Tactical Scenarios--Drunk & Dangerious

[Dennis G]

While on patrol as a shift supervisor for a security company you get a radio call from an officer at an armed site. He is requesting back-up, saying that he thinks the subject is armed with a gun.

You atempt to contact him via radio and advise him you are about 3-5 min away...No Response.

As you enter the site you check with the front desk (Motel) in order to find the room number the officer was making contact with.

the room is on the second floor, and ALL the rooms have plate glass fronts separated by cinderblock walls. There is a 3' walk way that has a very rickety wooden 3' high rail, and it is 30+' from the walk to a cement courtyard below.

You see the officer standind with a male white aprox 5'-7" 165 lbs (soaking wet) wearing a 3/4 length leather coat, silk sweat pants, and hi-top shoes, no shirt. You are about 50 yards away and the subject is between you and your partner

You hear the officer say:

"Sir, if you have a gun we need to know about it for our safety."

(It is aginst the rules at this location to have weapons. Policy)

When you get to the two you introduce yourself, and again ask him to tell you were the gun is for everyone's safety.

You note a heavy odor of beer, not just from his mouth, but covering him, it is mixed with the odor of urine.

He says that he has a CHL. You ask how old he is...20.
(lie# 1)

You must be 21 yrs old for CHL in OR. When you ploitely inform him of this. He responds by saying it is in process
(lie #2)

The subject is between you and your partner. Your parther is about 6'-3" and weighs around 335lbs.

Sudenly, he reaches into the waistband of his beer, and urine soaked sweat pants, and says he is going to kill you and your partner. He is, to the best of your knowledge; at this point reaching for a gun.

Your first instinct is to draw your gun and shoot, your partner has the EXACT same thought...

The problem is that if you draw and shoot your partner is right on the otherside of the suspect, and vice versa.

Your Response.

[Mark Sman]

First move is your parterners.

Attempt to clear his line of fire and close distance with subject.

If your partrner draws, you draw.

If your partner engages by hand (which he should) you prepare to dogpile the subject.

If the subject draws a thermal detonator you work on your Jabba laugh.

While still watching the glass, doors and walls from which bullets, people and thermal detonators may yet emerge.

Since it was stated that you introduced yourself it seems you are within 10 feet. 10 feet is to close to engage with firearm. Throw his ass over the rail.

[ßå$tĮТHÏ¿ð]

CALL FOR BACKUP, your a security guard...you dont need this **** ;) Call the cops, they can deal with the drunken asshole.

First move is your partners resposibility, as I assume the subject is now facing you.

He should already have his gun drawn on the subject, or at least try to stay outta your line of fire.

With the subject clearly intoxicated and with "urine stained pants" if he is armed he probably wouldnt have a clear shot as if he cant control his bodily functions his aim wont be so great. (although I wouldnt want to make a bet if you were closer then 10 feet).

If your partner doesnt draw his gun on the drunk and dog piles from behind jump ontop.

If the drunk draws a weapon, 1 shot to the dominant shoulder should suffice.

Otherwise keep the drunk busy until the po-po get there so he can spend a night of puking in the drunktank in his urine stained pants then jailed for uttering threats (and if he did pull a weapon hes in even more ****).

[soma]

Shoot him in the leg.

[duck]

Apply to his Patriotic feelings and say loud and clearly "No brie for me". :D It's always good to find a common factor.

[Flagg]

If the drunk draws a weapon, 1 shot to the dominant shoulder should suffice.


Shoot him in the leg.

While drawing, sidestep to the same side as the bad guy's draw hand, clear your team mate from the line of fire as best you can under the circumstances.....confirm a firearm and hose the guy center mass with an entire magazine.....then reload.

But calling law enforcement FIRST would have been key.

To the best of my knowledge, most firearms engagement distances occur within 20 feet......and most shots miss(including trained law enforcement officers)...trying to incapacitate with a single well placed gunshot while the adrenalin is pumping through you like crack cocaine isn't the optimal choice....keep it simple....I'd shoot to kill.

[Tane Angle]

The first question is why the police weren't called. If there might be a gun in the room, let the police handle it. Don't even confront the guy unless he starts threatening people.

The second question is why the supervisor didn't approach from a safe angle. Had something gone wrong sooner, the officer might not have even known that the supervisor was coming up behind the suspect. It is extremely important to have a safe and known backstop.

But since the situation is already as it is, as many already said, command the officer by name to not draw his sidearm while pushing the subject's front against the wall. In the time it takes to draw a weapon, the subject can be put against the wall. The officer will likely realize he does not need to shoot anymore, but if he does go to shoot now, he will have a clearer angle, with you out of the way. Depending on the rooms' door placements, the officers backstop will very likely be clear or very likely won't be. However, when in motel or hotel rooms, people instinctively sit on the beds (or eventually lie down on them). Odds are that any guests in the rooms will be below the line of fire.

Get control of the subject, particularly the arms and hands. Keep the subject close to the wall; if the subject goes for the weapon, he won't be able to get an angle that can hit the officer or the supervisor. Secure the weapon immediately.

Well, that's my 2 cents. Have a good one all, and just some thoughts...

[Mark Sman]

I still like the idea of throwing him over the rail.

Simple police report "Drunk fall down, go splat."