RACK molle or Tactical vest?

[CovOps]

Which do you prefer more?

RACK molle
http://www.special-warfare.net/data_base/306_vest/sds_01/ranger_rack_04.jpg

or

Tactical vest
http://www.special-warfare.net/data_base/306_vest/eagle_vest_01/tac_v1n_02.jpg

[ibstolidude]

of the 2 I prefer the RACK - but that is just personal preference -I actually prefer a simply chest harness(blackhawk makes a great one), camblepak, and pouches for the upper thight/hip.

The vest styles (atleast for me) tend to sift around and also get really hot.

I prefer to have gear higher on my chest and away from my waist.

[digitalghost]

Anything with PALS webbing means that the vest is cutomizable to put anything you want on it and thats a plus so I'll have to go w/ the Ranger RACK--- If you want that vest customized BHI has a modular version of it:


http://www.blackhawkindustries.com/uploads/product_images/37CL36ALL_1.jpghttp://www.blackhawkindustries.com/uploads/product_images/37CL36ALL_2.jpg

http://www.blackhawkindustries.com/product_detail.asp?product_id=2829&d=

[ibstolidude]

I'd die from heat troke in that - and I personally do not like the way they fit with body armor on. The Interceptor and like have the ability to place mag pouches directly on the armor cover, which I think is a awesome improvement over the old style RBA.

[Gordon]

Anything with PALS webbing means that the vest is cutomizable to put anything you want on it and thats a plus so I'll have to go w/ the Ranger RACK--- If you want that vest customized BHI has a modular version of it:

Last time I checked you were an 18 yr old fresh out of high school, sure you have a right to your opinion but don't you think this kind of thread is best left to the people who have experience hauling these things all over the world.

[Midtown]

I think the RACK by SDS is more comfortable, but the damn straps can dig into your shoulders if your not wearing armor underneath the RACK,
I hear really good things about the BHI version tho (STRIKE system I think its called)
And I really am not a fan of the Tac vest, I dig the SPEAR/Intercepter armor, but just dont like the functionality of it.

I just would rather go with something Molle Compatible.
(all my opinions are formed from airsoft, so dont spaz on me, but all the gear I've used is what the real operators/soldiers use)

[Beowulf]

we had a guy go down as a heat casualty b/c he was wearing a vest in intense heat while we were doing room clearing ina mout city.

It was intensely hot and he just got light headed, but that vest keeps all the heat in. It's like wearing a nylon jacket w/ mags and ammo...no thanks.
All best
beowulf

[digitalghost]

Beowulf: So can one wear armor such as the Interceptor/SPEAR/RAV in hot environments or would they have to sacrifice Armor for reduced heat? Aren't soldiers currently wearing Armor/Helmets in the hot Iraqi desert environment and Philliphines? I'd rather protect myself from bullets(armor) than heat(no armor)

[Beowulf]

well....you answered your own question didn't you?

[digitalghost]

Yes but you said someone you know had a heat injury because of that vest? Why did that happen? Is there a way to prevent it?

[JiJoMacLE45]

Don't do MOUT evolutions wearing body armor in oppressive heat. Sounds simple enough.

[Merik]

Yeah there is DG........Drink plenty of water. Thats the only way you can prevent it.

[Beowulf]

yeah he should have been drinking more water...that's really all you can do, and be aware of the mission and climate when choosing your gear.

[JiJoMacLE45]

Sometimes I feel like we are all digitalghosts babysitters.

1) Drink more water before you go out and play and the sun.
2) No swimming after lunch or you'll cramp up.
3) Hold daddy's hand before we cross the street.
4) Don't place shiny objects in your mouth.

[ We'll make an exception for you on the last one DG. Only place shiny objects in your mouth if the safety is off and you intend to pull the trigger.]

[Trigger]

:slap:
That's gonna leave a mark. rofl

[digitalghost]

Drink more water before you go out and play and the sun.
You forget "during"


[ We'll make an exception for you on the last one DG. Only place shiny objects in your mouth if the safety is off and you intend to pull the trigger.]
I wouldve done the suicide thing long ago if it wasn't for religion-- Working hard for every bloody thing in life sucks

[CovOps]

more inputs pls.

WHICH DO YOU PREFER MORE?

RACK MOLLE OR TACTICAL VEST

[ibstolidude]

all LBV's, LCE's and LBE's of any type suck..
The by name are for bearing and carrying weight and that just plain sucks.

I think overall the more experience you have with them the harder you look to find ways to avoid needing to carry the **** and starting think of smarter ways to consolidate.

And in my personal opinion (as stated) for me the vests lock in too much heat and I feel it...for other dudes??? I think they are convienent and own one, but would seldom use it as it lacks the versatility I like.

And yes Digitalghost many people when given the freedom do choose to loose the body armor (situation dependent) in trade off for the mobility, less weight and comfort...one can GUESS about what you would do, but as Beowulf can tell you it is a VERY different story when you have been wearing it day in and day out for 9 months in some dirt-hole, climbing up the sides of mountains, riding in vehicles lacking AC, riding on horses/donkeys, climbing around in all kinds of crap, getting in and out of vehicles and buildings etc.....as with anything you also start to learn/guess when you need it and when you may not.
- And even the Iraq pictures show that troops choose not to wear the armor at times - even those short breaks are important to both moral and rest - but most troops don't get the choice it is made by their commanders.

And about the MOUT casualty - the dude in question is considered by many to be a stud - he ended up taking atleast 2.5 liters LR and Sod (we were running low by then).. he was in a bad way... the main cause - who knows - bad food - puked up his a bunch of water - too much boozing days prior- hydrated the day of the training and not starting days before - the fact the sun was unrealenting - the fact that he had been going at it for several days in the sun in full gear with little rest - couple all together ??? The point is that it happens to the best.

[Bootneck]

Bingo. ID confirmed. He's ba-ack...



I wouldve done the suicide thing long ago if it wasn't for religion-- Working hard for every bloody thing in life sucks

[stuntman]

CovOps my opinion is pals type webbing is better. Because its very customable and companies are starting to make more pals type gear. So maybe the prices will lower and quality will remain high! Plus most here complain about such things as heat, when in retrospect unless you’re a special ops soldier you don't have the luxury of taking it off during combat operations. So when ever some one states "I don’t like it its makes me hot" or something (very true) like that, it's better if people here stick to the forum and just answer your point! IMHO also check this new style of pals webbing out..
http://gear-guru.net/tims_vest_interior_2.jpg
http://gear-guru.net/tims_vest_canteen_cover.jpg
http://gear-guru.net/tims_vest_back_panel.jpg
http://gear-guru.net/interceptor_front.jpg
http://gear-guru.net/interceptor_back.jpg
whats cooler then the new USMC marpat type spear gear?
enjoy CovOps!

[Beowulf]

all LBV's, LCE's and LBE's of any type suck..
The by name are for bearing and carrying weight and that just plain sucks.

haha...preach on!
-beowulf

[Haiw]

I wouldve done the suicide thing long ago if it wasn't for religion-- Working hard for every bloody thing in life sucks
goddamn why does religion always have to screw up everything :|

[globe]

Because the alternative will be the 'Myth of Sisyphus'. Let's not talk about the divine or the lack of and concentrate on LBEs.

[Light Fighter]

Although I have never been in actual combat having to carry this stuff, my company (Private Protection Service) has made me go on long training SIMS with some of the agents that we employ, we work side by side with SWAT agents, the ocasional FBI HRT trainig teams and on rare instinces SF types for this type of training. By no means is this "paintball/airsoft in the woods" It involves a lot physical tasks, setting up base camps, ambush/counter ambush, patrol and my personal choice isnt a vest or a chest rig, but a "belt rig" made by Arktis. Its comfortable, dosnt trap heat like some vests and I just find it a lot nicer to work in. I've also found the AK vests. What I have in od: http://www.ironwolfent.com/graphics/product1413_thumbnail.jpg[/list]

[SABER 2-3]

I personally have a custom vest that is a cross between a RACK and LCE. If given the choice an operator should test all types of LCE and decide what works for them. If not the standard ALICE LCE modified for individual use is still the prefered atleast in my unit. That is saying alot due to the fact that we can wear anything we want.

[EliteWolf]

i prefer the body armor/modular vest, IE the paraclete RAV or SPEAR RBA, its the best of both worlds packed into ONE single vest, a vest that not only saves your life, but carries your gear as well, and the nice thing about vests over Load bearing gear is the weight is distributed throughout the torse, not just the shoulders. its nice just having to take off your helmet, belt, and body armor and not have to undo any type of other gear u would otherwise wear over standard armor, when u take off the vest, the gear goes with it, and i think that makes life easier. lets hope so.

[SABER 2-3]

Here is the major problem w/ modular body armor. Concealable body armor offers the same level of protection as RBA and Interceptor (w/ or w/o plates) but is 1/4 the weight. There are many times when LCE is not worn but armor is. And there are many times when armor is not worn but LCE is. So unless you have the time and no one does to break these systems apart, having layered rigs works best.

[ibstolidude]

Take a demo dork bag and fill it full of your goodies, add a day pack (diddy bag or deedee bag) and a couple of high thigh rigs and Bob's your uncle. now move out and draw fire.

[SABER 2-3]

"But I just got this badass knife from the PX and was gonna hang it up-side down from my LCE suspenders."

[ibstolidude]

I like when you see dudes wearing a croock neck GI flashlight on their FIRING shoulder...?? huh?

How do does one shoot like that? Usually I guess it is a command SOP. I hate command SOP fors all gear. Our teams SOP's have certain items that are standard - location of personally carried IV's, dressings, autoinjectors for morphine, commo batteries and the like...but who really cares where the majority of else goes

[digitalghost]

EliteWolf: Is the RAV superior than all other modular armor systems out there i.e. (MOLLE/SPEAR/FSBE)etc. I guess I think so because it has more everything-- More pouches, more features such as the customizable back and quick release-- How exactly does the whole "quick release" feature work? What about all those zippers and stuff? I'm confused-- But I'm still impressed with tis features

[EliteWolf]

yea the RAV is better than the other govt issued modular body armor, its lighter, more comfortable, and as u said, it has more features...i do not own a RAV but this is what i hear about it, however i do not know exactly how the quick release system works.

[ibstolidude]

the best LBE in the army is the E-1 FNG....unfortunately we don't get any..so make to with a truck.

[Chris1]

the best LBE in the army is the E-1 FNG....unfortunately we don't get any..so make to with a truck.
I am interested in this kit, is it similar to our '79/80 pattern SPROG system and does it require as much kicking to work?
Do you know places that I could purchase one online?

[ibstolidude]

altough it has been a while...
it does require loads of kicking and has a tendency to be misplaced when not constantly in positive control

[globe]

altough it has been a while...
it does require loads of kicking and has a tendency to be misplaced when not constantly in positive control

:cantbeli:
What do you use? A leash? Bungee cord?

[RealUltimatePower]

HOLY CRAP IN A CAN BATMAN! That MARPAT vest is sooo sweet! Is it going to be issue to Marines going on MEU SOC deployment? Cause I'd sure love to use that when I get in the corps. But as for gear I'm not picky. I've use Cdn web gear for two years and it's not very durrable but it sure is comfy. And if worn right very effective. I just like having my mags at about stomach height. I find it easier to change in the ****e that way as opposed to on the chest.

So number 1 choice is that USMC modular vest and then the RACK

[Royal]

altough it has been a while...
it does require loads of kicking and has a tendency to be misplaced when not constantly in positive control

:cantbeli:
What do you use? A leash? Bungee cord?

Black and nasty or a vigilant Corporal...

[SABER 2-3]

Weve gone hi-tech in my area of operations. Gone are the days of attaching dummy cords to our dummys and sensitive items checks at stand-to. We now use the X-5000 replacement body tracker w/ GPS and set for multiple targets. We hope to get the SOPMOD version w/ laser designator, RAS rails and gangsta grip. Oh and of course the death-ray.