Does USA pay for military bases in Germany?

[NowPlaying]

One guy just told me that USA is not paying rent for their military installations in Germany, is that true? I cant find any information about this.

[Silent Reader]

i found this on the German wikipedia


Heute werden neben der kostenfreien Überlassung von Arealen zur militärischen Nutzung z. B. Kosten für anstehende Renovierungen und Neubauten dieser Militäreinrichtungen aus Steuermitteln der Bundesrepublik Deutschland finanziert. Eine Veröffentlichung des Bundesfinanzministeriums von 2005 veranschlagt die „Verteidigungslasten im Zusammenhang mit dem Aufenthalt ausländischer Streitkräfte“ auf rund 123,3 Millionen EUR Ausgaben, denen 24,9 Millionen EUR Einnahmen gegenüber stehen. Eine genaue jährliche Auflistung ist schwierig, da z. B. im Bundeshaushalt zahlreiche Einzeltitel Gelder bereitstellen.[3] (http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ausl%C3%A4ndische_Milit%C3%A4rbasen_in_Deutschland#cite_note-2) Diesen Stationierungskosten steht der Nutzen der internationalen Stabilität durch multilaterale Militärbündnisse, Einsparungen im Verteidigungshaushalt der Bundesrepublik und positive Auswirkungen dieser Standorte auf den regionalen Arbeitsmarkt und die dortige Wirtschaft gegenüber.The US not only pays no rent but Germany (or the German taxpayers) even pay for renovations and new buildings.
In 2005 the costs for all foreign troops stationed in Germany were €123,3m while they generated an income of €24,9m. Though such benefits as positive impact on the local jobmarket and economy around the bases etc is not included there.

[Firefly26]

The US not only pays no rent but Germany (or the German taxpayers) even pay for renovations and new buildings.

The first part is true-the second part is false or misunderstood. The US spends millions on new buildings on our posts. It's a major source of income for the local economies.

[Silent Reader]

The first part is true-the second part is false or misunderstood. The US spends millions on new buildings on our posts. It's a major source of income for the local economies.

its wikipedia :)
but i found this pdf (http://www.bundesfinanzministerium.de/nn_53848/sid_C515D0DEB3FD6FF9264F8F680B861D05/DE/BMF__Startseite/Service/Downloads/Abt__II/der__finanzplan__des__bundes__2004__2008,property=publicationFile.pdf) (in German) of the German 2005 budget

on page 20 there is a small paragraph about foreign troops in Germany

2 things:
at this time Germany partly payed for new structures at Spangdahlem and Ramstein since the US Airforce base in Frankfurt/Main was dissolved and was moved to these 2 other bases. (if i understood it correctly)

Germany also payed for an increase in value of the land which was given back from the foreign forces. so if the US builts a building on a base it gets part of the money back when it leaves the base

[Yahia Al Shaer]

As far as it is known , the foreign troops that were stationed in Germany never paid for their "bases" or camps in Germany.

That agreement, was a part of the "surrender conditions" and became later-on an understandable price for protecting Germanyduring the cold war years

The "USA, France, England and USSR" nations, had taken over the daily "catering , furnishing etc costs for their own troops" in Germany.

The most important factor, on the other side, was, those "Armies" were the largest employers in their areas .... except USSR, which tookover the eastern part , created the DDR Deutsche Demokratishe Republik, which in fact divided Germany and built the
wall of shame


Dr: Yahia Al Shaer

[Connaught Ranger]

As far as it is known , the foreign troops that were stationed in Germany never paid for their "bases" or camps in Germany.

That agreement, was a part of the "surrender conditions" and became later-on an understandable price for protecting Germanyduring the cold war years

The "USA, France, England and USSR" nations, had taken over the daily "catering , furnishing etc costs for their own troops" in Germany.

The most important factor, on the other side, was, those "Armies" were the largest employers in their areas .... except USSR, which tookover the eastern part , created the DDR Deutsche Demokratishe Republik, which in fact divided Germany and built the
wall of shame


Dr: Yahia Al Shaer

A small point, but, it would be more correct to state "the United Kingdom" for "England" as the British Military, Army & Airforce, were stationed in West Germany immediate postwar to the present day and not the English Army.

Connaught Ranger.:)

[cbreedon]

Oliver Cromwell's New Model Army :-)

Back on topic, I thought there was a big uproar a few years back when the US was talking about closing bases. The towns around the bases campaigned to keep them open.

[NowPlaying]

Interesting, I can understand not paying for bases during cold war, defense of western Europe from the communist threat an so on, but what about modern days? How does overall German society look on this question now? Are there any plans to start demanding rent money from American military? How does environmental damage is handled?

[Connaught Ranger]

What environmental damage?

[NowPlaying]

Any place where are military installations there are some environmental damage, like it or no. Starting from sound pollution, damaged roads and ending with oil and other hazardous material leaks, lost explosives laying around and so on.

[Yahia Al Shaer]

Interesting, I can understand not paying for bases during cold war, defense of western Europe from the communist threat an so on, but what about modern days? How does overall German society look on this question now? Are there any plans to start demanding rent money from American military? How does environmental damage is handled?

To be honest, WE MISS THEM

It was a great time for intercultural relationships we have a great lot of
wonderful memories ....

It was different , and many small and larger towns suffered and still suffer an economic "GAP" after they left ...

It is a time which deserves to be called very special

As far as the enviromental effects, this is also now, where the Bundeswehr Basis are present

By all possible measures, the US people have tried their best to give and leave a good impression about America ...

As far as the enviromental damage you mentiobn ... you are definately right, when you mean the ones and lots left behind the Russians and the DDR army.

Polution ... ground water ... the troops excersizing places "very vast areas" damaging the woods and a much more , as if the nature were at their disposal to turn it good again in seconds ... but this was never the
case ...

Even status of the barracks and living blocks and areas left behand , differ a great lot between those of left behind the russins (very very bad) and those left behind the US tropps and personnel ... in good shape, and a great portion is in use by the German civilians and the military

Dr: Yahia Al Shaer

[Dragonscript]

Any place where are military installations there are some environmental damage, like it or no. Starting from sound pollution, damaged roads and ending with oil and other hazardous material leaks, lost explosives laying around and so on.

Other than "lost" explosives, how is this any different than any other city?

[Connaught Ranger]

Any place where are military installations there are some environmental damage, like it or no. Starting from sound pollution, damaged roads and ending with oil and other hazardous material leaks, lost explosives laying around and so on.

The USA & GB were always mindful of the roads and compensation was paid for any unforeseen damage, Military ranges were located well away from inhabited locations and there has always been a good clean-up, disposal of oil etc..etc..The same could not always be said for the East German / and old Soviet facilities.

No bases on the western side have "lost" explosives just lying around, bombs from WW2 are found in the ground in Germany but that's hardly the fault of the troops stationed there post WW2.

Connaught Ranger.

[sig]

The USA & GB were always mindful of the roads and compensation was paid for any unforeseen damage, Military ranges were located well away from inhabited locations and there has always been a good clean-up, disposal of oil etc..etc.. No bases on the western side have "lost" explosives just lying around

Yeah sure. Have you ever heart of Helgoland?

[Connaught Ranger]

Yeah sure. Have you ever heart of Helgoland?


Helgoland = Under the Nazi regime, however, it was again made a naval stronghold and sustained severe Allied bombing toward the end of World War II (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/648813/World-War-II).

Before its destruction, the town of Helgoland extended from the Unterland to the Oberland, where the church occupied the highest point of the island.

With the defeat of Germany, the population was evacuated, and the British occupation authorities changed the physical character of much of the island when they destroyed the remaining fortifications by deep blasting. The island was used as a bombing range by the Royal Air Force (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/511222/The-Royal-Air-Force) until it was returned to West Germany (http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/640159/West-Germany) on March 1, 1952.

Yes former Nazi base and its destruction goes back to WWII and the immediate time following the end of WWII. So fits into the criteria I laid out in an earlier post.

Connaught Ranger.

[zema_06]

in italy they pay something...

[sig]

Yes former Nazi base and its destruction goes back to WWII and the immediate time following the end of WWII. So fits into the criteria I laid out in an earlier post.

Connaught Ranger.


Most of the destructions of Helgoland goes back to "Operation Big Bang", two years after the end of WW2.
The using as a bombing range 7 (!) years after the war, ended only after massive protests against the RAF.
The british soldiers at this time called the island "Hell-go land".
There was never any compensation or a "good clean up".
It took Germany years to clean up the island from undetonated bombs and ammunition.

[Connaught Ranger]

Most of the destructions of Helgoland goes back to "Operation Big Bang", two years after the end of WW2.
The using as a bombing range 7 (!) years after the war, ended only after massive protests against the RAF.
The british soldiers at this time called the island "Hell-go land".
There was never any compensation or a "good clean up".
It took Germany years to clean up the island from undetonated bombs and ammunition.

Yes, but as the place was a Nazi base should your indignation not be pointed towards them for building there in the first place:roll:.

And further with regards war, "to the winners go the spoils of war" to them the area was perfect for use as a bombing range.And this was an exception rather than the rule with regards the Cold War British "Occupation":p

Connaught Ranger

[rgjbloke]

I served in Celle in Germany with the British Army for a year in 1973/74. The base was kept pretty immaculate and there were not any dangerous explosives lying around. I had a great time and I think the vast majority of German people were happy to have us rather then the russians as their neighbours, and, we all spent money in the local economy, bars, club's and supermarkets etc. I'm pretty certain that the Army never paid "rent" for the base.

[cbreedon]

Most of the destructions of Helgoland goes back to "Operation Big Bang", two years after the end of WW2.
The using as a bombing range 7 (!) years after the war, ended only after massive protests against the RAF.
The british soldiers at this time called the island "Hell-go land".
There was never any compensation or a "good clean up".
It took Germany years to clean up the island from undetonated bombs and ammunition.
I don't think the Germans compensated the British for bombing London eitherp-)

[Connaught Ranger]

I don't think the Germans compensated the British for bombing London eitherp-)
Keep that up and you might be sent to "Coventry" ditto

[GtodeO]

sucks for the Germans having the Americans so close, are those americans troops and bases supposed to stay there forever.

[Connaught Ranger]

sucks for the Germans having the Americans so close, are those americans troops and bases supposed to stay there forever.

Why? does it suck for the Germans??:roll:

Connaught Ranger.

[domokun]

sucks for the Germans having the Americans so close, are those americans troops and bases supposed to stay there forever.

Way I see it... it's pretty good deal on Germans. They were there for cold war and everything. On last decade or so Germans them selves have put up plenty of money to keep US bases there.

[Vandervahn]

..., Military ranges were located well away from inhabited locations and there has always been a good clean-up, disposal of oil etc..etc...

That is part of the current economic problem, as many bases were kept in smaller towns and rural areas as well. A larger city might have no problem compensating lost income from closed based, but in the rural areas the soldiers were and are a big factor for the local economy.

Thats why it is usually the small town mayors at the forefront of the movements to keep those bases ;)

[Soldat_Américain]

It's the same when BRAC tries to close stuff in the States.

[tluassa]

I live in a town with many British soldiers (Gütersloh) and we get along very well. Of course it benefits the economy, by the Way many Soldiers buy Cars in Germany especially when they stay longer (and really nice ones :) )

[LineDoggie]

sucks for the Germans having the Americans so close, are those americans troops and bases supposed to stay there forever.


Yeah, because America sucks so much, Hundreds of Thousands of Your Countrymen come here legally and otherwise for a Better life :roll:

[LineDoggie]

in italy they pay something...

Likely due to the fact that Italy became a Co-Belligerant to the Allied Side in 1943.