British military 1962

[Hellfish]

I'm trying to find out a couple of things about the British military circa 1962...

1. What, if any, units were stationed in the West Indies or British Honduras? I have a good idea of what TA/Colonial units, but not regular Army. I've got a list of all the regiments in existance in 1962, but no idea where they may have been permanantly stationed or temporarily deployed (to Germany or elsewhere).

2. What, if any, was the name of the British unified military command in the Americas? The US has SOUTHCOM, for example. Just curious to know if the Brits had anything similar back then, when they still had significant territorial holdings in the region. I think the RN had a West Indies Station, but that's about all I can find.

3. What would a British infantry battalion in 1962 look like? How many companies, what heavy weapons, what AT weapons, etc. I know GPMGs and SLRs, probably Stens too, but what kind of mortars, artillery or AT weapons could they call on?

4. What British para and RM units were in existence in '62? Is there a list of units earmarked to go to Germany?

[TheKiwi]

I have a couple of Osprey books that might answer your 4th question, or at least parts of it. I'll look it up for you in the morning.

[welshmann]

good article from British Honduras(belize) 1962
http://www.soldiermagazine.co.uk/flashback/pages/218.pdf

[rgjbloke]

I'm trying to find out a couple of things about the British military circa 1962...

1. What, if any, units were stationed in the West Indies or British Honduras? I have a good idea of what TA/Colonial units, but not regular Army. I've got a list of all the regiments in existance in 1962, but no idea where they may have been permanantly stationed or temporarily deployed (to Germany or elsewhere).

2. What, if any, was the name of the British unified military command in the Americas? The US has SOUTHCOM, for example. Just curious to know if the Brits had anything similar back then, when they still had significant territorial holdings in the region. I think the RN had a West Indies Station, but that's about all I can find.

3. What would a British infantry battalion in 1962 look like? How many companies, what heavy weapons, what AT weapons, etc. I know GPMGs and SLRs, probably Stens too, but what kind of mortars, artillery or AT weapons could they call on?

4. What British para and RM units were in existence in '62? Is there a list of units earmarked to go to Germany?

I can help with some of this in 1971 onwards if you like but it is 9 years out on your request.

[a_very_ex_STAB]

3. What would a British infantry battalion in 1962 look like? How many companies, what heavy weapons, what AT weapons, etc. I know GPMGs and SLRs, probably Stens too, but what kind of mortars, artillery or AT weapons could they call on?

Fairly sure that the L7 GPMG (aka FN MAG) was not adopted in the British Army until the late 1960s not 1962. The Bren LMG rechambered to 7.62 NATO was most likely still in use then (and maybe even the Vickers for sustained fire).

I think Stens had probably been replaced by Sterling SMGs at that time

[retrobob]

I've got a load of material concerning the RN/RM and Army from the 1960's.Give me a few days and I'll dig up what I can. From the top of my head, I seem to recall that the sole Infantry Battalion for the entire Carribean at that time was provided by 1st Bn, The Royal Hampshire Regt. who were garrisoned at Airport Camp,British Honduras(Belize).
So far as I can gather, the only other British Army troops in the Carribean, apart from Jamaica based dets. of REME and other personnel assisting with the formation of the new Jamaica Defence Force-JDF during that period was,interestingly, a small detachment of Womens Royal Army Corps-WRAC based at Up Park Camp,Kingston Jamaica.The WRAC det, consisted largely of LEP's-Locally Entered Personel who carried out admin duties between Up Park Camp and Government House.The det. was disbanded and it's LEP's discharged just prior to Jamaica's Independence later that year
I don't know if a unified comand on the lines of SOUTHCOM existed but as far as the RN's concerned, what existed to look after the West Indies was actually Headquartered at HMS 'Malabar' in Bermuda under what I think was titled SNOWI-Senior Naval Officer West Indies.The old RN 'West Indies Squadron' I'm sure no longer existed by 1962. Standby for more gen as I get to it.

[retrobob]

Fairly sure that the L7 GPMG (aka FN MAG) was not adopted in the British Army until the late 1960s not 1962. The Bren LMG rechambered to 7.62 NATO was most likely still in use then (and maybe even the Vickers for sustained fire).

I think Stens had probably been replaced by Sterling SMGs at that time
The L7 GPMG was actually first fielded in 1962,though I'm not sure what Regt. or RM unit was the first to recieve it.I know that some British Infantry Regiments didn't recieve their first GPMG's 'til 67, or in some cases, as late as '68.It was certainly used during the latter part of the Borneo 'Confrontation', from '64 onwards I believe. Some battalions were equipped with both GPMG's and LMG's in the light role.Vickers MMG's were still in use(again, in some units/Bns. alongside both LMG's and GPMG's). The last Vickers gun actually fired 'in anger' by British Forces was with 45 Cdo.RM during the Radfan Campaign.

[Hellfish]

Thanks for the info. I'll happily take more as it comes (that sounds ******... but it is not).

[California Joe]

Working up an "Obscure British Military Loadout"?

[Hellfish]

Working up an "Obscure British Military Loadout"?

You know it.

[TheKiwi]

OK Hellfish

According the Osprey's The Royal Marines 1956-1984 (which I only received on Thursday), after WW2 the Commando's lost their Army components and the Royal Marines took over the Commando traditions. At the time there appears to have been 4 Commandos, 40, 41, 42, 43 and 45. (No 44 for some reason). 41 and 43 were re-established in 1960 along with the Commando Carrier concept (HMS Albion and HMS Bulwark). However overall Commando numbers shrank from approx 11,000 in 1953 to 8,500 in the 1960's. 43 Commando was disbanded in 1968, 41 Commando in 1981.

Each Commando in the 1960's apparently consisted on 680 all ranks, 3 rifle coys, 1 HQ coy, 1 support coy.

Finally, there is a plate in the book of a 45 Commando with a GPMG in Aden in 1964.

Next I will go through the Osprey British Airborne Forces 1940 to 1984 and see what was up with the Para's.

[welshmann]

Fairly sure that the L7 GPMG (aka FN MAG) was not adopted in the British Army until the late 1960s not 1962. The Bren LMG rechambered to 7.62 NATO was most likely still in use then (and maybe even the Vickers for sustained fire).

I think Stens had probably been replaced by Sterling SMGs at that time

dunno about gpmg,these pics saying 1963
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/6269/adengraffitibv4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/adengraffitibv4.jpg/1/w600.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img207/adengraffitibv4.jpg/1/)
look at 3rd man down
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/6785/adenpatrolho9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/adenpatrolho9.jpg/1/w400.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img519/adenpatrolho9.jpg/1/)
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/7966/ontherangesballykinler1su8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/ontherangesballykinler1su8.jpg/1/w720.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img519/ontherangesballykinler1su8.jpg/1/)

[Hellfish]

Thanks! Keep it coming!

[TheKiwi]

OK, Osprey's British Airborne Forces 1940 - 1984 says that after the 2nd World War, the British Para units were swiftly run down. In 1948, the 16th Independent Para Bde Group was created, and it contained 1 Para, 2 Para and 3 Para battalions. This format was to stay in place in 1977 when a cost cutting exercise killed it off. However there was a change in 1968 when it was decided that only 2 of the battalions would be in the airborne role, while the 3rd would be used in a garison role.

Further info. In 1961, when Iraq threatened Kuwait, 2 Para were flown in and stayed there until July that year. After that, the three Para battalions took turns in being posted to Bahrain and the gulf area.

In 1964, 1 Para spent three months in Cyprus during one of the "troubles" there, trying to keep the peace. Meanwhile, 3 Para spent some time in scenic Aden.

In 1965, 2 Para spent some time in Borneo (and Indonesia too :D )

Hope this helps.

In 1966, 2 Para were assigned to British Guiana during the run up to independence.