Obama promises "a pathway to citizenship" for all illigal immigrants

[Afro-European]

GUADALAJARA, Mexico - Flanked by his counterparts from Mexico and Canada, President Obama yesterday reiterated his commitment to pursuing comprehensive immigration reform, despite his packed political agenda and the staunch opposition such an initiative could face.
Obama predicted that he would be successful but acknowledged the challenges, saying, “I’ve got a lot on my plate.’’ He added that there would almost certainly be “demagogues out there who try to suggest that any form or pathway for legalization for those who are already in the United States is unacceptable.’’

But in the most detailed outline yet of his timetable, the president said that he expected the Democratic-controlled Congress, after completing work on healthcare, energy, and financial regulation, to draft immigration bills this year, and that he would begin work on getting them passed in 2010.

“Now, am I going to be able to snap my fingers and get this done? No,’’ the president said. “But ultimately, I think the American people want fairness. And we can create a system in which you have strong border security and an orderly process for people to come in. But we’re also giving an opportunity for those who are already in the United States to be able to achieve a pathway to citizenship so they don’t have to live in the shadows.’’

The president’s comments came during a news conference at the end of a summit of North American leaders. The meeting was aimed at increasing cooperation in the region on a broad range of shared problems and resolving some of the issues that have long strained trilateral relations among countries whose people and economies depend heavily on one another.

During the meetings, which began Sunday afternoon, Obama, President Felipe Calderon of Mexico, and Prime Minister Stephen Harper of Canada discussed climate change and clean energy, swine flu, immigration, trade, and the growing threat posed by organized crime.

Although it was clear at the news conference yesterday that the three leaders had not reached any significant agreements, they expressed understanding for one another’s positions and vowed to keep working to resolve disputes.

Harper, for example, stood by a decision a month ago to require Mexicans to apply for visas but said the problems were Canada’s, not Mexico’s. “It is simply far too easy to make a bogus refugee claim as a way of entering the country,’’ he said. “And we have to change that.’’

A “Buy American’’ provision attached to the US stimulus package has ignited a political storm in Canada, the United States’ most important trading partner. But yesterday, Obama played down the scope of the program, saying it was something he had grudgingly accepted to achieve the greater purpose of pumping money into the flailing US economy.

“I think it’s important to keep this in perspective,’’ Obama said. “This in no way has endangered the billions of dollars in trade taking place between our two countries.’’

Obama offered a spirited defense of Calderon’s efforts to rein in the drug cartels, a fight that has killed nearly 4,200 people this year. Recently, Senator Patrick Leahy, a Vermont Democrat, raised concerns about human rights abuses in the drug war, and Democratic legislators have threatened to withhold some financial support.

At the news conference, Obama said unequivocally that he would push for continuing US support for the Mexican effort, adding, “The biggest, by far, violators of human rights right now are the cartels themselves that are kidnapping people, extorting people, and encouraging corruption.’’

Calderon issued his own passionate defense, saying, “The struggle, the battle, the fight against organized crime is precisely to preserve the human rights of Mexican people.’’

The Mexican Supreme Court supported the army yesterday by declining to take up a case pushed by human rights advocates that challenged the use of military prosecutors, instead of civilian ones, in pursuing charges against rogue soldiers.

All three leaders seemed united in their support for Manuel Zelaya, the Honduran president who was ousted June 28 in what countries around the world have condemned as a coup.


http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2009/08/11/obama_details_push_for_immigration_legislation_in_2010/

"Pathway to citizenship"= legalizing 20-25 million illegal aliens.Uuumm Obama is looking for troubles.

[Ordie]

Good

We need more taxpayers.

[Afro-European]

Good

We need more taxpayers.
What are their contributions to the US economy?

[Alpheus]

But yesterday, Obama played down the scope of the program, saying it was something he had grudgingly accepted to achieve the greater purpose of pumping money into the flailing US economy.

Bull****. It was a thank-you-for-voting-for-me to the unions.

[wildcat]

reward criminals, I am all for reform, and making it better for immigrant workers to enter the country legally, but not to reward the criminals. I guess it is away to boost the numbers come elections if they are all citizens, that one way of swing voters, import them.

[Yeti2424]

Good

We need more taxpayers.

Quality over quantity. If new citizes and their families take more from the system then they put in it only make the situation worse.

[CG51]

Good

We need more taxpayers.

Illegal aliens help keep Social Security afloat by paying into the system and not receiving the benefits. This is not a good idea.

[Sinaloense]

So if it wasn't for the illegals working the fields of California and other places, who would be doing the picking?

[ronnieraygun]

So if it wasn't for the illegals working the fields of California and other places, who would be doing the picking?

Someone else.

[Cerri]

This is BS. Hundreds of thousands of people (who I might add are mostly well-educated) in other countries wait for years to get a chance to come here legally. On the other hand the government want to reward those who BROKE the LAW. Awesome. Just awesome. As a naturalized citizen who came here legally I am sickened by this ****.

[Sinaloense]

Someone else.

Who? I know in your life of quick fixes you simply think that, "someone" else will magically appear, but who?

[Cerri]

Who? I know in your life of quick fixes you simply think that, "someone" else will magically appear, but who?

Legal temporary workers.

[Sinaloense]

This is BS. Hundreds of thousands of people (who I might add are mostly well-educated) in other countries wait for years to get a chance to come here legally. On the other hand the government want to reward those who BROKE the LAW. Awesome. Just awesome. As a naturalized citizen who came here legally I am sickened by this ****.

Those hundreds of thousands of well educated people are not going to come here to work in some kitchen or pick grapes. The fact that this country also needs immigrants that are not of the well educated variety.

[CG51]

So if it wasn't for the illegals working the fields of California and other places, who would be doing the picking?

Everyone thinks that illegals only pick fruit or clean pools for 3 bucks an hour. That's not always true, there are plenty of skilled trade men that work for good money. They are in some cases more dependable and harder working than the average citizen.

[bababooey]

The plan Bush came up with was a good one. The whole pay a fine and back of the line thing worked with me. Preferably, ship them all back home, but that ain't gonna happen. A better plan would be if all us Americans would cut our own lawns, paint our own homes, and do all the menial jobs these illegals are doing. Let the lack of economic opportunity be what makes them go home, on their own dime.

[ronnieraygun]

Who? I know in your life of quick fixes you simply think that, "someone" else will magically appear, but who?

No quick fixes here. In the expedient market economy that moves American society there has always been people to do the grunt work. There always will be. A certain class of undocumented Mexicans is not indispensable and it never willl be.

[Ordie]

Quality over quantity. If new citizes and their families take more from the system then they put in it only make the situation worse.

Ironically its the "quality" higher income citizens and corporations that are more likely avoid taxes through loopholes than your average joe.

Besides, once a person becomes a resident, it opens new opportunities to getting a driver's license, which will enable a person to establish a bank account, get credit, purchase a new car, pay registration, insurance and greater upward mobility.

or purchase a home, property or establish new businesses.

There's a lot of potential cash out there within this community. Allowing for legalization may give local economies a much needed boost in for businesses and local coffers.

[Cerri]

Everyone thinks that illegals only pick fruit or clean pools for 3 bucks an hour. That's not always true, there are plenty of skilled trade men that work for good money. They are in some cases more dependable and harder working than the average citizen.

Very true. I know illegal construction workers making anywhere from $20-25/hr and pay no taxes. I'm pretty sure there are plenty of people willing to take those jobs.

[Sinaloense]

Legal temporary workers.

Most of the people that are working in those fields would prefer a temporary work permit. It wasn't until it got a lot harder to cross, that they decided to stick around.

[Sinaloense]

No quick fixes here. In the expedient market economy that moves American society there has always been people to do the grunt work. There always will be. A certain class of undocumented Mexicans is not indispensable and it never willl be.

That type of work is currently available for everybody, and yet you continue to see the same type of people doing that work. You live in a fantasy world.

[Ordie]

The plan Bush came up with was a good one. The whole pay a fine and back of the line thing worked with me. Preferably, ship them all back home, but that ain't gonna happen. A better plan would be if all us Americans would cut our own lawns, paint our own homes, and do all the menial jobs these illegals are doing. Let the lack of economic opportunity be what makes them go home, on their own dime.

X2

Quick cost benefit analysis:

$48 Billion for the deportation of 11 million people (Entire DHS budget)
or
$700 Billion into the economy.

[ronnieraygun]

That type of work is currently available for everybody, and yet you continue to see the same type of people doing that work. You live in a fantasy world.

No, I don't. I don't know why you derailed the discussion in the first place with the whole "indispensable Mexican" stuff. It's played out. As the economy gets worse and worse, people will have less patience for it. So someone takes a job that "no one else will do" for less money because of our defacto nudge-nudge wink-wink immigration policy with regards to Mexico and they get to the front of the line? I don't know what you're even implying by saying Mexicans do work that others won't. Bully for them. Does that mean that they get amnesty for being illegal? Please tell us.

[Panchito12]

You know I'm starting to think that Obama is just a fool who enjoys punishment.

He ain't fixed squat of the economy, which he no longer even talks about.

His vaunted health care plan is pretty much a shadow of his promise.

And the odds, in a tough economic market, that a bunch of illegal Mexicans are going to catch a break in the immigration ladder is but a dream.

Another defeat for the Chosen One.

[Chulo]

So if it wasn't for the illegals working the fields of California and other places, who would be doing the picking?
First of all, studies have shown that a majority of people working in the fields are there legally.
And the only reason why illegals are working is because employers dont pay tax or any other fees. It is not that people dont want to do the job, it is that the available illegal workforce is cheaper.
So who would do the jobs if illegals leave? well of course the legal ones.


On the other hand, democrats have a vested interest in keeping this amnesty bill going, because politically, illegals would vote more for the democratic party.

[59Diesel]

While it is a slap in the face to people who came here legaly. It's basically saying it's ok that you broke the law we accept you.

I do support making them legal but I more for them paying fines and etc.

This is really a touchy subject that would take alot to go into a Bill if it was me.

[ZeroZen]

it should be pathway to alien greencard.

[2495]

So obama is saying that all thos illegals get a free ticket to becoming US Citizens, but me and my wife get turned down for work visas even though we are both A) University Graduates, B) Have solid job offers, C) have enough money for a year at least, all because the USA doesn't 'need' my wifes specialised nursing 'skill set' and because we have a small child and we are planning on having another some time.

Well, its change alright, but he forgot to say 'short' every time.

[Ordie]

So obama is saying that all thos illegals get a free ticket to becoming US Citizens, but me and my wife get turned down for work visas even though we are both A) University Graduates, B) Have solid job offers, C) have enough money for a year at least, all because the USA doesn't 'need' my wifes specialised nursing 'skill set' and because we have a small child and we are planning on having another some time.

Well, its change alright, but he forgot to say 'short' every time.

The current system sucks because there are many arbitrary exceptions and loopholes.

Cubans get an automatic green card, but others to a lottery and Chinese from both Taiwan and China are alloted the same number of visa each.

Quite frankly we have benefited from a free ticket for years in cheap foods, goods and services of undocumented workers.

[Shuimo]

The current system sucks because there are many arbitrary exceptions and loopholes.

Cubans get an automatic green card, but others to a lottery and Chinese from both Taiwan and China are alloted the same number of visa each.



I am curious why Cubans can get automatic green card!
Is it due to political & ideological reasons?




Quite frankly we have benefited from a free ticket for years in cheap foods, goods and services of undocumented workers.


It is pretty much like what we have in Chinese cities!
Cheapo labor from rural areas provides the rich urban so much service yet cannot get Hukou in cities!

[Shuimo]

Good

We need more taxpayers.:)

Do you really embrace immigrants of all kinds into yr homeland?

[Ordie]

I am curious why Cubans can get automatic green card!
Is it due to political & ideological reasons?


That's the premise. Fleeing from a repressive Communist state.
Cubans have a powerful voting bloc in Florida. Politicians gives them favors by allowing Cuban refugees aslylum.
But they must arrive on dry land.
If they arrive within water on a beach, they can be deported. Most Cubans arrive via Mexico. The goal is to reach Brownsville, Texas and declare themselves as Cubans.

Note: The goal for Cuban Baseball players to reach to a third country (Bahamas, EU,) This way they can become a free agent and avoid being drafted in Major League Baseball. Thus earning top money at choice teams.

A good analogy would be if Yao Ming would have defected to Tonga instead of USA, he would have been playing with the Lakers earning big $$$$$.

[CG51]

Yep Ordie, not to derail the thread, but, both Cuban and Haitian can roll into Florida (or any state) and are considered refugees and can automatially get medicaid and other "entitlements".

PC AMERICA!

[Shuimo]

That's the premise. Fleeing from a repressive Communist state.
Cubans have a powerful voting bloc in Florida. Politicians gives them favors by allowing Cuban refugees aslylum.
But they must arrive on dry land.
If they arrive within water on a beach, they can be deported. Most Cubans arrive via Mexico. The goal is to reach Brownsville, Texas and declare themselves as Cubans.

Note: The goal for Cuban Baseball players to reach to a third country (Bahamas, EU,) This way they can become a free agent and avoid being drafted in Major League Baseball. Thus earning top money at choice teams.

A good analogy would be if Yao Ming would have defected to Tonga instead of USA, he would have been playing with the Lakers earning big $$$$$.
That is just insane in my opinion! I should say!
Anyone with a normal sense knows what pernicious effects such ideologically-charged policy cud trigger!

Why not just make Cuba the 54th state of the US?

[Rayber]

That is just insane in my opinion! I should say!
Anyone with a normal sense knows what pernicious effects such ideologically-charged policy cud trigger!

Why not just make Cuba the 54th state of the US?

Tried and failed p-)
*Runs for cover*

[Ordie]

A Chinese orphan adopted by US Citizens gets automatic citizenship upon arrival on US Territory.

Our ambassidor in Beijing has a child adopted from China.

[Shuimo]

A Chinese orphan adopted by US Citizens gets automatic citizenship upon arrival on US Territory.

Our ambassidor in Beijing has a child adopted from China.


http://hiphotos.baidu.com/shuangye/pic/item/b16fb31915f0fa6143a9adf0.jpg


Isn't she cute and pretty?

[Shuimo]

Tried and failed p-)
*Runs for cover*

Strikingly similar in charming contrast, USA has Cuba while China has North Korea to take care of!

[ronnieraygun]

Why not just make Cuba the 54th state of the US?

That's an odd question, Donger. Big countries often have complicated relationships with smaller neighbors with which they have some historical ties. p-)

It might have been a state by default for quite some time if you counted economic contributions to American industry prior to the revolution and since the time of the Spanish-American war (read: it was our whorehouse, racetrack and sugar cane field, for better or worse)

They needed a change but they got Castro and he tried to play both sides of the fence. He then played the Soviet bloc in short order just to twist Uncle Sam's beard and it didn't help that he lined thousands of people up against a wall. A lot of people fled to Florida and then you began to see why the policy was set in place that allows Cubans to become citizens in short order. It's complicated but in the most generic terms, the US government identified Cuba as a repressive regime and said come one, come all. Some argue that it's dangerous and kills a lot of people every year who try to get out and drown. Some say it was made to break the back of Cuba. Others say if the Cuban missile crisis had never taken place, we would not have this problem. Still others believe that this policy is brought about from the influence of Cuban-American groups who are organized and somewhat wealthy.

You can go on and on about this, but it's just a complicated issue made more so by a lot of really stubborn people, Dongman. Hope this helps. Germane to the thread is the fact that I think the whole "path of citizenship" concept is aimed mostly at Mexican workers in agriculture, manufacturing, construction and food service. Obama was trying to figure out a legal framework to excuse the mess that is our immigration policy and give it legitimacy. Of course, it's far too late and the problem is starting to solve itself with the soft economy (a lot of people are going back to Mexico).

[Rogue_Kop]

Good

We need more taxpayers.


what makes you think that?

[Ordie]

what makes you think that?

Residency will allow many access to the greater economy including banking, credit, auto-home-property ownership and educational opportunities each is associated with revenues to support public goods and services.

This circulates and pump more money into the economy and jobs. And increase the government revenues.

Many of these folks are renters, hording cash and wiring it home. They have no access to a driver's license thus no access to buy a car.

They don't have the incentive to buy a home or property because they may be deported and all is lost.

I know a family who became residents in 1986 thanks to Ronald Reagan.

The first thing they did was to buy a car. A year later they bought homes, and established lines of credit.

[Geezah]

This is BS. Hundreds of thousands of people (who I might add are mostly well-educated) in other countries wait for years to get a chance to come here legally. On the other hand the government want to reward those who BROKE the LAW. Awesome. Just awesome. As a naturalized citizen who came here legally I am sickened by this ****.

Amen to that.

Kick the illegal fvckers out and streamline the immigration process for those legally seeking entry into the US of A!

[tyovan]

My wife came here legally. You can't imagine the hoops, fees, and waiting involved just for her to qualify for a temporary work visa. And this is in regards to an experienced, Westernized, English speaking doctor who had a job offer in the US!
Then after we got married, and she qualified for a green card, the Gestapo (USCIS) put us through the Spanish Inquisition interrogating us for a few hours.. and we have to go back next summer for Round II of the Inquisition - though I'm bringing our baby after I sugar him up and make him ****, hopefully we'll get out of the office quicker..

I have no problem deporting everyone here illegally.

I think we do need to reform immigration though. Currently, much of it is based on family ties. We need to join the 21st century in our immigration police and move to a points-based immigration system that rewards those with skills we need.

I would say we also need to reform our citizenship laws, much like Ireland did fairly recently: your parents had to have had some legal basis for being in the country at the time of your birth for you to qualify for citizenship.