Saudi Prince: Zionism to Blame for Terrorism

[MetalBoy]

Official says Israel, supporters share bin Laden's objective
By Lisa Myers
Senior investigative correspondent
NBC News
Updated: 7:56 p.m. ET June 15, 2004

Last month, an attack on contractors at the Saudi oil facility in Yanbu killed six Westerners, two of them Americans. Senior Saudi officials told the world al-Qaida terrorists were to blame and al-Qaida claimed responsibility.

But tape obtained by NBC News reveals that, inside Saudi Arabia, on Saudi television, Crown Prince Abdullah told a strikingly different story about who was to blame.
NBC News translated Abdullah's remarks from Arabic: “Zionism is behind it. It has become clear now. It has become clear to us. I don’t say, I mean... It is not 100 percent, but 95 percent that the Zionist hands are behind what happened.”

Other senior Saudi officials reaffirmed the claim that supporters of Israel — Zionists — were behind the terror attacks.

Prince Nayef, the Saudi Interior Minister said, “Al-Qaida is backed by Israel and Zionism.”
Some call this dangerous Saudi doubletalk. “The crown prince’s statements are inflammatory and irresponsible,” said Sen. Susan Collins, R-Maine. “On the one hand they say reassuring words to American leaders, but on the other hand they spout inflammatory anti-Semitic rhetoric for their domestic population.”

Monday, a report by the prestigious Council on Foreign Relations said such statements undermine efforts to “change the mindset that foments extremism” and undercut otherwise “significant improvement” in Saudi efforts against al-Qaida.

For example, in the last year, the Saudis have waged sometimes daily gun battles against al-Qaida cells, passed new anti-terror financing laws and cracked down on charities helping fund bin Laden.

But the report complains that members of the Saudi elite who’ve allegedly financed al Qaida remain free and unpunished, including Yassin al Qadi — specially designated as a “global terrorist” by the U.S. Treasury Department.

According to William Wechsler, former National Security Council member and co-author of the Council on Foreign Relations report, “They have yet to arrest or incarcerate anybody publicly. And if you don’t take those actions then you can’t have deterrence.”

Qadi has repeatedly denied giving money to al-Qaida.

A Saudi spokesman claims that five men have been prosecuted for funding terrorism — they just weren’t publicly named.

As for the alleged Saudi doublespeak, a Saudi official in the United States defends the remarks, arguing that Zionists and others who argue for regime change in Saudi Arabia “share the same objective as Osama bin Laden.”

:| I don't know about this. I guess it could work in some twisted logical way. Get the Saudi people to think that the people they already hate (Zionists, Israelis) are actually the ones behind the terror attacks so they would stand together and support the government in their fight agaisnst Al-Qaeda. Seems pretty desperate move to me though.

[RavenW]

Get the Saudi people to think that the people they already hate (Zionists, Israelis) are actually the ones behind the terror attacks so they would stand together and support the government in their fight agaisnst Al-Qaeda. Seems pretty desperate move to me though.

Especially, since 90% of Saudi males between ages 18 and 55 support bin Laden attack on America. (according both to independent Arab poll and poll conducted right after Sept. 11 by Congress' Inernational Relations Commitee)

[Kilgor]

yeah.. this has been posted before but its very worthy to bring up again.

How the hell can they fight terrorism with this **** comming out of their mouths.

Some hard realities to face up to for the saudis

[seruriermarshal]

So I think Saudi are fail to anti-AQ .

[born_to_love]

What do they not blame on the jews and zionism

mother****ers i hope they get nuked

[born_to_love]

remember when they banned pokemon saying it meant :i am a jew: in japanese

****in stupid

[SeanAshi]

Zionism is behind it. It has become clear now. It has become clear to us. I don’t say, I mean... It is not 100 percent, but 95 percent that the Zionist hands are behind what happened.”
Just when I start to think or say positive things about the Saudis and support their war on terrorism they go off and say stupid **** like this :roll:

[W(M)D]

You dont think that they have now exposed the Zionist world takeover conspiracy theory?/ LOL

[G1]

Quiet! Saudi Arabia is cool, your President says so!

[SeanAshi]

Saudi Arabia is cool, your President says so!Yes they are cool, but their home grown terrorist are not cool.

[G1]

Saudi Arabia is cool, your President says so!Yes they are cool, but their home grown terrorist are not cool.

The differences between the Saudi regime and the Taliban are that they have oil and are friends with the U.S. Their Islamic laws are as strict or stricter than the Taliban, and Saudi is a dictatorship. How is that cool?

[Kilgor]

if its a choice between the saudi royal family or the terrorists, who would you prefer to stay in power ?

[Kitsune]

We have now the highest oil price in history but if Saudi Arabia falls into chaos, if their oil sources go off line for month or even more than a year...the price of oil will skyrocket. That could have desastrous effects on the worlds economy. And nobody wants that, least of all Bush BEFORE the presidential elections. So he will continue to treat the Saudis with kidsgloves on.

[G1]

We have now the highest oil price in history but if Saudi Arabia falls into chaos, if their oil sources go off line for month or even more than a year...the price of oil will skyrocket. That could have desastrous effects on the worlds economy. And nobody wants that, least of all Bush BEFORE the presidential elections. So he will continue to treat the Saudis with kidsgloves on.

Yes exactly. But that does not make them 'cool'. Hypocrisy reigns...

[/McH\]

if its a choice between the saudi royal family or the terrorists, who would you prefer to stay in power ?

I say.. Nuke Them All!! :D

[n4292936]

Saudi Arabia is cool, your President says so!Yes they are cool, but their home grown terrorist are not cool.

The differences between the Saudi regime and the Taliban are that they have oil and are friends with the U.S. Their Islamic laws are as strict or stricter than the Taliban, and Saudi is a dictatorship. How is that cool?
That's not quite true. i lived in Arabia for 11 years, their laws are not as strict or stricter than the Taliban's. They are comletely ****ed, but not as bad as the Talibans. Moreover, the Arabian regime is very different in nature than the Taliban's, if only in their level of overt support for terrorism. Now that its is threatening the regimes very survival I'd wager tolerance for it will fall by the wayside rather swiftly.

[usa320]

Saudi Arabia really needs to get their act together and take an agressive stance on terrorism, or they may find themselves on the recieving end of a **** barrage.

[molly747]

This may seem like a stupid question, but what exactly is Zionism? And why is it so threatening to so many people? I was raised Anglican, so I'm not really down with all this stuff.

[RavenW]

This may seem like a stupid question, but what exactly is Zionism?

Zionism is a desire of Jews to live in the state of their own.
It is national aspiration movement.

Now to the question why is it so threatening.

To my understanding it is simple fear of what Jews might do if you leave them to prosper...

e.g. Jews lived in persecution and discimination for centuries, yet they accomplished so many things in different fields like science, philosophy, music, art, medicine, entertainment.

Even been a minority, Jews nevertheless are NOT "weak", Jews are strong, rich and successful minority, based on the few fundamental traditions that run in Jewish families:

1. Respect for Book. (books in general)
2. Education.
3. Strong Family values and Family ties.
4. Care for Children and future generations.
5. Always should play some instrument (violine, piano, accordion, guitar etc)
6. Good hygiene (e.g. wash your hands before meal and after restroom, so you will not get a "black death" plague, only 40% of people wash their hands after toilet, I bet Jews tend to be in those 40%).

Thus, while for example, almost 50% of African American minority grows up without knowing their fathers, by single mother who must work hard to provide for the children, while being abandoned by husband.
Jewish children usually know and see their fathers as well as grandmas, aunts, uncles and all big Yidish family.

They also tend to remember their roots, and most Jews can tell yuo what country they came from, while some white majority people can't.

Then again comes the question of education, while a ordinary boy/girl from regular (majority) family might study at average level in school, Jewish boys/girls constantly hear things like

"You should study extra hard and get admitted to this university, because when it comes to the question of who to choose among equal students, they will choose a white boy, not you... so only if you be a bit stronger in maths and science you will be accepted... don't make them an oportunity to equally choose between you and majority, you will loose."

So Jews of course, make extra effort to excel.

Personal observation, most of EECS program (Electrical Engineering & Computer Science) at UC Berkeley are either Jewish, Hindu or Chinese.

What does it tells you? Long tradition of culture and knowledge,
long tradition of respect to education and studying, deep roots in ancient culture unlike other minorities that 300 years ago where mostly uneducated people.

Another example is of course Mideval Ages, while white majority did not care about girls education, Jews always spent special effort of whole community and MONEY of whole Jewish community to pay for education of Jewish girls and women. Why? Education was always important for Jews.


There is another sad truth, Jews unlike other nationalities had a "artificial" evolutionary selection on biological level. Since Jews were murdered by hundred thousand since ancient times, only smartest, bravest survived. Those who were willing to take risk and had quick reaction.

It does NOT mean that Jews biologically superior to other people, it only means that years and centuries of "selective" survival picked the quickest and most able people to adapt to new and harsh environment.
Basicaly, those with quick reactions survived. It's sad, but it's true. This process went as far as genocide of Jews by Romans.


So here we come to the question, why Zionism is so threatening to the World?

Well, lets see, imagine a group of people who are very successful in everything they do because of long standing tradition in education and family values.
They of course naturally become tops in science, music, medicine.
They fill universities in all different fields, not only as students, but as professors, teachers, educators.
They are succesfull in bussiness, even when they start from ZERO dollars and scratch.
They're good with money and usually tend to be politically as well as socially aware of surrounding world.

Now, if you would see this group to prosper so strongly while being opressed and persecuted, wouldn't you fear what they might actually do if all the boundaries of restrained were put aside?

e.g. In Soviet Union as well as in Harvard (1929) there existed an anti-semitic policy, no more than 1000 Jews for year admission.
And even with this ethnic "limitations", Jews filled up that quota and even more were admitted because some bright kids just had to be put for military development in physics and math departments.

Soviet olimpics in math and physics were scary for Jedophobs as well, since overwhelming majority of school olimpics participants were Jews.

Why talk about early 20th century?


I teach in regular American High School.
We have a Quiz kids team that participates in different competetions with other schools.
4 kids play knowledge quiz.
I saw the list of 41 school in Northern California.
Guess what pattern I found?
2 Jews, 1 Chinese, 1 white.
This pattern was repeated not only for my high school, but for other high schools through out California.

Sure there were exceptions for this pattern, sometimes it was like
1 Jew, 2 Chinese, 1 white.
But you got the picture.

Open a National Dean's List for colleges and univesities. You would be suprised how many Jews lists there.
Open any book of achievements in Medicine and Law, same pattern.
It's actually might look scary. National Deans List on some pages looks like a telephone book or Yellow Pages of Jews in America.

So now, you got this group of successful individuals, who want to be even more successull if they would live in the land of their own.

After all, Israel is like Second Silicon Valley with Intel and motorolla labs situated overthere... with bio-technology and nanotechnology etc.

If Israel would live in peace with its neighbours, then Israel probably would be the most succesfull country in the world.
Naturally, there are some people who don't want to see this.

So I guess a desire of Jew to live in the land of his own is threatening to some groups in the world, who fear and hate the success of a Jew on the planet of Earth.

[molly747]

I guess bc I am from a rural area of the South, I've never really understood the whole 'discrimination' thing. Not many Jews in the Mississippi Delta. But from my upbringing in the South, people are people. Memphis and the Mississippi Delta have a large Lebanese, Syrian, Italian, and Chinese population. Most of my friends growing up were descendants of these immigrants, so it's not as big a deal as people think (due to the movies and media's portrayal of the South).

[DE_Six]

:| I don't know about this. I guess it could work in some twisted logical way. Get the Saudi people to think that the people they already hate (Zionists, Israelis) are actually the ones behind the terror attacks so they would stand together and support the government in their fight agaisnst Al-Qaeda. Seems pretty desperate move to me though.

I don't know either, but it sounds awfully complicated when it could just be good old-fashioned responsibility shifting...

Not that this notion is scarce among middle eastern intellectuals to start with...

[ronin2172]

Thus, while for example, almost 50% of African American minority grows up without knowing their fathers, by single mother who must work hard to provide for the children, while being abandoned by husband.Jewish children usually know and see their fathers as well as grandmas, aunts, uncles and all big Yidish family.

.
so sad so true..... :(

[Mr. Nielsen]

Interesting thesis RavenW. But it sounds more like you are descriping a general upper/ lower class issue.

As to the perception of zionism as threathening, I think it's associated with the past and present history of the middle east. The zionists perceived as taking over, where the european colonists left. The impression that all US policy in the middle east is about aiding Israel, that the US keeps dictatorships in power in the middle east and that the zionists basicly controls the US.

Add to that the character most likely to boast on TV that he is a zionist, is a bearded lunatic with an m-16 rambling about a greater Israel.

I would say that those impressions are closer to to what the arabs associate with zionism, than just the jewish peoples longing of a state of their own, or that they are terribly succesful.

[chauncy republicans]

The whole "zionism is to blame statement" was political "damage control". While the Saudi Royal Family is a staunch allie of ours, it's subjects largly disaprove of United States policies. It's a bold enough statement to say what he did in relation to quelling the recent spat of terrorism, the last thing the Royal Family wants is to have it's subjects believe they are in cooperation with the so-called "zionists", which is a death sentance for a lawmaker in that region of the world.
I'm pretty sure the Royal Family knows damn well Israel is not to blame, they are just covering their asses.

[RavenW]

I'm pretty sure the Royal Family knows damn well Israel is not to blame, they are just covering their asses.


Word. :)

[Fox2]

Such is the dilemna of Mid-East politics. :|

[big80a2]

they will do for the next 40 years (thas how long the world has got oil reserves) and then they blame them again for jusing all oil :roll:

[AirZone]

This may seem like a stupid question, but what exactly is Zionism?

Zionism is a desire of Jews to live in the state of their own.
It is national aspiration movement.

Now to the question why is it so threatening.

To my understanding it is simple fear of what Jews might do if you leave them to prosper...

e.g. Jews lived in persecution and discimination for centuries, yet they accomplished so many things in different fields like science, philosophy, music, art, medicine, entertainment.

Even been a minority, Jews nevertheless are NOT "weak", Jews are strong, rich and successful minority, based on the few fundamental traditions that run in Jewish families:

1. Respect for Book. (books in general)
2. Education.
3. Strong Family values and Family ties.
4. Care for Children and future generations.
5. Always should play some instrument (violine, piano, accordion, guitar etc)
6. Good hygiene (e.g. wash your hands before meal and after restroom, so you will not get a "black death" plague, only 40% of people wash their hands after toilet, I bet Jews tend to be in those 40%).

Thus, while for example, almost 50% of African American minority grows up without knowing their fathers, by single mother who must work hard to provide for the children, while being abandoned by husband.
Jewish children usually know and see their fathers as well as grandmas, aunts, uncles and all big Yidish family.

They also tend to remember their roots, and most Jews can tell yuo what country they came from, while some white majority people can't.

Then again comes the question of education, while a ordinary boy/girl from regular (majority) family might study at average level in school, Jewish boys/girls constantly hear things like

"You should study extra hard and get admitted to this university, because when it comes to the question of who to choose among equal students, they will choose a white boy, not you... so only if you be a bit stronger in maths and science you will be accepted... don't make them an oportunity to equally choose between you and majority, you will loose."

So Jews of course, make extra effort to excel.

Personal observation, most of EECS program (Electrical Engineering & Computer Science) at UC Berkeley are either Jewish, Hindu or Chinese.

What does it tells you? Long tradition of culture and knowledge,
long tradition of respect to education and studying, deep roots in ancient culture unlike other minorities that 300 years ago where mostly uneducated people.

Another example is of course Mideval Ages, while white majority did not care about girls education, Jews always spent special effort of whole community and MONEY of whole Jewish community to pay for education of Jewish girls and women. Why? Education was always important for Jews.


There is another sad truth, Jews unlike other nationalities had a "artificial" evolutionary selection on biological level. Since Jews were murdered by hundred thousand since ancient times, only smartest, bravest survived. Those who were willing to take risk and had quick reaction.

It does NOT mean that Jews biologically superior to other people, it only means that years and centuries of "selective" survival picked the quickest and most able people to adapt to new and harsh environment.
Basicaly, those with quick reactions survived. It's sad, but it's true. This process went as far as genocide of Jews by Romans.


So here we come to the question, why Zionism is so threatening to the World?

Well, lets see, imagine a group of people who are very successful in everything they do because of long standing tradition in education and family values.
They of course naturally become tops in science, music, medicine.
They fill universities in all different fields, not only as students, but as professors, teachers, educators.
They are succesfull in bussiness, even when they start from ZERO dollars and scratch.
They're good with money and usually tend to be politically as well as socially aware of surrounding world.

Now, if you would see this group to prosper so strongly while being opressed and persecuted, wouldn't you fear what they might actually do if all the boundaries of restrained were put aside?

e.g. In Soviet Union as well as in Harvard (1929) there existed an anti-semitic policy, no more than 1000 Jews for year admission.
And even with this ethnic "limitations", Jews filled up that quota and even more were admitted because some bright kids just had to be put for military development in physics and math departments.

Soviet olimpics in math and physics were scary for Jedophobs as well, since overwhelming majority of school olimpics participants were Jews.

Why talk about early 20th century?


I teach in regular American High School.
We have a Quiz kids team that participates in different competetions with other schools.
4 kids play knowledge quiz.
I saw the list of 41 school in Northern California.
Guess what pattern I found?
2 Jews, 1 Chinese, 1 white.
This pattern was repeated not only for my high school, but for other high schools through out California.

Sure there were exceptions for this pattern, sometimes it was like
1 Jew, 2 Chinese, 1 white.
But you got the picture.

Open a National Dean's List for colleges and univesities. You would be suprised how many Jews lists there.
Open any book of achievements in Medicine and Law, same pattern.
It's actually might look scary. National Deans List on some pages looks like a telephone book or Yellow Pages of Jews in America.

So now, you got this group of successful individuals, who want to be even more successull if they would live in the land of their own.

After all, Israel is like Second Silicon Valley with Intel and motorolla labs situated overthere... with bio-technology and nanotechnology etc.

If Israel would live in peace with its neighbours, then Israel probably would be the most succesfull country in the world.
Naturally, there are some people who don't want to see this.

So I guess a desire of Jew to live in the land of his own is threatening to some groups in the world, who fear and hate the success of a Jew on the planet of Earth. Very intersting read thanks for giving me some info I didnt know...in Israel its kinda different because we are now more "spoiled" and you can see the same thing from the Israeli Arbs (very clever...mostly the christian..pretty much different mentality...pretty sad but thats life...) but as long we have people in our "technion" uhh... Institute of Technology in english? (its like USA MIT?) we have our future of our country in good hands ;)

[2Sheds_Jackson]

We have now the highest oil price in history but if Saudi Arabia falls into chaos, if their oil sources go off line for month or even more than a year...the price of oil will skyrocket. That could have desastrous effects on the worlds economy. And nobody wants that, least of all Bush BEFORE the presidential elections. So he will continue to treat the Saudis with kidsgloves on.

Graph of oil prices in year 2000 dollars. Right now we're at $37.32 in 2004 dollars which is about $33 in 2000 dollars. Nowhere near the all-time high.

http://www.wtrg.com/oil_graphs/oilprice1869.gif

[S'13]

6. Good hygiene (e.g. wash your hands before meal and after restroom, so you will not get a "black death" plague, only 40% of people wash their hands after toilet, I bet Jews tend to be in those 40%).


It's also worth mentioning the Jewish dietary laws (Kashrut).

For example, Jewish dietary law forbids the eating of bloody meat. It's very logical when you think about it. Let's say a person is eating the meat of a sick animal, when is there a greater risk that the person eating the meat will get the disease the animal carried? If the meat was well cooked or with the animal's contaminated blood? I think the answer is clear, but keep in mind that these dietary laws are from thousands of years ago. And there are plenty of other examples.

[DPGLAW]

Yea, I really believe that it was the jews who decided to kill other Jews and their allies, Westerners. This is one of the stupidest things that these moronic arabs could think of to say. I mean by saying something like this, he sounds like that Iraqi Information minister at the beginning of OIF.

These fools want us Americans to be their Allies so they pay our leaders lip service and then go make commments that incite terrorists to act. One day they are going to cross the line and end up our enemy and being an enemy of the United States is not the smartest move. Especially when your amred services are a joke, like that of Saudi Arabia and pretty much any other Middle Eastern Army.
The term Army is used very, ver loosely when describing a middle eastern army...lol

[S'13]

I mean by saying something like this, he sounds like that Iraqi Information minister at the beginning of OIF.

We Israelis call it "Eastern imagination" we had (and still have) to deal with this for the past 56 years.
One example is when in the Six Day War in 1967 the Egyptian government told its people that the Arab armies were "marching into Haifa" while in reality IDF soldiers were cooling themselves in the waters of the Suez canal. :lol:

[Moledet]

I mean by saying something like this, he sounds like that Iraqi Information minister at the beginning of OIF.

We Israelis call it "Eastern imagination" we had (and still have) to deal with this for the past 56 years.
One example is when in the Six Day War in 1967 the Egyptian government told its people that the Arab armies were "marching into Haifa" while in reality IDF soldiers were cooling themselves in the waters of the Suez canal. :lol:
Egypt also told it to the king of Jordan and Syria. They didn't want to sink alone in this war so they told Jordan and Syria to join in and to share the great "success" of this war. Ofcrouse he just lied to them and they attacked Israel and lost the Golan hights and the west bank while Egypt lost the Sinai desert.

[Javehn]

Well , they have also this huge ass motive of pride , and it's connected to their imagination . They are willing to lie , just to holdtheir image in the eyes of others ...

[chauncy republicans]

Yea, I really believe that it was the jews who decided to kill other Jews and their allies, Westerners. This is one of the stupidest things that these moronic arabs could think of to say. I mean by saying something like this, he sounds like that Iraqi Information minister at the beginning of OIF.

These fools want us Americans to be their Allies so they pay our leaders lip service and then go make commments that incite terrorists to act. One day they are going to cross the line and end up our enemy and being an enemy of the United States is not the smartest move. Especially when your amred services are a joke, like that of Saudi Arabia and pretty much any other Middle Eastern Army.
The term Army is used very, ver loosely when describing a middle eastern army...lol
It's obvious you dont understand the political dynamic in the mideast.

[Moledet]

The dynamic is very simple:
The Arabs lie--->The Europeans believe--->Israel defends--->USA supports.

[Javehn]

---------> Emirates and Saudi make oil price up -------------> Everybody suck big **** :lol: -----------> UN in action ----------->We suck big **** :roll:

[chauncy republicans]

The dynamic is very simple:
The Arabs lie--->The Europeans believe--->Israel defends--->USA supports.
I rest my case.

[Bootneck]

I just read Michael Oren's book Six Days of War and found it interesting how throughout the course of the war the Arabs governments lied to their people and how the Arab leaders lied to other Arab leaders about their crushing victories over the Israelis. What's amazing is that those doing the lying eventually seemed to buy in to their own lies.



I mean by saying something like this, he sounds like that Iraqi Information minister at the beginning of OIF.

We Israelis call it "Eastern imagination" we had (and still have) to deal with this for the past 56 years.
One example is when in the Six Day War in 1967 the Egyptian government told its people that the Arab armies were "marching into Haifa" while in reality IDF soldiers were cooling themselves in the waters of the Suez canal. :lol:

[Javehn]

Weel , over exadurating and lying is a serious motive in middle eastern culture , it goes together with preserving the fallen honor . Surprisingly (or not) ,many people do not know that fact . That's why it's preffered from time to time to stay away from Arabic media .