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View Full Version : UN: Blasphemy is a crime. Non binding... yet.



Mr.Flint
11-24-2008, 10:01 PM
UN anti-blasphemy measures have sinister goals, observers say


Steven Edwards , Canwest News Service

Published: Monday, November 24, 2008
UNITED NATIONS - Islamic countries Monday won United Nations backing for an anti-blasphemy measure Canada and other Western critics say risks being used to limit freedom of speech.
Combating Defamation of Religions passed 85-50 with 42 abstentions in a key UN General Assembly committee, and will enter into the international record after an expected rubber stamp by the plenary later in the year.
But while the draft's sponsors say it and earlier similar measures are aimed at preventing violence against worshippers regardless of religion, religious tolerance advocates warn the resolutions are being accumulated for a more sinister goal.



"It provides international cover for domestic anti-blasphemy laws, and there are a number of people who are in prison today because they have been accused of committing blasphemy," said Bennett Graham, international program director with the Becket Fund, a think tank aimed at promoting religious liberty.
"Those arrests are made legitimate by the UN body's (effective) stamp of approval."
Passage of the resolution is part of a 10-year action plan the 57-state Organization of Islamic Conference launched in 2005 to ensure "renaissance" of the "Muslim Ummah" or community.
While the current resolution is non-binding, Pakistan's Ambassador Masood Khan reminded the UN's Human Rights Council this year that the OIC ultimately seeks a "new instrument or convention" on the issue. Such a measure would impose its terms on signatory states.
"Each time the resolution comes up, we get a measure of where the world is on this issue, and we see that the campaign has been ramped up," said Hillel Neuer, executive director of the Geneva-based monitoring group UN Watch.
While this year's draft is less Islam-centric that resolutions of earlier years, analysts note it is more emphatic in linking religion defamation and incitement to violence.
That "risks limiting a broad range of peaceful speech and expression," Neuer argues.
The 2008 draft "underscores the need to combat defamation of religions, and incitement to religious hatred in general, by strategizing and harmonizing actions at the local, national regional and international levels."
It also laments "Islam is frequently and wrongly associated with human rights violations and terrorism."
But Western democracies argue that a religion can't enjoy protection from criticism because that would require a judicial ruling that its teachings are the "truth."
"Defamation carries a particular legal meaning and application in domestic systems that makes the term wholly unsuitable in the context of religions," says the U.S. government in a response on the issue to the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights.
"A defamatory statement . . . is more than just an offensive one. It is also a statement that is false."
The paper also points out the legal difficulty of even defining the term "defamation" since "one individual's sincere belief that his or her creed alone is the truth conflicts with another's sincerely held view of the truth."
Yemen, on behalf of OIC, successfully introduced the measure to the UN General Assembly for the first time in 2005 after Pakistan first tabled it 1999 for annual consideration in the Human Rights Commission - the Council's forerunner.
Canada and other Western countries emphasize the distinction between granting an "idea" rights - and defending the right of people not to be discriminated against.
"Canada rejects the basic premise that religions have rights; human rights belong to human beings," said Catherine Loubier, spokeswoman for Foreign Affairs Minister Lawrence Cannon.
"The focus (here) should not be on protecting religions, but rather on protecting the rights of the adherents of religions, including of people belonging to religious minorities, or people who may choose to change their religion, or not to practice religion at all."
Muslim countries say they are only trying to cut down of what they see as extensive bias against Islam in the West. In the lead-up to Monday's vote, many referred, for example, to the 2005 publication of Danish cartoons that satirized Muhammad, and which touched off riots through the Muslim world.
"Everybody is aware that there is a campaign in certain media to fuel the fire of incitement to hatred and to disfigure certain persons or figures through caricature," said one Sudanese diplomat.
But supporters of the Western position say the resolution and its predecessors contribute to increasing discrimination based on religion.
"From the human rights side of things, this is the opposite of what is supposed to be happening," said Becket's Graham. "Instead of protecting an individual, this resolution protects an idea, and relies on hurt feelings as a source of judgment. It can only lead to a jurisprudence of hurt feelings."
Canada says governments have abused laws against defamation or contempt of religions to "prosecute and imprison journalists, bloggers, academics students and peaceful political dissidents."
The Iranian parliament, for example, is currently weighing a draft amendment to its penal code that would impose capital punishment for apostasy.
But in an irony given Canada's stance, an anti-blasphemy law remains in the Criminal Code. Experts point out it has not been used for a prosecution in more than 70 years.
There's also consensus among opponents of the UN measure that people most likely to be targeted by anti-blasphemy laws are Muslims in Muslim countries.
"Pakistan has the (toughest) anti-blasphemy laws, and while they are certainly used against lots of minority religions, they are used mainly against Muslims," said Graham.
"They have been used to intimidate business partners, suppress any reformist ideas, jail people who discuss women's rights."
But he also noted that anti-blasphemy themes have been cited in countries that are predominantly non-Muslim.
"There are cases in Russia dealing people suing TV stations for airing South Park and the Simpsons because they see them as defamatory to Christianity," he explained.
"A lot of the violence in India dealing with Hindus and Christians is being spurred on by accusations that Hindu gods are being defamed, while there are also cases against artists in India for depicting Hindu gods in modernist way."
Another reason to ignore UN's resolutions....

Calanen
11-24-2008, 11:10 PM
Watch out for this. These so called Anti-Blasphemy statutes will be used to prevent any criticism of Islamic totalitarian regimes, and Islamic practices. Freedom of speech will be sacrificed on the altar of political correctness.

But many these days prefer political correctness to freedom of speech, so it perhaps wont be missed.

Trouble
11-24-2008, 11:15 PM
UN,

I would like to thank you from the bottom of my heart:

Thank you once and again for F**King up the world even more than it already was.

Thank you for throwing fuel onto the fire there by prolonging any real solution or settlement to all the Bulls**t chaos in the world.

Thank you for putting your handout, taking our hard earned Dollars and not accomplishing a damn thing of any usefulness to anyone.

Thank You, with allies like you Osama can retire.

Trouble
11-24-2008, 11:23 PM
On a more even keeled note. This is absolutely dangerous and undermines everything that we have been working toward for the last 60 years. Decisions like this are proof that the UN is not the organization it was meant to be and that it is time to replace it.

Alpheus
11-24-2008, 11:24 PM
Islamic countries Monday won United Nations backing for an anti-blasphemy measure Canada and other Western critics say risks being used to limit freedom of speech.

Ha. We are hardly the ones who should be complaining about freedom of speech, especially about Islam.

Rictor
11-24-2008, 11:32 PM
That's terrible. Kind of like the fact that it would be illegal for me to express a whole range of opinions because, in Canada, they fall under anti-hate speech laws. It's never good to see further restrictions being placed on freedom of expression, but it's hardly a new phenomenon. Or one limited to Islamic countries.

I also believe that if Saudi Arabia wants to jail people for expressing certain views, though I may not agree with it, it is within its rights to do so. They can have whatever wacky laws they choose, as long as the BS stops of their borders.

Mu-Meson
11-25-2008, 12:14 AM
UN,

I would like to thank you from the bottom of my heart:

Thank you once and again for F**King up the world even more than it already was.

Thank you for throwing fuel onto the fire there by prolonging any real solution or settlement to all the Bulls**t chaos in the world.

Thank you for putting your handout, taking our hard earned Dollars and not accomplishing a damn thing of any usefulness to anyone.

Thank You, with allies like you Osama can retire.

Dude, the UN is merely a reflection of the world. It doesn't change the state of affairs of the globe, it is changed by the state of affairs of nations. And that is even worse. If it was the former, then there would be hope things would be improved if ever the UN were to be taken apart (fingers crossed), but since it is the latter, we are truly screwed.

PS

Islamic countries Monday won United Nations backing for an anti-blasphemy measure Canada and other Western critics say risks being used to limit freedom of speech.

Stuff like this is so damn nice to see. Canadians want a reason to vote Conservative? Here it is. Liberals can talk pretty about Canada's standing in the world (soft power, moral leader, etc) but when anything requires standing up and speaking out, do they do anything? No. (and the NDP doesn't even bother pretending) Could any of my fellow Canucks imagine Dion, or which ever pansy the Libs pick to replace him, pulling Canada out of the Durban II conference? (Before the Israelis even, natch!)

Alph, the HRC business worked out ok, didn't it? The glare of attention will hopefully lead to the dismemberment of this "human rights" and victimhood industry.

Mr.Flint
11-25-2008, 01:36 AM
Dude, the UN is merely a reflection of the world. It doesn't change the state of affairs of the globe, it is changed by the state of affairs of nations. And that is even worse. If it was the former, then there would be hope things would be improved if ever the UN were to be taken apart (fingers crossed), but since it is the latter, we are truly screwed.

PS


Stuff like this is so damn nice to see. Canadians want a reason to vote Conservative? Here it is. Liberals can talk pretty about Canada's standing in the world (soft power, moral leader, etc) but when anything requires standing up and speaking out, do they do anything? No. (and the NDP doesn't even bother pretending) Could any of my fellow Canucks imagine Dion, or which ever pansy the Libs pick to replace him, pulling Canada out of the Durban II conference? (Before the Israelis even, natch!)

Alph, the HRC business worked out ok, didn't it? The glare of attention will hopefully lead to the dismemberment of this "human rights" and victimhood industry.
Apparently a study, (by the HRC affiliated Law Prof. supposedly) calls for abolition of it, and relegation of responsibilities to law enforcement agencies and courts.


Regardless of it, this stuff soon enough will become binding, and freedom of speech will become a violation of international law...

Calanen
11-25-2008, 01:37 AM
I also believe that if Saudi Arabia wants to jail people for expressing certain views, though I may not agree with it, it is within its rights to do so. They can have whatever wacky laws they choose, as long as the BS stops of their borders.

Yes they can. The problem for you is their wacky laws are based on religion, their Constitution is the Koran. That's right - don't believe me, look it up. So adherents of the faith are bringing their laws to a multicultist state near you - and it will shortly be blasphemy and defamation of religion to speak out against them.

theholeinthedonut
11-25-2008, 01:46 AM
The UN can stuff their resolution up it's rectum.
Ni Dieu, ni maître!

nullterm
11-25-2008, 01:53 AM
Does this mean the UN will start busting Iran for all it's anti-Zionist comments?

If the UN starts saying what we can think & say, then it's time to finally time to put the organization out to pasture. Just use it as a humanitarian tool.

Props to my fellow Canucks for standing up to it.

NavyTimes
11-25-2008, 03:25 AM
So bull****.

Even Life of Brian was considered blasphemy around here... :p

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNeq2Utm0nU

pacifist
11-25-2008, 03:29 AM
Blasphemy shouldn't be a crime.

I'm against UN in this.

Kilgor
11-25-2008, 03:29 AM
Article 18.

Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance.

Article 19.

Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers.


Throw that one out the door.

I love that Monty Python scene.

pacifist
11-25-2008, 03:30 AM
**** God and Allah!

:)

LazerLordz
11-25-2008, 03:38 AM
Wrong wrong wrong. But hey, who gives a damn about international law when it is not fair.

Such laws should only be national in nature.

gazell
11-25-2008, 07:47 AM
Holy %*&!

And where are all these gay demonstrators?

PeterG
11-25-2008, 07:52 AM
Holy %*&!

And where are all these gay demonstrators?

Homo******s are outlawed too. They are offensive to muslims. Would all homo******s please report to their respective town squares so they can be beheaded. Thank you.

Johnny_H02
11-25-2008, 07:56 AM
Article 18.

Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance.

Article 19.

Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers.


Throw that one out the door.

I love that Monty Python scene.
Whats the point of these two articles if they are making Blasphemy illegal?
Those two defeat the entire purpose, Religion and Religious motives defy logic at all times this is glaring proof.

Winger
11-25-2008, 08:00 AM
I read the title before opening the thread and immediately judged it was an Islamic effort. Sure enough. Nothing against all Islamists but it seems even extreme views make it into the mainstream of many of their societies.

Kletterbuxe
11-25-2008, 09:45 AM
I donīt really remember when the UN became the legislative branch of my country, so I donīt really care about this crap.

And I will continue to call religious figures what they are: imaginary friends.

Military-G
11-25-2008, 11:29 AM
I donīt really remember when the UN became the legislative branch of my country, so I donīt really care about this crap.

And I will continue to call religious figures what they are: imaginary friends.

Couldnt have put it better myself.

woot

Jobu
11-25-2008, 11:37 AM
Whats the point of these two articles if they are making Blasphemy illegal?
Those two defeat the entire purpose, Religion and Religious motives defy logic at all times this is glaring proof.


What's the point of any articles when there is no mechanism in place to enforce them?

The UN is a debating society, the actual charter is meaningless.

ed316
11-25-2008, 02:22 PM
It's non binding and no country is going to let this half ass measure supercede their own country's law.

tsuri
11-25-2008, 03:05 PM
It will always remain non-binding. UN Gremiums can can call for any kind of BS as long as they find a large majority of Arab and African states who vote for this.
Or ultra religious countries which are not in short supply on this planet.

You can just as well ignore this.