FN Five-seveN Users

[DmL5]

Does anybody know who all are using the FN 5.7mm Five-seveN? I know of a few units rumored to be using it, but it would help if anybody who was positive of any units using it would post them and their (reliable or unreliable) sources (or, even better, pictures) here; Thanks.

P.S. Also visit my P90 Users thread: http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=18882

[SMGLee]

FiveSeven is pretty useless as a pistol ammo. it is a different story in a sub gun.

[DmL5]

FiveSeven is pretty useless as a pistol ammo.

Not from what I hear; check out this thread (in the middle of page 2), and you'll find some 5.7-related info as well as shootings with it: http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=17056&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=16

[DmL5]

Here are some of the 5-7 users I know of; anybody got any more?

Atlanta SRT's (Two different departments)
Belgian Air Force
Belgian Army Special Forces
Belgian DSU
British SAS
Cyprus National Guard
Dallas/Fort Worth SWAT
Dutch Military
US Bellavue, NE SWAT
US Secret Service
US Lawrenceville, GA Police Department

[-Max-]

French GIGN is also a Five-SeveN user. I have recently see pics of GIGN members using it in two differents magazines (in a special issue for the 30th birthday of the unit).

GIGN also used the FN P90 a lot for CT operations. They adopted the new P90 Tactical version (who has two side rails and an enlarged Picatinny rail on the top).

[Glock]

Here are some of the 5-7 users I know of; anybody got any more?

Atlanta SRT's (Two different departments)
Belgian Air Force
Belgian Army Special Forces
Belgian DSU
British SAS
Cyprus National Guard
Dallas/Fort Worth SWAT
Dutch Military
US Bellavue, NE SWAT
US Secret Service
US Lawrenceville, GA Police Department

Hwo gives you that information?
I'am only sure that the Cyprus National Guard is using the Five-SeveN.
And Iam sure that the SAS have no Five-SeveN in use!
Greatings Leo

[-Max-]

Belgian Air Force (issued to F-16 pilots), Belgian Army SF, Belgian DSU and USSS are confirmed users.

For the SAS, who knows ? The P90 (and to a lesser extent, the Five-SeveN) is becoming popular among SF/CT units so i would not be surprised to see a few Five-SeveN and P90 in their armory. And dont forget that SAS have access to a large range of weapons... ;)

Countless books about Special Forces and SAS are released each year and its not because those books dont mention the Five-SeveN or the P90 in the "SAS weapons" section that they dont use it in reality... :|

[DmL5]

Hwo gives you that information?

Well, it depends which unit you're asking about; I've heard several places that the SAS have the 5-7 in their inventory, but its a question mark. I am quite sure of the others, and the list I showed didn't include the many US Police departments using it.

[1Cie GevGn]

When I was talking to an armourer of the 1st Mechanised Brigade in Leopoldsburg (Belgian army) he said that the Belgian army was actually on a crossroads, with one one side the normal 5.56 and 7.62 ammo, but the other options were a complete change into the FiveSeven system, pistol and P90. I asked again because I thought I missed something, and he actually said one option was that every soldier would carry a P90...

Sounds a bit expensive to me :lol: they even have a shortage on current hardware. I should get my rifle next week, and I've heared that a lot of people got an old rusty FAL :(

[-Max-]

When I was talking to an armourer of the 1st Mechanised Brigade in Leopoldsburg (Belgian army) he said that the Belgian army was actually on a crossroads, with one one side the normal 5.56 and 7.62 ammo, but the other options were a complete change into the FiveSeven system, pistol and P90. I asked again because I thought I missed something, and he actually said one option was that every soldier would carry a P90...


Sounds strange to me. The P90 is a submachinegun, not an assault rifle. The most likely next assault rifle of the Belgian Army is the FN F2000 (or maybe the G36 if H&K win the call of offers recently launched by the army for a small batch of new assault rifles :roll: ).

[Smintjes]

When I was talking to an armourer of the 1st Mechanised Brigade in Leopoldsburg (Belgian army) he said that the Belgian army was actually on a crossroads, with one one side the normal 5.56 and 7.62 ammo, but the other options were a complete change into the FiveSeven system, pistol and P90. I asked again because I thought I missed something, and he actually said one option was that every soldier would carry a P90...


Maybe he was talking about tank crews being armed with a P90 as a PDW. Although that's highly unlikely when you keep the Belgian defense budget in mind...

[1Cie GevGn]

I know, that's why I asked again and he firmly stated they were considering a full change into the 5.7 system. Sounded crazy to me then too.

[DeltaWhisky58]

Here are some of the 5-7 users I know of; anybody got any more?

Atlanta SRT's (Two different departments)
Belgian Air Force
Belgian Army Special Forces
Belgian DSU
British SAS
Cyprus National Guard
Dallas/Fort Worth SWAT
Dutch Military
US Bellavue, NE SWAT
US Secret Service
US Lawrenceville, GA Police Department

SAS using the FN5-7 - I don't think so - Evidence???

[Flanker]

Don't know about the SAS, but it seems quite probable that they keep P90s and the Five-Seven in their inventory for use in CQB scenarios where the baddies are wearing body-armour. We've seen the P90 used in this specialist role allready at the Japanese embassy thing in Peru(?) where the pointman used a P90 to penetrate the terrorist leaders body armour, while the rest of the assault unit carried other weapons.

Norwegian FSK (Forsvarets Spesial Kommando) uses the Five-Seven in this role as well, documented by this published picture from a training exercise onboard an aircraft. (sorry 'bout the size, but it's clipped from a newspaper)



edit: How can I conclude that it's used in a specialist role, just from this one picture? Beacuse no sane person shoots the hugely penetrating 5,7mm. bullet inside an aircraft filled with passengers and gasoline unless he's facing an opponent in body armour, that's why! Frangible bullets vs. body armour = dead entry team.

[DmL5]

The SAS are evaluating a new handgun. The SAS use handguns as concealed weapons, or as a back-up in case the HK MP5 sub-machineguns jam. They are carried in under-arm holsters and fired in a double handed crouch position. However, modern lightwieght body armour, which can stop all but the most powerful handguns at point-blank range, is increasingly used by terrorists and criminals nowdays. As a result the SAS (and other UK organisations) are evaluating a new handgun, the Five-SeveN, made by FN Herstal. This new handgun is claimed to be the most powerful handgun in the world. It can penetrate 48 layers of laminated Kevlar armour at a range of 200 metres. The browning 9mm pistol, currently used by the SAS, fires 8 gram bullets at a speed of 350 metres per second, whilst the Five-seveN fires (5.7mm) 2 gram bullets at a muzzle speed of 650 metres per second - almost twice as fast. It also produces significantly less recoil than a conventional handgun, due to the lightweight bullets, and an ingenious design which causes the gun to partially cancel out the recoil with the gas pressures created when the gun fires.

[DeltaWhisky58]

The SAS are evaluating a new handgun. The SAS use handguns as concealed weapons, or as a back-up in case the HK MP5 sub-machineguns jam. They are carried in under-arm holsters and fired in a double handed crouch position. However, modern lightwieght body armour, which can stop all but the most powerful handguns at point-blank range, is increasingly used by terrorists and criminals nowdays. As a result the SAS (and other UK organisations) are evaluating a new handgun, the Five-SeveN, made by FN Herstal. This new handgun is claimed to be the most powerful handgun in the world. It can penetrate 48 layers of laminated Kevlar armour at a range of 200 metres. The browning 9mm pistol, currently used by the SAS, fires 8 gram bullets at a speed of 350 metres per second, whilst the Five-seveN fires (5.7mm) 2 gram bullets at a muzzle speed of 650 metres per second - almost twice as fast. It also produces significantly less recoil than a conventional handgun, due to the lightweight bullets, and an ingenious design which causes the gun to partially cancel out the recoil with the gas pressures created when the gun fires.

The SAS evaluate almost every suitable weapon coming onto the market - that does not imply that they adopt it. There are huge numbers and varieties of weapons in the armouries at Credenhill which never see the light of day after evaluation.

[Royal]

The SAS are evaluating a new handgun. The SAS use handguns as concealed weapons, or as a back-up in case the HK MP5 sub-machineguns jam. They are carried in under-arm holsters and fired in a double handed crouch position. However, modern lightwieght body armour, which can stop all but the most powerful handguns at point-blank range, is increasingly used by terrorists and criminals nowdays. As a result the SAS (and other UK organisations) are evaluating a new handgun, the Five-SeveN, made by FN Herstal. This new handgun is claimed to be the most powerful handgun in the world. It can penetrate 48 layers of laminated Kevlar armour at a range of 200 metres. The browning 9mm pistol, currently used by the SAS, fires 8 gram bullets at a speed of 350 metres per second, whilst the Five-seveN fires (5.7mm) 2 gram bullets at a muzzle speed of 650 metres per second - almost twice as fast. It also produces significantly less recoil than a conventional handgun, due to the lightweight bullets, and an ingenious design which causes the gun to partially cancel out the recoil with the gas pressures created when the gun fires.

Don't know where this is from, but as to when it is somewhere in the dark ages. The L9A1 went out as the standard sidearm for UK SF well over ten years ago. They are still there, and a minority prefer them but to say that the L9A1 is currently used is a gross exageration.

[Flanker]

SAS also uses, or have used, the Sig P226 9mm. as documented by many pictures. The pistol is often fitted with an oversize 20 round magazine. My guess is that the Sig is more popular than the ageing Hi-Power, if they havn't switched over to Glocks or USPs since those pics were taken.

[Glock]

The SAS still use the Sig P226

[Royal]

The SAS still use the Sig P226

along with the P226K, the P229 and a few other odds and sods...

[DmL5]

The clipping I posted was actually fairly old; I have heard other places that they did take the 5-7 (and P90) into their inventory, although its still doubtful. And I know that they did not replace the P226, which is still in use.

[Flanker]

I don't think it's doubtful... They are the elite, they've got the cash, and they'd be stupid not to have a few P90s and Five-Sevens in their inventory because of their special cartridge that provides extreme penetration and decent range with a small, low recoiling round. Sure they've got it! Is it the regular issue handgun? No. But that doesn't mean they don't have it.

[DmL5]

Flanker, I don't think the gun in your pic is a 5-7, because if you look at its shadow on the wall, it has an external hammer (I think), and the 5-7 does not. Its still possible the FSK are using it; have you heard so anywhere else?

[Marsuitor]

Flanker, I don't think the gun in your pic is a 5-7, because if you look at its shadow on the wall, it has an external hammer (I think), and the 5-7 does not. Its still possible the FSK are using it; have you heard so anywhere else?
With regards to proof on whether the unit uses it or not, it all boils down to that single picture posted by Flanker. However, the winter training and doctrine development unit in the Norwegian army (SVI) has had the FN-P90 on trial for some time, and has ****loads of different stuff in armory. So seeing that the two weapons share the cartridge, it's not too far off to speculate(mind you) that SVI has a couple these about too, and that NORSOF has had it for tests on the odd training excercise. Whether they've adopted it or not would probably only be known if you were actually in the unit, which not too many are. I'm assuming they use a mix between Glock17 and perhaps the Sig226/9 however, as they the first is the standard sidearm in the forces, and the latter seemingly being a standard in some of the western SF communities.

[MK-ULTRA]

Montreal Police SWAT Unit uses the Five-seveN as well as the P90.

[AUDIEM249]

i heard the p90 is as accurate as a M16A2 up to 220 yards dont know for sure but even though it is a pdw i dont think it would be a bad standard issue weapon i think the only reason i am saying this is because i worship the weapon :D

[DTTO]

Here are some of the 5-7 users I know of; anybody got any more?

Atlanta SRT's (Two different departments)
Belgian Air Force
Belgian Army Special Forces
Belgian DSU
British SAS
Cyprus National Guard
Dallas/Fort Worth SWAT
Dutch Military
US Bellavue, NE SWAT
US Secret Service
US Lawrenceville, GA Police Department

Definately not a user.

S.

[DTTO]

i heard the p90 is as accurate as a M16A2 up to 220 yards dont know for sure but even though it is a pdw i dont think it would be a bad standard issue weapon i think the only reason i am saying this is because i worship the weapon :D

I think you have a good understanding of why you say such things.
Might want to do some reading regarding the effectiveness of the round fired by that weapon at the stated distance.

S.

[DmL5]

Here are some of the 5-7 users I know of; anybody got any more?

Atlanta SRT's (Two different departments)
Belgian Air Force
Belgian Army Special Forces
Belgian DSU
British SAS
Cyprus National Guard
Dallas/Fort Worth SWAT
Dutch Military
US Bellavue, NE SWAT
US Secret Service
US Lawrenceville, GA Police Department

Definately not a user.

S.

It would be nice to know what DEMSPEC was talking about though.

Thanks for the info.

[AUDIEM249]

DTTO i said i heard about that this isnt any BS i made up

[AUDIEM249]

perhaps i mixed up range and accuracy because at 219 yards exactly (did my reading) it is able to defeat class 3 body armor and is able to kill out to 437 yards without presents of armor

[Cardinal]

Belgian DSU rejected the 5-7.

[DmL5]

Belgian DSU rejected the 5-7.

Please elaborate. Below is my source:

The main weapon in the DSU arsenal is the ubiquitos HK MP-5 family and shortly the P90 (with various accesoires and optics). Remington 12-guage shotguns are also used for room clearing. Pistols include the Browning 9mm, Glock 17 and FN Five-seveN. Snipers are issued the Finnish Sako TRG-21 7.62 or a self-designed 7.62 police sniper rifle, they are also allowed to choose their own sniper rifles. Other weapons like the Smith & Wesson .38 revolver and HK 94 submachine gun are also used.

[Cardinal]

DSU have had trials with the 5-7, but the pistol was rejected for standardised operational use.

[Hawkeye]

Belgian SF and F-16 pilots use Five-Seven too