

:bash:

[Sinaloense]

I strongly disagree with you Sinaloense. Its a strong deterent(sp). It would be ideal for the death penalty to be implemented for kidnappers only.
The death penalty has never really been proven to deter anyone. Perhaps in countries where the death penalty is used to punish people for relatively minor offenses, does it show to work. However, if we were to use the U.S as a model, it would prove that it doesn't work for its intended puposes.

[Airgun_Hunter]

The death penalty has never really been proven to deter anyone. Perhaps in countries where the death penalty is used to punish people for relatively minor offenses, does it show to work. However, if we were to use the U.S as a model, it would prove that it doesn't work for its intended puposes.

But when it comes to high profile murderers, kidnappers and narco-piojoso scum then even if it wouldn't solve the problem at least we would get rid of them. That way they won't control anything from inside jail (as it happens) or escape (as it happens)

[jklv]

But when it comes to high profile murderers, kidnappers and narco-piojoso scum then even if it wouldn't solve the problem at least we would get rid of them. That way they won't control anything from inside jail (as it happens) or escape (as it happens)
Exactly, but the reason why the death penalty should not be implemented (IMO) is because of the high level of corruption and unprofessional criminal prosecution services, besides, this initiative is currently used as demagogy by populist political parties.
There is no fundamental law and order at this time in our country, at least not enough for such complex laws.

[Tokamak]

Honestly if i had it my way i would make it a possiblity for Cop killers/kidnappers/Military Deserters hitmen.
But i was reading an article today on Eluniversal that the PAN and PRD are not wantin to hear arguements about the death penalty after they had agreed to talk about it... STupidity man. old laws are for old times. !!

:bash:



Precisely, old laws for old times, that's why death penalty shouldn't be approved. Even here with a better system we have cases where "criminals" are proven innocent after several years, imagine what would happen in a country like Mexico.

[KoolD]

Probably what's needed is Hitmen to the service of the Mexican Secret Service or SEDENA to take down big piojosos. You know! under the records :-*$, Neutralize them, Depopulate narco eras, Targets of oportunity etc. You know what I mean;-)!

[jklv]

Probably what's needed is Hitmen to the service of the Mexican Secret Service or SEDENA to take down big piojosos. You know! under the records :-*$, Neutralize them, Depopulate narco eras, Targets of oportunity etc. You know what I mean;-)!
I agree with you on that, an unit like BOPE with full permission to kill. But only the best soldiers assigned to it. I guess the High Command SF are the ones perfect for this job. Their job would be to kill the scum not capture it.

[Shadowstorm]

I heard rumors that Grupo Aeromóvil de Fuerzas Especiales del Alto Mando has a white card or "license to kill" if needed to.

[KoolD]

I heard rumors that Grupo Aeromóvil de Fuerzas Especiales del Alto Mando has a white card or "license to kill" if needed to.
Well. I think that it's about time they use that license.:fork:.

[jklv]

I heard rumors that Grupo Aeromóvil de Fuerzas Especiales del Alto Mando has a white card or "license to kill" if needed to.
Nice


Well. I think that it's about time they use that license.:fork:.
LMAO, yeah.

Check this out

"Another known mission carried out by the High Command GAFE group was the capture of drug cartel leader Javier Torres Félix aka El JT in Culiacan, Sinaloa, January 27th of 2004. The commandos left Mexico City for Culiacan at 9:00 a.m. and returned with Félix at 6:00 p.m. that same day. Commanders had scheduled the arrest for another day but the Secretary told reporters that immediate capture was necessary."


Some pics of them:
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/6499/alfredobeltrangdevk5.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/3383/20082121302812009726284rx0.jpg
http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/6748/370x270caeal5.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/6025/captf9d8a8bd8dca4f1bb19qj5.jpg

[KoolD]

See how easy it is for them to make an excellent job. All they seem to need is the right orders. I think that Mexico has all the resources it needs to make a much more secure country; all it needs is the proper initiative and action.

[KoolD]

Interview with Felix Batista. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hI462ND8js

[Airgun_Hunter]

Well.. at least this two guys didn't kill each other the narco way (cowardly, shooting unarmed people on the back)

I'll try to translate it as best I can.

In the town of choix (somewhere in Sinaloa State), two man lost their lives when they had a "duel" old western style.

Local Police of that jurisdiction reported that because of old personal problems, Manuel Vega Chavez 35 y/o and Fernando Ruelas Flores 45 y/o accorded to have a "duel"

The first one armed with a .45 cal pistol, the other with a 12ga shotgun, they met at the agreed place to settle their differences with a "duel", Both resulted dead. (no shiite sherlock hehe )

Here's the story in spanish.
http://www.elimparcial.com/EdicionEnLinea/Notas/Nacional/16122008/346404.aspx

[alexgodinez]

Well.. at least this two guys didn't kill each other the narco way (cowardly, shooting unarmed people on the back)

I'll try to translate it as best I can.

In the town of choix (somewhere in Sinaloa State), two man lost their lives when they had a "duel" old western style.

Local Police of that jurisdiction reported that because of old personal problems, Manuel Vega Chavez 35 y/o and Fernando Ruelas Flores 45 y/o accorded to have a "duel"

The first one armed with a .45 cal pistol, the other with a 12ga shotgun, they met at the agreed place to settle their differences with a "duel", Both resulted dead. (no shiite sherlock hehe )

Here's the story in spanish.
http://www.elimparcial.com/EdicionEnLinea/Notas/Nacional/16122008/346404.aspx
what a interesting and unusual way to die..

[Felix U. Gómez]

Well. I think that it's about time they use that license.:fork:.
What makes you so sure that they haven't? It's not something that the state would advertise you know? Human rights groups and the opposition would be all over them.
A friend of mine here in Cd. Juárez told me that he believed that some of the killings (I don't know what percentage, but it's probably a small number (who knows)) were the results of actions by "white" cells. Deep inside I hope it's true.

[Felix U. Gómez]

The death penalty has never really been proven to deter anyone. Perhaps in countries where the death penalty is used to punish people for relatively minor offenses, does it show to work. However, if we were to use the U.S as a model, it would prove that it doesn't work for its intended puposes.

Very true what you say. The U.S. is the only "developed" country in the world with the death penalty and it is also the "developed" country with the highest murder rate. That alone should teach us that we should look for other alternatives like way longer prison sentences and much better high security prisons in far and remote inhospitable places.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Well.. at least this two guys didn't kill each other the narco way (cowardly, shooting unarmed people on the back)

I'll try to translate it as best I can.

In the town of choix (somewhere in Sinaloa State), two man lost their lives when they had a "duel" old western style.

Local Police of that jurisdiction reported that because of old personal problems, Manuel Vega Chavez 35 y/o and Fernando Ruelas Flores 45 y/o accorded to have a "duel"

The first one armed with a .45 cal pistol, the other with a 12ga shotgun, they met at the agreed place to settle their differences with a "duel", Both resulted dead. (no shiite sherlock hehe )

Here's the story in spanish.
http://www.elimparcial.com/EdicionEnLinea/Notas/Nacional/16122008/346404.aspx

I wish that more idiots had this initiative.

[Sinaloense]

Nice


LMAO, yeah.

Check this out

"Another known mission carried out by the High Command GAFE group was the capture of drug cartel leader Javier Torres Félix aka El JT in Culiacan, Sinaloa, January 27th of 2004. The commandos left Mexico City for Culiacan at 9:00 a.m. and returned with Félix at 6:00 p.m. that same day. Commanders had scheduled the arrest for another day but the Secretary told reporters that immediate capture was necessary."


Some pics of them:
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/6499/alfredobeltrangdevk5.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/3383/20082121302812009726284rx0.jpg
http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/6748/370x270caeal5.jpg
http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/6025/captf9d8a8bd8dca4f1bb19qj5.jpg


That looks like El Mochomo...

[jklv]

That looks like El Mochomo...
He is "El mochomo", the pictures are to show the High Command GAFE.

[jklv]

New discussion, WTH is up with politicians talking about crisis and all that crap?
It's like our country had never been so economically stable. Trying to make people forget the real crisis caused by dumb PRI presidents.

[alexgodinez]

Bush to meet with Mexican President Calderon


www.chinaview.cn (http://www.chinaview.cn/index.htm) http://imgs.xinhuanet.com/icon/2006english/2007korea/space.gif 2009-01-11 03:54:04 http://imgs.xinhuanet.com/icon/2006english/xiao.jpg (http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2009-01/11/content_10637633.htm#)http://imgs.xinhuanet.com/icon/2006english/2007korea/space.gif http://imgs.xinhuanet.com/icon/2006english/da.jpg (http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2009-01/11/content_10637633.htm#)http://imgs.xinhuanet.com/icon/2006english/2007korea/space.gif Print (javascript:doPrint();)
WASHINGTON, Jan. 10 (Xinhua) -- U.S. President George W. Bush will meet with his Mexican counterpart Felipe Calderon on Jan. 13,the White House said on Saturday.
The two leaders will discuss the U.S.-Mexico cooperation to confront "criminal organizations and related violence that plague the region, including implementation of the Merida Initiative," the White House said in a statement.
"The President will also use the meeting to again acknowledge President Calderon's courage and the people of Mexico's sacrifice in confronting the drug traffickers," according to the statement. During his visit to the United States, Calderon will also meet President-elect Barack Obama, who will take office on Jan. 20.
Earlier last month, the Bush administration released a 197-million-dollar aid package to support Mexico's struggle against drug cartels. Drug-related violence claimed some 5,000 lives in Mexico in 2008, and drug-related crimes have been spreading across the border into the United States.
The aid is part of the so-called Merida Initiative, which was a security cooperation among the two neighboring countries and the countries of Central America in order to combat the threats of drug trafficking, transnational crime, and terrorism in the Western Hemisphere.
Also on Jan. 13, Bush will offer the Presidential Medal of Freedom, the highest civilian award in the United States, to Colombian President Alvaro Uribe and former prime ministers Tony Blair of the United Kingdom and John Howard of Australia, for their steady support to the U.S.-led war against terrorism.
Blair and Howard, both of whom supported the Iraqi War launched in 2003 by the Bush administration, were seen as the most loyal partners of the U.S. president on the international political stage. Uribe is among few pro-Washington leaders in the Latin America.
Bush will bid farewell to the White House on Jan. 20.



this thread has been quiet for a while, well atleast im contruibiting something.

[jupiter]

Very true what you say. The U.S. is the only "developed" country in the world with the death penalty and it is also the "developed" country with the highest murder rate. That alone should teach us that we should look for other alternatives like way longer prison sentences and much better high security prisons in far and remote inhospitable places.
Longer prison terms, and who'll foot the bill? Tax payers? And remember that the gangs bosses are still running the bussines behind bars. Neither solution is perfect. You have to have a sort of cocktail, for some crimes death penalthy, for others, a nice vacations in the desert of Sonora, or Clarion Islands. p-)

[Felix U. Gómez]

I don't mind footing the bill if it is to keep human trash from ever walking the streets again. The problem with the death penalty is that if there is a mistake made during trial and sentencing, the mistake is usually permanent and can't be undone. Besides, would you trust our legal system to act honestly when it comes to having the power to take someone's life?
As for gang bosses still conducting business behind bars, notice that I said that we need "much better high security prisons", meaning that I am not satisfied with our current prison system.
For criminals deserving sentences like the death penalty I would prescribe instead a life sentence (without the possibility of early release) in far off and remote high security prison somewhere deep in the deserts of Baja California or out in the Revillagigedos Islands. A one way ticket for the rest of your life. I don't know about you, but for me it is much scarier to think of spending the remainding several decades of my life in a remote and inhospitable place, probably doing hard labor, than having an easy, quick way out, like being put to sleep.

[jupiter]

It's not an easy option, I know. The problem with the system in Mexico is the corruption, what good makes a better or safer prision of the warden can be bought? As allways, years and years with the spiraling problem of violence and corruption can't be erradicated in couple of years. We need to educate a whole generation of mexicans,(25-35 years span). And maybe we, in the future can see a police officer, a public servant in the ministery of labor, a commerce scales inspector not taking bribes because nobody is ofering a bribe. And after that, then we maybe can see that we can trust the antikidnnaping police, the patrol officer, the warden of the prision. Sadly, to much job to do, and who's gonna start the task?

[Felix U. Gómez]

It's not an easy option, I know. The problem with the system in Mexico is the corruption, what good makes a better or safer prision of the warden can be bought? As allways, years and years with the spiraling problem of violence and corruption can't be erradicated in couple of years. We need to educate a whole generation of mexicans,(25-35 years span). And maybe we, in the future can see a police officer, a public servant in the ministery of labor, a commerce scales inspector not taking bribes because nobody is ofering a bribe. And after that, then we maybe can see that we can trust the antikidnnaping police, the patrol officer, the warden of the prision. Sadly, to much job to do, and who's gonna start the task?

First we need teachers that aren't worth crap. I'm not saying that all of them are (there are quite several worthy example accross the country), but there are a lot of them that are worth crap. The government starts a program to improve education and all the teachers start complaining. Some teachers in some states complain because they can no longer sell or inherit their positions. Can you believe that!!!? Teachers will their positions to their children regardless of their childrens' abilities and qualifications? That's f-up!!! How can we expect to educate our societies when the teachers of Oaxaca think nothing of leaving the state's children for a year without education just because they don't like the governor of the state? They then conduct demonstrations and think nothing of trashing the downtown area of one of our most beautiful colonial cities? They think nothing of putting grafity on a 400+ year old building... hijos de toda su p...
We've got a long way to go Jupiter.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Here's something I posted on the picture thread:

I've been thinking that this is a real possibility and have been mentioning it several times when I criticize our Air Force for being almost non-existent. What were we to do if this really happened? It is obviously not a pipe dream if there are planners in the pentagon that have been giving it thought.

Carlos Benavides
El Universal
Tuesday January 13 2009
carlos.benavides @ eluniversal.com.mx
Mexico and Pakistan are two nations that the Department of Defense considered likely to be of sudden conflicts that require the intervention of U.S. troops.

A report by the Joint Command of the U.S. Forces (USJFCOM, for its acronym in Spanish) suggests that before a scene of chaos in Mexico, led by drug trafficking and organized crime, the United States would be obliged to respond to this situation given the implications for their security.

The reference in this scenario is reflected in the joint operating environment 2008 report, prepared by the Joint Forces Command in that country.

The report was made to stimulate thinking and trends on the environment in which they will fight the armed forces within 25 years.

The scenario that Mexico and Pakistan are countries that could live a "rapid collapse", is considered in the chapter called weak and failed states within USJFCOM report.

"There is a momentum in the literature of failed and weak states that has received relatively little attention, we refer to the phenomenon of the" rapid collapse, "the report said.

He adds: "In terms of the worst scenarios for the Joint Force, and indeed the world, two great nations and are considered important in relation to a swift and sudden collapse: Pakistan and Mexico.

"Some forms of collapse in Pakistan involving the possibility of sectarian civil war and a sustained, violent and bloody, and a safe haven even larger for violent extremists, and the question of what would happen to their nuclear weapons," the document detailing.

"The Mexican possibility may seem less viable, but the government, its politicians, their police and judicial infrastructure are all under attack and sustained pressure from criminal gangs and drug cartels. How to take this internal conflict in the coming years will have a significant impact on the stability of the Mexican State. Any collapse of Mexico to a chaotic situation would require a U.S. response, simply based on the serious implications for internal security, "he warned.

Last December, in an interview with The Washington Times, President George Bush warned of an imminent war with drug cartels, "where the first line of the struggle will be Mexico," and said that his successor in the White House , Barack Obama need to face "to the drug cartels in our own neighborhood."

Carlos Benavides
El Universal
Martes 13 de enero de 2009
carlos.benavides@eluniversal.com.mx

México y Paquistán son dos naciones que el Departamento de Defensa de Estados Unidos considera como susceptibles de presentar conflictos súbitos que hagan necesaria la intervención de tropas estadounidenses.
Un informe del Comando Conjunto de las Fuerzas de Estados Unidos (USJFCOM, por su sigla en inglés) plantea que ante un escenario de caos en México, provocado por el narcotráfico y el crimen organizado, Estados Unidos estaría obligado a dar una respuesta a esta situación, dadas las consecuencias para su seguridad interna.
La referencia sobre este escenario se encuentra plasmada en el informe Joint operating environment 2008, confeccionado por el Comando Conjunto de las Fuerzas de ese país.
El informe es realizado para estimular la reflexión y marcar las tendencias sobre el ambiente en el que combatirán las fuerzas armadas dentro de 25 años.
El escenario de que México y Paquistán son naciones que podrían vivir un “colapso rápido”, se encuentra considerado en el capítulo denominado Estados débiles y fallidos, dentro del reporte del USJFCOM.
“Hay una dinámica en la literatura de los Estados débiles y fallidos que ha recibido relativamente poca atención; nos referimos al fenómeno del “colapso rápido”, señala el informe.
Y agrega: “En términos de los peores escenarios para la Fuerza Conjunta, y de hecho para el mundo, dos naciones grandes e importantes son consideradas en relación con un colapso rápido y repentino: Paquistán y México.
“Algunas formas de derrumbe en Paquistán conllevan la posibilidad de una guerra civil y sectaria sostenida, violenta y sangrienta, y un refugio seguro aún más grande para extremistas violentos, y el asunto de qué pasaría con sus armas nucleares”, detalla el documento.
“La posibilidad mexicana podría parecer menos viable, pero el gobierno, sus políticos, su policía y su infraestructura judicial están todos sometidos a una agresión sostenida y presiones de pandillas criminales y cárteles de la droga. La forma que tome ese conflicto interno en los próximos años tendrá un impacto trascendental en la estabilidad del Estado mexicano. Cualquier derrumbe de México a una situación de caos demandaría una respuesta estadounidense, basándose simplemente en las graves implicaciones para la seguridad interior”, advierte.
En diciembre pasado, en entrevista con el diario The Washington Times, el presidente George Bush advirtió de una guerra inminente con los cárteles de la droga, “donde la primera línea de la lucha será México”, y dijo que su sucesor en la Casa Blanca, Barack Obama, necesitará enfrentar “a los cárteles de la droga en nuestro propio vecindario”.

http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/nacion/165051.html (http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/nacion/165051.html)

[jupiter]

Maybe is that why Galvan is saying that the picture of the Mexican armed forces is gray in terms of real war? Maybe he was alerted of that document, and putting pressure in congress to have more money for capital funding, thus making the war in narcos more intense, more close to these scumbags. No pause in tha war needs more money, more hardware, if Mexico fails, Usa will invade in some degree. (US citizen in dire situations, etc). I hope the congressmen don't start with the same argument: Internal affairs cannot compete to USA or any other country.

[Felix U. Gómez]

Especially if the U.S. is a major part of the problem, i.e. the world's biggest consumer of drugs and biggest source of weapons to the cartels.
The U.S. must first be free of fault and then they can call us a failed state.

[indiana46767]

MEXICO CITY
Petroleumworld.com, Jan 13, 2009
PEMEX plans to build a 200 million cubic feet of gas per day natural gas processing plant to handle new supplies from the Chicontepec basin, said Pemex on Tuesday.

Chicontepec is an oil field under development with associated natural gas. Pemex plans to pump around a billion cubic feet of natural gas in the area by 2016, according to the Energy Ministry.

Pemex plans to award the construction contract of the plant, located at the Poza Rica gas complex in northern Mexico and begin work before the end of May. It will take two years to build the plant

Pemex will produce propane, butane and natural gasoline, a natural gas liquid, at the new plant.

Pemex has increase its production of natural gas, in November gas output hit a new record of 7.2 billion cubic feet a day, up 19% from the year-ago month.

http://www.petroleumworld.com/story09011316.htm

Means more jobs and cash for the struggling PARASTATAL

[indiana46767]

El Universal
Mexico City Wednesday 14 January 2009
11:58 The government of Mexico made a formal proposal to the Department of Energy raised U.S. where the exploration and exploitation of oil that is in the Gulf of Mexico and border sites between the two nations, reported the Secretary of Energy Georgina Kessel.
To appear before the Senate, the official said it is holding an "equitable".

He added that the new administration headed by President Barack Obama will seek to achieve greater progress in the talks.

He also reported that the federal government will soon begin with the first public placement of bonds, which are part of the energy reform.

El Universal
Ciudad de México Miércoles 14 de enero de 2009
11:58 El gobierno de México realizó una propuesta oficial al departamento de Energía de Estados Unidos donde plantea la exploración y explotación del petróleo que se encuentra en el Golfo de México y yacimientos transfronterizos entre ambas naciones, informó la secretaria de Energía, Georgina Kessel.
Al comparecer ante el Senado de la República, la funcionaria dijo que se trata de una explotación "equitativa".
Agregó que con la nueva administración que encabezará el presidente Barack Obama se buscará alcanzar mayores avances en las conversaciones.
Además, informó que próximamente el gobierno federal comenzará con la primera colocación de bonos ciudadanos, los cuales forman parte de la reforma energética.


http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/notas/569052.html

[indiana46767]

President Felipe Calderón warned that oil "is going away," and therefore urged to produce "a lot more." On the topic, Pemex acknowledged that the lack of equipment has caused the closure of wells in the Cantarell oil field.

Oaxaca tour, the president praised the energy reform "that will allow greater investment and increased production," but regretted that Congress does not approve a reform to allow private participation in building refineries. "So many would be built at the same time and not just one, in order to offset the decline in production, he said.

Regarding the choice of where to build the next refinery, the government announced that instructed Petroleos Mexicanos (Pemex) to "conscientiously analyze project profitability and sustainable human development plan and, to analyze the economic aspect, but also the social aspect of development and the impact it has to generate this project. "

According to the oil, the site will be known in the second half of February.

For its part, the director of Pemex, Jesus Reyes Heroles, said the lack of technical equipment caused several wells in the Cantarell oil field closed temporarily.

"No equipment was available for injections nitrogen and accelerate the recovery of oil," he explained.

At Cantarell, he added, "we lost production of about 40 thousand barrels per day net" for 2008.

The official said that the rapid decline of production at the site took by surprise the parastatal and the infrastructure needed to counter it.

He added that the delay in the bidding to start work on Chicontepec also contributed to the loss of six months for additional production.

http://www.eluniversal.com.mx/notas/571355.html

[Tokamak]

I didn't know this happened and that there was a movie about it. It looks OK.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=0joNXQzia7I&feature=related