Obama's change = more of the same?

[Jobu]

Why is it that nearly everyone around Obama these days from his transition team to his tentative cabinet choices (Rahm, Summers, Podesta, Hillary?) are all the same old Democrat Washington insiders who have seemingly been part of the system forever? Have you seen his State Dept transition team? It's a who's who of Fannie Mae executives.

Wasn't it Obama himself who said we can't change if we keep putting the same people in positions of power?

Not very encouraging.

[Cornerstone]

1)Global financial crisis
2)two wars, f*cked up reputation abroad

We can do that, however not now, wait it out for just a little bit and you will get your change... Right now is not the time for amateur economists and fresh faced diplomats

[pascalywood]

Politicians will say anything to get elected.

[Chulo]

1)Global financial crisis
2)two wars, f*cked up reputation abroad

We can do that, however not now, wait it out for just a little bit and you will get your change... Right now is not the time for amateur economists and fresh faced diplomats
yup.. Change!*




*Just not right now

[Jobu]

We can do that, however not now...


Is that what people voted for?

[CG51]

I say let the guy take office first. Cannot judge him until he has been in office for a couple of years.

[vryhpyammoadded]

And the shills continue to herd the marks to the con. Hopefully someday, someone will manage to convince enough marks to see where the pea actually is.

As I’ve said for near a year, change™ always equals same. It’s time for a change must be the single most trite, overdone, and oldest political ploys ever yet it always works so damned well on the fearful sheeple. It’s almost like they want to be consumed by the machine.

[Chulo]

I say let the guy take office first. Cannot judge him until he has been in office for a couple of years.
by the way the news media puts it, he is already in charge. Got a new logo set up his own new seal and with the wave of his hand, he will solve all problems.

The fact is, the changes that the present administration are making and steps taken will only show effect in a month or two, but by that time, if they work out, obama will get the credit. If they dont, then Bush will get the blame.

[Cornerstone]

Is that what people voted for?
Yes it is change... Might I remind you that in every election there is the opportunity to bring peaceful- regime change, your expecting too much and being overly critical too early... remember he was preaching change before the financial crisis so this was an unexpected hurdle that will require some qualified, and experienced people

[Johnny_H02]

I say let the guy take office first. Cannot judge him until he has been in office for a couple of years.
Ah sensibility and common sense, something often lacking in the "Oh Noez Barack Hussein Obama iz teh s0cl1ali5t t3rr0r1st & nao r3publ1c4n nao d1ff3r3nT" discussion.

[ronnieraygun]

I say let the guy take office first. Cannot judge him until he has been in office for a couple of years.

Stop making sense, you.


p-)

[Jobu]

You're right.

We have to forget everything he said on the campaign trail and give him a free pass for a few years. It's sensible to not hold politicians accountable for the promises they made.

[Cornerstone]

You're right.

We have to forget everything he said on the campaign trail and give him a free pass for a few years. It's sensible to not hold politicians accountable for the promises they made.
Go do it, make sure everyone in office is from the abyss...

[Chulo]

Go do it, make sure everyone in office is from the abyss...

hold on, you vote someone on the basis of his promise to change- change the system, change the government, change society and promise to change it from day one. But as he starts to stack his house with the most partisan staff members, you are willing to give him a free pass?

When will you question the direction and actions then? after a month, a year?

[brainplay]

Its called "pandering to the public" guys. I mean of all the Secretary of State people to pick Mrs. Clinton is a poor choice in diplomatic terms but excellent choice to try and plunder her support base for his own. Promises were made knowing that they wouldn't go through but they energized the base. This will of course be blamed on Bush and poor Obama's hands are tied.

Same crap, different day. He's a politician, and a junior one at that surrounded by political operators who are more knowledgable and who are going to pigeon hole the dude until he wizens up. We should have expected this, but we didn't. Surprise surprise!

Now we just have to wait for the apologists to step in, swoon for a few minutes, and then make some prophecies about what he "might" do despite already having a bad start.

[Mofreaka]

Ah sensibility and common sense, something often lacking in the "Oh Noez Barack Hussein Obama iz teh s0cl1ali5t t3rr0r1st & nao r3publ1c4n nao d1ff3r3nT" discussion.

While I don't deny that those people are idiots, on the other hand, there are alot of people who think Obama is the next Jesus or something. He's a politician.

[Bombtrack]

http://www.babble.com/CS/blogs/strollerderby/2008/08/23-End/Tantrum-1.jpg

[Cornerstone]

hold on, you vote someone on the basis of his promise to change- change the system, change the government, change society and promise to change it from day one. But as he starts to stack his house with the most partisan staff members, you are willing to give him a free pass?

When will you question the direction and actions then? after a month, a year?
I will begin to question a non issue like that when the US economic position returns to normal, you can have some of the same people however with a different goal, its not always the people but their direction... Bush steered us into a ditch

[Bombtrack]

Newsflash: Not everyone who voted for Obama did so because of a campaign slogan.

[Chulo]

I will begin to question a non issue like that when the US economic position returns to normal, you can have some of the same people however with a different goal, its not always the people but their direction... Bush steered us into a ditch
What sort of bipartisan work can you do when you have the most radical partisans leading it? People can have different goals but a tiger wont change its stripes.
Bush may have been president, but alot of the pandering congress did lead to where we are right now.

Why do people think Bush is/was king and could do what he wanted and just sign something into existence. They ignore the very basis of how this government works, and placing sole blame on him only shows their ignorance or blindsided bias

[Chulo]

Newsflash: Not everyone who voted for Obama did so because of a campaign slogan.
i saw a stat a few weeks ago. about only 10 % trust obama as to about 70% of Mccain supporters, but 80% wanted the change Obama promised, but only less than 5% could actually really tell what that change was. over 80% got the change promises wrong.

I still think people got blown over the exposure, media and message over the real substance of the politics.

[Cornerstone]

What sort of bipartisan work can you do when you have the most radical partisans leading it? People can have different goals but a tiger wont change its stripes.
Bush may have been president, but alot of the pandering congress did lead to where we are right now.

Why do people think Bush is/was king and could do what he wanted and just sign something into existence. They ignore the very basis of how this government works, and placing sole blame on him only shows their ignorance or blindsided bias
So the old head of government isn't responsible for anything and can't effect the country but the new one is already f*cking everything up WTF

[Chulo]

So the old head of government isn't responsible for anything and can't effect the country but the new one is already f*cking everything up WTF
i think you miss the point.
1) i didnt say Bush is not to blame, just that blaming bush for everything is stupid - but people will continue to do so

2) Obama promised change and bipartisanship - but so far he has rallied the most partisan people around him on key positions.

3) so the staff and support will set the tone and how things are done, obama will only "envision" as he directs. So the ground work done by the most partisan people will sure set a tone for how things get done, which at this point is not going to be very bipartisan.

4) i didnt say anything about the new government messing anything up. Just that the changes made now will only show effect in a few months, if it goes well Obama will take credit since he has spent most of this time so far looking busy but doing nothing (because he does not have the power to) but if it goes badly then bush will be to blame.


so tell me where i said that Bush isn't responsible for anything and can't effect the country but the new one is already f*cking everything up

[Cornerstone]

i think you miss the point.
1) i didnt say Bush is not to blame, just that blaming bush for everything is stupid - but people will continue to do so

2) Obama promised change and bipartisanship - but so far he has rallied the most partisan people around him on key positions.

3) so the staff and support will set the tone and how things are done, obama will only "envision" as he directs. So the ground work done by the most partisan people will sure set a tone for how things get done, which at this point is not going to be very bipartisan.You don't know how it will work out, you have to wait and see... call back in two years, if nothing has changed then we will march on Washington and demand an impeachment or something

[Behan]

What this thread needs is change we can believe in.

[Chulo]

You don't know how it will work out, you have to wait and see... call back in two years, if nothing has changed then we will march on Washington and demand an impeachment or something
sure, we cant say, but you sure can guess. Look who he has on staff.. and see if you can pick out the people with a good history of working bipartisan, then look at who has a record at being very partisan. Like i said, a tiger cant change its stripes.. but then, its another change you can only believe in. and hope

[2Sheds_Jackson]

Yeah buddy - nothing says "change" and doing things a new way like re-creating an administration from a decade ago. We've even got a few of the folks dating back to Whitewater, the Clinton pardons of FALN terrorists, child molesters, and who sprang convicted domestic terrorists from the Weather Underground (hey wasn't there something about that thing with that Ayers guy? ...nah must just be a coincidence). When you think about it, it's almost comical.

[Chulo]

Yeah buddy - nothing says "change" and doing things a new way like re-creating an administration from a decade ago. We've even got a few of the folks dating back to Whitewater, the Clinton pardons of FALN terrorists, child molesters, and who sprang convicted domestic terrorists from the Weather Underground (hey wasn't there something about that thing with that Ayers guy? ...nah must just be a coincidence). When you think about it, it's almost comical.
so far 31 of the 47 major positions have been filled by recycled Clinton staffers..

[Behan]

Not to mention recycled Clinton spouses.


so far 31 of the 47 major positions have been filled by recycled Clinton staffers..

[Hilbert]

Why is it that nearly everyone around Obama these days from his transition team to his tentative cabinet choices (Rahm, Summers, Podesta, Hillary?) are all the same old Democrat Washington insiders who have seemingly been part of the system forever? Have you seen his State Dept transition team? It's a who's who of Fannie Mae executives.

Wasn't it Obama himself who said we can't change if we keep putting the same people in positions of power?

Not very encouraging.

Of course it's going to be more of the same. The only change is skin color and the President's party affiliation (from Republican to Democrat, Bush to Obama). Everytime the presidential elections come it's always "change, change, change" but nothing ever changes. Obama is no different.

Just my two cents,
Hilde

[philbob]

of course it's going to be more of the same. The only change is skin color and the president's party affiliation (from republican to democrat, bush to obama). Everytime the presidential elections come it's always "change, change, change" but nothing ever changes. Obama is no different.

Just my two cents,
hilde

philbob concures

[budgie]

by the way the news media puts it, he is already in charge. Got a new logo set up his own new seal and with the wave of his hand, he will solve all problems.

The fact is, the changes that the present administration are making and steps taken will only show effect in a month or two, but by that time, if they work out, obama will get the credit. If they dont, then Bush will get the blame.


Ahh the old "eight years" effect?

[Merfeller]

You're right.

We have to forget everything he said on the campaign trail and give him a free pass for a few years. It's sensible to not hold politicians accountable for the promises they made.

Well, according to his victory speech in Grant Park it might take more than one term to fulfill the promises he made. And some he might not be able to keep at all. So we need to forget everything that was said and have patience.

Yeah, you know, patience...a couple of years to get used to the job...like they gave George W Bush.:)

[Chulo]

Ahh the old "eight years" effect?
so what you are saying, the steps taken in the past few weeks is nothing new? There has been an aggressive change on policy that you did not see anywhere in the past 8 years.

But like i said.. anything that happens is the will of Messiah-O and soon he will banish evil bush to the underworld

[budgie]

What I was getting at is the old chesnut about economic policy taking eight years to come around. By this 'reasoning' the Republicans have argued that the prosperity of the Clinton years was a trickle down from Regan while the Bush recession is all Bill Clinton's fault. How convenient.

Now we have people saying that Bush's Wall St bailout will come a cropper about the time Obama takes office so he'll get all the credit. I doubt two months is enough. Regardless, if and when Obama dose introduce policies and if they do improve things a year down the track, it leaves an opening for you guys to put it all down to the Brilliance of George W Bush during his last few months in office, right?

[Chulo]

What I was getting at is the old chesnut about economic policy taking eight years to come around. By this 'reasoning' the Republicans have argued that the prosperity of the Clinton years was a trickle down from Regan while the Bush recession is all Bill Clinton's fault. How convenient.

Now we have people saying that Bush's Wall St bailout will come a cropper about the time Obama takes office so he'll get all the credit. I doubt two months is enough. Regardless, if and when Obama dose introduce policies and if they do improve things a year down the track, it leaves an opening for you guys to put it all down to the Brilliance of George W Bush during his last few months in office, right?
like i said, blaming one person for EVERYTHING that is happening is stupid. What ever has happened in the past 8 years has happened. Now there are some big programs and big choices made in the past few weeks that has nothing to do with Obama, but he will get/take credit for it.

but like you yourself said. Actions taken now may not show in 2 months, so if things do get better in the next year, then would Bush get some of the credit or is it the very presence of Obama that quelled the market?

[timetraveller]

I say let the guy take office first. Cannot judge him until he has been in office for a couple of years.


Exactly ....

Sadly people can't or will never understand that point .

[11 Bravo]

I say let the guy take office first. Cannot judge him until he has been in office for a couple of years.

Can't judge him until he's in ?....... but to judge himby the company he keeps would be wrong to you ?. Nutz !. When He named ramin the arse emmanuel as his COS... you know he sits on the fannie board....change my arse...they are just looking too pump federal dollars in their immeadiate buddies and their own pockets.

I like the comedian whom said " after a spell in office Oblahma will get hungry late one night and go down to the vending machines in the white house and when he gets there he finds he has no CHANGE."

[ronnieraygun]

Can't judge his Nutz !. When He named ramin the arse ... you know he sits on the fannie arse...they pump immeadiate buddies and their pockets.

I like the comedian whom said hungry late one night and go down


That's hawt. You're hawt.

[Chulo]

Can't judge him until he's in ?....... but to judge himby the company he keeps would be wrong to you ?. Nutz !. When He named ramin the arse emmanuel as his COS... you know he sits on the fannie board....change my arse...they are just looking too pump federal dollars in their immeadiate buddies and their own pockets.

I like the comedian whom said " after a spell in office Oblahma will get hungry late one night and go down to the vending machines in the white house and when he gets there he finds he has no CHANGE."
while i agree with others to wait untill he gets into office to see how things will work out. I still think its very foolish to ignore the past and just look to the blind future. In Obama's case, it is "unfair" "stupid" "racist" "hateful" and "unnecessary/irrelevant" of what has happened in his past- his associations, record or actions- and just trust that the future will be as good as he promises

[budgie]

but like you yourself said. Actions taken now may not show in 2 months, so if things do get better in the next year, then would Bush get some of the credit or is it the very presence of Obama that quelled the market?

Actually I don't believe either will have much effect but if credit is due, and Obama's policies are a follow-on from Bush's, then they"ll both deserve a share. If Obama takes a completely different direction and it works, then he can get some credit for that. But only some. The bailout was an inevitable government response and will buy the market time to correct. Whether or not it will correct sufficiently or quickly enough remains to be seen.