NATO spokesman reviews Op. "Allied force"

[Herman the II]

Interview with Jamie Shea. Jamie Shea, NATO's spokesman during the 78 day campaign to end the humanitarian crisis in Kosovo in 1999, goes back ...


Jamie Shea: Kosovo - then and now - part1
http://www.youtube.com/v/9SD7sEl1d-0&hl=de&fs=1

Jamie Shea: Kosovo - then and now - part2
http://www.youtube.com/v/jpk-Ub2-SuA&hl=de&fs=1

Jamie Shea: Kosovo - then and now - part3
http://www.youtube.com/v/_hi5ZREfo3w&hl=de&fs=1

Jamie Shea: Kosovo - then and now - part4
http://www.youtube.com/v/_L5ocn43DWA&hl=de&fs=1

[Paya]

I don't have much time, but calling Rambuillet and Ahtisaari mediation negotiations is pure bull.

Also, both Shea and the interviewer conveniently forgot to mention that two-thirds of the pre-war Serb population of Kosovo are now refugees, and that NATO did absolutely nothing to stop their expulsion. Exactly like it did nothing to stop the misappropriation of Serb property in Kosovo, the desecration of graveyards and holy sites, some of which are UNESCO world heritage sites.

The deliberate destruction of civilian targets by NATO during the bombing, such as the Radio Television Serbia, or the train full of civilians in the Surdulica gorge was also not mentioned.

[Arfah]

As I was based in Pristina in 2000...

There were Serb communities in Kosovo who were protected by KFOR troops (Russian soldiers at Kosovo Polje springs to mind). Many Serbs left Kosovo of their own free will because they feared reprisals from the Albanian majority and UCK. It's not the fault of NATO that the Serbian people headed north to Serbia but the actions of their own special police who were acting like Nazi butchers ! After all the atrocities committed by all sides in the Yugoslav civil war, NATO, the UN and EU was beginning to learn from its mistakes. Unfortunately, it didn't stop them making new ones, such as eventually declaring Kosovo as independent. Partition just doesn't work !

[tea drinker]

It's not the fault of NATO that the Serbian people headed north to Serbia but the actions of their own special police who were acting like Nazi butchers !
I've met grown men who were brought as children from Kosovo due to the rising danger to Serbs. One story I heard first hand is of a group of albanian kids hanging a serb kid. They would hang him a bit and let him down. He was let go after. The (serb) father went around to the house with a gun bashing on the door, but they wouldn't open up.
In any case he left shortly after this, obviously he didn't want his kids to be victims of that, or end up killing someone or being killed himself. Ironically the son ended up back in Kosovo as part of Missile defence, but he came home ok.
This had nothing to do with NATO, nor did it have anything to do with the butchering you mentioned, but it is certainly evidence to the contrary.
There is a deep problem there, it didn't suddenly appear, there may have been some sudden action, but don't be misled by that.

Look at Milosevic's rise to power, how he used the plight of the Serbs in Kosovo for his own benefit. Ironically, Serbs and Albanians may be better off long term due to the NATO ethnic non diversity program!

The thing about the train being bombed - ok the first time it was hit it seemed to appear very late on the bridge to effect a change in course for the missile - but then why was the train was hit again, with wounded / dead obviously in situ. Then there is the bombing of the Albanian convoy of civilians, obviously great care was excercised to ensure they were combatants!
Cap the operation off with a strike on the Chinese embassy, and Gen Michael Jackson refusing an order to storm the airport the Russkies were holding. "I'm not going to start WW3 for you".
Lovely.

[Arfah]

I'm not arguing. It's complicated !

Not part of the Yugoslav civil war but more of an extension to it.

My point is that the Serbs were not victims of an 'Expulsion' as someone else stated but fled due to fear. Just as Kosovar Albanians fled to Macedonia and Albania to get away from the Serb Special Police.

"What ye sow, so shall ye reap."

[Gentius]

I don't have much time, but calling Rambuillet and Ahtisaari mediation negotiations is pure bull.

Of course its bull, they eliminated Greater Serbian dream.



Also, both Shea and the interviewer conveniently forgot to mention that two-thirds of the pre-war Serb population of Kosovo are now refugees, and that NATO did absolutely nothing to stop their expulsion. Exactly like it did nothing to stop the misappropriation of Serb property in Kosovo, the desecration of graveyards and holy sites, some of which are UNESCO world heritage sites.

There has never been more then 197.000 Serbs registered in Kosovo by Yugoslavien census back in 90s, today they are some ~ 134.000. Perhaps unlike Serbia who has a population loss by -40.000/yearly, K-Serbs has 4-5 children, I dont know. Secondly, 180.000 Albanian buildings, religious and cultural sites were all destroyd and damaged by Serbian Security Forces. Why add only one side, lets be fair.



The deliberate destruction of civilian targets by NATO during the bombing, such as the Radio Television Serbia, or the train full of civilians in the Surdulica gorge was also not mentioned.

Tragic and RIP to civilians, but had they not been involved we would had another Srbrenica inside Kosovo, perhaps you think its OK?

[Paya]

Of course its bull, they eliminated Greater Serbian dream.
Oh, give me a break.


There has never been more then 197.000 Serbs registered in Kosovo by Yugoslavien census back in 90s, today they are some ~ 134.000.
The data from 1998 speaks of 244.000 Serbs and Montenegrins in Kosovo. Today, there are some 180.000 Serb and other non-Albanian refugees from Kosovo in Serbia-proper. You do the math.


Secondly, 180.000 Albanian buildings, religious and cultural sites were all destroyd and damaged by Serbian Security Forces. Why add only one side, lets be fair.
Yes, lets. The number you gave is grossly exaggerated. The fighting happened mostly in rural areas, hills, forests, and such. There, ofcourse, were cases were the KLA seized villages and small towns, the control of which had to be wrestled back by the Yugoslav Army and the Serbian Police. In such cases, the inhabited areas were bombed by tanks and artillery, prior to infantry assaults, as the Yugoslav Security Forces had little personnel trained in CQB and urban fighting. The destruction of civilian objects was inevitable, especially since the KLA used those objects as cover. Mosque minarets, for instance, were popular (and truth be told, logical) places for sniper nests.


Tragic and RIP to civilians, but had they not been involved we would had another Srbrenica inside Kosovo, perhaps you think its OK?
Nothing remotely on the scale of Srebrenica happened in Kosovo, and there is no evidence that it would have, had it not been for NATO bombing.

[Sumadinac]

As I was based in Pristina in 2000...

There were Serb communities in Kosovo who were protected by KFOR troops (Russian soldiers at Kosovo Polje springs to mind). Many Serbs left Kosovo of their own free will because they feared reprisals from the Albanian majority and UCK. It's not the fault of NATO that the Serbian people headed north to Serbia but the actions of their own special police who were acting like Nazi butchers ! After all the atrocities committed by all sides in the Yugoslav civil war, NATO, the UN and EU was beginning to learn from its mistakes. Unfortunately, it didn't stop them making new ones, such as eventually declaring Kosovo as independent. Partition just doesn't work !

Reprisals against civilians? How is it possible?

[Hyde]

The Big refugee waves started with the nato bombing, altough at that time (March 99) the yugoslav army and police forces already had gained back control over most of the territory of kosovo and with minor harm done to civilians, because that was not their goal. The operation startet in spring 98 and went to winter 98 and in that time, there were no hundreds of thousands people fleeing like you saw on tv after (and a week before) the bombings started and no more people died in the fightings than in any other war, just look at the iraq figures or the russia-georgia war etc. Reports clearly say that most people were fleeing from their village when kla seized it and fightings broke out and returned after the fighting was over. The numbers went high up after the bombing started, most of the civilians were gone, and the victims were mostly men. So there is a high chance that pssed off police or volunteers treated any men in the vicinity of KLA operations as a kla member and/or that many of the victims actually were kla members dressed in civilian clothes, as seen in many photos. But nobody will ever know the real number of civilians vc. kla members and that makes these nazi butcher and other stupid comments unneccessary because they are not true, simpel as that. It's like uninformed bar talk with no substance or knowledge of the conflict...and I wonder why such is never considered as flaming.