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ZeroZen
07-08-2009, 03:55 PM
Rep. Ron Paul so far has won 245 co-sponsors to a bill that would require a full-fledged audit of the Federal Reserve by the end of 2010.

All of a sudden, Congress is paying close attention to Ron Paul.

The feisty congressman from Texas, whose insurgent "Ron Paul Revolution" presidential campaign rankled Republican leaders last year, now has the GOP House leadership on his side -- backing a measure that generated paltry support when he first introduced it 26 years ago.

Paul, as of Tuesday, has won 245 co-sponsors to a bill that would require a full-fledged audit of the Federal Reserve by the end of 2010.

Paul attracted just 18 co-sponsors when he authored a similar bill, which died, in 1983. While the impact Fed policies have on inflation is once again a concern, fears about loose monetary policy and excessive federal spending appear even more widespread in 2009.

"In the past, I never got much support, but I think it's the financial crisis obviously that's drawing so much attention to it, and people want to know more about the Federal Reserve," Paul told FOXNews.com.

With the Federal Reserve holding interest rates at rock-bottom levels, pumping trillions into the economy and now poised to have new powers to oversee the financial system under President Obama's proposed regulatory overhaul, Paul said lawmakers want transparency.

"If they give them a lot more power and there's no more transparency, that'll be a disaster," he said.

The bill would call for the comptroller general in the Government Accountability Office to audit the Fed and report those findings to Congress. The GAO's ability to conduct such audits now is severely restricted.

A slew of top Republicans are backing the bill, as are many Democrats.

"Ron Paul has the right idea on this," said Sen. Jim DeMint, R-S.C., who supports similar legislation in the Senate. "I'm just hoping we can get a clear audit. ... We need to know what they're up to."

House Republican Leader John Boehner, who signed on as a co-sponsor this month, wrote in a recent blog post that the "lack of transparency and accountability" regarding federal dollars committed by the Fed and Treasury Department raise "serious concerns" and make an audit critical.

"The Federal Reserve Transparency Act would remove all of these restrictions, and allow GAO to get real answers from the Federal Reserve to protect American taxpayers," Boehner wrote.

Unfortunately for Paul, the bill appears to be idling in the House Financial Services Committee, which is chaired by Barney Frank, D-Mass. The bill has been sitting there, gathering co-sponsors, since Paul introduced it in late February.

"You've kind of got to rely on the Democratic leadership (to move the bill along)," a Boehner aide said. "I haven't heard a lot of support from Chairman Frank."

Calls to Frank's office were not returned.

Paul acknowledged that his bill hasn't advanced but said Frank has "promised" him he will deal with his bill and is willing to give it a hearing. Paul said it's easily got the "momentum" to pass the full House.

A representative with the Federal Reserve could not be reached for comment.

Obama, though, voiced confidence in Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke last Tuesday and defended the Fed's overall ability to regulate effectively as well as his proposal to give the body more power.

"If you look at what we've proposed, we are not so much expanding the Fed's power as we are focusing what the Fed needs to do to prevent the kinds of crises that are happening again," Obama said. "We want that power to be available so that taxpayers aren't on the hook."

Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., introduced a bill similar to Paul's in the Senate in March, which so far has attracted just three co-sponsors -- DeMint and Republican Sens. David Vitter of Louisiana and Mike Crapo of Idaho.

But DeMint told FOX News last week that the measure would have a good chance of passing the Senate if supporters can push Paul's to a vote, which he said would be successful, in the House.

"I think if we can get that much attention on this bill, I don't believe senators could vote against it, if people knew what they were voting for because everyone is suspicious of the Federal Reserve," DeMint said.

Paul's underlying goal is to abolish the Federal Reserve, which he finds contemptible.

"I blame almost everything on the Fed because they create the bubbles, they create the credit," Paul said.

But the move to require an audit, which Paul described as "neutral," puts him a bit more in the congressional mainstream.

That's a change of pace. The long-time congressman's GOP primary bid was decidedly outside the mainstream. His campaign drew enthusiastic support last year, and though it wasn't enough to pose an electoral threat to the top candidates, he even staged his own September counter-convention in Minneapolis -- down the road from the official Republican National Convention in St. Paul. His "Rally for the Republic" drew more than 10,000 supporters and was complete with a rock band and a slew of faux-delegates wielding signs for their states.

Paul frequently plays the role of party and congressional outsider. Most recently, he was the lone "no" vote on last Friday's resolution to condemn the Iranian government's crackdown on protesters.

He cited constitutional concerns in that vote, as he has in his criticism of the Fed and a slew of other issues.

"The whole process is unconstitutional. There is no legal authority to operate such a monetary system," Paul said in February, in a statement calling for Washington to "end the Fed." He introduced the Federal Reserve Transparency Act the following day.




Ron Paul’s bipartisan attack on the Fed
His proposed audit has drawn on widening anger with central bank

Ron Paul's legislative history is a lesson in principled failure. Among the bills he has co-sponsored: ending U.S. cooperation with the United Nations, a repeal of antitrust law "to restore the inherent benefits of the market economy," and stripping the government of the right to set a minimum wage. Just last week, he again introduced a bill "to repeal the Gun-Free School Zones Act of 1990," which would presumably make schools less safe but which would reinforce our right to bear arms. For Paul, ideology almost always trumps politics.

None of these bills, I should note, have picked up much support. And Paul's track record with economic legislation isn't any better. His perennial efforts — shifting the country back toward a gold standard, abolishing the personal income tax, and dismantling the Federal Reserve — are nonstarters. They so change the very fabric of this country that Paul can't marshal his colleagues to his side.

Which is why Paul's most recent legislative accomplishment is so impressive. He has rallied the majority of the House to support his new cause: an audit of the Federal Reserve. Legislators are sick of not knowing what's going on inside Bernanke's fortress, especially as the Fed becomes further enmeshed in the nation's fiscal policy. Paul's little bill has become emblematic of a larger movement, one that could spell trouble for Obama's troubled regulatory plan. Ron Paul — always an enemy of regulation — is now an enemy of Obama. And a mighty powerful one at that.

Paul wants to audit the Fed primarily because he wants to destroy it; the audit bill is just the latest chapter in Paul's lifelong crusade against it. His vendetta is fueled by the belief that the Federal Reserve is unconstitutional, a central bank within a country that doesn't allow central banks. That the Fed can manipulate the currency and "create legal tender out of thin air" is heresy. And so Paul attempts to dismantle it the only way he can: through legislation.

Thus we come to the audit. For Paul it's a foot in the door to a much larger goal. To the 244 co-sponsors — 74 of them Democrats — it's a way to show their constituents that they're worried, too, about where taxpayer dollars are going. It's an amusing dissonance between the leader of the rebellion and his revolutionaries. The two parties are after entirely separate goals, one (transparency) vastly more achievable than the other (the end of the Federal Reserve).

This again makes Paul's coalition all the more remarkable. The distrust of the Fed has reached a point at which a majority of House members are following a radical into battle. Congress' frustration was evident last month when Bernanke got roasted in front of Congress, putting his future as Fed chairman and the health of Obama's regulatory plan in doubt.

Obama's proposal is to make the Fed a super-regulator; one that can both intervene and responsibly interfere whenever necessary. It would keep tabs on all the financial institutions that are too big to fail — banks and insurers, mainly — and, theoretically, keep the economy safer from major shocks like the one we just went through. But critics say that the Fed is partly to blame for getting us into this mess, and its track record when trying to cushion a bank's fall is suspect.

This is where the trouble begins. The Obama administration hasn't promised to make the Fed any more transparent despite making it all the more powerful. Already over the past year the Fed's role has become as large as the financial crisis was urgent. Yet we don't know anything more about how the Fed does its business now than we did before it started guaranteeing trillions of dollars of assets. The Fed's responsibilities have matured, but its personality has not. It is still the gifted child that can do whatever it wants — and its parents are still so in awe of its intelligence that they don't ask any questions.

The audit bill would change that; Obama's regulatory plan would not. The Obama administration has offered typical platitudes about accountability but doesn't have specifics about how it would work. Ironically, a regulatory plan that's all about increased openness and transparency for the markets may fail to apply the same standards on its newly empowered regulator.

And so we're building toward a very interesting clash within the financial and political communities. Think of it as a math proof: Because of Ron Paul and the audit bill, we already know that Congress doesn't like the Fed. It feels this way because of the relationship between two variables: power and accountability. The Fed has too much power and too little accountability. Congress believes the two variables should have equal values. They do not, so Congress does not approve. Now, if you give the Fed more power but not more responsibility, this is going to make Congress upset. So upset that they may not pass the new regulatory legislation.

And so Obama finds himself in a difficult spot. He needs Congress on his side for a host of other legislation, so he may need to appease them here. But if he makes the Fed more accountable, the agency becomes even more a part of the government than it already is. This would be fine, except for the fact that the Fed isn't supposed to be a part of the government. So there's that.

But something has to give. Paul's Gang of 244 is fed up. They're ready to kill something. It will probably be Obama's regulatory plan. Then again, with Paul leading the charge you never know. It may be something central, something federal, something reserved. Never underestimate Ron Paul. Even if there's no reason not to.


its about time....

RECON DOC
07-08-2009, 04:22 PM
rep. Ron paul so far has won 245 co-sponsors to a bill that would require a full-fledged audit of the federal reserve by the end of 2010.

its about time....

x2..............

seraosha
07-08-2009, 04:25 PM
x2..............

x3............

Dan2004
07-08-2009, 04:47 PM
x3............

x4...........

About Goddamn time! woot

xav
07-08-2009, 04:49 PM
x5 and good move, but waiting for the anti-RonPaul crowd to show up

Power_serj
07-08-2009, 05:22 PM
Go Ron Paul. Ron Paul actually has a lot of good ideas for fixing the government. Too bad he has too many crazy ideas. His son seems to be a little more moderate with a lot of the same great ideas.

This is the best idea anyone in the Federal Government has had in a long time.

Hilbert
07-08-2009, 06:15 PM
x5 and good move, but waiting for the anti-RonPaul crowd to show up

x6.............

Fat Lazy American
07-08-2009, 06:31 PM
Pointless.

hskywalker
07-08-2009, 07:11 PM
I read somewhere this crisis doesn't start because federal reserve created the housing boom, but because politicians forcing coporations to support it to increase housing ownership.
Politicians should not mess too much with economy.
China is against federal reserve's loose monetary policy. Maybe this will change some member's mind.(Good job for federal reserve to piss of China):)

okiebugg
07-08-2009, 07:14 PM
Pointless.

Your approach is approximately equal to a far left ideological blogger. You think it is pointless to look at some of our Fed agencies who handle most if not all of the money supply? I would like to see audits (unannounced) of many Fed agencies

You just stay the way you are and you will see the American way of life destroyed before your very eyes

Kit
07-08-2009, 07:15 PM
On one hand, this bill will die because it doesn't seem in character for the Democrats to close down the Fed.

On the other hand, maybe the Democrats will get on board with this because they need to a scapegoat to politically save their ass.

Kilgor
07-08-2009, 07:16 PM
about time the cockroaches had a light shone on them.

Drain-O
07-08-2009, 07:16 PM
Lol, Ron Paul.

"Hey, imma put spending in bills I know will pass then vote no on the bill so I can make the claim that I am against all spending!"

Fat Lazy American
07-08-2009, 08:31 PM
Your approach is approximately equal to a far left ideological blogger. You think it is pointless to look at some of our Fed agencies who handle most if not all of the money supply? I would like to see audits (unannounced) of many Fed agencies

You just stay the way you are and you will see the American way of life destroyed before your very eyes

You need to check and re-check that list of cosponsors. Plenty of the far left is supportive of auditing the Fed, too. Abercrombie, DeFazio, Grijalva, Kaptur, Kucinich, Schakowsky, Woolsey ...

Scapegoating the Fed is a time-honored tradition of both the far left and the far right.

The mainstream of the Republican Party has latched onto the "Audit the Fed" bill (supported by such luminaries as Alex Jones and Andrew Napolitano, of course) because they think they can use it as ammunition to stymie Obama administration efforts to introduce banking regulations and to generally make things difficult. They won't actually go along with Ron Paul's plans to dismantle the Fed (although folks like Kucinich and Woolsey may well do so.)

The reality of the political motivated auditing an organization as large and complex as the Federal Reserve is that, well, everyone gets exactly what they expect. The data will be every bit as dense and obscure as the organization it's examining. Ideologically and politically motivated economists will read in whatever problems they already think existed and recommend changes they already advocated. And nothing will really happen.

The only winners are whatever accounting firms get the contract.

Umbro2914
07-08-2009, 09:52 PM
^ you are a fat lazy American. It's about time people take the time to listen and interpret rather then write someone off because they are a "loon" An audit of the Fed is long overdue.

And to all those on here who agree with an audit, the least you can do if you havent already is sign an online petition
http://www.campaignforliberty.com/campaigns/hr1207home.php

Takes all of.. 3 seconds?

Fat Lazy American
07-08-2009, 10:29 PM
I didn't even mention the fact that Ron Paul is a loon.

Kit
07-08-2009, 10:46 PM
Pointless.

I didn't even mention the fact that Ron Paul is a loon.

I see why "Lazy" is in your screen name.

Dan2004
07-08-2009, 11:26 PM
And to all those on here who agree with an audit, the least you can do if you havent already is sign an online petition
http://www.campaignforliberty.com/campaigns/hr1207home.php

Takes all of.. 3 seconds?

Signed it. :)

[WDW]Megaraptor
07-08-2009, 11:30 PM
Generally the Fed isn't audited because the results can negatively affect the markets.

The chairman of the Fed generally does not give interviews, for the same reason.

sinophile
07-09-2009, 12:14 AM
Stupidity. Suicidal stupidity.

This is like Cap and Trade for the Fed. First, the GAO and Fed OIG have audit authority. Next, if the Fed is engaged in an economic knife fight with other countries where currency manipulation is the blade.

Why, why, why would you expose Fed strategies to the world when no other central bank will do the same?

This is insanity. The value of the dollar is political stability in the US and Ron Paul is doing his utmost to bring about instability.

Albatross
07-09-2009, 12:20 AM
Do the audit, get back to zero and rebuild. **** it. If everyone goes down the playing field is still level. Ron Paul is the only one who has anything right, the rest of those idiots don't know their ass from a hole in the wall.

Albatross
07-09-2009, 12:22 AM
Stupidity. Suicidal stupidity.

This is like Cap and Trade for the Fed. First, the GAO and Fed OIG have audit authority. Next, if the Fed is engaged in an economic knife fight with other countries where currency manipulation is the blade.

Why, why, why would you expose Fed strategies to the world when no other central bank will do the same?

This is insanity. The value of the dollar is political stability in the US and Ron Paul is doing his utmost to bring about instability.

I don't know if you just popped out of a wormhole, but if we don't do something then most of the curencies of the world will not be pegged to USD. Most nations are attempting to make that move now.

We aren't stable due to lack of clarity by the government.

sinophile
07-09-2009, 12:23 AM
Do the audit, get back to zero and rebuild. **** it. If everyone goes down the playing field is still level. Ron Paul is the only one who has anything right, the rest of those idiots don't know their ass from a hole in the wall.

Its so easy to type or say that. Its another thing to live through this:

http://z.about.com/d/history1900s/1/0/9/1/gd49.gif

Consider the possibility Bernanke is a LOT smarter than you and get back to stacking shelves at Wal Mart.

Albatross
07-09-2009, 12:28 AM
Its so easy to type or say that. Its another thing to live through this:

http://z.about.com/d/history1900s/1/0/9/1/gd49.gif

Consider the possibility Bernanke is a LOT smarter than you and get back to stacking shelves at Wal Mart.

Bernake has more knowledge over finance and economics than I do I will give you that. What he doesn't have is a backbone. What you don't realize is that if we don't get this mess sorted out now, this thing will get so bad that we will all live thru that.

Wal-Mart, man thats a prayer that I have had for years.

But, just to entertain me, whats your background in economics and finance?

brainplay
07-09-2009, 10:05 AM
Why, why, why would you expose Fed strategies to the world when no other central bank will do the same?

Why do they have to be exposed to the world. The audit results can be kept in house and behind closed doors or at least for the more sensitive parts. Won't be the first time an info lockdown was imposed.

okiebugg
07-09-2009, 10:06 AM
You need to check and re-check that list of cosponsors. Plenty of the far left is supportive of auditing the Fed, too. Abercrombie, DeFazio, Grijalva, Kaptur, Kucinich, Schakowsky, Woolsey ...

Scapegoating the Fed is a time-honored tradition of both the far left and the far right.

The mainstream of the Republican Party has latched onto the "Audit the Fed" bill (supported by such luminaries as Alex Jones and Andrew Napolitano, of course) because they think they can use it as ammunition to stymie Obama administration efforts to introduce banking regulations and to generally make things difficult. They won't actually go along with Ron Paul's plans to dismantle the Fed (although folks like Kucinich and Woolsey may well do so.)

The reality of the political motivated auditing an organization as large and complex as the Federal Reserve is that, well, everyone gets exactly what they expect. The data will be every bit as dense and obscure as the organization it's examining. Ideologically and politically motivated economists will read in whatever problems they already think existed and recommend changes they already advocated. And nothing will really happen.

The only winners are whatever accounting firms get the contract.

"Scapegoating the Fed"? With the current administration, it is impossible. Generally speaking, the transparency we were promised has been ignored.

"Plenty of the far left is supportive of auditing the Fed, too. Abercrombie, DeFazio, Grijalva, Kaptur, Kucinich, Schakowsky, Woolsey ..."

"agreed..... there are a few insignicant members of the loon left who suport the auditing process. What about Pelosi and Reed and those (Barney Frank) who disagree and can obstipate the process?

"they think they can use it as ammunition to stymie Obama administration efforts to introduce banking regulations and to generally make things difficult."

The obama sponsored legislation that has come out of DC thus far has been an utter failure and has shown his thought process in the big picture. Why should I think that new "banking regulations" should be any different? You want more nationalization? 'We own' most of the automobile industry and the large banks.
As I speak, new unemployment claims show unemoploymen is soon to be 10% The numbers continue to rise even though the Pres and his minions psychically predicted the rate to top at 8%. 6,883,000 are unemployed. If sanity doesn't soon return to Government both the administration and its mirror the Legislature, we indeed will be in soup lines

Umbro2914
07-09-2009, 05:07 PM
http://z.about.com/d/history1900s/1/0/9/1/gd49.gif

.

This is what will occur if the Fed is allowed to continue to devalue our dollar and push inflation...

Fat Lazy American
07-09-2009, 05:44 PM
"Scapegoating the Fed"? With the current administration, it is impossible. Generally speaking, the transparency we were promised has been ignored.

"Plenty of the far left is supportive of auditing the Fed, too. Abercrombie, DeFazio, Grijalva, Kaptur, Kucinich, Schakowsky, Woolsey ..."

"agreed..... there are a few insignicant members of the loon left who suport the auditing process. What about Pelosi and Reed and those (Barney Frank) who disagree and can obstipate the process?

I was accused of being part of the loon left for opposing the bill. Barney Frank, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid are not loon left anymore than John Boehner and Mitch McConnell are far right. Partisans like you need to gain some perspective.

Frankly, though, I'm not as wary of the bill is sinophile is. I just think it's mostly pointless political grandstanding. I've actually read the bill. Its brevity, vague language and focus on reports to Congress suggests that's the only thing it's good for.




The obama sponsored legislation that has come out of DC thus far has been an utter failure and has shown his thought process in the big picture. Why should I think that new "banking regulations" should be any different? You want more nationalization? 'We own' most of the automobile industry and the large banks.
As I speak, new unemployment claims show unemoploymen is soon to be 10% The numbers continue to rise even though the Pres and his minions psychically predicted the rate to top at 8%. 6,883,000 are unemployed. If sanity doesn't soon return to Government both the administration and its mirror the Legislature, we indeed will be in soup linesIf it's your goal to blame the current administration for the economic downturn, then you've revealed yourself for a partisan hack.

And, of course, there are plenty economists that predicted this downturn would be this steep. And many of them blame the administration for not fully nationalizing the banks and having too small a stimulus. Welcome to the world of economic policy. Everyone's biases are always confirmed.

And I've yet to see any argument in favor of the bill other than "more transparency" -- something that's usually just a hollow slogan. And considering what the bill actually requires, certainly a hollow slogan in this case.

Ron Paul could have written a bill that would actually show the Fed's slip, so to speak. It would have been longer and much more specific as to what an "audit" entails. But then the rational wing of the Republican Party would never sign on.

But boy, if this bill passes and an audit occurs, boy will Ron Paul's angry speech that follows be a big hit on YouTube.

Fat Lazy American
07-09-2009, 05:46 PM
This is what will occur if the Fed is allowed to continue to devalue our dollar and push inflation...

The Great Depression was deflationary. L2History.

LS1 Miata
07-09-2009, 05:53 PM
Ron Paul FTW

Henry's Fork
07-09-2009, 06:00 PM
x5 and good move, but waiting for the anti-RonPaul crowd to show up

Remember now, RP is crazy. Says the far left and right.

I love him for the fact that he gets all main scumsuckers from the left and right panties in a bunch. Even if some of the sh1t he says is far out.

Umbro2914
07-09-2009, 06:51 PM
The Great Depression was deflationary. L2History.

well this wasent...

http://img.tfd.com/wiki/c/ca/Inflation-1923.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0e/Inflaci%C3%B3_utan_1946.jpg
My points the same; the Fed will only weaken the US economically

sinophile
07-09-2009, 10:45 PM
This is what will occur if the Fed is allowed to continue to devalue our dollar and push inflation...

There is your worthless opinion of what will happen, and the opinion of a trillion or so dollars traded by professionals. As you can see below thus far nobody agrees with you. The dollar remains comparatively strong with no signs - yet - in the treasury, gold or currency markets the sky will fall.

http://www.x-rates.com/d/USD/EUR/graph120.png
http://www.x-rates.com/d/USD/TWD/graph120.png
http://www.x-rates.com/d/USD/JPY/graph120.png
http://goldprice.org/charts/history/gold_60_day_o_b_usd.png?0.20947215568660826

Drain-O
07-09-2009, 10:50 PM
Enjoy this copypasta.

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n2/jrpwnt/story.jpg

DID SOMEBODY SAY RON PAUL?

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The notion of a rigid separation between church and state has no basis in either the text of the Constitution or the writings of our Founding Fathers. On the contrary, our Founders’ political views were strongly informed by their religious beliefs. Certainly the drafters of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, both replete with references to God, would be aghast at the federal government’s hostility to religion. The establishment clause of the First Amendment was simply intended to forbid the creation of an official state church like the Church of England, not to drive religion out of public life.

You're right Ron Paul, who needs seperation of church and state?

http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul148.html

Although "we are told that it is evil to be afraid of black men, it is hardly irrational. Black men commit murders, rapes, robberies, muggings and burglaries all out of proportion to their numbers."

"Black males age 13 that have been raised on the streets and who have joined criminal gangs are as big, strong, tough, scary, and culpable as any adult and should be treated as such."

"Opinion polls consistently show that only about 5% of blacks have sensible political opinions, i.e. support the free market, individual liberty and the end of welfare and affirmative action."

Oh Ron Paul, you crazy racist piece of ****!

http://www.austinchronicle.com/issues/vol16/issue9/pols.paul.side.html

Ron Paul posing with Don Black, former Grand Wizard of the KKK and current head of stormfront.org

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n2/jrpwnt/RonPaul-DonBlack.jpg

Interviewer, Erik Forman - Congressman Paul, thank you for providing time for this interview. With your permission I would like to skip the formalities, as my readers are fully aware of your Libertarian ideology and your platform. I would specifically like to talk about certain powers in our government that, to the thinking of a growing band of Constitutionalists, seem to have taken control of the political system itself. First question: do you believe there are secret forces at work that are attempting to dismantle the Constitution and the Bill of Rights?

Congressman Ron Paul - I don't know what the best word is, but secret is pretty good. They're certainly not known to a lot of people; it's actually what their doing. But then again, it's not absolute secrecy. If you look around you can usually get the information. There was a time when nobody even knew who was a member of the CFR or the Trilateral Commission. I think it's a bad sign that they're not as secret as they used to be. They're bolder now. But there is an agenda. They're behind the scenes in many way - very secretive. And, that was certainly the case on those individuals who planned and pushed us into the Iraqi War.

That's retarded on levels of 9/11 and Moon landing conspiracy theories.

http://www.illuminati-news.com/ron-paul.htm

Ron Paul on earmarks:

1. He asks for millions ($400 million this year alone) in earmarks
2. He places them in bills that are sure to be passed
3. He votes NAY on that bill, knowing that it will be passed anyways.

By voting NAY he can claim that he's against earmarks and unnecessary spending when he's adding earmarks for things that are completely frivolous and may I add that almost all of these funds won't even see his state of Texas. By voting NAY, he can sit around and claim everything you see on his pamphlets due to his deceptive techniques. - calvinkillips

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,292334,00.html

From Heresiarch: Nobody with any sense at all thinks that RON PAUL is going to even make it as far as getting the GOP nomination, not with a nationwide support rating hovering around one percent. This thread is for making fun of Ron Paul supporters. Every extra piece of information which shows how insane he is is another piece of information which his drooling legions have to conveniently ignore, and which we can mock them for.

Ron Paul is not a threat to America, because he has no chance of winning anything at all, but his supporters are a tremendous source of comedy. Libertarians bending over backwards to support a guy who doesn't believe in separation of church and state?

More facts and reading!

http://www.brokenlibrarian.org/ronpaul/
http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul-arch.html

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n2/jrpwnt/4m2ai6h.png

LS1 Miata
07-10-2009, 12:15 AM
Ron Paul FTW

Kit
07-10-2009, 01:02 AM
The notion of a rigid separation between church and state has no basis in either the text of the Constitution or the writings of our Founding Fathers. On the contrary, our Founders’ political views were strongly informed by their religious beliefs. Certainly the drafters of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, both replete with references to God, would be aghast at the federal government’s hostility to religion. The establishment clause of the First Amendment was simply intended to forbid the creation of an official state church like the Church of England, not to drive religion out of public life.

You're right Ron Paul, who needs seperation of church and state?


Reading comprehension FAIL

He's right. The First Amendment declares that there should be no "Church of America" sponsored by the state government. The Founding Fathers wanted to stray away from the European model of "Church of X". If the the United States Government picked a state church, that would mean they would have to pick a denomination. America was way too diverse because you had Quakers, Roman Catholic, Lutherans, and so forth. Not everybody was Anglican. So the founders said that the government couldn't have a bias towards any religion. The First Amendment does NOT mean the government has a duty to strike down religious practices done in public. So I'm not sure on how you're trying to nail him.

But I don't feel like commenting on that garbage heap you call a post. "Kill Your Father"? Where the hell did that come from? It makes it sound immature and lacking credibility.

Umbro2914
07-10-2009, 11:28 AM
Enjoy this copypasta.

Ron Paul on earmarks:

1. He asks for millions ($400 million this year alone) in earmarks
2. He places them in bills that are sure to be passed
3. He votes NAY on that bill, knowing that it will be passed anyways.

By voting NAY he can claim that he's against earmarks and unnecessary spending when he's adding earmarks for things that are completely frivolous and may I add that almost all of these funds won't even see his state of Texas. By voting NAY, he can sit around and claim everything you see on his pamphlets due to his deceptive techniques. - calvinkillips



Research Fail.

http://www.youtube.com/watch/v/fq_5H1XKVww

seraosha
07-10-2009, 11:37 AM
Can we cut to the chase and ban Drain-o for a week?
Kill your father?

Umbro2914
07-10-2009, 11:41 AM
There is your worthless opinion of what will happen, and the opinion of a trillion or so dollars traded by professionals. As you can see below thus far nobody agrees with you. The dollar remains comparatively strong with no signs - yet - in the treasury, gold or currency markets the sky will fall.




Yes but one cannot say that inflation and devaluation have no occured. Just look at the minimum wage...
in 1961 -- $1.15
in 2008 -- $6.55
in 2009 -- $7.25 <-- look at the increase in but one year....

What other explanation can be given for this other then the lose of value of the dollar? You basically need 7 dollars to buy now what you could've bought with 1 fifty years ago.


http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

http://www.dol.gov/esa/minwage/coverage.htm

Drain-O
07-10-2009, 01:09 PM
But I don't feel like commenting on that garbage heap you call a post. "Kill Your Father"? Where the hell did that come from? It makes it sound immature and lacking credibility.
I have no idea, it's either a meme created by 4Chan based on something he said, or something he said while off camera. Like I said, it's copypasta.

sinophile
07-10-2009, 11:29 PM
Yes but one cannot say that inflation and devaluation have no occured. Just look at the minimum wage...
in 1961 -- $1.15
in 2008 -- $6.55
in 2009 -- $7.25 <-- look at the increase in but one year....

What other explanation can be given for this other then the lose of value of the dollar? You basically need 7 dollars to buy now what you could've bought with 1 fifty years ago.


http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

http://www.dol.gov/esa/minwage/coverage.htm

We've already had a thread on the fallacy of your argument and here is the synopsis:

Your $1.15 minimum wage worker from 1961 had a 64 year life expectancy and his calculator cost $4,900 in 1960's dollars.

Today he will live to 75 and he can buy the same calculator for less than $1.

We got from there to here by way of our fractional lending system and other forms of leverage and investment.

Your dollar buys more today than it ever did. You just don't see it because you take productivity for granted and are focused on one very simple concept you read someplace.

budgie
07-11-2009, 01:01 AM
Your approach is approximately equal to a far left ideological blogger. You think it is pointless to look at some of our Fed agencies who handle most if not all of the money supply? I would like to see audits (unannounced) of many Fed agencies

You just stay the way you are and you will see the American way of life destroyed before your very eyes

I would posit that fiscal transparency and far-left ideology are not incompatible. Suddenly anything against common sense is 'left'? Hopefully congress will see the sense in such a move, as transparency in government spending is already fairly widespread among many of America's so-called 'socialist' allies in Western Europe and the Commonwealth.

Fat Lazy American
07-11-2009, 01:29 AM
budgie,

You think the ECB and BOE are transparent, subject to full auditing? Really?